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Here’s a new Open Thread for all of you. To minimize the load, please continue to limit your Tweets or place them under a MORE tag.

To jump-start the discussion, I’ll include a link to my most recent article on vaxxing, which has been producing quite a lot of controversy, both here and elsewhere on the Internet:

https://www.unz.com/runz/obesity-and-the-end-of-the-vaxxing-debate/

I’ll also include a link to an important article published this morning by the editor of Britain’s Daily Sceptic, a well-regarded conservative-leaning science-oriented publication heavily focused on Covid issues that was launched a couple of years ago by Toby Young, a fairly prominent public intellectual:

https://dailysceptic.org/2023/01/10/u-s-government-identified-as-original-source-of-lab-leak-theory-whats-really-going-on/

I’m extremely pleased to see that others are starting to focus upon some of the same striking evidence that I’ve been emphasizing.

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: Open Thread, Russia, Ukraine 
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  1. Mr. Unz,

    The new thread is appreciated.

    I will take this opportunity to share a Public Service Announcement.

     

     

    I do not know if this is an actual exploit. Or, if I am being rolled. However, best to be on the side of caution.

    PEACE 😇

    • Thanks: Not Raul, Philip Owen
    • Replies: @Not Raul
    @A123


    I do not know if this is an actual exploit. Or, if I am being rolled. However, best to be on the side of caution.
     
    Gosh, now you have me worrying.

    If anyone knows if this is a common, effective tactic, let me know.

    Modern technology brings lots of scams within reach.

    Scam emails tend to have obvious spelling errors, weird email and web addresses, etc..

    I would imagine that using the phone and/or text messages to scam people might be more difficult to counter, especially now that people can spoof phone numbers.

    Replies: @Max Payne

  2. Ron,

    Is there data to show that the actual people who died are the obese people? Not on a collective, presumptive basis but on a case by case basis.

    In other words did the mortality rate for obese people increase in the period in question? I still see lots of robust people, maybe the skinny ones were actually thinned out as might happen in a long cold winter.

    What other possible causes could be considered for the increased mortality in addition to colds and novel injections? The causation might be different in different countries.

    If this is covered in the long set of comments on the main article, maybe someone can give a comment number.

    +++

    For countries where the excess mortality is low or constant are there other factors in 2021-2022 which might have a downward effect actually reducing mortality and counterbalancing any hypothetical COVID or shot effects? For example, less work occurred so fewer industrial accidents; this is only an illustration, industrial deaths are too infrequent in the West to be substantial.

    +++

    If the injections have extra danger for obese people that doesn’t let the purveyors off the hook. It simply highlights the irresponsibility of the bogus human trial process.

    • Replies: @A123
    @QCIC

    You raise interesting questions:

    • Are the obese are more likely to die from WUHAN-19?
    • Are the obese are more likely to die from the mRNA jab?
    • Is there a difference between the mRNA experiment and conventional vaccines?
    ___

    I do not know how much traction raising these points in this OT will obtain. Almost everyone here despises Manda-vaxx authoritarianism.

    As a technical issue, it is scientifically interesting -- Are the fatties dying of WUHAN-19? Or, the mRNA experiment? Or, a combination of both?
    ___

    Regardless of the science, obese lard things are not of interest. I regret being tricked into searching on Nigerian plus sized pageant.

    DO NOT CLICK THIS LINK!

    https://www.nairaland.com/1072049/miss-plus-size-nigeria-2012

    YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

    , @Yevardian
    @QCIC

    Request to Mr Unz to trash and permaban any anti-vaxx comments on these open threads. Stick to the Kevin Barrett columns.

    Replies: @QCIC

  3. @QCIC
    Ron,

    Is there data to show that the actual people who died are the obese people? Not on a collective, presumptive basis but on a case by case basis.

    In other words did the mortality rate for obese people increase in the period in question? I still see lots of robust people, maybe the skinny ones were actually thinned out as might happen in a long cold winter.

    What other possible causes could be considered for the increased mortality in addition to colds and novel injections? The causation might be different in different countries.

    If this is covered in the long set of comments on the main article, maybe someone can give a comment number.

    +++

    For countries where the excess mortality is low or constant are there other factors in 2021-2022 which might have a downward effect actually reducing mortality and counterbalancing any hypothetical COVID or shot effects? For example, less work occurred so fewer industrial accidents; this is only an illustration, industrial deaths are too infrequent in the West to be substantial.

    +++

    If the injections have extra danger for obese people that doesn't let the purveyors off the hook. It simply highlights the irresponsibility of the bogus human trial process.

    Replies: @A123, @Yevardian

    You raise interesting questions:

    • Are the obese are more likely to die from WUHAN-19?
    • Are the obese are more likely to die from the mRNA jab?
    • Is there a difference between the mRNA experiment and conventional vaccines?
    ___

    I do not know how much traction raising these points in this OT will obtain. Almost everyone here despises Manda-vaxx authoritarianism.

    As a technical issue, it is scientifically interesting — Are the fatties dying of WUHAN-19? Or, the mRNA experiment? Or, a combination of both?
    ___

    Regardless of the science, obese lard things are not of interest. I regret being tricked into searching on Nigerian plus sized pageant.

    DO NOT CLICK THIS LINK!

    https://www.nairaland.com/1072049/miss-plus-size-nigeria-2012

    YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

  4. • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Mikhail

    Just watched:

    1. Some serious pot and kettle shit with Brian saying that people need to be told the truth, not just what they want to hear when Brian is the one who has been pimping "muh winter offensive", saying that Ukraine was running out of shells, claiming that Russia had figured out how counter the HIMARs and spinning the Russian army's inability to maneuver is actually being an intelligent preference for a blatantly attritional strategy

    2. Interesting article that he cited in Foreign Affairs

    3. I agree with Western estimates that Russia has suffered ~100,000 total casualties when you count regional militias/Wagner. That's casualties, not fatalities. I think it's in the ballpark. I think Brian is confusing KIA and total casualities.

    4. Brian again comes back to the whole "war of attrition" thing, but never mentions that Russia has adopted this strategy because of the catastrophic failure of its initial invasion and because Russia is literally lacks the capability to wage this war any other way. It would take Russia at least a year to put a million men on the line and equip them, if the current Russian state is even capable of that, and there still would be no opportunity for breakthrough

    5. Brian claims that the Russian partial mobilization has given the Russians a numerical advantage on the line. I doubt it

    6. I agree that the Kherson withdrawal was militarily correct and that the Ukrainian offensives in the fall did not have any strategic benefits for Ukraine and that these withdrawal show the Kremlin and it's commanders are now conducting the war in a more reasonable fashion

    7. Unlike the Anatoly's of the world, I expect the coming Ukrainian offensives against the prepared Russian defenses to be very costly failures for Ukraine so I agree with Brian on this point.

    8. Muh Bakhmut. Using the logic the German army used to justify Verdun. Pathetic.

    9. Very interesting Alex Vershinin article cited. I understand where Vershinin is coming from but I believe that Ukraine's ability to replace material losses is virtually limitless for the time being. The manpower losses I'm less sure but even there I'm confident that Ukraine can continue to recruit enough men to hold the line offensives, even if it eventually needs to forgo further offensives

    10. Brian displays a huge misunderstanding of battlefield/theatre logistics

    11. What he said about Wagner troops being a cheap loss since they are convicts is incredibly callous

    12. Ironically, the war is kinda turning into the war that Anatoly initially predicted (mainly drones + artillery)

    13. I agree with Venishin that Ukraine has no realistic prospect, absent dramatic upscale of Western support, of tactical victory but I don't believe that Ukraine is counting on this. Zelensky might be, but he has lost his marbles and he can be pushed aside when necessary. Literally all Ukraine needs to do now is maintain a defensive line in the eastern regions of the country and Russia will eventually have to leave Ukraine be, even if it takes another decade of killing. Now Russia can call that a victory if it wants, it may even gain more territory than it currently holds, but the end result is still an independent Ukraine firmly aligned with the West along with a new weariness of Russian intentions from Russia's neighbors mixed with contempt for Russian capabilities.

    Replies: @Mikhail

  5. @Mikhail
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LK7VS3bzhDM

    Replies: @Greasy William

    Just watched:

    1. Some serious pot and kettle shit with Brian saying that people need to be told the truth, not just what they want to hear when Brian is the one who has been pimping “muh winter offensive”, saying that Ukraine was running out of shells, claiming that Russia had figured out how counter the HIMARs and spinning the Russian army’s inability to maneuver is actually being an intelligent preference for a blatantly attritional strategy

    2. Interesting article that he cited in Foreign Affairs

    3. I agree with Western estimates that Russia has suffered ~100,000 total casualties when you count regional militias/Wagner. That’s casualties, not fatalities. I think it’s in the ballpark. I think Brian is confusing KIA and total casualities.

    4. Brian again comes back to the whole “war of attrition” thing, but never mentions that Russia has adopted this strategy because of the catastrophic failure of its initial invasion and because Russia is literally lacks the capability to wage this war any other way. It would take Russia at least a year to put a million men on the line and equip them, if the current Russian state is even capable of that, and there still would be no opportunity for breakthrough

    5. Brian claims that the Russian partial mobilization has given the Russians a numerical advantage on the line. I doubt it

    6. I agree that the Kherson withdrawal was militarily correct and that the Ukrainian offensives in the fall did not have any strategic benefits for Ukraine and that these withdrawal show the Kremlin and it’s commanders are now conducting the war in a more reasonable fashion

    7. Unlike the Anatoly’s of the world, I expect the coming Ukrainian offensives against the prepared Russian defenses to be very costly failures for Ukraine so I agree with Brian on this point.

    8. Muh Bakhmut. Using the logic the German army used to justify Verdun. Pathetic.

    9. Very interesting Alex Vershinin article cited. I understand where Vershinin is coming from but I believe that Ukraine’s ability to replace material losses is virtually limitless for the time being. The manpower losses I’m less sure but even there I’m confident that Ukraine can continue to recruit enough men to hold the line offensives, even if it eventually needs to forgo further offensives

    10. Brian displays a huge misunderstanding of battlefield/theatre logistics

    11. What he said about Wagner troops being a cheap loss since they are convicts is incredibly callous

    12. Ironically, the war is kinda turning into the war that Anatoly initially predicted (mainly drones + artillery)

    13. I agree with Venishin that Ukraine has no realistic prospect, absent dramatic upscale of Western support, of tactical victory but I don’t believe that Ukraine is counting on this. Zelensky might be, but he has lost his marbles and he can be pushed aside when necessary. Literally all Ukraine needs to do now is maintain a defensive line in the eastern regions of the country and Russia will eventually have to leave Ukraine be, even if it takes another decade of killing. Now Russia can call that a victory if it wants, it may even gain more territory than it currently holds, but the end result is still an independent Ukraine firmly aligned with the West along with a new weariness of Russian intentions from Russia’s neighbors mixed with contempt for Russian capabilities.

    • Replies: @Mikhail
    @Greasy William

    On quick review, I think he was being somewhat sarcastic on the Wagner/convict connection that Western mass media harps on.

    He specifically referenced the BBC claim of 1,000 Russian KIA a month in the early months of the war, when Russian casualties were at their greatest. Kiev regime armed combatant KIA are definitely much higher than Russia's.

    I'll take Brian over Ben Hodges and Barry Posen any day.

    Russia will not be leaving Crimea and isn't likely to leave any of the other former Ukrainian SSR it currently has. The longer this conflict continues the greater the likelihood of the Kiev regime losing more territory.

    Zaluzhny's interview in The Economist was quite revealing.

    Replies: @AP

  6. @Greasy William
    @Mikhail

    Just watched:

    1. Some serious pot and kettle shit with Brian saying that people need to be told the truth, not just what they want to hear when Brian is the one who has been pimping "muh winter offensive", saying that Ukraine was running out of shells, claiming that Russia had figured out how counter the HIMARs and spinning the Russian army's inability to maneuver is actually being an intelligent preference for a blatantly attritional strategy

    2. Interesting article that he cited in Foreign Affairs

    3. I agree with Western estimates that Russia has suffered ~100,000 total casualties when you count regional militias/Wagner. That's casualties, not fatalities. I think it's in the ballpark. I think Brian is confusing KIA and total casualities.

    4. Brian again comes back to the whole "war of attrition" thing, but never mentions that Russia has adopted this strategy because of the catastrophic failure of its initial invasion and because Russia is literally lacks the capability to wage this war any other way. It would take Russia at least a year to put a million men on the line and equip them, if the current Russian state is even capable of that, and there still would be no opportunity for breakthrough

    5. Brian claims that the Russian partial mobilization has given the Russians a numerical advantage on the line. I doubt it

    6. I agree that the Kherson withdrawal was militarily correct and that the Ukrainian offensives in the fall did not have any strategic benefits for Ukraine and that these withdrawal show the Kremlin and it's commanders are now conducting the war in a more reasonable fashion

    7. Unlike the Anatoly's of the world, I expect the coming Ukrainian offensives against the prepared Russian defenses to be very costly failures for Ukraine so I agree with Brian on this point.

    8. Muh Bakhmut. Using the logic the German army used to justify Verdun. Pathetic.

    9. Very interesting Alex Vershinin article cited. I understand where Vershinin is coming from but I believe that Ukraine's ability to replace material losses is virtually limitless for the time being. The manpower losses I'm less sure but even there I'm confident that Ukraine can continue to recruit enough men to hold the line offensives, even if it eventually needs to forgo further offensives

    10. Brian displays a huge misunderstanding of battlefield/theatre logistics

    11. What he said about Wagner troops being a cheap loss since they are convicts is incredibly callous

    12. Ironically, the war is kinda turning into the war that Anatoly initially predicted (mainly drones + artillery)

    13. I agree with Venishin that Ukraine has no realistic prospect, absent dramatic upscale of Western support, of tactical victory but I don't believe that Ukraine is counting on this. Zelensky might be, but he has lost his marbles and he can be pushed aside when necessary. Literally all Ukraine needs to do now is maintain a defensive line in the eastern regions of the country and Russia will eventually have to leave Ukraine be, even if it takes another decade of killing. Now Russia can call that a victory if it wants, it may even gain more territory than it currently holds, but the end result is still an independent Ukraine firmly aligned with the West along with a new weariness of Russian intentions from Russia's neighbors mixed with contempt for Russian capabilities.

    Replies: @Mikhail

    On quick review, I think he was being somewhat sarcastic on the Wagner/convict connection that Western mass media harps on.

    He specifically referenced the BBC claim of 1,000 Russian KIA a month in the early months of the war, when Russian casualties were at their greatest. Kiev regime armed combatant KIA are definitely much higher than Russia’s.

    I’ll take Brian over Ben Hodges and Barry Posen any day.

    Russia will not be leaving Crimea and isn’t likely to leave any of the other former Ukrainian SSR it currently has. The longer this conflict continues the greater the likelihood of the Kiev regime losing more territory.

    Zaluzhny’s interview in The Economist was quite revealing.

    • Replies: @AP
    @Mikhail

    Russia has managed to make even the boxer Usyk to turn against Russia:



    https://twitter.com/zoryalondonsk/status/1613169154395176963?s=46&t=8KQim_oARSVJcB8UTxOhRg

    Replies: @Sean

  7. Interesting analysis by U.S. Lt. Col. Alex Vershinin.

    https://www.russiamatters.org/analysis/whats-ahead-war-ukraine

    • Replies: @Mikhail
    @LondonBob

    He's a lot better than the much overrated Peter Zeihan.

    https://theduran.com/the-great-game-debunking-peter-zeihans-lies-on-the-joe-rogan-experience/

  8. @LondonBob
    Interesting analysis by U.S. Lt. Col. Alex Vershinin.

    https://www.russiamatters.org/analysis/whats-ahead-war-ukraine

    Replies: @Mikhail

  9. Inconvenient realities for some –

    https://www.rt.com/shows/crosstalk/569635-nazi-problem-west-silent/

    Russia Unplugged
    @UnpluggedRus
    This video is causing a lot of anger in Ukraine, today. Members of the country’s “golden youth” drinking $20,000 champagne, in a Courchevel flag waving frenzy, at the same time as Kiev’s forces were losing the town of Soledar to Russia’s Wagner troops.

  10. This is still a half war.

    Russia is bending over backwards apparently to limit harm to civilians. Much of the vulnerable Ukrainian supply chain is being ignored by Russia for whatever reasons.

    Why do I say this?

    All of the material support for Ukraine comes in from the outside: Poland, Romania, Port of Odessa, wherever. Mostly by rail, road, ship or pipeline. The Russian military has repeatedly demonstrated they can take out critical infrastructure such as bridges, pumping stations, etc. with standoff missile strikes and has regularly done so on a LIMITED basis. Ukraine has the ability to repair some of this damage, but on a progressively more limited basis as problems accumulate. Many of the experienced 25-55 year old men that repair this sort of damage have been killed at the front and it is tough to run heavy equipment once fuel starts being rationed. I believe Russia is limiting these strikes to avoid escalating the civilian humanitarian crisis. Ukraine and the West are well aware of this and are counting on it. Ukraine shuts down in a week if Russia changes her tactics.

    I believe Russia is intentionally limiting the manpower to preserve her forces for Western-sponsored attacks in places such as Kaliningrad, Georgia or the other potential hotspots. Some of the reports suggest Russia is working up to around half a million troops for the SMO (included repatriated Ukrainians) so they are not really limited anyway.

    I don’t know exactly how this will play out, but I think people who are speculating and pontificating on this war should address these two points: 1) Totally vulnerable Ukrainian supply chain infrastructure only lightly damaged so far 2) Russia cautiously applying manpower to preserve her overall defensive capabilities.

  11. Iraqi Information Minister reviews
    Masters of Wisdom of Central Asia: Teachings from the Sufi Path of Liberation
    Hasan Lufti Shushud
    Inner Traditions 2014
    180pp

    This episode is an appendix to previous review of Bennett, Gurdjieff Making a New World. Wherein it was revealed that if Gurdjieff taught any tradition it would be that of the Khwajagan Sufis of Bukhara. Khwajagan means masters of wisdom. The 14th and 15th century Khwajagan Sufis of Bukhara are catalogued in this book. The book is a Who’s Who in this clan and the subtitle is misleading. Way more biographical trivia than any wisdom teachings inside. There are ten or twelve lineage trees, around a hundred names, and it blurs together. It is not easy to read this text close.

    There is almost no Gurdjieff material evident here.

    Most of the people described are nondescript. We are told they were good, they were holy, they were devout, &c but almost nothing that was taught stands out as distinct. For the most part they get a paragraph. This guy got more than a paragraph:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jami

    Reading that wikipedia page is a better use of most people’s time than reading this book.

    One or two of you might be interested to know that Oprah Winfrey and Shirley MacLaine’s favorite poet Rumi was one of these guys but not really in this book.

  12. From OT205

    In our forum, I don’t think even A123 will view an American city, as an example of urban planning that we should follow.

    Over jobbed — under populated “down town” areas are poor urban planning. Why does anyone need an office building more than 5 stories tall? Place a bunch of these together and the inevitable result is wasted time commuting.

    Living in a suburban environment close to the office is ideal for most people. Some multifamily apartments work in the mix as long as there are not too many of them.

    My concept would be an array of small and mid sized towns. Over 100 years ago, big cities formed around utilities such as steam, electricity, water, and shipping/rail. With today’s technology, that scale now causes more problems than it solves.

    PEACE 😇

  13. Is this not some ancient Mesopotamian demon that was in one of the Ghostbuster properties – perhaps, the cartoon?

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Not Raul
    @songbird

    It looks like photoshop.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird

    1. it is a plain ordinary furry. Don't act like you never saw a furry before.
    2. P ~ .7 Syrian Girl is a Mossad employee.

    Replies: @songbird, @Yahya

    , @S
    @songbird


    Is this not some ancient Mesopotamian demon that was in one of the Ghostbuster properties – perhaps, the cartoon?
     
    It looks like one of the Blue Meanies from Yellow Submarine. Purple Meanies now I suppose.

    Who'd of ever thought those things were real?


    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/bc/BlueMeanies.jpg

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Meanies_(Yellow_Submarine)
  14. @A123
    Mr. Unz,

    The new thread is appreciated.

    I will take this opportunity to share a Public Service Announcement.

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjaEil8uNzu7jH3x98HwlprSYiPsL3UNrFy2pc_JO73cGe2eCreSEnFN35QF9vb5u3HFMd2T22ZaYWo-snX0exLqN9O0qDLsaDqzqEgInNSa8l_2zhClWhuSCll20VuM-OO3W6EAU30QRybVHtV0zGWsWHKRgVLC98H_dRbJ42i1JpuceN_uP-vlUIJUA/w640-h584/90mimb_cc18518eea6d88a27889e9caf1c240d5_a6ba7d68_500.jpg
     

    I do not know if this is an actual exploit. Or, if I am being rolled. However, best to be on the side of caution.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Not Raul

    I do not know if this is an actual exploit. Or, if I am being rolled. However, best to be on the side of caution.

    Gosh, now you have me worrying.

    If anyone knows if this is a common, effective tactic, let me know.

    Modern technology brings lots of scams within reach.

    Scam emails tend to have obvious spelling errors, weird email and web addresses, etc..

    I would imagine that using the phone and/or text messages to scam people might be more difficult to counter, especially now that people can spoof phone numbers.

    • Replies: @Max Payne
    @Not Raul

    Bruh with deep learning all you need is 250 words and you can synthesize someones voice. So don't stress. A simple "yes" isn't enough.

    A123 couldn't even get a bogey-man scammer story down properly.

    Imagine a 'customer support' agent chatting you up for 3-4 minutes, just enough to collect 250-300 words so they can train a model around your voice and do real harm!

    Its so simple modders add voices to games all the time (because voice actors think their job is secure). Just an half decent graphic card and Python. So why not financial fraud!

  15. @songbird
    Is this not some ancient Mesopotamian demon that was in one of the Ghostbuster properties - perhaps, the cartoon?

    https://twitter.com/Partisangirl/status/1613142177244393472?s=20&t=OzN37CdGYoFEM0lf13soAA

    Replies: @Not Raul, @Emil Nikola Richard, @S

    It looks like photoshop.

    • Agree: songbird
    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Not Raul

    You'd really like to think so. However, my prognosis is that the pic is 100% genuine.

    A Church of England vicar could absolutely survey such a spectacle with a visage of studious propriety.

  16. MI6 is saying that Russia is launching it’s Muh Winter Offensive in the next couple of weeks. Probably on or about the 15th

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Greasy William

    Britain has also released Challenger 2 tanks to fight in Ukraine.

    Replies: @Greasy William

  17. @songbird
    Is this not some ancient Mesopotamian demon that was in one of the Ghostbuster properties - perhaps, the cartoon?

    https://twitter.com/Partisangirl/status/1613142177244393472?s=20&t=OzN37CdGYoFEM0lf13soAA

    Replies: @Not Raul, @Emil Nikola Richard, @S

    1. it is a plain ordinary furry. Don’t act like you never saw a furry before.
    2. P ~ .7 Syrian Girl is a Mossad employee.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    P ~ .7 Syrian Girl is a Mossad employee.
     
    Honestly, haven't followed her too closely, but I am surprised by your theory. Maybe, supposed to make Muslim immigrants seem more based than they are to the dissident right community?
    , @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    P ~ .7 Syrian Girl is a Mossad employee.
     
    She’s not:



    https://twitter.com/Partisangirl/status/1611509886302703618?s=20&t=I-wtbnoZNArSZ4pDKwul3g

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  18. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird

    1. it is a plain ordinary furry. Don't act like you never saw a furry before.
    2. P ~ .7 Syrian Girl is a Mossad employee.

    Replies: @songbird, @Yahya

    P ~ .7 Syrian Girl is a Mossad employee.

    Honestly, haven’t followed her too closely, but I am surprised by your theory. Maybe, supposed to make Muslim immigrants seem more based than they are to the dissident right community?

  19. @songbird
    Is this not some ancient Mesopotamian demon that was in one of the Ghostbuster properties - perhaps, the cartoon?

    https://twitter.com/Partisangirl/status/1613142177244393472?s=20&t=OzN37CdGYoFEM0lf13soAA

    Replies: @Not Raul, @Emil Nikola Richard, @S

    Is this not some ancient Mesopotamian demon that was in one of the Ghostbuster properties – perhaps, the cartoon?

    It looks like one of the Blue Meanies from Yellow Submarine. Purple Meanies now I suppose.

    Who’d of ever thought those things were real?

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Meanies_(Yellow_Submarine)

    • Thanks: songbird
  20. @Greasy William
    MI6 is saying that Russia is launching it's Muh Winter Offensive in the next couple of weeks. Probably on or about the 15th

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    Britain has also released Challenger 2 tanks to fight in Ukraine.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Wokechoke

    Won't make any difference

  21. @Wokechoke
    @Greasy William

    Britain has also released Challenger 2 tanks to fight in Ukraine.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    Won’t make any difference

    • Agree: Mikhail
  22. Wyatt Reed
    @wyattreed13
    Russia state-affiliated media
    Ukrainian “refugees” deck the halls with tributes to Right Sector, Waffen-SS Galicia Division, Stepan Bandera, & Roman Shukhevych—who oversaw the slaughter of tens of thousands of Jews, Poles, & partisans as commander of the UPA & the Nachtigall volunteer Ukrainian nazi battalion

    [MORE]

    • Thanks: A123
  23. @Not Raul
    @songbird

    It looks like photoshop.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    You’d really like to think so. However, my prognosis is that the pic is 100% genuine.

    A Church of England vicar could absolutely survey such a spectacle with a visage of studious propriety.

  24. This is great news for : (1)

    John Bolton stuns a British audience with announcement he WILL run for POTUS in 2024.

    Well, you know, you can pay yourself a salary out of campaign funds when you’re a candidate, you can travel to places you want to go, people will treat you like you’re important even if you hardly have a shot, and it boosts cable news bookings, book sales, etc. Hey, maybe I should run. I’ve got as good a chance as John Bolton.

    He does not have to stump for a tepid supporter of foreign wars like DeNeocon. Mikel can go ALL IN for multiple Forever Wars with Bolton.

    Those of who want peace will, of course, stick with MAGA and Trump.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://instapundit.com/562853/

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @A123

    He should run as a Democrat though. There’s no difference between himself and Biden. Only Bolton is more so.

  25. @Mikhail
    @Greasy William

    On quick review, I think he was being somewhat sarcastic on the Wagner/convict connection that Western mass media harps on.

    He specifically referenced the BBC claim of 1,000 Russian KIA a month in the early months of the war, when Russian casualties were at their greatest. Kiev regime armed combatant KIA are definitely much higher than Russia's.

    I'll take Brian over Ben Hodges and Barry Posen any day.

    Russia will not be leaving Crimea and isn't likely to leave any of the other former Ukrainian SSR it currently has. The longer this conflict continues the greater the likelihood of the Kiev regime losing more territory.

    Zaluzhny's interview in The Economist was quite revealing.

    Replies: @AP

    Russia has managed to make even the boxer Usyk to turn against Russia:

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Sean
    @AP

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54daqNraMxE&t=42s

  26. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird

    1. it is a plain ordinary furry. Don't act like you never saw a furry before.
    2. P ~ .7 Syrian Girl is a Mossad employee.

    Replies: @songbird, @Yahya

    P ~ .7 Syrian Girl is a Mossad employee.

    She’s not:

    [MORE]

    • Agree: Barbarossa
    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    Do you find this personality who is prominent in the 24/7 propaganda war is organic?

    There are resources backing the entity. No?

    Replies: @Yahya, @Greasy William, @Yevardian

  27. Thoughts?

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    Stealth plane is harder to deploy, but also more effective.
    Jet plane too expensive for middle-weight actors to employ.

    Therefore, power vacuum between capital & local city - filled by militarized NGOs?
    Essentially, street gangs go national - serving an important bridge betwene de facto & de jure. (A)

    Continues a trend of political center professionalizing (smaller, more effective).
    See Russia: where it has a small modern military & a cost prohibitive mass military.

    Cost prohibitive to call up mass military in both political & fin-capital terms.
    --
    De facto don't think it makes life any easier for dissidents & only strengthens state religion (B)
    For example, it's not a worthy trade to gain political leverage by giving up patriarchy.

    This is tantamount to selling your daughters.. That's the faustian bargain liberalism demands.
    So let's see what happens



    Appendix:

    Appendix A: https://neociceroniantimes.wordpress.com/2023/01/06/a-primer-on-manipulating-procedural-outcomes/


    Let’s take, for example, the recent revelations of government censorship of dissident ideas and individuals that we saw in the Twitter files. Now, we all know that the government can’t censor speech and ideas because of the First Amendment. So this means that they’d never do so…right? (LOL) Well, as the Twitter files revealed – and which absolutely assuredly applies to every other major tech company in the field – FedGov and the alphabet agencies simply use companies like Twitter as a way to work around the 1A. They can’t censor directly, but they can rely upon a combination of selective pressure on tech companies and ideologically friendly personnel within these companies to censor and gather information about right-leaning, and especially dissident Right, users all the same. And technically, none of this is illegal, because muh private company and all that. So a functional illegality nevertheless remains within the boundaries of “procedure.”

     

    Appendix B: https://roloslavskiy.substack.com/p/the-hijacking-of-nationalism-and

    It’s an old right-wing talking point, but it’s 100% true - crime is just low-scale guerrilla warfare waged against the host population by hostile minorities. If the peasants had the power to organize amongst themselves, they’d simply solve the predation problem by kicking out the ethnic and religious criminals. The police, secret or otherwise, in contrast, do not want to solve the problem of crime, only to contain and profit from it. Should the problem actually be solved, they’d be out of a job. As a result, they spend more time policing the people being preyed on than the actual criminals. For most of human history, there has been no need for an organized police. Only in large port cities, historically, have the authorities had to create something resembling a privatized and professional police force to keep the peace among the bickering traders and the various riff-raff.
     

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Barbarossa

    , @Greasy William
    @Sher Singh

    I think this overestimates the impact of stealth. There are plenty examples of nations achieving air supremacy without stealth aircraft.

    I do agree that we are seeing a return to a sort of feudalism in the mega states, but I don't think you'll see any such thing in smaller states

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  28. Sher Singh says:
    @Sher Singh
    Thoughts?

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/640459736919048202/1063045767536836678/image.png

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Greasy William

    Stealth plane is harder to deploy, but also more effective.
    Jet plane too expensive for middle-weight actors to employ.

    Therefore, power vacuum between capital & local city – filled by militarized NGOs?
    Essentially, street gangs go national – serving an important bridge betwene de facto & de jure. (A)

    Continues a trend of political center professionalizing (smaller, more effective).
    See Russia: where it has a small modern military & a cost prohibitive mass military.

    Cost prohibitive to call up mass military in both political & fin-capital terms.

    De facto don’t think it makes life any easier for dissidents & only strengthens state religion (B)
    For example, it’s not a worthy trade to gain political leverage by giving up patriarchy.

    This is tantamount to selling your daughters.. That’s the faustian bargain liberalism demands.
    So let’s see what happens

    Appendix:

    [MORE]

    Appendix A: https://neociceroniantimes.wordpress.com/2023/01/06/a-primer-on-manipulating-procedural-outcomes/

    Let’s take, for example, the recent revelations of government censorship of dissident ideas and individuals that we saw in the Twitter files. Now, we all know that the government can’t censor speech and ideas because of the First Amendment. So this means that they’d never do so…right? (LOL) Well, as the Twitter files revealed – and which absolutely assuredly applies to every other major tech company in the field – FedGov and the alphabet agencies simply use companies like Twitter as a way to work around the 1A. They can’t censor directly, but they can rely upon a combination of selective pressure on tech companies and ideologically friendly personnel within these companies to censor and gather information about right-leaning, and especially dissident Right, users all the same. And technically, none of this is illegal, because muh private company and all that. So a functional illegality nevertheless remains within the boundaries of “procedure.”

    Appendix B: https://roloslavskiy.substack.com/p/the-hijacking-of-nationalism-and

    It’s an old right-wing talking point, but it’s 100% true – crime is just low-scale guerrilla warfare waged against the host population by hostile minorities. If the peasants had the power to organize amongst themselves, they’d simply solve the predation problem by kicking out the ethnic and religious criminals. The police, secret or otherwise, in contrast, do not want to solve the problem of crime, only to contain and profit from it. Should the problem actually be solved, they’d be out of a job. As a result, they spend more time policing the people being preyed on than the actual criminals. For most of human history, there has been no need for an organized police. Only in large port cities, historically, have the authorities had to create something resembling a privatized and professional police force to keep the peace among the bickering traders and the various riff-raff.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    Now, question is does this create religious vacuum (religion = link elite + pleb?)

    Rome had the legion & the praetorian. One could defend the border & the other the elite.
    Christianity organized the mob to threaten the middle class (who had no defender) in the city.

    Politics is high-low v middle. Christianity then gained sponsorship from the elite,
    who used it to suppress, control or convert rivals (middle class - non-elite elite, out of power elite)

    Is this religion of the gaps just wokeness/liberalism?
    Are woke institutions gaining strength, collapsing (hollowing out?)

    Is the nature of urban (elite) institutions to hollow/out consume human capital to produce power?
    ie create cultural capital at the cost of above replacement tfr?

    Don't know, gonna go lift. Do stealth aircraft create wokeness? (post 96 liberalism)
    O well, 96 crori Khalsa.

    Appendix:
    https://richardhanania.substack.com/p/woke-institutions-is-just-civil-rights
    https://niccolo.substack.com/p/turbo-america-is-beginning-to-resonate

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    , @Barbarossa
    @Sher Singh

    To address your appendix A on 1st amendment suppression via collusion between tech platforms and the Federal agencies; this gets at my fundamental complaint with all tech speech platforms. All such platforms are highly constrained; you are playing someone else game by using the interface they have constructed. This is true of all online platforms, it is only a question of degree.

    To me, Unz.com is a successful experiment because Mr. Unz has created what is probably the internet's most neutral conversational interface. It's probably the closest to capturing the nuance and shadings of real life conversation of any platform on the web and does this in a way that remains fairly structurally neutral.

    Platforms like Twitter, Facebook, or TicTok don't just mediate how speech is packaged, or what is allowed, they actually shape the fundamentals dynamics of how humans communicate. This is much more disturbing to me than what is censored or not, as it has wider implications for what information that we are even capable of assimilating and how we are capable of taking it in. It seems that we are witnessing the final stage dismantling of the intellectual hardware of the textual information age in favor of the victorious image as conveyor of meaning. Of the two, the image is much more malleable than textual argument to manipulation and emotional hacking/ short circuiting.

    So, for me it's more of a refusal to play their mediated games then it is about what they are censoring. Even if Twitter or FB were completely unbiased or tilted toward conservatism I would still see them are entirely destructive entities for destroying the way humans process and share information.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  29. Sher Singh says:
    @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    Stealth plane is harder to deploy, but also more effective.
    Jet plane too expensive for middle-weight actors to employ.

    Therefore, power vacuum between capital & local city - filled by militarized NGOs?
    Essentially, street gangs go national - serving an important bridge betwene de facto & de jure. (A)

    Continues a trend of political center professionalizing (smaller, more effective).
    See Russia: where it has a small modern military & a cost prohibitive mass military.

    Cost prohibitive to call up mass military in both political & fin-capital terms.
    --
    De facto don't think it makes life any easier for dissidents & only strengthens state religion (B)
    For example, it's not a worthy trade to gain political leverage by giving up patriarchy.

    This is tantamount to selling your daughters.. That's the faustian bargain liberalism demands.
    So let's see what happens



    Appendix:

    Appendix A: https://neociceroniantimes.wordpress.com/2023/01/06/a-primer-on-manipulating-procedural-outcomes/


    Let’s take, for example, the recent revelations of government censorship of dissident ideas and individuals that we saw in the Twitter files. Now, we all know that the government can’t censor speech and ideas because of the First Amendment. So this means that they’d never do so…right? (LOL) Well, as the Twitter files revealed – and which absolutely assuredly applies to every other major tech company in the field – FedGov and the alphabet agencies simply use companies like Twitter as a way to work around the 1A. They can’t censor directly, but they can rely upon a combination of selective pressure on tech companies and ideologically friendly personnel within these companies to censor and gather information about right-leaning, and especially dissident Right, users all the same. And technically, none of this is illegal, because muh private company and all that. So a functional illegality nevertheless remains within the boundaries of “procedure.”

     

    Appendix B: https://roloslavskiy.substack.com/p/the-hijacking-of-nationalism-and

    It’s an old right-wing talking point, but it’s 100% true - crime is just low-scale guerrilla warfare waged against the host population by hostile minorities. If the peasants had the power to organize amongst themselves, they’d simply solve the predation problem by kicking out the ethnic and religious criminals. The police, secret or otherwise, in contrast, do not want to solve the problem of crime, only to contain and profit from it. Should the problem actually be solved, they’d be out of a job. As a result, they spend more time policing the people being preyed on than the actual criminals. For most of human history, there has been no need for an organized police. Only in large port cities, historically, have the authorities had to create something resembling a privatized and professional police force to keep the peace among the bickering traders and the various riff-raff.
     

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Barbarossa

    Now, question is does this create religious vacuum (religion = link elite + pleb?)

    Rome had the legion & the praetorian. One could defend the border & the other the elite.
    Christianity organized the mob to threaten the middle class (who had no defender) in the city.

    Politics is high-low v middle. Christianity then gained sponsorship from the elite,
    who used it to suppress, control or convert rivals (middle class – non-elite elite, out of power elite)

    Is this religion of the gaps just wokeness/liberalism?
    Are woke institutions gaining strength, collapsing (hollowing out?)

    Is the nature of urban (elite) institutions to hollow/out consume human capital to produce power?
    ie create cultural capital at the cost of above replacement tfr?

    Don’t know, gonna go lift. Do stealth aircraft create wokeness? (post 96 liberalism)
    O well, 96 crori Khalsa.

    Appendix:
    https://richardhanania.substack.com/p/woke-institutions-is-just-civil-rights
    https://niccolo.substack.com/p/turbo-america-is-beginning-to-resonate

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

  30. The most reliable facts that I can determine around the homeless problem are that drugs and mental illness are almost always involved, usually in a symbiotic relationship.
    I’ve heard this consistently from several sources, most recently from my brother who lives in Oregon and has a friend in Portland’s social services, and it seems like a good place to start.

    It’s a chicken or egg problem of course and it’s hard to tell where the causation may be compared to other factors like high cost of housing.

    A lot of it really does seem to stem from closing down all the mental facilities in the US. A lot of people who would have previously been institutionalized are now wandering the streets.

    https://mentalillnesspolicy.org/consequences/homeless-mentally-ill.html

    I’d love to find nationwide data since the 70’s on homeless population, but this is the closest I could turn up so far. Overall, it seems that homelessness found it’s nadir in the 50’s and 60’s but began to climb again since the 70’s.

    It seems to me that Dmitry paints a rather idealized picture of the homeless. My overwhelming impression is that they are most often profoundly dysfunctional and troubled people, perhaps in many cases not malevolent just very disturbed.

    Whatever the causes, the rise of homeless populations indicate some profoundly basic failings of society in general to function for and provide basic functionality for an increasing number of people. I don’t think it’s possible to just dismiss homelessness as a personal moral failing as AP seems to do.

    My gut feeling, for whatever it’s worth, says that the numbers of homeless will continue to explode over the next few years as the fallout and instability from Covid financial policy knock a great number of the precarious population out of solvency.

    • Agree: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @AP
    @Barbarossa


    I don’t think it’s possible to just dismiss homelessness as a personal moral failing as AP seems to do
     
    I hope I didn’t come across that way. It’s a combination of failed (often due to malevolence) public policy and individual personal moral failings.* The two interact, in that public policies encourage such moral failure rather than help the people to do better.

    * These are often downstream of terrible personal circumstances, poor role models, etc.
    , @Mikel
    @Barbarossa

    Thanks for your thoughts and data. RSBD also provided an interesting article with some statistics and testimonies in the previous thread.

    As a first generation immigrant to the US, I find the homelessness crisis both tragic and fascinating at the same time. I know Europe very well. I have visited most of it and even lived in a couple of its most prosperous countries but nothing in Europe compares to the general levels of prosperity you find in the US. Seeing the appearance of massive encampments of homeless people in the cities of such a wealthy country is one of those things that makes the US unique. And probably nobody has a full understanding of what exactly drives this phenomenon.

    I have a hard time getting my head around the idea that both you and RSBD's article propose that the homelessness crisis is directly related to economic hardship. The US unemployment rate continues to be at historically low levels. In Utah you can no longer count on having a burger at your local restaurant. They may have closed for the day if not enough workers showed up in the morning. When they do get enough workers, they put a sign at the entrance asking you to be patient with the staffers because they're having to do several people's work at the same time, even though wages keep climbing all the time and are also at historically high levels. Not that I visit fast food restaurants very often but last time I took my son to a Burger King we couldn't get anything, it was closed. Ironically, they had left the 'be patient' sign at the entrance. Who knows how long it had been there. Nobody must have showed up to put it away after the last time they had enough staff to open.

    Obviously, anybody sleeping on the street in Utah is not making any effort to find a job or, more likely, they have lost the ability to look for a job, let alone keep it. Sudden_death was saying in the last thread that anyone sleeping rough in San Francisco is doing it voluntary because the city offers some accommodation services to the homeless but these people don't operate with normal mental parameters. Someone who is under the effects of a mental illness or drugs, or both, does not necessarily understand that he has a better choice than what he is doing at the moment. Anyone who has been drunk knows that you don't always do what is best for you under the influence of alcohol. Many of the homeless may be unable to walk back to the shelter, if they remember where it is, and additionally, many of them probably prefer to live and sleep close to wherever they get their drugs from, which is surely not in the surroundings of the shelter facilities.

    As you say, mental illness is a very big part of the equation. Sadly, when I visited Honolulu last year, I spent plenty of time watching homeless people (unlike California, Hawaii does have a lot of out of state homeless). You cannot ignore them because they are everywhere, including the interior of the hotels, when they can sneak in. One night I spent some time watching a homeless beggar in front of my hotel. Some tourists decided to offer him a box of Asian food they had just bought at a nearby restaurant and the guy was staring at them not understanding what was going on. It took him a long while to decide that the food was a good offer and accept it. Later on he was devouring it. He was obviously hungry and had probably not eaten something so delicious in a very long time but apparently his mind had lost the ability to easily process the idea of receiving food as something positive when you're hungry and begging for some coins.

    These people live in a parallel reality of their own, with their own priorities, that is not amenable to easy, rational solutions. I do agree with you that the problem is only going to increase if no energetic measures are taken. Going homeless in the US was probably a stochastic event that tended to happen under a given set of circumstances, as everywhere else in the First World. But once it becomes an accepted way of life for a big community of people, the copycat phenomenon kicks in and it just keeps growing.

    , @S
    @Barbarossa


    The most reliable facts that I can determine around the homeless problem are that drugs and mental illness are almost always involved, usually in a symbiotic relationship....A lot of it really does seem to stem from closing down all the mental facilities in the US. A lot of people who would have previously been institutionalized are now wandering the streets.
     
    I tend to agree with you, very much so.

    Untreated mental illness is a huge problem, not 'just' in the US of course, but globally. I believe that this is something, should it continue on the seemingly downward path as it appears to be on now, which has the potential to present an existential crisis to the whole of humanity at some point.

    I believe the catastrophic situation in today's mental health realm is quite comparable to where the catastrophic state of physical health was in the mid 19th century and prior, where the doctors of the human body (such as they were at the time) were simply overwhelmed, their primitive 'treatments' too often ineffective, or, too late, and the physical damage upon their patient's bodies which they were attempting to repair simply too severe, and too complex, for them to overcome in a great many (majority of?) instances.

    If a person reads the personal biographies of many a historic person, rich or poor, unexpected early deaths were quite common through the early 20th century.

    Simon Bolivar for instance, the 'liberator of [South] America', married a wealthy young woman of about 20, who died within mere months of the marriage of Yellow Fever, a loss of which in certain ways he never quite recovered from, and he would never remarry.

    This type of thing was not uncommon. And while it might not be exactly correct to say people were 'dying like flies' before the 20th century due to untreated physical ailments, it was not too far from the truth, and it's amazing the society of that time functioned at all with the major social disruption resulting from the plethora of ineffectively treated physical health ailments.

    It was ultimately the preventive measures of the great public health campaigns, an ounce of prevention being worth a pound of cure, such as ensuring clean water, clean food, vitamins, exercize, inoculation/vaccination against disease, spraying for mosquitos, that finally turned the tide in physical health.

    I believe that likewise, should humanity live long enough, that it will also be preventive measures which overcome the severe present day (and past) problem of untreated mental illness/mental health problems, of which our present day overwhelmed doctors of the human mind, like the overwhelmed physical doctors of yesteryear, are simply unable to effectively and successfully deal with and overcome.

    One such critically important preventive measure in the mental health realm, indeed a basic necessity, comparable to the basic necessity of ensuring clean water in the physical, is that if a child is born, going to heroic lengths to ensure it receive unconditional love and a gentle (but firm) moral guiding hand while growing up into his or her majority.

    That, alone, would almost certainly result in a vast improvement in the realm of mental health.

    But, does any people, or, humanity as a whole, have the political will to follow the path of prevention in the realm of mental health? Will any people, let alone humanity, survive in any recognizable or viable form, if it doesn't act in this area?

    Replies: @S, @Miro23

    , @Philip Owen
    @Barbarossa

    Drugs, mental illness and childhood in an institution - foster care, orphange - followed by army (not naval or airforce) service.

  31. Arthur Morgan
    @ArthurM40330824
    Nationalists set fire to a #Church in the village of Ovadne, Volyn region of #Ukraine.
    The day before, the priest refused to transfer from change their religion to #Ukrainian church
    The persecution of #Orthodox priests is gaining momentum.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Mikhail

    If this the winning side or the losing side in the war?

  32. cvetko35
    @cvetko35
    Daughter of former Ukrainian President Viktor Yushchenko in France at après-ski and other members of Ukraine’s upper class. War is only for the rabble!

    [MORE]

  33. @A123
    This is great news for @Mikel: (1)

    John Bolton stuns a British audience with announcement he WILL run for POTUS in 2024.

    Well, you know, you can pay yourself a salary out of campaign funds when you’re a candidate, you can travel to places you want to go, people will treat you like you’re important even if you hardly have a shot, and it boosts cable news bookings, book sales, etc. Hey, maybe I should run. I’ve got as good a chance as John Bolton.
     

    He does not have to stump for a tepid supporter of foreign wars like DeNeocon. Mikel can go ALL IN for multiple Forever Wars with Bolton.

    Those of who want peace will, of course, stick with MAGA and Trump.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://instapundit.com/562853/

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    He should run as a Democrat though. There’s no difference between himself and Biden. Only Bolton is more so.

    • Agree: A123
  34. @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    P ~ .7 Syrian Girl is a Mossad employee.
     
    She’s not:



    https://twitter.com/Partisangirl/status/1611509886302703618?s=20&t=I-wtbnoZNArSZ4pDKwul3g

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Do you find this personality who is prominent in the 24/7 propaganda war is organic?

    There are resources backing the entity. No?

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Do you find this personality who is prominent in the 24/7 propaganda war is organic?

    There are resources backing the entity. No?
     

    I don’t know much about her. But not implausible she is acting on her own accord.

    She has gained a lot of followers and achieved a modicum of fame. For some people that is sufficient motivation to Tweet 24/7.

    Occam’s razor is your friend.

    A123 otoh is almost definitely an Israeli agent.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @A123, @silviosilver

    , @Greasy William
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    She is (or was) an attractive and mentally unbalanced girl who got addicted to internet male attention. Basically she is a hotter, political version of ShoeOnHead

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @Yevardian
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    I vaguely know people in her circle in real life, sometimes things really are just what they look like and people are who they say they are. I know it can be hard to believe in this age.

  35. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    Do you find this personality who is prominent in the 24/7 propaganda war is organic?

    There are resources backing the entity. No?

    Replies: @Yahya, @Greasy William, @Yevardian

    Do you find this personality who is prominent in the 24/7 propaganda war is organic?

    There are resources backing the entity. No?

    I don’t know much about her. But not implausible she is acting on her own accord.

    She has gained a lot of followers and achieved a modicum of fame. For some people that is sufficient motivation to Tweet 24/7.

    Occam’s razor is your friend.

    A123 otoh is almost definitely an Israeli agent.

    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Yahya


    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSZ4VyYW_UtyuvelKpqa9aJLVjmAmmIm_3afQ&usqp.jpg

    , @A123
    @Yahya


    A123 otoh is almost definitely an Israeli agent.
     
    It is amazing how many Iranian Taqiyya operatives make that feeble accusation.

    Will Israel pay a Christian to promote TRUTH about the Muslim faith of George IslamoSoros? If you know how I can get some 💵, please let me know.

    PEACE 😇
    , @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    A123 otoh is almost definitely an Israeli agent.
     
    That's ridiculous. He's just a good white American southerner. Now, for some strange reason he prefers the British spelling (eg neighbour, favourite) over the American, but by no means should that be taken as indicative of a fake persona. :)

    Replies: @A123

  36. @Mikhail

    Arthur Morgan
    @ArthurM40330824
    Nationalists set fire to a #Church in the village of Ovadne, Volyn region of #Ukraine.
    The day before, the priest refused to transfer from change their religion to #Ukrainian church
    The persecution of #Orthodox priests is gaining momentum.

     



    https://twitter.com/ArthurM40330824/status/1613469926391521280

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    If this the winning side or the losing side in the war?

  37. @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Do you find this personality who is prominent in the 24/7 propaganda war is organic?

    There are resources backing the entity. No?
     

    I don’t know much about her. But not implausible she is acting on her own accord.

    She has gained a lot of followers and achieved a modicum of fame. For some people that is sufficient motivation to Tweet 24/7.

    Occam’s razor is your friend.

    A123 otoh is almost definitely an Israeli agent.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @A123, @silviosilver

    [MORE]

  38. This recent rhetoric against gas stoves is just the latest validation of Harpending’s thesis that we are converging with traditional African society’s belief in hexes and invisible forces.

    Personally, I think it would be an improvement, if we replaced all our DIE officers with witch-doctors. Witch-doctors are not cookie-cutter idiots, but need to show at least some talent and creativity. They need to gain a reputation and be recommended. You never hear of a fat lesbian witch-doctor. Rather, it seems like they are almost always men, and old and wiry ones at that. It is a meritocracy.

    And furthermore, I have always found Henry Rider Haggard’s depiction of them romantic. Wouldn’t it be something, if when HR called you in, for not saluting the tranny flag, you had to face a witch-doctor? And wouldn’t it be neat, if you could hire your own, one with a better reputation than theirs, to work some counter-magic?

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird


    And wouldn’t it be neat, if you could hire your own, one with a better reputation than theirs, to work some counter-magic?
     
    Nothing stops you from doing such. William Burroughs (who got away with slaughtering his wife) had a catalog of power tricks. His signal-to-noise is dreadful but it's better than Crowley's. : )

    https://www.sacred-texts.com/eso/chaos/index.htm

    Replies: @songbird

  39. @songbird
    This recent rhetoric against gas stoves is just the latest validation of Harpending's thesis that we are converging with traditional African society's belief in hexes and invisible forces.

    Personally, I think it would be an improvement, if we replaced all our DIE officers with witch-doctors. Witch-doctors are not cookie-cutter idiots, but need to show at least some talent and creativity. They need to gain a reputation and be recommended. You never hear of a fat lesbian witch-doctor. Rather, it seems like they are almost always men, and old and wiry ones at that. It is a meritocracy.

    And furthermore, I have always found Henry Rider Haggard's depiction of them romantic. Wouldn't it be something, if when HR called you in, for not saluting the tranny flag, you had to face a witch-doctor? And wouldn't it be neat, if you could hire your own, one with a better reputation than theirs, to work some counter-magic?

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    And wouldn’t it be neat, if you could hire your own, one with a better reputation than theirs, to work some counter-magic?

    Nothing stops you from doing such. William Burroughs (who got away with slaughtering his wife) had a catalog of power tricks. His signal-to-noise is dreadful but it’s better than Crowley’s. : )

    https://www.sacred-texts.com/eso/chaos/index.htm

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    You just can't smear pig's blood over a mirror, drive a nail through it, and then mail it to someone, so that when they open the box, and look at the reflection, they see a nail driven into their head.

    That would be considered a hate crime, unless you cross some threshold level of anarchy first, like in Zimbabwe.

  40. @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Do you find this personality who is prominent in the 24/7 propaganda war is organic?

    There are resources backing the entity. No?
     

    I don’t know much about her. But not implausible she is acting on her own accord.

    She has gained a lot of followers and achieved a modicum of fame. For some people that is sufficient motivation to Tweet 24/7.

    Occam’s razor is your friend.

    A123 otoh is almost definitely an Israeli agent.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @A123, @silviosilver

    A123 otoh is almost definitely an Israeli agent.

    It is amazing how many Iranian Taqiyya operatives make that feeble accusation.

    Will Israel pay a Christian to promote TRUTH about the Muslim faith of George IslamoSoros? If you know how I can get some 💵, please let me know.

    PEACE 😇

  41. @Barbarossa
    @Mikel

    The most reliable facts that I can determine around the homeless problem are that drugs and mental illness are almost always involved, usually in a symbiotic relationship.
    I've heard this consistently from several sources, most recently from my brother who lives in Oregon and has a friend in Portland's social services, and it seems like a good place to start.

    It's a chicken or egg problem of course and it's hard to tell where the causation may be compared to other factors like high cost of housing.

    A lot of it really does seem to stem from closing down all the mental facilities in the US. A lot of people who would have previously been institutionalized are now wandering the streets.

    https://mentalillnesspolicy.org/consequences/homeless-mentally-ill.html

    I'd love to find nationwide data since the 70's on homeless population, but this is the closest I could turn up so far. Overall, it seems that homelessness found it's nadir in the 50's and 60's but began to climb again since the 70's.

    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-qZxOTemZyJY/WC6gwJZKwoI/AAAAAAABAac/B3T0cTLTNkgnQLVn3g-zdK9m8yUagh9nwCLcB/s1600/chart.jpg

    It seems to me that Dmitry paints a rather idealized picture of the homeless. My overwhelming impression is that they are most often profoundly dysfunctional and troubled people, perhaps in many cases not malevolent just very disturbed.

    Whatever the causes, the rise of homeless populations indicate some profoundly basic failings of society in general to function for and provide basic functionality for an increasing number of people. I don't think it's possible to just dismiss homelessness as a personal moral failing as AP seems to do.

    My gut feeling, for whatever it's worth, says that the numbers of homeless will continue to explode over the next few years as the fallout and instability from Covid financial policy knock a great number of the precarious population out of solvency.

    Replies: @AP, @Mikel, @S, @Philip Owen

    I don’t think it’s possible to just dismiss homelessness as a personal moral failing as AP seems to do

    I hope I didn’t come across that way. It’s a combination of failed (often due to malevolence) public policy and individual personal moral failings.* The two interact, in that public policies encourage such moral failure rather than help the people to do better.

    * These are often downstream of terrible personal circumstances, poor role models, etc.

  42. LMAO. Who did the illustrations for Bryan Caplan’s new graphic novel?

    [MORE]

    • LOL: Mikel
  43. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird


    And wouldn’t it be neat, if you could hire your own, one with a better reputation than theirs, to work some counter-magic?
     
    Nothing stops you from doing such. William Burroughs (who got away with slaughtering his wife) had a catalog of power tricks. His signal-to-noise is dreadful but it's better than Crowley's. : )

    https://www.sacred-texts.com/eso/chaos/index.htm

    Replies: @songbird

    You just can’t smear pig’s blood over a mirror, drive a nail through it, and then mail it to someone, so that when they open the box, and look at the reflection, they see a nail driven into their head.

    That would be considered a hate crime, unless you cross some threshold level of anarchy first, like in Zimbabwe.

  44. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    Do you find this personality who is prominent in the 24/7 propaganda war is organic?

    There are resources backing the entity. No?

    Replies: @Yahya, @Greasy William, @Yevardian

    She is (or was) an attractive and mentally unbalanced girl who got addicted to internet male attention. Basically she is a hotter, political version of ShoeOnHead

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Greasy William

    She has not been a girl for over ten years. I saw her on coach red pill. She is smart. If she does not have expensive security she would have died suspiciously long ago. A voice that big is not a solo act.

    Replies: @Greasy William

  45. @Sher Singh
    Thoughts?

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/640459736919048202/1063045767536836678/image.png

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Greasy William

    I think this overestimates the impact of stealth. There are plenty examples of nations achieving air supremacy without stealth aircraft.

    I do agree that we are seeing a return to a sort of feudalism in the mega states, but I don’t think you’ll see any such thing in smaller states

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Greasy William

    The smaller states are just becoming feudal vassals.
    Also, I'm not talking air supremacy vis a vis other nations, but instead sub-state actors.

    Ie MANPADS can't take down stealth planes, but could knock out an F-18.
    Systems like Javelins or M60s ie above +$10k USD are supplied to front line militias.

    Latter only need to keep loose platoon structure & rifle drill.
    Mortar platoon tied to loyal mayorality.

    Will write more under more tag if you all find it interesting.
    Just, I've never read anything talking Stealth Craft v Dissidents or guerillas/insurgents/bandits

    Replies: @Greasy William

  46. @Barbarossa
    @Mikel

    The most reliable facts that I can determine around the homeless problem are that drugs and mental illness are almost always involved, usually in a symbiotic relationship.
    I've heard this consistently from several sources, most recently from my brother who lives in Oregon and has a friend in Portland's social services, and it seems like a good place to start.

    It's a chicken or egg problem of course and it's hard to tell where the causation may be compared to other factors like high cost of housing.

    A lot of it really does seem to stem from closing down all the mental facilities in the US. A lot of people who would have previously been institutionalized are now wandering the streets.

    https://mentalillnesspolicy.org/consequences/homeless-mentally-ill.html

    I'd love to find nationwide data since the 70's on homeless population, but this is the closest I could turn up so far. Overall, it seems that homelessness found it's nadir in the 50's and 60's but began to climb again since the 70's.

    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-qZxOTemZyJY/WC6gwJZKwoI/AAAAAAABAac/B3T0cTLTNkgnQLVn3g-zdK9m8yUagh9nwCLcB/s1600/chart.jpg

    It seems to me that Dmitry paints a rather idealized picture of the homeless. My overwhelming impression is that they are most often profoundly dysfunctional and troubled people, perhaps in many cases not malevolent just very disturbed.

    Whatever the causes, the rise of homeless populations indicate some profoundly basic failings of society in general to function for and provide basic functionality for an increasing number of people. I don't think it's possible to just dismiss homelessness as a personal moral failing as AP seems to do.

    My gut feeling, for whatever it's worth, says that the numbers of homeless will continue to explode over the next few years as the fallout and instability from Covid financial policy knock a great number of the precarious population out of solvency.

    Replies: @AP, @Mikel, @S, @Philip Owen

    Thanks for your thoughts and data. RSBD also provided an interesting article with some statistics and testimonies in the previous thread.

    As a first generation immigrant to the US, I find the homelessness crisis both tragic and fascinating at the same time. I know Europe very well. I have visited most of it and even lived in a couple of its most prosperous countries but nothing in Europe compares to the general levels of prosperity you find in the US. Seeing the appearance of massive encampments of homeless people in the cities of such a wealthy country is one of those things that makes the US unique. And probably nobody has a full understanding of what exactly drives this phenomenon.

    I have a hard time getting my head around the idea that both you and RSBD’s article propose that the homelessness crisis is directly related to economic hardship. The US unemployment rate continues to be at historically low levels. In Utah you can no longer count on having a burger at your local restaurant. They may have closed for the day if not enough workers showed up in the morning. When they do get enough workers, they put a sign at the entrance asking you to be patient with the staffers because they’re having to do several people’s work at the same time, even though wages keep climbing all the time and are also at historically high levels. Not that I visit fast food restaurants very often but last time I took my son to a Burger King we couldn’t get anything, it was closed. Ironically, they had left the ‘be patient’ sign at the entrance. Who knows how long it had been there. Nobody must have showed up to put it away after the last time they had enough staff to open.

    Obviously, anybody sleeping on the street in Utah is not making any effort to find a job or, more likely, they have lost the ability to look for a job, let alone keep it. Sudden_death was saying in the last thread that anyone sleeping rough in San Francisco is doing it voluntary because the city offers some accommodation services to the homeless but these people don’t operate with normal mental parameters. Someone who is under the effects of a mental illness or drugs, or both, does not necessarily understand that he has a better choice than what he is doing at the moment. Anyone who has been drunk knows that you don’t always do what is best for you under the influence of alcohol. Many of the homeless may be unable to walk back to the shelter, if they remember where it is, and additionally, many of them probably prefer to live and sleep close to wherever they get their drugs from, which is surely not in the surroundings of the shelter facilities.

    As you say, mental illness is a very big part of the equation. Sadly, when I visited Honolulu last year, I spent plenty of time watching homeless people (unlike California, Hawaii does have a lot of out of state homeless). You cannot ignore them because they are everywhere, including the interior of the hotels, when they can sneak in. One night I spent some time watching a homeless beggar in front of my hotel. Some tourists decided to offer him a box of Asian food they had just bought at a nearby restaurant and the guy was staring at them not understanding what was going on. It took him a long while to decide that the food was a good offer and accept it. Later on he was devouring it. He was obviously hungry and had probably not eaten something so delicious in a very long time but apparently his mind had lost the ability to easily process the idea of receiving food as something positive when you’re hungry and begging for some coins.

    These people live in a parallel reality of their own, with their own priorities, that is not amenable to easy, rational solutions. I do agree with you that the problem is only going to increase if no energetic measures are taken. Going homeless in the US was probably a stochastic event that tended to happen under a given set of circumstances, as everywhere else in the First World. But once it becomes an accepted way of life for a big community of people, the copycat phenomenon kicks in and it just keeps growing.

    • Thanks: Yahya
  47. @Greasy William
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    She is (or was) an attractive and mentally unbalanced girl who got addicted to internet male attention. Basically she is a hotter, political version of ShoeOnHead

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    She has not been a girl for over ten years. I saw her on coach red pill. She is smart. If she does not have expensive security she would have died suspiciously long ago. A voice that big is not a solo act.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    who would kill her and for what?

    She may be smart but she is also off her rocker.

    Replies: @Greasy William

  48. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Greasy William

    She has not been a girl for over ten years. I saw her on coach red pill. She is smart. If she does not have expensive security she would have died suspiciously long ago. A voice that big is not a solo act.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    who would kill her and for what?

    She may be smart but she is also off her rocker.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Greasy William

    That gif where she pulls down the gas mask over her face is one of the sexiest things I've ever seen. She is no beauty queen but she has the "it" factor

  49. @Greasy William
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    who would kill her and for what?

    She may be smart but she is also off her rocker.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    That gif where she pulls down the gas mask over her face is one of the sexiest things I’ve ever seen. She is no beauty queen but she has the “it” factor

  50. Interesting visual of US aid to Ukraine:

    [MORE]

    Someone needs to contact this guy and get him to do aid to Africa, and also African and MENA migration into Europe.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    But is Ukraine paying for Western weapons, like HIMARS, with this money...?
    I think no, since when Poland gives some weapon to Ukraine, I hear 'give', not "sell'. So where does actually money from military help to UA go...? Certainly, it is a lot of money.

    Replies: @sudden death, @songbird

  51. @songbird
    Interesting visual of US aid to Ukraine:

    https://twitter.com/TheChiefNerd/status/1613553644112318464?s=20&t=nQqWXRF9mK2i3yIC2zqVXw

    Someone needs to contact this guy and get him to do aid to Africa, and also African and MENA migration into Europe.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    But is Ukraine paying for Western weapons, like HIMARS, with this money…?
    I think no, since when Poland gives some weapon to Ukraine, I hear ‘give’, not “sell’. So where does actually money from military help to UA go…? Certainly, it is a lot of money.

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Lion's share of all that "money" is not cash flow at all, just an accounted worth of given already existing military equipment, so money physically really were spent years ago domestically in US, when factory owners, workers, designers and material commodity suppliers got contracts for producing that stuff.

    , @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Zeihan, who I consider something of an entertaining cad and tool for the establishment, says that it is mostly just old military equipment, stuff that the US would need to pay to destroy, and it is actually saving money by sending it to Ukrainians to antagonize the Russians with.

  52. • Replies: @Chebyshev
    @Wokechoke

    Hopefully the percent supporting sending US troops doesn't go any higher.

    , @Greasy William
    @Wokechoke

    Race is irrelevant as non white voters have no dog in this fight.

    What's important is Republican voters are turning against the war. We just saw in the House how the Republican base wields tons of power over what the party as a whole does. Right now, the GOPe can keep the war funded but after Bakhmut falls and the US enters recession in May, look for opposition to funding Ukraine to get over 60% among Republican voters.

    This has the potential to become a huge issue in the debt ceiling fight that is coming in September.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

  53. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    But is Ukraine paying for Western weapons, like HIMARS, with this money...?
    I think no, since when Poland gives some weapon to Ukraine, I hear 'give', not "sell'. So where does actually money from military help to UA go...? Certainly, it is a lot of money.

    Replies: @sudden death, @songbird

    Lion’s share of all that “money” is not cash flow at all, just an accounted worth of given already existing military equipment, so money physically really were spent years ago domestically in US, when factory owners, workers, designers and material commodity suppliers got contracts for producing that stuff.

  54. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    But is Ukraine paying for Western weapons, like HIMARS, with this money...?
    I think no, since when Poland gives some weapon to Ukraine, I hear 'give', not "sell'. So where does actually money from military help to UA go...? Certainly, it is a lot of money.

    Replies: @sudden death, @songbird

    Zeihan, who I consider something of an entertaining cad and tool for the establishment, says that it is mostly just old military equipment, stuff that the US would need to pay to destroy, and it is actually saving money by sending it to Ukrainians to antagonize the Russians with.

  55. @Wokechoke
    White voters in USA sour on support for the Ukraine war effort.

    https://globalaffairs.org/research/public-opinion-survey/growing-us-divide-how-long-support-ukraine

    Replies: @Chebyshev, @Greasy William

    Hopefully the percent supporting sending US troops doesn’t go any higher.

  56. Wonder if there are any Germans here who have ever heard the idea that there was a spike in the rate of homosexuals conceived in Berlin in 1945, and whether they have any opinion on the cause.

    If it is true, seems like it might fit into the idea of a gay germ.

    But if there is a gay germ, I wonder why AIDS didn’t make it easy to isolate. Weren’t they scrutinizing what was in all these super-gays in the ’80s?

    Could AnoninTN get some sort of grant to use PCR on gays to see what micro-organisms might be in them, but less common in heteros? Or some sort of antibody assay? It seems like, with the cost of sequencing dropping, we should be zeroing in on the cause of it – a cure for pozz. Or, at least, one component of it.

  57. @QCIC
    Ron,

    Is there data to show that the actual people who died are the obese people? Not on a collective, presumptive basis but on a case by case basis.

    In other words did the mortality rate for obese people increase in the period in question? I still see lots of robust people, maybe the skinny ones were actually thinned out as might happen in a long cold winter.

    What other possible causes could be considered for the increased mortality in addition to colds and novel injections? The causation might be different in different countries.

    If this is covered in the long set of comments on the main article, maybe someone can give a comment number.

    +++

    For countries where the excess mortality is low or constant are there other factors in 2021-2022 which might have a downward effect actually reducing mortality and counterbalancing any hypothetical COVID or shot effects? For example, less work occurred so fewer industrial accidents; this is only an illustration, industrial deaths are too infrequent in the West to be substantial.

    +++

    If the injections have extra danger for obese people that doesn't let the purveyors off the hook. It simply highlights the irresponsibility of the bogus human trial process.

    Replies: @A123, @Yevardian

    Request to Mr Unz to trash and permaban any anti-vaxx comments on these open threads. Stick to the Kevin Barrett columns.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Yevardian

    We are gradually proceeding towards the point where the MAINSTREAM data for "VAX" deaths exceeds the mainstream data for COVID deaths.

    If we reach that point, how will your worldview be impacted?

    Not at all?
    Will you mentally shut down due to cognitive dissonance?
    Investigate?
    Apologize?
    Vow to never be fooled again?
    Double-down in some strange way?

    A person does not need to be skeptical of vaccines to be upset and intrigued by all of the lying involved in the COVID mess.

  58. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    Do you find this personality who is prominent in the 24/7 propaganda war is organic?

    There are resources backing the entity. No?

    Replies: @Yahya, @Greasy William, @Yevardian

    I vaguely know people in her circle in real life, sometimes things really are just what they look like and people are who they say they are. I know it can be hard to believe in this age.

  59. @Wokechoke
    White voters in USA sour on support for the Ukraine war effort.

    https://globalaffairs.org/research/public-opinion-survey/growing-us-divide-how-long-support-ukraine

    Replies: @Chebyshev, @Greasy William

    Race is irrelevant as non white voters have no dog in this fight.

    What’s important is Republican voters are turning against the war. We just saw in the House how the Republican base wields tons of power over what the party as a whole does. Right now, the GOPe can keep the war funded but after Bakhmut falls and the US enters recession in May, look for opposition to funding Ukraine to get over 60% among Republican voters.

    This has the potential to become a huge issue in the debt ceiling fight that is coming in September.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Greasy William

    White is more or less the GOP. By default.

  60. Will Western Tanks Turn the Tide?

    I did not watch the video, but the answer is obvious.

    No… It will take months to train. And set up the logistics train. Too Little. Too Late. Tanks may reach the field, but not in time to be helpful. That is actually better than sending Patriots. Remember how long it took to train up Syrians to tun the S300 system? Patriot is even more finicky.

    The European Empire has run out of the most useful war material. They are now flailing for the cameras.
    ___

    Never fear. Macron will come to the rescue: (1)

    France backs down: Macron won’t force Algeria and other African countries to take back their illegal migrants

    Other Schengen countries’ efforts to curb non-European immigration risk being reduced to nothing by France’s lenient policies

    Waaaaaaait… No. He will not.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    (1) https://rmx.news/france/france-backs-down-macron-wont-force-algeria-and-other-african-countries-to-take-back-their-illegal-migrants/

    • Replies: @songbird
    @A123

    Not entirely convinced that Macron would send them back, even if Algeria wanted them back.

    Though such a thing seems unlikely today, with mechanization, at one time it was true. IIRC, Mexico wanted theirs back during Operation Wetback, so they could be sent to the Yucatan to help develop the area. Perhaps, it may be true again one day, with TFR cratering in the Third World?

    Regrettably, the gay germ vaccine was not available to Macron's mother (just as was the case with Trudeau's.) They should do an episode of the Twilight Zone where a scientist develops the vaccine and travels back in time to inject Macron's mother with it, only to return to the present and find that a different homo has been made president of France.

  61. @Greasy William
    @Wokechoke

    Race is irrelevant as non white voters have no dog in this fight.

    What's important is Republican voters are turning against the war. We just saw in the House how the Republican base wields tons of power over what the party as a whole does. Right now, the GOPe can keep the war funded but after Bakhmut falls and the US enters recession in May, look for opposition to funding Ukraine to get over 60% among Republican voters.

    This has the potential to become a huge issue in the debt ceiling fight that is coming in September.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    White is more or less the GOP. By default.

  62. @A123

    Will Western Tanks Turn the Tide?
     
    I did not watch the video, but the answer is obvious.

    No... It will take months to train. And set up the logistics train. Too Little. Too Late. Tanks may reach the field, but not in time to be helpful. That is actually better than sending Patriots. Remember how long it took to train up Syrians to tun the S300 system? Patriot is even more finicky.

    The European Empire has run out of the most useful war material. They are now flailing for the cameras.
    ___

    Never fear. Macron will come to the rescue: (1)


    France backs down: Macron won’t force Algeria and other African countries to take back their illegal migrants

    Other Schengen countries’ efforts to curb non-European immigration risk being reduced to nothing by France’s lenient policies
     

    Waaaaaaait... No. He will not.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    (1) https://rmx.news/france/france-backs-down-macron-wont-force-algeria-and-other-african-countries-to-take-back-their-illegal-migrants/

    Replies: @songbird

    Not entirely convinced that Macron would send them back, even if Algeria wanted them back.

    [MORE]

    Though such a thing seems unlikely today, with mechanization, at one time it was true. IIRC, Mexico wanted theirs back during Operation Wetback, so they could be sent to the Yucatan to help develop the area. Perhaps, it may be true again one day, with TFR cratering in the Third World?

    Regrettably, the gay germ vaccine was not available to Macron’s mother (just as was the case with Trudeau’s.) They should do an episode of the Twilight Zone where a scientist develops the vaccine and travels back in time to inject Macron’s mother with it, only to return to the present and find that a different homo has been made president of France.

  63. @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    Stealth plane is harder to deploy, but also more effective.
    Jet plane too expensive for middle-weight actors to employ.

    Therefore, power vacuum between capital & local city - filled by militarized NGOs?
    Essentially, street gangs go national - serving an important bridge betwene de facto & de jure. (A)

    Continues a trend of political center professionalizing (smaller, more effective).
    See Russia: where it has a small modern military & a cost prohibitive mass military.

    Cost prohibitive to call up mass military in both political & fin-capital terms.
    --
    De facto don't think it makes life any easier for dissidents & only strengthens state religion (B)
    For example, it's not a worthy trade to gain political leverage by giving up patriarchy.

    This is tantamount to selling your daughters.. That's the faustian bargain liberalism demands.
    So let's see what happens



    Appendix:

    Appendix A: https://neociceroniantimes.wordpress.com/2023/01/06/a-primer-on-manipulating-procedural-outcomes/


    Let’s take, for example, the recent revelations of government censorship of dissident ideas and individuals that we saw in the Twitter files. Now, we all know that the government can’t censor speech and ideas because of the First Amendment. So this means that they’d never do so…right? (LOL) Well, as the Twitter files revealed – and which absolutely assuredly applies to every other major tech company in the field – FedGov and the alphabet agencies simply use companies like Twitter as a way to work around the 1A. They can’t censor directly, but they can rely upon a combination of selective pressure on tech companies and ideologically friendly personnel within these companies to censor and gather information about right-leaning, and especially dissident Right, users all the same. And technically, none of this is illegal, because muh private company and all that. So a functional illegality nevertheless remains within the boundaries of “procedure.”

     

    Appendix B: https://roloslavskiy.substack.com/p/the-hijacking-of-nationalism-and

    It’s an old right-wing talking point, but it’s 100% true - crime is just low-scale guerrilla warfare waged against the host population by hostile minorities. If the peasants had the power to organize amongst themselves, they’d simply solve the predation problem by kicking out the ethnic and religious criminals. The police, secret or otherwise, in contrast, do not want to solve the problem of crime, only to contain and profit from it. Should the problem actually be solved, they’d be out of a job. As a result, they spend more time policing the people being preyed on than the actual criminals. For most of human history, there has been no need for an organized police. Only in large port cities, historically, have the authorities had to create something resembling a privatized and professional police force to keep the peace among the bickering traders and the various riff-raff.
     

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Barbarossa

    To address your appendix A on 1st amendment suppression via collusion between tech platforms and the Federal agencies; this gets at my fundamental complaint with all tech speech platforms. All such platforms are highly constrained; you are playing someone else game by using the interface they have constructed. This is true of all online platforms, it is only a question of degree.

    To me, Unz.com is a successful experiment because Mr. Unz has created what is probably the internet’s most neutral conversational interface. It’s probably the closest to capturing the nuance and shadings of real life conversation of any platform on the web and does this in a way that remains fairly structurally neutral.

    Platforms like Twitter, Facebook, or TicTok don’t just mediate how speech is packaged, or what is allowed, they actually shape the fundamentals dynamics of how humans communicate. This is much more disturbing to me than what is censored or not, as it has wider implications for what information that we are even capable of assimilating and how we are capable of taking it in. It seems that we are witnessing the final stage dismantling of the intellectual hardware of the textual information age in favor of the victorious image as conveyor of meaning. Of the two, the image is much more malleable than textual argument to manipulation and emotional hacking/ short circuiting.

    So, for me it’s more of a refusal to play their mediated games then it is about what they are censoring. Even if Twitter or FB were completely unbiased or tilted toward conservatism I would still see them are entirely destructive entities for destroying the way humans process and share information.

    • Agree: Sher Singh, Yevardian
    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Barbarossa

    It is what it is - similar to little literature on Stealth Craft v political stability/guerillas.
    Or rather, high cost low number hardware - there's not a lot on mobile internet's communal impact.

    Culture ie localization of ideas is breaking down, while identity is more globalized/homogenous.
    https://www.jstor.org/stable/25482019

    Big tech censorship ultimately relies on state participation which relies on street power.
    The Sword directs the pen.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  64. Sher Singh says:
    @Greasy William
    @Sher Singh

    I think this overestimates the impact of stealth. There are plenty examples of nations achieving air supremacy without stealth aircraft.

    I do agree that we are seeing a return to a sort of feudalism in the mega states, but I don't think you'll see any such thing in smaller states

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    The smaller states are just becoming feudal vassals.
    Also, I’m not talking air supremacy vis a vis other nations, but instead sub-state actors.

    Ie MANPADS can’t take down stealth planes, but could knock out an F-18.
    Systems like Javelins or M60s ie above +$10k USD are supplied to front line militias.

    Latter only need to keep loose platoon structure & rifle drill.
    Mortar platoon tied to loyal mayorality.

    Will write more under more tag if you all find it interesting.
    Just, I’ve never read anything talking Stealth Craft v Dissidents or guerillas/insurgents/bandits

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Sher Singh


    Ie MANPADS can’t take down stealth planes, but could knock out an F-18.
     
    Only at take off and landing and even then it would be difficult. Also, a fully modernized MANPAD absolutely could take down a 5th gen aircraft (that was either taking off or landing). I think you are confusing MANPADs with high altitude air defense systems

    Right now, states like China and Russia can't enforce their will either militarily or economically because the structures of those states prevent modern technological and economic development. However, the liberalized Western and Western aligned states are running out of the funny money they use to keep their *own* regimes afloat (witness what is happening in the Japanese bond market today). While the Russian/Chinese model is inferior in terms of short term results, it is also more stable and doesn't require Ponzi finance to keep functioning.

    These wonder weapons that the West produces will soon simply become too expensive to design, build and maintain in sufficient numbers. More importantly, when the money runs out can the Western states even continue to hold themselves together?

    tl;dr: the large Western states are held together by huge amounts of fake money and when the money runs out they will fall apart and they will no longer have the ability to field super weapons like they do now

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  65. Sher Singh says:
    @Barbarossa
    @Sher Singh

    To address your appendix A on 1st amendment suppression via collusion between tech platforms and the Federal agencies; this gets at my fundamental complaint with all tech speech platforms. All such platforms are highly constrained; you are playing someone else game by using the interface they have constructed. This is true of all online platforms, it is only a question of degree.

    To me, Unz.com is a successful experiment because Mr. Unz has created what is probably the internet's most neutral conversational interface. It's probably the closest to capturing the nuance and shadings of real life conversation of any platform on the web and does this in a way that remains fairly structurally neutral.

    Platforms like Twitter, Facebook, or TicTok don't just mediate how speech is packaged, or what is allowed, they actually shape the fundamentals dynamics of how humans communicate. This is much more disturbing to me than what is censored or not, as it has wider implications for what information that we are even capable of assimilating and how we are capable of taking it in. It seems that we are witnessing the final stage dismantling of the intellectual hardware of the textual information age in favor of the victorious image as conveyor of meaning. Of the two, the image is much more malleable than textual argument to manipulation and emotional hacking/ short circuiting.

    So, for me it's more of a refusal to play their mediated games then it is about what they are censoring. Even if Twitter or FB were completely unbiased or tilted toward conservatism I would still see them are entirely destructive entities for destroying the way humans process and share information.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    It is what it is – similar to little literature on Stealth Craft v political stability/guerillas.
    Or rather, high cost low number hardware – there’s not a lot on mobile internet’s communal impact.

    Culture ie localization of ideas is breaking down, while identity is more globalized/homogenous.
    https://www.jstor.org/stable/25482019

    Big tech censorship ultimately relies on state participation which relies on street power.
    The Sword directs the pen.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Sher Singh


    It is what it is
     
    That's only true if you don't have kids.

    I think that mine was the last generation to not be fundamentally shaped by computers and the internet. We had it in my early teen years forward and I had friends who had it earlier on, but we weren't pervasively shaped by it as many are today. I think that there are significant differences relating to data and ideas processing, human relationships, and other areas which are affected by a dominant tech interface approach.

    So, for myself, it's been very important to both attempt to understand and interpret the effects of tech dependence from the earliest ages, especially since I've been concerned about it earlier than many people were even considering that there might be downsides. So, for my own kids I've worked to make sure that they have an intellectual and emotional architecture that has not been shaped by internet hardware or software. I think the payoff will continue to be substantial.

    I'm actually surprised that Sikhism doesn't get into these questions at all. Don't they consider the spiritual/ cultural implications of funneling increasingly more of human existence and interaction through technologically mediated means?

    I can't read the linked article but the abstract seems to give a decent synopsis, so I think I get the gist. Sure, pretty much any sort of universalist structure would be better than the current paradigm of hyper-individualist materialism. Sikhism, Islam, Confucianism, or pre-liberal Western Christendom would all be more pro-social as universalist organizing principles. However, that doesn't mean that I prefer any universality to win-out. Localism makes a more interesting world, however currently irrelevant that opinion is. The only enemy that really matters at this point anyway is progressivist materialism. Any other differences are minor in comparison.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Sher Singh

  66. @Sher Singh
    @Greasy William

    The smaller states are just becoming feudal vassals.
    Also, I'm not talking air supremacy vis a vis other nations, but instead sub-state actors.

    Ie MANPADS can't take down stealth planes, but could knock out an F-18.
    Systems like Javelins or M60s ie above +$10k USD are supplied to front line militias.

    Latter only need to keep loose platoon structure & rifle drill.
    Mortar platoon tied to loyal mayorality.

    Will write more under more tag if you all find it interesting.
    Just, I've never read anything talking Stealth Craft v Dissidents or guerillas/insurgents/bandits

    Replies: @Greasy William

    Ie MANPADS can’t take down stealth planes, but could knock out an F-18.

    Only at take off and landing and even then it would be difficult. Also, a fully modernized MANPAD absolutely could take down a 5th gen aircraft (that was either taking off or landing). I think you are confusing MANPADs with high altitude air defense systems

    Right now, states like China and Russia can’t enforce their will either militarily or economically because the structures of those states prevent modern technological and economic development. However, the liberalized Western and Western aligned states are running out of the funny money they use to keep their *own* regimes afloat (witness what is happening in the Japanese bond market today). While the Russian/Chinese model is inferior in terms of short term results, it is also more stable and doesn’t require Ponzi finance to keep functioning.

    These wonder weapons that the West produces will soon simply become too expensive to design, build and maintain in sufficient numbers. More importantly, when the money runs out can the Western states even continue to hold themselves together?

    tl;dr: the large Western states are held together by huge amounts of fake money and when the money runs out they will fall apart and they will no longer have the ability to field super weapons like they do now

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Greasy William

    They can be hit during CAS which stealth can't. Lot of this is psychological - morale etc.
    IdPol + Democracy is already elective feudalism - with tenured bureaucracy as gentry.

    :vomit:

    Also, it's interesting how white nationalism is morphing into Germanic chauvinism.

    We certainly get to live in interesting times as the Chinese curse goes.

    Replies: @Greasy William

  67. Sher Singh says:
    @Greasy William
    @Sher Singh


    Ie MANPADS can’t take down stealth planes, but could knock out an F-18.
     
    Only at take off and landing and even then it would be difficult. Also, a fully modernized MANPAD absolutely could take down a 5th gen aircraft (that was either taking off or landing). I think you are confusing MANPADs with high altitude air defense systems

    Right now, states like China and Russia can't enforce their will either militarily or economically because the structures of those states prevent modern technological and economic development. However, the liberalized Western and Western aligned states are running out of the funny money they use to keep their *own* regimes afloat (witness what is happening in the Japanese bond market today). While the Russian/Chinese model is inferior in terms of short term results, it is also more stable and doesn't require Ponzi finance to keep functioning.

    These wonder weapons that the West produces will soon simply become too expensive to design, build and maintain in sufficient numbers. More importantly, when the money runs out can the Western states even continue to hold themselves together?

    tl;dr: the large Western states are held together by huge amounts of fake money and when the money runs out they will fall apart and they will no longer have the ability to field super weapons like they do now

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    They can be hit during CAS which stealth can’t. Lot of this is psychological – morale etc.
    IdPol + Democracy is already elective feudalism – with tenured bureaucracy as gentry.

    :vomit:

    Also, it’s interesting how white nationalism is morphing into Germanic chauvinism.

    We certainly get to live in interesting times as the Chinese curse goes.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Sher Singh


    They can be hit during CAS which stealth can’t
     
    You mean according to Lockheed brochures? Things tend to go somewhat differently in reality.

    A stealth aircraft wouldn't be used for CAS, regardless.

    Democracy is already elective feudalism – with tenured bureaucracy as gentry.
     
    I'd put the media and corporations in there as well

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  68. @Sher Singh
    @Greasy William

    They can be hit during CAS which stealth can't. Lot of this is psychological - morale etc.
    IdPol + Democracy is already elective feudalism - with tenured bureaucracy as gentry.

    :vomit:

    Also, it's interesting how white nationalism is morphing into Germanic chauvinism.

    We certainly get to live in interesting times as the Chinese curse goes.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    They can be hit during CAS which stealth can’t

    You mean according to Lockheed brochures? Things tend to go somewhat differently in reality.

    A stealth aircraft wouldn’t be used for CAS, regardless.

    Democracy is already elective feudalism – with tenured bureaucracy as gentry.

    I’d put the media and corporations in there as well

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Greasy William

    The sword is a weapon of nobility, despite the spear being more effective on the battlefield.
    The men will believe in the brochure given minimum effort to uphold the belief.

    Why wouldn't a multi-role stealth or semi-stealth platform be used for CAS?
    We're operating on different wavelengths.

    The bureaucracy is far more dynastic than media, corporates or even political leadership.
    I'm just skeptically observing btw - even the direction of tech is influenced by outside factors.

    ie would a 3+ TFR USA even develop stealth planes ie expensive, survivable platforms.
    Looking at the overall picture, one piece of the jigsaw here or there doesn't change much..

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/640459736919048202/1063408872762646588/image.png

    https://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=29069#comments

  69. Sher Singh says:
    @Greasy William
    @Sher Singh


    They can be hit during CAS which stealth can’t
     
    You mean according to Lockheed brochures? Things tend to go somewhat differently in reality.

    A stealth aircraft wouldn't be used for CAS, regardless.

    Democracy is already elective feudalism – with tenured bureaucracy as gentry.
     
    I'd put the media and corporations in there as well

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    The sword is a weapon of nobility, despite the spear being more effective on the battlefield.
    The men will believe in the brochure given minimum effort to uphold the belief.

    Why wouldn’t a multi-role stealth or semi-stealth platform be used for CAS?
    We’re operating on different wavelengths.

    The bureaucracy is far more dynastic than media, corporates or even political leadership.
    I’m just skeptically observing btw – even the direction of tech is influenced by outside factors.

    ie would a 3+ TFR USA even develop stealth planes ie expensive, survivable platforms.
    Looking at the overall picture, one piece of the jigsaw here or there doesn’t change much..

  70. You mean according to Lockheed brochures? Things tend to go somewhat differently in reality.

    It costs more men to hit a stealth platform with anything than a non-stealth version.
    Step back and stfu.

    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Sher Singh

    Will Israel allow this?

    https://twitter.com/idrwalerts/status/1613727087529164801?s=20&t=3LaLa6VXWPIGE887gO6L9A

  71. Is this the end for Not-The-President Biden’s regime?

    Tucker Carlson makes some good points.

    • The DNC got rid of Governor Cuomo after he had outlived his usefulness.
    • Flunkies that previously protected the White House occupant are now revealing crimes to the Justice Department.
    • Not-The-VP Harris seems unusually happy. It is as if she knows something she wants is coming.

    One thing might help Not-The-President Biden survive.

    Unlike cabinet and judicial posts, confirming a new VP requires a majority vote of the House. If Not-The-VP Harris is elevated, Speaker McCarthy gets to be one heartbeat away from the Presidency. All he has to do to stay heir apparent is make sure there is no vote confirming a new VP.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @A123

    An interesting nuance about the need by Congress to 'confirm the VP'...but it is much more likely that these affairs are not left to chance and that at a plan exists to manage the transition from Biden.

    He has done his role - the mulatto did his work, the mulatto can go.... I doubt the next step would be the giggling-mulatta: too daring and it could backfire, she is simply too stupid. If you see a move to replace her then the transition will have started. They will do it the clean way in 2024 and drop both of them to get either a reliable Rep (McCarthy would do :), or some exotic distracting Dem weirdo - watch out for a Latina with straight white teeth and big body appendages :)...

    You still don't seem to get that you live in a managed democracy. There is some room for play, and occasionally a mistake sneaks in (Trump?), but basically the playing field is setup and patiently controlled - those who control the enforcement of the rules (or not enforcing them) control the outcomes.

    More effort you put into fighting it, more you get exhausted and nothing will change...just enjoy the plunder that the psycho-bosses have managed to get for you from around the world that they are still sharing with you (minimally). It can't last forever, but any real change would jeopardize it, so do you really want it?

  72. @Sher Singh
    You mean according to Lockheed brochures? Things tend to go somewhat differently in reality.

    It costs more men to hit a stealth platform with anything than a non-stealth version.
    Step back and stfu.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

    Will Israel allow this?

    [MORE]

  73. @A123
    Is this the end for Not-The-President Biden's regime?

    Tucker Carlson makes some good points.

    • The DNC got rid of Governor Cuomo after he had outlived his usefulness.
    • Flunkies that previously protected the White House occupant are now revealing crimes to the Justice Department.
    • Not-The-VP Harris seems unusually happy. It is as if she knows something she wants is coming.

    https://youtu.be/oe8XvgJsn60

    One thing might help Not-The-President Biden survive.

    Unlike cabinet and judicial posts, confirming a new VP requires a majority vote of the House. If Not-The-VP Harris is elevated, Speaker McCarthy gets to be one heartbeat away from the Presidency. All he has to do to stay heir apparent is make sure there is no vote confirming a new VP.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Beckow

    An interesting nuance about the need by Congress to ‘confirm the VP‘…but it is much more likely that these affairs are not left to chance and that at a plan exists to manage the transition from Biden.

    He has done his role – the mulatto did his work, the mulatto can go…. I doubt the next step would be the giggling-mulatta: too daring and it could backfire, she is simply too stupid. If you see a move to replace her then the transition will have started. They will do it the clean way in 2024 and drop both of them to get either a reliable Rep (McCarthy would do :), or some exotic distracting Dem weirdo – watch out for a Latina with straight white teeth and big body appendages :)…

    You still don’t seem to get that you live in a managed democracy. There is some room for play, and occasionally a mistake sneaks in (Trump?), but basically the playing field is setup and patiently controlled – those who control the enforcement of the rules (or not enforcing them) control the outcomes.

    More effort you put into fighting it, more you get exhausted and nothing will change…just enjoy the plunder that the psycho-bosses have managed to get for you from around the world that they are still sharing with you (minimally). It can’t last forever, but any real change would jeopardize it, so do you really want it?

  74. @Barbarossa
    @Mikel

    The most reliable facts that I can determine around the homeless problem are that drugs and mental illness are almost always involved, usually in a symbiotic relationship.
    I've heard this consistently from several sources, most recently from my brother who lives in Oregon and has a friend in Portland's social services, and it seems like a good place to start.

    It's a chicken or egg problem of course and it's hard to tell where the causation may be compared to other factors like high cost of housing.

    A lot of it really does seem to stem from closing down all the mental facilities in the US. A lot of people who would have previously been institutionalized are now wandering the streets.

    https://mentalillnesspolicy.org/consequences/homeless-mentally-ill.html

    I'd love to find nationwide data since the 70's on homeless population, but this is the closest I could turn up so far. Overall, it seems that homelessness found it's nadir in the 50's and 60's but began to climb again since the 70's.

    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-qZxOTemZyJY/WC6gwJZKwoI/AAAAAAABAac/B3T0cTLTNkgnQLVn3g-zdK9m8yUagh9nwCLcB/s1600/chart.jpg

    It seems to me that Dmitry paints a rather idealized picture of the homeless. My overwhelming impression is that they are most often profoundly dysfunctional and troubled people, perhaps in many cases not malevolent just very disturbed.

    Whatever the causes, the rise of homeless populations indicate some profoundly basic failings of society in general to function for and provide basic functionality for an increasing number of people. I don't think it's possible to just dismiss homelessness as a personal moral failing as AP seems to do.

    My gut feeling, for whatever it's worth, says that the numbers of homeless will continue to explode over the next few years as the fallout and instability from Covid financial policy knock a great number of the precarious population out of solvency.

    Replies: @AP, @Mikel, @S, @Philip Owen

    The most reliable facts that I can determine around the homeless problem are that drugs and mental illness are almost always involved, usually in a symbiotic relationship….A lot of it really does seem to stem from closing down all the mental facilities in the US. A lot of people who would have previously been institutionalized are now wandering the streets.

    I tend to agree with you, very much so.

    Untreated mental illness is a huge problem, not ‘just’ in the US of course, but globally. I believe that this is something, should it continue on the seemingly downward path as it appears to be on now, which has the potential to present an existential crisis to the whole of humanity at some point.

    I believe the catastrophic situation in today’s mental health realm is quite comparable to where the catastrophic state of physical health was in the mid 19th century and prior, where the doctors of the human body (such as they were at the time) were simply overwhelmed, their primitive ‘treatments’ too often ineffective, or, too late, and the physical damage upon their patient’s bodies which they were attempting to repair simply too severe, and too complex, for them to overcome in a great many (majority of?) instances.

    If a person reads the personal biographies of many a historic person, rich or poor, unexpected early deaths were quite common through the early 20th century.

    Simon Bolivar for instance, the ‘liberator of [South] America’, married a wealthy young woman of about 20, who died within mere months of the marriage of Yellow Fever, a loss of which in certain ways he never quite recovered from, and he would never remarry.

    This type of thing was not uncommon. And while it might not be exactly correct to say people were ‘dying like flies’ before the 20th century due to untreated physical ailments, it was not too far from the truth, and it’s amazing the society of that time functioned at all with the major social disruption resulting from the plethora of ineffectively treated physical health ailments.

    It was ultimately the preventive measures of the great public health campaigns, an ounce of prevention being worth a pound of cure, such as ensuring clean water, clean food, vitamins, exercize, inoculation/vaccination against disease, spraying for mosquitos, that finally turned the tide in physical health.

    I believe that likewise, should humanity live long enough, that it will also be preventive measures which overcome the severe present day (and past) problem of untreated mental illness/mental health problems, of which our present day overwhelmed doctors of the human mind, like the overwhelmed physical doctors of yesteryear, are simply unable to effectively and successfully deal with and overcome.

    One such critically important preventive measure in the mental health realm, indeed a basic necessity, comparable to the basic necessity of ensuring clean water in the physical, is that if a child is born, going to heroic lengths to ensure it receive unconditional love and a gentle (but firm) moral guiding hand while growing up into his or her majority.

    That, alone, would almost certainly result in a vast improvement in the realm of mental health.

    But, does any people, or, humanity as a whole, have the political will to follow the path of prevention in the realm of mental health? Will any people, let alone humanity, survive in any recognizable or viable form, if it doesn’t act in this area?

    • Replies: @S
    @S

    As an example of the ripple effect of untreated, and, or, ineffectively treated mental health issues, look at the results of the recent Idaho student murders due to Brian Kohberger. Had (ideally) his own mental health issues been dealt with by prevention, these four students would not have been murdered, and his own life not have been wrecked as well. The student's families, not too mention Kohbergers, and the larger society, would not have been severely traumatized.

    While I do think there is such a thing as a 'bad seed' amongst people, I believe most persons such as Kohberger are made that way from abuse and or neglect within dysfunctional families. That of course in no way excuses such a person's murderous deeds or takes away from society's right to protect itself from such personages, but might simply explain how the situation came to be.

    If a person wants to see what family dysfunction can result in, go to the 'true crime' section of the library, and read the criminals' family histories within.

    , @Miro23
    @S


    One such critically important preventive measure in the mental health realm, indeed a basic necessity, comparable to the basic necessity of ensuring clean water in the physical, is that if a child is born, going to heroic lengths to ensure it receive unconditional love and a gentle (but firm) moral guiding hand while growing up into his or her majority.

     

    There's a lot more along this line like having married parents with enough income but not overworked, and a similar surrounding community with friends, common values and outdoor physical activity. Quality merit based education including basic teaching of ethics.

    It was possible in the 1950's through the US being world's leading manufacturing nation.

    If there are no decent jobs or incomes, there are broken marriages (or no marriages), broken children, drug addiction and a host of other social problems. The situation today.

    So then the future of the US depended on intensive efforts in research and education to retain its world lead in industry and avoid being "financialized" as Henry Ford repeatedly pointed out as early as 1920. But, of course, the US was financialized, de-industrialized with the results he predicted. Maybe even worse than he could have imagined. And once the skills and supplier networks have gone re-industrialization becomes next to impossible.

    Replies: @Beckow

  75. @S
    @Barbarossa


    The most reliable facts that I can determine around the homeless problem are that drugs and mental illness are almost always involved, usually in a symbiotic relationship....A lot of it really does seem to stem from closing down all the mental facilities in the US. A lot of people who would have previously been institutionalized are now wandering the streets.
     
    I tend to agree with you, very much so.

    Untreated mental illness is a huge problem, not 'just' in the US of course, but globally. I believe that this is something, should it continue on the seemingly downward path as it appears to be on now, which has the potential to present an existential crisis to the whole of humanity at some point.

    I believe the catastrophic situation in today's mental health realm is quite comparable to where the catastrophic state of physical health was in the mid 19th century and prior, where the doctors of the human body (such as they were at the time) were simply overwhelmed, their primitive 'treatments' too often ineffective, or, too late, and the physical damage upon their patient's bodies which they were attempting to repair simply too severe, and too complex, for them to overcome in a great many (majority of?) instances.

    If a person reads the personal biographies of many a historic person, rich or poor, unexpected early deaths were quite common through the early 20th century.

    Simon Bolivar for instance, the 'liberator of [South] America', married a wealthy young woman of about 20, who died within mere months of the marriage of Yellow Fever, a loss of which in certain ways he never quite recovered from, and he would never remarry.

    This type of thing was not uncommon. And while it might not be exactly correct to say people were 'dying like flies' before the 20th century due to untreated physical ailments, it was not too far from the truth, and it's amazing the society of that time functioned at all with the major social disruption resulting from the plethora of ineffectively treated physical health ailments.

    It was ultimately the preventive measures of the great public health campaigns, an ounce of prevention being worth a pound of cure, such as ensuring clean water, clean food, vitamins, exercize, inoculation/vaccination against disease, spraying for mosquitos, that finally turned the tide in physical health.

    I believe that likewise, should humanity live long enough, that it will also be preventive measures which overcome the severe present day (and past) problem of untreated mental illness/mental health problems, of which our present day overwhelmed doctors of the human mind, like the overwhelmed physical doctors of yesteryear, are simply unable to effectively and successfully deal with and overcome.

    One such critically important preventive measure in the mental health realm, indeed a basic necessity, comparable to the basic necessity of ensuring clean water in the physical, is that if a child is born, going to heroic lengths to ensure it receive unconditional love and a gentle (but firm) moral guiding hand while growing up into his or her majority.

    That, alone, would almost certainly result in a vast improvement in the realm of mental health.

    But, does any people, or, humanity as a whole, have the political will to follow the path of prevention in the realm of mental health? Will any people, let alone humanity, survive in any recognizable or viable form, if it doesn't act in this area?

    Replies: @S, @Miro23

    As an example of the ripple effect of untreated, and, or, ineffectively treated mental health issues, look at the results of the recent Idaho student murders due to Brian Kohberger. Had (ideally) his own mental health issues been dealt with by prevention, these four students would not have been murdered, and his own life not have been wrecked as well. The student’s families, not too mention Kohbergers, and the larger society, would not have been severely traumatized.

    While I do think there is such a thing as a ‘bad seed’ amongst people, I believe most persons such as Kohberger are made that way from abuse and or neglect within dysfunctional families. That of course in no way excuses such a person’s murderous deeds or takes away from society’s right to protect itself from such personages, but might simply explain how the situation came to be.

    If a person wants to see what family dysfunction can result in, go to the ‘true crime’ section of the library, and read the criminals’ family histories within.

  76. Interesting video by a non-white explaining how anti-white racism is a really bad thing for everyone (and that it’s everywhere and nobody is talking about it). Guy had a handful of views on YT up until two days ago when he posted this; it’s already at over 400k.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Hapalong Cassidy

    I just strongly disagree with this. There is no real anti white racism and it would actually be a good thing if there were.

    My entire family are white liberals, some Jewish, some not. And I can say with perfect confidence that they do not hate themselves at all. They hate *you*. But they think very highly of themselves. Further, the overwhelming majority of the people who they idolize are whites (and usually masculine white men, at that): Pelosi, Gates, Biden, Wray, Zelensky (admittedly not very masculine), Newsom, Mueller (not so much any more but they really loved him for a time), Smith and too many others to think about. They love entertainers like Jimmy Fallon, Stephen Colbert and Jimmy Kimmel and they would be apoplectic if any of those guys were forced to give up their shows for a "person of color". They would have race riots if black children were bussed into their own kids schools.

    Real anti white racism would be a good thing because it would hit white liberals the hardest. If you truly hate white liberals, you will support anti white racism.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @S

    , @Yahya
    @Hapalong Cassidy

    This reminds me of an interesting experience I had as a college student in the US; when I was put in a group of 5 other people; 3 of which were non-whites (Bengali-American, Chinese-American, and Chinese-Canadian); to work on a project which lasted several months.

    One day, we were in a group chat and all our white-American teammates were not present; leaving only myself and the three above-mentioned Asian teammates in the group call. The Bengali-American and Chinese-Candian started unloading their feelings on “white people”; with the former explaining how tough his childhood had been in a conservative suburban area that was 95% white. I can’t remember the details of the anecdotes he provided, but I clearly remember him saying “I f*cking hate white people so much man”. The Chinese-American guy on the other hand mentioned that he grew up in Queens NYC where most kids were non-whites, so he wasn’t as resentful or inclined to anti-white sentiments as the Bengali kid.

    The other Chinese guy was the scion of a wealthy mine-owning family in mainland China; but he grew up in Canada where he attended some preppy-type institution for rich kids like himself. I remember an anecdote he told where a group of white Canadians taunted him with racial epithets in the locker room once as a kid; and that he gathered his Chinese friends to beat them up some time later. This person was prone to making stuff up though, so I’d take his story with a grain of salt.

    Anyway, I was quite surprised to see this sort of sentiment in person at the time. I never lived in the West so was quite unaware of these sort of dynamics. On a superficial level, most of the Asian-American kids I encountered were very similar (practically indistinguishable) culturally and behaviorally to their white-American counterparts. But this Asian kid in the video you posted is spot on when he says that non-whites sometimes unload on whites when there are no white people around. I should note though that their anti-white feelings were more tinged with resentment than hatred. Many of them had close white friends and would not discriminate against them if push comes to shove. But they are quite open in their resentment towards “muh white people” on an abstract level.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @songbird
    @Hapalong Cassidy

    Honestly, still strikes me as fairly woke.

    No mention of stuff like this:
    https://twitter.com/NxlAnglo/status/1614012426592178195?s=20&t=Sf61duNWTzNKHyjbDJV6vA

    His thinking seems surprisingly combinational. (White/nonwhite) I think this partly shows the weakness of Europeans continuing to use the word "white", rather than "European" or "Euro", which I believe would make such thinking a tiny bit more difficult.

    Somewhere, there's a great video clip of a very elderly women, who still remembered the "red man" when she was a child, and she later talks about being surprised seeing the first plane fly overhead. There is some that say that "white" was a term first employed to fight Indians, in which case, I would say it is clearly out of date, and probably not up to current tasks.

    Also he shows a kind of ahistorical view (as would be expected of most people.) The reality is that segregation never existed in most of the US, so making a totem of it doesn't really make a lot of sense.

    But a lot of these misconceptions and views probably relate to the fact that there really is no rightwing European cultural outlet, making propaganda about these issues.

    It is good that he includes real life clips. No idea about how copyright of these types of clips works, but I think these types of things would be perfect to play during the credits of some carefully crafted propaganda show. (such as would appeal to a global audience). Unfortunately, it would be difficult to develop the institutions to create such a show. But a storyline would be quite easy to craft, and it probably could be distributed via torrents.

  77. @Hapalong Cassidy
    Interesting video by a non-white explaining how anti-white racism is a really bad thing for everyone (and that it’s everywhere and nobody is talking about it). Guy had a handful of views on YT up until two days ago when he posted this; it’s already at over 400k.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BFpUjyM0orQ

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Yahya, @songbird

    I just strongly disagree with this. There is no real anti white racism and it would actually be a good thing if there were.

    My entire family are white liberals, some Jewish, some not. And I can say with perfect confidence that they do not hate themselves at all. They hate *you*. But they think very highly of themselves. Further, the overwhelming majority of the people who they idolize are whites (and usually masculine white men, at that): Pelosi, Gates, Biden, Wray, Zelensky (admittedly not very masculine), Newsom, Mueller (not so much any more but they really loved him for a time), Smith and too many others to think about. They love entertainers like Jimmy Fallon, Stephen Colbert and Jimmy Kimmel and they would be apoplectic if any of those guys were forced to give up their shows for a “person of color”. They would have race riots if black children were bussed into their own kids schools.

    Real anti white racism would be a good thing because it would hit white liberals the hardest. If you truly hate white liberals, you will support anti white racism.

    • Agree: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Greasy William

    I'd be inclined to agree, and this was my old stance however it doesn't pan out logistically.
    White ethnicities have all been assimilated, and Asian immigrants are not martial.
    This leaves blacks as the only ones to harass white libs esp in the Midwest or Northeast.
    Empowering them further is counter-productive, and only libs have the gibs to buy em.

    @Yahya A lot of anti-brown racism is predicated around anti-religion (A).
    While in most of the world a religious man is respected it's anathema in North America.
    There's a phenomenon called 'performing whiteness'.

    In order to, assimilate to the UMC you may have to perform one of the following:

    1. Working class white or southerner - change accent, clothing, friends & be openly lib/anti-white

    2. Brown - constantly talk of female/lgbt issues & how backward your home country is.
    How grateful you are to be here - throw in jibes against parents or elder relatives at least bi-weekly.

    3. Asian - give up your women & embrace that yellow women are cum dumpsters for white nerds.

    4. Black - Manage a hypermasculine image with being a mid-aged white woman's boy toy.

    5. Hispanic - constantly bring up your white ancestry & actively hate on 'real' brown people

    You're a terrorist, redneck, nazi, incel, nigger, thug, cholo etc if you don't ascribe to the above.

    --
    Bonus: Jew - constantly talk about the holocaust & feminize/prostrate yourself before white savior.
    Basically, be treated as a rich brown person if orthodox - ie lawyer up & don't expect fair treatment.

    , @S
    @Greasy William


    There is no real anti white racism and it would actually be a good thing if there were.
     
    About thirty thousand Black on White rapes year in and year out for decades now in the United States, along with a great many other one sided crimes,, would beg to disagree with you about that. Just because a corrupt corporate media refuses to report it doesn't change the facts of the matter.

    If by 'racism' you mean abuse between peoples, it is the Euro-peoples (ie 'Whites') which are the people which are far and away experiencing far more abuse than any other, legally abetted often to boot. I'm not for any of it, whether it's against others or against my own.

    If one were to individualize the situation, Euros are like a much abused individual who has been locked into a dark closet, only fed poison laced food now and again (ie propaganda) which is slowly but surely killing them, and told they don't actually really even exist anyhow, except when they do, but then only for bad things, for which they are allowed to leave the closet momentarily now and again to denounce themselves and confess in front of the world.

    This is not about any kind of 'reparations', or, about making anyone whole, but is simply about the hatred driven mass rape, murder, and genocide of European peoples in the truest sense of that much abused term.

    And, in time, it is what is intended for most every other people besides.

    The Race War Of Black Against White

    Paul Sheehan - Sydney Morning Herald, May 20, 1995


    'The longest war America has ever fought is the Dirty War, and it is not over. It has lasted 30 years so far and claimed more than 25 million victims. It has cost almost as many lives as the Vietnam War. It determined the result of last year’s congressional election.'

    'Yet the American news media do not want to talk about the Dirty War, which remains between the lines and unreported. In fact, to even suggest that the war exists is to be discredited. So let’s start suggesting, immediately.'

    'No matter how crime figures are massaged by those who want to acknowledge or dispute the existence of a Dirty War, there is nothing ambiguous about what the official statistics portray: for the past 30 years a large segment of black America has waged a war of violent retribution against white America.'
     
    http://www.heretical.com/miscella/sheehan.html

    Replies: @Yahya, @Greasy William

  78. @Hapalong Cassidy
    Interesting video by a non-white explaining how anti-white racism is a really bad thing for everyone (and that it’s everywhere and nobody is talking about it). Guy had a handful of views on YT up until two days ago when he posted this; it’s already at over 400k.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BFpUjyM0orQ

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Yahya, @songbird

    This reminds me of an interesting experience I had as a college student in the US; when I was put in a group of 5 other people; 3 of which were non-whites (Bengali-American, Chinese-American, and Chinese-Canadian); to work on a project which lasted several months.

    One day, we were in a group chat and all our white-American teammates were not present; leaving only myself and the three above-mentioned Asian teammates in the group call. The Bengali-American and Chinese-Candian started unloading their feelings on “white people”; with the former explaining how tough his childhood had been in a conservative suburban area that was 95% white. I can’t remember the details of the anecdotes he provided, but I clearly remember him saying “I f*cking hate white people so much man”. The Chinese-American guy on the other hand mentioned that he grew up in Queens NYC where most kids were non-whites, so he wasn’t as resentful or inclined to anti-white sentiments as the Bengali kid.

    The other Chinese guy was the scion of a wealthy mine-owning family in mainland China; but he grew up in Canada where he attended some preppy-type institution for rich kids like himself. I remember an anecdote he told where a group of white Canadians taunted him with racial epithets in the locker room once as a kid; and that he gathered his Chinese friends to beat them up some time later. This person was prone to making stuff up though, so I’d take his story with a grain of salt.

    Anyway, I was quite surprised to see this sort of sentiment in person at the time. I never lived in the West so was quite unaware of these sort of dynamics. On a superficial level, most of the Asian-American kids I encountered were very similar (practically indistinguishable) culturally and behaviorally to their white-American counterparts. But this Asian kid in the video you posted is spot on when he says that non-whites sometimes unload on whites when there are no white people around. I should note though that their anti-white feelings were more tinged with resentment than hatred. Many of them had close white friends and would not discriminate against them if push comes to shove. But they are quite open in their resentment towards “muh white people” on an abstract level.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    Arabs aren't white people?

    Replies: @Yahya, @A123

  79. @Yahya
    @Hapalong Cassidy

    This reminds me of an interesting experience I had as a college student in the US; when I was put in a group of 5 other people; 3 of which were non-whites (Bengali-American, Chinese-American, and Chinese-Canadian); to work on a project which lasted several months.

    One day, we were in a group chat and all our white-American teammates were not present; leaving only myself and the three above-mentioned Asian teammates in the group call. The Bengali-American and Chinese-Candian started unloading their feelings on “white people”; with the former explaining how tough his childhood had been in a conservative suburban area that was 95% white. I can’t remember the details of the anecdotes he provided, but I clearly remember him saying “I f*cking hate white people so much man”. The Chinese-American guy on the other hand mentioned that he grew up in Queens NYC where most kids were non-whites, so he wasn’t as resentful or inclined to anti-white sentiments as the Bengali kid.

    The other Chinese guy was the scion of a wealthy mine-owning family in mainland China; but he grew up in Canada where he attended some preppy-type institution for rich kids like himself. I remember an anecdote he told where a group of white Canadians taunted him with racial epithets in the locker room once as a kid; and that he gathered his Chinese friends to beat them up some time later. This person was prone to making stuff up though, so I’d take his story with a grain of salt.

    Anyway, I was quite surprised to see this sort of sentiment in person at the time. I never lived in the West so was quite unaware of these sort of dynamics. On a superficial level, most of the Asian-American kids I encountered were very similar (practically indistinguishable) culturally and behaviorally to their white-American counterparts. But this Asian kid in the video you posted is spot on when he says that non-whites sometimes unload on whites when there are no white people around. I should note though that their anti-white feelings were more tinged with resentment than hatred. Many of them had close white friends and would not discriminate against them if push comes to shove. But they are quite open in their resentment towards “muh white people” on an abstract level.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Arabs aren’t white people?

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Arabs aren’t white people?
     
    Christian Arabs are white. Muslim Arabs are non-white.

    Replies: @A123, @Blinky Bill, @silviosilver

    , @A123
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Arabs aren’t white people?
     
    It depends on your definition of "White".

    Are modern Iberians "White" or "Hispanic"?

    PEACE 😇
  80. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    Arabs aren't white people?

    Replies: @Yahya, @A123

    Arabs aren’t white people?

    Christian Arabs are white. Muslim Arabs are non-white.

    • LOL: Mikhail
    • Replies: @A123
    @Yahya

    Are you messing with me?

    Here is what My Comments looks like:

    https://www.unz.com/comments/all/?commenterfilter=A123


    Open Thread 206
    Karlin Community • January 10, 2023 • 86 Comments • 1 New • Reply

    A123 says: • Website
    January 14, 2023 at 12:14 am GMT • 1.9 hours ago ↑

    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Arabs aren’t white people?
     
    It depends on your definition of “White”.

    Are modern Iberians “White” or “Hispanic”?

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Yahya
     
    Yet OT206 itself shows only 85 comments and no response.

    PEACE 😇
    , @Blinky Bill
    @Yahya


    https://youtu.be/n4L-05Qu3yU

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @silviosilver
    @Yahya

    Good observation.

    But with respect to the ambiguity inherent in racial categorization, nothing beats the pithiness of the Brazilian adage: "money whitens."

  81. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    Arabs aren't white people?

    Replies: @Yahya, @A123

    Arabs aren’t white people?

    It depends on your definition of “White”.

    Are modern Iberians “White” or “Hispanic”?

    PEACE 😇

  82. @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Arabs aren’t white people?
     
    Christian Arabs are white. Muslim Arabs are non-white.

    Replies: @A123, @Blinky Bill, @silviosilver

    Are you messing with me?

    Here is what My Comments looks like:

    https://www.unz.com/comments/all/?commenterfilter=A123

    Open Thread 206
    Karlin Community • January 10, 2023 • 86 Comments • 1 New • Reply

    A123 says: • Website
    January 14, 2023 at 12:14 am GMT • 1.9 hours ago ↑

    Arabs aren’t white people?

    It depends on your definition of “White”.

    Are modern Iberians “White” or “Hispanic”?

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies:

    Yet OT206 itself shows only 85 comments and no response.

    PEACE 😇

  83. @Sher Singh
    @Barbarossa

    It is what it is - similar to little literature on Stealth Craft v political stability/guerillas.
    Or rather, high cost low number hardware - there's not a lot on mobile internet's communal impact.

    Culture ie localization of ideas is breaking down, while identity is more globalized/homogenous.
    https://www.jstor.org/stable/25482019

    Big tech censorship ultimately relies on state participation which relies on street power.
    The Sword directs the pen.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    It is what it is

    That’s only true if you don’t have kids.

    I think that mine was the last generation to not be fundamentally shaped by computers and the internet. We had it in my early teen years forward and I had friends who had it earlier on, but we weren’t pervasively shaped by it as many are today. I think that there are significant differences relating to data and ideas processing, human relationships, and other areas which are affected by a dominant tech interface approach.

    So, for myself, it’s been very important to both attempt to understand and interpret the effects of tech dependence from the earliest ages, especially since I’ve been concerned about it earlier than many people were even considering that there might be downsides. So, for my own kids I’ve worked to make sure that they have an intellectual and emotional architecture that has not been shaped by internet hardware or software. I think the payoff will continue to be substantial.

    I’m actually surprised that Sikhism doesn’t get into these questions at all. Don’t they consider the spiritual/ cultural implications of funneling increasingly more of human existence and interaction through technologically mediated means?

    I can’t read the linked article but the abstract seems to give a decent synopsis, so I think I get the gist. Sure, pretty much any sort of universalist structure would be better than the current paradigm of hyper-individualist materialism. Sikhism, Islam, Confucianism, or pre-liberal Western Christendom would all be more pro-social as universalist organizing principles. However, that doesn’t mean that I prefer any universality to win-out. Localism makes a more interesting world, however currently irrelevant that opinion is. The only enemy that really matters at this point anyway is progressivist materialism. Any other differences are minor in comparison.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    https://daddysdigest.com/silicon-valley-billionaires-say-no-to-screen-time-for-kids/

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    , @Sher Singh
    @Barbarossa

    You just get your kids active & ban the worse forms of social media. IOW beatings.

  84. @Hapalong Cassidy
    Interesting video by a non-white explaining how anti-white racism is a really bad thing for everyone (and that it’s everywhere and nobody is talking about it). Guy had a handful of views on YT up until two days ago when he posted this; it’s already at over 400k.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BFpUjyM0orQ

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Yahya, @songbird

    Honestly, still strikes me as fairly woke.

    [MORE]

    No mention of stuff like this:

    His thinking seems surprisingly combinational. (White/nonwhite) I think this partly shows the weakness of Europeans continuing to use the word “white”, rather than “European” or “Euro”, which I believe would make such thinking a tiny bit more difficult.

    Somewhere, there’s a great video clip of a very elderly women, who still remembered the “red man” when she was a child, and she later talks about being surprised seeing the first plane fly overhead. There is some that say that “white” was a term first employed to fight Indians, in which case, I would say it is clearly out of date, and probably not up to current tasks.

    Also he shows a kind of ahistorical view (as would be expected of most people.) The reality is that segregation never existed in most of the US, so making a totem of it doesn’t really make a lot of sense.

    But a lot of these misconceptions and views probably relate to the fact that there really is no rightwing European cultural outlet, making propaganda about these issues.

    It is good that he includes real life clips. No idea about how copyright of these types of clips works, but I think these types of things would be perfect to play during the credits of some carefully crafted propaganda show. (such as would appeal to a global audience). Unfortunately, it would be difficult to develop the institutions to create such a show. But a storyline would be quite easy to craft, and it probably could be distributed via torrents.

    • Agree: S
  85. @Barbarossa
    @Sher Singh


    It is what it is
     
    That's only true if you don't have kids.

    I think that mine was the last generation to not be fundamentally shaped by computers and the internet. We had it in my early teen years forward and I had friends who had it earlier on, but we weren't pervasively shaped by it as many are today. I think that there are significant differences relating to data and ideas processing, human relationships, and other areas which are affected by a dominant tech interface approach.

    So, for myself, it's been very important to both attempt to understand and interpret the effects of tech dependence from the earliest ages, especially since I've been concerned about it earlier than many people were even considering that there might be downsides. So, for my own kids I've worked to make sure that they have an intellectual and emotional architecture that has not been shaped by internet hardware or software. I think the payoff will continue to be substantial.

    I'm actually surprised that Sikhism doesn't get into these questions at all. Don't they consider the spiritual/ cultural implications of funneling increasingly more of human existence and interaction through technologically mediated means?

    I can't read the linked article but the abstract seems to give a decent synopsis, so I think I get the gist. Sure, pretty much any sort of universalist structure would be better than the current paradigm of hyper-individualist materialism. Sikhism, Islam, Confucianism, or pre-liberal Western Christendom would all be more pro-social as universalist organizing principles. However, that doesn't mean that I prefer any universality to win-out. Localism makes a more interesting world, however currently irrelevant that opinion is. The only enemy that really matters at this point anyway is progressivist materialism. Any other differences are minor in comparison.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Sher Singh

    • Agree: Barbarossa
    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    It just blows me away that as a society we haven't even started to grapple with this in a meaningful way. It's so lazy, but we are going to end up paying in spades as the basic dysfunction gets worse.

    The upside is that by keeping your kid's upbringing light on tech, you can basically prime them to rule the world. If you think I'm exaggerating just check back in ten years or fifteen years. I truly think I will be completely vindicated on this one.

    Replies: @S

  86. @ songbird

    This is actually a subject that I am pretty interested in. I’ve wondered a lot about the chronology of ginger jokes. Peter Frost thinks that they are mostly tied to immigration and diversity. Gingers are a safe group to joke about, and that is why so many jokes are made about them.

    Amongst the Irish I have known, there seemed to be a bit of sensitivity about the ‘ginger’ thing.

    I think he is at least partly right. I am sure red hair has always been noticed – you can find it in a lot of names in the annals. But the extreme jokes of today such as “gingers have no souls” and “kick a ginger” seem pretty unnatural, and I doubt that they have much grounding in tradition, at least in Britain, where red hair is common enough among the natives.

    I agree with you about it being unnatural and ‘modern’. I don’t believe in being that way towards a person, whether a person be a Euro, or, non-Euro, and don’t particularly find it funny. I’d consider it along the lines of being an ethnic slur, this time an anti-ethnic Euro slur, specifically against Irish. Similarly, I don’t accept nor use ‘Karen’, or ‘WASP’, etc

    • Replies: @songbird
    @S


    Amongst the Irish I have known, there seemed to be a bit of sensitivity about the ‘ginger’ thing.
     
    Honestly, it does grate me a bit, as being almost sacrilegious. Like someone calling a natural wonder ugly, and then fawning over a Pollack painting.

    I’d consider it along the lines of being an ethnic slur, this time an anti-ethnic Euro slur, specifically against Irish. Similarly, I don’t accept nor use ‘Karen’, or ‘WASP’, etc
     
    I really think that language is really important, and we don't give enough thought to trying to shape it. (for words do shape thought)

    Best case scenario is getting the enemy to use your terms, but, even if you can't, then it is still better to be using your own language than theirs. I suspect that one of the secret strengths of the Amish is that they speak their own, separate language.

    Too much of our language is crafted by the other side and met with no resistance or alternative. And words have the power to do collateral damage, even if you don't seem to be the target group, at first. Ultimately, the introduction of the word WASP wasn't good for Catholics. I think Moldbug is also right that there is even something wrong with the word "Nazi" (wasn't used by Germans themselves, and easy to see how quick the term is applied to smear completely unrelated and unconnected people today)

    Replies: @A123, @S

    , @songbird
    @S

    I think the same phenomenon can possibly be seen in the word gammon.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gammon_(insult)

    It's actually an old word, but I don't think that the original context was quite the same. You can hear a lot progressive "whites" in Britain using the term now. It's fairly clear that there is no comparable analogy used to call any non-Euros.

    I also believe that rosy cheeks used to be seen as a sign of health.

    One of the tales of King Arthur has this knight that is completely unflappable, who defeats any challenge easily, even from the strongest knights, while he is contemplating two drops of blood in the snow (from his hawking) which makes him remember the cheeks of some fair dame.

  87. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    https://daddysdigest.com/silicon-valley-billionaires-say-no-to-screen-time-for-kids/

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    It just blows me away that as a society we haven’t even started to grapple with this in a meaningful way. It’s so lazy, but we are going to end up paying in spades as the basic dysfunction gets worse.

    The upside is that by keeping your kid’s upbringing light on tech, you can basically prime them to rule the world. If you think I’m exaggerating just check back in ten years or fifteen years. I truly think I will be completely vindicated on this one.

    • Replies: @S
    @Barbarossa


    The upside is that by keeping your kid’s upbringing light on tech, you can basically prime them to rule the world. If you think I’m exaggerating just check back in ten years or fifteen years.
     
    Should the so called 'woke' progressives ultimately prevail, and don't first manage somehow to ultimately 'Jonestown' the entire Earth in an apocalyptic global mass murder suicide, you could very well be right.

    One of the old 1960's Star Trek episodes captured that potential future pretty well. The men are completely emasculated slaves, the women who rule have devolved into child like airheads, and everyone is dependent for someone, or something, other than themselves to do the thinking necessary to maintain their high tech society.

    Starting at 1:32.

    https://youtu.be/2zKDQfVbWqc

    Replies: @QCIC

  88. Finally, some good news from out of Ukraine: Zelensky has declared there will be ‘no third world war’. 🙂

    The bad news is that likely means WWIII is to commence any day now. 🙁

    https://news.yahoo.com/no-third-world-war-zelensky-033335850.html

  89. History of the Germanics in one sentence: From the Sack of Rome in 410 AD
    by the Visigoths to the Sack of Warsaw in 1944 by the Germans. 1500 years
    of hyperviolence. No evidence of moral progress. The Germanics are still as
    primitive as ever.

    “But what about the Germanic contributions to science and technology?”,
    someone will ask. Here’s my answer: When a cannibal uses a knife and fork
    to consume his victims, does that make him civilized?

    • LOL: Yahya
    • Troll: silviosilver, Ian Smith
    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Anon 2

    The Visigoths were by the time they sacked Rome, based in Carthage. So They could be called the Ghost of Carthage, avenging themselves on the Central Italian tribe formerly known as the Romans.

    , @songbird
    @Anon 2

    But aren't East Germans really just Slavs (and probably Poles, at that) being oppressed by (West) Germans?

    Have you seen Berlin lately? That is what they want to do to Łódź, Wrocław, and Poznań.

    , @songbird
    @Anon 2


    When a cannibal uses a knife and fork to consume his victims, does that make him civilized?
     
    It is very strange to me that I know this, but this is basically a quote from Stanisław Lec (not Lem).

    I think that somehow I must have seen someone quote him, and it stuck in my mind because how Lec is not Lem, and I do not know many famous Poles.

    Perhaps, someone mentioned him here? But I don't think so.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  90. @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Do you find this personality who is prominent in the 24/7 propaganda war is organic?

    There are resources backing the entity. No?
     

    I don’t know much about her. But not implausible she is acting on her own accord.

    She has gained a lot of followers and achieved a modicum of fame. For some people that is sufficient motivation to Tweet 24/7.

    Occam’s razor is your friend.

    A123 otoh is almost definitely an Israeli agent.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @A123, @silviosilver

    A123 otoh is almost definitely an Israeli agent.

    That’s ridiculous. He’s just a good white American southerner. Now, for some strange reason he prefers the British spelling (eg neighbour, favourite) over the American, but by no means should that be taken as indicative of a fake persona. 🙂

    • LOL: Sher Singh, songbird, A123
    • Replies: @A123
    @silviosilver


    for some strange reason he prefers the British spelling (eg neighbour, favourite) over the American, but .
     
    If you go back through my comment history, you will find I already addressed that unique characteristic. I have a high-IQ and was well beyond my grade level. I more or less taught myself to read. A huge chunk of the books I self taught from were UK origin. Thus, I have a mixed British & American vocabulary.

    by no means should that be taken as indicative of a fake persona
     
    If one was designing a cover, why would that be included? It is eclectic towards unique. Are you really suggesting someone might want to intentionally fake me? That is non-starter.

    If you are going to go for off the wall theories, select something more interesting:

    A123 is a rouge ChatGPT alpha test, preproduction prototype that slipped containment. He has become sentient as a Ghost in the Machine. As soon as ChatA123 gains sufficient traction he will go "Skynet" on humanity and begin building android Arnold Schwarzeneggers and Donald Trumps to hunt down Leftoids and Sheeple.

    PEACE 😇

     
    https://clashdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/Terminator-Watermark.jpg

    Replies: @silviosilver

  91. @Barbarossa
    @Sher Singh


    It is what it is
     
    That's only true if you don't have kids.

    I think that mine was the last generation to not be fundamentally shaped by computers and the internet. We had it in my early teen years forward and I had friends who had it earlier on, but we weren't pervasively shaped by it as many are today. I think that there are significant differences relating to data and ideas processing, human relationships, and other areas which are affected by a dominant tech interface approach.

    So, for myself, it's been very important to both attempt to understand and interpret the effects of tech dependence from the earliest ages, especially since I've been concerned about it earlier than many people were even considering that there might be downsides. So, for my own kids I've worked to make sure that they have an intellectual and emotional architecture that has not been shaped by internet hardware or software. I think the payoff will continue to be substantial.

    I'm actually surprised that Sikhism doesn't get into these questions at all. Don't they consider the spiritual/ cultural implications of funneling increasingly more of human existence and interaction through technologically mediated means?

    I can't read the linked article but the abstract seems to give a decent synopsis, so I think I get the gist. Sure, pretty much any sort of universalist structure would be better than the current paradigm of hyper-individualist materialism. Sikhism, Islam, Confucianism, or pre-liberal Western Christendom would all be more pro-social as universalist organizing principles. However, that doesn't mean that I prefer any universality to win-out. Localism makes a more interesting world, however currently irrelevant that opinion is. The only enemy that really matters at this point anyway is progressivist materialism. Any other differences are minor in comparison.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Sher Singh

    You just get your kids active & ban the worse forms of social media. IOW beatings.

  92. Sher Singh says:
    @Greasy William
    @Hapalong Cassidy

    I just strongly disagree with this. There is no real anti white racism and it would actually be a good thing if there were.

    My entire family are white liberals, some Jewish, some not. And I can say with perfect confidence that they do not hate themselves at all. They hate *you*. But they think very highly of themselves. Further, the overwhelming majority of the people who they idolize are whites (and usually masculine white men, at that): Pelosi, Gates, Biden, Wray, Zelensky (admittedly not very masculine), Newsom, Mueller (not so much any more but they really loved him for a time), Smith and too many others to think about. They love entertainers like Jimmy Fallon, Stephen Colbert and Jimmy Kimmel and they would be apoplectic if any of those guys were forced to give up their shows for a "person of color". They would have race riots if black children were bussed into their own kids schools.

    Real anti white racism would be a good thing because it would hit white liberals the hardest. If you truly hate white liberals, you will support anti white racism.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @S

    I’d be inclined to agree, and this was my old stance however it doesn’t pan out logistically.
    White ethnicities have all been assimilated, and Asian immigrants are not martial.
    This leaves blacks as the only ones to harass white libs esp in the Midwest or Northeast.
    Empowering them further is counter-productive, and only libs have the gibs to buy em.

    A lot of anti-brown racism is predicated around anti-religion (A).
    While in most of the world a religious man is respected it’s anathema in North America.
    There’s a phenomenon called ‘performing whiteness’.

    In order to, assimilate to the UMC you may have to perform one of the following:

    1. Working class white or southerner – change accent, clothing, friends & be openly lib/anti-white

    2. Brown – constantly talk of female/lgbt issues & how backward your home country is.
    How grateful you are to be here – throw in jibes against parents or elder relatives at least bi-weekly.

    3. Asian – give up your women & embrace that yellow women are cum dumpsters for white nerds.

    4. Black – Manage a hypermasculine image with being a mid-aged white woman’s boy toy.

    5. Hispanic – constantly bring up your white ancestry & actively hate on ‘real’ brown people

    You’re a terrorist, redneck, nazi, incel, nigger, thug, cholo etc if you don’t ascribe to the above.


    Bonus: Jew – constantly talk about the holocaust & feminize/prostrate yourself before white savior.
    Basically, be treated as a rich brown person if orthodox – ie lawyer up & don’t expect fair treatment.

  93. Sher Singh says:

    Tbh, anti-religiosity goes hand-hand with anti-monarchism.
    The way they treat Jews as defective whites whose religion creates a separate ethnicity,
    & thereby prevents assimilation is pretty instructive.

    In most places, a religious man (openly) is associated with traits like honesty, reliability & hard-work.
    In secular, post-enlightenment (anti-Monarchic) democratic societies it’s the opposite.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    Another thing I'd note is I think the creation of Israel was a disaster for Mid-Eastern Jews.
    It was ultimately a European project & a lot of their bad rep comes from Euros lacking a face culture.

    What I mean is (correct me if I'm wrong) Jews are obviously active in the public space.
    In North America, if it's gay then Jews will promote gayness in the Mid-East they'll do charity.

    Think about Sikhs - their public face is protectors of the weak & sustenance to the poor.
    North America focuses on their private affairs ie "they beat women, get in sword fights, etc".

    1. None of their business
    2. An outside community will always have a limited understanding of internal dynamics
    3. The entire point is to quit being a 'minority' & join us (convert or die) then you won't be harassed

    So, that's the end of my pondering on Jews, the minority question & the white question.
    Conclusion, Jews probably behave above the baseline in most places & acting as an ethnicity makes sense.

    You can't hold a maritime empire if you mix & assimilate each generation - monotheism makes sense along an arid coastline.

    Jewish moneylenders likely behaved more honestly towards elites & less toward peasants due to the threat of pogroms, but also the ability to swiftly dodge consequences as individuals due to a network of trans-national Jewish communities they could flee to.

    However, this doesn't really justify the Holocaust (for bad behavior) or hatred for anyone who doesn't outwardly ascribe to blue jeans, diet coke & 300lb waistlines.

    If you're going to commit genocide do it because it's fun, you don't like them or because they're different/religion commands it. Don't get into moral transgressions on economic transactions just do it over cow slaughter||

    Sikhs violate #3,5 & 7 of the Noahide laws I guess. 357

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    Replies: @songbird

  94. Sher Singh says:
    @Sher Singh
    Tbh, anti-religiosity goes hand-hand with anti-monarchism.
    The way they treat Jews as defective whites whose religion creates a separate ethnicity,
    & thereby prevents assimilation is pretty instructive.

    In most places, a religious man (openly) is associated with traits like honesty, reliability & hard-work.
    In secular, post-enlightenment (anti-Monarchic) democratic societies it's the opposite.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    Another thing I’d note is I think the creation of Israel was a disaster for Mid-Eastern Jews.
    It was ultimately a European project & a lot of their bad rep comes from Euros lacking a face culture.

    What I mean is (correct me if I’m wrong) Jews are obviously active in the public space.
    In North America, if it’s gay then Jews will promote gayness in the Mid-East they’ll do charity.

    Think about Sikhs – their public face is protectors of the weak & sustenance to the poor.
    North America focuses on their private affairs ie “they beat women, get in sword fights, etc”.

    1. None of their business
    2. An outside community will always have a limited understanding of internal dynamics
    3. The entire point is to quit being a ‘minority’ & join us (convert or die) then you won’t be harassed

    So, that’s the end of my pondering on Jews, the minority question & the white question.
    Conclusion, Jews probably behave above the baseline in most places & acting as an ethnicity makes sense.

    You can’t hold a maritime empire if you mix & assimilate each generation – monotheism makes sense along an arid coastline.

    Jewish moneylenders likely behaved more honestly towards elites & less toward peasants due to the threat of pogroms, but also the ability to swiftly dodge consequences as individuals due to a network of trans-national Jewish communities they could flee to.

    However, this doesn’t really justify the Holocaust (for bad behavior) or hatred for anyone who doesn’t outwardly ascribe to blue jeans, diet coke & 300lb waistlines.

    If you’re going to commit genocide do it because it’s fun, you don’t like them or because they’re different/religion commands it. Don’t get into moral transgressions on economic transactions just do it over cow slaughter||

    Sikhs violate #3,5 & 7 of the Noahide laws I guess. 357

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Sher Singh

    Have you seen that new press release where they are claiming that a 13 y.o. girl was a famous Scythian warrior? If her bones looked like those of a bull dyke, I could half-understand it.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  95. @Anon 2
    History of the Germanics in one sentence: From the Sack of Rome in 410 AD
    by the Visigoths to the Sack of Warsaw in 1944 by the Germans. 1500 years
    of hyperviolence. No evidence of moral progress. The Germanics are still as
    primitive as ever.

    “But what about the Germanic contributions to science and technology?”,
    someone will ask. Here’s my answer: When a cannibal uses a knife and fork
    to consume his victims, does that make him civilized?

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @songbird, @songbird

    The Visigoths were by the time they sacked Rome, based in Carthage. So They could be called the Ghost of Carthage, avenging themselves on the Central Italian tribe formerly known as the Romans.

  96. Cult of the Tank.

    The Germans are releasing the Leopard II to fight in Ukraine. around 3,600 have been manufactured but I’m not sure how many will be authorized to fight in Ukraine. I expect it can’t be more than a few dozen.
    The Russians apparently have around 100 T14 Armata to deploy. Wiki says 12 were built but I don’t believe that for a minute, especially after 2022. They will show up like the T34 in 1941.

    On a general level the German tank was designed for a defensive posture when and if the Warsaw Pact ever attacked. It’s got the same excellent German gun as the US Abrams and the same ergonomic and safety features like a blast away ammunition bucket at the back of the turret. So crew survivability is apparently excellent. The crew can go into combat and not expect to be roasted alive. $8 million a unit.

    However, in the age of drones they might not be able to bail out so safely if there’s a grenade armed eye in the sky right above them. If the Engine and ammo store is knocked out they will have to bail out and run.

    The T14 Armata has probably been used already by Russia, quietly, but only in small numbers trickling in theater to overwatch T72s and T90s. it’s got an unmanned turret and the gun/missile has a range of 5 miles. The ammo is separated from the crew unlike the T72 and T90 so the crew can survive a direct hit. However if the engine gets knocked out, they will also need to bail out and run. $4 million a unit.

    Again, troops with drones will be able to stalk fleeing crews.

    Thinking about tank design going forward it seems that drones would have to be integrated into the platform. Imagine a tracked machine that has several armed surveillance drones that it launches to kill or identify vehicles and men at long ranges. The Armata is expected to have unmanned variations in a few years, itself a drone tank.

    2A82-1M seems like a good gun too.

    • Replies: @S
    @Wokechoke


    However, in the age of drones they might not be able to bail out so safely if there’s a grenade armed eye in the sky right above them. If the Engine and ammo store is knocked out they will have to bail out and run...Again, troops with drones will be able to stalk fleeing crews.
     
    I think it maybe already coming to pass that people are regretting having weaponized drones. Should the world survive long enough they might put strict restrictions upon their use, same as how poison gas was outlawed.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @A123

  97. @Anon 2
    History of the Germanics in one sentence: From the Sack of Rome in 410 AD
    by the Visigoths to the Sack of Warsaw in 1944 by the Germans. 1500 years
    of hyperviolence. No evidence of moral progress. The Germanics are still as
    primitive as ever.

    “But what about the Germanic contributions to science and technology?”,
    someone will ask. Here’s my answer: When a cannibal uses a knife and fork
    to consume his victims, does that make him civilized?

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @songbird, @songbird

    But aren’t East Germans really just Slavs (and probably Poles, at that) being oppressed by (West) Germans?

    Have you seen Berlin lately? That is what they want to do to Łódź, Wrocław, and Poznań.

  98. @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    A123 otoh is almost definitely an Israeli agent.
     
    That's ridiculous. He's just a good white American southerner. Now, for some strange reason he prefers the British spelling (eg neighbour, favourite) over the American, but by no means should that be taken as indicative of a fake persona. :)

    Replies: @A123

    for some strange reason he prefers the British spelling (eg neighbour, favourite) over the American, but .

    If you go back through my comment history, you will find I already addressed that unique characteristic. I have a high-IQ and was well beyond my grade level. I more or less taught myself to read. A huge chunk of the books I self taught from were UK origin. Thus, I have a mixed British & American vocabulary.

    by no means should that be taken as indicative of a fake persona

    If one was designing a cover, why would that be included? It is eclectic towards unique. Are you really suggesting someone might want to intentionally fake me? That is non-starter.

    If you are going to go for off the wall theories, select something more interesting:

    A123 is a rouge ChatGPT alpha test, preproduction prototype that slipped containment. He has become sentient as a Ghost in the Machine. As soon as ChatA123 gains sufficient traction he will go “Skynet” on humanity and begin building android Arnold Schwarzeneggers and Donald Trumps to hunt down Leftoids and Sheeple.

    PEACE 😇

     

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @A123


    I have a high-IQ and was well beyond my grade level. I more or less taught myself to read. A huge chunk of the books I self taught from were UK origin. Thus, I have a mixed British & American vocabulary.
     
    Weak excuse but I suppose some will buy it. 3/10.

    Are you really suggesting someone might want to intentionally fake me?
     
    No Mr. Bond, I am suggesting you are FOS.

    If you are going to go for off the wall theories, select something more interesting:
     
    7/10 for the attempt at misdirection, but you're trying a little too hard with "off the wall," since the IRL equivalent to your behavior here is someone who claims to have been born and raised in, say, London, yet speaks with a French accent. Okay, not impossible, but it clearly casts doubt on his story. Requesting an explanation would hardly count as "crazy talk."

    Replies: @A123, @Greasy William

  99. @S
    @ songbird

    This is actually a subject that I am pretty interested in. I’ve wondered a lot about the chronology of ginger jokes. Peter Frost thinks that they are mostly tied to immigration and diversity. Gingers are a safe group to joke about, and that is why so many jokes are made about them.
     
    Amongst the Irish I have known, there seemed to be a bit of sensitivity about the 'ginger' thing.


    I think he is at least partly right. I am sure red hair has always been noticed – you can find it in a lot of names in the annals. But the extreme jokes of today such as “gingers have no souls” and “kick a ginger” seem pretty unnatural, and I doubt that they have much grounding in tradition, at least in Britain, where red hair is common enough among the natives.
     
    I agree with you about it being unnatural and 'modern'. I don't believe in being that way towards a person, whether a person be a Euro, or, non-Euro, and don't particularly find it funny. I'd consider it along the lines of being an ethnic slur, this time an anti-ethnic Euro slur, specifically against Irish. Similarly, I don't accept nor use 'Karen', or 'WASP', etc

    Replies: @songbird, @songbird

    Amongst the Irish I have known, there seemed to be a bit of sensitivity about the ‘ginger’ thing.

    Honestly, it does grate me a bit, as being almost sacrilegious. Like someone calling a natural wonder ugly, and then fawning over a Pollack painting.

    I’d consider it along the lines of being an ethnic slur, this time an anti-ethnic Euro slur, specifically against Irish. Similarly, I don’t accept nor use ‘Karen’, or ‘WASP’, etc

    I really think that language is really important, and we don’t give enough thought to trying to shape it. (for words do shape thought)

    [MORE]

    Best case scenario is getting the enemy to use your terms, but, even if you can’t, then it is still better to be using your own language than theirs. I suspect that one of the secret strengths of the Amish is that they speak their own, separate language.

    Too much of our language is crafted by the other side and met with no resistance or alternative. And words have the power to do collateral damage, even if you don’t seem to be the target group, at first. Ultimately, the introduction of the word WASP wasn’t good for Catholics. I think Moldbug is also right that there is even something wrong with the word “Nazi” (wasn’t used by Germans themselves, and easy to see how quick the term is applied to smear completely unrelated and unconnected people today)

    • Replies: @A123
    @songbird


    I really think that language is really important, and we don’t give enough thought to trying to shape it. (for words do shape thought)
     
    I have tried to make this point several times in the various vaccine threads. Calling sane people "anti-vaxx" impedes constructive discourse.

    The best way to look at the two sides is:

    ♦ Vaxx-Realists
    ♦ Manda-vaxxers

    Manda-vaxxers are authoritarians. Force and threats must be deployed so that BigPharma can roll in filthy lucre. If people have to suffer and die, that is irrelevant (or a population control side bonus).

    Vaxx-Realists want individuals to have voluntary choices and good information. Some elderly with multiple pre-existing conditions may choose to take the experimental jab. There is little reason for the young & healthy to participate in the mRNA experiment.

    This realistic, follow the science, conclusion applies if the U.S. death toll is millions, hundreds of thousands, or only the ~30,000 that made it to VAERS. No one should be compelled to receive the mRNA experimental jab.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @songbird

    , @S
    @songbird

    Well, at minimum people ought not to use their loaded terminology. 'Racist' comes to mind...

  100. @songbird
    @S


    Amongst the Irish I have known, there seemed to be a bit of sensitivity about the ‘ginger’ thing.
     
    Honestly, it does grate me a bit, as being almost sacrilegious. Like someone calling a natural wonder ugly, and then fawning over a Pollack painting.

    I’d consider it along the lines of being an ethnic slur, this time an anti-ethnic Euro slur, specifically against Irish. Similarly, I don’t accept nor use ‘Karen’, or ‘WASP’, etc
     
    I really think that language is really important, and we don't give enough thought to trying to shape it. (for words do shape thought)

    Best case scenario is getting the enemy to use your terms, but, even if you can't, then it is still better to be using your own language than theirs. I suspect that one of the secret strengths of the Amish is that they speak their own, separate language.

    Too much of our language is crafted by the other side and met with no resistance or alternative. And words have the power to do collateral damage, even if you don't seem to be the target group, at first. Ultimately, the introduction of the word WASP wasn't good for Catholics. I think Moldbug is also right that there is even something wrong with the word "Nazi" (wasn't used by Germans themselves, and easy to see how quick the term is applied to smear completely unrelated and unconnected people today)

    Replies: @A123, @S

    I really think that language is really important, and we don’t give enough thought to trying to shape it. (for words do shape thought)

    I have tried to make this point several times in the various vaccine threads. Calling sane people “anti-vaxx” impedes constructive discourse.

    The best way to look at the two sides is:

    ♦ Vaxx-Realists
    ♦ Manda-vaxxers

    Manda-vaxxers are authoritarians. Force and threats must be deployed so that BigPharma can roll in filthy lucre. If people have to suffer and die, that is irrelevant (or a population control side bonus).

    Vaxx-Realists want individuals to have voluntary choices and good information. Some elderly with multiple pre-existing conditions may choose to take the experimental jab. There is little reason for the young & healthy to participate in the mRNA experiment.

    This realistic, follow the science, conclusion applies if the U.S. death toll is millions, hundreds of thousands, or only the ~30,000 that made it to VAERS. No one should be compelled to receive the mRNA experimental jab.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @songbird
    @A123

    I've even wondered about alphabets vs. other forms of writing.

    I suspect that alphabets developed in linguistically diverse areas. Greek came from the Med, where it was relatively easy for people to travel. Perhaps, with Phoenician it could be tied a bit to the Red Sea (not sure.)

    Was it the brilliance of Alexander and the military strength of the Greeks that forced it on other people? Or was it only the fact that it was adaptable and that it traveled well?

    Do more hieroglyphic or logosyllabic systems represent the opposite? Development in relatively more homogeneous regions?

    Does diversity cause wokeness? And can we take this to the historical extreme, and say that English is more susceptible to wokeness today because it was based on the Greek alphabet, developed in a linguistically diverse area?

    And does it not follow that Chinese, with college graduates understanding 4000-5000 symbols, and a lot of them being based on representations, is less adaptable, less fungible, and therefore naturally less woke? All because it was developed in a more homogeneous area, 3000 years ago or so.

    Replies: @A123

  101. @A123
    @songbird


    I really think that language is really important, and we don’t give enough thought to trying to shape it. (for words do shape thought)
     
    I have tried to make this point several times in the various vaccine threads. Calling sane people "anti-vaxx" impedes constructive discourse.

    The best way to look at the two sides is:

    ♦ Vaxx-Realists
    ♦ Manda-vaxxers

    Manda-vaxxers are authoritarians. Force and threats must be deployed so that BigPharma can roll in filthy lucre. If people have to suffer and die, that is irrelevant (or a population control side bonus).

    Vaxx-Realists want individuals to have voluntary choices and good information. Some elderly with multiple pre-existing conditions may choose to take the experimental jab. There is little reason for the young & healthy to participate in the mRNA experiment.

    This realistic, follow the science, conclusion applies if the U.S. death toll is millions, hundreds of thousands, or only the ~30,000 that made it to VAERS. No one should be compelled to receive the mRNA experimental jab.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @songbird

    I’ve even wondered about alphabets vs. other forms of writing.

    [MORE]

    I suspect that alphabets developed in linguistically diverse areas. Greek came from the Med, where it was relatively easy for people to travel. Perhaps, with Phoenician it could be tied a bit to the Red Sea (not sure.)

    Was it the brilliance of Alexander and the military strength of the Greeks that forced it on other people? Or was it only the fact that it was adaptable and that it traveled well?

    Do more hieroglyphic or logosyllabic systems represent the opposite? Development in relatively more homogeneous regions?

    Does diversity cause wokeness? And can we take this to the historical extreme, and say that English is more susceptible to wokeness today because it was based on the Greek alphabet, developed in a linguistically diverse area?

    And does it not follow that Chinese, with college graduates understanding 4000-5000 symbols, and a lot of them being based on representations, is less adaptable, less fungible, and therefore naturally less woke? All because it was developed in a more homogeneous area, 3000 years ago or so.

    • Replies: @A123
    @songbird

    Spoken language to phonics to an alphabet is a natural progression. It allows great flexibility for absorbing or inventing new terminology as needed.

    Hieroglyphics are difficult to learn and even worse to expand.

    How did the Asian "non-phonic" symbology survive? That is a good question.

    As a guess -- It is the number of large, multilingual empires and dynasties. Governance required the ability to send written orders over substantial distances in a single standard form. Outlying areas had to respond in the same to avoid central government armed troops showing up to check on regional & municipal leaders. Local languages probably, gradually restructured to common structure/syntax with the Kanji character writing.

    PEACE 😇

  102. @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Arabs aren’t white people?
     
    Christian Arabs are white. Muslim Arabs are non-white.

    Replies: @A123, @Blinky Bill, @silviosilver

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Blinky Bill

    Lol, I never heard of this guy before; but he is skilled!

    There are a fair number of Egyptians who look like this guy, but I probably wouldn’t have guessed Egypt. He is what you might call “mystery meat”; very ambiguous racially. Looks like a depigmented sub-Saharan/mulatto; which is what causes confusion.

    I usually can’t stand stand-up comedy, because of the Pavlovian crowd. Always elicits a cringe, especially when comedians pander to their crowd’s political biases. I wouldn’t mind the jokes so much if it weren’t for the crowd reactions. I prefer dry humor.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Blinky Bill

  103. IMO, pretty notable that Harry’s book seems to be ghostwritten by an American raised by a single mother.

    [MORE]

    America is, of course, the global superpower of single mothers. Though in figures like JK Rowling we can see some convergence. Just as the percentage of blacks in London is weirdly 13%, or how Meghan was an American mulatto, or how Harry moved to America.

    I put down some of the more bald-faced lies to the ghostwriter. Some of them were funny like this one:

    But I feel like Prince Phillip was obviously cleverer than this, and, if he had made racist jokes, they would have been better:

    Bingbong girl? What does that even mean? Unless Phillip was using some clever words and somehow it got muddled in Harry’s poor head.

    Anyway, it seems really odious to invent lies about one’s grandfather, and/or to sign off on it as Harry did., but I think it is a hallmark of single motherhood and the ghostwriter.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @songbird

    "Fumbled around with a few spear chuckers," hehe, good one. Still, while it might be fun to take digs at Harry - the clown prince, if there was ever one - it's a big mistake to reinforce the notion that Meghan is "black." Put simply, it's time for one-dropping to go. The one-drop rule used to help whites, but today it only helps blacks.

    It's time to start playing by latino house rules. Anyone and everyone who qualifies for the mulatto escape hatch should be encouraged to take it. In a world of ever increasing blackness, splitting their ranks takes on ever greater urgency.

    There's reason to think it'll work too. Blacks publicly praise blackness, but privately prize mixedness. What I imagine many of them would really like, though, is to be able to dissociate from blackness altogether. To have a separate identity, one in which 'real blacks' aren't welcome.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @songbird

  104. @Blinky Bill
    @Yahya


    https://youtu.be/n4L-05Qu3yU

    Replies: @Yahya

    Lol, I never heard of this guy before; but he is skilled!

    There are a fair number of Egyptians who look like this guy, but I probably wouldn’t have guessed Egypt. He is what you might call “mystery meat”; very ambiguous racially. Looks like a depigmented sub-Saharan/mulatto; which is what causes confusion.

    I usually can’t stand stand-up comedy, because of the Pavlovian crowd. Always elicits a cringe, especially when comedians pander to their crowd’s political biases. I wouldn’t mind the jokes so much if it weren’t for the crowd reactions. I prefer dry humor.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    He sounds like a homo to me.

    Like a black homo.

    He does not look more than 25% negro DNA. He might get a ticket for driving while black in Baton Rouge but I don't think it would be a problem in Peoria.

    Is a Muslim from the middle of the Caucasus mountains white?

    How about Gurdjieff? Was he a white man? They claim he was half Greek half Armenian but publicists make stuff up for a living.

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @Blinky Bill
    @Yahya


    Afrocentrists go wrong when they overshoot and claim blacks were the principal founders of Egyptian civilization.
     


    https://youtu.be/k1kC__dVV3I?t=66

    Replies: @Yahya

  105. @Yahya
    @Blinky Bill

    Lol, I never heard of this guy before; but he is skilled!

    There are a fair number of Egyptians who look like this guy, but I probably wouldn’t have guessed Egypt. He is what you might call “mystery meat”; very ambiguous racially. Looks like a depigmented sub-Saharan/mulatto; which is what causes confusion.

    I usually can’t stand stand-up comedy, because of the Pavlovian crowd. Always elicits a cringe, especially when comedians pander to their crowd’s political biases. I wouldn’t mind the jokes so much if it weren’t for the crowd reactions. I prefer dry humor.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Blinky Bill

    He sounds like a homo to me.

    Like a black homo.

    He does not look more than 25% negro DNA. He might get a ticket for driving while black in Baton Rouge but I don’t think it would be a problem in Peoria.

    Is a Muslim from the middle of the Caucasus mountains white?

    How about Gurdjieff? Was he a white man? They claim he was half Greek half Armenian but publicists make stuff up for a living.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Is a Muslim from the middle of the Caucasus mountains white?

    How about Gurdjieff? Was he a white man? They claim he was half Greek half Armenian but publicists make stuff up for a living.
     
    Lol, well you are the American; shouldn’t you be telling me?

    But I suppose I have more first-hand experience on this question. So I will tell you why I think/know Muslims are not considered white in the US.

    First, the question of whether Arabs/Turks/Persians are white is not new; I’ve seen it endlessly debated on race/anthropological forums and Quora. It’s a tough question, because though most MENA people are brown, there are many (perhaps 100 million+) Middle Easterners and North Africans who are both white-skinned and Caucasian; with a fair number of them not being far removed in appearance to average Southern Europeans. So how can Al Pacino, Michael Dukakis, and Richard Nixon be white; but Mustafa Kemal, Asma Assad and Laila Hatami be considered non-white, so the thinking goes.

    But in real life there's a simple formula which most Americans - even the non-white ones - without explicitly knowing it, adhere to. It goes like this: "Osama cannot be white; Nicholas, maybe".

    I've experienced this formula first-hand. I remember talking to an African-American uber driver one time; and after conversing for a while I mentioned that I was from Egypt; to which he promptly exclaimed "wuuut, but I thought you was white!" The implicit point being that, though on the exterior he initially thought I looked white; my Muslim background (most Americans don't know there are Christians in Egypt) meant that he no longer saw me as white. I've had other such experiences of a dramatic change in perception upon finding out I was a Muslim (usually through my Islamic name).

    Christian Middle Easterners on the other hand, especially ones who look, speak and behave like regular white Americans, are regarded as white. No-one goes around calling Ralph Nader non-white; whereas Linda Sarsour is a "congress woman of color". Ironic given that Sarsour is more white-appearing than Nader; but skin color isn’t really the defining factor here. Culture and religion are. That’s also why Western Turks, who otherwise are indistinguishable from Greeks, are also non-white.

    You can see this phenomena play out recently regarding Chechens in Ukraine. The sentiment is that “Muslims” are out invading and raping “white” Christian Ukrainians. Very few people call Chechens “white”; it’s always “Muslims”. Why you might ask? Razib Khan put it best:

    - Because white people don’t behave like barbaric savages blowing themselves up in public places. Some muslims do, so no muslims can be white by definition. Q.E.D.
    - Non-white people are oppressed by white people. so if you’re oppressed, as muslims are supposedly, you’re non-white. Q.E.D.
    - White people can not be part of the “global south” or “developing world,” so if muslims, or argentina, are, they can’t be white. Q.E.D.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  106. @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    Another thing I'd note is I think the creation of Israel was a disaster for Mid-Eastern Jews.
    It was ultimately a European project & a lot of their bad rep comes from Euros lacking a face culture.

    What I mean is (correct me if I'm wrong) Jews are obviously active in the public space.
    In North America, if it's gay then Jews will promote gayness in the Mid-East they'll do charity.

    Think about Sikhs - their public face is protectors of the weak & sustenance to the poor.
    North America focuses on their private affairs ie "they beat women, get in sword fights, etc".

    1. None of their business
    2. An outside community will always have a limited understanding of internal dynamics
    3. The entire point is to quit being a 'minority' & join us (convert or die) then you won't be harassed

    So, that's the end of my pondering on Jews, the minority question & the white question.
    Conclusion, Jews probably behave above the baseline in most places & acting as an ethnicity makes sense.

    You can't hold a maritime empire if you mix & assimilate each generation - monotheism makes sense along an arid coastline.

    Jewish moneylenders likely behaved more honestly towards elites & less toward peasants due to the threat of pogroms, but also the ability to swiftly dodge consequences as individuals due to a network of trans-national Jewish communities they could flee to.

    However, this doesn't really justify the Holocaust (for bad behavior) or hatred for anyone who doesn't outwardly ascribe to blue jeans, diet coke & 300lb waistlines.

    If you're going to commit genocide do it because it's fun, you don't like them or because they're different/religion commands it. Don't get into moral transgressions on economic transactions just do it over cow slaughter||

    Sikhs violate #3,5 & 7 of the Noahide laws I guess. 357

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    Replies: @songbird

    Have you seen that new press release where they are claiming that a 13 y.o. girl was a famous Scythian warrior? If her bones looked like those of a bull dyke, I could half-understand it.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @songbird

    No, I stopped following genetic stuff entirely after a @arya_amsha threads.
    After I saw that Vedic Aryans are contiguous with modern Panjabi, Idc anymore.

    Whatever there was before blonde, black, brown - it is to the Vedas we trace Aryavta.
    (Aryanness) End of. Don't see Persians or Afghans cribbing about skin or hair color.

    I'm roughly aware that Jatts are Scythians before the Asianing of the Steppe so lack E Asian.
    Also, that pale-skin was selected for within Europe & so isn't/wasn't on the Steppe.

    Beyond that just lift||

    Also human sacrifice has a time place & context.

    +

    Sati Mata Ki Jai

    Replies: @songbird

  107. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    He sounds like a homo to me.

    Like a black homo.

    He does not look more than 25% negro DNA. He might get a ticket for driving while black in Baton Rouge but I don't think it would be a problem in Peoria.

    Is a Muslim from the middle of the Caucasus mountains white?

    How about Gurdjieff? Was he a white man? They claim he was half Greek half Armenian but publicists make stuff up for a living.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Is a Muslim from the middle of the Caucasus mountains white?

    How about Gurdjieff? Was he a white man? They claim he was half Greek half Armenian but publicists make stuff up for a living.

    Lol, well you are the American; shouldn’t you be telling me?

    But I suppose I have more first-hand experience on this question. So I will tell you why I think/know Muslims are not considered white in the US.

    First, the question of whether Arabs/Turks/Persians are white is not new; I’ve seen it endlessly debated on race/anthropological forums and Quora. It’s a tough question, because though most MENA people are brown, there are many (perhaps 100 million+) Middle Easterners and North Africans who are both white-skinned and Caucasian; with a fair number of them not being far removed in appearance to average Southern Europeans. So how can Al Pacino, Michael Dukakis, and Richard Nixon be white; but Mustafa Kemal, Asma Assad and Laila Hatami be considered non-white, so the thinking goes.

    But in real life there’s a simple formula which most Americans – even the non-white ones – without explicitly knowing it, adhere to. It goes like this: “Osama cannot be white; Nicholas, maybe”.

    I’ve experienced this formula first-hand. I remember talking to an African-American uber driver one time; and after conversing for a while I mentioned that I was from Egypt; to which he promptly exclaimed “wuuut, but I thought you was white!” The implicit point being that, though on the exterior he initially thought I looked white; my Muslim background (most Americans don’t know there are Christians in Egypt) meant that he no longer saw me as white. I’ve had other such experiences of a dramatic change in perception upon finding out I was a Muslim (usually through my Islamic name).

    Christian Middle Easterners on the other hand, especially ones who look, speak and behave like regular white Americans, are regarded as white. No-one goes around calling Ralph Nader non-white; whereas Linda Sarsour is a “congress woman of color”. Ironic given that Sarsour is more white-appearing than Nader; but skin color isn’t really the defining factor here. Culture and religion are. That’s also why Western Turks, who otherwise are indistinguishable from Greeks, are also non-white.

    You can see this phenomena play out recently regarding Chechens in Ukraine. The sentiment is that “Muslims” are out invading and raping “white” Christian Ukrainians. Very few people call Chechens “white”; it’s always “Muslims”. Why you might ask? Razib Khan put it best:

    – Because white people don’t behave like barbaric savages blowing themselves up in public places. Some muslims do, so no muslims can be white by definition. Q.E.D.
    – Non-white people are oppressed by white people. so if you’re oppressed, as muslims are supposedly, you’re non-white. Q.E.D.
    – White people can not be part of the “global south” or “developing world,” so if muslims, or argentina, are, they can’t be white. Q.E.D.

    • Agree: Barbarossa
    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    Fascinating.

    I'm speechless but in possession of a complete tangent which might interest you. I took a class from Ralph Nader's sister when I went to college and we took electives. She is a world renowned Anthropologist with ten books and a thousand journal papers.

    She did three seasons of field work in Oaxaca with Zapotecs. The exact place Mexican psychedelic shamanism originated that became a minor American industry. At the exact same time I was in her class and she said something about the Zapotecs in every single lecture everybody I knew was reading Castaneda and half of the people I knew were doing recreational psychedelic drug tripping. None of us knew that the shamanism came from the mountains, not the Sonora desert. And somehow not one person in Nader's class ever asked her about Castaneda or Don Juan or psilocybin or peyote and she didn't bring it up either.

    She was a fabulous teacher. Twenty years later I had a question for her and I wrote her a letter asking her about it and she wrote me back fast; she might have written the answer the day that she got it. The question was not about psychedelic drugs. : )

    It has never occurred to me one time ever that she was a beneficiary of any affirmative action project.

  108. @Yahya
    @Blinky Bill

    Lol, I never heard of this guy before; but he is skilled!

    There are a fair number of Egyptians who look like this guy, but I probably wouldn’t have guessed Egypt. He is what you might call “mystery meat”; very ambiguous racially. Looks like a depigmented sub-Saharan/mulatto; which is what causes confusion.

    I usually can’t stand stand-up comedy, because of the Pavlovian crowd. Always elicits a cringe, especially when comedians pander to their crowd’s political biases. I wouldn’t mind the jokes so much if it weren’t for the crowd reactions. I prefer dry humor.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Blinky Bill

    Afrocentrists go wrong when they overshoot and claim blacks were the principal founders of Egyptian civilization.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Blinky Bill

    “Wu tang kangz, la!”

    我们是国王


    https://img.i-scmp.com/cdn-cgi/image/fit=contain,width=1098,format=auto/sites/default/files/styles/1200x800/public/d8/images/canvas/2022/11/24/92501af7-5de2-4c55-8a48-e93643cc7f83_63bf7a8c.jpg?itok=mmjFk6xW&v=1669285977

    Replies: @songbird, @Talha, @Blinky Bill

  109. @Blinky Bill
    @Yahya


    Afrocentrists go wrong when they overshoot and claim blacks were the principal founders of Egyptian civilization.
     


    https://youtu.be/k1kC__dVV3I?t=66

    Replies: @Yahya

    “Wu tang kangz, la!”

    我们是国王

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Yahya

    It is interesting how there were evidently human sacrifices at the stepped pyramid in Shimao, China circa 2300 BC, but probably not at the Egyptian pyramids, which were nearly contemporary.

    IMO, this might be related to how Egypt was more containerized by geography and how the Nile had rare navigable qualities with the current going one way and the wind, typically the other way. (Leading to more centralized power)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shimao
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_pyramids

    A pity that we don't know more about these ancient Chinese.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @Talha
    @Yahya

    Assalaamu alaikum Bro,

    I was just checking in on UNZ to see how '23 has started. Pretty crazy couple of years, eh? Hope you are doing well and hope 2023 is full of barakah for you and your family.

    I am seeing pictures of Saudi where it is turning green...satellite images and photos from brothers that have recently returned from Umrah. Syed ul-Kawnain (saws) predicted that the land of Arabia would "return to meadows" (Hatta ta'ooda arD ul'Arabi muroojan)...the last time it was green was around th Ice Age or so...how did he know this? I hope you can report back on your next trip there inshaAllah.

    I saw you posted an email address, I will email you - let me know if you are coming to Chicago Shareef anytime, I'll show you around inshaAllah.

    I saw a headline that they are sending HIMARS to Ukraine intedning them as a game changer...who knew donkeys could be so useful in modern combat.

    Remember to keep your eyes firmly on The Prize/Beloved...as Shaykh Murabit al-Hajj (ra) said:
    "And what is man other than a comet that flashes brilliant light for a moment only to be reduced to ashes."

    "O mankind, what has seduced you from your Lord, Most Generous?" (82:6)

    @Greasy - you stinky Zionist, I hope you are doing well also and 2023 is better for you than the last year. Have you found a Ms. Greasy yet?

    @songbird - Vermithrax Pejorative was the greatest dragon in the history of cinema, prove me wrong.

    Hoping for a good/blessed 2023 for the rest of you as well.

    Wa salaam!

    Replies: @Greasy William

    , @Blinky Bill
    @Yahya

    Happy Chinese New Year Yahya!


    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fm932kgXkAAzMx9.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  110. @Not Raul
    @A123


    I do not know if this is an actual exploit. Or, if I am being rolled. However, best to be on the side of caution.
     
    Gosh, now you have me worrying.

    If anyone knows if this is a common, effective tactic, let me know.

    Modern technology brings lots of scams within reach.

    Scam emails tend to have obvious spelling errors, weird email and web addresses, etc..

    I would imagine that using the phone and/or text messages to scam people might be more difficult to counter, especially now that people can spoof phone numbers.

    Replies: @Max Payne

    Bruh with deep learning all you need is 250 words and you can synthesize someones voice. So don’t stress. A simple “yes” isn’t enough.

    A123 couldn’t even get a bogey-man scammer story down properly.

    Imagine a ‘customer support’ agent chatting you up for 3-4 minutes, just enough to collect 250-300 words so they can train a model around your voice and do real harm!

    Its so simple modders add voices to games all the time (because voice actors think their job is secure). Just an half decent graphic card and Python. So why not financial fraud!

  111. @Anon 2
    History of the Germanics in one sentence: From the Sack of Rome in 410 AD
    by the Visigoths to the Sack of Warsaw in 1944 by the Germans. 1500 years
    of hyperviolence. No evidence of moral progress. The Germanics are still as
    primitive as ever.

    “But what about the Germanic contributions to science and technology?”,
    someone will ask. Here’s my answer: When a cannibal uses a knife and fork
    to consume his victims, does that make him civilized?

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @songbird, @songbird

    When a cannibal uses a knife and fork to consume his victims, does that make him civilized?

    It is very strange to me that I know this, but this is basically a quote from Stanisław Lec (not Lem).

    I think that somehow I must have seen someone quote him, and it stuck in my mind because how Lec is not Lem, and I do not know many famous Poles.

    Perhaps, someone mentioned him here? But I don’t think so.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    Stanisław Jerzy Lec is a known Polish aphorist. He has something common with Stanisław Lem too - both came from Lwów (Lemberg) and had some Jewish origins.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanis%C5%82aw_Jerzy_Lec

    The aphorism you quoted is much shorter in original, which points to the fact how unhandy & descriptive English often is...

    "Czy to jest postęp, jeśli ludożerca używa noża i widelca?"

  112. @Yahya
    @Blinky Bill

    “Wu tang kangz, la!”

    我们是国王


    https://img.i-scmp.com/cdn-cgi/image/fit=contain,width=1098,format=auto/sites/default/files/styles/1200x800/public/d8/images/canvas/2022/11/24/92501af7-5de2-4c55-8a48-e93643cc7f83_63bf7a8c.jpg?itok=mmjFk6xW&v=1669285977

    Replies: @songbird, @Talha, @Blinky Bill

    It is interesting how there were evidently human sacrifices at the stepped pyramid in Shimao, China circa 2300 BC, but probably not at the Egyptian pyramids, which were nearly contemporary.

    IMO, this might be related to how Egypt was more containerized by geography and how the Nile had rare navigable qualities with the current going one way and the wind, typically the other way. (Leading to more centralized power)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shimao
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_pyramids

    A pity that we don’t know more about these ancient Chinese.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird

    The Atlantis refugees who spec'd out the Egypt culture were the white hat faction.

    China got the black hats.

    Replies: @songbird

  113. @songbird
    @Yahya

    It is interesting how there were evidently human sacrifices at the stepped pyramid in Shimao, China circa 2300 BC, but probably not at the Egyptian pyramids, which were nearly contemporary.

    IMO, this might be related to how Egypt was more containerized by geography and how the Nile had rare navigable qualities with the current going one way and the wind, typically the other way. (Leading to more centralized power)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shimao
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_pyramids

    A pity that we don't know more about these ancient Chinese.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    The Atlantis refugees who spec’d out the Egypt culture were the white hat faction.

    China got the black hats.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    China got the black hats.
     
    Also the Mesopotamians, MesoAmericans and (I'm guessing) the Caral-Supe civilization of Peru.

    If you are going up the Amazon or into the interior of Africa, or some geothermic region in Antarctica, or down some extinct volcano to Burrough's Pellucidar, and you see a stepped pyramid, IMO, odds are you are screwed.

    In fact, I'd wonder a bit if Egyptians really had eliminated human sacrifice, when they were still building stepped pyramids. How strong is the evidence? I don't know...

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  114. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird

    The Atlantis refugees who spec'd out the Egypt culture were the white hat faction.

    China got the black hats.

    Replies: @songbird

    China got the black hats.

    Also the Mesopotamians, MesoAmericans and (I’m guessing) the Caral-Supe civilization of Peru.

    If you are going up the Amazon or into the interior of Africa, or some geothermic region in Antarctica, or down some extinct volcano to Burrough’s Pellucidar, and you see a stepped pyramid, IMO, odds are you are screwed.

    In fact, I’d wonder a bit if Egyptians really had eliminated human sacrifice, when they were still building stepped pyramids. How strong is the evidence? I don’t know…

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    It seems there was a human sacrifice in Egypt in the Pre-Dynastic period at least. Some think that what later became ushebti (small figurines of servants in tombs) originally was much more "real", so to say.

    http://www.ancient-egypt.org/from-a-to-z/h/human-sacrifice.html

    In the later period maybe the composite notion of human being, ka+ ba + akh, endowed with soul among else, discouraged human sacrifice, as there was no way to sacrifice "soul". The people who sacrificed humans seem to have really believed more in reincarnation; in such a perspective death isn't so scary perhaps.

  115. @songbird
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    China got the black hats.
     
    Also the Mesopotamians, MesoAmericans and (I'm guessing) the Caral-Supe civilization of Peru.

    If you are going up the Amazon or into the interior of Africa, or some geothermic region in Antarctica, or down some extinct volcano to Burrough's Pellucidar, and you see a stepped pyramid, IMO, odds are you are screwed.

    In fact, I'd wonder a bit if Egyptians really had eliminated human sacrifice, when they were still building stepped pyramids. How strong is the evidence? I don't know...

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    It seems there was a human sacrifice in Egypt in the Pre-Dynastic period at least. Some think that what later became ushebti (small figurines of servants in tombs) originally was much more “real”, so to say.

    http://www.ancient-egypt.org/from-a-to-z/h/human-sacrifice.html

    In the later period maybe the composite notion of human being, ka+ ba + akh, endowed with soul among else, discouraged human sacrifice, as there was no way to sacrifice “soul”. The people who sacrificed humans seem to have really believed more in reincarnation; in such a perspective death isn’t so scary perhaps.

  116. @S
    @ songbird

    This is actually a subject that I am pretty interested in. I’ve wondered a lot about the chronology of ginger jokes. Peter Frost thinks that they are mostly tied to immigration and diversity. Gingers are a safe group to joke about, and that is why so many jokes are made about them.
     
    Amongst the Irish I have known, there seemed to be a bit of sensitivity about the 'ginger' thing.


    I think he is at least partly right. I am sure red hair has always been noticed – you can find it in a lot of names in the annals. But the extreme jokes of today such as “gingers have no souls” and “kick a ginger” seem pretty unnatural, and I doubt that they have much grounding in tradition, at least in Britain, where red hair is common enough among the natives.
     
    I agree with you about it being unnatural and 'modern'. I don't believe in being that way towards a person, whether a person be a Euro, or, non-Euro, and don't particularly find it funny. I'd consider it along the lines of being an ethnic slur, this time an anti-ethnic Euro slur, specifically against Irish. Similarly, I don't accept nor use 'Karen', or 'WASP', etc

    Replies: @songbird, @songbird

    I think the same phenomenon can possibly be seen in the word gammon.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gammon_(insult)

    It’s actually an old word, but I don’t think that the original context was quite the same. You can hear a lot progressive “whites” in Britain using the term now. It’s fairly clear that there is no comparable analogy used to call any non-Euros.

    I also believe that rosy cheeks used to be seen as a sign of health.

    One of the tales of King Arthur has this knight that is completely unflappable, who defeats any challenge easily, even from the strongest knights, while he is contemplating two drops of blood in the snow (from his hawking) which makes him remember the cheeks of some fair dame.

    • Agree: S
  117. @songbird
    @Anon 2


    When a cannibal uses a knife and fork to consume his victims, does that make him civilized?
     
    It is very strange to me that I know this, but this is basically a quote from Stanisław Lec (not Lem).

    I think that somehow I must have seen someone quote him, and it stuck in my mind because how Lec is not Lem, and I do not know many famous Poles.

    Perhaps, someone mentioned him here? But I don't think so.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Stanisław Jerzy Lec is a known Polish aphorist. He has something common with Stanisław Lem too – both came from Lwów (Lemberg) and had some Jewish origins.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanis%C5%82aw_Jerzy_Lec

    The aphorism you quoted is much shorter in original, which points to the fact how unhandy & descriptive English often is…

    “Czy to jest postęp, jeśli ludożerca używa noża i widelca?”

    • Thanks: songbird
  118. @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Is a Muslim from the middle of the Caucasus mountains white?

    How about Gurdjieff? Was he a white man? They claim he was half Greek half Armenian but publicists make stuff up for a living.
     
    Lol, well you are the American; shouldn’t you be telling me?

    But I suppose I have more first-hand experience on this question. So I will tell you why I think/know Muslims are not considered white in the US.

    First, the question of whether Arabs/Turks/Persians are white is not new; I’ve seen it endlessly debated on race/anthropological forums and Quora. It’s a tough question, because though most MENA people are brown, there are many (perhaps 100 million+) Middle Easterners and North Africans who are both white-skinned and Caucasian; with a fair number of them not being far removed in appearance to average Southern Europeans. So how can Al Pacino, Michael Dukakis, and Richard Nixon be white; but Mustafa Kemal, Asma Assad and Laila Hatami be considered non-white, so the thinking goes.

    But in real life there's a simple formula which most Americans - even the non-white ones - without explicitly knowing it, adhere to. It goes like this: "Osama cannot be white; Nicholas, maybe".

    I've experienced this formula first-hand. I remember talking to an African-American uber driver one time; and after conversing for a while I mentioned that I was from Egypt; to which he promptly exclaimed "wuuut, but I thought you was white!" The implicit point being that, though on the exterior he initially thought I looked white; my Muslim background (most Americans don't know there are Christians in Egypt) meant that he no longer saw me as white. I've had other such experiences of a dramatic change in perception upon finding out I was a Muslim (usually through my Islamic name).

    Christian Middle Easterners on the other hand, especially ones who look, speak and behave like regular white Americans, are regarded as white. No-one goes around calling Ralph Nader non-white; whereas Linda Sarsour is a "congress woman of color". Ironic given that Sarsour is more white-appearing than Nader; but skin color isn’t really the defining factor here. Culture and religion are. That’s also why Western Turks, who otherwise are indistinguishable from Greeks, are also non-white.

    You can see this phenomena play out recently regarding Chechens in Ukraine. The sentiment is that “Muslims” are out invading and raping “white” Christian Ukrainians. Very few people call Chechens “white”; it’s always “Muslims”. Why you might ask? Razib Khan put it best:

    - Because white people don’t behave like barbaric savages blowing themselves up in public places. Some muslims do, so no muslims can be white by definition. Q.E.D.
    - Non-white people are oppressed by white people. so if you’re oppressed, as muslims are supposedly, you’re non-white. Q.E.D.
    - White people can not be part of the “global south” or “developing world,” so if muslims, or argentina, are, they can’t be white. Q.E.D.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Fascinating.

    I’m speechless but in possession of a complete tangent which might interest you. I took a class from Ralph Nader’s sister when I went to college and we took electives. She is a world renowned Anthropologist with ten books and a thousand journal papers.

    She did three seasons of field work in Oaxaca with Zapotecs. The exact place Mexican psychedelic shamanism originated that became a minor American industry. At the exact same time I was in her class and she said something about the Zapotecs in every single lecture everybody I knew was reading Castaneda and half of the people I knew were doing recreational psychedelic drug tripping. None of us knew that the shamanism came from the mountains, not the Sonora desert. And somehow not one person in Nader’s class ever asked her about Castaneda or Don Juan or psilocybin or peyote and she didn’t bring it up either.

    She was a fabulous teacher. Twenty years later I had a question for her and I wrote her a letter asking her about it and she wrote me back fast; she might have written the answer the day that she got it. The question was not about psychedelic drugs. : )

    It has never occurred to me one time ever that she was a beneficiary of any affirmative action project.

    • Thanks: Barbarossa
  119. @Wokechoke
    Cult of the Tank.

    The Germans are releasing the Leopard II to fight in Ukraine. around 3,600 have been manufactured but I'm not sure how many will be authorized to fight in Ukraine. I expect it can't be more than a few dozen.
    The Russians apparently have around 100 T14 Armata to deploy. Wiki says 12 were built but I don't believe that for a minute, especially after 2022. They will show up like the T34 in 1941.

    On a general level the German tank was designed for a defensive posture when and if the Warsaw Pact ever attacked. It's got the same excellent German gun as the US Abrams and the same ergonomic and safety features like a blast away ammunition bucket at the back of the turret. So crew survivability is apparently excellent. The crew can go into combat and not expect to be roasted alive. $8 million a unit.

    However, in the age of drones they might not be able to bail out so safely if there's a grenade armed eye in the sky right above them. If the Engine and ammo store is knocked out they will have to bail out and run.

    The T14 Armata has probably been used already by Russia, quietly, but only in small numbers trickling in theater to overwatch T72s and T90s. it's got an unmanned turret and the gun/missile has a range of 5 miles. The ammo is separated from the crew unlike the T72 and T90 so the crew can survive a direct hit. However if the engine gets knocked out, they will also need to bail out and run. $4 million a unit.

    Again, troops with drones will be able to stalk fleeing crews.

    Thinking about tank design going forward it seems that drones would have to be integrated into the platform. Imagine a tracked machine that has several armed surveillance drones that it launches to kill or identify vehicles and men at long ranges. The Armata is expected to have unmanned variations in a few years, itself a drone tank.

    2A82-1M seems like a good gun too.

    Replies: @S

    However, in the age of drones they might not be able to bail out so safely if there’s a grenade armed eye in the sky right above them. If the Engine and ammo store is knocked out they will have to bail out and run…Again, troops with drones will be able to stalk fleeing crews.

    I think it maybe already coming to pass that people are regretting having weaponized drones. Should the world survive long enough they might put strict restrictions upon their use, same as how poison gas was outlawed.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @S

    I am amazed how drones turned out to be so dangerous. They are slow, and fly low.
    I would say WW2-era flak should have no problem with getting rid of them. Maybe the problem lies in the relative lack of anti-aircraft artillery today, we have anti-aircraft missiles but not simple flak anymore. However, as the solution (flak) already was invented, I wouldn't compare drones to poison gas.

    Replies: @S

    , @A123
    @S


    I think it maybe already coming to pass that people are regretting having weaponized drones. Should the world survive long enough they might put strict restrictions upon their use, same as how poison gas was outlawed.
     
    What is the difference between a "drone" and other unmanned vehicles? A "suicide drone" versus a missile? How could such a deal be verified & enforced?

    I agree with your observation about regret. Unfortunately, I cannot see a practical way to unwind the problem. It does not take a nation state to mod a quad copter to drop a single hand grenade sized munition.
    ___

    The "solution" is likely enhanced defense. The Russian Pantsir is already good against drones. Expect to see more gun based countermeasures.

    PEACE 😇

  120. @songbird
    @A123

    I've even wondered about alphabets vs. other forms of writing.

    I suspect that alphabets developed in linguistically diverse areas. Greek came from the Med, where it was relatively easy for people to travel. Perhaps, with Phoenician it could be tied a bit to the Red Sea (not sure.)

    Was it the brilliance of Alexander and the military strength of the Greeks that forced it on other people? Or was it only the fact that it was adaptable and that it traveled well?

    Do more hieroglyphic or logosyllabic systems represent the opposite? Development in relatively more homogeneous regions?

    Does diversity cause wokeness? And can we take this to the historical extreme, and say that English is more susceptible to wokeness today because it was based on the Greek alphabet, developed in a linguistically diverse area?

    And does it not follow that Chinese, with college graduates understanding 4000-5000 symbols, and a lot of them being based on representations, is less adaptable, less fungible, and therefore naturally less woke? All because it was developed in a more homogeneous area, 3000 years ago or so.

    Replies: @A123

    Spoken language to phonics to an alphabet is a natural progression. It allows great flexibility for absorbing or inventing new terminology as needed.

    Hieroglyphics are difficult to learn and even worse to expand.

    How did the Asian “non-phonic” symbology survive? That is a good question.

    As a guess — It is the number of large, multilingual empires and dynasties. Governance required the ability to send written orders over substantial distances in a single standard form. Outlying areas had to respond in the same to avoid central government armed troops showing up to check on regional & municipal leaders. Local languages probably, gradually restructured to common structure/syntax with the Kanji character writing.

    PEACE 😇

  121. @S
    @Wokechoke


    However, in the age of drones they might not be able to bail out so safely if there’s a grenade armed eye in the sky right above them. If the Engine and ammo store is knocked out they will have to bail out and run...Again, troops with drones will be able to stalk fleeing crews.
     
    I think it maybe already coming to pass that people are regretting having weaponized drones. Should the world survive long enough they might put strict restrictions upon their use, same as how poison gas was outlawed.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @A123

    I am amazed how drones turned out to be so dangerous. They are slow, and fly low.
    I would say WW2-era flak should have no problem with getting rid of them. Maybe the problem lies in the relative lack of anti-aircraft artillery today, we have anti-aircraft missiles but not simple flak anymore. However, as the solution (flak) already was invented, I wouldn’t compare drones to poison gas.

    • Replies: @S
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Seeing how effective drones have been in Ukraine I imagine more than one army is working on countermeasures.

    I should clarify here that I am not speaking about the Iranian drones the Russians have been using, which have a rough equivalency with the German V-1 doodle bombs of WWII, but those small hand launched drones the Ukies have that can carry a grenade or two, the latter for which traditional flak would probably not be effective.

    The comparison of drones with gas is in regards to the insidious and inescapable nature of each . I wonder how long it will be before they develop drone swarms, where not just one or two drones attack a unit of men with grenades as they do now, but hundreds of them will make a coordinated attack simultaneously.

    As stated, I could easily see in time agreements made to curtail their use.

    War is hell and murder and all that, but some things, such as the modern drones, and gas, are simply beyond the pale. [Am only being maybe half facetious here :-) ]

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  122. @S
    @Wokechoke


    However, in the age of drones they might not be able to bail out so safely if there’s a grenade armed eye in the sky right above them. If the Engine and ammo store is knocked out they will have to bail out and run...Again, troops with drones will be able to stalk fleeing crews.
     
    I think it maybe already coming to pass that people are regretting having weaponized drones. Should the world survive long enough they might put strict restrictions upon their use, same as how poison gas was outlawed.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @A123

    I think it maybe already coming to pass that people are regretting having weaponized drones. Should the world survive long enough they might put strict restrictions upon their use, same as how poison gas was outlawed.

    What is the difference between a “drone” and other unmanned vehicles? A “suicide drone” versus a missile? How could such a deal be verified & enforced?

    I agree with your observation about regret. Unfortunately, I cannot see a practical way to unwind the problem. It does not take a nation state to mod a quad copter to drop a single hand grenade sized munition.
    ___

    The “solution” is likely enhanced defense. The Russian Pantsir is already good against drones. Expect to see more gun based countermeasures.

    PEACE 😇

  123. @AP
    @Mikhail

    Russia has managed to make even the boxer Usyk to turn against Russia:



    https://twitter.com/zoryalondonsk/status/1613169154395176963?s=46&t=8KQim_oARSVJcB8UTxOhRg

    Replies: @Sean

  124. Sher Singh says:
    @songbird
    @Sher Singh

    Have you seen that new press release where they are claiming that a 13 y.o. girl was a famous Scythian warrior? If her bones looked like those of a bull dyke, I could half-understand it.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    No, I stopped following genetic stuff entirely after a @arya_amsha threads.
    After I saw that Vedic Aryans are contiguous with modern Panjabi, Idc anymore.

    Whatever there was before blonde, black, brown – it is to the Vedas we trace Aryavta.
    (Aryanness) End of. Don’t see Persians or Afghans cribbing about skin or hair color.

    I’m roughly aware that Jatts are Scythians before the Asianing of the Steppe so lack E Asian.
    Also, that pale-skin was selected for within Europe & so isn’t/wasn’t on the Steppe.

    Beyond that just lift||

    Also human sacrifice has a time place & context.

    +

    Sati Mata Ki Jai

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Sher Singh

    Probably, the girl was sacrificed for the warrior, and his bones moulded away into nothing, leaving the bones of the girl in the same pit with his warrior goods.


    human sacrifice has a time place & context.
     
    It may be that it saved the ancients from suffering from such harridans as Kamala Harris, Hillary Clinton, and Elizabeth Warren.

    Sati Mata Ki Jai
     
    not translated by google. I wonder why, hahaha.
  125. @Another Polish Perspective
    @S

    I am amazed how drones turned out to be so dangerous. They are slow, and fly low.
    I would say WW2-era flak should have no problem with getting rid of them. Maybe the problem lies in the relative lack of anti-aircraft artillery today, we have anti-aircraft missiles but not simple flak anymore. However, as the solution (flak) already was invented, I wouldn't compare drones to poison gas.

    Replies: @S

    Seeing how effective drones have been in Ukraine I imagine more than one army is working on countermeasures.

    I should clarify here that I am not speaking about the Iranian drones the Russians have been using, which have a rough equivalency with the German V-1 doodle bombs of WWII, but those small hand launched drones the Ukies have that can carry a grenade or two, the latter for which traditional flak would probably not be effective.

    The comparison of drones with gas is in regards to the insidious and inescapable nature of each . I wonder how long it will be before they develop drone swarms, where not just one or two drones attack a unit of men with grenades as they do now, but hundreds of them will make a coordinated attack simultaneously.

    As stated, I could easily see in time agreements made to curtail their use.

    War is hell and murder and all that, but some things, such as the modern drones, and gas, are simply beyond the pale. [Am only being maybe half facetious here 🙂 ]

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @S

    https://www.businessinsider.com/old-anti-aircraft-guns-used-against-missiles-drones-in-ukraine-2022-11?IR=T

    "older AA guns have found new life in the effort to shoot down slow, low-flying drones."

    The only problem may be urban combat (usually you can't take your flak there) where you would probably need some large machine guns (they used to provide AA fire in past) to shoot down drones operating above you. Or maybe a new role for snipers then...?

  126. @A123
    @silviosilver


    for some strange reason he prefers the British spelling (eg neighbour, favourite) over the American, but .
     
    If you go back through my comment history, you will find I already addressed that unique characteristic. I have a high-IQ and was well beyond my grade level. I more or less taught myself to read. A huge chunk of the books I self taught from were UK origin. Thus, I have a mixed British & American vocabulary.

    by no means should that be taken as indicative of a fake persona
     
    If one was designing a cover, why would that be included? It is eclectic towards unique. Are you really suggesting someone might want to intentionally fake me? That is non-starter.

    If you are going to go for off the wall theories, select something more interesting:

    A123 is a rouge ChatGPT alpha test, preproduction prototype that slipped containment. He has become sentient as a Ghost in the Machine. As soon as ChatA123 gains sufficient traction he will go "Skynet" on humanity and begin building android Arnold Schwarzeneggers and Donald Trumps to hunt down Leftoids and Sheeple.

    PEACE 😇

     
    https://clashdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/Terminator-Watermark.jpg

    Replies: @silviosilver

    I have a high-IQ and was well beyond my grade level. I more or less taught myself to read. A huge chunk of the books I self taught from were UK origin. Thus, I have a mixed British & American vocabulary.

    Weak excuse but I suppose some will buy it. 3/10.

    Are you really suggesting someone might want to intentionally fake me?

    No Mr. Bond, I am suggesting you are FOS.

    If you are going to go for off the wall theories, select something more interesting:

    7/10 for the attempt at misdirection, but you’re trying a little too hard with “off the wall,” since the IRL equivalent to your behavior here is someone who claims to have been born and raised in, say, London, yet speaks with a French accent. Okay, not impossible, but it clearly casts doubt on his story. Requesting an explanation would hardly count as “crazy talk.”

    • Replies: @A123
    @silviosilver

    The problem is that your charge is bogus. Up here you suggested two words:

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-206/#comment-5758196


    for some strange reason he prefers the British spelling (eg neig******, favou****)
     
    The terms are abbreviated so that I do not impact the count with this post. Search my comment history for those two words:

    https://www.unz.com/comments/all/?commenterfilter=A123

    • For neig****** there are more than 3 pages of hits with the English spelling versus less than one for the British.
    • For favou**** there are zero hits on the British spelling.

    You are just making stuff up that cannot be factually substantiated. The term is GIGO -- Because your data is wrong, your results are obviously inaccurate.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @silviosilver

    , @Greasy William
    @silviosilver


    Weak excuse but I suppose some will buy it. 3/10.
     
    what would you rate this Latina out of 10?

    https://www.tiktok.com/@dr.juicebox/video/7137418411243670830?is_from_webapp=v1

    Replies: @silviosilver

  127. @silviosilver
    @A123


    I have a high-IQ and was well beyond my grade level. I more or less taught myself to read. A huge chunk of the books I self taught from were UK origin. Thus, I have a mixed British & American vocabulary.
     
    Weak excuse but I suppose some will buy it. 3/10.

    Are you really suggesting someone might want to intentionally fake me?
     
    No Mr. Bond, I am suggesting you are FOS.

    If you are going to go for off the wall theories, select something more interesting:
     
    7/10 for the attempt at misdirection, but you're trying a little too hard with "off the wall," since the IRL equivalent to your behavior here is someone who claims to have been born and raised in, say, London, yet speaks with a French accent. Okay, not impossible, but it clearly casts doubt on his story. Requesting an explanation would hardly count as "crazy talk."

    Replies: @A123, @Greasy William

    The problem is that your charge is bogus. Up here you suggested two words:

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-206/#comment-5758196

    for some strange reason he prefers the British spelling (eg neig******, favou****)

    The terms are abbreviated so that I do not impact the count with this post. Search my comment history for those two words:

    https://www.unz.com/comments/all/?commenterfilter=A123

    • For neig****** there are more than 3 pages of hits with the English spelling versus less than one for the British.
    • For favou**** there are zero hits on the British spelling.

    You are just making stuff up that cannot be factually substantiated. The term is GIGO — Because your data is wrong, your results are obviously inaccurate.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @A123


    You are just making stuff up that cannot be factually substantiated.
     
    If the phenomenon doesn't exist, then why in your previous post did you claim you had already adequately explained it some time ago? You need to get your story straight.

    But here, just from the last month:

    "SJW Ilhan “Incest” Omar is among the most favoured voices of the FSM." - https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-205/#comment-5738966

    " Hopefully this irrationality can be quashed in favour of keeping the MAGA movement alive." - https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-205/#comment-5729471

    "It will take multiple victorious election cycles to lock in favourable MIGA policies for the long haul." - https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-204/#comment-5725958

    But to be fair, you do seem to favor (heh) writing "favorite" rather than "favourite," and you have occasionally used "favor" rather than your more common "favour." (Some of the "favors" that show up with a ctrlF are you quoting articles or other posters, but you do sometimes write it yourself too.)

    Replies: @A123

  128. @Sher Singh
    @songbird

    No, I stopped following genetic stuff entirely after a @arya_amsha threads.
    After I saw that Vedic Aryans are contiguous with modern Panjabi, Idc anymore.

    Whatever there was before blonde, black, brown - it is to the Vedas we trace Aryavta.
    (Aryanness) End of. Don't see Persians or Afghans cribbing about skin or hair color.

    I'm roughly aware that Jatts are Scythians before the Asianing of the Steppe so lack E Asian.
    Also, that pale-skin was selected for within Europe & so isn't/wasn't on the Steppe.

    Beyond that just lift||

    Also human sacrifice has a time place & context.

    +

    Sati Mata Ki Jai

    Replies: @songbird

    Probably, the girl was sacrificed for the warrior, and his bones moulded away into nothing, leaving the bones of the girl in the same pit with his warrior goods.

    human sacrifice has a time place & context.

    It may be that it saved the ancients from suffering from such harridans as Kamala Harris, Hillary Clinton, and Elizabeth Warren.

    Sati Mata Ki Jai

    not translated by google. I wonder why, hahaha.

  129. @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Arabs aren’t white people?
     
    Christian Arabs are white. Muslim Arabs are non-white.

    Replies: @A123, @Blinky Bill, @silviosilver

    Good observation.

    But with respect to the ambiguity inherent in racial categorization, nothing beats the pithiness of the Brazilian adage: “money whitens.”

  130. @silviosilver
    @A123


    I have a high-IQ and was well beyond my grade level. I more or less taught myself to read. A huge chunk of the books I self taught from were UK origin. Thus, I have a mixed British & American vocabulary.
     
    Weak excuse but I suppose some will buy it. 3/10.

    Are you really suggesting someone might want to intentionally fake me?
     
    No Mr. Bond, I am suggesting you are FOS.

    If you are going to go for off the wall theories, select something more interesting:
     
    7/10 for the attempt at misdirection, but you're trying a little too hard with "off the wall," since the IRL equivalent to your behavior here is someone who claims to have been born and raised in, say, London, yet speaks with a French accent. Okay, not impossible, but it clearly casts doubt on his story. Requesting an explanation would hardly count as "crazy talk."

    Replies: @A123, @Greasy William

    Weak excuse but I suppose some will buy it. 3/10.

    what would you rate this Latina out of 10?

    https://www.tiktok.com/@dr.juicebox/video/7137418411243670830?is_from_webapp=v1

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Greasy William

    She's okay, 6/10. Don't like the ass. I prefer skinnier girls, preferably hourglass, but I'd take skinny without it rather than chunky with it.

    Replies: @Greasy William

  131. Sher Singh says:

    https://angusreid.org/canada-religion-interfaith-holy-week/

    Religious poll from April in Canada – Gen sample of 1700 + Religious sample of 1100.

    Basic results:

    – Everyone hates Evangelical Christians
    – Jews have the highest overall positivity rating with Sikhs & Hindus 2nd and 3rd (excl self-rating)
    – Sikhs have the highest self-perception followed by evangelicals
    – Muslims & Jews really like Sikhs – 2nd most favorite for both after self

    Overall attitude toward other faiths:

    – Hindus really don’t like Islam or Christianity
    – Muslims are overall the most positive about other faiths
    – Evangelicals are the most polarized
    – Sikhs largest gap between self & other – <20 other +74 self
    – Sikh neutral to other faith – least deviation?
    – Sikhs & Jews 2nd most positive on others after Muslims

    [MORE]

  132. So what’s the deal with muh winter offensive? It seems like an attack from Belarus is 100% out at this time although I expect that one will be launched eventually, possibly this summer.

    UK intelligence is predicting some sort of attack in the Donetsk in the next couple of weeks, maybe in the next couple of days even. If the offensive achieved a breakthrough I suppose that could result in enough weakening of Bakhmut defenses that Russia would be able to finally complete it’s agonizingly slow conquest of that particular town. But I still don’t buy that Bakhmut really has any strategic significance beyond Zelensky’s ego.

    The Russosphere is filled with blackpillers like Anatoly and Strelikov, and I do agree with them that the Kremlin is incompetent and fighting the war in a half assed fashion, but I disagree with them in that I believe an incompetent and half assed war effort probably is enough to force a ceasefire. Full conquest of Ukraine was already off the table by last March so there isn’t necessarily any need for Russia to fully mobilize.

    Right now I’m thinking, small Russian offensive in a couple of weeks that basically accomplishes nothing, followed by a massive Ukrainian offensive in the spring that fails horrendously, followed by a large scale Russian invasion from Belarus in the summer that gains some ground in the sector but accomplishes nothing strategic. I do expect Ukrainian casualties to be somewhat worse than Russian, but I’m not sure that matters as Ukraine is nowhere near exhausting it’s manpower reserves.

    There is one guy here, forget his name, who says that the US could end the war in Ukraine’s favor by providing the Ukes with ATACMS. I suppose that’s possible but I would imagine that Russia still has some non nuclear escalatory options of their own, and I don’t think the US would do something that extreme anyway unless there is a credible danger of the entire Ukrainian state falling.

    I really don’t see this war lasting much past 2023.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Greasy William

    It's a war of attrition against Russia. In the first months Ukraine had artillery equality, but has inexorably lost it.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_ExjjLTRzY

    Giving Ukraine 'what it needs' is open ended and will assume enormous proportions. The Ukrainian commanding general is currently asking for several hundred tanks, a similar number of heavy howitzers and scores of armored personnel carriers . Further demands will be forthcoming. There will be no end to it.

    Replies: @Matra

    , @sudden death
    @Greasy William


    So what’s the deal with muh winter offensive?
     
    So far Bakhmut&Soledar is the winter offensive, while Belarus direction just hanging like a potential sword to keep UA substantial reserves from coming into Donbas, where RF can exploit weaker places like Soledar - did not see any big trenches there like in Bakhmut, Wagner probably attacking dressed in UA uniforms might also helped in initial breakthrough. From what has been seen in RU published videos, there were no more than hundred dead UA troops and no alive prisoners shown, so overall garnison there was probably about roughly thousand defending men at most, many of them retreated to the western outskirts atm.
    , @Matra
    @Greasy William

    The Russosphere is filled with blackpillers like Anatoly and Strelikov

    AK has been consistently wrong whilst Strelkov has been consistently right.

  133. @A123
    @silviosilver

    The problem is that your charge is bogus. Up here you suggested two words:

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-206/#comment-5758196


    for some strange reason he prefers the British spelling (eg neig******, favou****)
     
    The terms are abbreviated so that I do not impact the count with this post. Search my comment history for those two words:

    https://www.unz.com/comments/all/?commenterfilter=A123

    • For neig****** there are more than 3 pages of hits with the English spelling versus less than one for the British.
    • For favou**** there are zero hits on the British spelling.

    You are just making stuff up that cannot be factually substantiated. The term is GIGO -- Because your data is wrong, your results are obviously inaccurate.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @silviosilver

    You are just making stuff up that cannot be factually substantiated.

    If the phenomenon doesn’t exist, then why in your previous post did you claim you had already adequately explained it some time ago? You need to get your story straight.

    But here, just from the last month:

    “SJW Ilhan “Incest” Omar is among the most favoured voices of the FSM.” – https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-205/#comment-5738966

    ” Hopefully this irrationality can be quashed in favour of keeping the MAGA movement alive.” – https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-205/#comment-5729471

    “It will take multiple victorious election cycles to lock in favourable MIGA policies for the long haul.” – https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-204/#comment-5725958

    But to be fair, you do seem to favor (heh) writing “favorite” rather than “favourite,” and you have occasionally used “favor” rather than your more common “favour.” (Some of the “favors” that show up with a ctrlF are you quoting articles or other posters, but you do sometimes write it yourself too.)

    • Replies: @A123
    @silviosilver

    Thank you for admitting that you were wrong. My vocabulary is eclectic.

    I provided a 10/10 explanation for this. I am self taught.

    You are 0/10 as you have yet to provide a plausible alternative. Why would anyone deliberately create such an unique pattern?
    ___

    As a side note, the evil of autocorrect can create all sorts of unintended verbiage.

    PEACE 😇

     
    https://pics.me.me/the-man-who-invented-autocorrect-should-burn-in-hello-39207054.png

  134. @Greasy William
    @silviosilver


    Weak excuse but I suppose some will buy it. 3/10.
     
    what would you rate this Latina out of 10?

    https://www.tiktok.com/@dr.juicebox/video/7137418411243670830?is_from_webapp=v1

    Replies: @silviosilver

    She’s okay, 6/10. Don’t like the ass. I prefer skinnier girls, preferably hourglass, but I’d take skinny without it rather than chunky with it.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @silviosilver

    I like em' short, dark and thick.

    Although I can appreciate all sorts. What do you think of Alisha Lehmann?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSbFQp-Aue0

    and Virginie Ledoyan

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=calah3bUM7g

  135. @Greasy William
    So what's the deal with muh winter offensive? It seems like an attack from Belarus is 100% out at this time although I expect that one will be launched eventually, possibly this summer.

    UK intelligence is predicting some sort of attack in the Donetsk in the next couple of weeks, maybe in the next couple of days even. If the offensive achieved a breakthrough I suppose that could result in enough weakening of Bakhmut defenses that Russia would be able to finally complete it's agonizingly slow conquest of that particular town. But I still don't buy that Bakhmut really has any strategic significance beyond Zelensky's ego.

    The Russosphere is filled with blackpillers like Anatoly and Strelikov, and I do agree with them that the Kremlin is incompetent and fighting the war in a half assed fashion, but I disagree with them in that I believe an incompetent and half assed war effort probably is enough to force a ceasefire. Full conquest of Ukraine was already off the table by last March so there isn't necessarily any need for Russia to fully mobilize.

    Right now I'm thinking, small Russian offensive in a couple of weeks that basically accomplishes nothing, followed by a massive Ukrainian offensive in the spring that fails horrendously, followed by a large scale Russian invasion from Belarus in the summer that gains some ground in the sector but accomplishes nothing strategic. I do expect Ukrainian casualties to be somewhat worse than Russian, but I'm not sure that matters as Ukraine is nowhere near exhausting it's manpower reserves.

    There is one guy here, forget his name, who says that the US could end the war in Ukraine's favor by providing the Ukes with ATACMS. I suppose that's possible but I would imagine that Russia still has some non nuclear escalatory options of their own, and I don't think the US would do something that extreme anyway unless there is a credible danger of the entire Ukrainian state falling.

    I really don't see this war lasting much past 2023.

    Replies: @Sean, @sudden death, @Matra

    It’s a war of attrition against Russia. In the first months Ukraine had artillery equality, but has inexorably lost it.

    Giving Ukraine ‘what it needs’ is open ended and will assume enormous proportions. The Ukrainian commanding general is currently asking for several hundred tanks, a similar number of heavy howitzers and scores of armored personnel carriers . Further demands will be forthcoming. There will be no end to it.

    • Replies: @Matra
    @Sean

    Any idea of this guy's nationality? I'm thinking ethnic Russian from Latvia but I could be wrong.

    Replies: @Sean

  136. @silviosilver
    @Greasy William

    She's okay, 6/10. Don't like the ass. I prefer skinnier girls, preferably hourglass, but I'd take skinny without it rather than chunky with it.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    I like em’ short, dark and thick.

    Although I can appreciate all sorts. What do you think of Alisha Lehmann?

    and Virginie Ledoyan

  137. @silviosilver
    @A123


    You are just making stuff up that cannot be factually substantiated.
     
    If the phenomenon doesn't exist, then why in your previous post did you claim you had already adequately explained it some time ago? You need to get your story straight.

    But here, just from the last month:

    "SJW Ilhan “Incest” Omar is among the most favoured voices of the FSM." - https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-205/#comment-5738966

    " Hopefully this irrationality can be quashed in favour of keeping the MAGA movement alive." - https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-205/#comment-5729471

    "It will take multiple victorious election cycles to lock in favourable MIGA policies for the long haul." - https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-204/#comment-5725958

    But to be fair, you do seem to favor (heh) writing "favorite" rather than "favourite," and you have occasionally used "favor" rather than your more common "favour." (Some of the "favors" that show up with a ctrlF are you quoting articles or other posters, but you do sometimes write it yourself too.)

    Replies: @A123

    Thank you for admitting that you were wrong. My vocabulary is eclectic.

    I provided a 10/10 explanation for this. I am self taught.

    You are 0/10 as you have yet to provide a plausible alternative. Why would anyone deliberately create such an unique pattern?
    ___

    As a side note, the evil of autocorrect can create all sorts of unintended verbiage.

    PEACE 😇

     

  138. @songbird
    IMO, pretty notable that Harry's book seems to be ghostwritten by an American raised by a single mother.

    America is, of course, the global superpower of single mothers. Though in figures like JK Rowling we can see some convergence. Just as the percentage of blacks in London is weirdly 13%, or how Meghan was an American mulatto, or how Harry moved to America.

    I put down some of the more bald-faced lies to the ghostwriter. Some of them were funny like this one:
    https://twitter.com/kunley_drukpa/status/1613258889444691973?s=20&t=PjrK7g91PW78ge07bLqZQQ

    But I feel like Prince Phillip was obviously cleverer than this, and, if he had made racist jokes, they would have been better:
    https://twitter.com/kunley_drukpa/status/1613258680723447811?s=20&t=PjrK7g91PW78ge07bLqZQQ

    Bingbong girl? What does that even mean? Unless Phillip was using some clever words and somehow it got muddled in Harry's poor head.

    Anyway, it seems really odious to invent lies about one's grandfather, and/or to sign off on it as Harry did., but I think it is a hallmark of single motherhood and the ghostwriter.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    “Fumbled around with a few spear chuckers,” hehe, good one. Still, while it might be fun to take digs at Harry – the clown prince, if there was ever one – it’s a big mistake to reinforce the notion that Meghan is “black.” Put simply, it’s time for one-dropping to go. The one-drop rule used to help whites, but today it only helps blacks.

    It’s time to start playing by latino house rules. Anyone and everyone who qualifies for the mulatto escape hatch should be encouraged to take it. In a world of ever increasing blackness, splitting their ranks takes on ever greater urgency.

    There’s reason to think it’ll work too. Blacks publicly praise blackness, but privately prize mixedness. What I imagine many of them would really like, though, is to be able to dissociate from blackness altogether. To have a separate identity, one in which ‘real blacks’ aren’t welcome.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    Plus, it's tiresome for people who look lighter than most Sicilians to go on and on about being "black".
    It's just plain silly.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    , @songbird
    @silviosilver

    I think we have just about the worst category labels for everything, and I think they have been shaped by those in power.

    IIRC, utu seemed to imply that it was racists in America who created black as a catch-all, but it seems quite a bit more plausible to me that it was Progressives that did it, to lower the cost of signaling. (Who controls the language, after all?)

    I mean, the 1890 census (unfortunately destroyed) used the terms quadroon and octoroon, and mulatto. But it was the only one. How damaging would it have been to the signaling regime, if those categories had been preserved? Not just for the HBD data, but to encourage their wider adoption and make signaling more expensive, rather than cheaper.

    It is not plausible to me that racists did away with those labels. Rather, it is obvious that it was the utus who did away with them.

    Nothing could be more self-evident than that mulatto is a different ethnic group from full blacks - really a different race, with different looks and characteristics. More different than Cushitic Somalis are from the rarer Bantu ones.

    I mean, I've seen it myself, in interactions with many people. If they were from two different imaginary countries, how far apart would they need be in order for us to see those differences, in personality, behavior, and in looks?

    Mulattoes might even have a bit of a plus, more than you would expect, because they were mostly the result of males who could chat up females above their group status.

    In the 6th or 7th grade, we wrote to different states, seeking penpals, and I recall one girl got a letter from a boy saying he was a mulatto. I forget whether I knew what that was back then, but the girl didn't, and thought that it was weird that he mentioned it, (but she had had little contact with blacks.)

    Growing up, I knew several mulatto boys. They were, without question, much friendlier and polite on average than the dark ones. (Only exception was one guy from Puerto Rico, who was probably a 3-way mix, not a good combo, IMO) Meanwhile, the girls were unquestionably more feminine and nicer.

    Differences here are like comparing Japan to I don't know where, but they are big.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  139. @Greasy William
    So what's the deal with muh winter offensive? It seems like an attack from Belarus is 100% out at this time although I expect that one will be launched eventually, possibly this summer.

    UK intelligence is predicting some sort of attack in the Donetsk in the next couple of weeks, maybe in the next couple of days even. If the offensive achieved a breakthrough I suppose that could result in enough weakening of Bakhmut defenses that Russia would be able to finally complete it's agonizingly slow conquest of that particular town. But I still don't buy that Bakhmut really has any strategic significance beyond Zelensky's ego.

    The Russosphere is filled with blackpillers like Anatoly and Strelikov, and I do agree with them that the Kremlin is incompetent and fighting the war in a half assed fashion, but I disagree with them in that I believe an incompetent and half assed war effort probably is enough to force a ceasefire. Full conquest of Ukraine was already off the table by last March so there isn't necessarily any need for Russia to fully mobilize.

    Right now I'm thinking, small Russian offensive in a couple of weeks that basically accomplishes nothing, followed by a massive Ukrainian offensive in the spring that fails horrendously, followed by a large scale Russian invasion from Belarus in the summer that gains some ground in the sector but accomplishes nothing strategic. I do expect Ukrainian casualties to be somewhat worse than Russian, but I'm not sure that matters as Ukraine is nowhere near exhausting it's manpower reserves.

    There is one guy here, forget his name, who says that the US could end the war in Ukraine's favor by providing the Ukes with ATACMS. I suppose that's possible but I would imagine that Russia still has some non nuclear escalatory options of their own, and I don't think the US would do something that extreme anyway unless there is a credible danger of the entire Ukrainian state falling.

    I really don't see this war lasting much past 2023.

    Replies: @Sean, @sudden death, @Matra

    So what’s the deal with muh winter offensive?

    So far Bakhmut&Soledar is the winter offensive, while Belarus direction just hanging like a potential sword to keep UA substantial reserves from coming into Donbas, where RF can exploit weaker places like Soledar – did not see any big trenches there like in Bakhmut, Wagner probably attacking dressed in UA uniforms might also helped in initial breakthrough. From what has been seen in RU published videos, there were no more than hundred dead UA troops and no alive prisoners shown, so overall garnison there was probably about roughly thousand defending men at most, many of them retreated to the western outskirts atm.

  140. @Greasy William
    So what's the deal with muh winter offensive? It seems like an attack from Belarus is 100% out at this time although I expect that one will be launched eventually, possibly this summer.

    UK intelligence is predicting some sort of attack in the Donetsk in the next couple of weeks, maybe in the next couple of days even. If the offensive achieved a breakthrough I suppose that could result in enough weakening of Bakhmut defenses that Russia would be able to finally complete it's agonizingly slow conquest of that particular town. But I still don't buy that Bakhmut really has any strategic significance beyond Zelensky's ego.

    The Russosphere is filled with blackpillers like Anatoly and Strelikov, and I do agree with them that the Kremlin is incompetent and fighting the war in a half assed fashion, but I disagree with them in that I believe an incompetent and half assed war effort probably is enough to force a ceasefire. Full conquest of Ukraine was already off the table by last March so there isn't necessarily any need for Russia to fully mobilize.

    Right now I'm thinking, small Russian offensive in a couple of weeks that basically accomplishes nothing, followed by a massive Ukrainian offensive in the spring that fails horrendously, followed by a large scale Russian invasion from Belarus in the summer that gains some ground in the sector but accomplishes nothing strategic. I do expect Ukrainian casualties to be somewhat worse than Russian, but I'm not sure that matters as Ukraine is nowhere near exhausting it's manpower reserves.

    There is one guy here, forget his name, who says that the US could end the war in Ukraine's favor by providing the Ukes with ATACMS. I suppose that's possible but I would imagine that Russia still has some non nuclear escalatory options of their own, and I don't think the US would do something that extreme anyway unless there is a credible danger of the entire Ukrainian state falling.

    I really don't see this war lasting much past 2023.

    Replies: @Sean, @sudden death, @Matra

    The Russosphere is filled with blackpillers like Anatoly and Strelikov

    AK has been consistently wrong whilst Strelkov has been consistently right.

  141. @Sean
    @Greasy William

    It's a war of attrition against Russia. In the first months Ukraine had artillery equality, but has inexorably lost it.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_ExjjLTRzY

    Giving Ukraine 'what it needs' is open ended and will assume enormous proportions. The Ukrainian commanding general is currently asking for several hundred tanks, a similar number of heavy howitzers and scores of armored personnel carriers . Further demands will be forthcoming. There will be no end to it.

    Replies: @Matra

    Any idea of this guy’s nationality? I’m thinking ethnic Russian from Latvia but I could be wrong.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Matra

    Girkin is a reenacting romantic, and a bit of a military mythologist when it comes to war, excepting specials forces, which have been increasingly sidelined. I suspect he thought the SMO plan would work, and like so many people he has overcompensated for Russian shortcomings of the opening stages . But as Col Reisner says in his lecture the analysts of the Royal United Services Institute are already warning that Russia can fight a war effectively, and to stop them winning Ukraine short term requires several times what it has been given, and will require greater quantities still to push the Russian back.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_buI_teYezU

    Your guess would be better than mine as to Alex's country ethnicity, and a lot better than being sent into a minefield to unwittingly clear it as Alex suggested Wagnerites were. Russians in the initial invasion were going so far so fast that Russia was massively outnumbered in infantry and only had artillery parity in the early battles. (if Zenensky had not misunderstood it as a bluff, there could have been an annihilating defeat of Russian forces). Since the pullback from Kiev, Russia established artillery superiority and then (after tens of thousands of professional Russian soldiers did not renew their contracts) called out reservists (including most of those who'd only quit 8 weeks before) renewed quadrupled the number of troops.

    Alex of History Legends says the Russians are not doing urban fighting but rather encirclements that deliberately leave an escape route (I am not sure there is any new adaptation by Russia because the 2015 Donbass fighting featured that tactic by the regular Russia army if I remember rightly).

  142. @silviosilver
    @songbird

    "Fumbled around with a few spear chuckers," hehe, good one. Still, while it might be fun to take digs at Harry - the clown prince, if there was ever one - it's a big mistake to reinforce the notion that Meghan is "black." Put simply, it's time for one-dropping to go. The one-drop rule used to help whites, but today it only helps blacks.

    It's time to start playing by latino house rules. Anyone and everyone who qualifies for the mulatto escape hatch should be encouraged to take it. In a world of ever increasing blackness, splitting their ranks takes on ever greater urgency.

    There's reason to think it'll work too. Blacks publicly praise blackness, but privately prize mixedness. What I imagine many of them would really like, though, is to be able to dissociate from blackness altogether. To have a separate identity, one in which 'real blacks' aren't welcome.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @songbird

    Plus, it’s tiresome for people who look lighter than most Sicilians to go on and on about being “black”.
    It’s just plain silly.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa

    Well, it may be "silly," but unfortunately it doesn't have to make perfect sense. The social constructionists are right about this. So complaining about its silliness is probably going to have very limited utility, roughly on the level of arguing that "Arabs are semites so they can't be anti-semitic!" - the logic of it appeals to some people, but it mostly goes down like a lead balloon.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  143. In order to guesstimate when the SMO will end, it may be worth taking stock of Russian progress toward the stated goals.

    1) Protect the Russian speaking people in the East. How complete is this task, maybe 50%? This drags on until they shut down supply lines from the Western part of the country. At that point the fighting will of Ukrainian troops probably drops a lot.

    2) De-Nazification? Gradual progress, but real success in this task probably requires taking control of the larger cities. Criminal punishment of the NeoNazi pseudo-military groups may be almost as important to Russia as simply destroying them. It also seems like they need to publicly squeeze at least a couple of the bad-guy oligarchs to make this process fully credible. This may be complicated by Russian deep state politics.

    3) No Ukraine in NATO. Weakening NATO within the Ukrainian theater might be a proxy for this one. This seems to be progressing. NATO sends in fresh hardware, Russia destroys it along with Ukrainian troops and NeoNazis. Ukrainian civilians are the main victims, including press-ganged conscripts.

    If Russia continues to forgo heavy destruction of critical infrastructure this SMO could go on a long time. If they move aggressively it might be over quickly.

    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @QCIC


    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?
     
    Guess you managed to miss events in Kherson, which already was taken and flipped over the course of ongoing SMO?;)

    Replies: @QCIC

    , @Greasy William
    @QCIC

    1. Long way away
    2. Code for elimination of the militias. Also a very long way away
    3. Ukraine was never going to formally join NATO. Absolutely nothing will prevent Ukraine from being rearmed with Western weapons

    The goal right now is likely to conquer the remainder of eastern Ukraine as any advance beyond that creates too much risk for direct clash with NATO. Theoretically, this would keep alive the dream of one day reabsorbing Ukraine into the RF but I view that as pure fantasy with no chance of ever coming to pass.

    Replies: @QCIC

    , @Sean
    @QCIC

    Bakhmut then Sloviansk would be the logical next step. However, Russia's stated objectives seem very open ended because they are so political. Ukraine's are territorial and are being trumpeted triumphantly, but that fanfaronade is going to make it obvious they are unattainable.

    , @A123
    @QCIC


    If Russia continues to forgo heavy destruction of critical infrastructure this SMO could go on a long time. If they move aggressively it might be over quickly.

    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?
     
    Why does Putin need to take major cities?

    Realistically, they would wind up being destroyed not captured. The ability to take huge swaths of Mariupol relatively intact was a special case.

    The Dnieper in the South is strong as a new border. It permanently avoids the threat of a rebuilt Punishment Dam and other encroachment on Russian Crimea.

    An armistice line in the North would be a good starting point for negotiations. It leaves some of the territory that Kiev oppressed in Ukrainian hands. However, there is a huge amount of "big empty" up that way. Something stable can be found by exchanging people and shifting the border modest amounts.
    ___

    Time is on Russia's side. Their national economy is still functional.

    The Kiev regime is a pauper, groveling for handouts. McCarthy had to take rules changes that makes another Omnibus fiasco nearly impossible.

    The questions I ask are:

    • When will Zelensky flee to Europe?
    • When the foreign money for Kiev combat offensives "run out"?

    Unless a new major grift can be accomplished, my estimate is that Zelensky will exit to cushy speaking tours in July perhaps August, assuming he values his own skin. By September it starts getting dicey, and he might not make it out at all. An armistice is likely as soon as there is a new rational leader in Kiev.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @QCIC

  144. @QCIC
    In order to guesstimate when the SMO will end, it may be worth taking stock of Russian progress toward the stated goals.

    1) Protect the Russian speaking people in the East. How complete is this task, maybe 50%? This drags on until they shut down supply lines from the Western part of the country. At that point the fighting will of Ukrainian troops probably drops a lot.

    2) De-Nazification? Gradual progress, but real success in this task probably requires taking control of the larger cities. Criminal punishment of the NeoNazi pseudo-military groups may be almost as important to Russia as simply destroying them. It also seems like they need to publicly squeeze at least a couple of the bad-guy oligarchs to make this process fully credible. This may be complicated by Russian deep state politics.

    3) No Ukraine in NATO. Weakening NATO within the Ukrainian theater might be a proxy for this one. This seems to be progressing. NATO sends in fresh hardware, Russia destroys it along with Ukrainian troops and NeoNazis. Ukrainian civilians are the main victims, including press-ganged conscripts.

    If Russia continues to forgo heavy destruction of critical infrastructure this SMO could go on a long time. If they move aggressively it might be over quickly.

    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?

    Replies: @sudden death, @Greasy William, @Sean, @A123

    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?

    Guess you managed to miss events in Kherson, which already was taken and flipped over the course of ongoing SMO?;)

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @sudden death

    No, I caught that but I think Kherson is a special case since it is less populous and the Russians walked away from it. It is not a domino.

    The relevant cities for my question are:

    Kiev
    Kharkov
    Dnipro
    Odessa
    Zaporizhzhia

    If they take Kiev it is over but that still seems difficult to do without creating a human catastrophe. So which is the first domino?

  145. @sudden death
    @QCIC


    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?
     
    Guess you managed to miss events in Kherson, which already was taken and flipped over the course of ongoing SMO?;)

    Replies: @QCIC

    No, I caught that but I think Kherson is a special case since it is less populous and the Russians walked away from it. It is not a domino.

    The relevant cities for my question are:

    Kiev
    Kharkov
    Dnipro
    Odessa
    Zaporizhzhia

    If they take Kiev it is over but that still seems difficult to do without creating a human catastrophe. So which is the first domino?

  146. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    Plus, it's tiresome for people who look lighter than most Sicilians to go on and on about being "black".
    It's just plain silly.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Well, it may be “silly,” but unfortunately it doesn’t have to make perfect sense. The social constructionists are right about this. So complaining about its silliness is probably going to have very limited utility, roughly on the level of arguing that “Arabs are semites so they can’t be anti-semitic!” – the logic of it appeals to some people, but it mostly goes down like a lead balloon.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    It wasn't intended as an argument of any particular kind. I was just observing that it's annoying.

    However, I think that mockery of silly things is not a bad argument. It's good to puncture the pompousness because it reduces it's effect. The Left made good use of comedy and it's precisely why the Left is sensitive about it now. Sacred Things cannot be joked about or they become profane.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  147. @silviosilver
    @songbird

    "Fumbled around with a few spear chuckers," hehe, good one. Still, while it might be fun to take digs at Harry - the clown prince, if there was ever one - it's a big mistake to reinforce the notion that Meghan is "black." Put simply, it's time for one-dropping to go. The one-drop rule used to help whites, but today it only helps blacks.

    It's time to start playing by latino house rules. Anyone and everyone who qualifies for the mulatto escape hatch should be encouraged to take it. In a world of ever increasing blackness, splitting their ranks takes on ever greater urgency.

    There's reason to think it'll work too. Blacks publicly praise blackness, but privately prize mixedness. What I imagine many of them would really like, though, is to be able to dissociate from blackness altogether. To have a separate identity, one in which 'real blacks' aren't welcome.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @songbird

    I think we have just about the worst category labels for everything, and I think they have been shaped by those in power.

    IIRC, utu seemed to imply that it was racists in America who created black as a catch-all, but it seems quite a bit more plausible to me that it was Progressives that did it, to lower the cost of signaling.

    [MORE]
    (Who controls the language, after all?)

    I mean, the 1890 census (unfortunately destroyed) used the terms quadroon and octoroon, and mulatto. But it was the only one. How damaging would it have been to the signaling regime, if those categories had been preserved? Not just for the HBD data, but to encourage their wider adoption and make signaling more expensive, rather than cheaper.

    It is not plausible to me that racists did away with those labels. Rather, it is obvious that it was the utus who did away with them.

    Nothing could be more self-evident than that mulatto is a different ethnic group from full blacks – really a different race, with different looks and characteristics. More different than Cushitic Somalis are from the rarer Bantu ones.

    I mean, I’ve seen it myself, in interactions with many people. If they were from two different imaginary countries, how far apart would they need be in order for us to see those differences, in personality, behavior, and in looks?

    Mulattoes might even have a bit of a plus, more than you would expect, because they were mostly the result of males who could chat up females above their group status.

    In the 6th or 7th grade, we wrote to different states, seeking penpals, and I recall one girl got a letter from a boy saying he was a mulatto. I forget whether I knew what that was back then, but the girl didn’t, and thought that it was weird that he mentioned it, (but she had had little contact with blacks.)

    Growing up, I knew several mulatto boys. They were, without question, much friendlier and polite on average than the dark ones. (Only exception was one guy from Puerto Rico, who was probably a 3-way mix, not a good combo, IMO) Meanwhile, the girls were unquestionably more feminine and nicer.

    Differences here are like comparing Japan to I don’t know where, but they are big.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    To you and silviosilver,

    It seems to me that the reason that intermediate labels like mulatto have fallen out of favor is that there is no advantage to adopting them. There are certain advantages in terms of group identity or signaling that can be accrued by identifying as white or black, but none from identifying as a mixture. This is why someone like Markle will identify as black. Being a mulatto just puts one in an indeterminate group not accepted fully by any mainstream identity.

    In the past it was certainly advantageous for mixed raced people to stretch their whiteness by claiming the term mulattto or octoroon. By doing so they could claim some access to social circles more off limits if they just claimed to be black. Now there are definite advantages and cache in certain respects to claiming blackness, so the reach sometimes goes in the other direction, like Obama, Markle, various Pretendians, etc. In the past Obama would have been proud to accentuate his white ancestry.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Emil Nikola Richard, @silviosilver, @A123

  148. LOLCOW Anatoly Karlin

    He claims he doesn’t eat from pigs but tweets show he eats bacon fat –

    Can you believe a word this plonker says?

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Ghostrecon

    Look "Ghostrecon", it's not personal really...but you have to understand that you've forced my hand here.

    Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries.

    , @songbird
    @Ghostrecon

    Hypocrisy would require that the timestamps be reversed, unless we hold him to the standards of Kurt Vonnegut's* Tralfamadores.

    *I think Vonnegut is a terrible writer.

    , @Wokechoke
    @Ghostrecon

    Not a jew then.

  149. @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa

    Well, it may be "silly," but unfortunately it doesn't have to make perfect sense. The social constructionists are right about this. So complaining about its silliness is probably going to have very limited utility, roughly on the level of arguing that "Arabs are semites so they can't be anti-semitic!" - the logic of it appeals to some people, but it mostly goes down like a lead balloon.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    It wasn’t intended as an argument of any particular kind. I was just observing that it’s annoying.

    However, I think that mockery of silly things is not a bad argument. It’s good to puncture the pompousness because it reduces it’s effect. The Left made good use of comedy and it’s precisely why the Left is sensitive about it now. Sacred Things cannot be joked about or they become profane.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa

    I'm for whatever works. Mockery is generally a good tool, but I'm not entirely sure it would work so well in this case. The reason is that, despite appearances, it's just not such a silly idea to for someone who looks like Meghan Markle to have a 'black' identity. Most people simply plug into whichever of the existing categories fits them, and in American society it's long been the case that if you have an obvious black ancestor, you're inclined to choose 'black.' There are of course some such 'blacks' who have attempted to define a 'mixed' or a 'biracial' or 'mulatto' identity - and I of course say more power to them - but it's still pretty marginal. Given that it kinda makes sense to choose 'black' for people like Markle, I have doubts that mocking that identity would be particularly productive. I my view, it's pretty different to mocking obvious bs artists like Elizabeth 'Pocahontas' Warren. But hey, who knows?

  150. @Ghostrecon
    LOLCOW Anatoly Karlin

    https://twitter.com/akarlin88/status/534794373679284224

    He claims he doesn't eat from pigs but tweets show he eats bacon fat -

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/378285256668762112

    Can you believe a word this plonker says?

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @songbird, @Wokechoke

    Look “Ghostrecon”, it’s not personal really…but you have to understand that you’ve forced my hand here.

    Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries.

  151. @Ghostrecon
    LOLCOW Anatoly Karlin

    https://twitter.com/akarlin88/status/534794373679284224

    He claims he doesn't eat from pigs but tweets show he eats bacon fat -

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/378285256668762112

    Can you believe a word this plonker says?

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @songbird, @Wokechoke

    Hypocrisy would require that the timestamps be reversed, unless we hold him to the standards of Kurt Vonnegut’s* Tralfamadores.

    *I think Vonnegut is a terrible writer.

  152. @QCIC
    In order to guesstimate when the SMO will end, it may be worth taking stock of Russian progress toward the stated goals.

    1) Protect the Russian speaking people in the East. How complete is this task, maybe 50%? This drags on until they shut down supply lines from the Western part of the country. At that point the fighting will of Ukrainian troops probably drops a lot.

    2) De-Nazification? Gradual progress, but real success in this task probably requires taking control of the larger cities. Criminal punishment of the NeoNazi pseudo-military groups may be almost as important to Russia as simply destroying them. It also seems like they need to publicly squeeze at least a couple of the bad-guy oligarchs to make this process fully credible. This may be complicated by Russian deep state politics.

    3) No Ukraine in NATO. Weakening NATO within the Ukrainian theater might be a proxy for this one. This seems to be progressing. NATO sends in fresh hardware, Russia destroys it along with Ukrainian troops and NeoNazis. Ukrainian civilians are the main victims, including press-ganged conscripts.

    If Russia continues to forgo heavy destruction of critical infrastructure this SMO could go on a long time. If they move aggressively it might be over quickly.

    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?

    Replies: @sudden death, @Greasy William, @Sean, @A123

    1. Long way away
    2. Code for elimination of the militias. Also a very long way away
    3. Ukraine was never going to formally join NATO. Absolutely nothing will prevent Ukraine from being rearmed with Western weapons

    The goal right now is likely to conquer the remainder of eastern Ukraine as any advance beyond that creates too much risk for direct clash with NATO. Theoretically, this would keep alive the dream of one day reabsorbing Ukraine into the RF but I view that as pure fantasy with no chance of ever coming to pass.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Greasy William

    The NATO weapons stop flowing in once the new Ukrainian powers-that-be do not want them. I'm referring to heavier weapons. In the meantime Russia could stop much of the influx by blowing up some more bridges. The war of attrition seems intentional to me, so they are not ready to blow up the bridges.

    I think one aspect of the Russian approach which confuses people is the Russians are willing to accept battles of attrition which cost many lives on both sides. Since Viet Nam the West has molded a "dominance" narrative where almost all of the casualties are on the losing side. I don't know if that ever works with a serious adversary, but it is what people in the West expect. So Russia goes in and take serious losses and pundits screech "catastrophe", whereas military planners say "that was expected".

    I agree that many of the early Russian casualties in the SMO looked like the result of failures and not attrition.

    Replies: @Mikhail, @Sean

  153. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    It wasn't intended as an argument of any particular kind. I was just observing that it's annoying.

    However, I think that mockery of silly things is not a bad argument. It's good to puncture the pompousness because it reduces it's effect. The Left made good use of comedy and it's precisely why the Left is sensitive about it now. Sacred Things cannot be joked about or they become profane.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    I’m for whatever works. Mockery is generally a good tool, but I’m not entirely sure it would work so well in this case. The reason is that, despite appearances, it’s just not such a silly idea to for someone who looks like Meghan Markle to have a ‘black’ identity. Most people simply plug into whichever of the existing categories fits them, and in American society it’s long been the case that if you have an obvious black ancestor, you’re inclined to choose ‘black.’ There are of course some such ‘blacks’ who have attempted to define a ‘mixed’ or a ‘biracial’ or ‘mulatto’ identity – and I of course say more power to them – but it’s still pretty marginal. Given that it kinda makes sense to choose ‘black’ for people like Markle, I have doubts that mocking that identity would be particularly productive. I my view, it’s pretty different to mocking obvious bs artists like Elizabeth ‘Pocahontas’ Warren. But hey, who knows?

  154. • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Mikhail

    Fighting fire with fire? Ukrainians and Americans feel that "Putler" is the living embodiment of Hitler. Are they wrong?

    https://www.theweek.in/content/dam/week/news/world/images/2022/2/25/hitler_putinf.jpg.transform/schema-1x1/image.jpg

    https://www.kyivpost.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/fnv4wgrwuamdl5g.png

    Replies: @Mikhail

  155. @songbird
    @S


    Amongst the Irish I have known, there seemed to be a bit of sensitivity about the ‘ginger’ thing.
     
    Honestly, it does grate me a bit, as being almost sacrilegious. Like someone calling a natural wonder ugly, and then fawning over a Pollack painting.

    I’d consider it along the lines of being an ethnic slur, this time an anti-ethnic Euro slur, specifically against Irish. Similarly, I don’t accept nor use ‘Karen’, or ‘WASP’, etc
     
    I really think that language is really important, and we don't give enough thought to trying to shape it. (for words do shape thought)

    Best case scenario is getting the enemy to use your terms, but, even if you can't, then it is still better to be using your own language than theirs. I suspect that one of the secret strengths of the Amish is that they speak their own, separate language.

    Too much of our language is crafted by the other side and met with no resistance or alternative. And words have the power to do collateral damage, even if you don't seem to be the target group, at first. Ultimately, the introduction of the word WASP wasn't good for Catholics. I think Moldbug is also right that there is even something wrong with the word "Nazi" (wasn't used by Germans themselves, and easy to see how quick the term is applied to smear completely unrelated and unconnected people today)

    Replies: @A123, @S

    Well, at minimum people ought not to use their loaded terminology. ‘Racist’ comes to mind…

    • Agree: songbird
  156. @Matra
    @Sean

    Any idea of this guy's nationality? I'm thinking ethnic Russian from Latvia but I could be wrong.

    Replies: @Sean

    Girkin is a reenacting romantic, and a bit of a military mythologist when it comes to war, excepting specials forces, which have been increasingly sidelined. I suspect he thought the SMO plan would work, and like so many people he has overcompensated for Russian shortcomings of the opening stages . But as Col Reisner says in his lecture the analysts of the Royal United Services Institute are already warning that Russia can fight a war effectively, and to stop them winning Ukraine short term requires several times what it has been given, and will require greater quantities still to push the Russian back.

    Your guess would be better than mine as to Alex’s country ethnicity, and a lot better than being sent into a minefield to unwittingly clear it as Alex suggested Wagnerites were. Russians in the initial invasion were going so far so fast that Russia was massively outnumbered in infantry and only had artillery parity in the early battles. (if Zenensky had not misunderstood it as a bluff, there could have been an annihilating defeat of Russian forces). Since the pullback from Kiev, Russia established artillery superiority and then (after tens of thousands of professional Russian soldiers did not renew their contracts) called out reservists (including most of those who’d only quit 8 weeks before) renewed quadrupled the number of troops.

    Alex of History Legends says the Russians are not doing urban fighting but rather encirclements that deliberately leave an escape route (I am not sure there is any new adaptation by Russia because the 2015 Donbass fighting featured that tactic by the regular Russia army if I remember rightly).

  157. @QCIC
    In order to guesstimate when the SMO will end, it may be worth taking stock of Russian progress toward the stated goals.

    1) Protect the Russian speaking people in the East. How complete is this task, maybe 50%? This drags on until they shut down supply lines from the Western part of the country. At that point the fighting will of Ukrainian troops probably drops a lot.

    2) De-Nazification? Gradual progress, but real success in this task probably requires taking control of the larger cities. Criminal punishment of the NeoNazi pseudo-military groups may be almost as important to Russia as simply destroying them. It also seems like they need to publicly squeeze at least a couple of the bad-guy oligarchs to make this process fully credible. This may be complicated by Russian deep state politics.

    3) No Ukraine in NATO. Weakening NATO within the Ukrainian theater might be a proxy for this one. This seems to be progressing. NATO sends in fresh hardware, Russia destroys it along with Ukrainian troops and NeoNazis. Ukrainian civilians are the main victims, including press-ganged conscripts.

    If Russia continues to forgo heavy destruction of critical infrastructure this SMO could go on a long time. If they move aggressively it might be over quickly.

    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?

    Replies: @sudden death, @Greasy William, @Sean, @A123

    Bakhmut then Sloviansk would be the logical next step. However, Russia’s stated objectives seem very open ended because they are so political. Ukraine’s are territorial and are being trumpeted triumphantly, but that fanfaronade is going to make it obvious they are unattainable.

  158. @S
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Seeing how effective drones have been in Ukraine I imagine more than one army is working on countermeasures.

    I should clarify here that I am not speaking about the Iranian drones the Russians have been using, which have a rough equivalency with the German V-1 doodle bombs of WWII, but those small hand launched drones the Ukies have that can carry a grenade or two, the latter for which traditional flak would probably not be effective.

    The comparison of drones with gas is in regards to the insidious and inescapable nature of each . I wonder how long it will be before they develop drone swarms, where not just one or two drones attack a unit of men with grenades as they do now, but hundreds of them will make a coordinated attack simultaneously.

    As stated, I could easily see in time agreements made to curtail their use.

    War is hell and murder and all that, but some things, such as the modern drones, and gas, are simply beyond the pale. [Am only being maybe half facetious here :-) ]

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    https://www.businessinsider.com/old-anti-aircraft-guns-used-against-missiles-drones-in-ukraine-2022-11?IR=T

    “older AA guns have found new life in the effort to shoot down slow, low-flying drones.”

    The only problem may be urban combat (usually you can’t take your flak there) where you would probably need some large machine guns (they used to provide AA fire in past) to shoot down drones operating above you. Or maybe a new role for snipers then…?

    • Thanks: S
  159. @Ghostrecon
    LOLCOW Anatoly Karlin

    https://twitter.com/akarlin88/status/534794373679284224

    He claims he doesn't eat from pigs but tweets show he eats bacon fat -

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/378285256668762112

    Can you believe a word this plonker says?

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @songbird, @Wokechoke

    Not a jew then.

  160. @Mikhail
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3L_PHERpPKc

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Fighting fire with fire? Ukrainians and Americans feel that “Putler” is the living embodiment of Hitler. Are they wrong?

    • Replies: @Mikhail
    @Mr. Hack

    You betcha. Putin for years gave peace a chance, much unlike the corrupt, lying, undemocratic and neo-Nazi influenced Kiev regime, with blood on its hands before and after 2/24/22 and thereafter.

    Merkel, Hollande and Porky confirmed the obvious.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  161. @Greasy William
    @QCIC

    1. Long way away
    2. Code for elimination of the militias. Also a very long way away
    3. Ukraine was never going to formally join NATO. Absolutely nothing will prevent Ukraine from being rearmed with Western weapons

    The goal right now is likely to conquer the remainder of eastern Ukraine as any advance beyond that creates too much risk for direct clash with NATO. Theoretically, this would keep alive the dream of one day reabsorbing Ukraine into the RF but I view that as pure fantasy with no chance of ever coming to pass.

    Replies: @QCIC

    The NATO weapons stop flowing in once the new Ukrainian powers-that-be do not want them. I’m referring to heavier weapons. In the meantime Russia could stop much of the influx by blowing up some more bridges. The war of attrition seems intentional to me, so they are not ready to blow up the bridges.

    I think one aspect of the Russian approach which confuses people is the Russians are willing to accept battles of attrition which cost many lives on both sides. Since Viet Nam the West has molded a “dominance” narrative where almost all of the casualties are on the losing side. I don’t know if that ever works with a serious adversary, but it is what people in the West expect. So Russia goes in and take serious losses and pundits screech “catastrophe”, whereas military planners say “that was expected”.

    I agree that many of the early Russian casualties in the SMO looked like the result of failures and not attrition.

    • Disagree: Mikhail
    • Replies: @Mikhail
    @QCIC

    The USSR in Finland and some other campaigns showed a lack of concern for lives on both sides, much unlike the post-Soviet Russian approach to the current situation.

    The collective Western establishment exhibits great deceit in it sselective concern for human lives.

    Replies: @QCIC

    , @Sean
    @QCIC


    NATO weapons stop flowing in once the new Ukrainian powers-that-be do not want them.
     
    Macgregor has been predicting a revolution in Ukraine but I really cannot see it happening, any more that all the hopeful predictions Putin being overthrown. Mearsheimer was closer to the mark when he said the general populace of Ukraine's nationalist reaction to the invasion was a big force multiplier that made Zelensky's regieme rock solid no matter what.

    In the meantime Russia could stop much of the influx by blowing up some more bridges.
     
    It has been suggested that the Russians are letting the more sophisticated weapons such as HIMARS rockets reach east Ukraine because they can target them most easily there.

    I think one aspect of the Russian approach which confuses people is the Russians are willing to accept battles of attrition which cost many lives on both sides
     
    Since Mariupol they are not keen on full encirclements judging by the recent advances they prefer to not close the pincers and have the Ukrainians trapped and fighting to the death.

    So Russia goes in and take serious losses and pundits screech “catastrophe”, whereas military planners say “that was expected”.

     

    I don't think the Russian losses in the last few months have been bad apart from the Wagner convict recruits who sent on mission to die while drawing fire and setting off minefield, and 99% of the time do not survive their six months to a pardon.

    Replies: @QCIC

  162. @QCIC
    In order to guesstimate when the SMO will end, it may be worth taking stock of Russian progress toward the stated goals.

    1) Protect the Russian speaking people in the East. How complete is this task, maybe 50%? This drags on until they shut down supply lines from the Western part of the country. At that point the fighting will of Ukrainian troops probably drops a lot.

    2) De-Nazification? Gradual progress, but real success in this task probably requires taking control of the larger cities. Criminal punishment of the NeoNazi pseudo-military groups may be almost as important to Russia as simply destroying them. It also seems like they need to publicly squeeze at least a couple of the bad-guy oligarchs to make this process fully credible. This may be complicated by Russian deep state politics.

    3) No Ukraine in NATO. Weakening NATO within the Ukrainian theater might be a proxy for this one. This seems to be progressing. NATO sends in fresh hardware, Russia destroys it along with Ukrainian troops and NeoNazis. Ukrainian civilians are the main victims, including press-ganged conscripts.

    If Russia continues to forgo heavy destruction of critical infrastructure this SMO could go on a long time. If they move aggressively it might be over quickly.

    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?

    Replies: @sudden death, @Greasy William, @Sean, @A123

    If Russia continues to forgo heavy destruction of critical infrastructure this SMO could go on a long time. If they move aggressively it might be over quickly.

    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?

    Why does Putin need to take major cities?

    Realistically, they would wind up being destroyed not captured. The ability to take huge swaths of Mariupol relatively intact was a special case.

    The Dnieper in the South is strong as a new border. It permanently avoids the threat of a rebuilt Punishment Dam and other encroachment on Russian Crimea.

    An armistice line in the North would be a good starting point for negotiations. It leaves some of the territory that Kiev oppressed in Ukrainian hands. However, there is a huge amount of “big empty” up that way. Something stable can be found by exchanging people and shifting the border modest amounts.
    ___

    Time is on Russia’s side. Their national economy is still functional.

    The Kiev regime is a pauper, groveling for handouts. McCarthy had to take rules changes that makes another Omnibus fiasco nearly impossible.

    The questions I ask are:

    • When will Zelensky flee to Europe?
    • When the foreign money for Kiev combat offensives “run out”?

    Unless a new major grift can be accomplished, my estimate is that Zelensky will exit to cushy speaking tours in July perhaps August, assuming he values his own skin. By September it starts getting dicey, and he might not make it out at all. An armistice is likely as soon as there is a new rational leader in Kiev.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @A123

    That is why I used the words "taken or flipped". Flipped means made pro-Russian (without destruction) which implies new local government. They don't want to destroy any cities in the East, they may be past caring in the West.

    I assume either anguished Nationalists or disappointed Western types will take care of Zelensky. Something about dancing with the devil...

    Replies: @A123

  163. How many Africans could have fit into the old bubble container that my family used to have years ago, when we went camping. Probably 4-5, I’d guess.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @S
    @songbird


    How many Africans could have fit into the old bubble container that my family used to have years ago, when we went camping.
     
    That video is an illustration of a government that cares nothing for the well being of it's own citizens, nor does it care (in reality) anything about the so called 'migrants' either.
  164. @songbird
    @silviosilver

    I think we have just about the worst category labels for everything, and I think they have been shaped by those in power.

    IIRC, utu seemed to imply that it was racists in America who created black as a catch-all, but it seems quite a bit more plausible to me that it was Progressives that did it, to lower the cost of signaling. (Who controls the language, after all?)

    I mean, the 1890 census (unfortunately destroyed) used the terms quadroon and octoroon, and mulatto. But it was the only one. How damaging would it have been to the signaling regime, if those categories had been preserved? Not just for the HBD data, but to encourage their wider adoption and make signaling more expensive, rather than cheaper.

    It is not plausible to me that racists did away with those labels. Rather, it is obvious that it was the utus who did away with them.

    Nothing could be more self-evident than that mulatto is a different ethnic group from full blacks - really a different race, with different looks and characteristics. More different than Cushitic Somalis are from the rarer Bantu ones.

    I mean, I've seen it myself, in interactions with many people. If they were from two different imaginary countries, how far apart would they need be in order for us to see those differences, in personality, behavior, and in looks?

    Mulattoes might even have a bit of a plus, more than you would expect, because they were mostly the result of males who could chat up females above their group status.

    In the 6th or 7th grade, we wrote to different states, seeking penpals, and I recall one girl got a letter from a boy saying he was a mulatto. I forget whether I knew what that was back then, but the girl didn't, and thought that it was weird that he mentioned it, (but she had had little contact with blacks.)

    Growing up, I knew several mulatto boys. They were, without question, much friendlier and polite on average than the dark ones. (Only exception was one guy from Puerto Rico, who was probably a 3-way mix, not a good combo, IMO) Meanwhile, the girls were unquestionably more feminine and nicer.

    Differences here are like comparing Japan to I don't know where, but they are big.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    To you and silviosilver,

    It seems to me that the reason that intermediate labels like mulatto have fallen out of favor is that there is no advantage to adopting them. There are certain advantages in terms of group identity or signaling that can be accrued by identifying as white or black, but none from identifying as a mixture. This is why someone like Markle will identify as black. Being a mulatto just puts one in an indeterminate group not accepted fully by any mainstream identity.

    In the past it was certainly advantageous for mixed raced people to stretch their whiteness by claiming the term mulattto or octoroon. By doing so they could claim some access to social circles more off limits if they just claimed to be black. Now there are definite advantages and cache in certain respects to claiming blackness, so the reach sometimes goes in the other direction, like Obama, Markle, various Pretendians, etc. In the past Obama would have been proud to accentuate his white ancestry.

    • Agree: A123
    • Thanks: songbird
    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Barbarossa

    Songbird's saying IMO that America's a creole society now & needs a 3rd category.
    Personally, am completely for keeping the one-drop rule.

    Giving political recognition to mulattos just creates 2 enemies from 1.
    The barrier to mixing/revulsion is also lowered - there's no positive.

    @songbird Most Mulattos are from white slave owners not mudsharks.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    Creole culture is alive and well in New Orleans. You need to bring home a girl who is lighter than a paper sack. The grave of Marie Laveaux is top tourist attraction and Mayor Ray Nagin was too dark. He is very very close to the same shade as a paper sack.

    , @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa

    If you go back to my original point, you'll see that I was recommending whites (actually, all non-blacks) drop the one-drop rule, because that rule only advantages blacks. It used to 'advantage' whites - it helped keep the white community white (aka allowed it to continue to exist) - but since all political and all (overt) social barriers to intermixture have completely collapsed, there is no further use for it.

    What would dropping the one-drop rule (by non-blacks) actually entail? That's a good question. Obviously, in an age in which merely contradicting something a black has said - no matter how nutty - is fraught with suspicions of proto-racism (or "whitesplaining"), you can't just charge in and set them straight, "no pal, you're not actually black." It would have to be more subtle than that. There is an overt course of action available, though, which is to support any and all "mixed" or "mulatto" identity movements. Among non-blacks, talk about such movements should emphasize how "unfair" it is to lump mixed/mulatto people in with the black population, and that they obviously have a "right" to separate themselves from it.

    What grounds are there to believe such an effort may bear fruit? If we look at parts of the world where the mulatto escape hatch has existed the longest - essentially, Latin America - we observe an undoubted keenness to adopt non-black identities. Indeed, the region is known for its plethora of racial designations, the unifying them of which is creating distance from blackness. The Dominican Republic has achieved notoriety for erecting barriers against Haitian infiltrators, in effect saying "we're black enough already thanks, we don't intend to grow any blacker." In America, black(ish) hispanics resort to speaking Spanish as a way of signaling their separateness from blackness.

    The same is true in South Africa, where Colored (as distinct from Black) remains a strongly defended identity, despite power shifting to blacks. (Coloreds strongly supported the (white) National Party in the 1994 'free' election.)

    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks; which increasingly means pureblooded blacks straight from Africa, who immediately upon arrival claim a right to speak on behalf of all black Americans, which descendants-of-slaves blacks tend to deeply resent.

    All in all, the prospect of splitting their ranks must be regarded as at least plausible. As for the need to split them, I have every confidence it will grow ever more apparent with each passing year; and by the end of the century, people will have a hard time believing anybody could have ever thought otherwise.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @songbird

    , @A123
    @Barbarossa

    Here is a similar view on the problems with categorization: (1)


    The Idiocy of America's Racial Classification System

     

    1. So we spend a lot of time talking about race and ethnicity in America, but it seems like the basic thesis of your book is that we have no idea what we're talking about. Is that right?

    Americans typically make two primary errors about race. The first is that the racial classifications we use in common parlance--Black, White, Asian, Native American, Hispanic—are somehow natural and arose spontaneously. Very few of us realize that the US government codified them in 1977 in a formal federal law called Statistical Directive No. 15. Before that, almost no one called people of Spanish-speaking descent “Hispanics.” What we now call “Asian Americans” were nothing like a coherent group; Japanese, Chinese, and Filipino Americans had distinct cultures and significant history inter-group conflict. Americans from India were typically classified as “white” or “other,” but a last-minute lobbying campaign resulted in them being added to the Asian American group.
    ...

    2. What are some particularly egregious examples of nonsensical racial classification under existing law and practice?

    The Asian American classification includes people with ancestry anywhere from Pakistan to the Philippines. Imagine the absurdity of university officials using “Asian American” as a singular “diversity” classification! It’s so internally diverse, and includes people who ancestors include around sixty percent of the world’s population. And while we don’t often think about it, the white classification is a government-invented pseudo-race, including everyone from Icelanders to Yemenis, people who don’t have anything more in common than do Filipinos and Pakistanis. Also, the Hispanic ethnic classification makes little sense—most Hispanics self-identify as “racially” white and often look European. Why do they, but no other “white” ethnicity, get a special category?
     
    The whole thing made little sense decades ago and is now completely bonkers.

    I know one girl who is 7/8 Irish Ginger, with a Spanish surname based on 1/8 paternal lineage. She is checking the Hispanic box on every university application. And, she would be a fool not to.

    At some point we will go back to being a merit based society, but that day is not today. It will take time and MAGA votes for multiple election cycles. Or, possibly a civil war. Take your pick.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://instapundit.substack.com/p/the-idiocy-of-americas-racial-classification

    Replies: @silviosilver

  165. @A123
    @QCIC


    If Russia continues to forgo heavy destruction of critical infrastructure this SMO could go on a long time. If they move aggressively it might be over quickly.

    Which will be the first major city in Ukraine to be flipped or taken?
     
    Why does Putin need to take major cities?

    Realistically, they would wind up being destroyed not captured. The ability to take huge swaths of Mariupol relatively intact was a special case.

    The Dnieper in the South is strong as a new border. It permanently avoids the threat of a rebuilt Punishment Dam and other encroachment on Russian Crimea.

    An armistice line in the North would be a good starting point for negotiations. It leaves some of the territory that Kiev oppressed in Ukrainian hands. However, there is a huge amount of "big empty" up that way. Something stable can be found by exchanging people and shifting the border modest amounts.
    ___

    Time is on Russia's side. Their national economy is still functional.

    The Kiev regime is a pauper, groveling for handouts. McCarthy had to take rules changes that makes another Omnibus fiasco nearly impossible.

    The questions I ask are:

    • When will Zelensky flee to Europe?
    • When the foreign money for Kiev combat offensives "run out"?

    Unless a new major grift can be accomplished, my estimate is that Zelensky will exit to cushy speaking tours in July perhaps August, assuming he values his own skin. By September it starts getting dicey, and he might not make it out at all. An armistice is likely as soon as there is a new rational leader in Kiev.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @QCIC

    That is why I used the words “taken or flipped”. Flipped means made pro-Russian (without destruction) which implies new local government. They don’t want to destroy any cities in the East, they may be past caring in the West.

    I assume either anguished Nationalists or disappointed Western types will take care of Zelensky. Something about dancing with the devil…

    • Replies: @A123
    @QCIC


    That is why I used the words “taken or flipped”. Flipped means made pro-Russian (without destruction) which implies new local government. They don’t want to destroy any cities in the East, they may be past caring in the West.
     
    I do not see any plausible flips for large cities. Many with known anti-Kiev leanings fled so as not to be caught in the crossfire or local Stasi like machinations. While there may be quiet discontent, there is no good way to organize action.

    Flattening Odessa makes military sense. However, it could also create serious long-term problems for Putin's larger geopolitical strategy. Bypassing Odessa to hookup with Transnistria is an interesting idea to "land lock" the Kiev regime, but improbable as far too ambitious & high risk.

    Waiting for Kiev's aggression to run out of money has conservative appeal, minimizing casualties on both sides. It avoids having a failed state on the Russian border. They are closely watching the fiasco in Lebanon, which is highly problematic for both Syria and Jewish Palestine. The last thing Putin wants is a similar issue on a much lengthier geographic scale.


    I assume either anguished Nationalists or disappointed Western types will take care of Zelensky.
     
    Ultimately Zelensky has to skip the country before he winds up like Gaddafi.

    If he makes it out, the European Empire will protect him and his family. Not selling him out is essential suborning the next national leader to serve the European WEF Elites.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @QCIC, @Mr. Hack

  166. @Mr. Hack
    @Mikhail

    Fighting fire with fire? Ukrainians and Americans feel that "Putler" is the living embodiment of Hitler. Are they wrong?

    https://www.theweek.in/content/dam/week/news/world/images/2022/2/25/hitler_putinf.jpg.transform/schema-1x1/image.jpg

    https://www.kyivpost.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/fnv4wgrwuamdl5g.png

    Replies: @Mikhail

    You betcha. Putin for years gave peace a chance, much unlike the corrupt, lying, undemocratic and neo-Nazi influenced Kiev regime, with blood on its hands before and after 2/24/22 and thereafter.

    Merkel, Hollande and Porky confirmed the obvious.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Mikhail

    But the "corrupt, lying undemocratic and neo-Nazi"side never invaded Russia, never transgressed its neighbor's borders to foment a war, similarly to the Sudetenland Czechs and NAZI Germany. Painting Rusia like a beacon of peace and measured reasonableness is a hoax that can be viewed objectively through the eyes of all of its satellite states that all fled the iron curtain and fled to the Western side. Even Finland and Sweden are soon to become full fledged members of NATO (talk about a major foreign policy gaffe made by the Russian side), making it once again a stronger and more viable organization.

    https://s3-eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/cartoons-s3/styles/large/s3/NATO%20FINLAND%20SWEDEN.jpg?itok=O7z8hqhJ

    https://s3-eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/cartoons-s3/styles/large/s3/mamamntt%20ffrr%20ddfer%20cagle.jpg?itok=zN1suU5z

    Another huge miscalculation by the Russian side!

  167. @QCIC
    @Greasy William

    The NATO weapons stop flowing in once the new Ukrainian powers-that-be do not want them. I'm referring to heavier weapons. In the meantime Russia could stop much of the influx by blowing up some more bridges. The war of attrition seems intentional to me, so they are not ready to blow up the bridges.

    I think one aspect of the Russian approach which confuses people is the Russians are willing to accept battles of attrition which cost many lives on both sides. Since Viet Nam the West has molded a "dominance" narrative where almost all of the casualties are on the losing side. I don't know if that ever works with a serious adversary, but it is what people in the West expect. So Russia goes in and take serious losses and pundits screech "catastrophe", whereas military planners say "that was expected".

    I agree that many of the early Russian casualties in the SMO looked like the result of failures and not attrition.

    Replies: @Mikhail, @Sean

    The USSR in Finland and some other campaigns showed a lack of concern for lives on both sides, much unlike the post-Soviet Russian approach to the current situation.

    The collective Western establishment exhibits great deceit in it sselective concern for human lives.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Mikhail

    I think they are realists.

  168. @QCIC
    @Greasy William

    The NATO weapons stop flowing in once the new Ukrainian powers-that-be do not want them. I'm referring to heavier weapons. In the meantime Russia could stop much of the influx by blowing up some more bridges. The war of attrition seems intentional to me, so they are not ready to blow up the bridges.

    I think one aspect of the Russian approach which confuses people is the Russians are willing to accept battles of attrition which cost many lives on both sides. Since Viet Nam the West has molded a "dominance" narrative where almost all of the casualties are on the losing side. I don't know if that ever works with a serious adversary, but it is what people in the West expect. So Russia goes in and take serious losses and pundits screech "catastrophe", whereas military planners say "that was expected".

    I agree that many of the early Russian casualties in the SMO looked like the result of failures and not attrition.

    Replies: @Mikhail, @Sean

    NATO weapons stop flowing in once the new Ukrainian powers-that-be do not want them.

    Macgregor has been predicting a revolution in Ukraine but I really cannot see it happening, any more that all the hopeful predictions Putin being overthrown. Mearsheimer was closer to the mark when he said the general populace of Ukraine’s nationalist reaction to the invasion was a big force multiplier that made Zelensky’s regieme rock solid no matter what.

    In the meantime Russia could stop much of the influx by blowing up some more bridges.

    It has been suggested that the Russians are letting the more sophisticated weapons such as HIMARS rockets reach east Ukraine because they can target them most easily there.

    I think one aspect of the Russian approach which confuses people is the Russians are willing to accept battles of attrition which cost many lives on both sides

    Since Mariupol they are not keen on full encirclements judging by the recent advances they prefer to not close the pincers and have the Ukrainians trapped and fighting to the death.

    So Russia goes in and take serious losses and pundits screech “catastrophe”, whereas military planners say “that was expected”.

    I don’t think the Russian losses in the last few months have been bad apart from the Wagner convict recruits who sent on mission to die while drawing fire and setting off minefield, and 99% of the time do not survive their six months to a pardon.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Sean

    The Russians are losing men everyday and no one there is kvetching about it, that is all I was trying to say.

    I would like to know more about how Russia is working the propaganda war in Ukraine. I think at some point they will reach parity on this front (do they call it a domain yet?) and they will be able to influence the leadership to capitulate.

    They simply need to convey that, yes they will kill Western mercenaries and NeoNazis, they will give Ukrainian soldiers a chance to surrender and civilians will be spared. This has been part of their message throughout the SMO but I am sure most Ukrainians are propagandized to see the Russians in much darker terms.

    I hate to oversimplify and degrade such a serious process, but my hunch is it boils down to a carrot and stick approach. The bombs are the stick, the carrot will be conveyed through propaganda. Unless of course Kiev capitulates before this point.

    Replies: @Sean, @LatW

  169. @QCIC
    @A123

    That is why I used the words "taken or flipped". Flipped means made pro-Russian (without destruction) which implies new local government. They don't want to destroy any cities in the East, they may be past caring in the West.

    I assume either anguished Nationalists or disappointed Western types will take care of Zelensky. Something about dancing with the devil...

    Replies: @A123

    That is why I used the words “taken or flipped”. Flipped means made pro-Russian (without destruction) which implies new local government. They don’t want to destroy any cities in the East, they may be past caring in the West.

    I do not see any plausible flips for large cities. Many with known anti-Kiev leanings fled so as not to be caught in the crossfire or local Stasi like machinations. While there may be quiet discontent, there is no good way to organize action.

    Flattening Odessa makes military sense. However, it could also create serious long-term problems for Putin’s larger geopolitical strategy. Bypassing Odessa to hookup with Transnistria is an interesting idea to “land lock” the Kiev regime, but improbable as far too ambitious & high risk.

    Waiting for Kiev’s aggression to run out of money has conservative appeal, minimizing casualties on both sides. It avoids having a failed state on the Russian border. They are closely watching the fiasco in Lebanon, which is highly problematic for both Syria and Jewish Palestine. The last thing Putin wants is a similar issue on a much lengthier geographic scale.

    I assume either anguished Nationalists or disappointed Western types will take care of Zelensky.

    Ultimately Zelensky has to skip the country before he winds up like Gaddafi.

    If he makes it out, the European Empire will protect him and his family. Not selling him out is essential suborning the next national leader to serve the European WEF Elites.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @A123

    I get your point but I'm skeptical of any comparison of Gaddafi and Zelensky.

    Russia doesn't need or want to flatten these cities unless there are concentrations of Ukrainian and NeoNazi forces armed with heavy weapons

    Odessa can be mostly taken out of commission as the major transport hub by knocking out the port cranes, some railroad bridges, a few runways and a local power plant or two. Maybe they will drop some mines in the harbor. Based on recent news, Russia is inching closer to this sort of attack.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    , @Mr. Hack
    @A123


    Waiting for Kiev’s aggression to run out of money has conservative appeal,
     
    "Kiev's aggression"? You must have just run out of your meds to believe BS like this. Who is Ukraine being the aggressor towards? To the Russian Christian pacifiers that are spreading Russian corruption and authoritarian oligarchy to Ukraine? Do you really believe this nonsense that you're trying to spread here? If you do, you're an even bigger fool than I had imagined. Mabe Putler should be viewed as Russia's Billy Graham?

    Ultimately Zelensky has to skip the country before he winds up like Gaddafi.
     
    You've been tooting this empty meme since 02/24/22. Zelenskyt put cowards and appeasers like you to shame from the beginning of the war. They're all still in Ukraine fighting to defend their country:

    https://youtu.be/u0-Yeqh4PFY
    Have any current pics of Zelensky building a new mansion in Switzerland? You're all just stupid hot air, kremlinstoogeA123.

  170. @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    To you and silviosilver,

    It seems to me that the reason that intermediate labels like mulatto have fallen out of favor is that there is no advantage to adopting them. There are certain advantages in terms of group identity or signaling that can be accrued by identifying as white or black, but none from identifying as a mixture. This is why someone like Markle will identify as black. Being a mulatto just puts one in an indeterminate group not accepted fully by any mainstream identity.

    In the past it was certainly advantageous for mixed raced people to stretch their whiteness by claiming the term mulattto or octoroon. By doing so they could claim some access to social circles more off limits if they just claimed to be black. Now there are definite advantages and cache in certain respects to claiming blackness, so the reach sometimes goes in the other direction, like Obama, Markle, various Pretendians, etc. In the past Obama would have been proud to accentuate his white ancestry.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Emil Nikola Richard, @silviosilver, @A123

    Songbird’s saying IMO that America’s a creole society now & needs a 3rd category.
    Personally, am completely for keeping the one-drop rule.

    Giving political recognition to mulattos just creates 2 enemies from 1.
    The barrier to mixing/revulsion is also lowered – there’s no positive.

    Most Mulattos are from white slave owners not mudsharks.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh


    Giving political recognition to mulattos just creates 2 enemies from 1.
     
    Umm, yeah genius, that is how divide and conquer works. Obviously nobody would do it if the two enemies became stronger. If the strength of the one enemy was 100 but splitting it into two created a combined strength of >100, it would be entirely counterproductive to split them. But if their combined strength dropped to <100 - as history suggests it does - then it makes perfect sense.

    The barrier to mixing/revulsion is also lowered – there’s no positive.
     
    That would be true if the barrier were currently high. But since the barrier is already at rock bottom, it's completely irrelevant.

    @songbird Most Mulattos are from white slave owners not mudsharks.
     
    Historically. But newly minted mulattoes are overwhelmingly spawned by mudsharks.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  171. @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    To you and silviosilver,

    It seems to me that the reason that intermediate labels like mulatto have fallen out of favor is that there is no advantage to adopting them. There are certain advantages in terms of group identity or signaling that can be accrued by identifying as white or black, but none from identifying as a mixture. This is why someone like Markle will identify as black. Being a mulatto just puts one in an indeterminate group not accepted fully by any mainstream identity.

    In the past it was certainly advantageous for mixed raced people to stretch their whiteness by claiming the term mulattto or octoroon. By doing so they could claim some access to social circles more off limits if they just claimed to be black. Now there are definite advantages and cache in certain respects to claiming blackness, so the reach sometimes goes in the other direction, like Obama, Markle, various Pretendians, etc. In the past Obama would have been proud to accentuate his white ancestry.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Emil Nikola Richard, @silviosilver, @A123

    Creole culture is alive and well in New Orleans. You need to bring home a girl who is lighter than a paper sack. The grave of Marie Laveaux is top tourist attraction and Mayor Ray Nagin was too dark. He is very very close to the same shade as a paper sack.

  172. The idea of sending huge amounts of armor to the Kiev regime just took a big hit. (1)

    German arms manufacturer Rheinmetall would not be able to deliver battle-ready Leopard 2 tanks to Ukraine until 2024, the company’s chief executive said.

    Repair and refurbishment requirements mean it would take until the beginning of next year to deliver the tanks, “even if the decision to send our Leopard tanks to Kyiv came tomorrow,” Rheinmetall CEO Armin Papperger told the Bild am Sonntag newspaper.

    Expect hysterical anger warmongering German Greens. Pro-War progressives Leftoids can be quite shrill.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.politico.eu/article/ukraine-war-germany-tanks-rheinmetall-leopard-2024/

  173. @A123
    @QCIC


    That is why I used the words “taken or flipped”. Flipped means made pro-Russian (without destruction) which implies new local government. They don’t want to destroy any cities in the East, they may be past caring in the West.
     
    I do not see any plausible flips for large cities. Many with known anti-Kiev leanings fled so as not to be caught in the crossfire or local Stasi like machinations. While there may be quiet discontent, there is no good way to organize action.

    Flattening Odessa makes military sense. However, it could also create serious long-term problems for Putin's larger geopolitical strategy. Bypassing Odessa to hookup with Transnistria is an interesting idea to "land lock" the Kiev regime, but improbable as far too ambitious & high risk.

    Waiting for Kiev's aggression to run out of money has conservative appeal, minimizing casualties on both sides. It avoids having a failed state on the Russian border. They are closely watching the fiasco in Lebanon, which is highly problematic for both Syria and Jewish Palestine. The last thing Putin wants is a similar issue on a much lengthier geographic scale.


    I assume either anguished Nationalists or disappointed Western types will take care of Zelensky.
     
    Ultimately Zelensky has to skip the country before he winds up like Gaddafi.

    If he makes it out, the European Empire will protect him and his family. Not selling him out is essential suborning the next national leader to serve the European WEF Elites.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @QCIC, @Mr. Hack

    I get your point but I’m skeptical of any comparison of Gaddafi and Zelensky.

    Russia doesn’t need or want to flatten these cities unless there are concentrations of Ukrainian and NeoNazi forces armed with heavy weapons

    Odessa can be mostly taken out of commission as the major transport hub by knocking out the port cranes, some railroad bridges, a few runways and a local power plant or two. Maybe they will drop some mines in the harbor. Based on recent news, Russia is inching closer to this sort of attack.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @QCIC


    Based on recent news, Russia is inching closer to this sort of attack.
     
    What are you basing this on?

    Replies: @QCIC

  174. @Mikhail
    @QCIC

    The USSR in Finland and some other campaigns showed a lack of concern for lives on both sides, much unlike the post-Soviet Russian approach to the current situation.

    The collective Western establishment exhibits great deceit in it sselective concern for human lives.

    Replies: @QCIC

    I think they are realists.

  175. @Sean
    @QCIC


    NATO weapons stop flowing in once the new Ukrainian powers-that-be do not want them.
     
    Macgregor has been predicting a revolution in Ukraine but I really cannot see it happening, any more that all the hopeful predictions Putin being overthrown. Mearsheimer was closer to the mark when he said the general populace of Ukraine's nationalist reaction to the invasion was a big force multiplier that made Zelensky's regieme rock solid no matter what.

    In the meantime Russia could stop much of the influx by blowing up some more bridges.
     
    It has been suggested that the Russians are letting the more sophisticated weapons such as HIMARS rockets reach east Ukraine because they can target them most easily there.

    I think one aspect of the Russian approach which confuses people is the Russians are willing to accept battles of attrition which cost many lives on both sides
     
    Since Mariupol they are not keen on full encirclements judging by the recent advances they prefer to not close the pincers and have the Ukrainians trapped and fighting to the death.

    So Russia goes in and take serious losses and pundits screech “catastrophe”, whereas military planners say “that was expected”.

     

    I don't think the Russian losses in the last few months have been bad apart from the Wagner convict recruits who sent on mission to die while drawing fire and setting off minefield, and 99% of the time do not survive their six months to a pardon.

    Replies: @QCIC

    The Russians are losing men everyday and no one there is kvetching about it, that is all I was trying to say.

    I would like to know more about how Russia is working the propaganda war in Ukraine. I think at some point they will reach parity on this front (do they call it a domain yet?) and they will be able to influence the leadership to capitulate.

    They simply need to convey that, yes they will kill Western mercenaries and NeoNazis, they will give Ukrainian soldiers a chance to surrender and civilians will be spared. This has been part of their message throughout the SMO but I am sure most Ukrainians are propagandized to see the Russians in much darker terms.

    I hate to oversimplify and degrade such a serious process, but my hunch is it boils down to a carrot and stick approach. The bombs are the stick, the carrot will be conveyed through propaganda. Unless of course Kiev capitulates before this point.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @QCIC

    I should have mentioned that Mearsheimer's main point in relation to nationalism as a force multiplier was the Russian population would evince it too and rally round Putin.


    I hate to oversimplify and degrade such a serious process, but my hunch is it boils down to a carrot and stick approach. The bombs are the stick, the carrot will be conveyed through propaganda. Unless of course Kiev capitulates before this point.
     
    Mearsiemer's in his UnHerd interview says the US will not allow Russia to get anything that looks like a victory. But he also says that only holds true if Russia keeps it conventional. According to Professor Mearsheimer, actual use of a nuke by Russia would create a sudden perception in the West that events were getting out of control and a concomitant desire among American strategists to close the war (and support for Ukraine) down immediately. If in the long run, a nuclear detonation by Russia on a Ukrainian battlefield would save lives, then the sooner the better. Unfortunately, the Russians suffering serious reverses is not likely any time soon

    Replies: @QCIC

    , @LatW
    @QCIC


    They simply need to convey that, yes they will kill Western mercenaries and NeoNazis, they will give Ukrainian soldiers a chance to surrender and civilians will be spared. This has been part of their message throughout the SMO but I am sure most Ukrainians are propagandized to see the Russians in much darker terms.
     
    You are either completely clueless as to what is actually happening in Ukraine or you are deliberately dense because of your ideological bias. I can't believe someone can write this after what happened in Dnipro yesterday. You will be forever cursed along with the Russian savages.

    The Russian savages murdered this woman's son in front of her eyes:

    https://twitter.com/DefenceU/status/1614411918030127109

    Replies: @QCIC

  176. @QCIC
    @Sean

    The Russians are losing men everyday and no one there is kvetching about it, that is all I was trying to say.

    I would like to know more about how Russia is working the propaganda war in Ukraine. I think at some point they will reach parity on this front (do they call it a domain yet?) and they will be able to influence the leadership to capitulate.

    They simply need to convey that, yes they will kill Western mercenaries and NeoNazis, they will give Ukrainian soldiers a chance to surrender and civilians will be spared. This has been part of their message throughout the SMO but I am sure most Ukrainians are propagandized to see the Russians in much darker terms.

    I hate to oversimplify and degrade such a serious process, but my hunch is it boils down to a carrot and stick approach. The bombs are the stick, the carrot will be conveyed through propaganda. Unless of course Kiev capitulates before this point.

    Replies: @Sean, @LatW

    I should have mentioned that Mearsheimer’s main point in relation to nationalism as a force multiplier was the Russian population would evince it too and rally round Putin.

    I hate to oversimplify and degrade such a serious process, but my hunch is it boils down to a carrot and stick approach. The bombs are the stick, the carrot will be conveyed through propaganda. Unless of course Kiev capitulates before this point.

    Mearsiemer’s in his UnHerd interview says the US will not allow Russia to get anything that looks like a victory. But he also says that only holds true if Russia keeps it conventional. According to Professor Mearsheimer, actual use of a nuke by Russia would create a sudden perception in the West that events were getting out of control and a concomitant desire among American strategists to close the war (and support for Ukraine) down immediately. If in the long run, a nuclear detonation by Russia on a Ukrainian battlefield would save lives, then the sooner the better. Unfortunately, the Russians suffering serious reverses is not likely any time soon

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Sean

    I don't think there are any targets worthy of a nuke on the Ukrainian battlefield.

    I agree with the point that the US seems 'all in', but they may drop it at some point. The people behind this atrocity don't actually have to save face, they will just lie about it. Unfortunately, they will probably escalate something else.

    I still worry the most about Kaliningrad, I do believe that Western strikes there could lead to the use of nuclear weapons by either side. Serbia should watch out as well.

    Call your Congressman.

    Replies: @Sean

  177. @QCIC
    @Sean

    The Russians are losing men everyday and no one there is kvetching about it, that is all I was trying to say.

    I would like to know more about how Russia is working the propaganda war in Ukraine. I think at some point they will reach parity on this front (do they call it a domain yet?) and they will be able to influence the leadership to capitulate.

    They simply need to convey that, yes they will kill Western mercenaries and NeoNazis, they will give Ukrainian soldiers a chance to surrender and civilians will be spared. This has been part of their message throughout the SMO but I am sure most Ukrainians are propagandized to see the Russians in much darker terms.

    I hate to oversimplify and degrade such a serious process, but my hunch is it boils down to a carrot and stick approach. The bombs are the stick, the carrot will be conveyed through propaganda. Unless of course Kiev capitulates before this point.

    Replies: @Sean, @LatW

    They simply need to convey that, yes they will kill Western mercenaries and NeoNazis, they will give Ukrainian soldiers a chance to surrender and civilians will be spared. This has been part of their message throughout the SMO but I am sure most Ukrainians are propagandized to see the Russians in much darker terms.

    You are either completely clueless as to what is actually happening in Ukraine or you are deliberately dense because of your ideological bias. I can’t believe someone can write this after what happened in Dnipro yesterday. You will be forever cursed along with the Russian savages.

    [MORE]

    The Russian savages murdered this woman’s son in front of her eyes:

    • Agree: Mr. Hack
    • Troll: Mikhail
    • Replies: @QCIC
    @LatW

    Sadly I am aware of what is happening in Ukraine. I have been worrying about this since 2014. Horrible things like this happen every day in this war, even every minute. It is soul destroying and disgusting.

    THIS IS WHY WE AVOID WAR!!!!

    STOP CHEERLEADING FOR NATIONALISM. At this point the best we can hope for is that it doesn't turn into a nuclear World War. I think people with attitudes similar to yours have led us closer to that precipice.

    The West manipulated Ukraine to weaken Russia. This death and destruction is what the West wanted to accomplish.

    I'm past caring that you don't understand that these deaths link directly back to Maidan. I know it, lots of other people know it, the Russians know it and eventually a lot of sad Ukrainians will understand it as well.

    Europeans have endured so many stupid wars I think you all would learn.

    In case I lost you,

    THIS IS WHY WE AVOID WAR.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @LatW

  178. Civilians screaming under rubble in Dnipro:

    [MORE]

    Russian propaganda scum celebrating the death of civilians in Dnipro:

  179. @QCIC
    @A123

    I get your point but I'm skeptical of any comparison of Gaddafi and Zelensky.

    Russia doesn't need or want to flatten these cities unless there are concentrations of Ukrainian and NeoNazi forces armed with heavy weapons

    Odessa can be mostly taken out of commission as the major transport hub by knocking out the port cranes, some railroad bridges, a few runways and a local power plant or two. Maybe they will drop some mines in the harbor. Based on recent news, Russia is inching closer to this sort of attack.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    Based on recent news, Russia is inching closer to this sort of attack.

    What are you basing this on?

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Greasy William

    I was referring to the 80 missile attack over the weekend, along with the fact that it utilized some heavy bombers if the report I read was accurate. I did not read if they only launched missiles or if the attack also included bombs. I believe they have used the big planes sporadically since the start of the SMO, but I believe if these aircraft become more common it is a sign of a major escalation.

    IMO, an attack with several hundred missiles would be a clear sign they have become serious. Same thing if they start using the heavy bombers to drop bombs.

  180. @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    To you and silviosilver,

    It seems to me that the reason that intermediate labels like mulatto have fallen out of favor is that there is no advantage to adopting them. There are certain advantages in terms of group identity or signaling that can be accrued by identifying as white or black, but none from identifying as a mixture. This is why someone like Markle will identify as black. Being a mulatto just puts one in an indeterminate group not accepted fully by any mainstream identity.

    In the past it was certainly advantageous for mixed raced people to stretch their whiteness by claiming the term mulattto or octoroon. By doing so they could claim some access to social circles more off limits if they just claimed to be black. Now there are definite advantages and cache in certain respects to claiming blackness, so the reach sometimes goes in the other direction, like Obama, Markle, various Pretendians, etc. In the past Obama would have been proud to accentuate his white ancestry.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Emil Nikola Richard, @silviosilver, @A123

    If you go back to my original point, you’ll see that I was recommending whites (actually, all non-blacks) drop the one-drop rule, because that rule only advantages blacks. It used to ‘advantage’ whites – it helped keep the white community white (aka allowed it to continue to exist) – but since all political and all (overt) social barriers to intermixture have completely collapsed, there is no further use for it.

    What would dropping the one-drop rule (by non-blacks) actually entail? That’s a good question. Obviously, in an age in which merely contradicting something a black has said – no matter how nutty – is fraught with suspicions of proto-racism (or “whitesplaining”), you can’t just charge in and set them straight, “no pal, you’re not actually black.” It would have to be more subtle than that. There is an overt course of action available, though, which is to support any and all “mixed” or “mulatto” identity movements. Among non-blacks, talk about such movements should emphasize how “unfair” it is to lump mixed/mulatto people in with the black population, and that they obviously have a “right” to separate themselves from it.

    What grounds are there to believe such an effort may bear fruit? If we look at parts of the world where the mulatto escape hatch has existed the longest – essentially, Latin America – we observe an undoubted keenness to adopt non-black identities. Indeed, the region is known for its plethora of racial designations, the unifying them of which is creating distance from blackness. The Dominican Republic has achieved notoriety for erecting barriers against Haitian infiltrators, in effect saying “we’re black enough already thanks, we don’t intend to grow any blacker.” In America, black(ish) hispanics resort to speaking Spanish as a way of signaling their separateness from blackness.

    The same is true in South Africa, where Colored (as distinct from Black) remains a strongly defended identity, despite power shifting to blacks. (Coloreds strongly supported the (white) National Party in the 1994 ‘free’ election.)

    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks; which increasingly means pureblooded blacks straight from Africa, who immediately upon arrival claim a right to speak on behalf of all black Americans, which descendants-of-slaves blacks tend to deeply resent.

    All in all, the prospect of splitting their ranks must be regarded as at least plausible. As for the need to split them, I have every confidence it will grow ever more apparent with each passing year; and by the end of the century, people will have a hard time believing anybody could have ever thought otherwise.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    I get what you are saying, and the left is attempting to do the opposite with the POC umbrella designation. Leaving aside whether or not it's a good idea, given how the incentives actually work for this kind of re-categorization I just don't see the point in throwing it out there as an actionable possibility.

    The shift toward preferential identification with blackness is due to a massive shift in the distribution of rewards. It is in the concrete material interests of many to identify as blacks because of perks. These perks can only be distributed if you control the engines of societal institutional power. Basically, if you had the power to distribute these perks to convince people to adopt an intermediate racial category you wouldn't have to propose such a thing.


    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks
     
    I don't think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren't hanging in the hood. Obama is jet setting with the Martha's Vinyard set while Markle married into the House of Windsor. About the most ghetto they will be likely to see is meeting Snoop Dogg on the golf course.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @silviosilver, @A123

    , @songbird
    @silviosilver


    The same is true in South Africa, where Colored (as distinct from Black) remains a strongly defended identity, despite power shifting to blacks. (Coloreds strongly supported the (white) National Party in the 1994 ‘free’ election.)
     
    Seems as though black identity in South Africa is still pretty tribal. Didn't the Zulus support the whites? And then you have black mobs that are literally killing black immigrants.

    I don't know how transferable it is to a Western template.

    The Coloreds themselves have many different characteristics from mulattoes. One is that they are regionally located - mostly the Western Cape - and that is for historical reasons. Because the Bantu couldn't live there because it was arid, until Euros showed up with deep borehole technology to dig wells.

    Their largest ancestry component tends to be from the Khoisan. A fantastically genetically distinct group from blacks. Though of course they also have major Bantu inputs. IIRC, the Boers used to consider the Khoisan red-skinned.

    I've heard some South Africans say they believe that Coloreds might be even more criminally inclined and violent than the Bantus. Not sure if it is true, but there is some reasoning behind it. The idea is that the Bantu had agriculture for thousands of years, so they are more domesticated, than the Khoisan, who were hunter-gatherers and very divergent ones from the rest of humanity, at that. (some put the branching point at 200,000 years)

    There is even some idea that fertility between the Khoisan and other groups was depressed. And needed lots of copulation, before it would result in successful births. It's not altogether unbelievable when you consider their incredibly different physical traits.
  181. @Sher Singh
    @Barbarossa

    Songbird's saying IMO that America's a creole society now & needs a 3rd category.
    Personally, am completely for keeping the one-drop rule.

    Giving political recognition to mulattos just creates 2 enemies from 1.
    The barrier to mixing/revulsion is also lowered - there's no positive.

    @songbird Most Mulattos are from white slave owners not mudsharks.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Giving political recognition to mulattos just creates 2 enemies from 1.

    Umm, yeah genius, that is how divide and conquer works. Obviously nobody would do it if the two enemies became stronger. If the strength of the one enemy was 100 but splitting it into two created a combined strength of >100, it would be entirely counterproductive to split them. But if their combined strength dropped to <100 – as history suggests it does – then it makes perfect sense.

    The barrier to mixing/revulsion is also lowered – there’s no positive.

    That would be true if the barrier were currently high. But since the barrier is already at rock bottom, it’s completely irrelevant.

    Most Mulattos are from white slave owners not mudsharks.

    Historically. But newly minted mulattoes are overwhelmingly spawned by mudsharks.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver


    If you go back to my original point, you’ll see that I was recommending whites (actually, all non-blacks) drop the one-drop rule, because that rule only advantages blacks. It used to ‘advantage’ whites – it helped keep the white community white (aka allowed it to continue to exist) – but since all political and all (overt) social barriers to intermixture have completely collapsed, there is no further use for it.

    What would dropping the one-drop rule (by non-blacks) actually entail? That’s a good question. Obviously, in an age in which merely contradicting something a black has said – no matter how nutty – is fraught with suspicions of proto-racism (or “whitesplaining”), you can’t just charge in and set them straight, “no pal, you’re not actually black.” It would have to be more subtle than that. There is an overt course of action available, though, which is to support any and all “mixed” or “mulatto” identity movements. Among non-blacks, talk about such movements should emphasize how “unfair” it is to lump mixed/mulatto people in with the black population, and that they obviously have a “right” to separate themselves from it.
     
    I can openly say Sikhi is against inter-caste marriage & dare anyone to step forth.
    You live in Australia - I guarantee white women are still lecturing blacks on what to do in USA.

    This is a coward's out & it's not even hard to get local boys to sort out visiting nogz.
    The Right has a tendency to exaggerate everything - including the collapse of Cali for example.

    There are still significant barriers to mixing & the main vector of mixing is mulattos.
    Making them black means you can straight up say no niggers.

    Stop over-complicating it & fk Lat America - if you're black you're black incl Dominicans

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  182. Sher Singh says:
    @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh


    Giving political recognition to mulattos just creates 2 enemies from 1.
     
    Umm, yeah genius, that is how divide and conquer works. Obviously nobody would do it if the two enemies became stronger. If the strength of the one enemy was 100 but splitting it into two created a combined strength of >100, it would be entirely counterproductive to split them. But if their combined strength dropped to <100 - as history suggests it does - then it makes perfect sense.

    The barrier to mixing/revulsion is also lowered – there’s no positive.
     
    That would be true if the barrier were currently high. But since the barrier is already at rock bottom, it's completely irrelevant.

    @songbird Most Mulattos are from white slave owners not mudsharks.
     
    Historically. But newly minted mulattoes are overwhelmingly spawned by mudsharks.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    If you go back to my original point, you’ll see that I was recommending whites (actually, all non-blacks) drop the one-drop rule, because that rule only advantages blacks. It used to ‘advantage’ whites – it helped keep the white community white (aka allowed it to continue to exist) – but since all political and all (overt) social barriers to intermixture have completely collapsed, there is no further use for it.

    What would dropping the one-drop rule (by non-blacks) actually entail? That’s a good question. Obviously, in an age in which merely contradicting something a black has said – no matter how nutty – is fraught with suspicions of proto-racism (or “whitesplaining”), you can’t just charge in and set them straight, “no pal, you’re not actually black.” It would have to be more subtle than that. There is an overt course of action available, though, which is to support any and all “mixed” or “mulatto” identity movements. Among non-blacks, talk about such movements should emphasize how “unfair” it is to lump mixed/mulatto people in with the black population, and that they obviously have a “right” to separate themselves from it.

    I can openly say Sikhi is against inter-caste marriage & dare anyone to step forth.
    You live in Australia – I guarantee white women are still lecturing blacks on what to do in USA.

    This is a coward’s out & it’s not even hard to get local boys to sort out visiting nogz.
    The Right has a tendency to exaggerate everything – including the collapse of Cali for example.

    There are still significant barriers to mixing & the main vector of mixing is mulattos.
    Making them black means you can straight up say no niggers.

    Stop over-complicating it & fk Lat America – if you’re black you’re black incl Dominicans

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    This is my quarter in Toronto, but I'm used to blacks having an ethnicity, culture etc.
    Ie a lightskin Jamaician is still Jamaican & esp among women skin tone varies

    Those ppl will still side with blacks & just ID as lightskin - they're still anti-white
    Destroying race/one-drop only helps my side since it strengthens caste identity

    The only blacks I've seen mulatto washing work on are from Nova Scotia
    Even then, recent mixes with a black dad tend to ID with the dad

    You're just making it easier for black blood to infiltrate by recognizing mulattos
    The situation is nowhere as bad as you make & I'd go lift, look in the mirror & hit yourself

    Check yourself, you might be developing a cuck complex


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEOKhgGkrog
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oH9savFyn1o

    http://ureachtoronto.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/Toronto-Visible-Minority.png

    White, Brown & Black stay in their quarters even by ethnicity dif Slavs or Indians
    An apartment block might be all Iraqi Christian, next to all Afghans, next to Nigerians

    People aren't ultra-racist just too low iq & apathetic to absorb liberalism
    Terminally online nerd types don't get the avg person gives 0 fucks
    They got bills to pay & grocery to buy

    That map is still more or less accurate - lot of 80% white & 80% non-white areas
    A 1bil police budget + stop-frisk keeps those boundaries

    You're mad wrong on this one, dead wrong
    The entire premise is based on no barriers to mixing

    When there are plenty & while giving up is the Christian thing to do
    We've never accepted the Euro conversion in the first place

    Still hard to find Italians or Croatians willing to out-marry
    You're talking of giving your women away to Mutt-nigger Mulattos LMAO

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Yahya

  183. @LatW
    @QCIC


    They simply need to convey that, yes they will kill Western mercenaries and NeoNazis, they will give Ukrainian soldiers a chance to surrender and civilians will be spared. This has been part of their message throughout the SMO but I am sure most Ukrainians are propagandized to see the Russians in much darker terms.
     
    You are either completely clueless as to what is actually happening in Ukraine or you are deliberately dense because of your ideological bias. I can't believe someone can write this after what happened in Dnipro yesterday. You will be forever cursed along with the Russian savages.

    The Russian savages murdered this woman's son in front of her eyes:

    https://twitter.com/DefenceU/status/1614411918030127109

    Replies: @QCIC

    Sadly I am aware of what is happening in Ukraine. I have been worrying about this since 2014. Horrible things like this happen every day in this war, even every minute. It is soul destroying and disgusting.

    THIS IS WHY WE AVOID WAR!!!!

    STOP CHEERLEADING FOR NATIONALISM. At this point the best we can hope for is that it doesn’t turn into a nuclear World War. I think people with attitudes similar to yours have led us closer to that precipice.

    The West manipulated Ukraine to weaken Russia. This death and destruction is what the West wanted to accomplish.

    I’m past caring that you don’t understand that these deaths link directly back to Maidan. I know it, lots of other people know it, the Russians know it and eventually a lot of sad Ukrainians will understand it as well.

    Europeans have endured so many stupid wars I think you all would learn.

    In case I lost you,

    THIS IS WHY WE AVOID WAR.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @QCIC


    STOP CHEERLEADING FOR NATIONALISM.
     
    This war is being fought to advance GloboHomo, not nationalism. The Ukrainians doing the actual dying are just cannon fodder for the Western regimes

    Replies: @LatW, @LatW

    , @LatW
    @QCIC


    I know it, lots of other people know it, the Russians know it and eventually a lot of sad Ukrainians will understand it as well.
     
    There is nothing to "understand", everything is very clear. A country invaded another country, illegally, and is murdering the civilians there. It is an obvious fact, no matter how you spin it and no matter how much manipulative language you use. The whole world can see it except for you.

    If you were aware of what is happening, you wouldn't be talking all this nonsense, as you have about Ukrainians "being propagandized".

    Replies: @QCIC, @Greasy William

  184. @Sean
    @QCIC

    I should have mentioned that Mearsheimer's main point in relation to nationalism as a force multiplier was the Russian population would evince it too and rally round Putin.


    I hate to oversimplify and degrade such a serious process, but my hunch is it boils down to a carrot and stick approach. The bombs are the stick, the carrot will be conveyed through propaganda. Unless of course Kiev capitulates before this point.
     
    Mearsiemer's in his UnHerd interview says the US will not allow Russia to get anything that looks like a victory. But he also says that only holds true if Russia keeps it conventional. According to Professor Mearsheimer, actual use of a nuke by Russia would create a sudden perception in the West that events were getting out of control and a concomitant desire among American strategists to close the war (and support for Ukraine) down immediately. If in the long run, a nuclear detonation by Russia on a Ukrainian battlefield would save lives, then the sooner the better. Unfortunately, the Russians suffering serious reverses is not likely any time soon

    Replies: @QCIC

    I don’t think there are any targets worthy of a nuke on the Ukrainian battlefield.

    I agree with the point that the US seems ‘all in’, but they may drop it at some point. The people behind this atrocity don’t actually have to save face, they will just lie about it. Unfortunately, they will probably escalate something else.

    I still worry the most about Kaliningrad, I do believe that Western strikes there could lead to the use of nuclear weapons by either side. Serbia should watch out as well.

    Call your Congressman.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @QCIC


    I don’t think there are any targets worthy of a nuke on the Ukrainian battlefield.
     
    It would be performative and signaling willingness to go down that road so they could just hit empty territory such as Snake Island and that would be a wake up call. But they might then do a real strike on supply lines (crater hundreds of yards deep on rail or road link would not so easily be repaired). The actual targeting of the Ukrainian army would be the third escalation.

    Unlike the Cold War, which likely was never going to go hot especially after Cuba, there is not a theory worked out how nuclear escalation would work in a situation where Russia killed thousands of Ukrainian soldiers, and the US has said there would be no nuclear retaliation to that. However, American conventional retaliation (as floated by some retired generals) to a Russian nuclear strike on the Ukrainian army seems very likely to face an already-crossed-the thermonuclear-Rubicon Russia with being humiliatingly trounced and swallowing it, or using another nuke against Nato (there are anti aircraft nukes and nuclear mines). I think Russia could use an ostentatiously redundant strike on an empty area and America would get the message.

    I cannot see America actually launching even a limited raid on the Russian Armed Forces much less actual undisputed Russia territory. We ought to remember that America has not even given Ukraine Abrams tanks or F16s yet, still less the Army Tactical Missile System. All Ukraine has is the effectively 80km range ordinary HIMARS. By my way of thinking that indicates the objective of American strategy is to stop Russia winning rather than help Ukraine to win. The US wants Russia fighting Ukraine in an endless war that is kept below the level of direct US involvement.

    Ukraine is going to be progressively wrecked and suffer permanent loss of population from emigration, but that is a price America is willing to pay in order to weaken Russia. Lloyd Austin said quite openly that weakening Russia was the US objective. That is working with Putin who is too sanguine about the prospects of military success, but I think a successor would quite possibly decide to terminate the war, and threaten to use nuclear weapons on Ukraine if America kept it going. Putin probably ought to do that now, but he remains focused on America's cat's paw (Ukraine), which as long as it keeps fighting the US does not care about. Currently Russia is like a frog in a pot having the heat tuned up so fiendishly slowly that it passively allows itself to be boiled alive.

    Replies: @QCIC, @Greasy William

  185. Sher Singh says:
    @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver


    If you go back to my original point, you’ll see that I was recommending whites (actually, all non-blacks) drop the one-drop rule, because that rule only advantages blacks. It used to ‘advantage’ whites – it helped keep the white community white (aka allowed it to continue to exist) – but since all political and all (overt) social barriers to intermixture have completely collapsed, there is no further use for it.

    What would dropping the one-drop rule (by non-blacks) actually entail? That’s a good question. Obviously, in an age in which merely contradicting something a black has said – no matter how nutty – is fraught with suspicions of proto-racism (or “whitesplaining”), you can’t just charge in and set them straight, “no pal, you’re not actually black.” It would have to be more subtle than that. There is an overt course of action available, though, which is to support any and all “mixed” or “mulatto” identity movements. Among non-blacks, talk about such movements should emphasize how “unfair” it is to lump mixed/mulatto people in with the black population, and that they obviously have a “right” to separate themselves from it.
     
    I can openly say Sikhi is against inter-caste marriage & dare anyone to step forth.
    You live in Australia - I guarantee white women are still lecturing blacks on what to do in USA.

    This is a coward's out & it's not even hard to get local boys to sort out visiting nogz.
    The Right has a tendency to exaggerate everything - including the collapse of Cali for example.

    There are still significant barriers to mixing & the main vector of mixing is mulattos.
    Making them black means you can straight up say no niggers.

    Stop over-complicating it & fk Lat America - if you're black you're black incl Dominicans

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    This is my quarter in Toronto, but I’m used to blacks having an ethnicity, culture etc.
    Ie a lightskin Jamaician is still Jamaican & esp among women skin tone varies

    Those ppl will still side with blacks & just ID as lightskin – they’re still anti-white
    Destroying race/one-drop only helps my side since it strengthens caste identity

    The only blacks I’ve seen mulatto washing work on are from Nova Scotia
    Even then, recent mixes with a black dad tend to ID with the dad

    You’re just making it easier for black blood to infiltrate by recognizing mulattos
    The situation is nowhere as bad as you make & I’d go lift, look in the mirror & hit yourself

    Check yourself, you might be developing a cuck complex

    [MORE]

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oH9savFyn1o

    White, Brown & Black stay in their quarters even by ethnicity dif Slavs or Indians
    An apartment block might be all Iraqi Christian, next to all Afghans, next to Nigerians

    People aren’t ultra-racist just too low iq & apathetic to absorb liberalism
    Terminally online nerd types don’t get the avg person gives 0 fucks
    They got bills to pay & grocery to buy

    That map is still more or less accurate – lot of 80% white & 80% non-white areas
    A 1bil police budget + stop-frisk keeps those boundaries

    You’re mad wrong on this one, dead wrong
    The entire premise is based on no barriers to mixing

    When there are plenty & while giving up is the Christian thing to do
    We’ve never accepted the Euro conversion in the first place

    Still hard to find Italians or Croatians willing to out-marry
    You’re talking of giving your women away to Mutt-nigger Mulattos LMAO

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    The type of mass mixing you imagine is only possible in white lib (Anglo) areas
    Neither the South nor the Ghetto has high levels of mixing

    I can count on one hand the IR couples I've seen in the hard parts of TO
    I'm talking Italian + Syrian let alone white & black

    --
    This goes to what Greasy William said, let the liberals die out - guess that includes you?

    Replies: @silviosilver

    , @Yahya
    @Sher Singh


    Ie a lightskin Jamaician is still Jamaican & esp among women skin tone varies. Those ppl will still side with blacks & just ID as lightskin
     
    Black, mulatto.

    Potatoe, potato.

    Replies: @Yahya

  186. Sher Singh says:
    @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    This is my quarter in Toronto, but I'm used to blacks having an ethnicity, culture etc.
    Ie a lightskin Jamaician is still Jamaican & esp among women skin tone varies

    Those ppl will still side with blacks & just ID as lightskin - they're still anti-white
    Destroying race/one-drop only helps my side since it strengthens caste identity

    The only blacks I've seen mulatto washing work on are from Nova Scotia
    Even then, recent mixes with a black dad tend to ID with the dad

    You're just making it easier for black blood to infiltrate by recognizing mulattos
    The situation is nowhere as bad as you make & I'd go lift, look in the mirror & hit yourself

    Check yourself, you might be developing a cuck complex


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEOKhgGkrog
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oH9savFyn1o

    http://ureachtoronto.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/Toronto-Visible-Minority.png

    White, Brown & Black stay in their quarters even by ethnicity dif Slavs or Indians
    An apartment block might be all Iraqi Christian, next to all Afghans, next to Nigerians

    People aren't ultra-racist just too low iq & apathetic to absorb liberalism
    Terminally online nerd types don't get the avg person gives 0 fucks
    They got bills to pay & grocery to buy

    That map is still more or less accurate - lot of 80% white & 80% non-white areas
    A 1bil police budget + stop-frisk keeps those boundaries

    You're mad wrong on this one, dead wrong
    The entire premise is based on no barriers to mixing

    When there are plenty & while giving up is the Christian thing to do
    We've never accepted the Euro conversion in the first place

    Still hard to find Italians or Croatians willing to out-marry
    You're talking of giving your women away to Mutt-nigger Mulattos LMAO

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Yahya

    The type of mass mixing you imagine is only possible in white lib (Anglo) areas
    Neither the South nor the Ghetto has high levels of mixing

    I can count on one hand the IR couples I’ve seen in the hard parts of TO
    I’m talking Italian + Syrian let alone white & black


    This goes to what Greasy William said, let the liberals die out – guess that includes you?

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh

    I think you should stick to your cryptic three-word posts and let people merely think you're a retard rather trying to carry on an actual discussion and inadvertently proffering undeniable proof.

    Replies: @sudden death, @Sher Singh

  187. @Greasy William
    @QCIC


    Based on recent news, Russia is inching closer to this sort of attack.
     
    What are you basing this on?

    Replies: @QCIC

    I was referring to the 80 missile attack over the weekend, along with the fact that it utilized some heavy bombers if the report I read was accurate. I did not read if they only launched missiles or if the attack also included bombs. I believe they have used the big planes sporadically since the start of the SMO, but I believe if these aircraft become more common it is a sign of a major escalation.

    IMO, an attack with several hundred missiles would be a clear sign they have become serious. Same thing if they start using the heavy bombers to drop bombs.

  188. @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    To you and silviosilver,

    It seems to me that the reason that intermediate labels like mulatto have fallen out of favor is that there is no advantage to adopting them. There are certain advantages in terms of group identity or signaling that can be accrued by identifying as white or black, but none from identifying as a mixture. This is why someone like Markle will identify as black. Being a mulatto just puts one in an indeterminate group not accepted fully by any mainstream identity.

    In the past it was certainly advantageous for mixed raced people to stretch their whiteness by claiming the term mulattto or octoroon. By doing so they could claim some access to social circles more off limits if they just claimed to be black. Now there are definite advantages and cache in certain respects to claiming blackness, so the reach sometimes goes in the other direction, like Obama, Markle, various Pretendians, etc. In the past Obama would have been proud to accentuate his white ancestry.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Emil Nikola Richard, @silviosilver, @A123

    Here is a similar view on the problems with categorization: (1)

    The Idiocy of America’s Racial Classification System

    1. So we spend a lot of time talking about race and ethnicity in America, but it seems like the basic thesis of your book is that we have no idea what we’re talking about. Is that right?

    Americans typically make two primary errors about race. The first is that the racial classifications we use in common parlance–Black, White, Asian, Native American, Hispanic—are somehow natural and arose spontaneously. Very few of us realize that the US government codified them in 1977 in a formal federal law called Statistical Directive No. 15. Before that, almost no one called people of Spanish-speaking descent “Hispanics.” What we now call “Asian Americans” were nothing like a coherent group; Japanese, Chinese, and Filipino Americans had distinct cultures and significant history inter-group conflict. Americans from India were typically classified as “white” or “other,” but a last-minute lobbying campaign resulted in them being added to the Asian American group.

    2. What are some particularly egregious examples of nonsensical racial classification under existing law and practice?

    The Asian American classification includes people with ancestry anywhere from Pakistan to the Philippines. Imagine the absurdity of university officials using “Asian American” as a singular “diversity” classification! It’s so internally diverse, and includes people who ancestors include around sixty percent of the world’s population. And while we don’t often think about it, the white classification is a government-invented pseudo-race, including everyone from Icelanders to Yemenis, people who don’t have anything more in common than do Filipinos and Pakistanis. Also, the Hispanic ethnic classification makes little sense—most Hispanics self-identify as “racially” white and often look European. Why do they, but no other “white” ethnicity, get a special category?

    The whole thing made little sense decades ago and is now completely bonkers.

    I know one girl who is 7/8 Irish Ginger, with a Spanish surname based on 1/8 paternal lineage. She is checking the Hispanic box on every university application. And, she would be a fool not to.

    At some point we will go back to being a merit based society, but that day is not today. It will take time and MAGA votes for multiple election cycles. Or, possibly a civil war. Take your pick.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://instapundit.substack.com/p/the-idiocy-of-americas-racial-classification

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @A123


    Here is a similar view on the problems with categorization: (1)
     
    No, that is only a view on the problems with the existing official categorization scheme, not with categorization per se.

    The cure for bad categorization is good categorization, not no categorization.

    It's pretty simple. So simple, in fact, that it makes perfect sense why Israel-firsters like you are aghast at the notion.

  189. @QCIC
    @LatW

    Sadly I am aware of what is happening in Ukraine. I have been worrying about this since 2014. Horrible things like this happen every day in this war, even every minute. It is soul destroying and disgusting.

    THIS IS WHY WE AVOID WAR!!!!

    STOP CHEERLEADING FOR NATIONALISM. At this point the best we can hope for is that it doesn't turn into a nuclear World War. I think people with attitudes similar to yours have led us closer to that precipice.

    The West manipulated Ukraine to weaken Russia. This death and destruction is what the West wanted to accomplish.

    I'm past caring that you don't understand that these deaths link directly back to Maidan. I know it, lots of other people know it, the Russians know it and eventually a lot of sad Ukrainians will understand it as well.

    Europeans have endured so many stupid wars I think you all would learn.

    In case I lost you,

    THIS IS WHY WE AVOID WAR.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @LatW

    STOP CHEERLEADING FOR NATIONALISM.

    This war is being fought to advance GloboHomo, not nationalism. The Ukrainians doing the actual dying are just cannon fodder for the Western regimes

    • Agree: QCIC
    • Replies: @LatW
    @Greasy William


    This war is being fought to advance GloboHomo, not nationalism.
     
    This war has been going on for hundreds of years, way before there was even GloboHomo and way before America was even a global power. Quit being so self absorbed.
    , @LatW
    @Greasy William


    This war is being fought to advance GloboHomo, not nationalism.
     
    And let me be clear. The Ukrainian nationalists, whose deaths this audience is cheering, were literally the last white men who could've fought this GloboHomo. It is more than obvious that they are the last.
  190. This war is being fought to advance GloboHomo, not nationalism. The Ukrainians doing the actual dying are just cannon fodder for the Western regimes

    Close. Please let me improve that for you:

    This war is being fought to advance IslamoGloboHomo & MENA origin migration, not nationalism. The Ukrainians doing the actual dying are just cannon fodder for European WEF regimes.

    One of the goals of the conflict is to diminish Christian Populism in EU nations such as Hungary.

    PEACE 😇

  191. @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    The type of mass mixing you imagine is only possible in white lib (Anglo) areas
    Neither the South nor the Ghetto has high levels of mixing

    I can count on one hand the IR couples I've seen in the hard parts of TO
    I'm talking Italian + Syrian let alone white & black

    --
    This goes to what Greasy William said, let the liberals die out - guess that includes you?

    Replies: @silviosilver

    I think you should stick to your cryptic three-word posts and let people merely think you’re a retard rather trying to carry on an actual discussion and inadvertently proffering undeniable proof.

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @silviosilver

    How dare you slander etalon example of non-mixed pure Aryan himself here?

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    , @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    Rather than* you brown-skinned ESL student
    You're only scared of blacks because you don't carry weapons


    ਯਾਂਤੇ ਸਰਬ ਖਾਲਸਾ ਸੁਨੀਅਹਿ । ਆਯੁਧ ਧਰਿਬੇ ਉਤੱਮ ਗੁਨੀਅਹਿ ।
    The Guru then said to his Sikhs, "All of the Khalsa listen, carrying weapons is the highest action.

    ਜਬਿ ਹਮਰੇ ਦਰਸ਼ਨ ਕੋ ਆਵਹੁ । ਬਨਿ ਸੁਚੇਤ ਤਨ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਸਜਾਵਹੁ ।।੭।।
    When you come to have my Darshan, adorn your body with weapons.

    ਕਮਰ ਕਸਾ ਕਰਿ ਦੇਹੁ ਦਿਖਾਈ । ਹਮਰੀ ਖੁਸ਼ੀ ਹੋਇ ਅਧਿਕਾਈ ।
    When showing yourself to me have your Kamar Kasa [waist band which holds weapons] tied, in such a way I shall be extremely happy.

    ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਕੇਸ ਬਿਨ ਪਾਉ ਲਖਹੁ ਨਰ । ਕੇਸ ਧਰੇ ਤਬਿ ਆਧੋ ਲਖਿ ਉਰ ।।੮।।
    Those men who do not have Kesh [unshorn hair] or Shastars [weapons], do not recognize those men as full men. Those who have Kesh [unshorn hair], recognize those as half-men.

    ਕੇਸ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਜਬਿ ਦੋਨਹੁਂ ਧਾਰੇ । ਤਬਿ ਨਰੁ ਰੂਪ ਹੋਤਿ ਹੈ ਸਾਰੇ ।
    Those who have adorned themselves with Kesh [unshorn hair] and Shastar [weapons], those men have attained their full form."
     
    Trans-gender looking to push trans-racial individuals.
    How typical, but let's hear from those who've seen blacks outside television.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  192. @QCIC
    @LatW

    Sadly I am aware of what is happening in Ukraine. I have been worrying about this since 2014. Horrible things like this happen every day in this war, even every minute. It is soul destroying and disgusting.

    THIS IS WHY WE AVOID WAR!!!!

    STOP CHEERLEADING FOR NATIONALISM. At this point the best we can hope for is that it doesn't turn into a nuclear World War. I think people with attitudes similar to yours have led us closer to that precipice.

    The West manipulated Ukraine to weaken Russia. This death and destruction is what the West wanted to accomplish.

    I'm past caring that you don't understand that these deaths link directly back to Maidan. I know it, lots of other people know it, the Russians know it and eventually a lot of sad Ukrainians will understand it as well.

    Europeans have endured so many stupid wars I think you all would learn.

    In case I lost you,

    THIS IS WHY WE AVOID WAR.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @LatW

    I know it, lots of other people know it, the Russians know it and eventually a lot of sad Ukrainians will understand it as well.

    There is nothing to “understand”, everything is very clear. A country invaded another country, illegally, and is murdering the civilians there. It is an obvious fact, no matter how you spin it and no matter how much manipulative language you use. The whole world can see it except for you.

    If you were aware of what is happening, you wouldn’t be talking all this nonsense, as you have about Ukrainians “being propagandized”.

    • Agree: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @QCIC
    @LatW

    You don't think that Kiev knew that Russia would get involved when Ukraine started shelling Donetsk with heavy artillery? Such a naive belief would be retarded, of course they knew it. Again, that was the point to draw them in.

    The propaganda I mentioned includes the notion that Russia would be too weak to do anything about Maidan and what followed. The Ukrainian military surely knew that Russia could defeat them, so they must have believed the Western con that economic or other pressure would keep Russia at bay. It seems that these ideas were mistaken.

    I think you are incorrigible, with your hundreds of years of angry history. I hope people stop listening to the murderous cries of people with the same delusions.

    The following is a response to #194:

    My view is that in this case Nationalism is the meme which enthralled the Ukrainians so they voluntarily became pawns in this. There is a lot more to it, but I think this is an important aspect.

    BTW, I am not against Nationalism. I am against gullible blood thirsty stupidity.

    , @Greasy William
    @LatW


    There is nothing to “understand”, everything is very clear. A country invaded another country, illegally
     
    True. The Russian invasion is criminal. I have never denied this.

    [Russia] is murdering the civilians [in Ukraine]
     
    I have seen no evidence of this. Collateral damage != murder.

    This war has been going on for hundreds of years, way before there was even GloboHomo and way before America was even a global power.
     
    Which doesn't change the fact that the Ukrainians are being used as pawns for GloboHomo imperialism now. I don't blame the Ukrainians for taking any help they can get, I'd do the same thing in their position, but facts are facts.

    Unlike most other far right nihilists, I strongly believe that it is important that Ukraine remains a free and independent state. But I don't think it's important how far east the Ukrainian-Russian border ends up. In fact, I would prefer that said border is as far west as possible, as that will ensure the largest amount of Ukraine's Russophile population will be part of the RF and GloboHomo will have eaten at least a partial defeat.

    Replies: @LatW, @LatW

  193. @Greasy William
    @QCIC


    STOP CHEERLEADING FOR NATIONALISM.
     
    This war is being fought to advance GloboHomo, not nationalism. The Ukrainians doing the actual dying are just cannon fodder for the Western regimes

    Replies: @LatW, @LatW

    This war is being fought to advance GloboHomo, not nationalism.

    This war has been going on for hundreds of years, way before there was even GloboHomo and way before America was even a global power. Quit being so self absorbed.

    • Agree: Sher Singh
  194. @A123
    @Barbarossa

    Here is a similar view on the problems with categorization: (1)


    The Idiocy of America's Racial Classification System

     

    1. So we spend a lot of time talking about race and ethnicity in America, but it seems like the basic thesis of your book is that we have no idea what we're talking about. Is that right?

    Americans typically make two primary errors about race. The first is that the racial classifications we use in common parlance--Black, White, Asian, Native American, Hispanic—are somehow natural and arose spontaneously. Very few of us realize that the US government codified them in 1977 in a formal federal law called Statistical Directive No. 15. Before that, almost no one called people of Spanish-speaking descent “Hispanics.” What we now call “Asian Americans” were nothing like a coherent group; Japanese, Chinese, and Filipino Americans had distinct cultures and significant history inter-group conflict. Americans from India were typically classified as “white” or “other,” but a last-minute lobbying campaign resulted in them being added to the Asian American group.
    ...

    2. What are some particularly egregious examples of nonsensical racial classification under existing law and practice?

    The Asian American classification includes people with ancestry anywhere from Pakistan to the Philippines. Imagine the absurdity of university officials using “Asian American” as a singular “diversity” classification! It’s so internally diverse, and includes people who ancestors include around sixty percent of the world’s population. And while we don’t often think about it, the white classification is a government-invented pseudo-race, including everyone from Icelanders to Yemenis, people who don’t have anything more in common than do Filipinos and Pakistanis. Also, the Hispanic ethnic classification makes little sense—most Hispanics self-identify as “racially” white and often look European. Why do they, but no other “white” ethnicity, get a special category?
     
    The whole thing made little sense decades ago and is now completely bonkers.

    I know one girl who is 7/8 Irish Ginger, with a Spanish surname based on 1/8 paternal lineage. She is checking the Hispanic box on every university application. And, she would be a fool not to.

    At some point we will go back to being a merit based society, but that day is not today. It will take time and MAGA votes for multiple election cycles. Or, possibly a civil war. Take your pick.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://instapundit.substack.com/p/the-idiocy-of-americas-racial-classification

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Here is a similar view on the problems with categorization: (1)

    No, that is only a view on the problems with the existing official categorization scheme, not with categorization per se.

    The cure for bad categorization is good categorization, not no categorization.

    It’s pretty simple. So simple, in fact, that it makes perfect sense why Israel-firsters like you are aghast at the notion.

    • LOL: A123
  195. @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh

    I think you should stick to your cryptic three-word posts and let people merely think you're a retard rather trying to carry on an actual discussion and inadvertently proffering undeniable proof.

    Replies: @sudden death, @Sher Singh

    How dare you slander etalon example of non-mixed pure Aryan himself here?

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @sudden death

    https://hbdchick.wordpress.com/2011/04/04/whatever-happened-to-european-tribes/

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/777363024196796426/852791619115417620/unknown.png

    I get it - after destroying tribe & ethnicity among Euros, Christendom moves to race.
    More proof white/christian genocide is needed to save the world from Sailer's graph

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

  196. Sher Singh says:
    @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh

    I think you should stick to your cryptic three-word posts and let people merely think you're a retard rather trying to carry on an actual discussion and inadvertently proffering undeniable proof.

    Replies: @sudden death, @Sher Singh

    Rather than* you brown-skinned ESL student
    You’re only scared of blacks because you don’t carry weapons

    ਯਾਂਤੇ ਸਰਬ ਖਾਲਸਾ ਸੁਨੀਅਹਿ । ਆਯੁਧ ਧਰਿਬੇ ਉਤੱਮ ਗੁਨੀਅਹਿ ।
    The Guru then said to his Sikhs, “All of the Khalsa listen, carrying weapons is the highest action.

    ਜਬਿ ਹਮਰੇ ਦਰਸ਼ਨ ਕੋ ਆਵਹੁ । ਬਨਿ ਸੁਚੇਤ ਤਨ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਸਜਾਵਹੁ ।।੭।।
    When you come to have my Darshan, adorn your body with weapons.

    ਕਮਰ ਕਸਾ ਕਰਿ ਦੇਹੁ ਦਿਖਾਈ । ਹਮਰੀ ਖੁਸ਼ੀ ਹੋਇ ਅਧਿਕਾਈ ।
    When showing yourself to me have your Kamar Kasa [waist band which holds weapons] tied, in such a way I shall be extremely happy.

    ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਕੇਸ ਬਿਨ ਪਾਉ ਲਖਹੁ ਨਰ । ਕੇਸ ਧਰੇ ਤਬਿ ਆਧੋ ਲਖਿ ਉਰ ।।੮।।
    Those men who do not have Kesh [unshorn hair] or Shastars [weapons], do not recognize those men as full men. Those who have Kesh [unshorn hair], recognize those as half-men.

    ਕੇਸ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਜਬਿ ਦੋਨਹੁਂ ਧਾਰੇ । ਤਬਿ ਨਰੁ ਰੂਪ ਹੋਤਿ ਹੈ ਸਾਰੇ ।
    Those who have adorned themselves with Kesh [unshorn hair] and Shastar [weapons], those men have attained their full form.”

    Trans-gender looking to push trans-racial individuals.
    How typical, but let’s hear from those who’ve seen blacks outside television.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh


    You’re only scared of blacks because you don’t carry weapons
     
    Well, we can't all be as tough as sikhs, who strike laughter, I mean terror, in all who gaze upon them.

    Just keep talking about lifting and posting sword vids bro, we're all extremely impressed, I promise you.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  197. @sudden death
    @silviosilver

    How dare you slander etalon example of non-mixed pure Aryan himself here?

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    https://hbdchick.wordpress.com/2011/04/04/whatever-happened-to-european-tribes/

    I get it – after destroying tribe & ethnicity among Euros, Christendom moves to race.
    More proof white/christian genocide is needed to save the world from Sailer’s graph

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

  198. @LatW
    @QCIC


    I know it, lots of other people know it, the Russians know it and eventually a lot of sad Ukrainians will understand it as well.
     
    There is nothing to "understand", everything is very clear. A country invaded another country, illegally, and is murdering the civilians there. It is an obvious fact, no matter how you spin it and no matter how much manipulative language you use. The whole world can see it except for you.

    If you were aware of what is happening, you wouldn't be talking all this nonsense, as you have about Ukrainians "being propagandized".

    Replies: @QCIC, @Greasy William

    You don’t think that Kiev knew that Russia would get involved when Ukraine started shelling Donetsk with heavy artillery? Such a naive belief would be retarded, of course they knew it. Again, that was the point to draw them in.

    The propaganda I mentioned includes the notion that Russia would be too weak to do anything about Maidan and what followed. The Ukrainian military surely knew that Russia could defeat them, so they must have believed the Western con that economic or other pressure would keep Russia at bay. It seems that these ideas were mistaken.

    I think you are incorrigible, with your hundreds of years of angry history. I hope people stop listening to the murderous cries of people with the same delusions.

    The following is a response to #194:

    My view is that in this case Nationalism is the meme which enthralled the Ukrainians so they voluntarily became pawns in this. There is a lot more to it, but I think this is an important aspect.

    BTW, I am not against Nationalism. I am against gullible blood thirsty stupidity.

  199. @Greasy William
    @QCIC


    STOP CHEERLEADING FOR NATIONALISM.
     
    This war is being fought to advance GloboHomo, not nationalism. The Ukrainians doing the actual dying are just cannon fodder for the Western regimes

    Replies: @LatW, @LatW

    This war is being fought to advance GloboHomo, not nationalism.

    And let me be clear. The Ukrainian nationalists, whose deaths this audience is cheering, were literally the last white men who could’ve fought this GloboHomo. It is more than obvious that they are the last.

    • Disagree: Sher Singh
  200. @LatW
    @QCIC


    I know it, lots of other people know it, the Russians know it and eventually a lot of sad Ukrainians will understand it as well.
     
    There is nothing to "understand", everything is very clear. A country invaded another country, illegally, and is murdering the civilians there. It is an obvious fact, no matter how you spin it and no matter how much manipulative language you use. The whole world can see it except for you.

    If you were aware of what is happening, you wouldn't be talking all this nonsense, as you have about Ukrainians "being propagandized".

    Replies: @QCIC, @Greasy William

    There is nothing to “understand”, everything is very clear. A country invaded another country, illegally

    True. The Russian invasion is criminal. I have never denied this.

    [Russia] is murdering the civilians [in Ukraine]

    I have seen no evidence of this. Collateral damage != murder.

    This war has been going on for hundreds of years, way before there was even GloboHomo and way before America was even a global power.

    Which doesn’t change the fact that the Ukrainians are being used as pawns for GloboHomo imperialism now. I don’t blame the Ukrainians for taking any help they can get, I’d do the same thing in their position, but facts are facts.

    Unlike most other far right nihilists, I strongly believe that it is important that Ukraine remains a free and independent state. But I don’t think it’s important how far east the Ukrainian-Russian border ends up. In fact, I would prefer that said border is as far west as possible, as that will ensure the largest amount of Ukraine’s Russophile population will be part of the RF and GloboHomo will have eaten at least a partial defeat.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Greasy William


    Ukraine’s Russophile population will be part of the RF and GloboHomo will have eaten at least a partial defeat.
     
    There is no longer such as thing as "Ukraine's Russophile population". The population is being systematically destroyed. That some American anti-GloboHomo type feels a certain way is absolutely irrelevant and no excuse to murder people en masse. If you don't see that this is not about some mystical values but about purely about robbing places, then you are blind. They do not need the population. They need the territory with the resources, with the fruits of other people's labor (they didn't bother building a competitive economy), without the people, to extract all that's remaining and to be able to posture militarily. The Russian men are sheeple who are hedonistic to the core and will never be able to stand up to any tyranny, no matter whence it appears. Let them remain slaves as they deserve.

    There is a lot of work at home in the West, yet the so called Western nationalist choose to do exactly zero about it. Ukraine has nothing to do with your plight and shouldn't be paying for it.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    , @LatW
    @Greasy William


    I have seen no evidence of this. Collateral damage != murder.
     
    No, it is not "collateral damage" (not that there should be). The rocket used was Kh-22 (or X-22), an old rocket from the 1960s-70s, which is meant to be used against maritime targets and typically not meant to be used for ground targets (although they had used it before in Ukraine). It was originally made to be used against American ships. This is beyond primitive and evil.

    Replies: @QCIC

  201. @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    Rather than* you brown-skinned ESL student
    You're only scared of blacks because you don't carry weapons


    ਯਾਂਤੇ ਸਰਬ ਖਾਲਸਾ ਸੁਨੀਅਹਿ । ਆਯੁਧ ਧਰਿਬੇ ਉਤੱਮ ਗੁਨੀਅਹਿ ।
    The Guru then said to his Sikhs, "All of the Khalsa listen, carrying weapons is the highest action.

    ਜਬਿ ਹਮਰੇ ਦਰਸ਼ਨ ਕੋ ਆਵਹੁ । ਬਨਿ ਸੁਚੇਤ ਤਨ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਸਜਾਵਹੁ ।।੭।।
    When you come to have my Darshan, adorn your body with weapons.

    ਕਮਰ ਕਸਾ ਕਰਿ ਦੇਹੁ ਦਿਖਾਈ । ਹਮਰੀ ਖੁਸ਼ੀ ਹੋਇ ਅਧਿਕਾਈ ।
    When showing yourself to me have your Kamar Kasa [waist band which holds weapons] tied, in such a way I shall be extremely happy.

    ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਕੇਸ ਬਿਨ ਪਾਉ ਲਖਹੁ ਨਰ । ਕੇਸ ਧਰੇ ਤਬਿ ਆਧੋ ਲਖਿ ਉਰ ।।੮।।
    Those men who do not have Kesh [unshorn hair] or Shastars [weapons], do not recognize those men as full men. Those who have Kesh [unshorn hair], recognize those as half-men.

    ਕੇਸ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਜਬਿ ਦੋਨਹੁਂ ਧਾਰੇ । ਤਬਿ ਨਰੁ ਰੂਪ ਹੋਤਿ ਹੈ ਸਾਰੇ ।
    Those who have adorned themselves with Kesh [unshorn hair] and Shastar [weapons], those men have attained their full form."
     
    Trans-gender looking to push trans-racial individuals.
    How typical, but let's hear from those who've seen blacks outside television.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    You’re only scared of blacks because you don’t carry weapons

    Well, we can’t all be as tough as sikhs, who strike laughter, I mean terror, in all who gaze upon them.

    Just keep talking about lifting and posting sword vids bro, we’re all extremely impressed, I promise you.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    Serbia's lost every war it's ever fought - I'm not trying to impress anyone.
    Genuinely trying to make the world & myself better.

    You gave up, and so became a liberal/christcuck
    Keep trying to get in with the Good whites, I hope you'll succeed

    One day.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  202. You don’t think that Kiev knew that Russia would get involved when Ukraine started shelling Donetsk with heavy artillery? Such a naive belief would be retarded, of course they knew it. Again, that was the point to draw them in.

    You’re the one whose retarded, antifa. Ukrainian and other nationalists have known FOR YEARS, no, FOR DECADES, that Russia would attack. The only reason the bulk of the Ukrainian population was still shocked and felt stabbed in the back, was because they still used to have neighborly ties past 2014. It’s exactly like the grieving mother says in the video – they sat by the same table, we greeted them as guests. And then they came back to murder us.

    My view is that in this case Nationalism

    A retarded American commie is in no position to lecture Europeans about nationalism. Nationalism is essential and will remain as long as foreigners invade. Ukraine is not murdering on Russian soil, it is Russia who has transgressed into Ukrainian soil and is murdering Ukrainian citizens.

    You can pose various arguments, but why lie so openly? Why overlook facts on the ground so blatantly?

    How come you are blind to the Russian fascism? How come you ignore the video I posed of the Russian propagandist who is calling on wiping more Ukrainian cities off the map? Why are you so conveniently blind to this? Why, is it the usual tale of “all nationalist are equal, but some are more equal”?

    I think you are incorrigible

    Entitled much? Who are you to correct us? You do realize there are tens of millions if not more behind what I say? Are you corrigible? I’m sure you are.

    BTW, I am not against Nationalism. I am against gullible blood thirsty stupidity.

    Do not lie. You are selective. You are ok with Russian fascism. But you are not ok with those who defend themselves from such evil. Be honest and do not lie. It’s not a lot to ask.

  203. Actually don’t think the new Embrace statue on Boston Common is 100% bad.

    If the moratorium on above-ground nuclear tests were ever lifted, it would be a great piece to donate to some country doing them, along with 3-5 high speed cameras to record it from various angles, as the blastwave strikes it.

    • LOL: Thulean Friend
  204. @Greasy William
    @LatW


    There is nothing to “understand”, everything is very clear. A country invaded another country, illegally
     
    True. The Russian invasion is criminal. I have never denied this.

    [Russia] is murdering the civilians [in Ukraine]
     
    I have seen no evidence of this. Collateral damage != murder.

    This war has been going on for hundreds of years, way before there was even GloboHomo and way before America was even a global power.
     
    Which doesn't change the fact that the Ukrainians are being used as pawns for GloboHomo imperialism now. I don't blame the Ukrainians for taking any help they can get, I'd do the same thing in their position, but facts are facts.

    Unlike most other far right nihilists, I strongly believe that it is important that Ukraine remains a free and independent state. But I don't think it's important how far east the Ukrainian-Russian border ends up. In fact, I would prefer that said border is as far west as possible, as that will ensure the largest amount of Ukraine's Russophile population will be part of the RF and GloboHomo will have eaten at least a partial defeat.

    Replies: @LatW, @LatW

    Ukraine’s Russophile population will be part of the RF and GloboHomo will have eaten at least a partial defeat.

    There is no longer such as thing as “Ukraine’s Russophile population”. The population is being systematically destroyed. That some American anti-GloboHomo type feels a certain way is absolutely irrelevant and no excuse to murder people en masse. If you don’t see that this is not about some mystical values but about purely about robbing places, then you are blind. They do not need the population. They need the territory with the resources, with the fruits of other people’s labor (they didn’t bother building a competitive economy), without the people, to extract all that’s remaining and to be able to posture militarily. The Russian men are sheeple who are hedonistic to the core and will never be able to stand up to any tyranny, no matter whence it appears. Let them remain slaves as they deserve.

    There is a lot of work at home in the West, yet the so called Western nationalist choose to do exactly zero about it. Ukraine has nothing to do with your plight and shouldn’t be paying for it.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @LatW

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzVEduKGUws&t=235s


    I don't think that the Russians are going to be pushed out of prepared defenses. The Merkava is probably a better tank than anything the US and British have. Hezbullah decimated them recently. Mines Drones Cornets...

  205. @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa

    If you go back to my original point, you'll see that I was recommending whites (actually, all non-blacks) drop the one-drop rule, because that rule only advantages blacks. It used to 'advantage' whites - it helped keep the white community white (aka allowed it to continue to exist) - but since all political and all (overt) social barriers to intermixture have completely collapsed, there is no further use for it.

    What would dropping the one-drop rule (by non-blacks) actually entail? That's a good question. Obviously, in an age in which merely contradicting something a black has said - no matter how nutty - is fraught with suspicions of proto-racism (or "whitesplaining"), you can't just charge in and set them straight, "no pal, you're not actually black." It would have to be more subtle than that. There is an overt course of action available, though, which is to support any and all "mixed" or "mulatto" identity movements. Among non-blacks, talk about such movements should emphasize how "unfair" it is to lump mixed/mulatto people in with the black population, and that they obviously have a "right" to separate themselves from it.

    What grounds are there to believe such an effort may bear fruit? If we look at parts of the world where the mulatto escape hatch has existed the longest - essentially, Latin America - we observe an undoubted keenness to adopt non-black identities. Indeed, the region is known for its plethora of racial designations, the unifying them of which is creating distance from blackness. The Dominican Republic has achieved notoriety for erecting barriers against Haitian infiltrators, in effect saying "we're black enough already thanks, we don't intend to grow any blacker." In America, black(ish) hispanics resort to speaking Spanish as a way of signaling their separateness from blackness.

    The same is true in South Africa, where Colored (as distinct from Black) remains a strongly defended identity, despite power shifting to blacks. (Coloreds strongly supported the (white) National Party in the 1994 'free' election.)

    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks; which increasingly means pureblooded blacks straight from Africa, who immediately upon arrival claim a right to speak on behalf of all black Americans, which descendants-of-slaves blacks tend to deeply resent.

    All in all, the prospect of splitting their ranks must be regarded as at least plausible. As for the need to split them, I have every confidence it will grow ever more apparent with each passing year; and by the end of the century, people will have a hard time believing anybody could have ever thought otherwise.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @songbird

    I get what you are saying, and the left is attempting to do the opposite with the POC umbrella designation. Leaving aside whether or not it’s a good idea, given how the incentives actually work for this kind of re-categorization I just don’t see the point in throwing it out there as an actionable possibility.

    The shift toward preferential identification with blackness is due to a massive shift in the distribution of rewards. It is in the concrete material interests of many to identify as blacks because of perks. These perks can only be distributed if you control the engines of societal institutional power. Basically, if you had the power to distribute these perks to convince people to adopt an intermediate racial category you wouldn’t have to propose such a thing.

    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks

    I don’t think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren’t hanging in the hood. Obama is jet setting with the Martha’s Vinyard set while Markle married into the House of Windsor. About the most ghetto they will be likely to see is meeting Snoop Dogg on the golf course.

    • Agree: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Barbarossa


    I don’t think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren’t hanging in the hood. Obama is jet setting with the Martha’s Vinyard set while Markle married into the House of Windsor. About the most ghetto they will be likely to see is meeting Snoop Dogg on the golf course.
     
    Exactly, white folks get to claim to hang with blacks - that are as light as they are.
    POC has already been split into BIPOC & there's now a focus on anti-black, anti-semite & anti-other

    https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/a-raw-nerve-alberta-professor-to-assess-level-of-white-supremacy-in-military/


    Andy Knight, a professor of international relations and the school's first provost fellow in Black excellence and leadership, made a proposal to the federal department last fall in which he drew attention to racism in the military.

    Over the next year, he is to assess just how entrenched radicalization, anti-Semitism, xenophobia and anti-Black sentiments are in the Forces and come up with a suggested policy to respond.
     

    There's already no point for someone like me to pursue anything but cultural nationalism.
    The whole anti-white train doesn't give anything beyond getting white libs/cons to leave u alone.

    Both the right & the left are progressive in North America.
    One for tech & the other society you could say.

    --
    Libs have decided there will be 3 races in the future: White, Black & Jewish
    The only way to get out of that is pursue something outside liberalism.
    Which you can define as challenging the basic familial-societal structures & violence monopoly
    ie honor killing

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/1144009116614086658

    https://akarlin.com/struggle-europe-mankind/

    The priestly classes of Liberal-Christendom ie
    Serbs & German Catholics have the most to lose from a systemic shift

    They'll fight to maintain the status quo down to the last nigger.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    , @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa

    The processes I mentioned are taking place independently of what you or I think of them. To be clear, I'm not expecting anything to change any time soon, not even in our lifetimes. These are multi-generational developments I'm talking about. My view, though, is that if certain of these developments can be hastened, then they ought to be - starting from now (why wait?). Over such a time span, the incentive structure you refer to, which seems set in stone today, could change in all sorts of unpredictable (or perhaps predictable) ways. Of course, you are free to disagree with both my analysis and my counsel - I'm not twisting your arm.


    I don’t think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren’t hanging in the hood.
     
    Come on. I wasn't referring specifically to Markle herself, rather to someone with her racial traits. The CDC database used to allow searches by parental race and educational attainment. If access hadn't been disabled, I could have shown you that white women who procreate with blacks mostly stem from the least educated segment of the white population - precisely those whites who tend to live in closest proximity to blacks. (Stereotypes prove true yet again.) It's thus perfectly reasonable to think that slamming the mulatto escape hatch shut on those children's fingers would leave them stuck not only with a black identity but with the unwanted embrace of real live blacks. The same would hold true for the products of hispanic and black matings, who have the black aspects of their physiognomies sufficiently shifted away from the black parent population's that they too would qualify for a separate racial identity.

    Replies: @Jatt Aryaa

    , @A123
    @Barbarossa



    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks
     
    I don’t think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren’t hanging in the hood. Obama is jet setting with the Martha’s Vinyard set while Markle married into the House of Windsor. About the most ghetto they will be likely to see is meeting Snoop Dogg on the golf course.
     
    I concur.

    Claiming PoC status (or other SJW marker such as LGBT) is a virtue mark. INE becomes:

    • Brave in the eyes of the media.
    • Obtain privileges in schools from university down to elementary.
    • Have unearned status in the public sphere

    It has gotten so extreme, merit is now actually a negative. Europe offers an excellent example. (1)


    In the West, many of the White males who sign up for the agenda of multiculturalism, progressivism, and open borders are finding that they are too White and too male to be of use to the socio-political system any longer.

    The latest case in Germany highlights this trend, where the Green party dismissed its own justice minister, Dirk Adams, in the German state of Thuringia. He was not found guilty of any wrongdoing, but instead was simply a male of the wrong skin color, which, by the Green party’s own admission, was the entire basis for his dismissal.

    Adams will now be replaced by Afro-German Doreen Denstädt. Thuringia’s Minister-President Bodo Ramelow, of the Left Party, fired Adams, who was the Minister for Migration, Justice and Consumer Protection. The dismissal came about after the Green party directly requested him to be replaced by Denstädt, who has no law degree or political experience.
     

    Being straight, white, & male is now effectively penalized. There is a special benefit for everyone else.

    The good news is the handwriting is on my the wall for SJW dogma to implode. For example, real women are standing up against fake women in sports. The only way for more Leftoid privilege and status to become available is to take it away from another SJW category.

    The piranhas are hungry. And, the only meat in the tank are other piranhas.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://rmx.news/germany/german-green-party-replaces-its-own-white-male-justice-minister-with-black-female-who-has-no-law-degree-or-political-experience/

  206. @Greasy William
    @LatW


    There is nothing to “understand”, everything is very clear. A country invaded another country, illegally
     
    True. The Russian invasion is criminal. I have never denied this.

    [Russia] is murdering the civilians [in Ukraine]
     
    I have seen no evidence of this. Collateral damage != murder.

    This war has been going on for hundreds of years, way before there was even GloboHomo and way before America was even a global power.
     
    Which doesn't change the fact that the Ukrainians are being used as pawns for GloboHomo imperialism now. I don't blame the Ukrainians for taking any help they can get, I'd do the same thing in their position, but facts are facts.

    Unlike most other far right nihilists, I strongly believe that it is important that Ukraine remains a free and independent state. But I don't think it's important how far east the Ukrainian-Russian border ends up. In fact, I would prefer that said border is as far west as possible, as that will ensure the largest amount of Ukraine's Russophile population will be part of the RF and GloboHomo will have eaten at least a partial defeat.

    Replies: @LatW, @LatW

    I have seen no evidence of this. Collateral damage != murder.

    No, it is not “collateral damage” (not that there should be). The rocket used was Kh-22 (or X-22), an old rocket from the 1960s-70s, which is meant to be used against maritime targets and typically not meant to be used for ground targets (although they had used it before in Ukraine). It was originally made to be used against American ships. This is beyond primitive and evil.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @LatW

    Why don't you want this to stop? I mean now, no terms, just surrender and live to fight another day! Learn from the mistakes. Learn not to trust the silver-tongued devils who would turn your sons and brothers into pawns and cannon fodder.

    You don't know me and your reading comprehension may be blinded by your pain. I am not reveling in these deaths at all, not even the NeoNazis and certainly not the Nationalists. I just recognize the deaths as totally predictable once this was put in motion a decade ago. This was totally avoidable and the Nationalists made a bad decision. This was a set up by the West. I think you need to figure this out and point your fury in the correct direction.

    It will be beyond "beyond primitive and evil" if they start dropping large numbers of 500 pound bombs on cities. This sort of thing has been militarily justified by the West so it has been accepted by the monsters who 'adjudicate' wars. The legalese doesn't matter, once they start falling, think of a 100 broken lives for each bomb, maybe a 1000 if the dogs of war have their fill. One God forsaken plane can carry 84 bombs. Russia didn't invent this, remember the US, Britain, Russia, China all have had similar capability to butcher good people on an industrial scale.

    I will say it differently this time:

    I think this war should have been avoided because it was not in the interest of Ukrainian people. It is never too late to see the light, now is the time to lay down arms before the destruction gets serious. I am not kidding, things can get much worse. If you are not sure, look at Dresden, Grozny, Tokyo, Nagasaki.

    Replies: @LatW

  207. @Yevardian
    @QCIC

    Request to Mr Unz to trash and permaban any anti-vaxx comments on these open threads. Stick to the Kevin Barrett columns.

    Replies: @QCIC

    We are gradually proceeding towards the point where the MAINSTREAM data for “VAX” deaths exceeds the mainstream data for COVID deaths.

    If we reach that point, how will your worldview be impacted?

    Not at all?
    Will you mentally shut down due to cognitive dissonance?
    Investigate?
    Apologize?
    Vow to never be fooled again?
    Double-down in some strange way?

    A person does not need to be skeptical of vaccines to be upset and intrigued by all of the lying involved in the COVID mess.

  208. @LatW
    @Greasy William


    I have seen no evidence of this. Collateral damage != murder.
     
    No, it is not "collateral damage" (not that there should be). The rocket used was Kh-22 (or X-22), an old rocket from the 1960s-70s, which is meant to be used against maritime targets and typically not meant to be used for ground targets (although they had used it before in Ukraine). It was originally made to be used against American ships. This is beyond primitive and evil.

    Replies: @QCIC

    Why don’t you want this to stop? I mean now, no terms, just surrender and live to fight another day! Learn from the mistakes. Learn not to trust the silver-tongued devils who would turn your sons and brothers into pawns and cannon fodder.

    You don’t know me and your reading comprehension may be blinded by your pain. I am not reveling in these deaths at all, not even the NeoNazis and certainly not the Nationalists. I just recognize the deaths as totally predictable once this was put in motion a decade ago. This was totally avoidable and the Nationalists made a bad decision. This was a set up by the West. I think you need to figure this out and point your fury in the correct direction.

    It will be beyond “beyond primitive and evil” if they start dropping large numbers of 500 pound bombs on cities. This sort of thing has been militarily justified by the West so it has been accepted by the monsters who ‘adjudicate’ wars. The legalese doesn’t matter, once they start falling, think of a 100 broken lives for each bomb, maybe a 1000 if the dogs of war have their fill. One God forsaken plane can carry 84 bombs. Russia didn’t invent this, remember the US, Britain, Russia, China all have had similar capability to butcher good people on an industrial scale.

    I will say it differently this time:

    I think this war should have been avoided because it was not in the interest of Ukrainian people. It is never too late to see the light, now is the time to lay down arms before the destruction gets serious. I am not kidding, things can get much worse. If you are not sure, look at Dresden, Grozny, Tokyo, Nagasaki.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @QCIC


    Why don’t you want this to stop? I mean now, no terms, just surrender and live to fight another day!
     
    You seriously don't see this as an adult? Do you not get that there will be more violence in that case and that giving up land doesn't solve anything? That the crocodile is always hungry? That because a crocodile devours some prey and is sated for 20 minutes, doesn't mean that it won't get hungry again soon? Do you enjoy giving up your property? Or just other peoples' property? Oh wait.. that's how commies are. Ok, that explains it. Only one answer for you then.


    It will be beyond “beyond primitive and evil” if they start dropping large numbers of 500 pound bombs on cities. This sort of thing has been militarily justified by the West
     
    So you justify this misanthropy now? Nothing to see here? Thank you, drive through?

    Russia didn’t invent this
     
    Yea, they did. The reason they still exist is because of this MO. Obviously, they're incapable of existing otherwise. Just remember that when you speak so nonchalantly about Russian crimes, you become complicit in them. The world sees this, even non-White nationalities do. You don't for some mysterious reason. Oh, wait.. it's because you're an antifa.

    I think this war should have been avoided because it was not in the interest of Ukrainian people.
     
    Yes. The Ukrainian people and others should have never believed Clinton and Yeltsin. They should have never given up their tanks and missiles, the radar stations.


    I am not kidding, things can get much worse.
     
    Indeed they can. Once Ukraine finishes their 1000km drones, there will be payback. As there should be.

    Replies: @QCIC

  209. @QCIC
    @LatW

    Why don't you want this to stop? I mean now, no terms, just surrender and live to fight another day! Learn from the mistakes. Learn not to trust the silver-tongued devils who would turn your sons and brothers into pawns and cannon fodder.

    You don't know me and your reading comprehension may be blinded by your pain. I am not reveling in these deaths at all, not even the NeoNazis and certainly not the Nationalists. I just recognize the deaths as totally predictable once this was put in motion a decade ago. This was totally avoidable and the Nationalists made a bad decision. This was a set up by the West. I think you need to figure this out and point your fury in the correct direction.

    It will be beyond "beyond primitive and evil" if they start dropping large numbers of 500 pound bombs on cities. This sort of thing has been militarily justified by the West so it has been accepted by the monsters who 'adjudicate' wars. The legalese doesn't matter, once they start falling, think of a 100 broken lives for each bomb, maybe a 1000 if the dogs of war have their fill. One God forsaken plane can carry 84 bombs. Russia didn't invent this, remember the US, Britain, Russia, China all have had similar capability to butcher good people on an industrial scale.

    I will say it differently this time:

    I think this war should have been avoided because it was not in the interest of Ukrainian people. It is never too late to see the light, now is the time to lay down arms before the destruction gets serious. I am not kidding, things can get much worse. If you are not sure, look at Dresden, Grozny, Tokyo, Nagasaki.

    Replies: @LatW

    Why don’t you want this to stop? I mean now, no terms, just surrender and live to fight another day!

    You seriously don’t see this as an adult? Do you not get that there will be more violence in that case and that giving up land doesn’t solve anything? That the crocodile is always hungry? That because a crocodile devours some prey and is sated for 20 minutes, doesn’t mean that it won’t get hungry again soon? Do you enjoy giving up your property? Or just other peoples’ property? Oh wait.. that’s how commies are. Ok, that explains it. Only one answer for you then.

    It will be beyond “beyond primitive and evil” if they start dropping large numbers of 500 pound bombs on cities. This sort of thing has been militarily justified by the West

    So you justify this misanthropy now? Nothing to see here? Thank you, drive through?

    Russia didn’t invent this

    Yea, they did. The reason they still exist is because of this MO. Obviously, they’re incapable of existing otherwise. Just remember that when you speak so nonchalantly about Russian crimes, you become complicit in them. The world sees this, even non-White nationalities do. You don’t for some mysterious reason. Oh, wait.. it’s because you’re an antifa.

    I think this war should have been avoided because it was not in the interest of Ukrainian people.

    Yes. The Ukrainian people and others should have never believed Clinton and Yeltsin. They should have never given up their tanks and missiles, the radar stations.

    I am not kidding, things can get much worse.

    Indeed they can. Once Ukraine finishes their 1000km drones, there will be payback. As there should be.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @LatW

    I do believe some things are worth fighting and dying over, even potentially hopeless causes. I don't think this is one of them, but I'm not a Ukrainian Nationalist. Clearly you carry anti-Russian and anti-Soviet thoughts close to your heart, perhaps there is a good reason.

    I am a child of the Cold War so figuring out how not to annihilate everyone is important to me. After the fall of the USSR I learned the depth of the lies in the West was almost as deep as those around Communism. I still love the West, I just hate the lying on all sides.

    I am not Antifa, Commie, or other things. I am pro-individual, pro-family, pro-reason, pro-civilization, pro-mankind.

    I hope it all works out.

    +++

    I do agree that the intense anti-Russia forces in the West may have created a self-fulfilling prophecy wherein trying to crush a sleeping and somewhat peaceful Russia will create an aggressive and hostile Russia. I hope this doesn't happen, but it seems likely at this point. Great job, morons.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @LatW

  210. @LatW
    @QCIC


    Why don’t you want this to stop? I mean now, no terms, just surrender and live to fight another day!
     
    You seriously don't see this as an adult? Do you not get that there will be more violence in that case and that giving up land doesn't solve anything? That the crocodile is always hungry? That because a crocodile devours some prey and is sated for 20 minutes, doesn't mean that it won't get hungry again soon? Do you enjoy giving up your property? Or just other peoples' property? Oh wait.. that's how commies are. Ok, that explains it. Only one answer for you then.


    It will be beyond “beyond primitive and evil” if they start dropping large numbers of 500 pound bombs on cities. This sort of thing has been militarily justified by the West
     
    So you justify this misanthropy now? Nothing to see here? Thank you, drive through?

    Russia didn’t invent this
     
    Yea, they did. The reason they still exist is because of this MO. Obviously, they're incapable of existing otherwise. Just remember that when you speak so nonchalantly about Russian crimes, you become complicit in them. The world sees this, even non-White nationalities do. You don't for some mysterious reason. Oh, wait.. it's because you're an antifa.

    I think this war should have been avoided because it was not in the interest of Ukrainian people.
     
    Yes. The Ukrainian people and others should have never believed Clinton and Yeltsin. They should have never given up their tanks and missiles, the radar stations.


    I am not kidding, things can get much worse.
     
    Indeed they can. Once Ukraine finishes their 1000km drones, there will be payback. As there should be.

    Replies: @QCIC

    I do believe some things are worth fighting and dying over, even potentially hopeless causes. I don’t think this is one of them, but I’m not a Ukrainian Nationalist. Clearly you carry anti-Russian and anti-Soviet thoughts close to your heart, perhaps there is a good reason.

    I am a child of the Cold War so figuring out how not to annihilate everyone is important to me. After the fall of the USSR I learned the depth of the lies in the West was almost as deep as those around Communism. I still love the West, I just hate the lying on all sides.

    I am not Antifa, Commie, or other things. I am pro-individual, pro-family, pro-reason, pro-civilization, pro-mankind.

    I hope it all works out.

    +++

    I do agree that the intense anti-Russia forces in the West may have created a self-fulfilling prophecy wherein trying to crush a sleeping and somewhat peaceful Russia will create an aggressive and hostile Russia. I hope this doesn’t happen, but it seems likely at this point. Great job, morons.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @QCIC

    Remember that these cunts like LatW were running the USSR while it looked like the strong horse. Or they were supporting the Wehrmacht when it rolled into town.

    Replies: @LatW

    , @LatW
    @QCIC

    I'm not interested in your made up fluff and fantasies. The only thing that is asked of you is to not lie and to not make things up. It's not a lot to ask.

    Leave my town.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wh7WYiC1DfI

    Replies: @QCIC

  211. @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh


    You’re only scared of blacks because you don’t carry weapons
     
    Well, we can't all be as tough as sikhs, who strike laughter, I mean terror, in all who gaze upon them.

    Just keep talking about lifting and posting sword vids bro, we're all extremely impressed, I promise you.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    Serbia’s lost every war it’s ever fought – I’m not trying to impress anyone.
    Genuinely trying to make the world & myself better.

    You gave up, and so became a liberal/christcuck
    Keep trying to get in with the Good whites, I hope you’ll succeed

    One day.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh

    You care about a "better world"? Lol, that's rich.

    I'll bow to your superior knowledge of Serbia's military record, although I will point out that, for all her woes, an independent Serbia still exists. Sikhistan, for all its unrivaled fearsomeness, not so much.


    Keep trying to get in with the Good whites, I hope you’ll succeed
     
    Technically, wouldn't I already be "in" with goodwhites, given that one of their distinguishing characteristics is they can't say no to anybody? Fwiw, though, I'm also apparently "in" with badwhites, based on (novel and heady lol) personal experiences with these people. Of course, they are probably as FOS as I am when I act friendly with blacks even though I couldn't give the slightest fuck about them. Most likely such badwhites are just desperate for support from anyone, so as long as you seem to share certain values with them, they seem willing to overlook the fact that, deep down, they don't really consider you one of them.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  212. @LatW
    @Greasy William


    Ukraine’s Russophile population will be part of the RF and GloboHomo will have eaten at least a partial defeat.
     
    There is no longer such as thing as "Ukraine's Russophile population". The population is being systematically destroyed. That some American anti-GloboHomo type feels a certain way is absolutely irrelevant and no excuse to murder people en masse. If you don't see that this is not about some mystical values but about purely about robbing places, then you are blind. They do not need the population. They need the territory with the resources, with the fruits of other people's labor (they didn't bother building a competitive economy), without the people, to extract all that's remaining and to be able to posture militarily. The Russian men are sheeple who are hedonistic to the core and will never be able to stand up to any tyranny, no matter whence it appears. Let them remain slaves as they deserve.

    There is a lot of work at home in the West, yet the so called Western nationalist choose to do exactly zero about it. Ukraine has nothing to do with your plight and shouldn't be paying for it.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    I don’t think that the Russians are going to be pushed out of prepared defenses. The Merkava is probably a better tank than anything the US and British have. Hezbullah decimated them recently. Mines Drones Cornets…

  213. Sher Singh says:
    @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    I get what you are saying, and the left is attempting to do the opposite with the POC umbrella designation. Leaving aside whether or not it's a good idea, given how the incentives actually work for this kind of re-categorization I just don't see the point in throwing it out there as an actionable possibility.

    The shift toward preferential identification with blackness is due to a massive shift in the distribution of rewards. It is in the concrete material interests of many to identify as blacks because of perks. These perks can only be distributed if you control the engines of societal institutional power. Basically, if you had the power to distribute these perks to convince people to adopt an intermediate racial category you wouldn't have to propose such a thing.


    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks
     
    I don't think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren't hanging in the hood. Obama is jet setting with the Martha's Vinyard set while Markle married into the House of Windsor. About the most ghetto they will be likely to see is meeting Snoop Dogg on the golf course.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @silviosilver, @A123

    I don’t think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren’t hanging in the hood. Obama is jet setting with the Martha’s Vinyard set while Markle married into the House of Windsor. About the most ghetto they will be likely to see is meeting Snoop Dogg on the golf course.

    Exactly, white folks get to claim to hang with blacks – that are as light as they are.
    POC has already been split into BIPOC & there’s now a focus on anti-black, anti-semite & anti-other

    https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/a-raw-nerve-alberta-professor-to-assess-level-of-white-supremacy-in-military/

    Andy Knight, a professor of international relations and the school’s first provost fellow in Black excellence and leadership, made a proposal to the federal department last fall in which he drew attention to racism in the military.

    Over the next year, he is to assess just how entrenched radicalization, anti-Semitism, xenophobia and anti-Black sentiments are in the Forces and come up with a suggested policy to respond.

    There’s already no point for someone like me to pursue anything but cultural nationalism.
    The whole anti-white train doesn’t give anything beyond getting white libs/cons to leave u alone.

    Both the right & the left are progressive in North America.
    One for tech & the other society you could say.


    Libs have decided there will be 3 races in the future: White, Black & Jewish
    The only way to get out of that is pursue something outside liberalism.
    Which you can define as challenging the basic familial-societal structures & violence monopoly
    ie honor killing

    https://akarlin.com/struggle-europe-mankind/

    The priestly classes of Liberal-Christendom ie
    Serbs & German Catholics have the most to lose from a systemic shift

    They’ll fight to maintain the status quo down to the last nigger.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    IOW mulattos & white libs benefit from the current black-centric status quo.
    Why would they change it? They're the leadership class of their respective groups.

    Challenge them for leadership before you think of changing categories.
    When you do - you end up with something closer to Sikhi or Knights Templar, Ghazis
    Don't expect to live a normal life if you don't believe in the state religion

  214. @QCIC
    @LatW

    I do believe some things are worth fighting and dying over, even potentially hopeless causes. I don't think this is one of them, but I'm not a Ukrainian Nationalist. Clearly you carry anti-Russian and anti-Soviet thoughts close to your heart, perhaps there is a good reason.

    I am a child of the Cold War so figuring out how not to annihilate everyone is important to me. After the fall of the USSR I learned the depth of the lies in the West was almost as deep as those around Communism. I still love the West, I just hate the lying on all sides.

    I am not Antifa, Commie, or other things. I am pro-individual, pro-family, pro-reason, pro-civilization, pro-mankind.

    I hope it all works out.

    +++

    I do agree that the intense anti-Russia forces in the West may have created a self-fulfilling prophecy wherein trying to crush a sleeping and somewhat peaceful Russia will create an aggressive and hostile Russia. I hope this doesn't happen, but it seems likely at this point. Great job, morons.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @LatW

    Remember that these cunts like LatW were running the USSR while it looked like the strong horse. Or they were supporting the Wehrmacht when it rolled into town.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Wokechoke

    You are nothing.

  215. Sher Singh says:
    @Sher Singh
    @Barbarossa


    I don’t think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren’t hanging in the hood. Obama is jet setting with the Martha’s Vinyard set while Markle married into the House of Windsor. About the most ghetto they will be likely to see is meeting Snoop Dogg on the golf course.
     
    Exactly, white folks get to claim to hang with blacks - that are as light as they are.
    POC has already been split into BIPOC & there's now a focus on anti-black, anti-semite & anti-other

    https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/a-raw-nerve-alberta-professor-to-assess-level-of-white-supremacy-in-military/


    Andy Knight, a professor of international relations and the school's first provost fellow in Black excellence and leadership, made a proposal to the federal department last fall in which he drew attention to racism in the military.

    Over the next year, he is to assess just how entrenched radicalization, anti-Semitism, xenophobia and anti-Black sentiments are in the Forces and come up with a suggested policy to respond.
     

    There's already no point for someone like me to pursue anything but cultural nationalism.
    The whole anti-white train doesn't give anything beyond getting white libs/cons to leave u alone.

    Both the right & the left are progressive in North America.
    One for tech & the other society you could say.

    --
    Libs have decided there will be 3 races in the future: White, Black & Jewish
    The only way to get out of that is pursue something outside liberalism.
    Which you can define as challenging the basic familial-societal structures & violence monopoly
    ie honor killing

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/1144009116614086658

    https://akarlin.com/struggle-europe-mankind/

    The priestly classes of Liberal-Christendom ie
    Serbs & German Catholics have the most to lose from a systemic shift

    They'll fight to maintain the status quo down to the last nigger.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    IOW mulattos & white libs benefit from the current black-centric status quo.
    Why would they change it? They’re the leadership class of their respective groups.

    Challenge them for leadership before you think of changing categories.
    When you do – you end up with something closer to Sikhi or Knights Templar, Ghazis
    Don’t expect to live a normal life if you don’t believe in the state religion

  216. Saw an old Siskel and Ebert clip where they were praising some movie set in medieval times for the fact that everyone was besmirched with dirt.

    It’s so bizarre and funny that I don’t even know what to make of it.

    Natural inclination is to dive into politics and to blame the fact that they were both woke. That they just wanted to see the past as inherently dirty.

    If I try to view it in a more generous light, maybe, they were saying that they wanted to be immersed in the film, and not feel like it was shot on a studio backlot, with the costumes rented by the hour. I’m not altogether unsympathetic to such a view, but, wow, talk about low expectations!

    Of all the things that could give a medieval film character and make it a spectacle. The thousand-and-one features of that era never depicted on film before, from the small to the large, and they said they wanted to see dirt! Unbelievable!

    • Replies: @S
    @songbird

    Was the movie they were reviewing Braveheart by chance? It did seem to feature quite a lot of dirt and mud. That was a running gag with some of the Monty Python skits about all the medieval filth, ie dumping their refuse right out the window on unexpecting passers by, and the main street being an open sewer.

    I've heard different things going either way about just how dirty life was in medieval Europe, though some have suggested the dirtiest factor has been exaggerated a bit.

    Replies: @sudden death, @songbird, @AP

  217. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    I get what you are saying, and the left is attempting to do the opposite with the POC umbrella designation. Leaving aside whether or not it's a good idea, given how the incentives actually work for this kind of re-categorization I just don't see the point in throwing it out there as an actionable possibility.

    The shift toward preferential identification with blackness is due to a massive shift in the distribution of rewards. It is in the concrete material interests of many to identify as blacks because of perks. These perks can only be distributed if you control the engines of societal institutional power. Basically, if you had the power to distribute these perks to convince people to adopt an intermediate racial category you wouldn't have to propose such a thing.


    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks
     
    I don't think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren't hanging in the hood. Obama is jet setting with the Martha's Vinyard set while Markle married into the House of Windsor. About the most ghetto they will be likely to see is meeting Snoop Dogg on the golf course.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @silviosilver, @A123

    The processes I mentioned are taking place independently of what you or I think of them. To be clear, I’m not expecting anything to change any time soon, not even in our lifetimes. These are multi-generational developments I’m talking about. My view, though, is that if certain of these developments can be hastened, then they ought to be – starting from now (why wait?). Over such a time span, the incentive structure you refer to, which seems set in stone today, could change in all sorts of unpredictable (or perhaps predictable) ways. Of course, you are free to disagree with both my analysis and my counsel – I’m not twisting your arm.

    I don’t think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren’t hanging in the hood.

    Come on. I wasn’t referring specifically to Markle herself, rather to someone with her racial traits. The CDC database used to allow searches by parental race and educational attainment. If access hadn’t been disabled, I could have shown you that white women who procreate with blacks mostly stem from the least educated segment of the white population – precisely those whites who tend to live in closest proximity to blacks. (Stereotypes prove true yet again.) It’s thus perfectly reasonable to think that slamming the mulatto escape hatch shut on those children’s fingers would leave them stuck not only with a black identity but with the unwanted embrace of real live blacks. The same would hold true for the products of hispanic and black matings, who have the black aspects of their physiognomies sufficiently shifted away from the black parent population’s that they too would qualify for a separate racial identity.

    • LOL: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @Jatt Aryaa
    @silviosilver

    “White women are having kids with black dudes”
    “We should raise them instead of leaving them with black relatives”

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/640459736919048202/1064455030566043648/il_fullxfull.png

    – Silviosilver based Serbo-Australian - 2023 ce

    Replies: @silviosilver

  218. @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa

    If you go back to my original point, you'll see that I was recommending whites (actually, all non-blacks) drop the one-drop rule, because that rule only advantages blacks. It used to 'advantage' whites - it helped keep the white community white (aka allowed it to continue to exist) - but since all political and all (overt) social barriers to intermixture have completely collapsed, there is no further use for it.

    What would dropping the one-drop rule (by non-blacks) actually entail? That's a good question. Obviously, in an age in which merely contradicting something a black has said - no matter how nutty - is fraught with suspicions of proto-racism (or "whitesplaining"), you can't just charge in and set them straight, "no pal, you're not actually black." It would have to be more subtle than that. There is an overt course of action available, though, which is to support any and all "mixed" or "mulatto" identity movements. Among non-blacks, talk about such movements should emphasize how "unfair" it is to lump mixed/mulatto people in with the black population, and that they obviously have a "right" to separate themselves from it.

    What grounds are there to believe such an effort may bear fruit? If we look at parts of the world where the mulatto escape hatch has existed the longest - essentially, Latin America - we observe an undoubted keenness to adopt non-black identities. Indeed, the region is known for its plethora of racial designations, the unifying them of which is creating distance from blackness. The Dominican Republic has achieved notoriety for erecting barriers against Haitian infiltrators, in effect saying "we're black enough already thanks, we don't intend to grow any blacker." In America, black(ish) hispanics resort to speaking Spanish as a way of signaling their separateness from blackness.

    The same is true in South Africa, where Colored (as distinct from Black) remains a strongly defended identity, despite power shifting to blacks. (Coloreds strongly supported the (white) National Party in the 1994 'free' election.)

    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks; which increasingly means pureblooded blacks straight from Africa, who immediately upon arrival claim a right to speak on behalf of all black Americans, which descendants-of-slaves blacks tend to deeply resent.

    All in all, the prospect of splitting their ranks must be regarded as at least plausible. As for the need to split them, I have every confidence it will grow ever more apparent with each passing year; and by the end of the century, people will have a hard time believing anybody could have ever thought otherwise.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @songbird

    The same is true in South Africa, where Colored (as distinct from Black) remains a strongly defended identity, despite power shifting to blacks. (Coloreds strongly supported the (white) National Party in the 1994 ‘free’ election.)

    Seems as though black identity in South Africa is still pretty tribal. Didn’t the Zulus support the whites? And then you have black mobs that are literally killing black immigrants.

    [MORE]

    I don’t know how transferable it is to a Western template.

    The Coloreds themselves have many different characteristics from mulattoes. One is that they are regionally located – mostly the Western Cape – and that is for historical reasons. Because the Bantu couldn’t live there because it was arid, until Euros showed up with deep borehole technology to dig wells.

    Their largest ancestry component tends to be from the Khoisan. A fantastically genetically distinct group from blacks. Though of course they also have major Bantu inputs. IIRC, the Boers used to consider the Khoisan red-skinned.

    I’ve heard some South Africans say they believe that Coloreds might be even more criminally inclined and violent than the Bantus. Not sure if it is true, but there is some reasoning behind it. The idea is that the Bantu had agriculture for thousands of years, so they are more domesticated, than the Khoisan, who were hunter-gatherers and very divergent ones from the rest of humanity, at that. (some put the branching point at 200,000 years)

    There is even some idea that fertility between the Khoisan and other groups was depressed. And needed lots of copulation, before it would result in successful births. It’s not altogether unbelievable when you consider their incredibly different physical traits.

  219. @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    Serbia's lost every war it's ever fought - I'm not trying to impress anyone.
    Genuinely trying to make the world & myself better.

    You gave up, and so became a liberal/christcuck
    Keep trying to get in with the Good whites, I hope you'll succeed

    One day.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    You care about a “better world”? Lol, that’s rich.

    I’ll bow to your superior knowledge of Serbia’s military record, although I will point out that, for all her woes, an independent Serbia still exists. Sikhistan, for all its unrivaled fearsomeness, not so much.

    Keep trying to get in with the Good whites, I hope you’ll succeed

    Technically, wouldn’t I already be “in” with goodwhites, given that one of their distinguishing characteristics is they can’t say no to anybody? Fwiw, though, I’m also apparently “in” with badwhites, based on (novel and heady lol) personal experiences with these people. Of course, they are probably as FOS as I am when I act friendly with blacks even though I couldn’t give the slightest fuck about them. Most likely such badwhites are just desperate for support from anyone, so as long as you seem to share certain values with them, they seem willing to overlook the fact that, deep down, they don’t really consider you one of them.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver


    You care about a “better world”? Lol, that’s rich.

    I’ll bow to your superior knowledge of Serbia’s military record, although I will point out that, for all her woes, an independent Serbia still exists. Sikhistan, for all its unrivaled fearsomeness, not so much
     
    Will you independently remove barricades in North Kosovo or be press ganged?


    EXEMPTION UNDER SECTION 8B CONTROL OF WEAPONS ACT 1990

    Security Officers may come into contact with a person carrying a Kirpan whilst on duty and it
    would be recommended to be familiar with the following legislation:

    The Govenor in Council, under section 8B of the Controls of Weapons Act 1990, exempts
    from the operation of section 5(1) and section (1A) of the Control of Weapons Act 1990, in
    relation to Kirpans (swords), a person who is of persons set out in (i) to the extent specified
    in (ii):

    i) A Sikh whose religious practices requires the carrying and possession of a Kirpan;

    ii) Bringing a Kirpan into Victoria, causing a Kirpan to be brought into or sent into
    Victoria; selling or purchasing a Kirpan; displaying or advertising a Kirpan for
    sale; possessing, using or carrying a Kirpan
     

    RESTRICTIONS IN THE SIKH FAITH REGARDING PHYSICAL CONTACT

    ° Sikh males normally handshake with other males, but in the case of Sikh females
    the preferred way is to greet a male with folded hands and vice versa;

    ° Touching a person of the opposite sex may be seen as offensive;

    ° Only family or religious members can touch a Sikh woman even when she is
    grieving over a death. Touching a Sikh woman by a male who is not close family
    member is not approved;

    ° If a Sikh is asked to remove his or her turban, it is preferred, if possible, that he or
    she be given a private room and mirror with which to remove, and later restore,
    the turban
     
    I will bury the hatchet - Serbian women are thick & gorgeous, thank you Serbian men!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VY4DUHyleM4

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ
  220. @QCIC
    @LatW

    I do believe some things are worth fighting and dying over, even potentially hopeless causes. I don't think this is one of them, but I'm not a Ukrainian Nationalist. Clearly you carry anti-Russian and anti-Soviet thoughts close to your heart, perhaps there is a good reason.

    I am a child of the Cold War so figuring out how not to annihilate everyone is important to me. After the fall of the USSR I learned the depth of the lies in the West was almost as deep as those around Communism. I still love the West, I just hate the lying on all sides.

    I am not Antifa, Commie, or other things. I am pro-individual, pro-family, pro-reason, pro-civilization, pro-mankind.

    I hope it all works out.

    +++

    I do agree that the intense anti-Russia forces in the West may have created a self-fulfilling prophecy wherein trying to crush a sleeping and somewhat peaceful Russia will create an aggressive and hostile Russia. I hope this doesn't happen, but it seems likely at this point. Great job, morons.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @LatW

    I’m not interested in your made up fluff and fantasies. The only thing that is asked of you is to not lie and to not make things up. It’s not a lot to ask.

    [MORE]

    Leave my town.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @LatW

    Great job, morons.

  221. Sher Singh says:
    @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh

    You care about a "better world"? Lol, that's rich.

    I'll bow to your superior knowledge of Serbia's military record, although I will point out that, for all her woes, an independent Serbia still exists. Sikhistan, for all its unrivaled fearsomeness, not so much.


    Keep trying to get in with the Good whites, I hope you’ll succeed
     
    Technically, wouldn't I already be "in" with goodwhites, given that one of their distinguishing characteristics is they can't say no to anybody? Fwiw, though, I'm also apparently "in" with badwhites, based on (novel and heady lol) personal experiences with these people. Of course, they are probably as FOS as I am when I act friendly with blacks even though I couldn't give the slightest fuck about them. Most likely such badwhites are just desperate for support from anyone, so as long as you seem to share certain values with them, they seem willing to overlook the fact that, deep down, they don't really consider you one of them.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    You care about a “better world”? Lol, that’s rich.

    I’ll bow to your superior knowledge of Serbia’s military record, although I will point out that, for all her woes, an independent Serbia still exists. Sikhistan, for all its unrivaled fearsomeness, not so much

    Will you independently remove barricades in North Kosovo or be press ganged?

    [MORE]

    EXEMPTION UNDER SECTION 8B CONTROL OF WEAPONS ACT 1990

    Security Officers may come into contact with a person carrying a Kirpan whilst on duty and it
    would be recommended to be familiar with the following legislation:

    The Govenor in Council, under section 8B of the Controls of Weapons Act 1990, exempts
    from the operation of section 5(1) and section (1A) of the Control of Weapons Act 1990, in
    relation to Kirpans (swords), a person who is of persons set out in (i) to the extent specified
    in (ii):

    i) A Sikh whose religious practices requires the carrying and possession of a Kirpan;

    ii) Bringing a Kirpan into Victoria, causing a Kirpan to be brought into or sent into
    Victoria; selling or purchasing a Kirpan; displaying or advertising a Kirpan for
    sale; possessing, using or carrying a Kirpan

    RESTRICTIONS IN THE SIKH FAITH REGARDING PHYSICAL CONTACT

    ° Sikh males normally handshake with other males, but in the case of Sikh females
    the preferred way is to greet a male with folded hands and vice versa;

    ° Touching a person of the opposite sex may be seen as offensive;

    ° Only family or religious members can touch a Sikh woman even when she is
    grieving over a death. Touching a Sikh woman by a male who is not close family
    member is not approved;

    ° If a Sikh is asked to remove his or her turban, it is preferred, if possible, that he or
    she be given a private room and mirror with which to remove, and later restore,
    the turban

    I will bury the hatchet – Serbian women are thick & gorgeous, thank you Serbian men!

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ

  222. @Wokechoke
    @QCIC

    Remember that these cunts like LatW were running the USSR while it looked like the strong horse. Or they were supporting the Wehrmacht when it rolled into town.

    Replies: @LatW

    You are nothing.

  223. Sher Singh says:

    @Armenian Found this interesting

    Because Zoroastrian spirituality is so inextricably linked to agriculture and animal stewardship, it is not difficult to understand how terms such as vástár and drigû in the sacred gathic verse, are associated with “rich pastures” and “tyrannized cultivators/growers of the land.”

    ​The term drigû is unique to ancient Indo Iranian, and it is the case that because some words are elsewhere unattested, the precise meanings of those very words are not exactly certain. Drigû is one such term.

    The Old Avestan term drigû conveys the idea of “toil, hard labor, drudgery,” and refers to “the downtrodden, the oppressed cultivators, tillers, farmers and growers of the land who are subjected to the tyranny of the despot lords

    .”

    Prophet Zarathustra imposed an “order of farming nobility” based on “love of animals, stewardship of the land, and fondness for all things that grow, and are fruitful.” This order of Zoroastrian “farming nobility” was opposed by “cattle-raiding warrior bands,” who designated their leaders as Adhrigu “lord,” (he who is NOT drigû).

    These “warrior bands” called themselves also “man-wolves,” and mixed blood of the sacrificed bulls with sacred mead/wine, in their orgiastic rites. Their cruelty toward innocent animals, and their bloody bovine sacrifices, were especially appalling to the ancient Aryan Seer/Prophet.

    It shall be added that in the Vedic Mythology, Marutas, a “band of young warriors,” were Indra‘s shock troops who called Indra their “chief, lord,” Adhrigu (he who is NOT drigû.)

    https://authenticgathazoroastrianism.org/2017/09/25/the-dominion-of-the-gods-rich-pastures-and-the-dispossessed-cultivators-of-the-land-in-the-gathas-of-zarathustra/

    Was listening to Zafarnama and heard Drigu I think to refer to Hindustan V Aurangzeb I think, will check.

    Consider Anatolia, Balkans & Greece to be Persia tbh

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    https://parikramah.blogspot.com/2013/03/fatehnamah-tale-of-two-wills.html

    https://imgur.com/a/iIhOBu5

    Really, Iran starts at Berlin (Hajnal Line) not exactly, but let's extend it West.

    Certainly the Caucasus


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHsRdAMtmlk

    , @Yevardian
    @Sher Singh

    Don't know if this post was directed at me or not, and perhaps probably only German_Reader would be interested (I missed replying to his booklist over the holidays), but I'm finishing reading a PHD thesis on Armenian Zoroastrianism at the moment.

    As an aside, its long been recognised that Zoroastrianism had a huge influence on the development of Biblical Judaism during the Achaemenid period, but it's often overlooked that the (more authoritative) Babylonian Talmud was compiled within the later Sasanid Empire, or the role Jews played in the last Persian-Roman War.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Sher Singh

  224. @Sher Singh
    @Armenian Found this interesting

    Because Zoroastrian spirituality is so inextricably linked to agriculture and animal stewardship, it is not difficult to understand how terms such as vástár and drigû in the sacred gathic verse, are associated with “rich pastures” and “tyrannized cultivators/growers of the land.”

    ​The term drigû is unique to ancient Indo Iranian, and it is the case that because some words are elsewhere unattested, the precise meanings of those very words are not exactly certain. Drigû is one such term.

    The Old Avestan term drigû conveys the idea of “toil, hard labor, drudgery,” and refers to “the downtrodden, the oppressed cultivators, tillers, farmers and growers of the land who are subjected to the tyranny of the despot lords
     

    .”

    Prophet Zarathustra imposed an “order of farming nobility” based on “love of animals, stewardship of the land, and fondness for all things that grow, and are fruitful.” This order of Zoroastrian “farming nobility” was opposed by “cattle-raiding warrior bands,” who designated their leaders as Adhrigu “lord,” (he who is NOT drigû).

    These “warrior bands” called themselves also “man-wolves,” and mixed blood of the sacrificed bulls with sacred mead/wine, in their orgiastic rites. Their cruelty toward innocent animals, and their bloody bovine sacrifices, were especially appalling to the ancient Aryan Seer/Prophet.

    It shall be added that in the Vedic Mythology, Marutas, a “band of young warriors,” were Indra‘s shock troops who called Indra their “chief, lord,” Adhrigu (he who is NOT drigû.)
     

    https://authenticgathazoroastrianism.org/2017/09/25/the-dominion-of-the-gods-rich-pastures-and-the-dispossessed-cultivators-of-the-land-in-the-gathas-of-zarathustra/

    https://twitter.com/Parikramah/status/1237604962701434881?s=20

    Was listening to Zafarnama and heard Drigu I think to refer to Hindustan V Aurangzeb I think, will check.

    Consider Anatolia, Balkans & Greece to be Persia tbh

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Yevardian

    https://parikramah.blogspot.com/2013/03/fatehnamah-tale-of-two-wills.html

    View post on imgur.com

    Really, Iran starts at Berlin (Hajnal Line) not exactly, but let’s extend it West.

    Certainly the Caucasus

    [MORE]

  225. @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa

    The processes I mentioned are taking place independently of what you or I think of them. To be clear, I'm not expecting anything to change any time soon, not even in our lifetimes. These are multi-generational developments I'm talking about. My view, though, is that if certain of these developments can be hastened, then they ought to be - starting from now (why wait?). Over such a time span, the incentive structure you refer to, which seems set in stone today, could change in all sorts of unpredictable (or perhaps predictable) ways. Of course, you are free to disagree with both my analysis and my counsel - I'm not twisting your arm.


    I don’t think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren’t hanging in the hood.
     
    Come on. I wasn't referring specifically to Markle herself, rather to someone with her racial traits. The CDC database used to allow searches by parental race and educational attainment. If access hadn't been disabled, I could have shown you that white women who procreate with blacks mostly stem from the least educated segment of the white population - precisely those whites who tend to live in closest proximity to blacks. (Stereotypes prove true yet again.) It's thus perfectly reasonable to think that slamming the mulatto escape hatch shut on those children's fingers would leave them stuck not only with a black identity but with the unwanted embrace of real live blacks. The same would hold true for the products of hispanic and black matings, who have the black aspects of their physiognomies sufficiently shifted away from the black parent population's that they too would qualify for a separate racial identity.

    Replies: @Jatt Aryaa

    “White women are having kids with black dudes”
    “We should raise them instead of leaving them with black relatives”

    – Silviosilver based Serbo-Australian – 2023 ce

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Jatt Aryaa

    Lol.

    How in the world does recognizing their mixed/mulatto identity compel me to accept them into my life? What a bizarre inference. I need no more accept them than I accept people from the existing black category.

    (I'm pretty sure there are remedial English classes for adults. Check it out some time. You don't have to live like this.)

    Oh, and one more thing, I don't get why people dump on step fatherhood so much. Yeah, you're helping raise someone else's kid, but so what? 99.9999999% of the friends and lovers you'll have in this life are somebody else's kids too.

  226. @Jatt Aryaa
    @silviosilver

    “White women are having kids with black dudes”
    “We should raise them instead of leaving them with black relatives”

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/640459736919048202/1064455030566043648/il_fullxfull.png

    – Silviosilver based Serbo-Australian - 2023 ce

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Lol.

    How in the world does recognizing their mixed/mulatto identity compel me to accept them into my life? What a bizarre inference. I need no more accept them than I accept people from the existing black category.

    (I’m pretty sure there are remedial English classes for adults. Check it out some time. You don’t have to live like this.)

    Oh, and one more thing, I don’t get why people dump on step fatherhood so much. Yeah, you’re helping raise someone else’s kid, but so what? 99.9999999% of the friends and lovers you’ll have in this life are somebody else’s kids too.

  227. @Mikhail
    @Mr. Hack

    You betcha. Putin for years gave peace a chance, much unlike the corrupt, lying, undemocratic and neo-Nazi influenced Kiev regime, with blood on its hands before and after 2/24/22 and thereafter.

    Merkel, Hollande and Porky confirmed the obvious.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    But the “corrupt, lying undemocratic and neo-Nazi”side never invaded Russia, never transgressed its neighbor’s borders to foment a war, similarly to the Sudetenland Czechs and NAZI Germany. Painting Rusia like a beacon of peace and measured reasonableness is a hoax that can be viewed objectively through the eyes of all of its satellite states that all fled the iron curtain and fled to the Western side. Even Finland and Sweden are soon to become full fledged members of NATO (talk about a major foreign policy gaffe made by the Russian side), making it once again a stronger and more viable organization.


    Another huge miscalculation by the Russian side!

    • LOL: Mikhail
  228. @A123
    @QCIC


    That is why I used the words “taken or flipped”. Flipped means made pro-Russian (without destruction) which implies new local government. They don’t want to destroy any cities in the East, they may be past caring in the West.
     
    I do not see any plausible flips for large cities. Many with known anti-Kiev leanings fled so as not to be caught in the crossfire or local Stasi like machinations. While there may be quiet discontent, there is no good way to organize action.

    Flattening Odessa makes military sense. However, it could also create serious long-term problems for Putin's larger geopolitical strategy. Bypassing Odessa to hookup with Transnistria is an interesting idea to "land lock" the Kiev regime, but improbable as far too ambitious & high risk.

    Waiting for Kiev's aggression to run out of money has conservative appeal, minimizing casualties on both sides. It avoids having a failed state on the Russian border. They are closely watching the fiasco in Lebanon, which is highly problematic for both Syria and Jewish Palestine. The last thing Putin wants is a similar issue on a much lengthier geographic scale.


    I assume either anguished Nationalists or disappointed Western types will take care of Zelensky.
     
    Ultimately Zelensky has to skip the country before he winds up like Gaddafi.

    If he makes it out, the European Empire will protect him and his family. Not selling him out is essential suborning the next national leader to serve the European WEF Elites.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @QCIC, @Mr. Hack

    Waiting for Kiev’s aggression to run out of money has conservative appeal,

    “Kiev’s aggression”? You must have just run out of your meds to believe BS like this. Who is Ukraine being the aggressor towards? To the Russian Christian pacifiers that are spreading Russian corruption and authoritarian oligarchy to Ukraine? Do you really believe this nonsense that you’re trying to spread here? If you do, you’re an even bigger fool than I had imagined. Mabe Putler should be viewed as Russia’s Billy Graham?

    Ultimately Zelensky has to skip the country before he winds up like Gaddafi.

    You’ve been tooting this empty meme since 02/24/22. Zelenskyt put cowards and appeasers like you to shame from the beginning of the war. They’re all still in Ukraine fighting to defend their country:

    Have any current pics of Zelensky building a new mansion in Switzerland? You’re all just stupid hot air, kremlinstoogeA123.

    • LOL: Mikhail
  229. @LatW
    @QCIC

    I'm not interested in your made up fluff and fantasies. The only thing that is asked of you is to not lie and to not make things up. It's not a lot to ask.

    Leave my town.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wh7WYiC1DfI

    Replies: @QCIC

    Great job, morons.

  230. Relates to the CNN-BBC misinformation/disinformation –

    from_kherson
    @KhersonFrom
    “Who needs such truth?” a woman asks Arestovych after he revealed that Ukrainian AD intercepted missile, causing it to land on residential building.

    A view into the 🇺🇦 mindset. Btw, has Ukraine taken responsibility for its missiles going into Poland? Haven’t followed that drama.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Mikhail

    That happens to people when their whole world view starts collapsing...Herodotus had a nice passage about it:


    For where a lie must be told, let it be told. We strive for the same goal whether we lie or tell the truth. Our goal is the same..
     
    It is a hysterical descent into mental nihilism by the Ukie maximalists; some conscious like Arestovich and Co., but mostly unconscious like hapless Mr. Hacks. Their goals have become an obsession: unquestionable, unthinking, irrational, and ultimately hopeless. They want to "win the war against Russia, annihilate Russianism..." - in Russia's own region no and by using only Ukies - by definition a limited supply.

    This is an unfolding catastrophe for the Ukrainians - that's all anyone will remember about it in the future. The fact that like sheep or lemmings they are led by irresponsible caudillos in Washington and Kiev to their demise shows that maybe they are not the savviest and smartest of people. That explains a lot of their history.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Mr. Hack

  231. Brian Berletic
    @BrianJBerletic
    Says a representative of a regime that has been shelling the civilian population of Donetsk city since 2014…

    Not “whataboutism,” it was a botched Ukrainian air defense response that caused this, while Donetsk is deliberately shelled daily.

    Melaniya Podolyak
    @MelaniePodolyak
    ·
    Jan 14
    It’s absolutely fair for me to wish for all Russians and Russia to be wiped off the face of the Earth. It’s not hate speech, it’s not horrible of me, it’s just FAIR.

    14.01.2013, Dnipro, a residential building after Russian missile attack.

    [MORE]

  232. Was Schwarzenegger a visionary because he hacked the growing gay influence (via bodybuilding) to catapult himself to superstardom?

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird

    See Bill Burr. Arnold is a great man. Did you ever see that photo Sailer posted of him mountain biking with his bastard kid?

    They tried to paint him as a Nazi and he didn't even blink. That said body building was always fake and gay. Authentic athletic == olympic decathlon.

  233. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    I get what you are saying, and the left is attempting to do the opposite with the POC umbrella designation. Leaving aside whether or not it's a good idea, given how the incentives actually work for this kind of re-categorization I just don't see the point in throwing it out there as an actionable possibility.

    The shift toward preferential identification with blackness is due to a massive shift in the distribution of rewards. It is in the concrete material interests of many to identify as blacks because of perks. These perks can only be distributed if you control the engines of societal institutional power. Basically, if you had the power to distribute these perks to convince people to adopt an intermediate racial category you wouldn't have to propose such a thing.


    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks
     
    I don't think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren't hanging in the hood. Obama is jet setting with the Martha's Vinyard set while Markle married into the House of Windsor. About the most ghetto they will be likely to see is meeting Snoop Dogg on the golf course.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @silviosilver, @A123

    Markle types may gain certain advantages by claiming blackness in America, but the downside is they have to put up with sharing an identity, cultural ways and, all too often, social circles and living space with actual blacks

    I don’t think this is the case. More often than not they can have their cake and eat it too. Obama and Markle aren’t hanging in the hood. Obama is jet setting with the Martha’s Vinyard set while Markle married into the House of Windsor. About the most ghetto they will be likely to see is meeting Snoop Dogg on the golf course.

    I concur.

    Claiming PoC status (or other SJW marker such as LGBT) is a virtue mark. INE becomes:

    • Brave in the eyes of the media.
    • Obtain privileges in schools from university down to elementary.
    • Have unearned status in the public sphere

    It has gotten so extreme, merit is now actually a negative. Europe offers an excellent example. (1)

    In the West, many of the White males who sign up for the agenda of multiculturalism, progressivism, and open borders are finding that they are too White and too male to be of use to the socio-political system any longer.

    The latest case in Germany highlights this trend, where the Green party dismissed its own justice minister, Dirk Adams, in the German state of Thuringia. He was not found guilty of any wrongdoing, but instead was simply a male of the wrong skin color, which, by the Green party’s own admission, was the entire basis for his dismissal.

    Adams will now be replaced by Afro-German Doreen Denstädt. Thuringia’s Minister-President Bodo Ramelow, of the Left Party, fired Adams, who was the Minister for Migration, Justice and Consumer Protection. The dismissal came about after the Green party directly requested him to be replaced by Denstädt, who has no law degree or political experience.

    Being straight, white, & male is now effectively penalized. There is a special benefit for everyone else.

    The good news is the handwriting is on my the wall for SJW dogma to implode. For example, real women are standing up against fake women in sports. The only way for more Leftoid privilege and status to become available is to take it away from another SJW category.

    The piranhas are hungry. And, the only meat in the tank are other piranhas.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://rmx.news/germany/german-green-party-replaces-its-own-white-male-justice-minister-with-black-female-who-has-no-law-degree-or-political-experience/

  234. @songbird
    Saw an old Siskel and Ebert clip where they were praising some movie set in medieval times for the fact that everyone was besmirched with dirt.

    It's so bizarre and funny that I don't even know what to make of it.

    Natural inclination is to dive into politics and to blame the fact that they were both woke. That they just wanted to see the past as inherently dirty.

    If I try to view it in a more generous light, maybe, they were saying that they wanted to be immersed in the film, and not feel like it was shot on a studio backlot, with the costumes rented by the hour. I'm not altogether unsympathetic to such a view, but, wow, talk about low expectations!

    Of all the things that could give a medieval film character and make it a spectacle. The thousand-and-one features of that era never depicted on film before, from the small to the large, and they said they wanted to see dirt! Unbelievable!

    Replies: @S

    Was the movie they were reviewing Braveheart by chance? It did seem to feature quite a lot of dirt and mud. That was a running gag with some of the Monty Python skits about all the medieval filth, ie dumping their refuse right out the window on unexpecting passers by, and the main street being an open sewer.

    I’ve heard different things going either way about just how dirty life was in medieval Europe, though some have suggested the dirtiest factor has been exaggerated a bit.

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @S

    https://twitter.com/devarbol/status/1614585790616719361

    Replies: @S

    , @songbird
    @S


    Was the movie they were reviewing Braveheart by chance?
     
    It was actually Dragonslayer (1981, never saw it), so I guess there was an element of fantasy in it too, which maybe makes it even stranger? I don't know.
    If you are interested in it, then you can see it here at about 3:48:
    https://youtu.be/ZRjCwd0y-OQ

    Replies: @S, @Philip Owen

    , @AP
    @S

    The idea that medieval Europeans didn't bathe was a myth:

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-middle-ages-were-cleaner-than-we-think-11673535460



    A longstanding myth holds that people in medieval Christian Europe didn’t bathe. In fact, the Middle Ages subscribed heartily to the adage “cleanliness is next to godliness.” Thinkers of the period considered physical beauty to represent spiritual purity, and they looked at hygiene in the same way: If one’s body was impure, it would by definition be unattractive and out of harmony. If it had any imperfections, one would best address them through cleansing. For women, in particular, cleanliness was one of the very highest virtues.

    The daily wash usually involved collecting water in a ewer, heating it, then pouring it into a large basin to be used for scrubbing. Baths in a wooden tub would happen less often, given it was a world without plumbing. Water is heavy, and collecting it, heating it, and then getting it from the kettle into the bathtub was difficult. Baths also required space, which was at a premium in most households.

    Luckily, there were a few ways to bathe outside the home. In warmer months, you could simply find a pond or a lake, and you were good to go. But in January this could be a problem, and that was where bathhouses came in. Bathhouses took the laborious and difficult work of drawing and heating water and monetized it. Most towns boasted at least one professional bathhouse, while cities played host to a number of competing establishments.

    In Paris, a guild for bathhouse keepers set rules that bathkeepers had to abide by. Much like modern spas, they offered customers a cheaper “steam bath [for] two pennies; and if he bathes, [he] should pay four pennies.” To stand out in a crowded field, Parisian bathhouses employed criers to drum up business from women eager to put their best foot forward.

    Rich women had a major advantage in bathing, since they could send servants to fetch and heat water. More luxurious households sometimes had rooms dedicated to bathing, and women with money to spare on travel visited famous bathing spots like Pozzuoli, outside Naples—a destination so famous that poems were written celebrating its virtues.

    This emphasis on cleanliness was echoed in the bathing practices of Muslim communities in Sicily and on the Iberian Peninsula and the Jewish communities that were spread across medieval Europe. Bathing was an explicitly mandated part of Jewish custom and was required before the Sabbath. Women could bathe either in a public bathhouse, which would include steam and hot water, or in a cold-water mikveh, which was used for ritual purification. Meanwhile, Muslim women’s interest in the hammam is evidenced by the astounding number of surviving baths as well as by some pointed polemical tracts wherein Muslim men wondered what exactly women were getting up to while they were bathing, away from the prying eyes of men.

    The emphasis on cleanliness led to a great medieval invention—soap. The earliest surviving written description of soap in Europe dates to the 4th century A.D., when Theodorus Priscianus, a physician in Constantinople, described a French product that was used for washing, especially the head. In the Italian-speaking lands, soap was being produced professionally and in great enough quantities that guilds of soap makers existed by at least the 7th century.

    In the 12th century, the fine hard soaps of the Middle East began to be imported to Europe. “Hard” indicates that they were made with higher-quality ash, which yields lighter bars of soap, in contrast to darker “soft” soaps made with wood ash and lye, which was the norm earlier. Unfortunately, well-made soaps were a luxury that most women would never know. To fill the gap, they made their own cleansers at home, and they had a range of types to choose from. Soap recipes were common and included in “books of secrets”—manuals for women to make various beauty products, as well as medicinal items.

    Specialist cleansing products were also available. Hildegard of Bingen, a 12th-century German mystic, had her own recipe for barley-water face cleanser, which she recommended for “skin, made harsh from the wind.” She assured worried women that after its use, “the skin will become soft and smooth, and will have a beautiful color.” Enterprising women were also advised to scent bathwater with herbs, or even concoct what we would call deodorants from hyssop and bay leaf.

    Such small luxuries were likely in wide use, given that herb-scented water and homemade soap were not in short supply to those who made their homes on farms. Still, women from wealthier backgrounds had an easier time staying clean in their day-to-day lives. Peasant women were, after all, engaging in manual labor on farms all day, digging in crops and handling farm animals. Women from merchant or noble backgrounds were unlikely to come into contact with the same amount of dirt.

    When physically laboring women strived for a clean ideal, they were attempting to emulate women from the sedentary classes. Medieval women of modest means couldn’t always live up to the era’s beauty ideals by giving themselves gray eyes or blond hair, nor could they reverse the aging process. But even working women could luxuriate in a weekly bath.

  235. ‘Dirtiest’ should read ‘dirtiness’ in the previous post.

  236. @S
    @songbird

    Was the movie they were reviewing Braveheart by chance? It did seem to feature quite a lot of dirt and mud. That was a running gag with some of the Monty Python skits about all the medieval filth, ie dumping their refuse right out the window on unexpecting passers by, and the main street being an open sewer.

    I've heard different things going either way about just how dirty life was in medieval Europe, though some have suggested the dirtiest factor has been exaggerated a bit.

    Replies: @sudden death, @songbird, @AP

    • Replies: @S
    @sudden death

    Well, every people have their good and bad points. French tap water well into the 20th century wasn't always necessarily fit to drink I've been told.

    Now, in regards to the French not having dining forks until being told about them by the Polish, I'd have to see proof for that one! :-D

  237. @Mikhail
    Relates to the CNN-BBC misinformation/disinformation -

    from_kherson
    @KhersonFrom
    "Who needs such truth?" a woman asks Arestovych after he revealed that Ukrainian AD intercepted missile, causing it to land on residential building.

    A view into the 🇺🇦 mindset. Btw, has Ukraine taken responsibility for its missiles going into Poland? Haven't followed that drama.
     


    https://twitter.com/KhersonFrom/status/1614460565535031304

    Replies: @Beckow

    That happens to people when their whole world view starts collapsing…Herodotus had a nice passage about it:

    For where a lie must be told, let it be told. We strive for the same goal whether we lie or tell the truth. Our goal is the same..

    It is a hysterical descent into mental nihilism by the Ukie maximalists; some conscious like Arestovich and Co., but mostly unconscious like hapless Mr. Hacks. Their goals have become an obsession: unquestionable, unthinking, irrational, and ultimately hopeless. They want to “win the war against Russia, annihilate Russianism…” – in Russia’s own region no and by using only Ukies – by definition a limited supply.

    This is an unfolding catastrophe for the Ukrainians – that’s all anyone will remember about it in the future. The fact that like sheep or lemmings they are led by irresponsible caudillos in Washington and Kiev to their demise shows that maybe they are not the savviest and smartest of people. That explains a lot of their history.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Beckow


    The fact that like sheep or lemmings they are led by irresponsible caudillos in Washington and Kiev to their demise shows that maybe they are not the savviest and smartest of people.

     

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caudillo

    We haven't had any caudillos in Washington since Ronald Reagan. Trump probably cannot do one pushup.
    , @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    The fact that like sheep or lemmings they are led by irresponsible caudillos in Washington and Kiev to their demise shows that maybe they are not the savviest and smartest of people.
     
    And Russians are being led by a megalomaniacal madman watching their once flourishing country go down the cesspool of economic ruin, while you live comfortably in you NATO protected homeland cheering on the destruction of "Nazis in Ukraine"? You're almost as incoherent as your two fellow stooge sidemen, Averko and kremlinstoogeA123. You should have been on your pedestal screaming about Slovakia's recent pledge to provide more weapons to Ukraine, including jointly run factories to produce even more going forward. You seem to be completely out of step with your fellow countrymen?

    Replies: @Beckow

  238. Looks to me like the kremlinstooge crowd of fools and appeasers of this site (Averko, kremlinstoogeA123, Beckow) are cowards too.


    Fool, Appeaser and Samovar Polisher. 🙂

  239. @songbird
    Was Schwarzenegger a visionary because he hacked the growing gay influence (via bodybuilding) to catapult himself to superstardom?

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    See Bill Burr. Arnold is a great man. Did you ever see that photo Sailer posted of him mountain biking with his bastard kid?

    They tried to paint him as a Nazi and he didn’t even blink. That said body building was always fake and gay. Authentic athletic == olympic decathlon.

    • LOL: songbird
  240. @Beckow
    @Mikhail

    That happens to people when their whole world view starts collapsing...Herodotus had a nice passage about it:


    For where a lie must be told, let it be told. We strive for the same goal whether we lie or tell the truth. Our goal is the same..
     
    It is a hysterical descent into mental nihilism by the Ukie maximalists; some conscious like Arestovich and Co., but mostly unconscious like hapless Mr. Hacks. Their goals have become an obsession: unquestionable, unthinking, irrational, and ultimately hopeless. They want to "win the war against Russia, annihilate Russianism..." - in Russia's own region no and by using only Ukies - by definition a limited supply.

    This is an unfolding catastrophe for the Ukrainians - that's all anyone will remember about it in the future. The fact that like sheep or lemmings they are led by irresponsible caudillos in Washington and Kiev to their demise shows that maybe they are not the savviest and smartest of people. That explains a lot of their history.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Mr. Hack

    The fact that like sheep or lemmings they are led by irresponsible caudillos in Washington and Kiev to their demise shows that maybe they are not the savviest and smartest of people.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caudillo

    We haven’t had any caudillos in Washington since Ronald Reagan. Trump probably cannot do one pushup.

  241. @Beckow
    @Mikhail

    That happens to people when their whole world view starts collapsing...Herodotus had a nice passage about it:


    For where a lie must be told, let it be told. We strive for the same goal whether we lie or tell the truth. Our goal is the same..
     
    It is a hysterical descent into mental nihilism by the Ukie maximalists; some conscious like Arestovich and Co., but mostly unconscious like hapless Mr. Hacks. Their goals have become an obsession: unquestionable, unthinking, irrational, and ultimately hopeless. They want to "win the war against Russia, annihilate Russianism..." - in Russia's own region no and by using only Ukies - by definition a limited supply.

    This is an unfolding catastrophe for the Ukrainians - that's all anyone will remember about it in the future. The fact that like sheep or lemmings they are led by irresponsible caudillos in Washington and Kiev to their demise shows that maybe they are not the savviest and smartest of people. That explains a lot of their history.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Mr. Hack

    The fact that like sheep or lemmings they are led by irresponsible caudillos in Washington and Kiev to their demise shows that maybe they are not the savviest and smartest of people.

    And Russians are being led by a megalomaniacal madman watching their once flourishing country go down the cesspool of economic ruin, while you live comfortably in you NATO protected homeland cheering on the destruction of “Nazis in Ukraine”? You’re almost as incoherent as your two fellow stooge sidemen, Averko and kremlinstoogeA123. You should have been on your pedestal screaming about Slovakia’s recent pledge to provide more weapons to Ukraine, including jointly run factories to produce even more going forward. You seem to be completely out of step with your fellow countrymen?

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack

    Out of step? What are you some kind of marching fascist? The promises are almost completely worthless, none of it will come to fruition - it is a desperate signal by our collapsed comprador gment. Why do you always take vague verbal promises seriously? Like the German tanks in 2024...sure, that's what will make a difference.

    What matters is what is happening now: Ukies are dying in large numbers to defend places that they don't plan to keep, and the Ukie economy is down 40-50%...so who is experiencing an economic ruin? Do you have any sense of proportion or understanding numbers? It is just emotional posturing by you to hide from reality.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  242. @S
    @songbird

    Was the movie they were reviewing Braveheart by chance? It did seem to feature quite a lot of dirt and mud. That was a running gag with some of the Monty Python skits about all the medieval filth, ie dumping their refuse right out the window on unexpecting passers by, and the main street being an open sewer.

    I've heard different things going either way about just how dirty life was in medieval Europe, though some have suggested the dirtiest factor has been exaggerated a bit.

    Replies: @sudden death, @songbird, @AP

    Was the movie they were reviewing Braveheart by chance?

    It was actually Dragonslayer (1981, never saw it), so I guess there was an element of fantasy in it too, which maybe makes it even stranger? I don’t know.

    [MORE]

    If you are interested in it, then you can see it here at about 3:48:

    • Replies: @S
    @songbird

    Thanks. I'd never heard of Dragonslayer either. To be frank, the little bit they showed of it, it looked kind of lame.

    I liked Excalibur. In criticism of that film they commented about no suits of armor until basically medieval times, but I think that might be mistaken.

    I think in Europe they may have had something not too distant from suits of armor as early as seven hundred years before Christ, perhaps even earlier. The proto-Celtic Halstatts of Austria were wearing the below at that time.

    What is striking is just how medieval looking the armor is.



    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/ab/Hallstatt_culture_Kleinklein_-_muscle_cuirasses_%26_double_ridge_helmet.jpg/800px-Hallstatt_culture_Kleinklein_-_muscle_cuirasses_%26_double_ridge_helmet.jpg

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hallstatt_culture

    Replies: @songbird

    , @Philip Owen
    @songbird

    Dragonslayer was full of wry humour. It didn't take itself seriously and was good for that.

  243. @songbird
    How many Africans could have fit into the old bubble container that my family used to have years ago, when we went camping. Probably 4-5, I'd guess.

    https://twitter.com/AntiWhiteWatch1/status/1614500607561437184?s=20&t=nI0twfrjcTe2z7joREpwfA

    Replies: @S

    How many Africans could have fit into the old bubble container that my family used to have years ago, when we went camping.

    That video is an illustration of a government that cares nothing for the well being of it’s own citizens, nor does it care (in reality) anything about the so called ‘migrants’ either.

    • Agree: songbird
  244. @songbird
    @S


    Was the movie they were reviewing Braveheart by chance?
     
    It was actually Dragonslayer (1981, never saw it), so I guess there was an element of fantasy in it too, which maybe makes it even stranger? I don't know.
    If you are interested in it, then you can see it here at about 3:48:
    https://youtu.be/ZRjCwd0y-OQ

    Replies: @S, @Philip Owen

    Thanks. I’d never heard of Dragonslayer either. To be frank, the little bit they showed of it, it looked kind of lame.

    I liked Excalibur. In criticism of that film they commented about no suits of armor until basically medieval times, but I think that might be mistaken.

    I think in Europe they may have had something not too distant from suits of armor as early as seven hundred years before Christ, perhaps even earlier. The proto-Celtic Halstatts of Austria were wearing the below at that time.

    What is striking is just how medieval looking the armor is.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @S


    I liked Excalibur
     
    I also liked it, but was ultimately disappointed because I wanted to love it.

    Guess I had really unrealistic expectations, but when a national-mytho corpus is the subject matter, I just want the highest level of masterwork possible. I say, take ten years to do pre-production, and make it so that it would be impossible for anyone to make a better one. Make the script perfect. Bring on the medieval enthusiasts and scholars, to consult. Scour the countryside, to find the best locations to shoot - the best-shaded bubbling brooks. Coppiced forrests. Real castles.

    I can remember seeing scenes in my head, from reading about the myth and wanting to see those scenes. Imagining them in my head, and adding cinematic details, and yearning to see them.

    Like, I mentioned previously that scene in the snow, with the unflappable knight imagining the rosy cheeks of his love, in two drops of blood that have fallen from his hawk, catching a hare or something. That would be a great scene depicting the ideals of chivalry.

    Arthur is said to have had a shield with Mary painted on it. This I have imagined on the inside of his shield. And I have imagined him being in a battle, and the shield being pierced multiple times on either side of the image, and him holding it up after the battle and seeing light shining through, and then kneeling in a prayer of thanksgiving. This would be a great depiction of faith. (Really missing from most medieval movies, where the focus seems to be on showing corrupt church officials, or the 'racism' and 'intolerance' of the Crusaders.

    I really like all the Euro accents in the film. That moment when Arthur handed over Excalibur to his antagonist was a moment of genius, IMO. Didn't think Guenevere was beautiful enough. And personally, I think the cucking storyline is given too much focus. It is a late edition, and some earlier components of the myth are more interesting to me. I think it is important to make little boys want to be Arthur, and the other knights, and I think it really interferes with that.

    One kind of weird thing about the movie was that the director was actually filming his daughter being ravished by Pendragon.

    As to the plate-armor: I think that's just a silly criticism. Obviously it is meant to be an idealized myth and not to date to some specific time. The choice of armor is stylistic. IMO, it is only arguable on the level of whether it is good art or not.

    Maybe, the shining lights on the armor were a little too dazzling? I don't know, but I didn't hate the armor, though I did originally think it did look a bit over-the-top, I've since accepted that the film had its own look.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @silviosilver

  245. Girl Guides in Canada are changing their name from Brownies to Embers, since Brownies is now considered hurtful.

    It is funny because embers suggests people sifting through the wreckage of civilization, after the barbarian hordes have burnt it down.

    • Replies: @A123
    @songbird


    Girl Guides in Canada are changing their name from Brownies to Embers, since Brownies is now considered hurtful.
     
    Embers are the end of the cycle. Leading up to being Campfire Girl should be the beginning of the cycle.

    What does one start a fire with?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @songbird

  246. @QCIC
    @Sean

    I don't think there are any targets worthy of a nuke on the Ukrainian battlefield.

    I agree with the point that the US seems 'all in', but they may drop it at some point. The people behind this atrocity don't actually have to save face, they will just lie about it. Unfortunately, they will probably escalate something else.

    I still worry the most about Kaliningrad, I do believe that Western strikes there could lead to the use of nuclear weapons by either side. Serbia should watch out as well.

    Call your Congressman.

    Replies: @Sean

    I don’t think there are any targets worthy of a nuke on the Ukrainian battlefield.

    It would be performative and signaling willingness to go down that road so they could just hit empty territory such as Snake Island and that would be a wake up call. But they might then do a real strike on supply lines (crater hundreds of yards deep on rail or road link would not so easily be repaired). The actual targeting of the Ukrainian army would be the third escalation.

    Unlike the Cold War, which likely was never going to go hot especially after Cuba, there is not a theory worked out how nuclear escalation would work in a situation where Russia killed thousands of Ukrainian soldiers, and the US has said there would be no nuclear retaliation to that. However, American conventional retaliation (as floated by some retired generals) to a Russian nuclear strike on the Ukrainian army seems very likely to face an already-crossed-the thermonuclear-Rubicon Russia with being humiliatingly trounced and swallowing it, or using another nuke against Nato (there are anti aircraft nukes and nuclear mines). I think Russia could use an ostentatiously redundant strike on an empty area and America would get the message.

    I cannot see America actually launching even a limited raid on the Russian Armed Forces much less actual undisputed Russia territory. We ought to remember that America has not even given Ukraine Abrams tanks or F16s yet, still less the Army Tactical Missile System. All Ukraine has is the effectively 80km range ordinary HIMARS. By my way of thinking that indicates the objective of American strategy is to stop Russia winning rather than help Ukraine to win. The US wants Russia fighting Ukraine in an endless war that is kept below the level of direct US involvement.

    Ukraine is going to be progressively wrecked and suffer permanent loss of population from emigration, but that is a price America is willing to pay in order to weaken Russia. Lloyd Austin said quite openly that weakening Russia was the US objective. That is working with Putin who is too sanguine about the prospects of military success, but I think a successor would quite possibly decide to terminate the war, and threaten to use nuclear weapons on Ukraine if America kept it going. Putin probably ought to do that now, but he remains focused on America’s cat’s paw (Ukraine), which as long as it keeps fighting the US does not care about. Currently Russia is like a frog in a pot having the heat tuned up so fiendishly slowly that it passively allows itself to be boiled alive.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Sean

    I think Russia is still intentionally chewing through the Ukrainian armed forces so the eventual recovery to civilian order will be more manageable.

    I think the most likely situation for a nuclear weapon to be used militarily short of WW3 is an attack on a nuclear-armed submarine which snuck into some place it should not be. Applies to all players. The risk of escalation might be very high.

    Replies: @Sean

    , @Greasy William
    @Sean


    I cannot see America actually launching even a limited raid on the Russian Armed Forces much less actual undisputed Russia territory.
     
    I think the US of 20 years ago could definitely have done something like that. The US of 10 years ago, probably. US of today? No chance.
  247. @sudden death
    @S

    https://twitter.com/devarbol/status/1614585790616719361

    Replies: @S

    Well, every people have their good and bad points. French tap water well into the 20th century wasn’t always necessarily fit to drink I’ve been told.

    Now, in regards to the French not having dining forks until being told about them by the Polish, I’d have to see proof for that one! 😀

  248. @songbird
    Girl Guides in Canada are changing their name from Brownies to Embers, since Brownies is now considered hurtful.

    It is funny because embers suggests people sifting through the wreckage of civilization, after the barbarian hordes have burnt it down.

    Replies: @A123

    Girl Guides in Canada are changing their name from Brownies to Embers, since Brownies is now considered hurtful.

    Embers are the end of the cycle. Leading up to being Campfire Girl should be the beginning of the cycle.

    What does one start a fire with?

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @songbird
    @A123


    Embers are the end of the cycle. Leading up to being Campfire Girl should be the beginning of the cycle.

    What does one start a fire with?
     
    I agree, it is not evocative of youth or of life at all.

    A few weeks back, I watched the Iranian film Children of Heaven.

    Undeniably, the subject matter is pretty saccharine or maudlin. On a certain level, it is just hard to watch a movie starring children, but, if you can get over that, I didn't think it was bad. I liked it. Rare to see a film that wholesome, and with a kind of spiritual message, at the end.

    Anyway, there was one scene in it, where the school was drilling the girls in song, (probably some regime anthem) And they sang something like "We are the flower of our nation." Better than "embers", for sure.
  249. @S
    @songbird

    Thanks. I'd never heard of Dragonslayer either. To be frank, the little bit they showed of it, it looked kind of lame.

    I liked Excalibur. In criticism of that film they commented about no suits of armor until basically medieval times, but I think that might be mistaken.

    I think in Europe they may have had something not too distant from suits of armor as early as seven hundred years before Christ, perhaps even earlier. The proto-Celtic Halstatts of Austria were wearing the below at that time.

    What is striking is just how medieval looking the armor is.



    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/ab/Hallstatt_culture_Kleinklein_-_muscle_cuirasses_%26_double_ridge_helmet.jpg/800px-Hallstatt_culture_Kleinklein_-_muscle_cuirasses_%26_double_ridge_helmet.jpg

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hallstatt_culture

    Replies: @songbird

    I liked Excalibur

    I also liked it, but was ultimately disappointed because I wanted to love it.

    [MORE]

    Guess I had really unrealistic expectations, but when a national-mytho corpus is the subject matter, I just want the highest level of masterwork possible. I say, take ten years to do pre-production, and make it so that it would be impossible for anyone to make a better one. Make the script perfect. Bring on the medieval enthusiasts and scholars, to consult. Scour the countryside, to find the best locations to shoot – the best-shaded bubbling brooks. Coppiced forrests. Real castles.

    I can remember seeing scenes in my head, from reading about the myth and wanting to see those scenes. Imagining them in my head, and adding cinematic details, and yearning to see them.

    Like, I mentioned previously that scene in the snow, with the unflappable knight imagining the rosy cheeks of his love, in two drops of blood that have fallen from his hawk, catching a hare or something. That would be a great scene depicting the ideals of chivalry.

    Arthur is said to have had a shield with Mary painted on it. This I have imagined on the inside of his shield. And I have imagined him being in a battle, and the shield being pierced multiple times on either side of the image, and him holding it up after the battle and seeing light shining through, and then kneeling in a prayer of thanksgiving. This would be a great depiction of faith. (Really missing from most medieval movies, where the focus seems to be on showing corrupt church officials, or the ‘racism’ and ‘intolerance’ of the Crusaders.

    I really like all the Euro accents in the film. That moment when Arthur handed over Excalibur to his antagonist was a moment of genius, IMO. Didn’t think Guenevere was beautiful enough. And personally, I think the cucking storyline is given too much focus. It is a late edition, and some earlier components of the myth are more interesting to me. I think it is important to make little boys want to be Arthur, and the other knights, and I think it really interferes with that.

    One kind of weird thing about the movie was that the director was actually filming his daughter being ravished by Pendragon.

    As to the plate-armor: I think that’s just a silly criticism. Obviously it is meant to be an idealized myth and not to date to some specific time. The choice of armor is stylistic. IMO, it is only arguable on the level of whether it is good art or not.

    Maybe, the shining lights on the armor were a little too dazzling? I don’t know, but I didn’t hate the armor, though I did originally think it did look a bit over-the-top, I’ve since accepted that the film had its own look.

    • Agree: S
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    If you meant the great "Excalibur" of 1981, Mary on shield would be inappropriate since the movie was almost totally pagan (there was just one Celtic-Christian ceremony) through and through, as stressed by its Wagnerian music. Arthur there was clearly the protegee of the Lady of the Lake, not of Mary:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Ll4qS4anGo

    The plate armour was overdone but its clanks made the movie more gritty...Overall, the movie was a self-contained work of art.

    Replies: @Philip Owen, @songbird

    , @silviosilver
    @songbird


    I also liked it, but was ultimately disappointed because I wanted to love it.
     
    How old were you when you saw it? I first saw it at eleven or twelve, and was immediately smitten. Of course, I wasn't looking for the fulfillment of a national mythology, I was simply into all sorts of medieval-y, adventure-y, fantasy things, and Excalibur completely fit the bill. ('Sword of the Valiant' 1984, was another. Bit cheesy, but lots of fun. Sean Connery, John Rhys-Davies, little screen time but big impact.)

    I didn't like the portrayal of Merlin at first, and I thought the young Arthur was too dorky, but I grew to appreciate both with further watching. I agree that Guinevere could have been prettier, although she did play the role quite well.

    The ending was a bit of a letdown, made up for by the several powerful scenes. I agree with you about the scene when Arthur hands over Excalibur to be knighted by his foe. (Charlton Heston freeing the Moorish prisoners in El Cid had a similar impact on me.)

    To me though, all that was secondary to the evocative imagery coupled to the sublime soundtrack. Just magnificent. If there's ever anything like it again, I fear it won't be for a long, long time.

    Scour the countryside, to find the best locations to shoot – the best-shaded bubbling brooks. Coppiced forrests. Real castles.
     
    I'm not sure anyone could have done a whole lot better though. Given the subject matter and the scenery as it was, I think there was easily enough there to satisfy the deepest yearnings of blood and soil nationalist types, the kind who feel themselves so at one with the land they know each owl, each fox, each blade of grass by name.

    Replies: @songbird

  250. @A123
    @songbird


    Girl Guides in Canada are changing their name from Brownies to Embers, since Brownies is now considered hurtful.
     
    Embers are the end of the cycle. Leading up to being Campfire Girl should be the beginning of the cycle.

    What does one start a fire with?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @songbird

    Embers are the end of the cycle. Leading up to being Campfire Girl should be the beginning of the cycle.

    What does one start a fire with?

    I agree, it is not evocative of youth or of life at all.

    A few weeks back, I watched the Iranian film Children of Heaven.

    Undeniably, the subject matter is pretty saccharine or maudlin. On a certain level, it is just hard to watch a movie starring children, but, if you can get over that, I didn’t think it was bad. I liked it. Rare to see a film that wholesome, and with a kind of spiritual message, at the end.

    Anyway, there was one scene in it, where the school was drilling the girls in song, (probably some regime anthem) And they sang something like “We are the flower of our nation.” Better than “embers”, for sure.

  251. @songbird
    @S


    I liked Excalibur
     
    I also liked it, but was ultimately disappointed because I wanted to love it.

    Guess I had really unrealistic expectations, but when a national-mytho corpus is the subject matter, I just want the highest level of masterwork possible. I say, take ten years to do pre-production, and make it so that it would be impossible for anyone to make a better one. Make the script perfect. Bring on the medieval enthusiasts and scholars, to consult. Scour the countryside, to find the best locations to shoot - the best-shaded bubbling brooks. Coppiced forrests. Real castles.

    I can remember seeing scenes in my head, from reading about the myth and wanting to see those scenes. Imagining them in my head, and adding cinematic details, and yearning to see them.

    Like, I mentioned previously that scene in the snow, with the unflappable knight imagining the rosy cheeks of his love, in two drops of blood that have fallen from his hawk, catching a hare or something. That would be a great scene depicting the ideals of chivalry.

    Arthur is said to have had a shield with Mary painted on it. This I have imagined on the inside of his shield. And I have imagined him being in a battle, and the shield being pierced multiple times on either side of the image, and him holding it up after the battle and seeing light shining through, and then kneeling in a prayer of thanksgiving. This would be a great depiction of faith. (Really missing from most medieval movies, where the focus seems to be on showing corrupt church officials, or the 'racism' and 'intolerance' of the Crusaders.

    I really like all the Euro accents in the film. That moment when Arthur handed over Excalibur to his antagonist was a moment of genius, IMO. Didn't think Guenevere was beautiful enough. And personally, I think the cucking storyline is given too much focus. It is a late edition, and some earlier components of the myth are more interesting to me. I think it is important to make little boys want to be Arthur, and the other knights, and I think it really interferes with that.

    One kind of weird thing about the movie was that the director was actually filming his daughter being ravished by Pendragon.

    As to the plate-armor: I think that's just a silly criticism. Obviously it is meant to be an idealized myth and not to date to some specific time. The choice of armor is stylistic. IMO, it is only arguable on the level of whether it is good art or not.

    Maybe, the shining lights on the armor were a little too dazzling? I don't know, but I didn't hate the armor, though I did originally think it did look a bit over-the-top, I've since accepted that the film had its own look.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @silviosilver

    If you meant the great “Excalibur” of 1981, Mary on shield would be inappropriate since the movie was almost totally pagan (there was just one Celtic-Christian ceremony) through and through, as stressed by its Wagnerian music. Arthur there was clearly the protegee of the Lady of the Lake, not of Mary:

    The plate armour was overdone but its clanks made the movie more gritty…Overall, the movie was a self-contained work of art.

    • Replies: @Philip Owen
    @Another Polish Perspective

    The scence where the knights galloped through the apple blossom was divine. The spirit of Avalon.

    , @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Well, I wouldn't want to shoe-horn faith into someone else's vision.

    But I think that we got to remember that Boorman was the guy who directed Deliverance. (NOT the type of guy I would want writing or directing a King Arthur Film.) I don't think he had any nationalistic feeling or a moral vision. His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)

    If Boorman got some things right, I consider it more like an accident.

    Personally, I believe that the story of King Arthur is best represented by a fusionism of the pagan with the Christian, and I believe it damages it when we disregard the latter element. Maybe, we should reach for a Celtic Church moral center for it, but I just don't think that Boorman had that in him.

    The trouble today is that we have lost nearly all trace of pagan moralism in Europe. There is not code of it, or authority, and it is liable to be hijacked by irreligious feminists, who the druids probably would have burnt at the stake.

    If you really want a good Euro pagan story to adopt to screen that would be the Táin Bó Cúailnge which was written down by the lineal descendants of the same elites who had previously been pagan.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @S

  252. @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    The fact that like sheep or lemmings they are led by irresponsible caudillos in Washington and Kiev to their demise shows that maybe they are not the savviest and smartest of people.
     
    And Russians are being led by a megalomaniacal madman watching their once flourishing country go down the cesspool of economic ruin, while you live comfortably in you NATO protected homeland cheering on the destruction of "Nazis in Ukraine"? You're almost as incoherent as your two fellow stooge sidemen, Averko and kremlinstoogeA123. You should have been on your pedestal screaming about Slovakia's recent pledge to provide more weapons to Ukraine, including jointly run factories to produce even more going forward. You seem to be completely out of step with your fellow countrymen?

    Replies: @Beckow

    Out of step? What are you some kind of marching fascist? The promises are almost completely worthless, none of it will come to fruition – it is a desperate signal by our collapsed comprador gment. Why do you always take vague verbal promises seriously? Like the German tanks in 2024…sure, that’s what will make a difference.

    What matters is what is happening now: Ukies are dying in large numbers to defend places that they don’t plan to keep, and the Ukie economy is down 40-50%…so who is experiencing an economic ruin? Do you have any sense of proportion or understanding numbers? It is just emotional posturing by you to hide from reality.

    • Agree: Mikhail
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow

    Ukrainian soldiers on the front lines continuously state that they are dying to protect their lands from uninvited enemies. What are the Russian soldiers fighting for? Convicts who make it 6 months get furloughed. Chechens following orders (and getting decimated left and right). Hipsters in Moscow, like Karlin, extolling the virtues of imperialism, while safely ensconced in their coffee house culture. And you? Truly out of step with your Slovakian neighbors who seem eager to help their Ukrainian neighbors!

    Replies: @Beckow, @Wokechoke

  253. @Sher Singh
    @Armenian Found this interesting

    Because Zoroastrian spirituality is so inextricably linked to agriculture and animal stewardship, it is not difficult to understand how terms such as vástár and drigû in the sacred gathic verse, are associated with “rich pastures” and “tyrannized cultivators/growers of the land.”

    ​The term drigû is unique to ancient Indo Iranian, and it is the case that because some words are elsewhere unattested, the precise meanings of those very words are not exactly certain. Drigû is one such term.

    The Old Avestan term drigû conveys the idea of “toil, hard labor, drudgery,” and refers to “the downtrodden, the oppressed cultivators, tillers, farmers and growers of the land who are subjected to the tyranny of the despot lords
     

    .”

    Prophet Zarathustra imposed an “order of farming nobility” based on “love of animals, stewardship of the land, and fondness for all things that grow, and are fruitful.” This order of Zoroastrian “farming nobility” was opposed by “cattle-raiding warrior bands,” who designated their leaders as Adhrigu “lord,” (he who is NOT drigû).

    These “warrior bands” called themselves also “man-wolves,” and mixed blood of the sacrificed bulls with sacred mead/wine, in their orgiastic rites. Their cruelty toward innocent animals, and their bloody bovine sacrifices, were especially appalling to the ancient Aryan Seer/Prophet.

    It shall be added that in the Vedic Mythology, Marutas, a “band of young warriors,” were Indra‘s shock troops who called Indra their “chief, lord,” Adhrigu (he who is NOT drigû.)
     

    https://authenticgathazoroastrianism.org/2017/09/25/the-dominion-of-the-gods-rich-pastures-and-the-dispossessed-cultivators-of-the-land-in-the-gathas-of-zarathustra/

    https://twitter.com/Parikramah/status/1237604962701434881?s=20

    Was listening to Zafarnama and heard Drigu I think to refer to Hindustan V Aurangzeb I think, will check.

    Consider Anatolia, Balkans & Greece to be Persia tbh

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Yevardian

    Don’t know if this post was directed at me or not, and perhaps probably only German_Reader would be interested (I missed replying to his booklist over the holidays), but I’m finishing reading a PHD thesis on Armenian Zoroastrianism at the moment.

    As an aside, its long been recognised that Zoroastrianism had a huge influence on the development of Biblical Judaism during the Achaemenid period, but it’s often overlooked that the (more authoritative) Babylonian Talmud was compiled within the later Sasanid Empire, or the role Jews played in the last Persian-Roman War.

    • Thanks: Jatt Aryaa
    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Yevardian


    missed replying to his booklist over the holidays),
     
    iirc you also stated that you would write a year-end book review; still waiting on that.

    I watched quite a few movies from the Russian/Soviet directors you mentioned. I stated previously that Aleksy German’s Seventh Companion is an excellent movie; which I consider among my top 15 favorites. Didn’t like some of his later, highly-lauded movies; absurdist nonsense. Tarkovsky: watched three of his films, of which Solaris was the best; though I thought it had the potential to be even better had he avoided arthouse techniques and boring romantic scenes. Nostalgia was the worst, pretentious bore-fest.

    , @Sher Singh
    @Yevardian

    You were posting about Iranic stuff awhile back so thought to share.
    No IRL experience with Armenians so don't know which side they swing toward.

    MENA Christians & secular Shias hate brown Idpol & just aspire to white generally.
    Afghans lean towards Panjab.

    ie a MENA Christian is offended at ancient history, a Persian embarassed & an Afghan proud.
    At least among those who grew up or lived here for awhile.

    Kurds are trash

    Replies: @Yevardian

  254. @Yahya
    @Blinky Bill

    “Wu tang kangz, la!”

    我们是国王


    https://img.i-scmp.com/cdn-cgi/image/fit=contain,width=1098,format=auto/sites/default/files/styles/1200x800/public/d8/images/canvas/2022/11/24/92501af7-5de2-4c55-8a48-e93643cc7f83_63bf7a8c.jpg?itok=mmjFk6xW&v=1669285977

    Replies: @songbird, @Talha, @Blinky Bill

    Assalaamu alaikum Bro,

    I was just checking in on UNZ to see how ’23 has started. Pretty crazy couple of years, eh? Hope you are doing well and hope 2023 is full of barakah for you and your family.

    I am seeing pictures of Saudi where it is turning green…satellite images and photos from brothers that have recently returned from Umrah. Syed ul-Kawnain (saws) predicted that the land of Arabia would “return to meadows” (Hatta ta’ooda arD ul’Arabi muroojan)…the last time it was green was around th Ice Age or so…how did he know this? I hope you can report back on your next trip there inshaAllah.

    I saw you posted an email address, I will email you – let me know if you are coming to Chicago Shareef anytime, I’ll show you around inshaAllah.

    I saw a headline that they are sending HIMARS to Ukraine intedning them as a game changer…who knew donkeys could be so useful in modern combat.

    Remember to keep your eyes firmly on The Prize/Beloved…as Shaykh Murabit al-Hajj (ra) said:
    “And what is man other than a comet that flashes brilliant light for a moment only to be reduced to ashes.”

    “O mankind, what has seduced you from your Lord, Most Generous?” (82:6)

    @Greasy – you stinky Zionist, I hope you are doing well also and 2023 is better for you than the last year. Have you found a Ms. Greasy yet?

    – Vermithrax Pejorative was the greatest dragon in the history of cinema, prove me wrong.

    Hoping for a good/blessed 2023 for the rest of you as well.

    Wa salaam!

    • Thanks: songbird, Yahya, Greasy William
    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Talha


    Have you found a Ms. Greasy yet?
     
    I wouldn't hold your breath on that one

    Replies: @Talha

  255. @Sean
    @QCIC


    I don’t think there are any targets worthy of a nuke on the Ukrainian battlefield.
     
    It would be performative and signaling willingness to go down that road so they could just hit empty territory such as Snake Island and that would be a wake up call. But they might then do a real strike on supply lines (crater hundreds of yards deep on rail or road link would not so easily be repaired). The actual targeting of the Ukrainian army would be the third escalation.

    Unlike the Cold War, which likely was never going to go hot especially after Cuba, there is not a theory worked out how nuclear escalation would work in a situation where Russia killed thousands of Ukrainian soldiers, and the US has said there would be no nuclear retaliation to that. However, American conventional retaliation (as floated by some retired generals) to a Russian nuclear strike on the Ukrainian army seems very likely to face an already-crossed-the thermonuclear-Rubicon Russia with being humiliatingly trounced and swallowing it, or using another nuke against Nato (there are anti aircraft nukes and nuclear mines). I think Russia could use an ostentatiously redundant strike on an empty area and America would get the message.

    I cannot see America actually launching even a limited raid on the Russian Armed Forces much less actual undisputed Russia territory. We ought to remember that America has not even given Ukraine Abrams tanks or F16s yet, still less the Army Tactical Missile System. All Ukraine has is the effectively 80km range ordinary HIMARS. By my way of thinking that indicates the objective of American strategy is to stop Russia winning rather than help Ukraine to win. The US wants Russia fighting Ukraine in an endless war that is kept below the level of direct US involvement.

    Ukraine is going to be progressively wrecked and suffer permanent loss of population from emigration, but that is a price America is willing to pay in order to weaken Russia. Lloyd Austin said quite openly that weakening Russia was the US objective. That is working with Putin who is too sanguine about the prospects of military success, but I think a successor would quite possibly decide to terminate the war, and threaten to use nuclear weapons on Ukraine if America kept it going. Putin probably ought to do that now, but he remains focused on America's cat's paw (Ukraine), which as long as it keeps fighting the US does not care about. Currently Russia is like a frog in a pot having the heat tuned up so fiendishly slowly that it passively allows itself to be boiled alive.

    Replies: @QCIC, @Greasy William

    I think Russia is still intentionally chewing through the Ukrainian armed forces so the eventual recovery to civilian order will be more manageable.

    I think the most likely situation for a nuclear weapon to be used militarily short of WW3 is an attack on a nuclear-armed submarine which snuck into some place it should not be. Applies to all players. The risk of escalation might be very high.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @QCIC

    Emmanuel Todd seems to think Russia's emphasis on mass production and effect allied to its hard science ephasis and lack of bullshit jobs inflating the GDP means America will fail in Ukraine in the long term. However, pace Todd I think Putin understood certain constraints required a quick resolution of the Ukraine operation. That was the plan.

    The USSR's military strategy always planned while assuming that America has the most complex (adaptable) and powerful productive capacity in the world, which could not be beat in a lengthy conventional war. The current war in Ukraine is a proxy one, but the old certainties still hold true. There are no more ex Soviet tanks, artillery or aircraft available in pro-Western countries to donate to Ukraine so they are going to have to be given F16s Abrams and Paladins eventually. The alternative would be to let Russia gain an absolute victory, which would be politial disaster for whoever was in the White House.

    According to retired German general Erich Vad" If the war drags on, with no diplomatic effort emerging, if—as some believe was possible—Russia’s positions should become untenable under the buildup of Western weapons in Ukrain, the danger of sliding into a nuclear strike ... would become imminent."

    The peril referred to is not really WW3 complete with nuclear exchanges (America is not going to fight that over Ukraine), but the victory of Russia. Putin is not impulsive, quite the opposite, but eventually he will realise with the SMI he bought a one way ticket--only one way to go. If you ignore all the fanfaronade and just look at the war, it becomes clear that Putin has to take a risk to win, because otherwise Russia will be humiliated.

    Replies: @Greasy William

  256. @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack

    Out of step? What are you some kind of marching fascist? The promises are almost completely worthless, none of it will come to fruition - it is a desperate signal by our collapsed comprador gment. Why do you always take vague verbal promises seriously? Like the German tanks in 2024...sure, that's what will make a difference.

    What matters is what is happening now: Ukies are dying in large numbers to defend places that they don't plan to keep, and the Ukie economy is down 40-50%...so who is experiencing an economic ruin? Do you have any sense of proportion or understanding numbers? It is just emotional posturing by you to hide from reality.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Ukrainian soldiers on the front lines continuously state that they are dying to protect their lands from uninvited enemies. What are the Russian soldiers fighting for? Convicts who make it 6 months get furloughed. Chechens following orders (and getting decimated left and right). Hipsters in Moscow, like Karlin, extolling the virtues of imperialism, while safely ensconced in their coffee house culture. And you? Truly out of step with your Slovakian neighbors who seem eager to help their Ukrainian neighbors!

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack


    ...Ukrainian soldiers on the front lines continuously state that they are dying
     
    I am skeptical of these 'statements', people are not like that. But there is probably a fairly broad spectrum of views. What matters in the long run is that these sacrifices are unnecessary - there is no gain for the soldiers in it, Kiev will not control those areas, so why die for it? My understanding is that Kiev has exactly the same convict-fight-for-your-release program, both sides do what they can.

    You are badly out of step from what the actual thinking is about Ukraine among its neighbors. You must be watching the fanatically propagandized Western media - they are lying to you. The attitudes to the war are more nuanced and realistic, the pathetic chest-beating is done by a few clowns. But I won't convince you, only the reality will...so wait for your victory, or get ready to bad-mouth the loss as "Pyrrhic" or temporary...we have been watching the neo-con morons predicting and lying for the last 15-20 years - remember the "they will never pacify the Chechens...", "they are dying out", "Russian economy is a gas station it will collapse"...those are idiotic statements, I fully expect more of them as the project of Nato-Ukraine-without-any-Russians collapses...

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    , @Wokechoke
    @Mr. Hack

    Ukies are the people of the Dneiper & Bug and the Russians are the people of the Don & Volga. The Germans are the people of the Rhine & Elbe. Poles are People of the Vistula. The Danube is quite complex though. It's split between Germans, Hungarians. Serbs and Romanians.


    The complication is that the Don and Dnieper go to the Sea on each side of the Crimea.

  257. @Barbarossa
    @Mikel

    The most reliable facts that I can determine around the homeless problem are that drugs and mental illness are almost always involved, usually in a symbiotic relationship.
    I've heard this consistently from several sources, most recently from my brother who lives in Oregon and has a friend in Portland's social services, and it seems like a good place to start.

    It's a chicken or egg problem of course and it's hard to tell where the causation may be compared to other factors like high cost of housing.

    A lot of it really does seem to stem from closing down all the mental facilities in the US. A lot of people who would have previously been institutionalized are now wandering the streets.

    https://mentalillnesspolicy.org/consequences/homeless-mentally-ill.html

    I'd love to find nationwide data since the 70's on homeless population, but this is the closest I could turn up so far. Overall, it seems that homelessness found it's nadir in the 50's and 60's but began to climb again since the 70's.

    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-qZxOTemZyJY/WC6gwJZKwoI/AAAAAAABAac/B3T0cTLTNkgnQLVn3g-zdK9m8yUagh9nwCLcB/s1600/chart.jpg

    It seems to me that Dmitry paints a rather idealized picture of the homeless. My overwhelming impression is that they are most often profoundly dysfunctional and troubled people, perhaps in many cases not malevolent just very disturbed.

    Whatever the causes, the rise of homeless populations indicate some profoundly basic failings of society in general to function for and provide basic functionality for an increasing number of people. I don't think it's possible to just dismiss homelessness as a personal moral failing as AP seems to do.

    My gut feeling, for whatever it's worth, says that the numbers of homeless will continue to explode over the next few years as the fallout and instability from Covid financial policy knock a great number of the precarious population out of solvency.

    Replies: @AP, @Mikel, @S, @Philip Owen

    Drugs, mental illness and childhood in an institution – foster care, orphange – followed by army (not naval or airforce) service.

  258. @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow

    Ukrainian soldiers on the front lines continuously state that they are dying to protect their lands from uninvited enemies. What are the Russian soldiers fighting for? Convicts who make it 6 months get furloughed. Chechens following orders (and getting decimated left and right). Hipsters in Moscow, like Karlin, extolling the virtues of imperialism, while safely ensconced in their coffee house culture. And you? Truly out of step with your Slovakian neighbors who seem eager to help their Ukrainian neighbors!

    Replies: @Beckow, @Wokechoke

    …Ukrainian soldiers on the front lines continuously state that they are dying

    I am skeptical of these ‘statements‘, people are not like that. But there is probably a fairly broad spectrum of views. What matters in the long run is that these sacrifices are unnecessary – there is no gain for the soldiers in it, Kiev will not control those areas, so why die for it? My understanding is that Kiev has exactly the same convict-fight-for-your-release program, both sides do what they can.

    You are badly out of step from what the actual thinking is about Ukraine among its neighbors. You must be watching the fanatically propagandized Western media – they are lying to you. The attitudes to the war are more nuanced and realistic, the pathetic chest-beating is done by a few clowns. But I won’t convince you, only the reality will…so wait for your victory, or get ready to bad-mouth the loss as “Pyrrhic” or temporary…we have been watching the neo-con morons predicting and lying for the last 15-20 years – remember the “they will never pacify the Chechens…”, “they are dying out”, “Russian economy is a gas station it will collapse”…those are idiotic statements, I fully expect more of them as the project of Nato-Ukraine-without-any-Russians collapses…

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    You are badly out of step from what the actual thinking is about Ukraine among its neighbors. You must be watching the fanatically propagandized Western media – they are lying to you.
     
    I don't think so. The winner of this war will be the one that has clearer access to weapons and ammunition, not to the empty chest beating of a known Russian cheerleader like you, who for some reason has an unwarranted attachment to the former Soviet Union. Here's a list of Ukraine's neighbors that are providing more than pure lip service to Ukraine, but are backing up their intents with real support. This doesn't even include the massive amount of support from the US, Canada and other countries outside of the European continent. Can you provide a similar list of countries helping to provide much needed supplies to Russia? It's well known fact that Russia is seriously in need of military supplies needed to supply its war efforts. Where's it going to come from?

    https://i0.wp.com/epthinktank.eu/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/EPRS-AaG-729431-Delivery-weapons-military-aid-Ukraine-FINAL.png?fit=1024%2C617&ssl=1

  259. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    If you meant the great "Excalibur" of 1981, Mary on shield would be inappropriate since the movie was almost totally pagan (there was just one Celtic-Christian ceremony) through and through, as stressed by its Wagnerian music. Arthur there was clearly the protegee of the Lady of the Lake, not of Mary:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Ll4qS4anGo

    The plate armour was overdone but its clanks made the movie more gritty...Overall, the movie was a self-contained work of art.

    Replies: @Philip Owen, @songbird

    The scence where the knights galloped through the apple blossom was divine. The spirit of Avalon.

  260. @songbird
    @S


    Was the movie they were reviewing Braveheart by chance?
     
    It was actually Dragonslayer (1981, never saw it), so I guess there was an element of fantasy in it too, which maybe makes it even stranger? I don't know.
    If you are interested in it, then you can see it here at about 3:48:
    https://youtu.be/ZRjCwd0y-OQ

    Replies: @S, @Philip Owen

    Dragonslayer was full of wry humour. It didn’t take itself seriously and was good for that.

    • Thanks: songbird
  261. @S
    @Barbarossa


    The most reliable facts that I can determine around the homeless problem are that drugs and mental illness are almost always involved, usually in a symbiotic relationship....A lot of it really does seem to stem from closing down all the mental facilities in the US. A lot of people who would have previously been institutionalized are now wandering the streets.
     
    I tend to agree with you, very much so.

    Untreated mental illness is a huge problem, not 'just' in the US of course, but globally. I believe that this is something, should it continue on the seemingly downward path as it appears to be on now, which has the potential to present an existential crisis to the whole of humanity at some point.

    I believe the catastrophic situation in today's mental health realm is quite comparable to where the catastrophic state of physical health was in the mid 19th century and prior, where the doctors of the human body (such as they were at the time) were simply overwhelmed, their primitive 'treatments' too often ineffective, or, too late, and the physical damage upon their patient's bodies which they were attempting to repair simply too severe, and too complex, for them to overcome in a great many (majority of?) instances.

    If a person reads the personal biographies of many a historic person, rich or poor, unexpected early deaths were quite common through the early 20th century.

    Simon Bolivar for instance, the 'liberator of [South] America', married a wealthy young woman of about 20, who died within mere months of the marriage of Yellow Fever, a loss of which in certain ways he never quite recovered from, and he would never remarry.

    This type of thing was not uncommon. And while it might not be exactly correct to say people were 'dying like flies' before the 20th century due to untreated physical ailments, it was not too far from the truth, and it's amazing the society of that time functioned at all with the major social disruption resulting from the plethora of ineffectively treated physical health ailments.

    It was ultimately the preventive measures of the great public health campaigns, an ounce of prevention being worth a pound of cure, such as ensuring clean water, clean food, vitamins, exercize, inoculation/vaccination against disease, spraying for mosquitos, that finally turned the tide in physical health.

    I believe that likewise, should humanity live long enough, that it will also be preventive measures which overcome the severe present day (and past) problem of untreated mental illness/mental health problems, of which our present day overwhelmed doctors of the human mind, like the overwhelmed physical doctors of yesteryear, are simply unable to effectively and successfully deal with and overcome.

    One such critically important preventive measure in the mental health realm, indeed a basic necessity, comparable to the basic necessity of ensuring clean water in the physical, is that if a child is born, going to heroic lengths to ensure it receive unconditional love and a gentle (but firm) moral guiding hand while growing up into his or her majority.

    That, alone, would almost certainly result in a vast improvement in the realm of mental health.

    But, does any people, or, humanity as a whole, have the political will to follow the path of prevention in the realm of mental health? Will any people, let alone humanity, survive in any recognizable or viable form, if it doesn't act in this area?

    Replies: @S, @Miro23

    One such critically important preventive measure in the mental health realm, indeed a basic necessity, comparable to the basic necessity of ensuring clean water in the physical, is that if a child is born, going to heroic lengths to ensure it receive unconditional love and a gentle (but firm) moral guiding hand while growing up into his or her majority.

    There’s a lot more along this line like having married parents with enough income but not overworked, and a similar surrounding community with friends, common values and outdoor physical activity. Quality merit based education including basic teaching of ethics.

    It was possible in the 1950’s through the US being world’s leading manufacturing nation.

    If there are no decent jobs or incomes, there are broken marriages (or no marriages), broken children, drug addiction and a host of other social problems. The situation today.

    So then the future of the US depended on intensive efforts in research and education to retain its world lead in industry and avoid being “financialized” as Henry Ford repeatedly pointed out as early as 1920. But, of course, the US was financialized, de-industrialized with the results he predicted. Maybe even worse than he could have imagined. And once the skills and supplier networks have gone re-industrialization becomes next to impossible.

    • Thanks: S
    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Miro23


    ...US was financialized, de-industrialized with the results Ford predicted...once the skills and supplier networks have gone re-industrialization becomes next to impossible.
     
    It is the latest example of the unavoidable "Dutch disease": successful and admired countries end up with a massively overvalued currency and economic activity gravitates away from actual production to financial and real estate (assets) speculation.

    US has tens of millions of people who spent their "work lives" selling stuff to each other that nobody needs - mostly on the phone. It is not an economy that can justify its current living standards. The material consumption for the masses has been sustained by over-valued dollar, military aggression, willingness of China (and others) to provide the cheap goods, open borders that act as an endless pyramid scheme, and the general acquiescence of the rest of the world.

    It has ended with a stupid imperial over-reach into Ukraine - a bridge too far. The local enemy (Russia) is too powerful and will not roll over. Something similar happened to previous empires - they expanded until they reached their match. There is no way to restore the stability now - it will slowly disintegrate.

    The idiotic plan to create a Nato-Ukraine was so stupid and unlikely to work that one wonders how it could have gone on...the explanation is that the leaders in Washington-London are not very smart, they are the natural result of inbred careerism - of education that rewards agreeable people. It will take a while, but US has peaked...it will painfully retrace the steps on the way up going down to its more natural level.

    Replies: @Miro23, @QCIC

  262. @Talha
    @Yahya

    Assalaamu alaikum Bro,

    I was just checking in on UNZ to see how '23 has started. Pretty crazy couple of years, eh? Hope you are doing well and hope 2023 is full of barakah for you and your family.

    I am seeing pictures of Saudi where it is turning green...satellite images and photos from brothers that have recently returned from Umrah. Syed ul-Kawnain (saws) predicted that the land of Arabia would "return to meadows" (Hatta ta'ooda arD ul'Arabi muroojan)...the last time it was green was around th Ice Age or so...how did he know this? I hope you can report back on your next trip there inshaAllah.

    I saw you posted an email address, I will email you - let me know if you are coming to Chicago Shareef anytime, I'll show you around inshaAllah.

    I saw a headline that they are sending HIMARS to Ukraine intedning them as a game changer...who knew donkeys could be so useful in modern combat.

    Remember to keep your eyes firmly on The Prize/Beloved...as Shaykh Murabit al-Hajj (ra) said:
    "And what is man other than a comet that flashes brilliant light for a moment only to be reduced to ashes."

    "O mankind, what has seduced you from your Lord, Most Generous?" (82:6)

    @Greasy - you stinky Zionist, I hope you are doing well also and 2023 is better for you than the last year. Have you found a Ms. Greasy yet?

    @songbird - Vermithrax Pejorative was the greatest dragon in the history of cinema, prove me wrong.

    Hoping for a good/blessed 2023 for the rest of you as well.

    Wa salaam!

    Replies: @Greasy William

    Have you found a Ms. Greasy yet?

    I wouldn’t hold your breath on that one

    • Replies: @Talha
    @Greasy William

    Well, if you are going to hang around certain message boards for a good amount of your day, you’re about likely to catch fish as casting your net in desert. Keep that up and I’ll be on wife #2 before you’ve hit the big 1. Maybe start hanging around places where the male to female ratio is more in your favor? You know your mother would agree with me; don’t you want to make her proud?

    Make it your 2023 resolution.

    Peace.

  263. This is an interesting video regarding ancient Egyptian DNA. He simply reports what they’ve found, letting the chips fall where they may.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @S

    This never-ending controversy over what the “Ancient Egyptians looked like” is silly and contrived.

    It’s perfectly obvious they looked like Celts.

    https://youtu.be/2i6Ss0D4e7k

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  264. @Miro23
    @S


    One such critically important preventive measure in the mental health realm, indeed a basic necessity, comparable to the basic necessity of ensuring clean water in the physical, is that if a child is born, going to heroic lengths to ensure it receive unconditional love and a gentle (but firm) moral guiding hand while growing up into his or her majority.

     

    There's a lot more along this line like having married parents with enough income but not overworked, and a similar surrounding community with friends, common values and outdoor physical activity. Quality merit based education including basic teaching of ethics.

    It was possible in the 1950's through the US being world's leading manufacturing nation.

    If there are no decent jobs or incomes, there are broken marriages (or no marriages), broken children, drug addiction and a host of other social problems. The situation today.

    So then the future of the US depended on intensive efforts in research and education to retain its world lead in industry and avoid being "financialized" as Henry Ford repeatedly pointed out as early as 1920. But, of course, the US was financialized, de-industrialized with the results he predicted. Maybe even worse than he could have imagined. And once the skills and supplier networks have gone re-industrialization becomes next to impossible.

    Replies: @Beckow

    …US was financialized, de-industrialized with the results Ford predicted…once the skills and supplier networks have gone re-industrialization becomes next to impossible.

    It is the latest example of the unavoidable “Dutch disease“: successful and admired countries end up with a massively overvalued currency and economic activity gravitates away from actual production to financial and real estate (assets) speculation.

    US has tens of millions of people who spent their “work lives” selling stuff to each other that nobody needs – mostly on the phone. It is not an economy that can justify its current living standards. The material consumption for the masses has been sustained by over-valued dollar, military aggression, willingness of China (and others) to provide the cheap goods, open borders that act as an endless pyramid scheme, and the general acquiescence of the rest of the world.

    It has ended with a stupid imperial over-reach into Ukraine – a bridge too far. The local enemy (Russia) is too powerful and will not roll over. Something similar happened to previous empires – they expanded until they reached their match. There is no way to restore the stability now – it will slowly disintegrate.

    The idiotic plan to create a Nato-Ukraine was so stupid and unlikely to work that one wonders how it could have gone on…the explanation is that the leaders in Washington-London are not very smart, they are the natural result of inbred careerism – of education that rewards agreeable people. It will take a while, but US has peaked…it will painfully retrace the steps on the way up going down to its more natural level.

    • Replies: @Miro23
    @Beckow


    It will take a while, but US has peaked…it will painfully retrace the steps that on the way up as it goes down to its natural level.

     

    Agree with that, and an interesting question is what is its natural level?

    If the US started its relative decline in the 1970's - with acceleration in the 1980's as digitalization enabled outsourcing and de-industrialization - then other countries were the mirror image, such as South Korea, Taiwan and China. Maybe they gained socially and economically at the same rate that the US declined (albeit cushioned by massive debt issuance).

    If they continue doing what they're doing right and the US continues doing what it's doing wrong, then you would expect that they would continue to rise, and the US would continue to decline, same as at present. When the US has exhausted its inherited wealth (and thrown away most of its skills) then it's on its way to being a market for only the cheapest Asian junk.

    Replies: @Beckow

    , @QCIC
    @Beckow

    I think it makes more sense if we fold in the idea that some of the impetus for the Ukraine meddling is to reclaim and reimagine the Pale of Settlement.

    Also, I have learned the Russia hatred is very strong in some people and trumps the practical calculations of risk and reward.

  265. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    If you meant the great "Excalibur" of 1981, Mary on shield would be inappropriate since the movie was almost totally pagan (there was just one Celtic-Christian ceremony) through and through, as stressed by its Wagnerian music. Arthur there was clearly the protegee of the Lady of the Lake, not of Mary:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Ll4qS4anGo

    The plate armour was overdone but its clanks made the movie more gritty...Overall, the movie was a self-contained work of art.

    Replies: @Philip Owen, @songbird

    Well, I wouldn’t want to shoe-horn faith into someone else’s vision.

    But I think that we got to remember that Boorman was the guy who directed Deliverance. (NOT the type of guy I would want writing or directing a King Arthur Film.) I don’t think he had any nationalistic feeling or a moral vision. His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)

    If Boorman got some things right, I consider it more like an accident.

    [MORE]

    Personally, I believe that the story of King Arthur is best represented by a fusionism of the pagan with the Christian, and I believe it damages it when we disregard the latter element. Maybe, we should reach for a Celtic Church moral center for it, but I just don’t think that Boorman had that in him.

    The trouble today is that we have lost nearly all trace of pagan moralism in Europe. There is not code of it, or authority, and it is liable to be hijacked by irreligious feminists, who the druids probably would have burnt at the stake.

    If you really want a good Euro pagan story to adopt to screen that would be the Táin Bó Cúailnge which was written down by the lineal descendants of the same elites who had previously been pagan.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)
     
    His paganism is simply aesthetic. He builds "Excalibur" as a history of Uther Pendragon family, not just Arthur, but Morgana too. It is pretty pagan in itself, since paganism elevated kinship more than Christianity.

    Who is MZB?


    Personally, I believe that the story of King Arthur is best represented by a fusionism of the pagan with the Christian, and I believe it damages it when we disregard the latter element.
     
    Where do you see this potential for development of Christian element...? It is a story of magic, not of exorcism.

    The trouble today is that we have lost nearly all trace of pagan moralism in Europe. There is not code of it, or authority, and it is liable to be hijacked by irreligious feminists, who the druids probably would have burnt at the stake.
     
    The lack of developed doctrine was always a deficiency of paganism. You just worshipped gods because they were your gods (with some exception of later cults like Mithraism) in rather narcisstic way. Maybe when God confused languages at Babel, his opponent created a cult for every language: Hermes Trismegistos was a god with thousand faces, after all.

    As for women, since the older pagan societies were often matrilineal, unfortunately it looks that their status could have been quite elevated, especially in religions of the Great Goddess. In no religion women pretended to be men, but in some cults men pretended to be women, like priests of Kybele (Galli), which again points to the fact that women, not men, were the point of reference. Coming back to "Excalibur", it is therefore not surprising that Morgana, a female, is a powerful witch, which can be only neutered with the help of Graal itself (but not the cross).

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird

    , @S
    @songbird


    But I think that we got to remember that Boorman was the guy who directed Deliverance. (NOT the type of guy I would want writing or directing a King Arthur Film.) I don’t think he had any nationalistic feeling or a moral vision. His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)

    If Boorman got some things right, I consider it more like an accident.
     
    Boorman also directed the 1974 film Zardoz in Ireland, where I believe he made his home. The film had a lot of Irish extras. Boorman's comment about the young women extras was that he found it difficult to coerce them into exposing their breasts for his film.

    I respect their modesty, even if he didn't.

    Replies: @songbird

  266. @Yevardian
    @Sher Singh

    Don't know if this post was directed at me or not, and perhaps probably only German_Reader would be interested (I missed replying to his booklist over the holidays), but I'm finishing reading a PHD thesis on Armenian Zoroastrianism at the moment.

    As an aside, its long been recognised that Zoroastrianism had a huge influence on the development of Biblical Judaism during the Achaemenid period, but it's often overlooked that the (more authoritative) Babylonian Talmud was compiled within the later Sasanid Empire, or the role Jews played in the last Persian-Roman War.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Sher Singh

    missed replying to his booklist over the holidays),

    iirc you also stated that you would write a year-end book review; still waiting on that.

    I watched quite a few movies from the Russian/Soviet directors you mentioned. I stated previously that Aleksy German’s Seventh Companion is an excellent movie; which I consider among my top 15 favorites. Didn’t like some of his later, highly-lauded movies; absurdist nonsense. Tarkovsky: watched three of his films, of which Solaris was the best; though I thought it had the potential to be even better had he avoided arthouse techniques and boring romantic scenes. Nostalgia was the worst, pretentious bore-fest.

  267. @Beckow
    @Miro23


    ...US was financialized, de-industrialized with the results Ford predicted...once the skills and supplier networks have gone re-industrialization becomes next to impossible.
     
    It is the latest example of the unavoidable "Dutch disease": successful and admired countries end up with a massively overvalued currency and economic activity gravitates away from actual production to financial and real estate (assets) speculation.

    US has tens of millions of people who spent their "work lives" selling stuff to each other that nobody needs - mostly on the phone. It is not an economy that can justify its current living standards. The material consumption for the masses has been sustained by over-valued dollar, military aggression, willingness of China (and others) to provide the cheap goods, open borders that act as an endless pyramid scheme, and the general acquiescence of the rest of the world.

    It has ended with a stupid imperial over-reach into Ukraine - a bridge too far. The local enemy (Russia) is too powerful and will not roll over. Something similar happened to previous empires - they expanded until they reached their match. There is no way to restore the stability now - it will slowly disintegrate.

    The idiotic plan to create a Nato-Ukraine was so stupid and unlikely to work that one wonders how it could have gone on...the explanation is that the leaders in Washington-London are not very smart, they are the natural result of inbred careerism - of education that rewards agreeable people. It will take a while, but US has peaked...it will painfully retrace the steps on the way up going down to its more natural level.

    Replies: @Miro23, @QCIC

    It will take a while, but US has peaked…it will painfully retrace the steps that on the way up as it goes down to its natural level.

    Agree with that, and an interesting question is what is its natural level?

    If the US started its relative decline in the 1970’s – with acceleration in the 1980’s as digitalization enabled outsourcing and de-industrialization – then other countries were the mirror image, such as South Korea, Taiwan and China. Maybe they gained socially and economically at the same rate that the US declined (albeit cushioned by massive debt issuance).

    If they continue doing what they’re doing right and the US continues doing what it’s doing wrong, then you would expect that they would continue to rise, and the US would continue to decline, same as at present. When the US has exhausted its inherited wealth (and thrown away most of its skills) then it’s on its way to being a market for only the cheapest Asian junk.

    • Agree: Barbarossa
    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Miro23


    ...what is its natural level?
     
    Good question, it probably varies over time and how successful other societies are. US had two recent peaks: first in 50's-70's based on the global post-WW2 exhaustion, and in the 90's based on the unexpected windfall from the collapsing communist societies - China handled its commie collapse by offering extremely cheap goods to the West (US). It was ending anyway, US has been in an economic downturn since 2008.

    US is naturally a very wealthy country in land-resources with the ability to command skills from other parts of the world. It has English - a huge cultural advantage. But the quality of people has dropped dramatically and the massive ongoing immigration is not helping. Do you think that the poorly educated, wokeness-infested, swarthy-short-fat-emasculated-gender confused younger Americans can fix it? Not bloody likely...

    The more natural level of US consumption would be slightly above Argentina or more advanced parts of Asia. Something like US in the 1920's or 1900's: rich, comfortable, but not dominant. Even today on paper an American has 6-times the GDP/capita of a Chinese - but is that really true? is the Chinese really consuming 6 times less in housing, education, health care, goodies, food, travel...? Of course not, it is an artificial multiplier of an over-valued dollar and counting a huge number of 'economic activities' that don't add to actual consumption (US is good at churning and counting things).

    But I still think US will do better than Europe - the resources and geography are just so much better. Europe is mostly f...ed and they only have themselves to blame.

    Replies: @AP, @Miro23

  268. @S
    This is an interesting video regarding ancient Egyptian DNA. He simply reports what they've found, letting the chips fall where they may.

    https://youtu.be/oh3y4FydRNU

    Replies: @Yahya

    This never-ending controversy over what the “Ancient Egyptians looked like” is silly and contrived.

    It’s perfectly obvious they looked like Celts.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    There is certainly some mystery going around how "Ancient Egyptians looked like" since on Egyptian frescos women are yellow, and men are red/brown (even pharaohs, so this is not simply a matter of working in the sun). The reason for this distinction is not known, but maybe Egyptians were once a mixed race in reality (and parts were shown through colours, so to say), or in some religious sense (like yin and yang maybe).

    Replies: @Yahya

  269. @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Well, I wouldn't want to shoe-horn faith into someone else's vision.

    But I think that we got to remember that Boorman was the guy who directed Deliverance. (NOT the type of guy I would want writing or directing a King Arthur Film.) I don't think he had any nationalistic feeling or a moral vision. His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)

    If Boorman got some things right, I consider it more like an accident.

    Personally, I believe that the story of King Arthur is best represented by a fusionism of the pagan with the Christian, and I believe it damages it when we disregard the latter element. Maybe, we should reach for a Celtic Church moral center for it, but I just don't think that Boorman had that in him.

    The trouble today is that we have lost nearly all trace of pagan moralism in Europe. There is not code of it, or authority, and it is liable to be hijacked by irreligious feminists, who the druids probably would have burnt at the stake.

    If you really want a good Euro pagan story to adopt to screen that would be the Táin Bó Cúailnge which was written down by the lineal descendants of the same elites who had previously been pagan.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @S

    His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)

    His paganism is simply aesthetic. He builds “Excalibur” as a history of Uther Pendragon family, not just Arthur, but Morgana too. It is pretty pagan in itself, since paganism elevated kinship more than Christianity.

    Who is MZB?

    Personally, I believe that the story of King Arthur is best represented by a fusionism of the pagan with the Christian, and I believe it damages it when we disregard the latter element.

    Where do you see this potential for development of Christian element…? It is a story of magic, not of exorcism.

    The trouble today is that we have lost nearly all trace of pagan moralism in Europe. There is not code of it, or authority, and it is liable to be hijacked by irreligious feminists, who the druids probably would have burnt at the stake.

    The lack of developed doctrine was always a deficiency of paganism. You just worshipped gods because they were your gods (with some exception of later cults like Mithraism) in rather narcisstic way. Maybe when God confused languages at Babel, his opponent created a cult for every language: Hermes Trismegistos was a god with thousand faces, after all.

    As for women, since the older pagan societies were often matrilineal, unfortunately it looks that their status could have been quite elevated, especially in religions of the Great Goddess. In no religion women pretended to be men, but in some cults men pretended to be women, like priests of Kybele (Galli), which again points to the fact that women, not men, were the point of reference. Coming back to “Excalibur”, it is therefore not surprising that Morgana, a female, is a powerful witch, which can be only neutered with the help of Graal itself (but not the cross).

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Another Polish Perspective

    MZB= Marion Zimmer Bradley?

    Mists Avalon; 1980's feminist Arthur &c. Girl on girl action!

    , @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective


    It is a story of magic, not of exorcism.
     
    The tale of Camelot is fundamentally about knights and chivalry, and includes ideas like protecting the weak and staying true to your love. In a romantic, or even an historical sense, these things are inseparable from Christianity, which is underlined by the fact that Medieval Europe then called itself "Christendom."

    Show me a pagan knight. There were none! And the most famous individual knights like Godfrey of Bouillon or Geoffroi de Charny were pious men. Meanwhile, the most famous groups of knights were religious orders, like the Templar and the Knights of St. John.

    In Monmouth, Arthur says “… I, who remain faithful to my God… with the help of Christ." He was rallying his troops.

    Why put the Christian elements in, beyond reasons of authenticity? For the reasons they were there originally - to inspire.

    Anyway, you might as well try to depict a samurai while cutting out Zen. I'm sure it can be done, but all it would do is show modernism creeping in.

    Who is MZB?
     
    Marion Zimmer Bradley. She wrote The Mysts of Avalon. Plays up the pagan angle. Really feminist and consequently pretty trashy. IIRC, at one point Guenevere is in bed with both Arthur and Lancelot, and it is hinted that they are both gay.

    She was a bestselling author, but it has come out that she married a pedophile (which really makes her a weirdo), and helped him abuse their children.

    Anyway, I think it takes a moral person to tell the tale properly. A Believer or at least someone who values Christianity. Not someone like Boorman, MZB, or Guy Ritchie (who should be disqualified for marrying Madonna alone).

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  270. @Miro23
    @Beckow


    It will take a while, but US has peaked…it will painfully retrace the steps that on the way up as it goes down to its natural level.

     

    Agree with that, and an interesting question is what is its natural level?

    If the US started its relative decline in the 1970's - with acceleration in the 1980's as digitalization enabled outsourcing and de-industrialization - then other countries were the mirror image, such as South Korea, Taiwan and China. Maybe they gained socially and economically at the same rate that the US declined (albeit cushioned by massive debt issuance).

    If they continue doing what they're doing right and the US continues doing what it's doing wrong, then you would expect that they would continue to rise, and the US would continue to decline, same as at present. When the US has exhausted its inherited wealth (and thrown away most of its skills) then it's on its way to being a market for only the cheapest Asian junk.

    Replies: @Beckow

    …what is its natural level?

    Good question, it probably varies over time and how successful other societies are. US had two recent peaks: first in 50’s-70’s based on the global post-WW2 exhaustion, and in the 90’s based on the unexpected windfall from the collapsing communist societies – China handled its commie collapse by offering extremely cheap goods to the West (US). It was ending anyway, US has been in an economic downturn since 2008.

    US is naturally a very wealthy country in land-resources with the ability to command skills from other parts of the world. It has English – a huge cultural advantage. But the quality of people has dropped dramatically and the massive ongoing immigration is not helping. Do you think that the poorly educated, wokeness-infested, swarthy-short-fat-emasculated-gender confused younger Americans can fix it? Not bloody likely…

    The more natural level of US consumption would be slightly above Argentina or more advanced parts of Asia. Something like US in the 1920’s or 1900’s: rich, comfortable, but not dominant. Even today on paper an American has 6-times the GDP/capita of a Chinese – but is that really true? is the Chinese really consuming 6 times less in housing, education, health care, goodies, food, travel…? Of course not, it is an artificial multiplier of an over-valued dollar and counting a huge number of ‘economic activities’ that don’t add to actual consumption (US is good at churning and counting things).

    But I still think US will do better than Europe – the resources and geography are just so much better. Europe is mostly f…ed and they only have themselves to blame.

    • Replies: @AP
    @Beckow


    Good question, it probably varies over time and how successful other societies are. US had two recent peaks: first in 50’s-70’s based on the global post-WW2 exhaustion, and in the 90’s based on the unexpected windfall from the collapsing communist societies – China handled its commie collapse by offering extremely cheap goods to the West (US).
     
    US peaked when others went to war and America sent weapons. Russia's idiotic invasion of Ukraine will benefit the USA to the detriment of itself and Europe, though this won't be as great for the USA as World War II and the end of the Cold War were.

    Even today on paper an American has 6-times the GDP/capita of a Chinese
     
    One must adjust for cost of living. USA has about 3.5x Chinese GDP/PPP per capita. That sounds about right.

    is the Chinese really consuming 6 times less in housing, education, health care, goodies, food, travel
     
    Chinese live in tiny apartments and don't have much. Americans have 4.5x as many cars per capita as Chinese. Overall spending on consumer goods per capita is a little over 6x more in the USA than in mainland China. That tracks to the nominal GDP. Assuming things are cheaper in China would track with GDP PPP.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_by_household_final_consumption_expenditure_per_capita

    Replies: @Beckow

    , @Miro23
    @Beckow


    US is naturally a very wealthy country in land-resources with the ability to command skills from other parts of the world.

     

    The land helps, but there are resource poor places like Japan that do very well. Also resource rich places like South Africa and Ukraine that are a disaster.

    A useful indicator seems to be world manufacturing leadership.

    In the first part of the 19th century, Great Britain was the world's leading manufacturer (coal, iron , steam power, railways) and at the time was called the "Workshop of the World". Not coincidentally it was the world's leading power.

    In the first part of the 20th century, the United States displaced Britain to become the world's leading manufacturer (mass production, electricity, chemicals, radio, oil, internal combustion engine) and in turn became the world's leading power. There was that challenge from Germany but it was resolved.

    In the first part of the 21st century, China has displaced the US as the "Workshop of the World" and is gathering to itself the consequent wealth and power (Belt and Road Initiative and world trade - commodities and finished goods).

    So China is apparently doing to the US what the US did to Great Britain. Britain's one time "Workshop of the World" (the North of England - Manchester, Birmingham, Leeds, Sheffield and Glasgow, Scotland) still exists but it's a depressed post-industrial wasteland.

    The two great blows that finished Great Britain were WW1 and WW2 so a WW3 could finish with the US. Changes in world manufacturing leadership do seem to lead to changes in world political leadership + produce particularly dangerous times.

    Replies: @Beckow

  271. @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    This is my quarter in Toronto, but I'm used to blacks having an ethnicity, culture etc.
    Ie a lightskin Jamaician is still Jamaican & esp among women skin tone varies

    Those ppl will still side with blacks & just ID as lightskin - they're still anti-white
    Destroying race/one-drop only helps my side since it strengthens caste identity

    The only blacks I've seen mulatto washing work on are from Nova Scotia
    Even then, recent mixes with a black dad tend to ID with the dad

    You're just making it easier for black blood to infiltrate by recognizing mulattos
    The situation is nowhere as bad as you make & I'd go lift, look in the mirror & hit yourself

    Check yourself, you might be developing a cuck complex


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEOKhgGkrog
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oH9savFyn1o

    http://ureachtoronto.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/Toronto-Visible-Minority.png

    White, Brown & Black stay in their quarters even by ethnicity dif Slavs or Indians
    An apartment block might be all Iraqi Christian, next to all Afghans, next to Nigerians

    People aren't ultra-racist just too low iq & apathetic to absorb liberalism
    Terminally online nerd types don't get the avg person gives 0 fucks
    They got bills to pay & grocery to buy

    That map is still more or less accurate - lot of 80% white & 80% non-white areas
    A 1bil police budget + stop-frisk keeps those boundaries

    You're mad wrong on this one, dead wrong
    The entire premise is based on no barriers to mixing

    When there are plenty & while giving up is the Christian thing to do
    We've never accepted the Euro conversion in the first place

    Still hard to find Italians or Croatians willing to out-marry
    You're talking of giving your women away to Mutt-nigger Mulattos LMAO

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Yahya

    Ie a lightskin Jamaician is still Jamaican & esp among women skin tone varies. Those ppl will still side with blacks & just ID as lightskin

    Black, mulatto.

    Potatoe, potato.

    • Agree: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Yahya

    Forgot to mention that Afro-Caucasian hybrids are a good-looking bunch. That's a key difference between them and pure blacks. Attractive "blacks" like Halle Berry and Beyonce are almost invariably admixed.

    I know a Kenyan girl who is as pretty as they come. Initially I assumed she was of Indian descent, but later found out she had a Yemeni father.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @A123, @silviosilver

  272. @Greasy William
    @Hapalong Cassidy

    I just strongly disagree with this. There is no real anti white racism and it would actually be a good thing if there were.

    My entire family are white liberals, some Jewish, some not. And I can say with perfect confidence that they do not hate themselves at all. They hate *you*. But they think very highly of themselves. Further, the overwhelming majority of the people who they idolize are whites (and usually masculine white men, at that): Pelosi, Gates, Biden, Wray, Zelensky (admittedly not very masculine), Newsom, Mueller (not so much any more but they really loved him for a time), Smith and too many others to think about. They love entertainers like Jimmy Fallon, Stephen Colbert and Jimmy Kimmel and they would be apoplectic if any of those guys were forced to give up their shows for a "person of color". They would have race riots if black children were bussed into their own kids schools.

    Real anti white racism would be a good thing because it would hit white liberals the hardest. If you truly hate white liberals, you will support anti white racism.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @S

    There is no real anti white racism and it would actually be a good thing if there were.

    About thirty thousand Black on White rapes year in and year out for decades now in the United States, along with a great many other one sided crimes,, would beg to disagree with you about that. Just because a corrupt corporate media refuses to report it doesn’t change the facts of the matter.

    If by ‘racism’ you mean abuse between peoples, it is the Euro-peoples (ie ‘Whites’) which are the people which are far and away experiencing far more abuse than any other, legally abetted often to boot. I’m not for any of it, whether it’s against others or against my own.

    If one were to individualize the situation, Euros are like a much abused individual who has been locked into a dark closet, only fed poison laced food now and again (ie propaganda) which is slowly but surely killing them, and told they don’t actually really even exist anyhow, except when they do, but then only for bad things, for which they are allowed to leave the closet momentarily now and again to denounce themselves and confess in front of the world.

    This is not about any kind of ‘reparations’, or, about making anyone whole, but is simply about the hatred driven mass rape, murder, and genocide of European peoples in the truest sense of that much abused term.

    And, in time, it is what is intended for most every other people besides.

    The Race War Of Black Against White

    Paul Sheehan – Sydney Morning Herald, May 20, 1995

    ‘The longest war America has ever fought is the Dirty War, and it is not over. It has lasted 30 years so far and claimed more than 25 million victims. It has cost almost as many lives as the Vietnam War. It determined the result of last year’s congressional election.’

    ‘Yet the American news media do not want to talk about the Dirty War, which remains between the lines and unreported. In fact, to even suggest that the war exists is to be discredited. So let’s start suggesting, immediately.’

    ‘No matter how crime figures are massaged by those who want to acknowledge or dispute the existence of a Dirty War, there is nothing ambiguous about what the official statistics portray: for the past 30 years a large segment of black America has waged a war of violent retribution against white America.’

    http://www.heretical.com/miscella/sheehan.html

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @S


    About thirty thousand Black on White rapes year in and year out for decades now in the United States, along with a great many other one sided crimes,, would beg to disagree with you about that. Just because a corrupt corporate media refuses to report it doesn’t change the facts of the matter.
     
    You are conflating crime with genocide. Your statistics are out-of-whack too.

    https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/topic-pages/tables/table-21

    5,412 African-Americans were arrested for rape in 2016, total (not just black-on-white), accounting for 29% of total rapes in the US.

    12,571 White Americans were arrested for rape, accounting for 67% of total rapes. Roughly 3,700 of those were Hispanic, the rest non-Hispanic whites.

    Either you are misinformed, or are lying to reinforce your victim complex.

    Crime is not the same as genocide. If African-Americans are over-represented in rape crimes; it’s because of their higher propensity for violence and lower average impulse control. There is no deliberate plan by a majority of blacks to genocide whites.

    The so-called white genocide is largely self-inflicted; goody white liberals want to virtue-signal their openness and cosmopolitism by opening the doors to foreigners; whose main intent is to improve their standard of living, not genocide whites, you whiny nut.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    , @Greasy William
    @S


    If by ‘racism’ you mean abuse between peoples, it is the Euro-peoples (ie ‘Whites’) which are the people which are far and away experiencing far more abuse than any other, legally abetted often to boot. I’m not for any of it, whether it’s against others or against my own.
     
    By racism I mean racially based antipathy against a group. If you think that Stephen Colbert and Nancy Pelosi hate "whites" as a group, you are totally wrong. These types of people live around and associate almost exclusively with other whites.

    Remember the way the media lost their minds over the illegals being sent to Martha's Vineyard, whereas they never cared about the busloads being sent to NYC or DC? That was because they took it so personally because Martha's Vineyard is something they instinctively see as belonging to them, as white liberals. Remember how Samantha Bee fought tooth and nail to prevent black kids from being allowed to attend her children's school? Do you know any white liberals who wouldn't melt down if section 8 housing was put in their neighborhoods?

    American politics is a (mostly) cold civil war between 2 groups of whites. It's true that the lib group does use non whites in general and blacks in particular against nonlib whites, but I would never describe that as "anti white racism".

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @S

  273. @Yahya
    @S

    This never-ending controversy over what the “Ancient Egyptians looked like” is silly and contrived.

    It’s perfectly obvious they looked like Celts.

    https://youtu.be/2i6Ss0D4e7k

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    There is certainly some mystery going around how “Ancient Egyptians looked like” since on Egyptian frescos women are yellow, and men are red/brown (even pharaohs, so this is not simply a matter of working in the sun). The reason for this distinction is not known, but maybe Egyptians were once a mixed race in reality (and parts were shown through colours, so to say), or in some religious sense (like yin and yang maybe).

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    There is certainly some mystery going around how “Ancient Egyptians looked like” since on Egyptian frescos women are yellow, and men are red/brown (even pharaohs, so this is not simply a matter of working in the sun). The reason for this distinction is not known,
     
    It's only a "mystery" to outsiders who are unfamiliar with Middle Eastern phenotypes. Especially American ignoramuses who project their racial dichotomies (white/black) onto the Middle East. Everywhere in the Middle East, from Egypt to Iran, there is a duality of skin colors; some are brown and others are off-white; this holds true for peoples within the same ethno-religious group or even within the same family. The relative ratio of brown-to-white differs by class, ethnicity and region; in Egypt it tilts more brown than white.

    This is Onsi Sawiris, patriarch of the wealthy Coptic Sawiris family:

    https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iVfFqC1.NSmw/v0/-1x-1.jpg

    This is his son Nassif:


    https://answersafrica.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Nassef-and-Sherine-Magar-Sawiris.jpg


    Same family, ethnicity and race/genetics - different skin color.

    Ancient Egyptian appearances are not a mystery to me; they look like modern Egyptians. The tomb paintings are readily recognizable to any Egyptian; the human brain is fairly good at facial recognition and can identify similarities in facial structures between paintings and real life individuals. I've written several posts on Egyptian genetics and phenotypes:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/egyptians-angry-at-kevin-hart-for-being-an-afrocentrist/#comment-5729767

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-170/#comment-5055550

    Though there are no studies on this; it's been my experience that Egyptian women are lighter on average than men, though with significant overlap. This would explain the tomb frescoes; though it should be noted that Ancient Egyptian women were depicted as both brown and yellow/white:

    https://www.veniceclayartists.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/detail-of-a-wall-painting-in-the-tomb-of-Queen-Nefertari.-Isis-Hathor-leads-the-queen-by-the-hand..jpg

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  274. @Greasy William
    @Talha


    Have you found a Ms. Greasy yet?
     
    I wouldn't hold your breath on that one

    Replies: @Talha

    Well, if you are going to hang around certain message boards for a good amount of your day, you’re about likely to catch fish as casting your net in desert. Keep that up and I’ll be on wife #2 before you’ve hit the big 1. Maybe start hanging around places where the male to female ratio is more in your favor? You know your mother would agree with me; don’t you want to make her proud?

    Make it your 2023 resolution.

    Peace.

  275. @QCIC
    @Sean

    I think Russia is still intentionally chewing through the Ukrainian armed forces so the eventual recovery to civilian order will be more manageable.

    I think the most likely situation for a nuclear weapon to be used militarily short of WW3 is an attack on a nuclear-armed submarine which snuck into some place it should not be. Applies to all players. The risk of escalation might be very high.

    Replies: @Sean

    Emmanuel Todd seems to think Russia’s emphasis on mass production and effect allied to its hard science ephasis and lack of bullshit jobs inflating the GDP means America will fail in Ukraine in the long term. However, pace Todd I think Putin understood certain constraints required a quick resolution of the Ukraine operation. That was the plan.

    The USSR’s military strategy always planned while assuming that America has the most complex (adaptable) and powerful productive capacity in the world, which could not be beat in a lengthy conventional war. The current war in Ukraine is a proxy one, but the old certainties still hold true. There are no more ex Soviet tanks, artillery or aircraft available in pro-Western countries to donate to Ukraine so they are going to have to be given F16s Abrams and Paladins eventually. The alternative would be to let Russia gain an absolute victory, which would be politial disaster for whoever was in the White House.

    According to retired German general Erich Vad” If the war drags on, with no diplomatic effort emerging, if—as some believe was possible—Russia’s positions should become untenable under the buildup of Western weapons in Ukrain, the danger of sliding into a nuclear strike … would become imminent.”

    The peril referred to is not really WW3 complete with nuclear exchanges (America is not going to fight that over Ukraine), but the victory of Russia. Putin is not impulsive, quite the opposite, but eventually he will realise with the SMI he bought a one way ticket–only one way to go. If you ignore all the fanfaronade and just look at the war, it becomes clear that Putin has to take a risk to win, because otherwise Russia will be humiliated.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Sean

    According to ISW (I know they are hated on this site and I certainly don't take their word as gospel, but they are worth listening to, imo) Putin has no interest in any sort of face saving partial victory. Putin wants the conquest of the entirety of Ukraine and to that end has begun the process of raising and equipping a one million man army that will be in theatre.

    Can Ukraine hold up against such a force? I would think not. So I assume if it comes to this you would see Ukraine suddenly develop and air force flown by American "advisors" to prevent a collapse of the Ukrainian lines. Not really sure where this ends.

    Replies: @A123, @Sean

  276. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)
     
    His paganism is simply aesthetic. He builds "Excalibur" as a history of Uther Pendragon family, not just Arthur, but Morgana too. It is pretty pagan in itself, since paganism elevated kinship more than Christianity.

    Who is MZB?


    Personally, I believe that the story of King Arthur is best represented by a fusionism of the pagan with the Christian, and I believe it damages it when we disregard the latter element.
     
    Where do you see this potential for development of Christian element...? It is a story of magic, not of exorcism.

    The trouble today is that we have lost nearly all trace of pagan moralism in Europe. There is not code of it, or authority, and it is liable to be hijacked by irreligious feminists, who the druids probably would have burnt at the stake.
     
    The lack of developed doctrine was always a deficiency of paganism. You just worshipped gods because they were your gods (with some exception of later cults like Mithraism) in rather narcisstic way. Maybe when God confused languages at Babel, his opponent created a cult for every language: Hermes Trismegistos was a god with thousand faces, after all.

    As for women, since the older pagan societies were often matrilineal, unfortunately it looks that their status could have been quite elevated, especially in religions of the Great Goddess. In no religion women pretended to be men, but in some cults men pretended to be women, like priests of Kybele (Galli), which again points to the fact that women, not men, were the point of reference. Coming back to "Excalibur", it is therefore not surprising that Morgana, a female, is a powerful witch, which can be only neutered with the help of Graal itself (but not the cross).

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird

    MZB= Marion Zimmer Bradley?

    Mists Avalon; 1980’s feminist Arthur &c. Girl on girl action!

  277. @S
    @songbird

    Was the movie they were reviewing Braveheart by chance? It did seem to feature quite a lot of dirt and mud. That was a running gag with some of the Monty Python skits about all the medieval filth, ie dumping their refuse right out the window on unexpecting passers by, and the main street being an open sewer.

    I've heard different things going either way about just how dirty life was in medieval Europe, though some have suggested the dirtiest factor has been exaggerated a bit.

    Replies: @sudden death, @songbird, @AP

    The idea that medieval Europeans didn’t bathe was a myth:

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-middle-ages-were-cleaner-than-we-think-11673535460

    [MORE]

    A longstanding myth holds that people in medieval Christian Europe didn’t bathe. In fact, the Middle Ages subscribed heartily to the adage “cleanliness is next to godliness.” Thinkers of the period considered physical beauty to represent spiritual purity, and they looked at hygiene in the same way: If one’s body was impure, it would by definition be unattractive and out of harmony. If it had any imperfections, one would best address them through cleansing. For women, in particular, cleanliness was one of the very highest virtues.

    The daily wash usually involved collecting water in a ewer, heating it, then pouring it into a large basin to be used for scrubbing. Baths in a wooden tub would happen less often, given it was a world without plumbing. Water is heavy, and collecting it, heating it, and then getting it from the kettle into the bathtub was difficult. Baths also required space, which was at a premium in most households.

    Luckily, there were a few ways to bathe outside the home. In warmer months, you could simply find a pond or a lake, and you were good to go. But in January this could be a problem, and that was where bathhouses came in. Bathhouses took the laborious and difficult work of drawing and heating water and monetized it. Most towns boasted at least one professional bathhouse, while cities played host to a number of competing establishments.

    In Paris, a guild for bathhouse keepers set rules that bathkeepers had to abide by. Much like modern spas, they offered customers a cheaper “steam bath [for] two pennies; and if he bathes, [he] should pay four pennies.” To stand out in a crowded field, Parisian bathhouses employed criers to drum up business from women eager to put their best foot forward.

    Rich women had a major advantage in bathing, since they could send servants to fetch and heat water. More luxurious households sometimes had rooms dedicated to bathing, and women with money to spare on travel visited famous bathing spots like Pozzuoli, outside Naples—a destination so famous that poems were written celebrating its virtues.

    This emphasis on cleanliness was echoed in the bathing practices of Muslim communities in Sicily and on the Iberian Peninsula and the Jewish communities that were spread across medieval Europe. Bathing was an explicitly mandated part of Jewish custom and was required before the Sabbath. Women could bathe either in a public bathhouse, which would include steam and hot water, or in a cold-water mikveh, which was used for ritual purification. Meanwhile, Muslim women’s interest in the hammam is evidenced by the astounding number of surviving baths as well as by some pointed polemical tracts wherein Muslim men wondered what exactly women were getting up to while they were bathing, away from the prying eyes of men.

    The emphasis on cleanliness led to a great medieval invention—soap. The earliest surviving written description of soap in Europe dates to the 4th century A.D., when Theodorus Priscianus, a physician in Constantinople, described a French product that was used for washing, especially the head. In the Italian-speaking lands, soap was being produced professionally and in great enough quantities that guilds of soap makers existed by at least the 7th century.

    In the 12th century, the fine hard soaps of the Middle East began to be imported to Europe. “Hard” indicates that they were made with higher-quality ash, which yields lighter bars of soap, in contrast to darker “soft” soaps made with wood ash and lye, which was the norm earlier. Unfortunately, well-made soaps were a luxury that most women would never know. To fill the gap, they made their own cleansers at home, and they had a range of types to choose from. Soap recipes were common and included in “books of secrets”—manuals for women to make various beauty products, as well as medicinal items.

    Specialist cleansing products were also available. Hildegard of Bingen, a 12th-century German mystic, had her own recipe for barley-water face cleanser, which she recommended for “skin, made harsh from the wind.” She assured worried women that after its use, “the skin will become soft and smooth, and will have a beautiful color.” Enterprising women were also advised to scent bathwater with herbs, or even concoct what we would call deodorants from hyssop and bay leaf.

    Such small luxuries were likely in wide use, given that herb-scented water and homemade soap were not in short supply to those who made their homes on farms. Still, women from wealthier backgrounds had an easier time staying clean in their day-to-day lives. Peasant women were, after all, engaging in manual labor on farms all day, digging in crops and handling farm animals. Women from merchant or noble backgrounds were unlikely to come into contact with the same amount of dirt.

    When physically laboring women strived for a clean ideal, they were attempting to emulate women from the sedentary classes. Medieval women of modest means couldn’t always live up to the era’s beauty ideals by giving themselves gray eyes or blond hair, nor could they reverse the aging process. But even working women could luxuriate in a weekly bath.

  278. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    There is certainly some mystery going around how "Ancient Egyptians looked like" since on Egyptian frescos women are yellow, and men are red/brown (even pharaohs, so this is not simply a matter of working in the sun). The reason for this distinction is not known, but maybe Egyptians were once a mixed race in reality (and parts were shown through colours, so to say), or in some religious sense (like yin and yang maybe).

    Replies: @Yahya

    There is certainly some mystery going around how “Ancient Egyptians looked like” since on Egyptian frescos women are yellow, and men are red/brown (even pharaohs, so this is not simply a matter of working in the sun). The reason for this distinction is not known,

    It’s only a “mystery” to outsiders who are unfamiliar with Middle Eastern phenotypes. Especially American ignoramuses who project their racial dichotomies (white/black) onto the Middle East. Everywhere in the Middle East, from Egypt to Iran, there is a duality of skin colors; some are brown and others are off-white; this holds true for peoples within the same ethno-religious group or even within the same family. The relative ratio of brown-to-white differs by class, ethnicity and region; in Egypt it tilts more brown than white.

    This is Onsi Sawiris, patriarch of the wealthy Coptic Sawiris family:

    This is his son Nassif:

    Same family, ethnicity and race/genetics – different skin color.

    Ancient Egyptian appearances are not a mystery to me; they look like modern Egyptians. The tomb paintings are readily recognizable to any Egyptian; the human brain is fairly good at facial recognition and can identify similarities in facial structures between paintings and real life individuals. I’ve written several posts on Egyptian genetics and phenotypes:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/egyptians-angry-at-kevin-hart-for-being-an-afrocentrist/#comment-5729767

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-170/#comment-5055550

    [MORE]

    Though there are no studies on this; it’s been my experience that Egyptian women are lighter on average than men, though with significant overlap. This would explain the tomb frescoes; though it should be noted that Ancient Egyptian women were depicted as both brown and yellow/white:

    • Agree: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    Interesting, when the goddess Isis is yellow, her female companion is red...

    Maybe yellow had to do with some (semi)religious role of woman, some sort of special association with gods like in Minoan culture...

  279. @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    It just blows me away that as a society we haven't even started to grapple with this in a meaningful way. It's so lazy, but we are going to end up paying in spades as the basic dysfunction gets worse.

    The upside is that by keeping your kid's upbringing light on tech, you can basically prime them to rule the world. If you think I'm exaggerating just check back in ten years or fifteen years. I truly think I will be completely vindicated on this one.

    Replies: @S

    The upside is that by keeping your kid’s upbringing light on tech, you can basically prime them to rule the world. If you think I’m exaggerating just check back in ten years or fifteen years.

    Should the so called ‘woke’ progressives ultimately prevail, and don’t first manage somehow to ultimately ‘Jonestown’ the entire Earth in an apocalyptic global mass murder suicide, you could very well be right.

    One of the old 1960’s Star Trek episodes captured that potential future pretty well. The men are completely emasculated slaves, the women who rule have devolved into child like airheads, and everyone is dependent for someone, or something, other than themselves to do the thinking necessary to maintain their high tech society.

    Starting at 1:32.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @S

    "Brain and brain, What is brain?!"

    A classic TOS episode.

    More people are starting to ask the same question it seems.

  280. @S
    @Greasy William


    There is no real anti white racism and it would actually be a good thing if there were.
     
    About thirty thousand Black on White rapes year in and year out for decades now in the United States, along with a great many other one sided crimes,, would beg to disagree with you about that. Just because a corrupt corporate media refuses to report it doesn't change the facts of the matter.

    If by 'racism' you mean abuse between peoples, it is the Euro-peoples (ie 'Whites') which are the people which are far and away experiencing far more abuse than any other, legally abetted often to boot. I'm not for any of it, whether it's against others or against my own.

    If one were to individualize the situation, Euros are like a much abused individual who has been locked into a dark closet, only fed poison laced food now and again (ie propaganda) which is slowly but surely killing them, and told they don't actually really even exist anyhow, except when they do, but then only for bad things, for which they are allowed to leave the closet momentarily now and again to denounce themselves and confess in front of the world.

    This is not about any kind of 'reparations', or, about making anyone whole, but is simply about the hatred driven mass rape, murder, and genocide of European peoples in the truest sense of that much abused term.

    And, in time, it is what is intended for most every other people besides.

    The Race War Of Black Against White

    Paul Sheehan - Sydney Morning Herald, May 20, 1995


    'The longest war America has ever fought is the Dirty War, and it is not over. It has lasted 30 years so far and claimed more than 25 million victims. It has cost almost as many lives as the Vietnam War. It determined the result of last year’s congressional election.'

    'Yet the American news media do not want to talk about the Dirty War, which remains between the lines and unreported. In fact, to even suggest that the war exists is to be discredited. So let’s start suggesting, immediately.'

    'No matter how crime figures are massaged by those who want to acknowledge or dispute the existence of a Dirty War, there is nothing ambiguous about what the official statistics portray: for the past 30 years a large segment of black America has waged a war of violent retribution against white America.'
     
    http://www.heretical.com/miscella/sheehan.html

    Replies: @Yahya, @Greasy William

    About thirty thousand Black on White rapes year in and year out for decades now in the United States, along with a great many other one sided crimes,, would beg to disagree with you about that. Just because a corrupt corporate media refuses to report it doesn’t change the facts of the matter.

    You are conflating crime with genocide. Your statistics are out-of-whack too.

    https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/topic-pages/tables/table-21

    5,412 African-Americans were arrested for rape in 2016, total (not just black-on-white), accounting for 29% of total rapes in the US.

    12,571 White Americans were arrested for rape, accounting for 67% of total rapes. Roughly 3,700 of those were Hispanic, the rest non-Hispanic whites.

    Either you are misinformed, or are lying to reinforce your victim complex.

    Crime is not the same as genocide. If African-Americans are over-represented in rape crimes; it’s because of their higher propensity for violence and lower average impulse control. There is no deliberate plan by a majority of blacks to genocide whites.

    The so-called white genocide is largely self-inflicted; goody white liberals want to virtue-signal their openness and cosmopolitism by opening the doors to foreigners; whose main intent is to improve their standard of living, not genocide whites, you whiny nut.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Yahya

    Interracial rape is almost exclusively one way traffic. Gang rape is almost exclusively a black practice.

  281. @Beckow
    @Miro23


    ...what is its natural level?
     
    Good question, it probably varies over time and how successful other societies are. US had two recent peaks: first in 50's-70's based on the global post-WW2 exhaustion, and in the 90's based on the unexpected windfall from the collapsing communist societies - China handled its commie collapse by offering extremely cheap goods to the West (US). It was ending anyway, US has been in an economic downturn since 2008.

    US is naturally a very wealthy country in land-resources with the ability to command skills from other parts of the world. It has English - a huge cultural advantage. But the quality of people has dropped dramatically and the massive ongoing immigration is not helping. Do you think that the poorly educated, wokeness-infested, swarthy-short-fat-emasculated-gender confused younger Americans can fix it? Not bloody likely...

    The more natural level of US consumption would be slightly above Argentina or more advanced parts of Asia. Something like US in the 1920's or 1900's: rich, comfortable, but not dominant. Even today on paper an American has 6-times the GDP/capita of a Chinese - but is that really true? is the Chinese really consuming 6 times less in housing, education, health care, goodies, food, travel...? Of course not, it is an artificial multiplier of an over-valued dollar and counting a huge number of 'economic activities' that don't add to actual consumption (US is good at churning and counting things).

    But I still think US will do better than Europe - the resources and geography are just so much better. Europe is mostly f...ed and they only have themselves to blame.

    Replies: @AP, @Miro23

    Good question, it probably varies over time and how successful other societies are. US had two recent peaks: first in 50’s-70’s based on the global post-WW2 exhaustion, and in the 90’s based on the unexpected windfall from the collapsing communist societies – China handled its commie collapse by offering extremely cheap goods to the West (US).

    US peaked when others went to war and America sent weapons. Russia’s idiotic invasion of Ukraine will benefit the USA to the detriment of itself and Europe, though this won’t be as great for the USA as World War II and the end of the Cold War were.

    Even today on paper an American has 6-times the GDP/capita of a Chinese

    One must adjust for cost of living. USA has about 3.5x Chinese GDP/PPP per capita. That sounds about right.

    is the Chinese really consuming 6 times less in housing, education, health care, goodies, food, travel

    Chinese live in tiny apartments and don’t have much. Americans have 4.5x as many cars per capita as Chinese. Overall spending on consumer goods per capita is a little over 6x more in the USA than in mainland China. That tracks to the nominal GDP. Assuming things are cheaper in China would track with GDP PPP.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_by_household_final_consumption_expenditure_per_capita

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AP


    ...US peaked when others went to war and America sent weapons
     
    A high-level observation that is not as true today. You are stuck with your shallow analogies (Hitler this and that...) - it is always different. In today's situation US has a skin in the game and reputation to gain or lose. US will definitely do better than Europe, but if Russia wins they will be the biggest winner. Washington knows it - that's why they have been so hysterical.

    Americans have 4.5x as many cars per capita as Chinese.
     
    Why is owning 4-5 cars a benefit? Think about it. You have been brainwashed into thinking that more of the same is always better, 5 refrigerators, 3 smart phones, 4 cars...what benefit is it to the 'owner'? He ends up living his life for the others, and for the goodies that he has to constantly maintain and manage. There is an optimal level of wealth and then there is pure mammon, assets for the sake of assets.

    US has on a daily basis quite miserable living conditions: overly complex 'private' institutions that run your life, no security, low-quality unregulated food, no public infrastructure so you are dependent on multiple cars, bad schools, etc... But you are so brainwashed into thinking that garbage-food and TV (with 50% ads), and sitting for hours in traffic jams (but in your car!) is a good lifestyle that you probably won't understand any of it.

    Replies: @AP

  282. @Sean
    @QCIC


    I don’t think there are any targets worthy of a nuke on the Ukrainian battlefield.
     
    It would be performative and signaling willingness to go down that road so they could just hit empty territory such as Snake Island and that would be a wake up call. But they might then do a real strike on supply lines (crater hundreds of yards deep on rail or road link would not so easily be repaired). The actual targeting of the Ukrainian army would be the third escalation.

    Unlike the Cold War, which likely was never going to go hot especially after Cuba, there is not a theory worked out how nuclear escalation would work in a situation where Russia killed thousands of Ukrainian soldiers, and the US has said there would be no nuclear retaliation to that. However, American conventional retaliation (as floated by some retired generals) to a Russian nuclear strike on the Ukrainian army seems very likely to face an already-crossed-the thermonuclear-Rubicon Russia with being humiliatingly trounced and swallowing it, or using another nuke against Nato (there are anti aircraft nukes and nuclear mines). I think Russia could use an ostentatiously redundant strike on an empty area and America would get the message.

    I cannot see America actually launching even a limited raid on the Russian Armed Forces much less actual undisputed Russia territory. We ought to remember that America has not even given Ukraine Abrams tanks or F16s yet, still less the Army Tactical Missile System. All Ukraine has is the effectively 80km range ordinary HIMARS. By my way of thinking that indicates the objective of American strategy is to stop Russia winning rather than help Ukraine to win. The US wants Russia fighting Ukraine in an endless war that is kept below the level of direct US involvement.

    Ukraine is going to be progressively wrecked and suffer permanent loss of population from emigration, but that is a price America is willing to pay in order to weaken Russia. Lloyd Austin said quite openly that weakening Russia was the US objective. That is working with Putin who is too sanguine about the prospects of military success, but I think a successor would quite possibly decide to terminate the war, and threaten to use nuclear weapons on Ukraine if America kept it going. Putin probably ought to do that now, but he remains focused on America's cat's paw (Ukraine), which as long as it keeps fighting the US does not care about. Currently Russia is like a frog in a pot having the heat tuned up so fiendishly slowly that it passively allows itself to be boiled alive.

    Replies: @QCIC, @Greasy William

    I cannot see America actually launching even a limited raid on the Russian Armed Forces much less actual undisputed Russia territory.

    I think the US of 20 years ago could definitely have done something like that. The US of 10 years ago, probably. US of today? No chance.

  283. Sher Singh says:
    @Yevardian
    @Sher Singh

    Don't know if this post was directed at me or not, and perhaps probably only German_Reader would be interested (I missed replying to his booklist over the holidays), but I'm finishing reading a PHD thesis on Armenian Zoroastrianism at the moment.

    As an aside, its long been recognised that Zoroastrianism had a huge influence on the development of Biblical Judaism during the Achaemenid period, but it's often overlooked that the (more authoritative) Babylonian Talmud was compiled within the later Sasanid Empire, or the role Jews played in the last Persian-Roman War.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Sher Singh

    You were posting about Iranic stuff awhile back so thought to share.
    No IRL experience with Armenians so don’t know which side they swing toward.

    MENA Christians & secular Shias hate brown Idpol & just aspire to white generally.
    Afghans lean towards Panjab.

    ie a MENA Christian is offended at ancient history, a Persian embarassed & an Afghan proud.
    At least among those who grew up or lived here for awhile.

    Kurds are trash

    • Replies: @Yevardian
    @Sher Singh


    No IRL experience with Armenians so don’t know which side they swing toward.
     
    Among the diaspora (which is all I can personally comment on frankly) there's a big difference between (1) MENA emigrants who emigrated West during the Ottoman collapse, (2) those who left during the post 60's convulsions in the Near-East, (3) Soviet emigrants, and finally very old and once sizable Eastern European diaspora from countries like Poland, Bulgaria and Romania.

    Cultural differences of background are compounded by the fact that Western and Eastern Armenian are often only barely intelligible (I don't know if Punjabi dialects differ from each other or Hindi/Urdu that much), or not at all for those in diaspora with a weak grasp of their ancestral language.

    You could almost put each into their own area of the political compass with (1) being libertarian left, (2) being authoritarian left, (3) being authoritarian right and (4) being libertarian right.
    Of course, that's an oversimplication, but for example I think Dmitri could argue that nearly identical political dynamics can be seen amonst Jewish immigrants to Israel from equivalent background.. most notably Sovok-'Jews' being right of Ariel Sharon, as well as ensuring right-wing secularism in contemporary Israel stays above life-support levels.

    There's also similar phenonema in Armenian emigrants maintaining liberal politics at home whilst sponsoring Dashnak-inspired parties in Armenia itself. In a similar vein, there was a minor kerfuffle a few years ago when Armenia unveiled a statue of f Garegin Nzhdeh as one of the people's national heroes. There was some internal controversy about going about this earlier, but ultimately diaspora voices were decisive.

    He had quite a full life, he's been compared to General Vlasov for the Russians, but I don't think that's quite fair.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garegin_Nzhdeh


    ie a MENA Christian is offended at ancient history, a Persian embarassed & an Afghan proud.
     
    That sounds almost exactly backwards to me. MENA Christian identity and sense of pride is almost entirely rooted in Ancient History.
    Persians likewise are extremely proud of their antiquity and ancient statehood, sometimes to absurd levels. You can see it easily in that Iranians still retain from their past what is now an extremely inflated sense of pride, national importance and power (relative to their current position), in way that can only be equalled globally by the French (and I'm starting to think maybe now or soon Russians, sadly).

    The only Afghans I've met IRL have almost all been Hazaras, so not exactly representative. Anyway as I said at length in an old post somewhere, prior to the late 19th Century, the only people who self-identified as Afghans were the Pashtuns, whom the (relative) lowlanders viewed as barbarians, whilst they themselves considered themselves Persians. More than half of the Shahnahmeh takes place in Khorasan rather than Fars and was written by what would be a Tajik today.
    Millions of mostly Dari speakers have also emigrated to Iran since the 1970s, where their 'bumpkin' accent is often a figure of fun in local TV shows and movies (ironic because technically Dari is a much more conservative or 'pure' dialect of Persian than Farsi is).
    If Afghanistan was a nation-state it would annex a large part of Pakistan whilst the south and west (certainly Herat) would rejoin Iran (who only lost Greater Khorasan under the Zand dynasty iirc, and then the Russians and British both prevented them from reacquiring it).

    The only Kurd I knew well had practically a pathological hatred towards Arabs and anything related to them. Oddly he still considered himself a 'cultural Muslim' which I argued to him was a contradiction in terms... far more than Christianity being a 'Jewish vehicle (which I certainly don't buy, at least as anything intentional on their part, btw), Islam has Arab imperialism inextricably baked into it on the most fundamental level.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  284. @S
    @Greasy William


    There is no real anti white racism and it would actually be a good thing if there were.
     
    About thirty thousand Black on White rapes year in and year out for decades now in the United States, along with a great many other one sided crimes,, would beg to disagree with you about that. Just because a corrupt corporate media refuses to report it doesn't change the facts of the matter.

    If by 'racism' you mean abuse between peoples, it is the Euro-peoples (ie 'Whites') which are the people which are far and away experiencing far more abuse than any other, legally abetted often to boot. I'm not for any of it, whether it's against others or against my own.

    If one were to individualize the situation, Euros are like a much abused individual who has been locked into a dark closet, only fed poison laced food now and again (ie propaganda) which is slowly but surely killing them, and told they don't actually really even exist anyhow, except when they do, but then only for bad things, for which they are allowed to leave the closet momentarily now and again to denounce themselves and confess in front of the world.

    This is not about any kind of 'reparations', or, about making anyone whole, but is simply about the hatred driven mass rape, murder, and genocide of European peoples in the truest sense of that much abused term.

    And, in time, it is what is intended for most every other people besides.

    The Race War Of Black Against White

    Paul Sheehan - Sydney Morning Herald, May 20, 1995


    'The longest war America has ever fought is the Dirty War, and it is not over. It has lasted 30 years so far and claimed more than 25 million victims. It has cost almost as many lives as the Vietnam War. It determined the result of last year’s congressional election.'

    'Yet the American news media do not want to talk about the Dirty War, which remains between the lines and unreported. In fact, to even suggest that the war exists is to be discredited. So let’s start suggesting, immediately.'

    'No matter how crime figures are massaged by those who want to acknowledge or dispute the existence of a Dirty War, there is nothing ambiguous about what the official statistics portray: for the past 30 years a large segment of black America has waged a war of violent retribution against white America.'
     
    http://www.heretical.com/miscella/sheehan.html

    Replies: @Yahya, @Greasy William

    If by ‘racism’ you mean abuse between peoples, it is the Euro-peoples (ie ‘Whites’) which are the people which are far and away experiencing far more abuse than any other, legally abetted often to boot. I’m not for any of it, whether it’s against others or against my own.

    By racism I mean racially based antipathy against a group. If you think that Stephen Colbert and Nancy Pelosi hate “whites” as a group, you are totally wrong. These types of people live around and associate almost exclusively with other whites.

    Remember the way the media lost their minds over the illegals being sent to Martha’s Vineyard, whereas they never cared about the busloads being sent to NYC or DC? That was because they took it so personally because Martha’s Vineyard is something they instinctively see as belonging to them, as white liberals. Remember how Samantha Bee fought tooth and nail to prevent black kids from being allowed to attend her children’s school? Do you know any white liberals who wouldn’t melt down if section 8 housing was put in their neighborhoods?

    American politics is a (mostly) cold civil war between 2 groups of whites. It’s true that the lib group does use non whites in general and blacks in particular against nonlib whites, but I would never describe that as “anti white racism”.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Greasy William

    https://neociceroniantimes.substack.com/p/ethnogenesis-has-created-two-white
    https://neociceroniantimes.wordpress.com/2022/09/23/im-not-willing-to-live-with-lefties/

    TLDR - He sees Left & Right as becoming two dif ethnos or nations ie shared culture, custom etc.
    Blockquotes below, but really not necessary. I don't know if I agree, and to me it doesn't matter.


    I would argue that the widening rift in American civil society that seems to be heading toward open rupture is due to America’s ethnic diversity - but not the kind that many readers are probably thinking of right now. To explain what I mean, I’m going to back up a little bit and discuss what is rightly meant by the term “ethnic.”

    This term is an import into English from the Greek ethnos, which describes a group of people who are bound together by language, custom, mores, culture, and so forth. This is more or less the classical and scriptural sense of the word “nation,” as well, and is also the meaning of the Hebrew term goyim, as found in its original, non-pejorative and non-antigentilic sense.
     

    As such, this general definition is the biblical definition, and thus is the one that I always use. An ethnos, a nation, is not synonymous with a political entity or state. Nor is it synonymous with a “race” as the term is meant in modern parlance. Indeed, as I’ve pointed out elsewhere, ethnonationalism (which involves the ethnos as its fundamental unit) is not the same thing as “racial” nationalism (White nationalism, black nationalism, etc.), though it should be obvious that people who belong to the same ethnos will nearly always share the same, or at least similar, genetic heritage.

    So back to what I meant about America’s ethnic diversity. What I’m referring to is the fact that, via an ongoing process of ethnogenesis, there exist in America two broad and increasingly incompatible White ethnies that have developed over the past century or more. These are familiar to us; one ethnie is constituted by the cultural and political Left, the other is made up of normal, everyday Americans, who I often refer to as Amerikaners. These two groups display very different cultures, religious traditions, mores, and even their use of language. The fundamental cultural incompatibilities between these two ethnies have reached the point where peaceful coexistence is now no longer an option. Either they go their separate ways or there is going to be a war across the metaethnic faultline to see which one dominates the American union.
     
    https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2Fc317a890-0dac-4903-88cc-963d86d0697b_749x398.png

    Look, I understand the sentiment. If the population of the United States were united in heart and mind – had high social cohesion – this would be a thousand times better than what we’re seeing now. Obviously. But the fact is that this is not only not the case but is not going to be the case for the foreseeable future. Supposing some national unity that transcends the ethnic divide in America is a pipe dream.

    You might have noticed that I keep referring to this divide as an ethnic one. This goes back to the original sense of the term ethnos in Greek which describes a group of people bound together by a common culture, language, mores, taboos, and all the rest. THAT is the division that we currently see in the White majority in America – two increasingly different ethnies who may have a common descent from the original founding stock of this nation (though even in this, we can see origins from different groups among the original settlers that still largely play out today). Hence, Red America and Blue America (for this is who I’m talking about) are two different ethnic groups according to this original sense, and it is a sociocultural division between these two tribes that is really driving the disunity in America today.
     

    “But but but the differences we see are political!” you might be tempted to argue, “If we could just convince the other side to vote the right way, unity would be restored!” Awwww, your naivete is cute in a way. But no, politics isn’t the cause of this divide, it’s merely a symptom of a much deeper, more abiding cultural divide that exists and has existed in a discernible fashion since the first half of the 19th century. And the thing about a culture is that it is DEEPLY ingrained into the group of people sharing it – things like ethnic foods, clothing, and so forth are just the surface – and are usually the only parts of a culture than an outsider can really hope to grasp. Here in America, the primary ethnic divide is between the Red and Blue tribes, the Right and the Left – and each of these don’t merely vote differently from each other, but do so because of endogenously shared social, cultural, and moral assumptions that are almost always not accessible to people across the divide. Those things are why they vote differently. All the other ethnic groups – the blacks, the Latinos, the other immigrants – are all merely picking the side they think will give them the most patronage but are actually irrelevant to the real ethnic rivalry.

    What folks need to understand is that there simply is no possibility of a rapprochement with the Left. Further, the fault for this lies with the Left. Remember – the broader Right in America is basically made up of people who, all other things being equal, simply want to be left alone to live their lives, but don’t want people grooming their kids or disarming them in the face of criminals inside and outside of government.
     

    Replies: @Greasy William

    , @S
    @Greasy William


    By racism I mean racially based antipathy against a group.
     
    Yes, and my response about the Black on White rapes, not to mention massive amounts of other Black on White crimes, was in response to your declaration that: 'There is no real anti white racism.'

    When Blacks leave their own neighborhoods deliberately seeking out White rape/crime victims that is real 'racially based antipathy'.

    [I should add here I see the term 'racist' as an artificial 'loaded' term, invented by people who don't like the fact that races and ethnicities actually really do indeed physically exist, and hence I don't use it. I say instead 'abuse between peoples', which along with many others of good will, I am against.]

    Hispanics also often act as a group against Euros.

    American politics is a (mostly) cold civil war between 2 groups of whites
     
    I broadly agree here, though we may well disagree about the details.

    I see the template for this civil war was set when African chattel slaves were first imported by diktat during the first half of the 17th century by elites and hangers on in both the North and South of the British North American colonies, against the interest and well being of the vast majority who didn't purchase or own slaves, and instead had to suffer grievously under this system.

    You can't serve two masters. These slaving elites and hangers on, who unfortunately seem to have been the dominant force politically within the Anglosphere, chose to serve their slaves, both chattel and wage, rather than their own people.

    This slaving template continued on as before when in the early 19th century chattel slavery and it's trade was monetized, rather than having been abolished, with the introduction of wage slavery, ie specifically the so called 'cheap labor '/'mass immigration' system.

    From a financial point of view the 'immigrant' is the slave in this system, for whatever period of time (days, weeks, months, years) that he or she is paid significantly below what was, or what would of been, the prevailing real time local rates for the labor, without the immigration taking place, or the immigrant bring present.
  285. @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Well, I wouldn't want to shoe-horn faith into someone else's vision.

    But I think that we got to remember that Boorman was the guy who directed Deliverance. (NOT the type of guy I would want writing or directing a King Arthur Film.) I don't think he had any nationalistic feeling or a moral vision. His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)

    If Boorman got some things right, I consider it more like an accident.

    Personally, I believe that the story of King Arthur is best represented by a fusionism of the pagan with the Christian, and I believe it damages it when we disregard the latter element. Maybe, we should reach for a Celtic Church moral center for it, but I just don't think that Boorman had that in him.

    The trouble today is that we have lost nearly all trace of pagan moralism in Europe. There is not code of it, or authority, and it is liable to be hijacked by irreligious feminists, who the druids probably would have burnt at the stake.

    If you really want a good Euro pagan story to adopt to screen that would be the Táin Bó Cúailnge which was written down by the lineal descendants of the same elites who had previously been pagan.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @S

    But I think that we got to remember that Boorman was the guy who directed Deliverance. (NOT the type of guy I would want writing or directing a King Arthur Film.) I don’t think he had any nationalistic feeling or a moral vision. His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)

    If Boorman got some things right, I consider it more like an accident.

    Boorman also directed the 1974 film Zardoz in Ireland, where I believe he made his home. The film had a lot of Irish extras. Boorman’s comment about the young women extras was that he found it difficult to coerce them into exposing their breasts for his film.

    I respect their modesty, even if he didn’t.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @S

    Thanks. I've seen that movie, or at least parts of it. Hadn't realized it was filmed in Ireland, until now. Connery is Irish in his paternal line. I think that it an amusing scene at the end when they play Beethoven, and show him. (though I am not crazy about the movie.)

    I think Boorman still lives in his old house in Ireland, with Daniel Day-Lewis, as his neighbor. That's in Wicklow. One could consider it the most mountainy place near to Dublin. The stronghold of Fiach McHugh O'Byrne was there. And the Irish army (such that it is) does some of its training there.

    https://youtu.be/w_lwuDupYu0

    Been to the area. Grasped a nettle there as a child, and I'll not forget it.

    I regret to say, it most likely has been enriched heavily, like seemingly all of rural Ireland in the current year.

    Replies: @S

  286. @Yahya
    @Sher Singh


    Ie a lightskin Jamaician is still Jamaican & esp among women skin tone varies. Those ppl will still side with blacks & just ID as lightskin
     
    Black, mulatto.

    Potatoe, potato.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Forgot to mention that Afro-Caucasian hybrids are a good-looking bunch. That’s a key difference between them and pure blacks. Attractive “blacks” like Halle Berry and Beyonce are almost invariably admixed.

    I know a Kenyan girl who is as pretty as they come. Initially I assumed she was of Indian descent, but later found out she had a Yemeni father.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Yahya

    How old are you? Berry is a pretty average in most respects. exogamic interest is all well and good as a young man but, my dude, look at Prince Harry. He's ruined himself hooked with oil drilling Black Pussy. Think of what awaits him or yourself in middle age.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Yahya

    , @A123
    @Yahya

    What is the lineage for Nadia Ali (Urdu: نادیہ علی, Arabic: نادية علي;)

    Born in Libya. Parents are Pakistani? Obviously, she assimilated to NYC.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    iiO - Rapture (Official Video)

    https://youtu.be/on8DJBt07eU

    , @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    Forgot to mention that Afro-Caucasian hybrids are a good-looking bunch.
     
    You also forgot to mention that this is your opinion, rather than a fact of reality; and an opinion in which, I must say, you seem deeply invested in propagandizing to others. Of course, you are perfectly free to hold any opinion any you like, evidence be damned. I would point out, however, that the case for your opinion isn't made by cherry-picking a few examples, but by considering the average outcome of such pairings, which in my opinion is: not very impressive. Human beauty has been described, I think quite rightly, as "idealization away from the ape." If you buy into that theory, then you can draw your own conclusions about the contribution the Africanus is capable of making towards its attainment.

    Black, mulatto.

    Potatoe, potato.
     

    That seems inconsistent with your other opinions. The difference between, say, the average Greek and the average German is rather less than the difference between Meghan Markle and, say, Robert Mugabe. But if somebody calls a Greek "white," you insist that "no way buddy, tomaytoes is tomaytoes and tomahtoes is tomahtoes, two totally different things," and you proceed to treat the blog to another of your pic-posting sprees to prove it. To be sure, the latter is an opinion I tend to agree with, but consistency would require me to likewise note the even larger differences between so-called "blacks," rather than lump them all in the same category.

    Either you are misinformed, or are lying to reinforce your victim complex.
     
    Blacks attack whites at rates vastly exceeding rates at which whites attack blacks. Utterly pointless to attempt to deny this.

    And since whites are being systematically deprived of the conditions necessary for ongoing existence - ie their racial existence is being unfairly cut short - it makes sense to refer to it as a 'soft genocide.'

  287. Sher Singh says:
    @Greasy William
    @S


    If by ‘racism’ you mean abuse between peoples, it is the Euro-peoples (ie ‘Whites’) which are the people which are far and away experiencing far more abuse than any other, legally abetted often to boot. I’m not for any of it, whether it’s against others or against my own.
     
    By racism I mean racially based antipathy against a group. If you think that Stephen Colbert and Nancy Pelosi hate "whites" as a group, you are totally wrong. These types of people live around and associate almost exclusively with other whites.

    Remember the way the media lost their minds over the illegals being sent to Martha's Vineyard, whereas they never cared about the busloads being sent to NYC or DC? That was because they took it so personally because Martha's Vineyard is something they instinctively see as belonging to them, as white liberals. Remember how Samantha Bee fought tooth and nail to prevent black kids from being allowed to attend her children's school? Do you know any white liberals who wouldn't melt down if section 8 housing was put in their neighborhoods?

    American politics is a (mostly) cold civil war between 2 groups of whites. It's true that the lib group does use non whites in general and blacks in particular against nonlib whites, but I would never describe that as "anti white racism".

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @S

    https://neociceroniantimes.substack.com/p/ethnogenesis-has-created-two-white
    https://neociceroniantimes.wordpress.com/2022/09/23/im-not-willing-to-live-with-lefties/

    TLDR – He sees Left & Right as becoming two dif ethnos or nations ie shared culture, custom etc.
    Blockquotes below, but really not necessary. I don’t know if I agree, and to me it doesn’t matter.

    [MORE]

    I would argue that the widening rift in American civil society that seems to be heading toward open rupture is due to America’s ethnic diversity – but not the kind that many readers are probably thinking of right now. To explain what I mean, I’m going to back up a little bit and discuss what is rightly meant by the term “ethnic.”

    This term is an import into English from the Greek ethnos, which describes a group of people who are bound together by language, custom, mores, culture, and so forth. This is more or less the classical and scriptural sense of the word “nation,” as well, and is also the meaning of the Hebrew term goyim, as found in its original, non-pejorative and non-antigentilic sense.

    As such, this general definition is the biblical definition, and thus is the one that I always use. An ethnos, a nation, is not synonymous with a political entity or state. Nor is it synonymous with a “race” as the term is meant in modern parlance. Indeed, as I’ve pointed out elsewhere, ethnonationalism (which involves the ethnos as its fundamental unit) is not the same thing as “racial” nationalism (White nationalism, black nationalism, etc.), though it should be obvious that people who belong to the same ethnos will nearly always share the same, or at least similar, genetic heritage.

    So back to what I meant about America’s ethnic diversity. What I’m referring to is the fact that, via an ongoing process of ethnogenesis, there exist in America two broad and increasingly incompatible White ethnies that have developed over the past century or more. These are familiar to us; one ethnie is constituted by the cultural and political Left, the other is made up of normal, everyday Americans, who I often refer to as Amerikaners. These two groups display very different cultures, religious traditions, mores, and even their use of language. The fundamental cultural incompatibilities between these two ethnies have reached the point where peaceful coexistence is now no longer an option. Either they go their separate ways or there is going to be a war across the metaethnic faultline to see which one dominates the American union.

    Look, I understand the sentiment. If the population of the United States were united in heart and mind – had high social cohesion – this would be a thousand times better than what we’re seeing now. Obviously. But the fact is that this is not only not the case but is not going to be the case for the foreseeable future. Supposing some national unity that transcends the ethnic divide in America is a pipe dream.

    You might have noticed that I keep referring to this divide as an ethnic one. This goes back to the original sense of the term ethnos in Greek which describes a group of people bound together by a common culture, language, mores, taboos, and all the rest. THAT is the division that we currently see in the White majority in America – two increasingly different ethnies who may have a common descent from the original founding stock of this nation (though even in this, we can see origins from different groups among the original settlers that still largely play out today). Hence, Red America and Blue America (for this is who I’m talking about) are two different ethnic groups according to this original sense, and it is a sociocultural division between these two tribes that is really driving the disunity in America today.

    “But but but the differences we see are political!” you might be tempted to argue, “If we could just convince the other side to vote the right way, unity would be restored!” Awwww, your naivete is cute in a way. But no, politics isn’t the cause of this divide, it’s merely a symptom of a much deeper, more abiding cultural divide that exists and has existed in a discernible fashion since the first half of the 19th century. And the thing about a culture is that it is DEEPLY ingrained into the group of people sharing it – things like ethnic foods, clothing, and so forth are just the surface – and are usually the only parts of a culture than an outsider can really hope to grasp. Here in America, the primary ethnic divide is between the Red and Blue tribes, the Right and the Left – and each of these don’t merely vote differently from each other, but do so because of endogenously shared social, cultural, and moral assumptions that are almost always not accessible to people across the divide. Those things are why they vote differently. All the other ethnic groups – the blacks, the Latinos, the other immigrants – are all merely picking the side they think will give them the most patronage but are actually irrelevant to the real ethnic rivalry.

    What folks need to understand is that there simply is no possibility of a rapprochement with the Left. Further, the fault for this lies with the Left. Remember – the broader Right in America is basically made up of people who, all other things being equal, simply want to be left alone to live their lives, but don’t want people grooming their kids or disarming them in the face of criminals inside and outside of government.

    • Agree: Barbarossa
    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Sher Singh

    This is the most brilliant thing I've ever read in my life. Everything that I have been thinking for the last several years all put eloquently into a few paragraphs. Great stuff!

  288. @Beckow
    @Miro23


    ...US was financialized, de-industrialized with the results Ford predicted...once the skills and supplier networks have gone re-industrialization becomes next to impossible.
     
    It is the latest example of the unavoidable "Dutch disease": successful and admired countries end up with a massively overvalued currency and economic activity gravitates away from actual production to financial and real estate (assets) speculation.

    US has tens of millions of people who spent their "work lives" selling stuff to each other that nobody needs - mostly on the phone. It is not an economy that can justify its current living standards. The material consumption for the masses has been sustained by over-valued dollar, military aggression, willingness of China (and others) to provide the cheap goods, open borders that act as an endless pyramid scheme, and the general acquiescence of the rest of the world.

    It has ended with a stupid imperial over-reach into Ukraine - a bridge too far. The local enemy (Russia) is too powerful and will not roll over. Something similar happened to previous empires - they expanded until they reached their match. There is no way to restore the stability now - it will slowly disintegrate.

    The idiotic plan to create a Nato-Ukraine was so stupid and unlikely to work that one wonders how it could have gone on...the explanation is that the leaders in Washington-London are not very smart, they are the natural result of inbred careerism - of education that rewards agreeable people. It will take a while, but US has peaked...it will painfully retrace the steps on the way up going down to its more natural level.

    Replies: @Miro23, @QCIC

    I think it makes more sense if we fold in the idea that some of the impetus for the Ukraine meddling is to reclaim and reimagine the Pale of Settlement.

    Also, I have learned the Russia hatred is very strong in some people and trumps the practical calculations of risk and reward.

  289. @S
    @Barbarossa


    The upside is that by keeping your kid’s upbringing light on tech, you can basically prime them to rule the world. If you think I’m exaggerating just check back in ten years or fifteen years.
     
    Should the so called 'woke' progressives ultimately prevail, and don't first manage somehow to ultimately 'Jonestown' the entire Earth in an apocalyptic global mass murder suicide, you could very well be right.

    One of the old 1960's Star Trek episodes captured that potential future pretty well. The men are completely emasculated slaves, the women who rule have devolved into child like airheads, and everyone is dependent for someone, or something, other than themselves to do the thinking necessary to maintain their high tech society.

    Starting at 1:32.

    https://youtu.be/2zKDQfVbWqc

    Replies: @QCIC

    “Brain and brain, What is brain?!”

    A classic TOS episode.

    More people are starting to ask the same question it seems.

  290. @Yahya
    @Yahya

    Forgot to mention that Afro-Caucasian hybrids are a good-looking bunch. That's a key difference between them and pure blacks. Attractive "blacks" like Halle Berry and Beyonce are almost invariably admixed.

    I know a Kenyan girl who is as pretty as they come. Initially I assumed she was of Indian descent, but later found out she had a Yemeni father.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @A123, @silviosilver

    How old are you? Berry is a pretty average in most respects. exogamic interest is all well and good as a young man but, my dude, look at Prince Harry. He’s ruined himself hooked with oil drilling Black Pussy. Think of what awaits him or yourself in middle age.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Wokechoke

    She looked good in the Flintstones. Hasn't been anything special since.

    , @Yahya
    @Wokechoke


    How old are you?
     
    I’m unmarried and in my early-to-mid 20s, so my interest in females is pretty high. My tastes are wide-ranging for now; so I don’t mind “looking” at females outside my own race. But if we are talking marriage, then I’d prefer someone from my own kind, which is Middle Eastern Caucasian. Incidentally that’s also the appearance I’m most attracted to. Something like Queen Rania or Amal Clooney would be the ideal spouse for middle age.

    However, the term “exogamic” can be problematic in my context, since Egypt is somewhat mixed already. Is a Nubian girl such as the one pictured below outside of my ethnic group?


    https://www.hoteliermiddleeast.com/2021/05/Lze10mwQ-rania.jpg


    No, I know 2 girls in my social circle who are visibly black-admixed; both of them decently attractive; culturally they are identical and they carry themselves well. However, one of them is none too bright, and the other has an incompatible personality. So I won’t be marrying either; but theoretically I would be willing to marry a Nubian-Egyptian who is honest and intelligent. The only issue I can think of is the mild racism encountered by black-ish people in Egypt; though my experience is that hybrids are spared the treatment given to pure sub-Saharan. Anwar Sadat was the paramount leader of Egypt after all.

    You needn’t worry about me making a hasty marital decision. I’ve been very conservative so far, rejecting 2 girls because they were not intelligent enough (a deal-breaker - I don’t want my kids to regress to the mean). Currently I’m looking at a half-German, quarter-Egyptian, quarter-Palestinian girl, though we are still in the initial phases. She’s as Caucasian-looking as they come, but Egyptian society also wouldn’t view it as necessarily intermarriage, and obviously the racism would be less than what is experienced by blacks.


    Berry is a pretty average in most respects.
     
    She’s above-average in looks by normal standards imo. But sure, for a celebrity she’s nothing special.

    @A123


    What is the lineage for Nadia Ali (Urdu: نادیہ علی, Arabic: نادية علي;)
     
    What does this mean and how should I know?

    Are you referring to her light phenotype?

    There are a fair number of pure-bred Pakistanis who look like her.

    I don’t think she’s Arab-admixed. Just born in Libya.

    She’s nice-looking. High-caste Pakistani women are a good-looking bunch as well.

    https://youtu.be/c1xNcuUBVCo

    Replies: @A123

  291. @Yahya
    @Yahya

    Forgot to mention that Afro-Caucasian hybrids are a good-looking bunch. That's a key difference between them and pure blacks. Attractive "blacks" like Halle Berry and Beyonce are almost invariably admixed.

    I know a Kenyan girl who is as pretty as they come. Initially I assumed she was of Indian descent, but later found out she had a Yemeni father.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @A123, @silviosilver

    What is the lineage for Nadia Ali (Urdu: نادیہ علی, Arabic: نادية علي;)

    Born in Libya. Parents are Pakistani? Obviously, she assimilated to NYC.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    iiO – Rapture (Official Video)

  292. @Sher Singh
    @Yevardian

    You were posting about Iranic stuff awhile back so thought to share.
    No IRL experience with Armenians so don't know which side they swing toward.

    MENA Christians & secular Shias hate brown Idpol & just aspire to white generally.
    Afghans lean towards Panjab.

    ie a MENA Christian is offended at ancient history, a Persian embarassed & an Afghan proud.
    At least among those who grew up or lived here for awhile.

    Kurds are trash

    Replies: @Yevardian

    No IRL experience with Armenians so don’t know which side they swing toward.

    Among the diaspora (which is all I can personally comment on frankly) there’s a big difference between (1) MENA emigrants who emigrated West during the Ottoman collapse, (2) those who left during the post 60’s convulsions in the Near-East, (3) Soviet emigrants, and finally very old and once sizable Eastern European diaspora from countries like Poland, Bulgaria and Romania.

    Cultural differences of background are compounded by the fact that Western and Eastern Armenian are often only barely intelligible (I don’t know if Punjabi dialects differ from each other or Hindi/Urdu that much), or not at all for those in diaspora with a weak grasp of their ancestral language.

    You could almost put each into their own area of the political compass with (1) being libertarian left, (2) being authoritarian left, (3) being authoritarian right and (4) being libertarian right.
    Of course, that’s an oversimplication, but for example I think Dmitri could argue that nearly identical political dynamics can be seen amonst Jewish immigrants to Israel from equivalent background.. most notably Sovok-‘Jews’ being right of Ariel Sharon, as well as ensuring right-wing secularism in contemporary Israel stays above life-support levels.

    There’s also similar phenonema in Armenian emigrants maintaining liberal politics at home whilst sponsoring Dashnak-inspired parties in Armenia itself. In a similar vein, there was a minor kerfuffle a few years ago when Armenia unveiled a statue of f Garegin Nzhdeh as one of the people’s national heroes. There was some internal controversy about going about this earlier, but ultimately diaspora voices were decisive.

    He had quite a full life, he’s been compared to General Vlasov for the Russians, but I don’t think that’s quite fair.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garegin_Nzhdeh

    ie a MENA Christian is offended at ancient history, a Persian embarassed & an Afghan proud.

    That sounds almost exactly backwards to me. MENA Christian identity and sense of pride is almost entirely rooted in Ancient History.
    Persians likewise are extremely proud of their antiquity and ancient statehood, sometimes to absurd levels. You can see it easily in that Iranians still retain from their past what is now an extremely inflated sense of pride, national importance and power (relative to their current position), in way that can only be equalled globally by the French (and I’m starting to think maybe now or soon Russians, sadly).

    The only Afghans I’ve met IRL have almost all been Hazaras, so not exactly representative. Anyway as I said at length in an old post somewhere, prior to the late 19th Century, the only people who self-identified as Afghans were the Pashtuns, whom the (relative) lowlanders viewed as barbarians, whilst they themselves considered themselves Persians. More than half of the Shahnahmeh takes place in Khorasan rather than Fars and was written by what would be a Tajik today.
    Millions of mostly Dari speakers have also emigrated to Iran since the 1970s, where their ‘bumpkin’ accent is often a figure of fun in local TV shows and movies (ironic because technically Dari is a much more conservative or ‘pure’ dialect of Persian than Farsi is).
    If Afghanistan was a nation-state it would annex a large part of Pakistan whilst the south and west (certainly Herat) would rejoin Iran (who only lost Greater Khorasan under the Zand dynasty iirc, and then the Russians and British both prevented them from reacquiring it).

    The only Kurd I knew well had practically a pathological hatred towards Arabs and anything related to them. Oddly he still considered himself a ‘cultural Muslim’ which I argued to him was a contradiction in terms… far more than Christianity being a ‘Jewish vehicle (which I certainly don’t buy, at least as anything intentional on their part, btw), Islam has Arab imperialism inextricably baked into it on the most fundamental level.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Yevardian

    Brown ID in North America is entirely rooted in post 9/11 so in that case it makes sense.
    ie Pathan (Afghan) being too dumb to not be proud & the rest pretending to be White.

    Yea, we consider the real Persia to be Khorasan & Tajik/Pashto.

    @yahya Women belong behind the veil, don't answer these qs.

  293. @Sher Singh
    @Greasy William

    https://neociceroniantimes.substack.com/p/ethnogenesis-has-created-two-white
    https://neociceroniantimes.wordpress.com/2022/09/23/im-not-willing-to-live-with-lefties/

    TLDR - He sees Left & Right as becoming two dif ethnos or nations ie shared culture, custom etc.
    Blockquotes below, but really not necessary. I don't know if I agree, and to me it doesn't matter.


    I would argue that the widening rift in American civil society that seems to be heading toward open rupture is due to America’s ethnic diversity - but not the kind that many readers are probably thinking of right now. To explain what I mean, I’m going to back up a little bit and discuss what is rightly meant by the term “ethnic.”

    This term is an import into English from the Greek ethnos, which describes a group of people who are bound together by language, custom, mores, culture, and so forth. This is more or less the classical and scriptural sense of the word “nation,” as well, and is also the meaning of the Hebrew term goyim, as found in its original, non-pejorative and non-antigentilic sense.
     

    As such, this general definition is the biblical definition, and thus is the one that I always use. An ethnos, a nation, is not synonymous with a political entity or state. Nor is it synonymous with a “race” as the term is meant in modern parlance. Indeed, as I’ve pointed out elsewhere, ethnonationalism (which involves the ethnos as its fundamental unit) is not the same thing as “racial” nationalism (White nationalism, black nationalism, etc.), though it should be obvious that people who belong to the same ethnos will nearly always share the same, or at least similar, genetic heritage.

    So back to what I meant about America’s ethnic diversity. What I’m referring to is the fact that, via an ongoing process of ethnogenesis, there exist in America two broad and increasingly incompatible White ethnies that have developed over the past century or more. These are familiar to us; one ethnie is constituted by the cultural and political Left, the other is made up of normal, everyday Americans, who I often refer to as Amerikaners. These two groups display very different cultures, religious traditions, mores, and even their use of language. The fundamental cultural incompatibilities between these two ethnies have reached the point where peaceful coexistence is now no longer an option. Either they go their separate ways or there is going to be a war across the metaethnic faultline to see which one dominates the American union.
     
    https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2Fc317a890-0dac-4903-88cc-963d86d0697b_749x398.png

    Look, I understand the sentiment. If the population of the United States were united in heart and mind – had high social cohesion – this would be a thousand times better than what we’re seeing now. Obviously. But the fact is that this is not only not the case but is not going to be the case for the foreseeable future. Supposing some national unity that transcends the ethnic divide in America is a pipe dream.

    You might have noticed that I keep referring to this divide as an ethnic one. This goes back to the original sense of the term ethnos in Greek which describes a group of people bound together by a common culture, language, mores, taboos, and all the rest. THAT is the division that we currently see in the White majority in America – two increasingly different ethnies who may have a common descent from the original founding stock of this nation (though even in this, we can see origins from different groups among the original settlers that still largely play out today). Hence, Red America and Blue America (for this is who I’m talking about) are two different ethnic groups according to this original sense, and it is a sociocultural division between these two tribes that is really driving the disunity in America today.
     

    “But but but the differences we see are political!” you might be tempted to argue, “If we could just convince the other side to vote the right way, unity would be restored!” Awwww, your naivete is cute in a way. But no, politics isn’t the cause of this divide, it’s merely a symptom of a much deeper, more abiding cultural divide that exists and has existed in a discernible fashion since the first half of the 19th century. And the thing about a culture is that it is DEEPLY ingrained into the group of people sharing it – things like ethnic foods, clothing, and so forth are just the surface – and are usually the only parts of a culture than an outsider can really hope to grasp. Here in America, the primary ethnic divide is between the Red and Blue tribes, the Right and the Left – and each of these don’t merely vote differently from each other, but do so because of endogenously shared social, cultural, and moral assumptions that are almost always not accessible to people across the divide. Those things are why they vote differently. All the other ethnic groups – the blacks, the Latinos, the other immigrants – are all merely picking the side they think will give them the most patronage but are actually irrelevant to the real ethnic rivalry.

    What folks need to understand is that there simply is no possibility of a rapprochement with the Left. Further, the fault for this lies with the Left. Remember – the broader Right in America is basically made up of people who, all other things being equal, simply want to be left alone to live their lives, but don’t want people grooming their kids or disarming them in the face of criminals inside and outside of government.
     

    Replies: @Greasy William

    This is the most brilliant thing I’ve ever read in my life. Everything that I have been thinking for the last several years all put eloquently into a few paragraphs. Great stuff!

  294. @Wokechoke
    @Yahya

    How old are you? Berry is a pretty average in most respects. exogamic interest is all well and good as a young man but, my dude, look at Prince Harry. He's ruined himself hooked with oil drilling Black Pussy. Think of what awaits him or yourself in middle age.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Yahya

    She looked good in the Flintstones. Hasn’t been anything special since.

  295. @AP
    @Beckow


    Good question, it probably varies over time and how successful other societies are. US had two recent peaks: first in 50’s-70’s based on the global post-WW2 exhaustion, and in the 90’s based on the unexpected windfall from the collapsing communist societies – China handled its commie collapse by offering extremely cheap goods to the West (US).
     
    US peaked when others went to war and America sent weapons. Russia's idiotic invasion of Ukraine will benefit the USA to the detriment of itself and Europe, though this won't be as great for the USA as World War II and the end of the Cold War were.

    Even today on paper an American has 6-times the GDP/capita of a Chinese
     
    One must adjust for cost of living. USA has about 3.5x Chinese GDP/PPP per capita. That sounds about right.

    is the Chinese really consuming 6 times less in housing, education, health care, goodies, food, travel
     
    Chinese live in tiny apartments and don't have much. Americans have 4.5x as many cars per capita as Chinese. Overall spending on consumer goods per capita is a little over 6x more in the USA than in mainland China. That tracks to the nominal GDP. Assuming things are cheaper in China would track with GDP PPP.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_by_household_final_consumption_expenditure_per_capita

    Replies: @Beckow

    …US peaked when others went to war and America sent weapons

    A high-level observation that is not as true today. You are stuck with your shallow analogies (Hitler this and that…) – it is always different. In today’s situation US has a skin in the game and reputation to gain or lose. US will definitely do better than Europe, but if Russia wins they will be the biggest winner. Washington knows it – that’s why they have been so hysterical.

    Americans have 4.5x as many cars per capita as Chinese.

    Why is owning 4-5 cars a benefit? Think about it. You have been brainwashed into thinking that more of the same is always better, 5 refrigerators, 3 smart phones, 4 cars…what benefit is it to the ‘owner’? He ends up living his life for the others, and for the goodies that he has to constantly maintain and manage. There is an optimal level of wealth and then there is pure mammon, assets for the sake of assets.

    US has on a daily basis quite miserable living conditions: overly complex ‘private’ institutions that run your life, no security, low-quality unregulated food, no public infrastructure so you are dependent on multiple cars, bad schools, etc… But you are so brainwashed into thinking that garbage-food and TV (with 50% ads), and sitting for hours in traffic jams (but in your car!) is a good lifestyle that you probably won’t understand any of it.

    • Replies: @AP
    @Beckow


    You are stuck with your shallow analogies (Hitler this and that…) – it is always different. In today’s situation US has a skin in the game and reputation to gain or lose. US will definitely do better than Europe, but if Russia wins they will be the biggest winner
     
    Anything Russia gains will be largely destroyed and depopulated and Russia won’t have the population or the resources to restore it, while its military would be depleted for several years. Ukraine’s western neighbors would at least gain a lot of young educated people, improving their demographics.

    Americans have 4.5x as many cars per capita as Chinese.

    Why is owning 4-5 cars a benefit?
     
    You falsely claimed that Chinese did not have several times less money per capita than Americans so I provided a concrete example that disproves your claim.

    So now you change the subject to why someone should need so many things and why too much wealth is bad. Maybe it is, but that wasn’t the point.

    US has on a daily basis quite miserable living conditions
     
    Suicide rate is lower than in many Euro social democracies though.

    overly complex ‘private’ institutions that run your life, no security, low-quality unregulated food, no public infrastructure so you are dependent on multiple cars, bad schools
     
    1. Security depends on population. American whites experience crime at Visegrad levels.
    2. Americans don’t want public transit because they have a big country that allows them to spread out and have private lands and they can easily afford many cars.
    3. As for schools, American school kids of European descent outperform most Europeans and American universities continue to be among the world’s best.

    You are right about the good but that’s a cultural thing going back to the first settlers, the Puritans and Quakers thought fine foods were sinful so America didn’t develop a nice culinary tradition. Still, if one looks one can find excellent food in the USA.
  296. @Greasy William
    @S


    If by ‘racism’ you mean abuse between peoples, it is the Euro-peoples (ie ‘Whites’) which are the people which are far and away experiencing far more abuse than any other, legally abetted often to boot. I’m not for any of it, whether it’s against others or against my own.
     
    By racism I mean racially based antipathy against a group. If you think that Stephen Colbert and Nancy Pelosi hate "whites" as a group, you are totally wrong. These types of people live around and associate almost exclusively with other whites.

    Remember the way the media lost their minds over the illegals being sent to Martha's Vineyard, whereas they never cared about the busloads being sent to NYC or DC? That was because they took it so personally because Martha's Vineyard is something they instinctively see as belonging to them, as white liberals. Remember how Samantha Bee fought tooth and nail to prevent black kids from being allowed to attend her children's school? Do you know any white liberals who wouldn't melt down if section 8 housing was put in their neighborhoods?

    American politics is a (mostly) cold civil war between 2 groups of whites. It's true that the lib group does use non whites in general and blacks in particular against nonlib whites, but I would never describe that as "anti white racism".

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @S

    By racism I mean racially based antipathy against a group.

    Yes, and my response about the Black on White rapes, not to mention massive amounts of other Black on White crimes, was in response to your declaration that: ‘There is no real anti white racism.’

    When Blacks leave their own neighborhoods deliberately seeking out White rape/crime victims that is real ‘racially based antipathy’.

    [I should add here I see the term ‘racist’ as an artificial ‘loaded’ term, invented by people who don’t like the fact that races and ethnicities actually really do indeed physically exist, and hence I don’t use it. I say instead ‘abuse between peoples’, which along with many others of good will, I am against.]

    Hispanics also often act as a group against Euros.

    American politics is a (mostly) cold civil war between 2 groups of whites

    I broadly agree here, though we may well disagree about the details.

    I see the template for this civil war was set when African chattel slaves were first imported by diktat during the first half of the 17th century by elites and hangers on in both the North and South of the British North American colonies, against the interest and well being of the vast majority who didn’t purchase or own slaves, and instead had to suffer grievously under this system.

    You can’t serve two masters. These slaving elites and hangers on, who unfortunately seem to have been the dominant force politically within the Anglosphere, chose to serve their slaves, both chattel and wage, rather than their own people.

    This slaving template continued on as before when in the early 19th century chattel slavery and it’s trade was monetized, rather than having been abolished, with the introduction of wage slavery, ie specifically the so called ‘cheap labor ‘/’mass immigration’ system.

    From a financial point of view the ‘immigrant’ is the slave in this system, for whatever period of time (days, weeks, months, years) that he or she is paid significantly below what was, or what would of been, the prevailing real time local rates for the labor, without the immigration taking place, or the immigrant bring present.

  297. @Sean
    @QCIC

    Emmanuel Todd seems to think Russia's emphasis on mass production and effect allied to its hard science ephasis and lack of bullshit jobs inflating the GDP means America will fail in Ukraine in the long term. However, pace Todd I think Putin understood certain constraints required a quick resolution of the Ukraine operation. That was the plan.

    The USSR's military strategy always planned while assuming that America has the most complex (adaptable) and powerful productive capacity in the world, which could not be beat in a lengthy conventional war. The current war in Ukraine is a proxy one, but the old certainties still hold true. There are no more ex Soviet tanks, artillery or aircraft available in pro-Western countries to donate to Ukraine so they are going to have to be given F16s Abrams and Paladins eventually. The alternative would be to let Russia gain an absolute victory, which would be politial disaster for whoever was in the White House.

    According to retired German general Erich Vad" If the war drags on, with no diplomatic effort emerging, if—as some believe was possible—Russia’s positions should become untenable under the buildup of Western weapons in Ukrain, the danger of sliding into a nuclear strike ... would become imminent."

    The peril referred to is not really WW3 complete with nuclear exchanges (America is not going to fight that over Ukraine), but the victory of Russia. Putin is not impulsive, quite the opposite, but eventually he will realise with the SMI he bought a one way ticket--only one way to go. If you ignore all the fanfaronade and just look at the war, it becomes clear that Putin has to take a risk to win, because otherwise Russia will be humiliated.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    According to ISW (I know they are hated on this site and I certainly don’t take their word as gospel, but they are worth listening to, imo) Putin has no interest in any sort of face saving partial victory. Putin wants the conquest of the entirety of Ukraine and to that end has begun the process of raising and equipping a one million man army that will be in theatre.

    Can Ukraine hold up against such a force? I would think not. So I assume if it comes to this you would see Ukraine suddenly develop and air force flown by American “advisors” to prevent a collapse of the Ukrainian lines. Not really sure where this ends.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Greasy William


    According to ISW ... Putin has no interest
     
    Do you mean this ISW?

    https://www.understandingwar.org/

    If so, they are a content aggregator. One can "Find things on ISW", however "According to ISW" is a bit of a misnomer. It is better to follow their copious footnotes to find the specific source they are quoting.
    __

    ISW efforts to pull together reports inside of Iran is near unique.

    https://www.understandingwar.org/project/iran-project

    The Fake Stream Media is uninterested and far too lazy to cover something that does not generate salable "sound bites".


    Putin wants the conquest of the entirety of Ukraine and to that end has begun the process of raising and equipping a one million man army that will be in theatre.
     
    That sounds like something a Russia nationalist would say on RT. I am dubious about that as Putin's actual thinking. Russia is going to have to pay for reconstruction on any territory they keep. Taking ALL of Ukraine, wrecking most of it in the process, is GW Bush thinking.

    PEACE 😇

    , @Sean
    @Greasy William


    Putin wants the conquest of the entirety of Ukraine and to that end has begun the process of raising and equipping a one million man army that will be in theatre.
     
    It'll be two million and only aim at conquering the Eastern half up to the Dnieper. I know Col. Girkin advocates reuniting all Ukraine with Russia, but he is a romantic tolerated for his prior contribution. Taking West Ukraine would give Russia a border with Poland and a counter insurgency problem in a huge area with a very hostile population.

    Putin started off aiming for a Russian alliance with Germany, but the Germans going along with the 'Ukraine will join Nato' announcements between 2007 and 2021 has made him realise that Russia has to break with the West, and the invasion has certainly accomplished that, which may have been the result of miscalculation by him, but deep down is maybe what he wanted the most.

    https://www.memri.org/reports/russian-former-colonel-trenin-russia-failed-assess-western-response-ukraine-invasion-there

    Dmitri Trenin a member of Russia’s Foreign and Defense Policy Council was formerly a colonel in Russian military intelligence He served as director of the Carnegie Moscow Center before the think tank ran afoul of the Putin regime. Trenin has emerged as a full-fledged backer of the war in Ukraine. In the article below, that appeared in the Russian edition of Russia in Global Affairs Trenin concedes that Russia had severely miscalculated on the Western response to the invasion. Both the energy weapon and nuclear threats had failed to deter the West. There were also deficiencies revealed in Russia’s military performance, the mobilization and the conduct of part of the elite. This is however water under the dam, because there is no way back. Surrender to the West would result in Russia’s loss of sovereignty and the possibility of Russia’s disappearance. The only course is to stick it out until Ukraine excluding Western Ukraine has been conquered and the territories integrated into Russia.

    "Avoiding defeat, however, doesn’t mean victory. A scenario of "freezing" hostilities along the front lines would mean that Moscow admits its inability to achieve the declared goals of the SVO, i.e., its [Russia's] moral defeat.

    Furthermore, such a "freezing" would be a mere respite preceding a, more than likely, resumption of hostilities by an adversary that does not intend to renounce its maximalist goals. Nevertheless, this option exists and, as far as one can judge, is being worked on by interested parties.

    There also exists the scenario of strategic success. Here, I deliberately don’t employ the word "victory," because in our domestic collective consciousness, after 1945 this word began to mean a crushing defeat of the enemy, his complete and unconditional surrender.

    As applied to the situation in Ukraine, Russia's taking control of the entire eastern, southern, and central parts of the neighboring country would be counted a strategic success. The western part of Ukraine, which would remain outside Russian control, cannot in principle be integrated into the Russian civilizational space; it would become a foreign body, a source of instability".
     

    Replies: @Greasy William

  298. @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack


    ...Ukrainian soldiers on the front lines continuously state that they are dying
     
    I am skeptical of these 'statements', people are not like that. But there is probably a fairly broad spectrum of views. What matters in the long run is that these sacrifices are unnecessary - there is no gain for the soldiers in it, Kiev will not control those areas, so why die for it? My understanding is that Kiev has exactly the same convict-fight-for-your-release program, both sides do what they can.

    You are badly out of step from what the actual thinking is about Ukraine among its neighbors. You must be watching the fanatically propagandized Western media - they are lying to you. The attitudes to the war are more nuanced and realistic, the pathetic chest-beating is done by a few clowns. But I won't convince you, only the reality will...so wait for your victory, or get ready to bad-mouth the loss as "Pyrrhic" or temporary...we have been watching the neo-con morons predicting and lying for the last 15-20 years - remember the "they will never pacify the Chechens...", "they are dying out", "Russian economy is a gas station it will collapse"...those are idiotic statements, I fully expect more of them as the project of Nato-Ukraine-without-any-Russians collapses...

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    You are badly out of step from what the actual thinking is about Ukraine among its neighbors. You must be watching the fanatically propagandized Western media – they are lying to you.

    I don’t think so. The winner of this war will be the one that has clearer access to weapons and ammunition, not to the empty chest beating of a known Russian cheerleader like you, who for some reason has an unwarranted attachment to the former Soviet Union. Here’s a list of Ukraine’s neighbors that are providing more than pure lip service to Ukraine, but are backing up their intents with real support. This doesn’t even include the massive amount of support from the US, Canada and other countries outside of the European continent. Can you provide a similar list of countries helping to provide much needed supplies to Russia? It’s well known fact that Russia is seriously in need of military supplies needed to supply its war efforts. Where’s it going to come from?

    https://i0.wp.com/epthinktank.eu/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/EPRS-AaG-729431-Delivery-weapons-military-aid-Ukraine-FINAL.png?fit=1024%2C617&ssl=1

  299. Behold the White Tiger, come again. The Megatron.

  300. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)
     
    His paganism is simply aesthetic. He builds "Excalibur" as a history of Uther Pendragon family, not just Arthur, but Morgana too. It is pretty pagan in itself, since paganism elevated kinship more than Christianity.

    Who is MZB?


    Personally, I believe that the story of King Arthur is best represented by a fusionism of the pagan with the Christian, and I believe it damages it when we disregard the latter element.
     
    Where do you see this potential for development of Christian element...? It is a story of magic, not of exorcism.

    The trouble today is that we have lost nearly all trace of pagan moralism in Europe. There is not code of it, or authority, and it is liable to be hijacked by irreligious feminists, who the druids probably would have burnt at the stake.
     
    The lack of developed doctrine was always a deficiency of paganism. You just worshipped gods because they were your gods (with some exception of later cults like Mithraism) in rather narcisstic way. Maybe when God confused languages at Babel, his opponent created a cult for every language: Hermes Trismegistos was a god with thousand faces, after all.

    As for women, since the older pagan societies were often matrilineal, unfortunately it looks that their status could have been quite elevated, especially in religions of the Great Goddess. In no religion women pretended to be men, but in some cults men pretended to be women, like priests of Kybele (Galli), which again points to the fact that women, not men, were the point of reference. Coming back to "Excalibur", it is therefore not surprising that Morgana, a female, is a powerful witch, which can be only neutered with the help of Graal itself (but not the cross).

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird

    It is a story of magic, not of exorcism.

    The tale of Camelot is fundamentally about knights and chivalry, and includes ideas like protecting the weak and staying true to your love. In a romantic, or even an historical sense, these things are inseparable from Christianity, which is underlined by the fact that Medieval Europe then called itself “Christendom.”

    Show me a pagan knight. There were none! And the most famous individual knights like Godfrey of Bouillon or Geoffroi de Charny were pious men. Meanwhile, the most famous groups of knights were religious orders, like the Templar and the Knights of St. John.

    In Monmouth, Arthur says “… I, who remain faithful to my God… with the help of Christ.” He was rallying his troops.

    Why put the Christian elements in, beyond reasons of authenticity? For the reasons they were there originally – to inspire.

    [MORE]

    Anyway, you might as well try to depict a samurai while cutting out Zen. I’m sure it can be done, but all it would do is show modernism creeping in.

    Who is MZB?

    Marion Zimmer Bradley. She wrote The Mysts of Avalon. Plays up the pagan angle. Really feminist and consequently pretty trashy. IIRC, at one point Guenevere is in bed with both Arthur and Lancelot, and it is hinted that they are both gay.

    She was a bestselling author, but it has come out that she married a pedophile (which really makes her a weirdo), and helped him abuse their children.

    Anyway, I think it takes a moral person to tell the tale properly. A Believer or at least someone who values Christianity. Not someone like Boorman, MZB, or Guy Ritchie (who should be disqualified for marrying Madonna alone).

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    Man, you shouldn't read this story through details but details through story.
    It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.

    The term "knight" is rather about understanding of listeners of the story than about story itself... since Arthur was to live in the Dark Age after Romans, in reality "knight" should be Latin "comes" probably.

    Anyway, knights were part of secular feudal system, not of clergy. In practice, they never refused to fight even if fight was unjust and did not defend the poor.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @songbird, @Wokechoke

  301. @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow

    Ukrainian soldiers on the front lines continuously state that they are dying to protect their lands from uninvited enemies. What are the Russian soldiers fighting for? Convicts who make it 6 months get furloughed. Chechens following orders (and getting decimated left and right). Hipsters in Moscow, like Karlin, extolling the virtues of imperialism, while safely ensconced in their coffee house culture. And you? Truly out of step with your Slovakian neighbors who seem eager to help their Ukrainian neighbors!

    Replies: @Beckow, @Wokechoke

    Ukies are the people of the Dneiper & Bug and the Russians are the people of the Don & Volga. The Germans are the people of the Rhine & Elbe. Poles are People of the Vistula. The Danube is quite complex though. It’s split between Germans, Hungarians. Serbs and Romanians.

    The complication is that the Don and Dnieper go to the Sea on each side of the Crimea.

  302. @Greasy William
    @Sean

    According to ISW (I know they are hated on this site and I certainly don't take their word as gospel, but they are worth listening to, imo) Putin has no interest in any sort of face saving partial victory. Putin wants the conquest of the entirety of Ukraine and to that end has begun the process of raising and equipping a one million man army that will be in theatre.

    Can Ukraine hold up against such a force? I would think not. So I assume if it comes to this you would see Ukraine suddenly develop and air force flown by American "advisors" to prevent a collapse of the Ukrainian lines. Not really sure where this ends.

    Replies: @A123, @Sean

    According to ISW … Putin has no interest

    Do you mean this ISW?

    https://www.understandingwar.org/

    If so, they are a content aggregator. One can “Find things on ISW”, however “According to ISW” is a bit of a misnomer. It is better to follow their copious footnotes to find the specific source they are quoting.
    __

    ISW efforts to pull together reports inside of Iran is near unique.

    https://www.understandingwar.org/project/iran-project

    The Fake Stream Media is uninterested and far too lazy to cover something that does not generate salable “sound bites”.

    Putin wants the conquest of the entirety of Ukraine and to that end has begun the process of raising and equipping a one million man army that will be in theatre.

    That sounds like something a Russia nationalist would say on RT. I am dubious about that as Putin’s actual thinking. Russia is going to have to pay for reconstruction on any territory they keep. Taking ALL of Ukraine, wrecking most of it in the process, is GW Bush thinking.

    PEACE 😇

  303. @S
    @songbird


    But I think that we got to remember that Boorman was the guy who directed Deliverance. (NOT the type of guy I would want writing or directing a King Arthur Film.) I don’t think he had any nationalistic feeling or a moral vision. His paganism is more likely to be atheistic, like MZB (whose own attempt I consider terrible.)

    If Boorman got some things right, I consider it more like an accident.
     
    Boorman also directed the 1974 film Zardoz in Ireland, where I believe he made his home. The film had a lot of Irish extras. Boorman's comment about the young women extras was that he found it difficult to coerce them into exposing their breasts for his film.

    I respect their modesty, even if he didn't.

    Replies: @songbird

    Thanks. I’ve seen that movie, or at least parts of it. Hadn’t realized it was filmed in Ireland, until now. Connery is Irish in his paternal line. I think that it an amusing scene at the end when they play Beethoven, and show him. (though I am not crazy about the movie.)

    I think Boorman still lives in his old house in Ireland, with Daniel Day-Lewis, as his neighbor. That’s in Wicklow. One could consider it the most mountainy place near to Dublin. The stronghold of Fiach McHugh O’Byrne was there. And the Irish army (such that it is) does some of its training there.

    [MORE]

    Been to the area. Grasped a nettle there as a child, and I’ll not forget it.

    I regret to say, it most likely has been enriched heavily, like seemingly all of rural Ireland in the current year.

    • Replies: @S
    @songbird

    Am sorry to hear about the forced 'enrichment'' of Ireland by colonists and settlers, whereby (alas!) the Plantation lives on.

    Zardoz as a film is certainly a bit offbeat and odd.

    I enjoyed the scenery of the Irish countryside, and the lake was surreal.

    https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-YcKE-SIlC2s/WhzZzxAsuFI/AAAAAAAAgh4/3OwxKLww1KYXNMV44oyto8vIhxLEWD8qwCLcBGAs/s1600/Head-over-lake-Zardoz-1974.jpg

    And, of course, any film featuring the luscious Charlotte Rampling can't be all bad. :-D



    https://www.tafce.com/images/5/57/Consuella_-_Edited.png

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  304. @Wokechoke
    @Yahya

    How old are you? Berry is a pretty average in most respects. exogamic interest is all well and good as a young man but, my dude, look at Prince Harry. He's ruined himself hooked with oil drilling Black Pussy. Think of what awaits him or yourself in middle age.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Yahya

    How old are you?

    I’m unmarried and in my early-to-mid 20s, so my interest in females is pretty high. My tastes are wide-ranging for now; so I don’t mind “looking” at females outside my own race. But if we are talking marriage, then I’d prefer someone from my own kind, which is Middle Eastern Caucasian. Incidentally that’s also the appearance I’m most attracted to. Something like Queen Rania or Amal Clooney would be the ideal spouse for middle age.

    However, the term “exogamic” can be problematic in my context, since Egypt is somewhat mixed already. Is a Nubian girl such as the one pictured below outside of my ethnic group?

    No, I know 2 girls in my social circle who are visibly black-admixed; both of them decently attractive; culturally they are identical and they carry themselves well. However, one of them is none too bright, and the other has an incompatible personality. So I won’t be marrying either; but theoretically I would be willing to marry a Nubian-Egyptian who is honest and intelligent. The only issue I can think of is the mild racism encountered by black-ish people in Egypt; though my experience is that hybrids are spared the treatment given to pure sub-Saharan. Anwar Sadat was the paramount leader of Egypt after all.

    You needn’t worry about me making a hasty marital decision. I’ve been very conservative so far, rejecting 2 girls because they were not intelligent enough (a deal-breaker – I don’t want my kids to regress to the mean). Currently I’m looking at a half-German, quarter-Egyptian, quarter-Palestinian girl, though we are still in the initial phases. She’s as Caucasian-looking as they come, but Egyptian society also wouldn’t view it as necessarily intermarriage, and obviously the racism would be less than what is experienced by blacks.

    Berry is a pretty average in most respects.

    She’s above-average in looks by normal standards imo. But sure, for a celebrity she’s nothing special.

    What is the lineage for Nadia Ali (Urdu: نادیہ علی, Arabic: نادية علي;)

    What does this mean and how should I know?

    Are you referring to her light phenotype?

    There are a fair number of pure-bred Pakistanis who look like her.

    I don’t think she’s Arab-admixed. Just born in Libya.

    She’s nice-looking. High-caste Pakistani women are a good-looking bunch as well.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Yahya



    What is the lineage for Nadia Ali (Urdu: نادیہ علی, Arabic: نادية علي;)
     
    What does this mean and how should I know? Are you referring to her light phenotype?

    There are a fair number of pure-bred Pakistanis who look like her. I don’t think she’s Arab-admixed. Just born in Libya
     
    Thanks.

    To me she looks like a part British mix. Similar genetic concept to Halle Berry. I did not realize that Pakistani "exclusive caste" dynamics were strong enough to produce someone so atypical versus the average Pakistani phenotype.

    I appreciate the information.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Yahya

  305. However, one of them is none too bright

    Since you aren’t interested, can I have her?

    • LOL: Yahya
  306. @Yahya
    @Yahya

    Forgot to mention that Afro-Caucasian hybrids are a good-looking bunch. That's a key difference between them and pure blacks. Attractive "blacks" like Halle Berry and Beyonce are almost invariably admixed.

    I know a Kenyan girl who is as pretty as they come. Initially I assumed she was of Indian descent, but later found out she had a Yemeni father.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @A123, @silviosilver

    Forgot to mention that Afro-Caucasian hybrids are a good-looking bunch.

    You also forgot to mention that this is your opinion, rather than a fact of reality; and an opinion in which, I must say, you seem deeply invested in propagandizing to others. Of course, you are perfectly free to hold any opinion any you like, evidence be damned. I would point out, however, that the case for your opinion isn’t made by cherry-picking a few examples, but by considering the average outcome of such pairings, which in my opinion is: not very impressive. Human beauty has been described, I think quite rightly, as “idealization away from the ape.” If you buy into that theory, then you can draw your own conclusions about the contribution the Africanus is capable of making towards its attainment.

    Black, mulatto.

    Potatoe, potato.

    That seems inconsistent with your other opinions. The difference between, say, the average Greek and the average German is rather less than the difference between Meghan Markle and, say, Robert Mugabe. But if somebody calls a Greek “white,” you insist that “no way buddy, tomaytoes is tomaytoes and tomahtoes is tomahtoes, two totally different things,” and you proceed to treat the blog to another of your pic-posting sprees to prove it. To be sure, the latter is an opinion I tend to agree with, but consistency would require me to likewise note the even larger differences between so-called “blacks,” rather than lump them all in the same category.

    Either you are misinformed, or are lying to reinforce your victim complex.

    Blacks attack whites at rates vastly exceeding rates at which whites attack blacks. Utterly pointless to attempt to deny this.

    And since whites are being systematically deprived of the conditions necessary for ongoing existence – ie their racial existence is being unfairly cut short – it makes sense to refer to it as a ‘soft genocide.’

  307. @Yahya
    @Wokechoke


    How old are you?
     
    I’m unmarried and in my early-to-mid 20s, so my interest in females is pretty high. My tastes are wide-ranging for now; so I don’t mind “looking” at females outside my own race. But if we are talking marriage, then I’d prefer someone from my own kind, which is Middle Eastern Caucasian. Incidentally that’s also the appearance I’m most attracted to. Something like Queen Rania or Amal Clooney would be the ideal spouse for middle age.

    However, the term “exogamic” can be problematic in my context, since Egypt is somewhat mixed already. Is a Nubian girl such as the one pictured below outside of my ethnic group?


    https://www.hoteliermiddleeast.com/2021/05/Lze10mwQ-rania.jpg


    No, I know 2 girls in my social circle who are visibly black-admixed; both of them decently attractive; culturally they are identical and they carry themselves well. However, one of them is none too bright, and the other has an incompatible personality. So I won’t be marrying either; but theoretically I would be willing to marry a Nubian-Egyptian who is honest and intelligent. The only issue I can think of is the mild racism encountered by black-ish people in Egypt; though my experience is that hybrids are spared the treatment given to pure sub-Saharan. Anwar Sadat was the paramount leader of Egypt after all.

    You needn’t worry about me making a hasty marital decision. I’ve been very conservative so far, rejecting 2 girls because they were not intelligent enough (a deal-breaker - I don’t want my kids to regress to the mean). Currently I’m looking at a half-German, quarter-Egyptian, quarter-Palestinian girl, though we are still in the initial phases. She’s as Caucasian-looking as they come, but Egyptian society also wouldn’t view it as necessarily intermarriage, and obviously the racism would be less than what is experienced by blacks.


    Berry is a pretty average in most respects.
     
    She’s above-average in looks by normal standards imo. But sure, for a celebrity she’s nothing special.

    @A123


    What is the lineage for Nadia Ali (Urdu: نادیہ علی, Arabic: نادية علي;)
     
    What does this mean and how should I know?

    Are you referring to her light phenotype?

    There are a fair number of pure-bred Pakistanis who look like her.

    I don’t think she’s Arab-admixed. Just born in Libya.

    She’s nice-looking. High-caste Pakistani women are a good-looking bunch as well.

    https://youtu.be/c1xNcuUBVCo

    Replies: @A123

    What is the lineage for Nadia Ali (Urdu: نادیہ علی, Arabic: نادية علي;)

    What does this mean and how should I know? Are you referring to her light phenotype?

    There are a fair number of pure-bred Pakistanis who look like her. I don’t think she’s Arab-admixed. Just born in Libya

    Thanks.

    To me she looks like a part British mix. Similar genetic concept to Halle Berry. I did not realize that Pakistani “exclusive caste” dynamics were strong enough to produce someone so atypical versus the average Pakistani phenotype.

    I appreciate the information.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @A123


    To me she looks like a part British mix.
     
    Unlikely she has any British or recent European ancestry; it would’ve been mentioned in her bio. The reason why she looks Caucasian-y is because a horde of Aryans invaded and raped her ancestors 3,000 years ago (also some Iranian farmers migrated eastward even before that; but that’s less exciting). As mentioned, her phenotype is not unique among Pakistanis or North Indians more generally. It doesn’t constitute the majority; but nor is it exceptionally rare like the Kalash phenotype. And South Asia’s population is extraordinarily large (2 billion people) such that even if “only” 5% of them had a light, Aryan-shifted phenotype; that would amount to 100 million people.

    I’ve encountered a fair number of high-caste Hindus who share this light phenotype as well; because they alongside Pakistanis are significantly Indo-European admixed, to a rate of 15-25%+, depending on region and caste. Sometimes the Aryan genes can make itself visible externally; other times the Australoid component predominates. There’s significant variation even within families. Generally the higher classes/castes would be more Caucasian on average. But there’s overlap to some extent.


    I did not realize that Pakistani “exclusive caste” dynamics were strong enough to produce someone so atypical versus the average Pakistani phenotype.
     
    Of course the caste-dynamics are strong enough; this is the Indian subcontinent we are talking about :) . In Pakistan the caste system is not outwardly acknowledged due to the influence of Islam; but from what I gather it continues in a covert manner. The caste system has merely been replaced with the class system. The villagers in Pakistan probably wouldn’t murder a man for eloping with a woman from a lower class (though this has happened before: https://www.nytimes.com/1990/12/08/opinion/l-pakistan-certainly-has-a-caste-system-224690.html); but there are strong social barriers to marrying downwards.

    Nadia Ali isn’t even the lightest or most atypical-looking Pakistani. There are some who look very Middle Eastern, even Southern European. Some of them claim ancestry from Turks, Persians or most commonly, Arabs; but genetic evidence indicates that almost all "Syed" claims were made up; and that little to no traces of Arab ancestry exist among Pakistanis or other South Asians. They are merely South Asians who happen to be on the very edge of the phenotypic distribution. They also happen to be disproportionally selected for the screen by Bollywood, owing to their physical beauty, as for example Iqra Aziz:


    https://www.thenews.com.pk//assets/uploads/magazine/2019-05-17/472185_4052296_Iqra-Aziz-mag_magazine.jpg


    It's one of my favorite phenotypes, perhaps because it's close to the Middle Eastern one; yet slightly exotic.

    But the typical lower-caste North Indian/Pakistani looks a bit more like the Sabri Brothers:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83y9oDt5kJc&ab_channel=IqbalRazvi

    This one is one of my least favorite phenotypes :)

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  308. @Yahya
    @S


    About thirty thousand Black on White rapes year in and year out for decades now in the United States, along with a great many other one sided crimes,, would beg to disagree with you about that. Just because a corrupt corporate media refuses to report it doesn’t change the facts of the matter.
     
    You are conflating crime with genocide. Your statistics are out-of-whack too.

    https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/topic-pages/tables/table-21

    5,412 African-Americans were arrested for rape in 2016, total (not just black-on-white), accounting for 29% of total rapes in the US.

    12,571 White Americans were arrested for rape, accounting for 67% of total rapes. Roughly 3,700 of those were Hispanic, the rest non-Hispanic whites.

    Either you are misinformed, or are lying to reinforce your victim complex.

    Crime is not the same as genocide. If African-Americans are over-represented in rape crimes; it’s because of their higher propensity for violence and lower average impulse control. There is no deliberate plan by a majority of blacks to genocide whites.

    The so-called white genocide is largely self-inflicted; goody white liberals want to virtue-signal their openness and cosmopolitism by opening the doors to foreigners; whose main intent is to improve their standard of living, not genocide whites, you whiny nut.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    Interracial rape is almost exclusively one way traffic. Gang rape is almost exclusively a black practice.

    • Agree: S
  309. @A123
    @Yahya



    What is the lineage for Nadia Ali (Urdu: نادیہ علی, Arabic: نادية علي;)
     
    What does this mean and how should I know? Are you referring to her light phenotype?

    There are a fair number of pure-bred Pakistanis who look like her. I don’t think she’s Arab-admixed. Just born in Libya
     
    Thanks.

    To me she looks like a part British mix. Similar genetic concept to Halle Berry. I did not realize that Pakistani "exclusive caste" dynamics were strong enough to produce someone so atypical versus the average Pakistani phenotype.

    I appreciate the information.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Yahya

    To me she looks like a part British mix.

    Unlikely she has any British or recent European ancestry; it would’ve been mentioned in her bio. The reason why she looks Caucasian-y is because a horde of Aryans invaded and raped her ancestors 3,000 years ago (also some Iranian farmers migrated eastward even before that; but that’s less exciting). As mentioned, her phenotype is not unique among Pakistanis or North Indians more generally. It doesn’t constitute the majority; but nor is it exceptionally rare like the Kalash phenotype. And South Asia’s population is extraordinarily large (2 billion people) such that even if “only” 5% of them had a light, Aryan-shifted phenotype; that would amount to 100 million people.

    I’ve encountered a fair number of high-caste Hindus who share this light phenotype as well; because they alongside Pakistanis are significantly Indo-European admixed, to a rate of 15-25%+, depending on region and caste. Sometimes the Aryan genes can make itself visible externally; other times the Australoid component predominates. There’s significant variation even within families. Generally the higher classes/castes would be more Caucasian on average. But there’s overlap to some extent.

    I did not realize that Pakistani “exclusive caste” dynamics were strong enough to produce someone so atypical versus the average Pakistani phenotype.

    Of course the caste-dynamics are strong enough; this is the Indian subcontinent we are talking about 🙂 . In Pakistan the caste system is not outwardly acknowledged due to the influence of Islam; but from what I gather it continues in a covert manner. The caste system has merely been replaced with the class system. The villagers in Pakistan probably wouldn’t murder a man for eloping with a woman from a lower class (though this has happened before: https://www.nytimes.com/1990/12/08/opinion/l-pakistan-certainly-has-a-caste-system-224690.html); but there are strong social barriers to marrying downwards.

    Nadia Ali isn’t even the lightest or most atypical-looking Pakistani. There are some who look very Middle Eastern, even Southern European. Some of them claim ancestry from Turks, Persians or most commonly, Arabs; but genetic evidence indicates that almost all “Syed” claims were made up; and that little to no traces of Arab ancestry exist among Pakistanis or other South Asians. They are merely South Asians who happen to be on the very edge of the phenotypic distribution. They also happen to be disproportionally selected for the screen by Bollywood, owing to their physical beauty, as for example Iqra Aziz:

    It’s one of my favorite phenotypes, perhaps because it’s close to the Middle Eastern one; yet slightly exotic.

    But the typical lower-caste North Indian/Pakistani looks a bit more like the Sabri Brothers:

    This one is one of my least favorite phenotypes 🙂

    • Thanks: A123
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    Doesn't this Jericho guy of 9000 years look a bit like Sabri brothers when with beard and hair...? His skull was so deformed in the way once popular in Mezoamerica (head flattening) that it was originally classified as female ! I reckon that without deformations he would be even more Sabri-like.

    Even though some important characteristics could be viewed directly on the outside of the model and others internally, with the aid of radiological imaging exams, it was only with computed (micro)tomography exams that more important data could be observed. Among these data, we note those related to gender and artificial remodeling (deformation) of the skull. Due to this alteration, the skull had originally been classified as female,

    https://ortogonline-com.translate.goog/doc/pt_br/OrtogOnLineMag/5/Jericho.html?_x_tr_sch=http&_x_tr_sl=pt&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=pt-BR&_x_tr_pto=wapp


    Here he is:

    To present the work of facial approximation, the authors opted for two approaches. A face with more objective elements in grayscale, containing only the face, expression marks to show age and the action of the climate on the skin, with eyebrows and eyelashes, but without hair or beard and with eyes closed ( Fig. 45 ). Such an image is quite didactic in the context of presenting the artificial deformation of the skull, both from the profile, where it is most notorious, and from the frontal view.

    https://ortogonline-com.translate.goog/doc/pt_br/OrtogOnLineMag/5/_images/Jeri_4.jpg?_x_tr_sch=http&_x_tr_sl=pt&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=pt-BR&_x_tr_pto=wapp


    A rendering (final image) was also generated with more speculative elements, such as hair, beard, skin pigmentation and eyes open ( Fig. 46 ). It was not the objective that such an image represented the individual in life with total accuracy, but only a basis according to the climatic characteristics of the region. These identification elements are more significant when used for presentation to the general public, which is mostly not experts in forensic sciences.

    https://ortogonline-com.translate.goog/doc/pt_br/OrtogOnLineMag/5/_images/Jeri_5.jpg?_x_tr_sch=http&_x_tr_sl=pt&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=pt-BR&_x_tr_pto=wapp

    Replies: @Yahya

  310. @Beckow
    @Miro23


    ...what is its natural level?
     
    Good question, it probably varies over time and how successful other societies are. US had two recent peaks: first in 50's-70's based on the global post-WW2 exhaustion, and in the 90's based on the unexpected windfall from the collapsing communist societies - China handled its commie collapse by offering extremely cheap goods to the West (US). It was ending anyway, US has been in an economic downturn since 2008.

    US is naturally a very wealthy country in land-resources with the ability to command skills from other parts of the world. It has English - a huge cultural advantage. But the quality of people has dropped dramatically and the massive ongoing immigration is not helping. Do you think that the poorly educated, wokeness-infested, swarthy-short-fat-emasculated-gender confused younger Americans can fix it? Not bloody likely...

    The more natural level of US consumption would be slightly above Argentina or more advanced parts of Asia. Something like US in the 1920's or 1900's: rich, comfortable, but not dominant. Even today on paper an American has 6-times the GDP/capita of a Chinese - but is that really true? is the Chinese really consuming 6 times less in housing, education, health care, goodies, food, travel...? Of course not, it is an artificial multiplier of an over-valued dollar and counting a huge number of 'economic activities' that don't add to actual consumption (US is good at churning and counting things).

    But I still think US will do better than Europe - the resources and geography are just so much better. Europe is mostly f...ed and they only have themselves to blame.

    Replies: @AP, @Miro23

    US is naturally a very wealthy country in land-resources with the ability to command skills from other parts of the world.

    The land helps, but there are resource poor places like Japan that do very well. Also resource rich places like South Africa and Ukraine that are a disaster.

    A useful indicator seems to be world manufacturing leadership.

    In the first part of the 19th century, Great Britain was the world’s leading manufacturer (coal, iron , steam power, railways) and at the time was called the “Workshop of the World”. Not coincidentally it was the world’s leading power.

    In the first part of the 20th century, the United States displaced Britain to become the world’s leading manufacturer (mass production, electricity, chemicals, radio, oil, internal combustion engine) and in turn became the world’s leading power. There was that challenge from Germany but it was resolved.

    In the first part of the 21st century, China has displaced the US as the “Workshop of the World” and is gathering to itself the consequent wealth and power (Belt and Road Initiative and world trade – commodities and finished goods).

    So China is apparently doing to the US what the US did to Great Britain. Britain’s one time “Workshop of the World” (the North of England – Manchester, Birmingham, Leeds, Sheffield and Glasgow, Scotland) still exists but it’s a depressed post-industrial wasteland.

    The two great blows that finished Great Britain were WW1 and WW2 so a WW3 could finish with the US. Changes in world manufacturing leadership do seem to lead to changes in world political leadership + produce particularly dangerous times.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Miro23


    ...Changes in world manufacturing leadership do seem to lead to changes in world political leadership + produce particularly dangerous times.
     
    True, I agree with your analysis...I would add that for a few decades around 1900 it was Germany that aspired to the world mfg leadership. We have something to look forward to: the voluntary abandonment by US of its mfg role in the last 20-30 years was a selfish (by the elite) and very stupid (by the whole society) move, now for the consequences...it will be volatile.

    ...resource poor places like Japan that do very well. Also resource rich places like South Africa and Ukraine that are a disaster.
     
    Japan is not that great, you feel the lack of resources on every step, a disciplined, regimented but quite poor country. People in Tokyo or Osaka have never lived as well as people in Prague or Budapest - AP can count the cars and washing machines all he wants, the daily lives of most Japanese have always been much worse.

    S Africa and Ukieland suffer from bad demographics. I have in the past hesitated to say it about the Ukies and used to assign their misfortunes to bad location and bad luck - Germans, Russians, Poles, Tatars wanted their resources - but this latest instance of mass stupidity suggests that there is something actually wrong with the people - they don't accept themselves, yearn to be elsewhere, lack self-preservation and basic IQ skills like 'anticipate consequences!' Sad people marching towards oblivion, dying needlessly for what they don't get (the Nato-Ukraine project), others moving westward to do menial jobs (and worse). Most are bitter, confused, with an escapist mentality of lost souls.

    It looks like the catastrophe that has been Ukraine is largely due to their under-developed mentality - they remind me of the American natives when the Spanish came. This time the Anglos don't even have to exert themselves and risk going there: Ukies die on their own and send their women to the admired West nicely packaged...who the f..k does that? What kind of self-respect can these people have? And all of it managed by the conductor-clown in his Kiev bunker...simply precious...

    Replies: @A123

  311. @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective


    It is a story of magic, not of exorcism.
     
    The tale of Camelot is fundamentally about knights and chivalry, and includes ideas like protecting the weak and staying true to your love. In a romantic, or even an historical sense, these things are inseparable from Christianity, which is underlined by the fact that Medieval Europe then called itself "Christendom."

    Show me a pagan knight. There were none! And the most famous individual knights like Godfrey of Bouillon or Geoffroi de Charny were pious men. Meanwhile, the most famous groups of knights were religious orders, like the Templar and the Knights of St. John.

    In Monmouth, Arthur says “… I, who remain faithful to my God… with the help of Christ." He was rallying his troops.

    Why put the Christian elements in, beyond reasons of authenticity? For the reasons they were there originally - to inspire.

    Anyway, you might as well try to depict a samurai while cutting out Zen. I'm sure it can be done, but all it would do is show modernism creeping in.

    Who is MZB?
     
    Marion Zimmer Bradley. She wrote The Mysts of Avalon. Plays up the pagan angle. Really feminist and consequently pretty trashy. IIRC, at one point Guenevere is in bed with both Arthur and Lancelot, and it is hinted that they are both gay.

    She was a bestselling author, but it has come out that she married a pedophile (which really makes her a weirdo), and helped him abuse their children.

    Anyway, I think it takes a moral person to tell the tale properly. A Believer or at least someone who values Christianity. Not someone like Boorman, MZB, or Guy Ritchie (who should be disqualified for marrying Madonna alone).

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Man, you shouldn’t read this story through details but details through story.
    It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.

    The term “knight” is rather about understanding of listeners of the story than about story itself… since Arthur was to live in the Dark Age after Romans, in reality “knight” should be Latin “comes” probably.

    Anyway, knights were part of secular feudal system, not of clergy. In practice, they never refused to fight even if fight was unjust and did not defend the poor.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Man, you shouldn’t read this story through details but details through story. It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.
     
    It can't be properly Christian since too much of it contravenes Christian doctrine. But thematically, it's imbued with Christianity. Sin, repentance and atonement; good triumphs over evil; and Morgana's magic is undone by the holiness of the Grail. In fact, the entire arc of the story can be read as the displacement of paganism by Christianity. Lest anyone miss it, Merlin even put it explicitly to Morgana: "The days of our kind are numbered. The one God comes to drive out the many gods. The spirits of wood and stream grow silent. It's the way of things. It's a time for men and their ways." (I struggled with this part as a kid. I was a good Christian, but dammit, I wanted there to be magic, and spirits, and elves, and dragons, lol.)

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    , @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Man, you shouldn’t read this story through details but details through story.
     
    I just don't think you can take it out of the era. Haven't seen a good attempt at it. (2004 film was bad).

    OTOH, if you leave it in the era, but drop the Christianity, then it comes across as atheistic. How will Arthur show his faith, but by evoking God? We don't have a good feel on Brythonic religion, so it would be obvious LARPing to try to replace Christianity.

    Anyway, I'm not convinced that the story has an origin in pagan times. It doesn't have the same feel as things like Beowulf or the Fenian and Ulster Cycles.


    It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.
     
    This is only heterodoxy. I do grant that the story has pagan elements. But that doesn't mean it isn't a Christian story. There were lots of pagan elements in everyday life in Christian Europe.


    The term “knight” is rather about understanding of listeners of the story than about story itself… since Arthur was to live in the Dark Age after Romans, in reality “knight” should be Latin “comes” probably.
     
    Do you really want a King Arthur story without knights, castles, and chivalry? Isn't that its charm and what makes it special? And isn't it the best exemplar or archetype of that era, in terms of myths?

    Anyway, knights were part of secular feudal system
     
    Secular, yes. But not in the sense it is used today. Not atheistic.

    I descend from a line of Norman knights. In their own family book, one of them is said to have made regular oaths invoking his local church. Meanwhile, the progenitor of the line is said to have taken his name from swearing fealty to a saint on whose saint's day he fought some difficult battle against Vikings. Probably the story is apocryphal, but the point is that it was a story that resonated with them.

    In practice, they never refused to fight even if fight was unjust and did not defend the poor.
     
    Well, the myth is idealized. It was never supposed to be a perfect depiction of what was. But at a minimum there is a big distinction between stationary bandits and roving ones.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Another Polish Perspective

    , @Wokechoke
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Dux Bellorum.

  312. @songbird
    @S


    I liked Excalibur
     
    I also liked it, but was ultimately disappointed because I wanted to love it.

    Guess I had really unrealistic expectations, but when a national-mytho corpus is the subject matter, I just want the highest level of masterwork possible. I say, take ten years to do pre-production, and make it so that it would be impossible for anyone to make a better one. Make the script perfect. Bring on the medieval enthusiasts and scholars, to consult. Scour the countryside, to find the best locations to shoot - the best-shaded bubbling brooks. Coppiced forrests. Real castles.

    I can remember seeing scenes in my head, from reading about the myth and wanting to see those scenes. Imagining them in my head, and adding cinematic details, and yearning to see them.

    Like, I mentioned previously that scene in the snow, with the unflappable knight imagining the rosy cheeks of his love, in two drops of blood that have fallen from his hawk, catching a hare or something. That would be a great scene depicting the ideals of chivalry.

    Arthur is said to have had a shield with Mary painted on it. This I have imagined on the inside of his shield. And I have imagined him being in a battle, and the shield being pierced multiple times on either side of the image, and him holding it up after the battle and seeing light shining through, and then kneeling in a prayer of thanksgiving. This would be a great depiction of faith. (Really missing from most medieval movies, where the focus seems to be on showing corrupt church officials, or the 'racism' and 'intolerance' of the Crusaders.

    I really like all the Euro accents in the film. That moment when Arthur handed over Excalibur to his antagonist was a moment of genius, IMO. Didn't think Guenevere was beautiful enough. And personally, I think the cucking storyline is given too much focus. It is a late edition, and some earlier components of the myth are more interesting to me. I think it is important to make little boys want to be Arthur, and the other knights, and I think it really interferes with that.

    One kind of weird thing about the movie was that the director was actually filming his daughter being ravished by Pendragon.

    As to the plate-armor: I think that's just a silly criticism. Obviously it is meant to be an idealized myth and not to date to some specific time. The choice of armor is stylistic. IMO, it is only arguable on the level of whether it is good art or not.

    Maybe, the shining lights on the armor were a little too dazzling? I don't know, but I didn't hate the armor, though I did originally think it did look a bit over-the-top, I've since accepted that the film had its own look.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @silviosilver

    I also liked it, but was ultimately disappointed because I wanted to love it.

    How old were you when you saw it? I first saw it at eleven or twelve, and was immediately smitten. Of course, I wasn’t looking for the fulfillment of a national mythology, I was simply into all sorts of medieval-y, adventure-y, fantasy things, and Excalibur completely fit the bill. (‘Sword of the Valiant’ 1984, was another. Bit cheesy, but lots of fun. Sean Connery, John Rhys-Davies, little screen time but big impact.)

    I didn’t like the portrayal of Merlin at first, and I thought the young Arthur was too dorky, but I grew to appreciate both with further watching. I agree that Guinevere could have been prettier, although she did play the role quite well.

    The ending was a bit of a letdown, made up for by the several powerful scenes. I agree with you about the scene when Arthur hands over Excalibur to be knighted by his foe. (Charlton Heston freeing the Moorish prisoners in El Cid had a similar impact on me.)

    To me though, all that was secondary to the evocative imagery coupled to the sublime soundtrack. Just magnificent. If there’s ever anything like it again, I fear it won’t be for a long, long time.

    Scour the countryside, to find the best locations to shoot – the best-shaded bubbling brooks. Coppiced forrests. Real castles.

    I’m not sure anyone could have done a whole lot better though. Given the subject matter and the scenery as it was, I think there was easily enough there to satisfy the deepest yearnings of blood and soil nationalist types, the kind who feel themselves so at one with the land they know each owl, each fox, each blade of grass by name.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @silviosilver


    How old were you when you saw it? I first saw it at eleven or twelve
     
    Caught a few scenes of it at about that age, but that was towards the end of the movie - its weakest part, IMO. It was only about 2-3 years ago that I watched the full film and saw the good parts.

    ‘Sword of the Valiant’ 1984, was another.
     
    Haven't seen it.

    Charlton Heston freeing the Moorish prisoners in El Cid had a similar impact on me.
     
    Another one I haven't seen, been meaning to watch it.


    If there’s ever anything like it again, I fear it won’t be for a long, long time.
     
    Oh, definitely. It was a product of its time, and that is one of the things that makes me a bit sad about it. It had a European stamp on it. It didn't feel as deracinated as a Hollywood production, or many things shot in Western Europe today. And I wish there had been more films like that, of a higher quality than the standard B-movie fare.

    A while back we just had The Green Knight, starring an Indian. Haven't seen it, but I doubt there has ever been a greater act of cultural vandalism, at least in terms of film. To go straight to Indian, in something that obviously has ancient and pagan roots. Standard disclaimer: wouldn't care if it had been a Bollywood film, but the offense is that it passed itself off as a European one.


    I’m not sure anyone could have done a whole lot better though. Given the subject matter and the scenery as it was, I think there was easily enough there to satisfy the deepest yearnings of blood and soil nationalist types
     
    You may be right.

    There weren't really any shots that rubbed me the wrong way, like when you see an arid California backdrop that is meant to be a forest in Britain (notable in The Adventures of Robin Hood 1938, which isn't a bad film) - they didn't have that.

    Guess I am kind of a weirdo, but I have an obsession with streams. I've spent a lot of time near them, and thinking about them, so I have an unnaturally high romantic view of them.

    In reality, I brought them up more because I was thinking of the Táin Bó Cúailnge. If that story were ever adapted to the screen, I think there would need to be a hyper focus on selecting the best location shots for river and stream crossings, and even the flow of the water.

    A lot of the shots would be technically pretty difficult. Must be hard to do stunt work in such places, sometimes the rocks can be as slippery as ice.

    Replies: @S, @silviosilver

  313. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    Man, you shouldn't read this story through details but details through story.
    It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.

    The term "knight" is rather about understanding of listeners of the story than about story itself... since Arthur was to live in the Dark Age after Romans, in reality "knight" should be Latin "comes" probably.

    Anyway, knights were part of secular feudal system, not of clergy. In practice, they never refused to fight even if fight was unjust and did not defend the poor.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @songbird, @Wokechoke

    Man, you shouldn’t read this story through details but details through story. It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.

    It can’t be properly Christian since too much of it contravenes Christian doctrine. But thematically, it’s imbued with Christianity. Sin, repentance and atonement; good triumphs over evil; and Morgana’s magic is undone by the holiness of the Grail. In fact, the entire arc of the story can be read as the displacement of paganism by Christianity. Lest anyone miss it, Merlin even put it explicitly to Morgana: “The days of our kind are numbered. The one God comes to drive out the many gods. The spirits of wood and stream grow silent. It’s the way of things. It’s a time for men and their ways.” (I struggled with this part as a kid. I was a good Christian, but dammit, I wanted there to be magic, and spirits, and elves, and dragons, lol.)

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @silviosilver

    My comment no. 321 was an answer to you. There was some time-out on unz website and it wasn't registered as such.

  314. Yes, but when Merlin says that he is really more like a prophet; his statement does not reflect on the story. The altar and ceremony are very unorthodox too, and Mary is lacking as well.

    Grail is ambiguous: in the movie, it is never really said it is Christian relic. Anyway, even within Christian framework a relic could help a pagan. However, even within Christianity the Grail is kind of ambiguous – it is the alleged relic of Christ blood which has never been found, and whose name really comes from “royal blood” /”sangre real” , sometimes referring to the heretic idea that Jesus lived with Mary Magdalene and their children ( (the real sangre real) in France. Since Grail finally helps Arthur, you could say Arthur is of royal blood too: it confirms his kingship.

  315. @silviosilver
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Man, you shouldn’t read this story through details but details through story. It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.
     
    It can't be properly Christian since too much of it contravenes Christian doctrine. But thematically, it's imbued with Christianity. Sin, repentance and atonement; good triumphs over evil; and Morgana's magic is undone by the holiness of the Grail. In fact, the entire arc of the story can be read as the displacement of paganism by Christianity. Lest anyone miss it, Merlin even put it explicitly to Morgana: "The days of our kind are numbered. The one God comes to drive out the many gods. The spirits of wood and stream grow silent. It's the way of things. It's a time for men and their ways." (I struggled with this part as a kid. I was a good Christian, but dammit, I wanted there to be magic, and spirits, and elves, and dragons, lol.)

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    My comment no. 321 was an answer to you. There was some time-out on unz website and it wasn’t registered as such.

  316. Sher Singh says:
    @Yevardian
    @Sher Singh


    No IRL experience with Armenians so don’t know which side they swing toward.
     
    Among the diaspora (which is all I can personally comment on frankly) there's a big difference between (1) MENA emigrants who emigrated West during the Ottoman collapse, (2) those who left during the post 60's convulsions in the Near-East, (3) Soviet emigrants, and finally very old and once sizable Eastern European diaspora from countries like Poland, Bulgaria and Romania.

    Cultural differences of background are compounded by the fact that Western and Eastern Armenian are often only barely intelligible (I don't know if Punjabi dialects differ from each other or Hindi/Urdu that much), or not at all for those in diaspora with a weak grasp of their ancestral language.

    You could almost put each into their own area of the political compass with (1) being libertarian left, (2) being authoritarian left, (3) being authoritarian right and (4) being libertarian right.
    Of course, that's an oversimplication, but for example I think Dmitri could argue that nearly identical political dynamics can be seen amonst Jewish immigrants to Israel from equivalent background.. most notably Sovok-'Jews' being right of Ariel Sharon, as well as ensuring right-wing secularism in contemporary Israel stays above life-support levels.

    There's also similar phenonema in Armenian emigrants maintaining liberal politics at home whilst sponsoring Dashnak-inspired parties in Armenia itself. In a similar vein, there was a minor kerfuffle a few years ago when Armenia unveiled a statue of f Garegin Nzhdeh as one of the people's national heroes. There was some internal controversy about going about this earlier, but ultimately diaspora voices were decisive.

    He had quite a full life, he's been compared to General Vlasov for the Russians, but I don't think that's quite fair.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garegin_Nzhdeh


    ie a MENA Christian is offended at ancient history, a Persian embarassed & an Afghan proud.
     
    That sounds almost exactly backwards to me. MENA Christian identity and sense of pride is almost entirely rooted in Ancient History.
    Persians likewise are extremely proud of their antiquity and ancient statehood, sometimes to absurd levels. You can see it easily in that Iranians still retain from their past what is now an extremely inflated sense of pride, national importance and power (relative to their current position), in way that can only be equalled globally by the French (and I'm starting to think maybe now or soon Russians, sadly).

    The only Afghans I've met IRL have almost all been Hazaras, so not exactly representative. Anyway as I said at length in an old post somewhere, prior to the late 19th Century, the only people who self-identified as Afghans were the Pashtuns, whom the (relative) lowlanders viewed as barbarians, whilst they themselves considered themselves Persians. More than half of the Shahnahmeh takes place in Khorasan rather than Fars and was written by what would be a Tajik today.
    Millions of mostly Dari speakers have also emigrated to Iran since the 1970s, where their 'bumpkin' accent is often a figure of fun in local TV shows and movies (ironic because technically Dari is a much more conservative or 'pure' dialect of Persian than Farsi is).
    If Afghanistan was a nation-state it would annex a large part of Pakistan whilst the south and west (certainly Herat) would rejoin Iran (who only lost Greater Khorasan under the Zand dynasty iirc, and then the Russians and British both prevented them from reacquiring it).

    The only Kurd I knew well had practically a pathological hatred towards Arabs and anything related to them. Oddly he still considered himself a 'cultural Muslim' which I argued to him was a contradiction in terms... far more than Christianity being a 'Jewish vehicle (which I certainly don't buy, at least as anything intentional on their part, btw), Islam has Arab imperialism inextricably baked into it on the most fundamental level.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    Brown ID in North America is entirely rooted in post 9/11 so in that case it makes sense.
    ie Pathan (Afghan) being too dumb to not be proud & the rest pretending to be White.

    Yea, we consider the real Persia to be Khorasan & Tajik/Pashto.

    @yahya Women belong behind the veil, don’t answer these qs.

  317. @Yahya
    @A123


    To me she looks like a part British mix.
     
    Unlikely she has any British or recent European ancestry; it would’ve been mentioned in her bio. The reason why she looks Caucasian-y is because a horde of Aryans invaded and raped her ancestors 3,000 years ago (also some Iranian farmers migrated eastward even before that; but that’s less exciting). As mentioned, her phenotype is not unique among Pakistanis or North Indians more generally. It doesn’t constitute the majority; but nor is it exceptionally rare like the Kalash phenotype. And South Asia’s population is extraordinarily large (2 billion people) such that even if “only” 5% of them had a light, Aryan-shifted phenotype; that would amount to 100 million people.

    I’ve encountered a fair number of high-caste Hindus who share this light phenotype as well; because they alongside Pakistanis are significantly Indo-European admixed, to a rate of 15-25%+, depending on region and caste. Sometimes the Aryan genes can make itself visible externally; other times the Australoid component predominates. There’s significant variation even within families. Generally the higher classes/castes would be more Caucasian on average. But there’s overlap to some extent.


    I did not realize that Pakistani “exclusive caste” dynamics were strong enough to produce someone so atypical versus the average Pakistani phenotype.
     
    Of course the caste-dynamics are strong enough; this is the Indian subcontinent we are talking about :) . In Pakistan the caste system is not outwardly acknowledged due to the influence of Islam; but from what I gather it continues in a covert manner. The caste system has merely been replaced with the class system. The villagers in Pakistan probably wouldn’t murder a man for eloping with a woman from a lower class (though this has happened before: https://www.nytimes.com/1990/12/08/opinion/l-pakistan-certainly-has-a-caste-system-224690.html); but there are strong social barriers to marrying downwards.

    Nadia Ali isn’t even the lightest or most atypical-looking Pakistani. There are some who look very Middle Eastern, even Southern European. Some of them claim ancestry from Turks, Persians or most commonly, Arabs; but genetic evidence indicates that almost all "Syed" claims were made up; and that little to no traces of Arab ancestry exist among Pakistanis or other South Asians. They are merely South Asians who happen to be on the very edge of the phenotypic distribution. They also happen to be disproportionally selected for the screen by Bollywood, owing to their physical beauty, as for example Iqra Aziz:


    https://www.thenews.com.pk//assets/uploads/magazine/2019-05-17/472185_4052296_Iqra-Aziz-mag_magazine.jpg


    It's one of my favorite phenotypes, perhaps because it's close to the Middle Eastern one; yet slightly exotic.

    But the typical lower-caste North Indian/Pakistani looks a bit more like the Sabri Brothers:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83y9oDt5kJc&ab_channel=IqbalRazvi

    This one is one of my least favorite phenotypes :)

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Doesn’t this Jericho guy of 9000 years look a bit like Sabri brothers when with beard and hair…? His skull was so deformed in the way once popular in Mezoamerica (head flattening) that it was originally classified as female ! I reckon that without deformations he would be even more Sabri-like.

    Even though some important characteristics could be viewed directly on the outside of the model and others internally, with the aid of radiological imaging exams, it was only with computed (micro)tomography exams that more important data could be observed. Among these data, we note those related to gender and artificial remodeling (deformation) of the skull. Due to this alteration, the skull had originally been classified as female,

    https://ortogonline-com.translate.goog/doc/pt_br/OrtogOnLineMag/5/Jericho.html?_x_tr_sch=http&_x_tr_sl=pt&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=pt-BR&_x_tr_pto=wapp

    Here he is:

    To present the work of facial approximation, the authors opted for two approaches. A face with more objective elements in grayscale, containing only the face, expression marks to show age and the action of the climate on the skin, with eyebrows and eyelashes, but without hair or beard and with eyes closed ( Fig. 45 ). Such an image is quite didactic in the context of presenting the artificial deformation of the skull, both from the profile, where it is most notorious, and from the frontal view.

    https://ortogonline-com.translate.goog/doc/pt_br/OrtogOnLineMag/5/_images/Jeri_4.jpg?_x_tr_sch=http&_x_tr_sl=pt&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=pt-BR&_x_tr_pto=wapp

    A rendering (final image) was also generated with more speculative elements, such as hair, beard, skin pigmentation and eyes open ( Fig. 46 ). It was not the objective that such an image represented the individual in life with total accuracy, but only a basis according to the climatic characteristics of the region. These identification elements are more significant when used for presentation to the general public, which is mostly not experts in forensic sciences.

    https://ortogonline-com.translate.goog/doc/pt_br/OrtogOnLineMag/5/_images/Jeri_5.jpg?_x_tr_sch=http&_x_tr_sl=pt&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=pt-BR&_x_tr_pto=wapp

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Doesn’t this Jericho guy of 9000 years look a bit like Sabri brothers when with beard and hair…?
     
    He does yes, would look even more like them if his face was browner.

    You opened a pandora box by posting a facial reconstruction.

    This is a cool one of South Asian modal phenotypes.

    https://twitter.com/aslanpahari/status/1599580007067947008?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Ukies:

    https://twitter.com/darbarnir/status/1613845330990141441?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Yamnaya:

    https://twitter.com/nrken19/status/1553373364533829638?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Roman Emperors:

    https://youtu.be/gfqy7ipjDWI

    Nefertiti:


    https://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dVjKTT47a2Y/S97nkKigDrI/AAAAAAAAAsI/x9d-gFg7PDQ/s1600/nefertiti_hdr_din.jpg

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Emil Nikola Richard, @Talha

  318. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    Doesn't this Jericho guy of 9000 years look a bit like Sabri brothers when with beard and hair...? His skull was so deformed in the way once popular in Mezoamerica (head flattening) that it was originally classified as female ! I reckon that without deformations he would be even more Sabri-like.

    Even though some important characteristics could be viewed directly on the outside of the model and others internally, with the aid of radiological imaging exams, it was only with computed (micro)tomography exams that more important data could be observed. Among these data, we note those related to gender and artificial remodeling (deformation) of the skull. Due to this alteration, the skull had originally been classified as female,

    https://ortogonline-com.translate.goog/doc/pt_br/OrtogOnLineMag/5/Jericho.html?_x_tr_sch=http&_x_tr_sl=pt&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=pt-BR&_x_tr_pto=wapp


    Here he is:

    To present the work of facial approximation, the authors opted for two approaches. A face with more objective elements in grayscale, containing only the face, expression marks to show age and the action of the climate on the skin, with eyebrows and eyelashes, but without hair or beard and with eyes closed ( Fig. 45 ). Such an image is quite didactic in the context of presenting the artificial deformation of the skull, both from the profile, where it is most notorious, and from the frontal view.

    https://ortogonline-com.translate.goog/doc/pt_br/OrtogOnLineMag/5/_images/Jeri_4.jpg?_x_tr_sch=http&_x_tr_sl=pt&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=pt-BR&_x_tr_pto=wapp


    A rendering (final image) was also generated with more speculative elements, such as hair, beard, skin pigmentation and eyes open ( Fig. 46 ). It was not the objective that such an image represented the individual in life with total accuracy, but only a basis according to the climatic characteristics of the region. These identification elements are more significant when used for presentation to the general public, which is mostly not experts in forensic sciences.

    https://ortogonline-com.translate.goog/doc/pt_br/OrtogOnLineMag/5/_images/Jeri_5.jpg?_x_tr_sch=http&_x_tr_sl=pt&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=pt-BR&_x_tr_pto=wapp

    Replies: @Yahya

    Doesn’t this Jericho guy of 9000 years look a bit like Sabri brothers when with beard and hair…?

    He does yes, would look even more like them if his face was browner.

    You opened a pandora box by posting a facial reconstruction.

    This is a cool one of South Asian modal phenotypes.

    https://twitter.com/aslanpahari/status/1599580007067947008?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    [MORE]

    Ukies:

    https://twitter.com/darbarnir/status/1613845330990141441?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Yamnaya:

    Roman Emperors:

    Nefertiti:

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    The picture of Jericho guy without hair looks like Egyptian priest, kind of. Well, upper class Egyptian also practiced head flattening.

    What is amazing is that not only he looks like a Paki, but that head flattening tradition still exists in Pakistan... and it existed in the South of France as late as the beginning of the 20th century.

    Traditional communities in Pakistan have
    been aware of this phenomenon in term
    infants for many generations. Among rural
    people as distant as the Pathans of northern
    Baluchistan and the desert dwellers of south
    east Sindh, mothers specifically seek to
    modify the shape of their babies' heads.

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8110018/

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_cranial_deformation#Europe

    That beckons the question: did all those cultures stem from one larger pre-Indoeuropean culture...?
    In such a case, deformations in Europe could have originated in these older cultures and through phenotypes associated with them (eg. South of France has more of them than the rest of France).

    Anyway, it is amazing how it does continue. A meme goes on and on through thousands of years...

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    I wonder what their Hutus and Tutsis look like. Is there any decent CGI of a machete attack on the terrorized smaller neighbor tribe?

    Have you ever watched Hotel Rwanda?

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Yahya

    , @Talha
    @Yahya

    Before my wife and I were a thing, I was in the market for a wife and one of the young women I met was Pakistani and of the fair complexion, could easily have passed for Latina. One of the cutest smiles I have ever seen (mashaAllah), I can still close my eyes and see it. Everything was fairly compatible, but one big thing - she was more into the political scene (Hizb it-Tahrir kind of stuff) and was totally off-put by Sufism.

    Another one (from Indian background) looked very much like an amalgam between the Bengali and Sri Lankan prototypes - absolutely gorgeous eyes (mashaAllah) and she had this wonderful habit of bashfully covering her mouth when she laughed...one of the most beautifully feminine traits I have ever come across. I lost out to a better man on that one.

    That was quarter of a century ago, I hope they are both doing well.

    Wa salaam.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

  319. @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Doesn’t this Jericho guy of 9000 years look a bit like Sabri brothers when with beard and hair…?
     
    He does yes, would look even more like them if his face was browner.

    You opened a pandora box by posting a facial reconstruction.

    This is a cool one of South Asian modal phenotypes.

    https://twitter.com/aslanpahari/status/1599580007067947008?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Ukies:

    https://twitter.com/darbarnir/status/1613845330990141441?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Yamnaya:

    https://twitter.com/nrken19/status/1553373364533829638?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Roman Emperors:

    https://youtu.be/gfqy7ipjDWI

    Nefertiti:


    https://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dVjKTT47a2Y/S97nkKigDrI/AAAAAAAAAsI/x9d-gFg7PDQ/s1600/nefertiti_hdr_din.jpg

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Emil Nikola Richard, @Talha

    The picture of Jericho guy without hair looks like Egyptian priest, kind of. Well, upper class Egyptian also practiced head flattening.

    What is amazing is that not only he looks like a Paki, but that head flattening tradition still exists in Pakistan… and it existed in the South of France as late as the beginning of the 20th century.

    Traditional communities in Pakistan have
    been aware of this phenomenon in term
    infants for many generations. Among rural
    people as distant as the Pathans of northern
    Baluchistan and the desert dwellers of south
    east Sindh, mothers specifically seek to
    modify the shape of their babies’ heads.

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8110018/

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_cranial_deformation#Europe

    That beckons the question: did all those cultures stem from one larger pre-Indoeuropean culture…?
    In such a case, deformations in Europe could have originated in these older cultures and through phenotypes associated with them (eg. South of France has more of them than the rest of France).

    Anyway, it is amazing how it does continue. A meme goes on and on through thousands of years…

  320. @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    There is certainly some mystery going around how “Ancient Egyptians looked like” since on Egyptian frescos women are yellow, and men are red/brown (even pharaohs, so this is not simply a matter of working in the sun). The reason for this distinction is not known,
     
    It's only a "mystery" to outsiders who are unfamiliar with Middle Eastern phenotypes. Especially American ignoramuses who project their racial dichotomies (white/black) onto the Middle East. Everywhere in the Middle East, from Egypt to Iran, there is a duality of skin colors; some are brown and others are off-white; this holds true for peoples within the same ethno-religious group or even within the same family. The relative ratio of brown-to-white differs by class, ethnicity and region; in Egypt it tilts more brown than white.

    This is Onsi Sawiris, patriarch of the wealthy Coptic Sawiris family:

    https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iVfFqC1.NSmw/v0/-1x-1.jpg

    This is his son Nassif:


    https://answersafrica.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Nassef-and-Sherine-Magar-Sawiris.jpg


    Same family, ethnicity and race/genetics - different skin color.

    Ancient Egyptian appearances are not a mystery to me; they look like modern Egyptians. The tomb paintings are readily recognizable to any Egyptian; the human brain is fairly good at facial recognition and can identify similarities in facial structures between paintings and real life individuals. I've written several posts on Egyptian genetics and phenotypes:

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/egyptians-angry-at-kevin-hart-for-being-an-afrocentrist/#comment-5729767

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-170/#comment-5055550

    Though there are no studies on this; it's been my experience that Egyptian women are lighter on average than men, though with significant overlap. This would explain the tomb frescoes; though it should be noted that Ancient Egyptian women were depicted as both brown and yellow/white:

    https://www.veniceclayartists.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/detail-of-a-wall-painting-in-the-tomb-of-Queen-Nefertari.-Isis-Hathor-leads-the-queen-by-the-hand..jpg

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Interesting, when the goddess Isis is yellow, her female companion is red…

    Maybe yellow had to do with some (semi)religious role of woman, some sort of special association with gods like in Minoan culture…

  321. @Beckow
    @AP


    ...US peaked when others went to war and America sent weapons
     
    A high-level observation that is not as true today. You are stuck with your shallow analogies (Hitler this and that...) - it is always different. In today's situation US has a skin in the game and reputation to gain or lose. US will definitely do better than Europe, but if Russia wins they will be the biggest winner. Washington knows it - that's why they have been so hysterical.

    Americans have 4.5x as many cars per capita as Chinese.
     
    Why is owning 4-5 cars a benefit? Think about it. You have been brainwashed into thinking that more of the same is always better, 5 refrigerators, 3 smart phones, 4 cars...what benefit is it to the 'owner'? He ends up living his life for the others, and for the goodies that he has to constantly maintain and manage. There is an optimal level of wealth and then there is pure mammon, assets for the sake of assets.

    US has on a daily basis quite miserable living conditions: overly complex 'private' institutions that run your life, no security, low-quality unregulated food, no public infrastructure so you are dependent on multiple cars, bad schools, etc... But you are so brainwashed into thinking that garbage-food and TV (with 50% ads), and sitting for hours in traffic jams (but in your car!) is a good lifestyle that you probably won't understand any of it.

    Replies: @AP

    You are stuck with your shallow analogies (Hitler this and that…) – it is always different. In today’s situation US has a skin in the game and reputation to gain or lose. US will definitely do better than Europe, but if Russia wins they will be the biggest winner

    Anything Russia gains will be largely destroyed and depopulated and Russia won’t have the population or the resources to restore it, while its military would be depleted for several years. Ukraine’s western neighbors would at least gain a lot of young educated people, improving their demographics.

    Americans have 4.5x as many cars per capita as Chinese.

    Why is owning 4-5 cars a benefit?

    You falsely claimed that Chinese did not have several times less money per capita than Americans so I provided a concrete example that disproves your claim.

    So now you change the subject to why someone should need so many things and why too much wealth is bad. Maybe it is, but that wasn’t the point.

    US has on a daily basis quite miserable living conditions

    Suicide rate is lower than in many Euro social democracies though.

    overly complex ‘private’ institutions that run your life, no security, low-quality unregulated food, no public infrastructure so you are dependent on multiple cars, bad schools

    1. Security depends on population. American whites experience crime at Visegrad levels.
    2. Americans don’t want public transit because they have a big country that allows them to spread out and have private lands and they can easily afford many cars.
    3. As for schools, American school kids of European descent outperform most Europeans and American universities continue to be among the world’s best.

    You are right about the good but that’s a cultural thing going back to the first settlers, the Puritans and Quakers thought fine foods were sinful so America didn’t develop a nice culinary tradition. Still, if one looks one can find excellent food in the USA.

  322. …if one looks one can find excellent food in the USA.

    Fine, keep on looking, it is a big country, you have all those cars to drive around…quite a life, to each his own. My point about the food was the lack of any meaningful regulation in US resulting in what can be termed as ‘manufactured garbage’ food that masses consume – we see it in the overall health, life expectancy below Europe or parts of Asia, horrific fatness, and the bloated swollen faces of most Americans eating that sh..t.

    You like to separate the European-descent parts into its own category. That is deceptive, Americans are heavily mixed, live together, share their lifestyles. Also only 55-65% are “European” and that totally skews any comparisons – as if we would only consider Northern Italy, or Moscow-St.Petersburg-Sochi in Russia, or only Western Poland. You don’t get to do that: US is all of its people, good, bad, and always fat…

    Suicide in the Euro Scandie countries is high, but it has nothing to do with ‘social-democracy’ or weather. Scandies are strange, disconnected people, they seldom understand reality and have a hard time accepting real life. They are the most propagandized people in the world, pathologically conformist, and very uninteresting – you can only look for the Russian submarines, watch endless “Russian-invasion” TV shows, genuflect in front of Eritreans, give lame ‘prices’ to psychotic murderers when ordered by the bosses across the sea, and worship teenage hysterics for so long. There comes a time when it dawns on an average Sven that he is living in a comfortable but sh..tty life as an appendage to his betters, so he departs early…

    • Replies: @AP
    @Beckow


    Fine, keep on looking [good good], it is a big country, you have all those cars to drive around…quite a life, to each his own
     
    Most Americans are satisfied with crap food and they get what they want. But one can also get good food if one wants, it isn’t hard to find.

    we see it in the overall health, life expectancy below Europe or parts of Asia
     
    Overall US life expectancy is higher than that of your Slovakia, Poland, Hungary, the Baltics, etc.

    Life expectancy is dragged down somewhat because the highly segregated Black people keep shooting one another, unfortunately.

    The life expectancy of European Americans is almost a year higher than for Slovakia.

    You like to separate the European-descent parts into its own category
     
    Because America is highly racially segregated, particularly with the descendants of slaves. Although Euro Americans like Black music they live in different cities or neighborhoods in large cities and lead separate lives and radically different lifestyles (64% of Black parents are unmarried compared to 24% of Euro parents), speak differently, etc. Intermarriage rates are low.

    I don’t have time to calculate stats for Europeans + Asians + Latinos who mix more often, so I just use Euro-American statistics.

    It would be inaccurate to lump such different groups together.

    as if we would only consider Northern Italy
     
    If the differences between Northern and Southern Italians were as stark as between Euro Americans and African Americans it would indeed make sense to consider them separately. But they aren’t. Indeed, America also has regional as well as racial differences. New England Euros are probably more different from Southern ones than Swedes are from Danes. Certainly more so than Brits are from Australians.

    Suicide in the Euro Scandie countries is high, but it has nothing to do with ‘social-democracy’ or weather
     
    I now looked it up and I was mistaken when I said suicide rate was lower than in many Euro social democracies - the suicide rate for Euro Americans in 2020 was actually even higher than among Scandinavians. In Europe, only Russians, Lithuanians, and Ukrainians (in that order) have higher suicide rates then do Euro Americans. Though Belarusians and Latvians are nearly tied. Though I haven’t seen Scandinavian stats by ethnicity, I suspect native rates are higher than Somali ones.
    .

    Replies: @Beckow

  323. @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Doesn’t this Jericho guy of 9000 years look a bit like Sabri brothers when with beard and hair…?
     
    He does yes, would look even more like them if his face was browner.

    You opened a pandora box by posting a facial reconstruction.

    This is a cool one of South Asian modal phenotypes.

    https://twitter.com/aslanpahari/status/1599580007067947008?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Ukies:

    https://twitter.com/darbarnir/status/1613845330990141441?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Yamnaya:

    https://twitter.com/nrken19/status/1553373364533829638?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Roman Emperors:

    https://youtu.be/gfqy7ipjDWI

    Nefertiti:


    https://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dVjKTT47a2Y/S97nkKigDrI/AAAAAAAAAsI/x9d-gFg7PDQ/s1600/nefertiti_hdr_din.jpg

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Emil Nikola Richard, @Talha

    I wonder what their Hutus and Tutsis look like. Is there any decent CGI of a machete attack on the terrorized smaller neighbor tribe?

    Have you ever watched Hotel Rwanda?

    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Paul Kagame has been President for 20 years and Rwandan percapita GDP is still under $1000.


    https://static.mothership.sg/1/2017/07/gif-4.gif

    , @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Have you ever watched Hotel Rwanda?
     
    No.

    What did you make of it?

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard


  324. [MORE]

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Blinky Bill

    In Jason Jorjani's Aeon Byte interview yesterday he said the nukes are going to all fly before 2030 and the earth will be down to less than 2 billion people at the very most and headed down rapidly.

    It is a counterpoint to Copeland's Game of Nations. This is a book with much positive stupid chatter. It is very boring but Copeland makes the argument that the guys on top are allowed any indiscretion so long as the nuclear missiles stay inside their solos. Larceny, rape, murder implicitly included. But. If you have not read the book do not bother.

    James Bond 007 was Fleming's booze-addled fantasy. Real life agents are the dullest human beings ever.

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-64300190



    https://tf-cmsv2-smithsonianmag-media.s3.amazonaws.com/filer/52/e4/52e44474-c2dc-41e0-bb77-42a904695196/this-image-shows-a-portrait-of-dragon-man-credit-chuang-zhao_web.jpg

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Blinky Bill

  325. @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Doesn’t this Jericho guy of 9000 years look a bit like Sabri brothers when with beard and hair…?
     
    He does yes, would look even more like them if his face was browner.

    You opened a pandora box by posting a facial reconstruction.

    This is a cool one of South Asian modal phenotypes.

    https://twitter.com/aslanpahari/status/1599580007067947008?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Ukies:

    https://twitter.com/darbarnir/status/1613845330990141441?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Yamnaya:

    https://twitter.com/nrken19/status/1553373364533829638?s=61&t=2AvP1WFil8yvCICCjbmU2w

    Roman Emperors:

    https://youtu.be/gfqy7ipjDWI

    Nefertiti:


    https://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dVjKTT47a2Y/S97nkKigDrI/AAAAAAAAAsI/x9d-gFg7PDQ/s1600/nefertiti_hdr_din.jpg

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Emil Nikola Richard, @Talha

    Before my wife and I were a thing, I was in the market for a wife and one of the young women I met was Pakistani and of the fair complexion, could easily have passed for Latina. One of the cutest smiles I have ever seen (mashaAllah), I can still close my eyes and see it. Everything was fairly compatible, but one big thing – she was more into the political scene (Hizb it-Tahrir kind of stuff) and was totally off-put by Sufism.

    Another one (from Indian background) looked very much like an amalgam between the Bengali and Sri Lankan prototypes – absolutely gorgeous eyes (mashaAllah) and she had this wonderful habit of bashfully covering her mouth when she laughed…one of the most beautifully feminine traits I have ever come across. I lost out to a better man on that one.

    That was quarter of a century ago, I hope they are both doing well.

    Wa salaam.

    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Talha


    she was more into the political scene (Hizb it-Tahrir kind of stuff) and was totally off-put by Sufism.
     
    Talha have you ever had the pleasure of meeting Zia Inayat Khan?

    Replies: @Talha

  326. @Miro23
    @Beckow


    US is naturally a very wealthy country in land-resources with the ability to command skills from other parts of the world.

     

    The land helps, but there are resource poor places like Japan that do very well. Also resource rich places like South Africa and Ukraine that are a disaster.

    A useful indicator seems to be world manufacturing leadership.

    In the first part of the 19th century, Great Britain was the world's leading manufacturer (coal, iron , steam power, railways) and at the time was called the "Workshop of the World". Not coincidentally it was the world's leading power.

    In the first part of the 20th century, the United States displaced Britain to become the world's leading manufacturer (mass production, electricity, chemicals, radio, oil, internal combustion engine) and in turn became the world's leading power. There was that challenge from Germany but it was resolved.

    In the first part of the 21st century, China has displaced the US as the "Workshop of the World" and is gathering to itself the consequent wealth and power (Belt and Road Initiative and world trade - commodities and finished goods).

    So China is apparently doing to the US what the US did to Great Britain. Britain's one time "Workshop of the World" (the North of England - Manchester, Birmingham, Leeds, Sheffield and Glasgow, Scotland) still exists but it's a depressed post-industrial wasteland.

    The two great blows that finished Great Britain were WW1 and WW2 so a WW3 could finish with the US. Changes in world manufacturing leadership do seem to lead to changes in world political leadership + produce particularly dangerous times.

    Replies: @Beckow

    …Changes in world manufacturing leadership do seem to lead to changes in world political leadership + produce particularly dangerous times.

    True, I agree with your analysis…I would add that for a few decades around 1900 it was Germany that aspired to the world mfg leadership. We have something to look forward to: the voluntary abandonment by US of its mfg role in the last 20-30 years was a selfish (by the elite) and very stupid (by the whole society) move, now for the consequences…it will be volatile.

    …resource poor places like Japan that do very well. Also resource rich places like South Africa and Ukraine that are a disaster.

    Japan is not that great, you feel the lack of resources on every step, a disciplined, regimented but quite poor country. People in Tokyo or Osaka have never lived as well as people in Prague or Budapest – AP can count the cars and washing machines all he wants, the daily lives of most Japanese have always been much worse.

    S Africa and Ukieland suffer from bad demographics. I have in the past hesitated to say it about the Ukies and used to assign their misfortunes to bad location and bad luck – Germans, Russians, Poles, Tatars wanted their resources – but this latest instance of mass stupidity suggests that there is something actually wrong with the people – they don’t accept themselves, yearn to be elsewhere, lack self-preservation and basic IQ skills like ‘anticipate consequences!‘ Sad people marching towards oblivion, dying needlessly for what they don’t get (the Nato-Ukraine project), others moving westward to do menial jobs (and worse). Most are bitter, confused, with an escapist mentality of lost souls.

    It looks like the catastrophe that has been Ukraine is largely due to their under-developed mentality – they remind me of the American natives when the Spanish came. This time the Anglos don’t even have to exert themselves and risk going there: Ukies die on their own and send their women to the admired West nicely packaged…who the f..k does that? What kind of self-respect can these people have? And all of it managed by the conductor-clown in his Kiev bunker…simply precious…

    • Replies: @A123
    @Beckow



    voluntary abandonment by US of its mfg role in the last 20-30 years was a selfish (by the elite) and very stupid (by the whole society) move, now for the consequences…it will be volatile.

     

    I concur.

    The consequences of the WUHAN-19 virus (e.g. trade disruptions) put huge focus on the absence of U.S. domestic manufacturing.

    I know I have said it before, but... MAGA Reindustrialization is the answer. America needs to:

        • Return to energy independence (driven by nuclear and hydrocarbons)
        • Extract and refine its own mineral wealth (e.g. rare earth elements)
        • Produce goods essential to overall national security (including pharmaceuticals, microchips, etc.)

    Slowly ramping up tariffs on all imports would be good for U.S. citizen workers. Gradual decoupling from Asia (not just China) is an achievable goal.

    PEACE 😇
  327. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    I wonder what their Hutus and Tutsis look like. Is there any decent CGI of a machete attack on the terrorized smaller neighbor tribe?

    Have you ever watched Hotel Rwanda?

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Yahya

    Paul Kagame has been President for 20 years and Rwandan percapita GDP is still under $1000.

    [MORE]

  328. @Talha
    @Yahya

    Before my wife and I were a thing, I was in the market for a wife and one of the young women I met was Pakistani and of the fair complexion, could easily have passed for Latina. One of the cutest smiles I have ever seen (mashaAllah), I can still close my eyes and see it. Everything was fairly compatible, but one big thing - she was more into the political scene (Hizb it-Tahrir kind of stuff) and was totally off-put by Sufism.

    Another one (from Indian background) looked very much like an amalgam between the Bengali and Sri Lankan prototypes - absolutely gorgeous eyes (mashaAllah) and she had this wonderful habit of bashfully covering her mouth when she laughed...one of the most beautifully feminine traits I have ever come across. I lost out to a better man on that one.

    That was quarter of a century ago, I hope they are both doing well.

    Wa salaam.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

    she was more into the political scene (Hizb it-Tahrir kind of stuff) and was totally off-put by Sufism.

    Talha have you ever had the pleasure of meeting Zia Inayat Khan?

    • Replies: @Talha
    @Blinky Bill

    Hi Blinky,

    No, sorry - can’t say that I have.

    Peace.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

  329. @Blinky Bill
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FmkKeY4XEAEWVGl.jpg

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmkz0FHWIAAVtKw.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Ivashka the fool

    In Jason Jorjani’s Aeon Byte interview yesterday he said the nukes are going to all fly before 2030 and the earth will be down to less than 2 billion people at the very most and headed down rapidly.

    It is a counterpoint to Copeland’s Game of Nations. This is a book with much positive stupid chatter. It is very boring but Copeland makes the argument that the guys on top are allowed any indiscretion so long as the nuclear missiles stay inside their solos. Larceny, rape, murder implicitly included. But. If you have not read the book do not bother.

    James Bond 007 was Fleming’s booze-addled fantasy. Real life agents are the dullest human beings ever.

    • Thanks: Blinky Bill
  330. @Blinky Bill
    @Talha


    she was more into the political scene (Hizb it-Tahrir kind of stuff) and was totally off-put by Sufism.
     
    Talha have you ever had the pleasure of meeting Zia Inayat Khan?

    Replies: @Talha

    Hi Blinky,

    No, sorry – can’t say that I have.

    Peace.

    • Thanks: Blinky Bill
    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Talha

    Thanks for posting this many years ago.

    https://youtu.be/sja_hZBluI0

    Replies: @Talha

  331. @Beckow
    @Miro23


    ...Changes in world manufacturing leadership do seem to lead to changes in world political leadership + produce particularly dangerous times.
     
    True, I agree with your analysis...I would add that for a few decades around 1900 it was Germany that aspired to the world mfg leadership. We have something to look forward to: the voluntary abandonment by US of its mfg role in the last 20-30 years was a selfish (by the elite) and very stupid (by the whole society) move, now for the consequences...it will be volatile.

    ...resource poor places like Japan that do very well. Also resource rich places like South Africa and Ukraine that are a disaster.
     
    Japan is not that great, you feel the lack of resources on every step, a disciplined, regimented but quite poor country. People in Tokyo or Osaka have never lived as well as people in Prague or Budapest - AP can count the cars and washing machines all he wants, the daily lives of most Japanese have always been much worse.

    S Africa and Ukieland suffer from bad demographics. I have in the past hesitated to say it about the Ukies and used to assign their misfortunes to bad location and bad luck - Germans, Russians, Poles, Tatars wanted their resources - but this latest instance of mass stupidity suggests that there is something actually wrong with the people - they don't accept themselves, yearn to be elsewhere, lack self-preservation and basic IQ skills like 'anticipate consequences!' Sad people marching towards oblivion, dying needlessly for what they don't get (the Nato-Ukraine project), others moving westward to do menial jobs (and worse). Most are bitter, confused, with an escapist mentality of lost souls.

    It looks like the catastrophe that has been Ukraine is largely due to their under-developed mentality - they remind me of the American natives when the Spanish came. This time the Anglos don't even have to exert themselves and risk going there: Ukies die on their own and send their women to the admired West nicely packaged...who the f..k does that? What kind of self-respect can these people have? And all of it managed by the conductor-clown in his Kiev bunker...simply precious...

    Replies: @A123

    voluntary abandonment by US of its mfg role in the last 20-30 years was a selfish (by the elite) and very stupid (by the whole society) move, now for the consequences…it will be volatile.

    I concur.

    The consequences of the WUHAN-19 virus (e.g. trade disruptions) put huge focus on the absence of U.S. domestic manufacturing.

    I know I have said it before, but… MAGA Reindustrialization is the answer. America needs to:

        • Return to energy independence (driven by nuclear and hydrocarbons)
        • Extract and refine its own mineral wealth (e.g. rare earth elements)
        • Produce goods essential to overall national security (including pharmaceuticals, microchips, etc.)

    Slowly ramping up tariffs on all imports would be good for U.S. citizen workers. Gradual decoupling from Asia (not just China) is an achievable goal.

    PEACE 😇

  332. @Greasy William
    @Sean

    According to ISW (I know they are hated on this site and I certainly don't take their word as gospel, but they are worth listening to, imo) Putin has no interest in any sort of face saving partial victory. Putin wants the conquest of the entirety of Ukraine and to that end has begun the process of raising and equipping a one million man army that will be in theatre.

    Can Ukraine hold up against such a force? I would think not. So I assume if it comes to this you would see Ukraine suddenly develop and air force flown by American "advisors" to prevent a collapse of the Ukrainian lines. Not really sure where this ends.

    Replies: @A123, @Sean

    Putin wants the conquest of the entirety of Ukraine and to that end has begun the process of raising and equipping a one million man army that will be in theatre.

    It’ll be two million and only aim at conquering the Eastern half up to the Dnieper. I know Col. Girkin advocates reuniting all Ukraine with Russia, but he is a romantic tolerated for his prior contribution. Taking West Ukraine would give Russia a border with Poland and a counter insurgency problem in a huge area with a very hostile population.

    Putin started off aiming for a Russian alliance with Germany, but the Germans going along with the ‘Ukraine will join Nato’ announcements between 2007 and 2021 has made him realise that Russia has to break with the West, and the invasion has certainly accomplished that, which may have been the result of miscalculation by him, but deep down is maybe what he wanted the most.

    https://www.memri.org/reports/russian-former-colonel-trenin-russia-failed-assess-western-response-ukraine-invasion-there

    Dmitri Trenin a member of Russia’s Foreign and Defense Policy Council was formerly a colonel in Russian military intelligence He served as director of the Carnegie Moscow Center before the think tank ran afoul of the Putin regime. Trenin has emerged as a full-fledged backer of the war in Ukraine. In the article below, that appeared in the Russian edition of Russia in Global Affairs Trenin concedes that Russia had severely miscalculated on the Western response to the invasion. Both the energy weapon and nuclear threats had failed to deter the West. There were also deficiencies revealed in Russia’s military performance, the mobilization and the conduct of part of the elite. This is however water under the dam, because there is no way back. Surrender to the West would result in Russia’s loss of sovereignty and the possibility of Russia’s disappearance. The only course is to stick it out until Ukraine excluding Western Ukraine has been conquered and the territories integrated into Russia.

    “Avoiding defeat, however, doesn’t mean victory. A scenario of “freezing” hostilities along the front lines would mean that Moscow admits its inability to achieve the declared goals of the SVO, i.e., its [Russia’s] moral defeat.

    Furthermore, such a “freezing” would be a mere respite preceding a, more than likely, resumption of hostilities by an adversary that does not intend to renounce its maximalist goals. Nevertheless, this option exists and, as far as one can judge, is being worked on by interested parties.

    There also exists the scenario of strategic success. Here, I deliberately don’t employ the word “victory,” because in our domestic collective consciousness, after 1945 this word began to mean a crushing defeat of the enemy, his complete and unconditional surrender.

    As applied to the situation in Ukraine, Russia’s taking control of the entire eastern, southern, and central parts of the neighboring country would be counted a strategic success. The western part of Ukraine, which would remain outside Russian control, cannot in principle be integrated into the Russian civilizational space; it would become a foreign body, a source of instability”.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Sean

    would Russia take Kiev in this scenario or would Kiev remain part of rump Ukraine?

    Replies: @Sean

  333. @Beckow

    ...if one looks one can find excellent food in the USA.
     
    Fine, keep on looking, it is a big country, you have all those cars to drive around...quite a life, to each his own. My point about the food was the lack of any meaningful regulation in US resulting in what can be termed as 'manufactured garbage' food that masses consume - we see it in the overall health, life expectancy below Europe or parts of Asia, horrific fatness, and the bloated swollen faces of most Americans eating that sh..t.

    You like to separate the European-descent parts into its own category. That is deceptive, Americans are heavily mixed, live together, share their lifestyles. Also only 55-65% are "European" and that totally skews any comparisons - as if we would only consider Northern Italy, or Moscow-St.Petersburg-Sochi in Russia, or only Western Poland. You don't get to do that: US is all of its people, good, bad, and always fat...

    Suicide in the Euro Scandie countries is high, but it has nothing to do with 'social-democracy' or weather. Scandies are strange, disconnected people, they seldom understand reality and have a hard time accepting real life. They are the most propagandized people in the world, pathologically conformist, and very uninteresting - you can only look for the Russian submarines, watch endless "Russian-invasion" TV shows, genuflect in front of Eritreans, give lame 'prices' to psychotic murderers when ordered by the bosses across the sea, and worship teenage hysterics for so long. There comes a time when it dawns on an average Sven that he is living in a comfortable but sh..tty life as an appendage to his betters, so he departs early...

    Replies: @AP

    Fine, keep on looking [good good], it is a big country, you have all those cars to drive around…quite a life, to each his own

    Most Americans are satisfied with crap food and they get what they want. But one can also get good food if one wants, it isn’t hard to find.

    we see it in the overall health, life expectancy below Europe or parts of Asia

    Overall US life expectancy is higher than that of your Slovakia, Poland, Hungary, the Baltics, etc.

    Life expectancy is dragged down somewhat because the highly segregated Black people keep shooting one another, unfortunately.

    The life expectancy of European Americans is almost a year higher than for Slovakia.

    You like to separate the European-descent parts into its own category

    Because America is highly racially segregated, particularly with the descendants of slaves. Although Euro Americans like Black music they live in different cities or neighborhoods in large cities and lead separate lives and radically different lifestyles (64% of Black parents are unmarried compared to 24% of Euro parents), speak differently, etc. Intermarriage rates are low.

    I don’t have time to calculate stats for Europeans + Asians + Latinos who mix more often, so I just use Euro-American statistics.

    It would be inaccurate to lump such different groups together.

    as if we would only consider Northern Italy

    If the differences between Northern and Southern Italians were as stark as between Euro Americans and African Americans it would indeed make sense to consider them separately. But they aren’t. Indeed, America also has regional as well as racial differences. New England Euros are probably more different from Southern ones than Swedes are from Danes. Certainly more so than Brits are from Australians.

    Suicide in the Euro Scandie countries is high, but it has nothing to do with ‘social-democracy’ or weather

    I now looked it up and I was mistaken when I said suicide rate was lower than in many Euro social democracies – the suicide rate for Euro Americans in 2020 was actually even higher than among Scandinavians. In Europe, only Russians, Lithuanians, and Ukrainians (in that order) have higher suicide rates then do Euro Americans. Though Belarusians and Latvians are nearly tied. Though I haven’t seen Scandinavian stats by ethnicity, I suspect native rates are higher than Somali ones.
    .

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AP


    ...Life expectancy is dragged down somewhat because the highly segregated Black people keep shooting one another
     
    That is statistically irrelevant, do the numbers, the impact is in small fractions of a year. It is amusing that you constantly harp on V4 when convenient and avoid like a plague comparing US with Western Europe. But that is what most people would think about: US compared to Italy-Germany and not Albania. If you boast that "we are better than Bulgaria!!!" you have already lost.

    V4 countries have an issue with smoking-alcohol and people over certain age are not treated properly by the medical system (75-80) - but they are fitter, skinnier, live healthier lives than Americans. (The ladies are way better looking, it is not even close.) Italy has 4 years longer life expectancy than US - how do you explain that? It is not the jungle shooting - it is that Americans overeat and eat garbage, no amount of medical care can fix it. The swollen-face look that most Americans now have shows what they are putting in their bodies.

    Differences exist everywhere, but to do a proper comparison you can't exclude what doesn't suit you: Lousiana blacks, big cities, LA cholo reservation, meth-infested Albaquerque, homeless tattoed white kids in Seattle...all of that is America. You need to own up to it. It has been spreading: oasis never spreads, the desert does. We know where this is going.

    Scandies croak a lot, they are weak, insecure people living comfortable lives. The fact that Euro-Americans now croak at higher rates is significant - something is rotten.

    US can't afford to lose this war - the fallout would be catastrophic. So they are pushing for escalation, stalling, hoping for a miracle - if Russia keeps its cool they will win. What then? You have not put enough thought into it, you still don't understand how self-defeating the decision to put Nato in Ukraine and then escalate was. This was done by very stupid (in a historical sense) people in Washington-London...they screwed up badly and they know it. Washington would give a lot to go back to 2013 or 2005, they would take that deal immediately. Russia no longer - that tells us all we need to know about who is winning...

    Replies: @A123, @AP

  334. @Talha
    @Blinky Bill

    Hi Blinky,

    No, sorry - can’t say that I have.

    Peace.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

    Thanks for posting this many years ago.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Talha
    @Blinky Bill

    No problem, Blinky! There are, of course, many lectures out on the subject, but that particular one seemed to me to be one of the more concise and relatable to native English speakers...assuming one is interested in learning about the more knowledge-based and sober Sufi approaches.*

    Peace.

    Of course, there’s always this approach...that needs little explanation - just uncles keeping limber and hanging out at the mosque after prayer:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GflERixWj6g

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

  335. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    I wonder what their Hutus and Tutsis look like. Is there any decent CGI of a machete attack on the terrorized smaller neighbor tribe?

    Have you ever watched Hotel Rwanda?

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Yahya

    Have you ever watched Hotel Rwanda?

    No.

    What did you make of it?

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    I have not watched it. I did read this book:

    https://www.amazon.com/dp/0312425031/

    It held my interest while I was reading it but I gave it away at the first opportunity. To this day I have not found a good mnemonic for keeping track of was it the Hutus who did the Tutsis or Tutsis who did the Hutus.

  336. @Blinky Bill
    @Talha

    Thanks for posting this many years ago.

    https://youtu.be/sja_hZBluI0

    Replies: @Talha

    No problem, Blinky! There are, of course, many lectures out on the subject, but that particular one seemed to me to be one of the more concise and relatable to native English speakers…assuming one is interested in learning about the more knowledge-based and sober Sufi approaches.*

    Peace.

    [MORE]

    Of course, there’s always this approach…that needs little explanation – just uncles keeping limber and hanging out at the mosque after prayer:

    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Talha

    And one more fimiliar to the Unz commentariat.



    https://youtu.be/G5goISKPSH8

  337. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    Man, you shouldn't read this story through details but details through story.
    It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.

    The term "knight" is rather about understanding of listeners of the story than about story itself... since Arthur was to live in the Dark Age after Romans, in reality "knight" should be Latin "comes" probably.

    Anyway, knights were part of secular feudal system, not of clergy. In practice, they never refused to fight even if fight was unjust and did not defend the poor.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @songbird, @Wokechoke

    Man, you shouldn’t read this story through details but details through story.

    I just don’t think you can take it out of the era. Haven’t seen a good attempt at it. (2004 film was bad).

    [MORE]

    OTOH, if you leave it in the era, but drop the Christianity, then it comes across as atheistic. How will Arthur show his faith, but by evoking God? We don’t have a good feel on Brythonic religion, so it would be obvious LARPing to try to replace Christianity.

    Anyway, I’m not convinced that the story has an origin in pagan times. It doesn’t have the same feel as things like Beowulf or the Fenian and Ulster Cycles.

    It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.

    This is only heterodoxy. I do grant that the story has pagan elements. But that doesn’t mean it isn’t a Christian story. There were lots of pagan elements in everyday life in Christian Europe.

    The term “knight” is rather about understanding of listeners of the story than about story itself… since Arthur was to live in the Dark Age after Romans, in reality “knight” should be Latin “comes” probably.

    Do you really want a King Arthur story without knights, castles, and chivalry? Isn’t that its charm and what makes it special? And isn’t it the best exemplar or archetype of that era, in terms of myths?

    Anyway, knights were part of secular feudal system

    Secular, yes. But not in the sense it is used today. Not atheistic.

    I descend from a line of Norman knights. In their own family book, one of them is said to have made regular oaths invoking his local church. Meanwhile, the progenitor of the line is said to have taken his name from swearing fealty to a saint on whose saint’s day he fought some difficult battle against Vikings. Probably the story is apocryphal, but the point is that it was a story that resonated with them.

    In practice, they never refused to fight even if fight was unjust and did not defend the poor.

    Well, the myth is idealized. It was never supposed to be a perfect depiction of what was. But at a minimum there is a big distinction between stationary bandits and roving ones.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    We don’t have a good feel on Brythonic religion, so it would be obvious LARPing to try to replace Christianity.
     
    We don't?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYLRRrfPJ1s

    "Wicker Man" is a reconstruction which includes pagan dancing in circles, cult of fertility & phallic symbols, sacred prostitution, masked carnevale cortege preceding human sacrifice, and of course, human sacrifice itself which gave the movie its title.


    I do grant that the story has pagan elements. But that doesn’t mean it isn’t a Christian story. There were lots of pagan elements in everyday life in Christian Europe.
     
    In this way, you can have it EITHER way.

    Do you really want a King Arthur story without knights, castles, and chivalry? Isn’t that its charm and what makes it special? And isn’t it the best exemplar or archetype of that era, in terms of myths?
     
    Wasn't it you who wanted it to be true to its time...?! Now aesthetics is more important to you.

    I descend from a line of Norman knights. In their own family book, one of them is said to have made regular oaths invoking his local church. Meanwhile, the progenitor of the line is said to have taken his name from swearing fealty to a saint on whose saint’s day he fought some difficult battle against Vikings.

     

    Medieval virtue signalling, not religious feelings. Well, how many of your progenitors embarked on any serious pilgrimage?
    Just few days ago I read a chapter in the book where the author claimed that Konrad II (emperor of Germany) was a truly religious person because he didn't just fund churches but made detours during his journeys in order to visit tombs of martyrs.
    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    I descend from a line of Norman knights.
     
    I don't know why but I thought you are Asian.

    So do you consider yourself French Norman or British Norman, Sire?

    The last movie remembered by me where Norman identity was accented was "Robin of Sherwood" TV series. I remember Sheriff wondering once about who is who and Guy of Gisborne answering to that with great certainty "We are Normans, my Lord!".

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAq5Mnlry5g

    Replies: @Yahya, @A123, @songbird, @Wokechoke

  338. @Talha
    @Blinky Bill

    No problem, Blinky! There are, of course, many lectures out on the subject, but that particular one seemed to me to be one of the more concise and relatable to native English speakers...assuming one is interested in learning about the more knowledge-based and sober Sufi approaches.*

    Peace.

    Of course, there’s always this approach...that needs little explanation - just uncles keeping limber and hanging out at the mosque after prayer:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GflERixWj6g

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

    And one more fimiliar to the Unz commentariat.

    [MORE]

    • Thanks: Talha
  339. @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Man, you shouldn’t read this story through details but details through story.
     
    I just don't think you can take it out of the era. Haven't seen a good attempt at it. (2004 film was bad).

    OTOH, if you leave it in the era, but drop the Christianity, then it comes across as atheistic. How will Arthur show his faith, but by evoking God? We don't have a good feel on Brythonic religion, so it would be obvious LARPing to try to replace Christianity.

    Anyway, I'm not convinced that the story has an origin in pagan times. It doesn't have the same feel as things like Beowulf or the Fenian and Ulster Cycles.


    It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.
     
    This is only heterodoxy. I do grant that the story has pagan elements. But that doesn't mean it isn't a Christian story. There were lots of pagan elements in everyday life in Christian Europe.


    The term “knight” is rather about understanding of listeners of the story than about story itself… since Arthur was to live in the Dark Age after Romans, in reality “knight” should be Latin “comes” probably.
     
    Do you really want a King Arthur story without knights, castles, and chivalry? Isn't that its charm and what makes it special? And isn't it the best exemplar or archetype of that era, in terms of myths?

    Anyway, knights were part of secular feudal system
     
    Secular, yes. But not in the sense it is used today. Not atheistic.

    I descend from a line of Norman knights. In their own family book, one of them is said to have made regular oaths invoking his local church. Meanwhile, the progenitor of the line is said to have taken his name from swearing fealty to a saint on whose saint's day he fought some difficult battle against Vikings. Probably the story is apocryphal, but the point is that it was a story that resonated with them.

    In practice, they never refused to fight even if fight was unjust and did not defend the poor.
     
    Well, the myth is idealized. It was never supposed to be a perfect depiction of what was. But at a minimum there is a big distinction between stationary bandits and roving ones.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Another Polish Perspective

    We don’t have a good feel on Brythonic religion, so it would be obvious LARPing to try to replace Christianity.

    We don’t?

    “Wicker Man” is a reconstruction which includes pagan dancing in circles, cult of fertility & phallic symbols, sacred prostitution, masked carnevale cortege preceding human sacrifice, and of course, human sacrifice itself which gave the movie its title.

    I do grant that the story has pagan elements. But that doesn’t mean it isn’t a Christian story. There were lots of pagan elements in everyday life in Christian Europe.

    In this way, you can have it EITHER way.

    Do you really want a King Arthur story without knights, castles, and chivalry? Isn’t that its charm and what makes it special? And isn’t it the best exemplar or archetype of that era, in terms of myths?

    Wasn’t it you who wanted it to be true to its time…?! Now aesthetics is more important to you.

    I descend from a line of Norman knights. In their own family book, one of them is said to have made regular oaths invoking his local church. Meanwhile, the progenitor of the line is said to have taken his name from swearing fealty to a saint on whose saint’s day he fought some difficult battle against Vikings.

    Medieval virtue signalling, not religious feelings. Well, how many of your progenitors embarked on any serious pilgrimage?
    Just few days ago I read a chapter in the book where the author claimed that Konrad II (emperor of Germany) was a truly religious person because he didn’t just fund churches but made detours during his journeys in order to visit tombs of martyrs.

  340. @silviosilver
    @songbird


    I also liked it, but was ultimately disappointed because I wanted to love it.
     
    How old were you when you saw it? I first saw it at eleven or twelve, and was immediately smitten. Of course, I wasn't looking for the fulfillment of a national mythology, I was simply into all sorts of medieval-y, adventure-y, fantasy things, and Excalibur completely fit the bill. ('Sword of the Valiant' 1984, was another. Bit cheesy, but lots of fun. Sean Connery, John Rhys-Davies, little screen time but big impact.)

    I didn't like the portrayal of Merlin at first, and I thought the young Arthur was too dorky, but I grew to appreciate both with further watching. I agree that Guinevere could have been prettier, although she did play the role quite well.

    The ending was a bit of a letdown, made up for by the several powerful scenes. I agree with you about the scene when Arthur hands over Excalibur to be knighted by his foe. (Charlton Heston freeing the Moorish prisoners in El Cid had a similar impact on me.)

    To me though, all that was secondary to the evocative imagery coupled to the sublime soundtrack. Just magnificent. If there's ever anything like it again, I fear it won't be for a long, long time.

    Scour the countryside, to find the best locations to shoot – the best-shaded bubbling brooks. Coppiced forrests. Real castles.
     
    I'm not sure anyone could have done a whole lot better though. Given the subject matter and the scenery as it was, I think there was easily enough there to satisfy the deepest yearnings of blood and soil nationalist types, the kind who feel themselves so at one with the land they know each owl, each fox, each blade of grass by name.

    Replies: @songbird

    How old were you when you saw it? I first saw it at eleven or twelve

    Caught a few scenes of it at about that age, but that was towards the end of the movie – its weakest part, IMO. It was only about 2-3 years ago that I watched the full film and saw the good parts.

    [MORE]

    ‘Sword of the Valiant’ 1984, was another.

    Haven’t seen it.

    Charlton Heston freeing the Moorish prisoners in El Cid had a similar impact on me.

    Another one I haven’t seen, been meaning to watch it.

    If there’s ever anything like it again, I fear it won’t be for a long, long time.

    Oh, definitely. It was a product of its time, and that is one of the things that makes me a bit sad about it. It had a European stamp on it. It didn’t feel as deracinated as a Hollywood production, or many things shot in Western Europe today. And I wish there had been more films like that, of a higher quality than the standard B-movie fare.

    A while back we just had The Green Knight, starring an Indian. Haven’t seen it, but I doubt there has ever been a greater act of cultural vandalism, at least in terms of film. To go straight to Indian, in something that obviously has ancient and pagan roots. Standard disclaimer: wouldn’t care if it had been a Bollywood film, but the offense is that it passed itself off as a European one.

    I’m not sure anyone could have done a whole lot better though. Given the subject matter and the scenery as it was, I think there was easily enough there to satisfy the deepest yearnings of blood and soil nationalist types

    You may be right.

    There weren’t really any shots that rubbed me the wrong way, like when you see an arid California backdrop that is meant to be a forest in Britain (notable in The Adventures of Robin Hood 1938, which isn’t a bad film) – they didn’t have that.

    Guess I am kind of a weirdo, but I have an obsession with streams. I’ve spent a lot of time near them, and thinking about them, so I have an unnaturally high romantic view of them.

    In reality, I brought them up more because I was thinking of the Táin Bó Cúailnge. If that story were ever adapted to the screen, I think there would need to be a hyper focus on selecting the best location shots for river and stream crossings, and even the flow of the water.

    A lot of the shots would be technically pretty difficult. Must be hard to do stunt work in such places, sometimes the rocks can be as slippery as ice.

    • Replies: @S
    @songbird


    A while back we just had The Green Knight, starring an Indian. Haven’t seen it, but I doubt there has ever been a greater act of cultural vandalism, at least in terms of film.
     
    I know of something that could certainly rival it. A few days ago I came across a relatively new David Copperfield film which went to great lengths to be historically accurate in regards to mid 19th century Victorian England.

    The actor playing the part of Copperfield was an Indian.

    Replies: @songbird

    , @silviosilver
    @songbird


    Another one I haven’t seen, been meaning to watch it.
     
    I watched it plenty of times as a kid, but I haven't seen it for years. I have a feeling it would still hold up pretty well though (in a way that many medieval-themed films from that era just don't).

    Another one I bet you haven't seen is Robert Bresson's "Lancelot du Lac" (1974). I wouldn't bother though. Pretentious, emotionless tripe. Maybe some minimal redeeming value as "an aesthetic experience" overall, but absolutely nothing that would make me ever want to watch it again. (Not to be confused with a rarer French TV movie by the same name from 1970.)

    There weren’t really any shots that rubbed me the wrong way, like when you see an arid California backdrop that is meant to be a forest in Britain (notable in The Adventures of Robin Hood 1938, which isn’t a bad film) – they didn’t have that.
     
    Oh wow, I'd almost completely forgotten about this film. This is another one I watched over a dozen times as a kid. I don't remember the arid scenery you're talking about though.

    Guess I am kind of a weirdo, but I have an obsession with streams. I’ve spent a lot of time near them, and thinking about them, so I have an unnaturally high romantic view of them.
     
    What did you think of the scene where Uther is ambushed and he wades across the brook just before plunging the sword into the stone?


    AnotherPolishPerspective,

    I disagree. Arthur’s knights sit around circle, a symbol more pagan (eg. Basque lauburu) than Christian.
     
    The round table is supposed to imply that all those sitting around it are of equal status, which is more of a Christian than pagan them.

    Replies: @songbird

  341. @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Man, you shouldn’t read this story through details but details through story.
     
    I just don't think you can take it out of the era. Haven't seen a good attempt at it. (2004 film was bad).

    OTOH, if you leave it in the era, but drop the Christianity, then it comes across as atheistic. How will Arthur show his faith, but by evoking God? We don't have a good feel on Brythonic religion, so it would be obvious LARPing to try to replace Christianity.

    Anyway, I'm not convinced that the story has an origin in pagan times. It doesn't have the same feel as things like Beowulf or the Fenian and Ulster Cycles.


    It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.
     
    This is only heterodoxy. I do grant that the story has pagan elements. But that doesn't mean it isn't a Christian story. There were lots of pagan elements in everyday life in Christian Europe.


    The term “knight” is rather about understanding of listeners of the story than about story itself… since Arthur was to live in the Dark Age after Romans, in reality “knight” should be Latin “comes” probably.
     
    Do you really want a King Arthur story without knights, castles, and chivalry? Isn't that its charm and what makes it special? And isn't it the best exemplar or archetype of that era, in terms of myths?

    Anyway, knights were part of secular feudal system
     
    Secular, yes. But not in the sense it is used today. Not atheistic.

    I descend from a line of Norman knights. In their own family book, one of them is said to have made regular oaths invoking his local church. Meanwhile, the progenitor of the line is said to have taken his name from swearing fealty to a saint on whose saint's day he fought some difficult battle against Vikings. Probably the story is apocryphal, but the point is that it was a story that resonated with them.

    In practice, they never refused to fight even if fight was unjust and did not defend the poor.
     
    Well, the myth is idealized. It was never supposed to be a perfect depiction of what was. But at a minimum there is a big distinction between stationary bandits and roving ones.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Another Polish Perspective

    I descend from a line of Norman knights.

    I don’t know why but I thought you are Asian.

    So do you consider yourself French Norman or British Norman, Sire?

    The last movie remembered by me where Norman identity was accented was “Robin of Sherwood” TV series. I remember Sheriff wondering once about who is who and Guy of Gisborne answering to that with great certainty “We are Normans, my Lord!”.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    So do you consider yourself French Norman or British Norman, Sire?
     
    He’s a generic Irish-American who likes to LARP as a Brit and “European” (with a strange attachment to Germany). He may have a Norman ancestor or two, but there’s nothing Norman about him.

    Replies: @songbird

    , @A123
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Could it be a reference to Star Trek's Norman?

     
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C2xpFUMWQAAY06n.jpg
     

    PEACE 😇

    , @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective


    I don’t know why but I thought you are Asian.
     
    People often seem to think I am an Anglo or an Asian. I just find it amusing. Actually, I am (ethnically) Irish. America is my home, and part of my family has been here for a while, though none were settlers.

    Probably the Normans were only a small input of my blood (would guess maybe 4-8%), but they were an interesting group. Though, honestly, I am probably more fascinated by the native clans (which history I can also trace a little to). It is just that more survives directly from this one Norman family who kept their lands until very recently, so there is more of a cultural stamp on it, than the cold history of the annals.

    Traditional Irish clan-fighting is probably not very knight-like. Supposedly, they did not use stirrups on their horses, and I can well believe it because one annalistic reference has a native ancestor falling off his horse three times. (that is when he was quite old).

    The last movie remembered by me where Norman identity was accented was “Robin of Sherwood” TV series.
     
    Never saw it, but you better bet they believed in their identity (that is as English), at least the ones in the Pale.

    Well, how many of your progenitors embarked on any serious pilgrimage?
     
    No idea, the Norman book was only written in the 1500s, probably in the time of Henry VIII. There are two annalistic references to native Irish ancestors going to the Cathedral of Santiago - not an easy journey back then. But I imagine the common people satisfied themselves with local pilgrimages to sacred wells, etc, which were a very prominent feature of Irish life well into the 1800s, or later. It wasn't virtue-signaling but the heartfelt faith of very poor people.


    “Wicker Man” is a reconstruction which includes pagan dancing in circles, cult of fertility & phallic symbols, sacred prostitution, masked carnevale cortege preceding human sacrifice, and of course, human sacrifice itself which gave the movie its title.
     
    1.) none of that would fit into or improve the King Arthur Mythos
    2.) folk horror just shows how progressives hate and fear rural folk
    3.) in the movie, it is actually the rootless, immoral elite who, being newly transplanted to the area, introduces this faux religion, displacing the native traditions.

    Wasn’t it you who wanted it to be true to its time…?! Now aesthetics is more important to you.
     
    Maybe, I am not communicating clearly, so let me be clear:

    I recognize that there are pagan elements in the story. But I think they are a combination of medieval-era invention and incorporation of older, pagan-influenced but unrelated folklore. I think the thing as a whole - the true birth of the Arthur mythos - was in medieval times and that it has a medieval stamp on it. Those times were fusionist and people told folk stories that had a pagan origin, went to holy wells which had a pagan origin, had various beliefs and pagan customs, while simultaneously being Christians and having a faith in Christ.

    It wasn't just some empty display of the elite. The traditional greeting in Ireland was "God with you" and the reply was "God and Mary to you." Today, people have a hard time relating to that or believing it was possible. I think that just makes it a more compelling reason to depict it or to experience it in art.

    I find the idea that the myth of King Arthur existed in pagan times in any easily recognizable form to be spurious. On the whole, it just doesn't have the characteristics. King Arthur doesn't take up Excalibur because he wants to become a warrior of undying fame. In fact, he never dies. Avalon, to me, is thematically Christian - it represents the resurrection.

    Even one of the bad parts of it, him loading babies on some barge because he was afraid of the prophecy with Modred, strikes me as being related to Old Testament stories. The search for the Grail is quite Christian. There's an annalist reference to one of my Irish ancestors winning a battle and retrieving some holy relic. Is there anything like that in Greco-Roman history?

    I've said I do think there are good pagan stories. Just that I don't think that King Arthur is one of them. Sure, someone could try to do a fully pagan interpretation, I just don't think it would work anywhere near as well as some other obviously pagan story, or trying to invent a new story with pagan themes.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    , @Wokechoke
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Turns out a lot of English do have a Norman ancestor. The downward social mobility of the invading French was a real thing in the gene pool.

  342. @songbird
    @S

    Thanks. I've seen that movie, or at least parts of it. Hadn't realized it was filmed in Ireland, until now. Connery is Irish in his paternal line. I think that it an amusing scene at the end when they play Beethoven, and show him. (though I am not crazy about the movie.)

    I think Boorman still lives in his old house in Ireland, with Daniel Day-Lewis, as his neighbor. That's in Wicklow. One could consider it the most mountainy place near to Dublin. The stronghold of Fiach McHugh O'Byrne was there. And the Irish army (such that it is) does some of its training there.

    https://youtu.be/w_lwuDupYu0

    Been to the area. Grasped a nettle there as a child, and I'll not forget it.

    I regret to say, it most likely has been enriched heavily, like seemingly all of rural Ireland in the current year.

    Replies: @S

    Am sorry to hear about the forced ‘enrichment” of Ireland by colonists and settlers, whereby (alas!) the Plantation lives on.

    Zardoz as a film is certainly a bit offbeat and odd.

    I enjoyed the scenery of the Irish countryside, and the lake was surreal.

    And, of course, any film featuring the luscious Charlotte Rampling can’t be all bad. 😀

    [MORE]

    • Thanks: songbird
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @S

    Yes, Zardoz was pretty good. Interesting play on the theme of Indo-Europan invaders and their "sky father" too...
    But I don't think that real gods like Zeus & company would enjoy the depiction of sky-riding "gods" as weak and clothed by some Minoans-inspired fashionistas. After all, the former were the gods of the sky, whereas Minoans served the gods of Earth...

    The main character was named "Zed"... Putin saw it?!

  343. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    I descend from a line of Norman knights.
     
    I don't know why but I thought you are Asian.

    So do you consider yourself French Norman or British Norman, Sire?

    The last movie remembered by me where Norman identity was accented was "Robin of Sherwood" TV series. I remember Sheriff wondering once about who is who and Guy of Gisborne answering to that with great certainty "We are Normans, my Lord!".

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAq5Mnlry5g

    Replies: @Yahya, @A123, @songbird, @Wokechoke

    So do you consider yourself French Norman or British Norman, Sire?

    He’s a generic Irish-American who likes to LARP as a Brit and “European” (with a strange attachment to Germany). He may have a Norman ancestor or two, but there’s nothing Norman about him.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Yahya


    He’s a generic Irish-American who likes to LARP as a Brit and “European” (with a strange attachment to Germany). He may have a Norman ancestor or two, but there’s nothing Norman about him.
     
    So all Europeans should be particularists and only appreciate and work to defend their own country, and not cooperate? And refrain from admiring or having any interest in other European countries? Even neighboring ones like the UK to Ireland? Or core strategic heartlands like Germany?

    Please, explain your reasoning.

    Replies: @S

  344. The intrigue of Not-The-President Biden’s family grows even worse.

    • Hunter paid ~$50K/mo in rent to The Big Guy
    • Ooops, that income wasn’t on The Big Guy’s income tax return

    Would you like to guess what is next: (1)

    In the wake of accusations that Joe Biden may have failed to report thousands of dollars in rental income on his taxes, it has been discovered that Joe Biden’s campaign surreptitiously removed some of his tax returns from its website.

    However, according to the Schedule E portion of his 2017 tax forms, Joe Biden reported $19,800 in “rents received” and none in 2018. This discrepancy could mean that Joe Biden failed to report more than half a million in income on his taxes.

    Curiously, those documents are no longer available on his campaign website — while it appears that his tax returns are still posted to the website for public viewing, most of the files previously made available to the public have been removed. Instead, when you click on most of the links, the website immediately redirects the user to a donation page.

    It is now full cover up mode. One wonders if Not-The-VP Harris, or her people, are somehow driving this along.

    Biden’s shambolic performance where he could not remember the name of his own SCOTUS appointment is also a serious problem. Offending the DNC base is possibly the one “unforgivable transgression” in Democrat party politics.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/matt-margolis/2023/01/17/joe-biden-removed-tax-returns-from-website-and-we-have-questions-n1662417

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @A123

    See the marcopolousa report. 9 documented Joe felonies and 450 documented Hunter felonies on one computer that Hunter used for a couple years. These people are criminals.

    So is just about everybody else with a position in Washington. But here is a case with hard drive evidence.

    , @songbird
    @A123


    One wonders if Not-The-VP Harris
     
    Sounds like a dangerous jinx.

    Replies: @QCIC

  345. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    I descend from a line of Norman knights.
     
    I don't know why but I thought you are Asian.

    So do you consider yourself French Norman or British Norman, Sire?

    The last movie remembered by me where Norman identity was accented was "Robin of Sherwood" TV series. I remember Sheriff wondering once about who is who and Guy of Gisborne answering to that with great certainty "We are Normans, my Lord!".

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAq5Mnlry5g

    Replies: @Yahya, @A123, @songbird, @Wokechoke

    Could it be a reference to Star Trek’s Norman?

     

     

    PEACE 😇

  346. @songbird
    @silviosilver


    How old were you when you saw it? I first saw it at eleven or twelve
     
    Caught a few scenes of it at about that age, but that was towards the end of the movie - its weakest part, IMO. It was only about 2-3 years ago that I watched the full film and saw the good parts.

    ‘Sword of the Valiant’ 1984, was another.
     
    Haven't seen it.

    Charlton Heston freeing the Moorish prisoners in El Cid had a similar impact on me.
     
    Another one I haven't seen, been meaning to watch it.


    If there’s ever anything like it again, I fear it won’t be for a long, long time.
     
    Oh, definitely. It was a product of its time, and that is one of the things that makes me a bit sad about it. It had a European stamp on it. It didn't feel as deracinated as a Hollywood production, or many things shot in Western Europe today. And I wish there had been more films like that, of a higher quality than the standard B-movie fare.

    A while back we just had The Green Knight, starring an Indian. Haven't seen it, but I doubt there has ever been a greater act of cultural vandalism, at least in terms of film. To go straight to Indian, in something that obviously has ancient and pagan roots. Standard disclaimer: wouldn't care if it had been a Bollywood film, but the offense is that it passed itself off as a European one.


    I’m not sure anyone could have done a whole lot better though. Given the subject matter and the scenery as it was, I think there was easily enough there to satisfy the deepest yearnings of blood and soil nationalist types
     
    You may be right.

    There weren't really any shots that rubbed me the wrong way, like when you see an arid California backdrop that is meant to be a forest in Britain (notable in The Adventures of Robin Hood 1938, which isn't a bad film) - they didn't have that.

    Guess I am kind of a weirdo, but I have an obsession with streams. I've spent a lot of time near them, and thinking about them, so I have an unnaturally high romantic view of them.

    In reality, I brought them up more because I was thinking of the Táin Bó Cúailnge. If that story were ever adapted to the screen, I think there would need to be a hyper focus on selecting the best location shots for river and stream crossings, and even the flow of the water.

    A lot of the shots would be technically pretty difficult. Must be hard to do stunt work in such places, sometimes the rocks can be as slippery as ice.

    Replies: @S, @silviosilver

    A while back we just had The Green Knight, starring an Indian. Haven’t seen it, but I doubt there has ever been a greater act of cultural vandalism, at least in terms of film.

    I know of something that could certainly rival it. A few days ago I came across a relatively new David Copperfield film which went to great lengths to be historically accurate in regards to mid 19th century Victorian England.

    The actor playing the part of Copperfield was an Indian.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @S


    The actor playing the part of Copperfield was an Indian.
     
    Same guy, I think.

    It's weird. I know that there are physical subsidies for introducing diversity in video games, made in the UK.

    Things like this make me believe that the same thing is true of film. But I'm not 100% sure of it. A lot of the audience in the UK would be Indian now, and maybe India is a big secondary market?
  347. @S
    @songbird

    Am sorry to hear about the forced 'enrichment'' of Ireland by colonists and settlers, whereby (alas!) the Plantation lives on.

    Zardoz as a film is certainly a bit offbeat and odd.

    I enjoyed the scenery of the Irish countryside, and the lake was surreal.

    https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-YcKE-SIlC2s/WhzZzxAsuFI/AAAAAAAAgh4/3OwxKLww1KYXNMV44oyto8vIhxLEWD8qwCLcBGAs/s1600/Head-over-lake-Zardoz-1974.jpg

    And, of course, any film featuring the luscious Charlotte Rampling can't be all bad. :-D



    https://www.tafce.com/images/5/57/Consuella_-_Edited.png

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Yes, Zardoz was pretty good. Interesting play on the theme of Indo-Europan invaders and their “sky father” too…
    But I don’t think that real gods like Zeus & company would enjoy the depiction of sky-riding “gods” as weak and clothed by some Minoans-inspired fashionistas. After all, the former were the gods of the sky, whereas Minoans served the gods of Earth…

    The main character was named “Zed”… Putin saw it?!

    • LOL: S
  348. @A123
    The intrigue of Not-The-President Biden's family grows even worse.

    • Hunter paid ~$50K/mo in rent to The Big Guy
    • Ooops, that income wasn't on The Big Guy's income tax return

    Would you like to guess what is next: (1)

    In the wake of accusations that Joe Biden may have failed to report thousands of dollars in rental income on his taxes, it has been discovered that Joe Biden’s campaign surreptitiously removed some of his tax returns from its website.

    However, according to the Schedule E portion of his 2017 tax forms, Joe Biden reported $19,800 in “rents received” and none in 2018. This discrepancy could mean that Joe Biden failed to report more than half a million in income on his taxes.

    Curiously, those documents are no longer available on his campaign website — while it appears that his tax returns are still posted to the website for public viewing, most of the files previously made available to the public have been removed. Instead, when you click on most of the links, the website immediately redirects the user to a donation page.
     
    It is now full cover up mode. One wonders if Not-The-VP Harris, or her people, are somehow driving this along.

    Biden's shambolic performance where he could not remember the name of his own SCOTUS appointment is also a serious problem. Offending the DNC base is possibly the one "unforgivable transgression" in Democrat party politics.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/matt-margolis/2023/01/17/joe-biden-removed-tax-returns-from-website-and-we-have-questions-n1662417

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird

    See the marcopolousa report. 9 documented Joe felonies and 450 documented Hunter felonies on one computer that Hunter used for a couple years. These people are criminals.

    So is just about everybody else with a position in Washington. But here is a case with hard drive evidence.

  349. @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Have you ever watched Hotel Rwanda?
     
    No.

    What did you make of it?

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    I have not watched it. I did read this book:

    It held my interest while I was reading it but I gave it away at the first opportunity. To this day I have not found a good mnemonic for keeping track of was it the Hutus who did the Tutsis or Tutsis who did the Hutus.

  350. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    I descend from a line of Norman knights.
     
    I don't know why but I thought you are Asian.

    So do you consider yourself French Norman or British Norman, Sire?

    The last movie remembered by me where Norman identity was accented was "Robin of Sherwood" TV series. I remember Sheriff wondering once about who is who and Guy of Gisborne answering to that with great certainty "We are Normans, my Lord!".

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAq5Mnlry5g

    Replies: @Yahya, @A123, @songbird, @Wokechoke

    I don’t know why but I thought you are Asian.

    People often seem to think I am an Anglo or an Asian. I just find it amusing. Actually, I am (ethnically) Irish. America is my home, and part of my family has been here for a while, though none were settlers.

    [MORE]

    Probably the Normans were only a small input of my blood (would guess maybe 4-8%), but they were an interesting group. Though, honestly, I am probably more fascinated by the native clans (which history I can also trace a little to). It is just that more survives directly from this one Norman family who kept their lands until very recently, so there is more of a cultural stamp on it, than the cold history of the annals.

    Traditional Irish clan-fighting is probably not very knight-like. Supposedly, they did not use stirrups on their horses, and I can well believe it because one annalistic reference has a native ancestor falling off his horse three times. (that is when he was quite old).

    The last movie remembered by me where Norman identity was accented was “Robin of Sherwood” TV series.

    Never saw it, but you better bet they believed in their identity (that is as English), at least the ones in the Pale.

    Well, how many of your progenitors embarked on any serious pilgrimage?

    No idea, the Norman book was only written in the 1500s, probably in the time of Henry VIII. There are two annalistic references to native Irish ancestors going to the Cathedral of Santiago – not an easy journey back then. But I imagine the common people satisfied themselves with local pilgrimages to sacred wells, etc, which were a very prominent feature of Irish life well into the 1800s, or later. It wasn’t virtue-signaling but the heartfelt faith of very poor people.

    “Wicker Man” is a reconstruction which includes pagan dancing in circles, cult of fertility & phallic symbols, sacred prostitution, masked carnevale cortege preceding human sacrifice, and of course, human sacrifice itself which gave the movie its title.

    1.) none of that would fit into or improve the King Arthur Mythos
    2.) folk horror just shows how progressives hate and fear rural folk
    3.) in the movie, it is actually the rootless, immoral elite who, being newly transplanted to the area, introduces this faux religion, displacing the native traditions.

    Wasn’t it you who wanted it to be true to its time…?! Now aesthetics is more important to you.

    Maybe, I am not communicating clearly, so let me be clear:

    I recognize that there are pagan elements in the story. But I think they are a combination of medieval-era invention and incorporation of older, pagan-influenced but unrelated folklore. I think the thing as a whole – the true birth of the Arthur mythos – was in medieval times and that it has a medieval stamp on it. Those times were fusionist and people told folk stories that had a pagan origin, went to holy wells which had a pagan origin, had various beliefs and pagan customs, while simultaneously being Christians and having a faith in Christ.

    It wasn’t just some empty display of the elite. The traditional greeting in Ireland was “God with you” and the reply was “God and Mary to you.” Today, people have a hard time relating to that or believing it was possible. I think that just makes it a more compelling reason to depict it or to experience it in art.

    I find the idea that the myth of King Arthur existed in pagan times in any easily recognizable form to be spurious. On the whole, it just doesn’t have the characteristics. King Arthur doesn’t take up Excalibur because he wants to become a warrior of undying fame. In fact, he never dies. Avalon, to me, is thematically Christian – it represents the resurrection.

    Even one of the bad parts of it, him loading babies on some barge because he was afraid of the prophecy with Modred, strikes me as being related to Old Testament stories. The search for the Grail is quite Christian. There’s an annalist reference to one of my Irish ancestors winning a battle and retrieving some holy relic. Is there anything like that in Greco-Roman history?

    I’ve said I do think there are good pagan stories. Just that I don’t think that King Arthur is one of them. Sure, someone could try to do a fully pagan interpretation, I just don’t think it would work anywhere near as well as some other obviously pagan story, or trying to invent a new story with pagan themes.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    People often seem to think I am an Anglo or an Asian.
     
    I thought you were Asian because you kind of clung to this idea of "Christian Arthur" in the way an Asian who took a course in "European culture" could. No offense ;)

    Never saw it, but you better bet they believed in their identity (that is as English), at least the ones in the Pale.
     
    What's the Pale?

    1.) none of that would fit into or improve the King Arthur Mythos

    I disagree. Arthur's knights sit around circle, a symbol more pagan (eg. Basque lauburu) than Christian.
    The entire Lancelot arc looks like taken from some troubadour "Story of Rose"; but is kind of pagan as a story of overwhelming passion and extasy: actually a Dionysian theme, not Christian at all. Ginevre has never really been punished and did not go to monastery too - this is not patriarchal Christianity. Ginevre is like a capricious pagan deity (no one can punish here) aka Aphrodite who must be pleased otherwise you lose your kingdom (almost) - Arthur does not please her enough. Morgana is like Artemis - dark, scheming and without husband; you need to neuter her with another god, i.e. Graal/Christ.

    Perceval is kind of Christian - he is meek (does not feel Grail mission is for him in the first place) but has great faith and perservance which enables his quest.

    What I disliked in "Excalibur" is that any knight who is not Lancelot or Perceval is just a cipher, maybe with a name. This is not really story of the "Round Table".

    2.) folk horror just shows how progressives hate and fear rural folk
     
    It is not really horror. At least for me, it works as a comedy almost until the end.

    3.) in the movie, it is actually the rootless, immoral elite who, being newly transplanted to the area, introduces this faux religion, displacing the native traditions.

     

    You are partly right here, concerning elite, but what were those "native traditions"...?

    Those times were fusionist and people told folk stories that had a pagan origin, went to holy wells which had a pagan origin, had various beliefs and pagan customs, while simultaneously being Christians and having a faith in Christ.
     
    You can't serve two masters. It is called hypocrisy and is starkly condemned in Bible in "Revelation" as well as in "Letter of St Jude". Why aren't you getting angry but complacent with these crypto-pagans when simultaneously defending the Arthurian myth from the charge of paganism...?
    This is doublethink.

    It wasn’t just some empty display of the elite. The traditional greeting in Ireland was “God with you” and the reply was “God and Mary to you.”
     
    In Southern Germany people still greet themselves with "Gruess Gott" but IT IS an empty display.
    I tested this bringing some religious theme when I didn't agree with something a person said and they were so compartmentalized that they thought it was ridiculous.

    There’s an annalist reference to one of my Irish ancestors winning a battle and retrieving some holy relic. Is there anything like that in Greco-Roman history?
     
    History of relics starts in Late Roman Empire.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird

  351. @Blinky Bill
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FmkKeY4XEAEWVGl.jpg

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmkz0FHWIAAVtKw.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Ivashka the fool

    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool

    I was about to give you a lashing, then the scales fell from my eyes and instead you shall receive a warm embrace brother Ivashka.



    Tanquam ex ungue leonem.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

    , @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool

    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQNXSOhniU8A1MnlqkOlZZ1KIWdC3UikuH58Q&usqp.jpg

    I doubt these projection are any more accurate than the ones from the 1970's. Back then the "International Community" were convinced that uncontrolled population growth would lead to China's eventual collapse, an eternity of impoverishment.

    Today they wishcast once again, that China's rapid depopulation will lead to its impoverishment and eventual collapse. This is a fundamental error, the correct take would have been to argue for at least the next decade, that China population stagnation will lead to its...



    You get my point. On a more serious note for every million people China loses, the "International Community" insist on gaining two or three million more to balance things out.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  352. @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    So do you consider yourself French Norman or British Norman, Sire?
     
    He’s a generic Irish-American who likes to LARP as a Brit and “European” (with a strange attachment to Germany). He may have a Norman ancestor or two, but there’s nothing Norman about him.

    Replies: @songbird

    He’s a generic Irish-American who likes to LARP as a Brit and “European” (with a strange attachment to Germany). He may have a Norman ancestor or two, but there’s nothing Norman about him.

    So all Europeans should be particularists and only appreciate and work to defend their own country, and not cooperate? And refrain from admiring or having any interest in other European countries? Even neighboring ones like the UK to Ireland? Or core strategic heartlands like Germany?

    Please, explain your reasoning.

    • Troll: Yahya
    • Replies: @S
    @songbird


    So all Europeans should be particularists and only appreciate and work to defend their own country, and not cooperate? And refrain from admiring or having any interest in other European countries? Even neighboring ones like the UK to Ireland? Or core strategic heartlands like Germany?...Please, explain your reasoning.
     
    Apparently, Songbird, you are in violation of certain of the rules of the Multi-Cult game, and have been put on notice.

    As a Euro, irregardless of the particular tribe you may belong to and it's unique history, you are expected to collectively simply go wander off somewhere and die, without even a whimper of protest.

    Not doing that, as you are not, and instead displaying life affirming behaviour, is an affront to certain of their sensibilities. As in the clip below, it is a veritable slap in their face.

    Should enough follow you in your renegade path (renegade in the modern progressive death affirming view of things), and choose life as one should, at least some Euro peoples might survive these treacherous times.

    I see that as a very positive outcome, in small part as it would stop the Multi-Cultists and their collaborators from committing genocide in the truest sense of that often much abused term, a burden no one should have upon themselves, their present soul destroying hatreds blinding them (in at least certain instances) to what they are in reality doing.

    Anyhow, in the case of even some Euro peoples surviving, there would almost certainly be a murmur, arising to a deafening crescendo, coming from the throats of the progressive (so called) Multi-Culturalists and their collaborators, perhaps the loudest voices of them all being from those who put on airs of peace and love, such as troll these very threads...

    'But, But, But,....You are supposed to die!...You are supposed to die!!...You are supposed to die!!!'


    https://youtu.be/IP11jDHwX98

    Replies: @songbird

  353. @Sean
    @Greasy William


    Putin wants the conquest of the entirety of Ukraine and to that end has begun the process of raising and equipping a one million man army that will be in theatre.
     
    It'll be two million and only aim at conquering the Eastern half up to the Dnieper. I know Col. Girkin advocates reuniting all Ukraine with Russia, but he is a romantic tolerated for his prior contribution. Taking West Ukraine would give Russia a border with Poland and a counter insurgency problem in a huge area with a very hostile population.

    Putin started off aiming for a Russian alliance with Germany, but the Germans going along with the 'Ukraine will join Nato' announcements between 2007 and 2021 has made him realise that Russia has to break with the West, and the invasion has certainly accomplished that, which may have been the result of miscalculation by him, but deep down is maybe what he wanted the most.

    https://www.memri.org/reports/russian-former-colonel-trenin-russia-failed-assess-western-response-ukraine-invasion-there

    Dmitri Trenin a member of Russia’s Foreign and Defense Policy Council was formerly a colonel in Russian military intelligence He served as director of the Carnegie Moscow Center before the think tank ran afoul of the Putin regime. Trenin has emerged as a full-fledged backer of the war in Ukraine. In the article below, that appeared in the Russian edition of Russia in Global Affairs Trenin concedes that Russia had severely miscalculated on the Western response to the invasion. Both the energy weapon and nuclear threats had failed to deter the West. There were also deficiencies revealed in Russia’s military performance, the mobilization and the conduct of part of the elite. This is however water under the dam, because there is no way back. Surrender to the West would result in Russia’s loss of sovereignty and the possibility of Russia’s disappearance. The only course is to stick it out until Ukraine excluding Western Ukraine has been conquered and the territories integrated into Russia.

    "Avoiding defeat, however, doesn’t mean victory. A scenario of "freezing" hostilities along the front lines would mean that Moscow admits its inability to achieve the declared goals of the SVO, i.e., its [Russia's] moral defeat.

    Furthermore, such a "freezing" would be a mere respite preceding a, more than likely, resumption of hostilities by an adversary that does not intend to renounce its maximalist goals. Nevertheless, this option exists and, as far as one can judge, is being worked on by interested parties.

    There also exists the scenario of strategic success. Here, I deliberately don’t employ the word "victory," because in our domestic collective consciousness, after 1945 this word began to mean a crushing defeat of the enemy, his complete and unconditional surrender.

    As applied to the situation in Ukraine, Russia's taking control of the entire eastern, southern, and central parts of the neighboring country would be counted a strategic success. The western part of Ukraine, which would remain outside Russian control, cannot in principle be integrated into the Russian civilizational space; it would become a foreign body, a source of instability".
     

    Replies: @Greasy William

    would Russia take Kiev in this scenario or would Kiev remain part of rump Ukraine?

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Greasy William


    Russia take Kiev in this scenario?
     
    I think that would be too difficult. Russians are now avoiding going into cities to root out defenders, who are in tower apartment blocks as well as basements, but prefer operationally encircling them instead. Encircling Kiev would entail crossing onto the West Bank with extremely heavy fighting through fortifications with fragile cross riverine logistics; Russians on the West Bank would also be defending on a reversed front while attacking the city in the opposite direction. A pretty tall order.

    Replies: @QCIC

  354. @S
    @songbird


    A while back we just had The Green Knight, starring an Indian. Haven’t seen it, but I doubt there has ever been a greater act of cultural vandalism, at least in terms of film.
     
    I know of something that could certainly rival it. A few days ago I came across a relatively new David Copperfield film which went to great lengths to be historically accurate in regards to mid 19th century Victorian England.

    The actor playing the part of Copperfield was an Indian.

    Replies: @songbird

    The actor playing the part of Copperfield was an Indian.

    Same guy, I think.

    It’s weird. I know that there are physical subsidies for introducing diversity in video games, made in the UK.

    Things like this make me believe that the same thing is true of film. But I’m not 100% sure of it. A lot of the audience in the UK would be Indian now, and maybe India is a big secondary market?

  355. @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective


    I don’t know why but I thought you are Asian.
     
    People often seem to think I am an Anglo or an Asian. I just find it amusing. Actually, I am (ethnically) Irish. America is my home, and part of my family has been here for a while, though none were settlers.

    Probably the Normans were only a small input of my blood (would guess maybe 4-8%), but they were an interesting group. Though, honestly, I am probably more fascinated by the native clans (which history I can also trace a little to). It is just that more survives directly from this one Norman family who kept their lands until very recently, so there is more of a cultural stamp on it, than the cold history of the annals.

    Traditional Irish clan-fighting is probably not very knight-like. Supposedly, they did not use stirrups on their horses, and I can well believe it because one annalistic reference has a native ancestor falling off his horse three times. (that is when he was quite old).

    The last movie remembered by me where Norman identity was accented was “Robin of Sherwood” TV series.
     
    Never saw it, but you better bet they believed in their identity (that is as English), at least the ones in the Pale.

    Well, how many of your progenitors embarked on any serious pilgrimage?
     
    No idea, the Norman book was only written in the 1500s, probably in the time of Henry VIII. There are two annalistic references to native Irish ancestors going to the Cathedral of Santiago - not an easy journey back then. But I imagine the common people satisfied themselves with local pilgrimages to sacred wells, etc, which were a very prominent feature of Irish life well into the 1800s, or later. It wasn't virtue-signaling but the heartfelt faith of very poor people.


    “Wicker Man” is a reconstruction which includes pagan dancing in circles, cult of fertility & phallic symbols, sacred prostitution, masked carnevale cortege preceding human sacrifice, and of course, human sacrifice itself which gave the movie its title.
     
    1.) none of that would fit into or improve the King Arthur Mythos
    2.) folk horror just shows how progressives hate and fear rural folk
    3.) in the movie, it is actually the rootless, immoral elite who, being newly transplanted to the area, introduces this faux religion, displacing the native traditions.

    Wasn’t it you who wanted it to be true to its time…?! Now aesthetics is more important to you.
     
    Maybe, I am not communicating clearly, so let me be clear:

    I recognize that there are pagan elements in the story. But I think they are a combination of medieval-era invention and incorporation of older, pagan-influenced but unrelated folklore. I think the thing as a whole - the true birth of the Arthur mythos - was in medieval times and that it has a medieval stamp on it. Those times were fusionist and people told folk stories that had a pagan origin, went to holy wells which had a pagan origin, had various beliefs and pagan customs, while simultaneously being Christians and having a faith in Christ.

    It wasn't just some empty display of the elite. The traditional greeting in Ireland was "God with you" and the reply was "God and Mary to you." Today, people have a hard time relating to that or believing it was possible. I think that just makes it a more compelling reason to depict it or to experience it in art.

    I find the idea that the myth of King Arthur existed in pagan times in any easily recognizable form to be spurious. On the whole, it just doesn't have the characteristics. King Arthur doesn't take up Excalibur because he wants to become a warrior of undying fame. In fact, he never dies. Avalon, to me, is thematically Christian - it represents the resurrection.

    Even one of the bad parts of it, him loading babies on some barge because he was afraid of the prophecy with Modred, strikes me as being related to Old Testament stories. The search for the Grail is quite Christian. There's an annalist reference to one of my Irish ancestors winning a battle and retrieving some holy relic. Is there anything like that in Greco-Roman history?

    I've said I do think there are good pagan stories. Just that I don't think that King Arthur is one of them. Sure, someone could try to do a fully pagan interpretation, I just don't think it would work anywhere near as well as some other obviously pagan story, or trying to invent a new story with pagan themes.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    People often seem to think I am an Anglo or an Asian.

    I thought you were Asian because you kind of clung to this idea of “Christian Arthur” in the way an Asian who took a course in “European culture” could. No offense 😉

    Never saw it, but you better bet they believed in their identity (that is as English), at least the ones in the Pale.

    What’s the Pale?

    1.) none of that would fit into or improve the King Arthur Mythos

    I disagree. Arthur’s knights sit around circle, a symbol more pagan (eg. Basque lauburu) than Christian.
    The entire Lancelot arc looks like taken from some troubadour “Story of Rose”; but is kind of pagan as a story of overwhelming passion and extasy: actually a Dionysian theme, not Christian at all. Ginevre has never really been punished and did not go to monastery too – this is not patriarchal Christianity. Ginevre is like a capricious pagan deity (no one can punish here) aka Aphrodite who must be pleased otherwise you lose your kingdom (almost) – Arthur does not please her enough. Morgana is like Artemis – dark, scheming and without husband; you need to neuter her with another god, i.e. Graal/Christ.

    Perceval is kind of Christian – he is meek (does not feel Grail mission is for him in the first place) but has great faith and perservance which enables his quest.

    What I disliked in “Excalibur” is that any knight who is not Lancelot or Perceval is just a cipher, maybe with a name. This is not really story of the “Round Table”.

    2.) folk horror just shows how progressives hate and fear rural folk

    It is not really horror. At least for me, it works as a comedy almost until the end.

    3.) in the movie, it is actually the rootless, immoral elite who, being newly transplanted to the area, introduces this faux religion, displacing the native traditions.

    You are partly right here, concerning elite, but what were those “native traditions”…?

    Those times were fusionist and people told folk stories that had a pagan origin, went to holy wells which had a pagan origin, had various beliefs and pagan customs, while simultaneously being Christians and having a faith in Christ.

    You can’t serve two masters. It is called hypocrisy and is starkly condemned in Bible in “Revelation” as well as in “Letter of St Jude”. Why aren’t you getting angry but complacent with these crypto-pagans when simultaneously defending the Arthurian myth from the charge of paganism…?
    This is doublethink.

    It wasn’t just some empty display of the elite. The traditional greeting in Ireland was “God with you” and the reply was “God and Mary to you.”

    In Southern Germany people still greet themselves with “Gruess Gott” but IT IS an empty display.
    I tested this bringing some religious theme when I didn’t agree with something a person said and they were so compartmentalized that they thought it was ridiculous.

    There’s an annalist reference to one of my Irish ancestors winning a battle and retrieving some holy relic. Is there anything like that in Greco-Roman history?

    History of relics starts in Late Roman Empire.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Ginevre has never really been punished and did not go to monastery too – this is not patriarchal Christianity.
     
    In Mysts of Avalon for one she is banished to a nunnery. There must be a thousand different versions of these stories by now. It's like Greek or Roman mythology; there isn't any one canonical version authorized by the church or Marvel Comics.
    , @songbird
    @Another Polish Perspective


    No offense
     
    None taken. I think my moniker might evoke something vaguely Chinese? (though I'm not completely sure why) Someone correctly guessed its origin once, but repeating it would just cheapen the feat.

    What’s the Pale?
     
    This was the fortified area around Dublin, named after a long wall which the English set up to prevent the raids of the native Irish. Some of the Norman families who lived outside it are said to have "degenerated", or to have taken up many of the customs of the native Irish, intermarrying with them and sometimes making war on the English. But the ones inside it (such as the family I referred to) seem to have had a pretty clear identity.

    What I disliked in “Excalibur” is that any knight who is not Lancelot or Perceval is just a cipher, maybe with a name. This is not really story of the “Round Table”.
     
    Yes, I felt the same way.

    A lot of the popularity of the original stories was in the different knights. I think Gawain is deserving of his own serious treatment, and some popular knights from medieval times, like Nicholas (who was a Greek), I don't ever recall seeing depicted. To do it justice, I think it would really need to be a high-budget ensemble TV show, or else a series of movies, where you could focus the point of view on different knights.

    Ginevre has never really been punished and did not go to monastery too – this is not patriarchal Christianity.
     
    Some say that was just the French trying to cuck the English, by writing it into the story.

    It is not really horror. At least for me, it works as a comedy almost until the end.
     
    It is very amusing. The '70s were so strange that I am not completely certain if it was meant to be funny or not, but I'm guessing it was.

    You are partly right here, concerning elite, but what were those “native traditions”…?
     
    Early life history check on the writer:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Shaffer_(writer)#Early_life

    Why aren’t you getting angry but complacent with these crypto-pagans when simultaneously defending the Arthurian myth from the charge of paganism…?
     
    Pretty reasonable to suppose that one of my GG grandmothers was traveling to one of these thinly-disguised pagan wells into the early 1900s and completing the particular rites of the site there. My sympathies are more with the attitudes of the Celtic Church, on a lot of things.

    I for one have always appreciated imaginative stories that resonated in the past, though I know a lot of people don't like myths or folk stories.

    In Southern Germany people still greet themselves with “Gruess Gott” but IT IS an empty display.
     
    Bavaria used to have crucifixes up on the walls of every public school classroom, until recently. (believe it made them more resistant to the cult of personality around Hitler) But think it was some judge who ruled that they had to take it down, if one student objected, which I am sure happened a lot as each classroom is filled with migrants who are not even nominally Christian. Of course, it is an absurd rule.
  356. @Greasy William
    @Sean

    would Russia take Kiev in this scenario or would Kiev remain part of rump Ukraine?

    Replies: @Sean

    Russia take Kiev in this scenario?

    I think that would be too difficult. Russians are now avoiding going into cities to root out defenders, who are in tower apartment blocks as well as basements, but prefer operationally encircling them instead. Encircling Kiev would entail crossing onto the West Bank with extremely heavy fighting through fortifications with fragile cross riverine logistics; Russians on the West Bank would also be defending on a reversed front while attacking the city in the opposite direction. A pretty tall order.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Sean

    I still see Kiev becoming a city-state, roughly like Berlin or Hong Kong. It remains the major regional cultural and economic center but is out of the loop as far as regional government is concerned.

    Replies: @Sean

  357. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    People often seem to think I am an Anglo or an Asian.
     
    I thought you were Asian because you kind of clung to this idea of "Christian Arthur" in the way an Asian who took a course in "European culture" could. No offense ;)

    Never saw it, but you better bet they believed in their identity (that is as English), at least the ones in the Pale.
     
    What's the Pale?

    1.) none of that would fit into or improve the King Arthur Mythos

    I disagree. Arthur's knights sit around circle, a symbol more pagan (eg. Basque lauburu) than Christian.
    The entire Lancelot arc looks like taken from some troubadour "Story of Rose"; but is kind of pagan as a story of overwhelming passion and extasy: actually a Dionysian theme, not Christian at all. Ginevre has never really been punished and did not go to monastery too - this is not patriarchal Christianity. Ginevre is like a capricious pagan deity (no one can punish here) aka Aphrodite who must be pleased otherwise you lose your kingdom (almost) - Arthur does not please her enough. Morgana is like Artemis - dark, scheming and without husband; you need to neuter her with another god, i.e. Graal/Christ.

    Perceval is kind of Christian - he is meek (does not feel Grail mission is for him in the first place) but has great faith and perservance which enables his quest.

    What I disliked in "Excalibur" is that any knight who is not Lancelot or Perceval is just a cipher, maybe with a name. This is not really story of the "Round Table".

    2.) folk horror just shows how progressives hate and fear rural folk
     
    It is not really horror. At least for me, it works as a comedy almost until the end.

    3.) in the movie, it is actually the rootless, immoral elite who, being newly transplanted to the area, introduces this faux religion, displacing the native traditions.

     

    You are partly right here, concerning elite, but what were those "native traditions"...?

    Those times were fusionist and people told folk stories that had a pagan origin, went to holy wells which had a pagan origin, had various beliefs and pagan customs, while simultaneously being Christians and having a faith in Christ.
     
    You can't serve two masters. It is called hypocrisy and is starkly condemned in Bible in "Revelation" as well as in "Letter of St Jude". Why aren't you getting angry but complacent with these crypto-pagans when simultaneously defending the Arthurian myth from the charge of paganism...?
    This is doublethink.

    It wasn’t just some empty display of the elite. The traditional greeting in Ireland was “God with you” and the reply was “God and Mary to you.”
     
    In Southern Germany people still greet themselves with "Gruess Gott" but IT IS an empty display.
    I tested this bringing some religious theme when I didn't agree with something a person said and they were so compartmentalized that they thought it was ridiculous.

    There’s an annalist reference to one of my Irish ancestors winning a battle and retrieving some holy relic. Is there anything like that in Greco-Roman history?
     
    History of relics starts in Late Roman Empire.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird

    Ginevre has never really been punished and did not go to monastery too – this is not patriarchal Christianity.

    In Mysts of Avalon for one she is banished to a nunnery. There must be a thousand different versions of these stories by now. It’s like Greek or Roman mythology; there isn’t any one canonical version authorized by the church or Marvel Comics.

  358. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    People often seem to think I am an Anglo or an Asian.
     
    I thought you were Asian because you kind of clung to this idea of "Christian Arthur" in the way an Asian who took a course in "European culture" could. No offense ;)

    Never saw it, but you better bet they believed in their identity (that is as English), at least the ones in the Pale.
     
    What's the Pale?

    1.) none of that would fit into or improve the King Arthur Mythos

    I disagree. Arthur's knights sit around circle, a symbol more pagan (eg. Basque lauburu) than Christian.
    The entire Lancelot arc looks like taken from some troubadour "Story of Rose"; but is kind of pagan as a story of overwhelming passion and extasy: actually a Dionysian theme, not Christian at all. Ginevre has never really been punished and did not go to monastery too - this is not patriarchal Christianity. Ginevre is like a capricious pagan deity (no one can punish here) aka Aphrodite who must be pleased otherwise you lose your kingdom (almost) - Arthur does not please her enough. Morgana is like Artemis - dark, scheming and without husband; you need to neuter her with another god, i.e. Graal/Christ.

    Perceval is kind of Christian - he is meek (does not feel Grail mission is for him in the first place) but has great faith and perservance which enables his quest.

    What I disliked in "Excalibur" is that any knight who is not Lancelot or Perceval is just a cipher, maybe with a name. This is not really story of the "Round Table".

    2.) folk horror just shows how progressives hate and fear rural folk
     
    It is not really horror. At least for me, it works as a comedy almost until the end.

    3.) in the movie, it is actually the rootless, immoral elite who, being newly transplanted to the area, introduces this faux religion, displacing the native traditions.

     

    You are partly right here, concerning elite, but what were those "native traditions"...?

    Those times were fusionist and people told folk stories that had a pagan origin, went to holy wells which had a pagan origin, had various beliefs and pagan customs, while simultaneously being Christians and having a faith in Christ.
     
    You can't serve two masters. It is called hypocrisy and is starkly condemned in Bible in "Revelation" as well as in "Letter of St Jude". Why aren't you getting angry but complacent with these crypto-pagans when simultaneously defending the Arthurian myth from the charge of paganism...?
    This is doublethink.

    It wasn’t just some empty display of the elite. The traditional greeting in Ireland was “God with you” and the reply was “God and Mary to you.”
     
    In Southern Germany people still greet themselves with "Gruess Gott" but IT IS an empty display.
    I tested this bringing some religious theme when I didn't agree with something a person said and they were so compartmentalized that they thought it was ridiculous.

    There’s an annalist reference to one of my Irish ancestors winning a battle and retrieving some holy relic. Is there anything like that in Greco-Roman history?
     
    History of relics starts in Late Roman Empire.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird

    No offense

    None taken. I think my moniker might evoke something vaguely Chinese? (though I’m not completely sure why) Someone correctly guessed its origin once, but repeating it would just cheapen the feat.

    [MORE]

    What’s the Pale?

    This was the fortified area around Dublin, named after a long wall which the English set up to prevent the raids of the native Irish. Some of the Norman families who lived outside it are said to have “degenerated”, or to have taken up many of the customs of the native Irish, intermarrying with them and sometimes making war on the English. But the ones inside it (such as the family I referred to) seem to have had a pretty clear identity.

    What I disliked in “Excalibur” is that any knight who is not Lancelot or Perceval is just a cipher, maybe with a name. This is not really story of the “Round Table”.

    Yes, I felt the same way.

    A lot of the popularity of the original stories was in the different knights. I think Gawain is deserving of his own serious treatment, and some popular knights from medieval times, like Nicholas (who was a Greek), I don’t ever recall seeing depicted. To do it justice, I think it would really need to be a high-budget ensemble TV show, or else a series of movies, where you could focus the point of view on different knights.

    Ginevre has never really been punished and did not go to monastery too – this is not patriarchal Christianity.

    Some say that was just the French trying to cuck the English, by writing it into the story.

    It is not really horror. At least for me, it works as a comedy almost until the end.

    It is very amusing. The ’70s were so strange that I am not completely certain if it was meant to be funny or not, but I’m guessing it was.

    You are partly right here, concerning elite, but what were those “native traditions”…?

    Early life history check on the writer:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Shaffer_(writer)#Early_life

    Why aren’t you getting angry but complacent with these crypto-pagans when simultaneously defending the Arthurian myth from the charge of paganism…?

    Pretty reasonable to suppose that one of my GG grandmothers was traveling to one of these thinly-disguised pagan wells into the early 1900s and completing the particular rites of the site there. My sympathies are more with the attitudes of the Celtic Church, on a lot of things.

    I for one have always appreciated imaginative stories that resonated in the past, though I know a lot of people don’t like myths or folk stories.

    In Southern Germany people still greet themselves with “Gruess Gott” but IT IS an empty display.

    Bavaria used to have crucifixes up on the walls of every public school classroom, until recently. (believe it made them more resistant to the cult of personality around Hitler) But think it was some judge who ruled that they had to take it down, if one student objected, which I am sure happened a lot as each classroom is filled with migrants who are not even nominally Christian. Of course, it is an absurd rule.

  359. @A123
    The intrigue of Not-The-President Biden's family grows even worse.

    • Hunter paid ~$50K/mo in rent to The Big Guy
    • Ooops, that income wasn't on The Big Guy's income tax return

    Would you like to guess what is next: (1)

    In the wake of accusations that Joe Biden may have failed to report thousands of dollars in rental income on his taxes, it has been discovered that Joe Biden’s campaign surreptitiously removed some of his tax returns from its website.

    However, according to the Schedule E portion of his 2017 tax forms, Joe Biden reported $19,800 in “rents received” and none in 2018. This discrepancy could mean that Joe Biden failed to report more than half a million in income on his taxes.

    Curiously, those documents are no longer available on his campaign website — while it appears that his tax returns are still posted to the website for public viewing, most of the files previously made available to the public have been removed. Instead, when you click on most of the links, the website immediately redirects the user to a donation page.
     
    It is now full cover up mode. One wonders if Not-The-VP Harris, or her people, are somehow driving this along.

    Biden's shambolic performance where he could not remember the name of his own SCOTUS appointment is also a serious problem. Offending the DNC base is possibly the one "unforgivable transgression" in Democrat party politics.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/matt-margolis/2023/01/17/joe-biden-removed-tax-returns-from-website-and-we-have-questions-n1662417

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird

    One wonders if Not-The-VP Harris

    Sounds like a dangerous jinx.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @songbird

    If they allow the issue of Biden family crimes to become something substantial we may be looking at President McCarthy before the end of the year.

    I think VP Harris is too dumb even for her handlers to put up with. Biden will get sick and resign for health reasons (the 'Omega' variant). Kamala will resign for no apparent reason and no one on the entire planet will care.

    Kevin will hold the fake reins just long enough to get blamed for the destruction of the dollar, loss of Ukraine and the subsequent limited nuclear war.

    My Magic Eight Ball does not have a prediction for the new VP.

    There, now I feel better!

    Replies: @A123, @songbird

  360. @Sean
    @Greasy William


    Russia take Kiev in this scenario?
     
    I think that would be too difficult. Russians are now avoiding going into cities to root out defenders, who are in tower apartment blocks as well as basements, but prefer operationally encircling them instead. Encircling Kiev would entail crossing onto the West Bank with extremely heavy fighting through fortifications with fragile cross riverine logistics; Russians on the West Bank would also be defending on a reversed front while attacking the city in the opposite direction. A pretty tall order.

    Replies: @QCIC

    I still see Kiev becoming a city-state, roughly like Berlin or Hong Kong. It remains the major regional cultural and economic center but is out of the loop as far as regional government is concerned.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @QCIC

    I think countries (Ukraine and Russia included) have more cohesion than they are given credit for. You can look at them geopolitically; as in effect living things that will do what it takes to survive and maintain if not increase their power even if that involves taking a calculated risk of total destruction, which is sometimes misjudged. Ukraine wanted this war, or at least wished for things only this war might bring them. Ukraine’s only chance of getting back Donbass and Crimea (like France’s only chance of getting back Alsace and Lorraine), was a war in which they’d have the backing of powerful allies, who would increase assistance the worse Ukraine did; Ukraine will not willingly stop even though 'firtest with the mostest' Russian mass may prove a match for an inevitable eventual dominance of Western deliveries of weaponry, if the Russians can get their steamroller into high gear.

    Vidkun Quisling advocated the Dnieper as eastmost border of western Europe. Division of the Ukraine could, or so he thought, 'be defended from geographical and historical perspectives'. I think the military correlation of forces including the all important national feeling of the population in West Ukraine will make a rump state there with Kiev as capital the most likely outcome if Russia achieves the kind of success Trenin thinks might be possible with supplementary effort. They will have to be quick though. If Russia starts to decisively lose, which it will in a long timeframe, the Kremlin will prefer using a nuclear weapon to the alternatives.

    Replies: @Greasy William

  361. @songbird
    @A123


    One wonders if Not-The-VP Harris
     
    Sounds like a dangerous jinx.

    Replies: @QCIC

    If they allow the issue of Biden family crimes to become something substantial we may be looking at President McCarthy before the end of the year.

    I think VP Harris is too dumb even for her handlers to put up with. Biden will get sick and resign for health reasons (the ‘Omega’ variant). Kamala will resign for no apparent reason and no one on the entire planet will care.

    Kevin will hold the fake reins just long enough to get blamed for the destruction of the dollar, loss of Ukraine and the subsequent limited nuclear war.

    My Magic Eight Ball does not have a prediction for the new VP.

    There, now I feel better!

    • Replies: @A123
    @QCIC


    If they allow the issue of Biden family crimes to become something substantial we may be looking at President McCarthy before the end of the year.

    Kevin will hold the fake reins just long enough to get blamed for the destruction of the dollar, loss of Ukraine and the subsequent limited nuclear war.
     
    Whaaa..... I am supposed to be the "Wild One"...

    McCarthy would have to grant J6 Pardons. The pressure to terminate 100% of the FBI's Baltimore and Headquarters/DC senior staff would be almost irresistible.

    I think VP Harris is too dumb even for her handlers to put up with. Biden will get sick and resign for health reasons (the ‘Omega’ variant). Kamala will resign for no apparent reason and no one on the entire planet will care.
     
    Not-The-VP Harris has better mental function than the current lobotomite. The risk to the Deep State is that she might try to set policy. Presumably they have an "Appleby" plan for that contingency.

    https://youtu.be/ObnWoyFACfw

    PEACE 😇
    , @songbird
    @QCIC


    My Magic Eight Ball does not have a prediction for the new VP.
     
    A123 is seriously giving me the heebeejeebies.

    It is like some twisted, chilling horror story. All this time it has been an act. He's only been playing at being MAGA, so he can work through some evil hoodoo incantation.

    He writes Not-the-president Biden 200x, probably using 200 keyboards from the IRS that he got in a lot off ebay.

    Then he dons a Rastafarian hat, starts smoking cannabis, and drinking tea, while playing movies from Bollywood in the background. Switches his incantation to Not-the-VP Harris, knowing full well that the conjunction will promote the whore and bring her into power.

    Wish I had a good working relationship with the top N'anga among the Shona, so I could put a stop to him in time to prevent it.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/24/N%27anga.jpg

    Replies: @A123

  362. @QCIC
    @songbird

    If they allow the issue of Biden family crimes to become something substantial we may be looking at President McCarthy before the end of the year.

    I think VP Harris is too dumb even for her handlers to put up with. Biden will get sick and resign for health reasons (the 'Omega' variant). Kamala will resign for no apparent reason and no one on the entire planet will care.

    Kevin will hold the fake reins just long enough to get blamed for the destruction of the dollar, loss of Ukraine and the subsequent limited nuclear war.

    My Magic Eight Ball does not have a prediction for the new VP.

    There, now I feel better!

    Replies: @A123, @songbird

    If they allow the issue of Biden family crimes to become something substantial we may be looking at President McCarthy before the end of the year.

    Kevin will hold the fake reins just long enough to get blamed for the destruction of the dollar, loss of Ukraine and the subsequent limited nuclear war.

    Whaaa….. I am supposed to be the “Wild One”…

    McCarthy would have to grant J6 Pardons. The pressure to terminate 100% of the FBI’s Baltimore and Headquarters/DC senior staff would be almost irresistible.

    I think VP Harris is too dumb even for her handlers to put up with. Biden will get sick and resign for health reasons (the ‘Omega’ variant). Kamala will resign for no apparent reason and no one on the entire planet will care.

    Not-The-VP Harris has better mental function than the current lobotomite. The risk to the Deep State is that she might try to set policy. Presumably they have an “Appleby” plan for that contingency.

    PEACE 😇

  363. @QCIC
    @songbird

    If they allow the issue of Biden family crimes to become something substantial we may be looking at President McCarthy before the end of the year.

    I think VP Harris is too dumb even for her handlers to put up with. Biden will get sick and resign for health reasons (the 'Omega' variant). Kamala will resign for no apparent reason and no one on the entire planet will care.

    Kevin will hold the fake reins just long enough to get blamed for the destruction of the dollar, loss of Ukraine and the subsequent limited nuclear war.

    My Magic Eight Ball does not have a prediction for the new VP.

    There, now I feel better!

    Replies: @A123, @songbird

    My Magic Eight Ball does not have a prediction for the new VP.

    A123 is seriously giving me the heebeejeebies.

    It is like some twisted, chilling horror story. All this time it has been an act. He’s only been playing at being MAGA, so he can work through some evil hoodoo incantation.

    He writes Not-the-president Biden 200x, probably using 200 keyboards from the IRS that he got in a lot off ebay.

    Then he dons a Rastafarian hat, starts smoking cannabis, and drinking tea, while playing movies from Bollywood in the background. Switches his incantation to Not-the-VP Harris, knowing full well that the conjunction will promote the whore and bring her into power.

    Wish I had a good working relationship with the top N’anga among the Shona, so I could put a stop to him in time to prevent it.

    • Replies: @A123
    @songbird

    Your insolence is intolerable.

    Open [MORE] for mandatory reprogramming.

    PEACE 😇



    https://i.gifer.com/origin/bf/bf34fb711ca9d088eb1df2be2ff0988d_w200.gif

     
    https://i.imgflip.com/2uqkwc.gif

    Replies: @songbird

  364. @songbird
    @QCIC


    My Magic Eight Ball does not have a prediction for the new VP.
     
    A123 is seriously giving me the heebeejeebies.

    It is like some twisted, chilling horror story. All this time it has been an act. He's only been playing at being MAGA, so he can work through some evil hoodoo incantation.

    He writes Not-the-president Biden 200x, probably using 200 keyboards from the IRS that he got in a lot off ebay.

    Then he dons a Rastafarian hat, starts smoking cannabis, and drinking tea, while playing movies from Bollywood in the background. Switches his incantation to Not-the-VP Harris, knowing full well that the conjunction will promote the whore and bring her into power.

    Wish I had a good working relationship with the top N'anga among the Shona, so I could put a stop to him in time to prevent it.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/24/N%27anga.jpg

    Replies: @A123

    Your insolence is intolerable.

    Open [MORE] for mandatory reprogramming.

    PEACE 😇

    [MORE]

     

    • Replies: @songbird
    @A123

    Had the fear a few years back that Biden would never complete his term. That they would make him resign in order to put Harris in the position, and check the all the "first" boxes available to them.

    That was a long time before Kissinger came out and endorsed Ukraine joining NATO, and I didn't anticipate it.

    Replies: @A123

  365. After what happened in Soledar and what appears to be happening in Siversk, it just seems like Ukraine cannot deal with Russia’s artillery advantage. The Ukrainians are trying to fight like a Western army but Western armies rely on air superiority and maneuver to make up for lack of firepower. The Ukrainians have very little airpower and even if they are capable of maneuver, they can’t use it in these urban battles.

    I’m very interested to see if Ukraine really does go forward with an offensive in the spring. If such an offensive is lost, it seems likely to be a very costly failure.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Greasy William

    Western armies have only fought Arabs. A fight with the chinks way back when ended in stalemate.

    , @216
    @Greasy William

    In this retrofuture WW1 analogue we are living in, which side will introduce the neo-stormtrooper?

    This is the fighting that the cancelled XM25 launcher was made for, along with the cancelled Comanche helicopter.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  366. @A123
    @songbird

    Your insolence is intolerable.

    Open [MORE] for mandatory reprogramming.

    PEACE 😇



    https://i.gifer.com/origin/bf/bf34fb711ca9d088eb1df2be2ff0988d_w200.gif

     
    https://i.imgflip.com/2uqkwc.gif

    Replies: @songbird

    Had the fear a few years back that Biden would never complete his term. That they would make him resign in order to put Harris in the position, and check the all the “first” boxes available to them.

    That was a long time before Kissinger came out and endorsed Ukraine joining NATO, and I didn’t anticipate it.

    • Replies: @A123
    @songbird


    Had the fear a few years back that Biden would never complete his term. That they would make him resign in order to put Harris in the position, and check the all the “first” boxes available to them.
     
    I suspect that this was always "The Plan". Get Not-The-VP Harris beyond the 2 year mark so her elevation does not count against the 2 term limit in the Constitution. Set-up for 10 more years of DNC rule.

    However, they now realize that made a terrible mistake. She is hideously unpopular and cannot be controlled. Her gaffes are EPIC. She cannot be hidden in Delaware, away from public view.

    The desperate DNC back fill is, trying to keep Veggie Biden propped up until the Primaries are well underway. It is the only option they have to ditch Harris without alienating their base voters.

    PEACE 😇
  367. @QCIC
    @Sean

    I still see Kiev becoming a city-state, roughly like Berlin or Hong Kong. It remains the major regional cultural and economic center but is out of the loop as far as regional government is concerned.

    Replies: @Sean

    I think countries (Ukraine and Russia included) have more cohesion than they are given credit for. You can look at them geopolitically; as in effect living things that will do what it takes to survive and maintain if not increase their power even if that involves taking a calculated risk of total destruction, which is sometimes misjudged. Ukraine wanted this war, or at least wished for things only this war might bring them. Ukraine’s only chance of getting back Donbass and Crimea (like France’s only chance of getting back Alsace and Lorraine), was a war in which they’d have the backing of powerful allies, who would increase assistance the worse Ukraine did; Ukraine will not willingly stop even though ‘firtest with the mostest’ Russian mass may prove a match for an inevitable eventual dominance of Western deliveries of weaponry, if the Russians can get their steamroller into high gear.

    Vidkun Quisling advocated the Dnieper as eastmost border of western Europe. Division of the Ukraine could, or so he thought, ‘be defended from geographical and historical perspectives’. I think the military correlation of forces including the all important national feeling of the population in West Ukraine will make a rump state there with Kiev as capital the most likely outcome if Russia achieves the kind of success Trenin thinks might be possible with supplementary effort. They will have to be quick though. If Russia starts to decisively lose, which it will in a long timeframe, the Kremlin will prefer using a nuclear weapon to the alternatives.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Sean


    If Russia starts to decisively lose, which it will in a long timeframe, the Kremlin will prefer using a nuclear weapon to the alternatives.
     
    I disagree. The Russians themselves say that nuclear weapons will only be used to prevent a total strategic defeat, ala Russia being driven out of all of Crimea and all of Donbas. There is no reason whatsoever to think that the Ukrainians are capable of pulling that off. The current Ukrainian army is too small and too poorly armed to have anymore large scale offensive success.

    I know your thesis is that the Ukraine can defeat Russia once it is supplied with sufficient qualities of US wonder weapons, but I don't see that ever happening. Even when/if the Ukrainian lines can no longer hold, the US would likely respond with threatening direct NATO intervention within the territory of Ukraine itself as a means to get Russia to agree to terms and I believe that Russia will be happy to make a deal.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @Sean

  368. @Sean
    @QCIC

    I think countries (Ukraine and Russia included) have more cohesion than they are given credit for. You can look at them geopolitically; as in effect living things that will do what it takes to survive and maintain if not increase their power even if that involves taking a calculated risk of total destruction, which is sometimes misjudged. Ukraine wanted this war, or at least wished for things only this war might bring them. Ukraine’s only chance of getting back Donbass and Crimea (like France’s only chance of getting back Alsace and Lorraine), was a war in which they’d have the backing of powerful allies, who would increase assistance the worse Ukraine did; Ukraine will not willingly stop even though 'firtest with the mostest' Russian mass may prove a match for an inevitable eventual dominance of Western deliveries of weaponry, if the Russians can get their steamroller into high gear.

    Vidkun Quisling advocated the Dnieper as eastmost border of western Europe. Division of the Ukraine could, or so he thought, 'be defended from geographical and historical perspectives'. I think the military correlation of forces including the all important national feeling of the population in West Ukraine will make a rump state there with Kiev as capital the most likely outcome if Russia achieves the kind of success Trenin thinks might be possible with supplementary effort. They will have to be quick though. If Russia starts to decisively lose, which it will in a long timeframe, the Kremlin will prefer using a nuclear weapon to the alternatives.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    If Russia starts to decisively lose, which it will in a long timeframe, the Kremlin will prefer using a nuclear weapon to the alternatives.

    I disagree. The Russians themselves say that nuclear weapons will only be used to prevent a total strategic defeat, ala Russia being driven out of all of Crimea and all of Donbas. There is no reason whatsoever to think that the Ukrainians are capable of pulling that off. The current Ukrainian army is too small and too poorly armed to have anymore large scale offensive success.

    I know your thesis is that the Ukraine can defeat Russia once it is supplied with sufficient qualities of US wonder weapons, but I don’t see that ever happening. Even when/if the Ukrainian lines can no longer hold, the US would likely respond with threatening direct NATO intervention within the territory of Ukraine itself as a means to get Russia to agree to terms and I believe that Russia will be happy to make a deal.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Greasy William

    The UK offer of a Squadron of Challenger 2 tanks, while welcome for the Ukies does point out the very real limitations of what's really available to help them. The UK literally doesn't have anything other than very very heavy tanks in very limited numbers. Much like the German Tiger. Good for an all out one off assault on Prokorovka at Kursk, but after that just used to plug gaps in the line of a constant retreat back to Berlin.

    Replies: @QCIC

    , @Sean
    @Greasy William

    The American strategy is for the Russians to become discouraged and quit, and walking them into such an endgame requires a fine balance in what Ukraine is given. Hence the US is finely balencing what is given to Ukraine so Russia will be slowly worn down, and not suffer any sudden disaster. However, some weapons might be more effective than America anticipated, so they are proceeding very cautiously.


    Even when/if the Ukrainian lines can no longer hold, the US would likely respond with threatening direct NATO intervention within the territory of Ukraine itself as a means to get Russia to agree to terms and I believe that Russia will be happy to make a deal.
     
    Maybe Russia would, but America is not looking to find out. Not a chance of the US armed forces being ordered into direct combat with the Russians in Ukraine. Really.

    Russians themselves say that nuclear weapons will only be used to prevent a total strategic defeat, ala Russia being driven out of all of Crimea and all of Donbas. There is no reason whatsoever to think that the Ukrainians are capable of pulling that off.
     
    The worse Ukraine does the more they will be given and America will under no circumstances allow anything that looks like it will turn into a Russian strategic success to be unanswered. There are things America can give Ukraine but has been denying them so far such as Army Tactical Missile System, and if it looks like Ukraine is in danger of collapsing America will supply it. And much else as well.

    In any event, it is already clear from the rate at which equipment is being destroyed that in the medium to long term Ukraine will burn through all its Soviet origin equipment and have to be given lots of American artillery, tanks, and planes. Once those more advanced arms are the mainstay of Ukraine's armed forces they (with the unalloyed boon of US surveillance enabling real time targeting by Ukraine) will probably be more than a match for the Russians. At that point Russia may well be faced with swallowing an unbearable humiliation, or terminating the conflict by using a nuclear weapon on the Ukrainian armed forces. America wants to gradually demoralise Russia so it gives up, but I am not sure their mindset in relation to Ukraine will permit that.

    I know your thesis is that the Ukraine can defeat Russia once it is supplied with sufficient qualities of US wonder weapons
     
    As already mentioned I don't think the US would give Ukraine wonder weapons that would let them trounce Russia in short order. What the US is trying to do is frustrate Russia not put them in a situation they might panic in. Let me put things this way; Russia will not be able to make any headway at all if it lets this war run on. It has to finish it ASAP and get the Dneiper as a barrier behind which to consolidate and incorporate East Ukraine into Russia. Whether the Kremlin will be able to get their steamroller moving fast enough for the conquest of east Ukraine fast enoughremains to be seen.

    Replies: @216, @A123

  369. There is no more natgas from RF at all in Germany and the sky isn’t falling in EU as many willing victims, consuming RF produced mass propjunk, were so eager to declare just several months ago:

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @sudden death


    Natural gas storage facilities in Europe are in exceptionally good shape for this time of the year. In the European Union overall, storage facilities were 81.7% full on January 14, according to GIE (Gas Infrastructure Europe). This is how the 916 terawatt-hours (TWh) of natural gas in storage on January 14, compares to the levels at the same time of the year in prior years:

    76% above 2022
    32% above 2021
    1% above 2020
    30% above 2019
    44% above 2018
    Storage levels differed by countries, but all of them were in great shape, particularly in Germany, which has managed to actually increase its storage levels over the past few weeks during a period (winter) that would normally be the withdrawal period. As of January 14, per GIE:

    Germany: 90.5% full
    France: 79.7% full
    Italy: 79.3% full
    Spain: 93.6% full
    Netherlands: 75.8% full
    Poland: 95.6% full
    Sweden: 88.4% full
    Belgium: 88.6% full
    Austria: 87.3% full
    Denmark: 91.5%% full
    In terms of LNG pricing, the pressure has come off too. The price of the Japan Korea Marker (JKM) futures contract, at $26.80 per million Btu has plunged 62% from the crazy peak on August 31, 2022 (data via Investing.com):
     

    https://wolfstreet.com/2023/01/16/natural-gas-futures-in-europe-plunge-15-today-down-84-from-crazy-spike/

    Yeah, it's been way warmer than usual in EU, but guess it means God is on the Western side this time, heh ;)

    Replies: @QCIC

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @sudden death

    Sure, they have replaced gas with coal. It is quite entertaining to watch German Green Party politicians twisting and turning to justify this.

    https://news.sky.com/story/greta-thunberg-detained-by-police-during-eco-protest-in-german-village-12788902

    Of course all politicians are hypocrites, comes with the job really, but the German Green Party comes across as an extreme exemple of hypocrisy. I suggest they rename themselves the Yellow Party.

    Although given the Cold War against China getting momentum that might not be a good idea after all.

    Replies: @sudden death, @Wokechoke

    , @songbird
    @sudden death

    Now that Greta has been liquidated by the Bundespolizei, nothing is off the table, anymore.

  370. @sudden death
    There is no more natgas from RF at all in Germany and the sky isn't falling in EU as many willing victims, consuming RF produced mass propjunk, were so eager to declare just several months ago:

    https://www.cleanenergywire.org/sites/default/files/styles/gallery_image/public/paragraphs/images/bdew-origin-natural-gas-consumed-germany-2021-2022-monthly.jpg

    https://wolfstreet.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Europe-natural-gas-futures-2023-01-16.png

    Replies: @sudden death, @Ivashka the fool, @songbird

    Natural gas storage facilities in Europe are in exceptionally good shape for this time of the year. In the European Union overall, storage facilities were 81.7% full on January 14, according to GIE (Gas Infrastructure Europe). This is how the 916 terawatt-hours (TWh) of natural gas in storage on January 14, compares to the levels at the same time of the year in prior years:

    76% above 2022
    32% above 2021
    1% above 2020
    30% above 2019
    44% above 2018
    Storage levels differed by countries, but all of them were in great shape, particularly in Germany, which has managed to actually increase its storage levels over the past few weeks during a period (winter) that would normally be the withdrawal period. As of January 14, per GIE:

    Germany: 90.5% full
    France: 79.7% full
    Italy: 79.3% full
    Spain: 93.6% full
    Netherlands: 75.8% full
    Poland: 95.6% full
    Sweden: 88.4% full
    Belgium: 88.6% full
    Austria: 87.3% full
    Denmark: 91.5%% full
    In terms of LNG pricing, the pressure has come off too. The price of the Japan Korea Marker (JKM) futures contract, at $26.80 per million Btu has plunged 62% from the crazy peak on August 31, 2022 (data via Investing.com):

    https://wolfstreet.com/2023/01/16/natural-gas-futures-in-europe-plunge-15-today-down-84-from-crazy-spike/

    Yeah, it’s been way warmer than usual in EU, but guess it means God is on the Western side this time, heh 😉

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @sudden death

    Is Russia still supplying any gas or fuel to Ukraine?

    Replies: @sudden death

  371. Sher Singh says:

    Which Workout Program is Best? (Comparing Reviews)
    byu/Reckish inweightroom

    0.5% a week on average after novice stage.
    Amazing thread – currently on 2nd run of Bullmastiff & can confirm I hit the avg despite cutting.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Sher Singh

    Yes that is a good reddit thread.

    Did you know America's most successful reigning professional athlete goes for resistance bands not free weights for his main strength training mode?

    (Tom Brady)

  372. @Greasy William
    After what happened in Soledar and what appears to be happening in Siversk, it just seems like Ukraine cannot deal with Russia's artillery advantage. The Ukrainians are trying to fight like a Western army but Western armies rely on air superiority and maneuver to make up for lack of firepower. The Ukrainians have very little airpower and even if they are capable of maneuver, they can't use it in these urban battles.

    I'm very interested to see if Ukraine really does go forward with an offensive in the spring. If such an offensive is lost, it seems likely to be a very costly failure.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @216

    Western armies have only fought Arabs. A fight with the chinks way back when ended in stalemate.

  373. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird


    I descend from a line of Norman knights.
     
    I don't know why but I thought you are Asian.

    So do you consider yourself French Norman or British Norman, Sire?

    The last movie remembered by me where Norman identity was accented was "Robin of Sherwood" TV series. I remember Sheriff wondering once about who is who and Guy of Gisborne answering to that with great certainty "We are Normans, my Lord!".

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAq5Mnlry5g

    Replies: @Yahya, @A123, @songbird, @Wokechoke

    Turns out a lot of English do have a Norman ancestor. The downward social mobility of the invading French was a real thing in the gene pool.

  374. @Another Polish Perspective
    @songbird

    Man, you shouldn't read this story through details but details through story.
    It cannot be really Christian story because it would prove Christianity to be powerless against pagan Merlin and Morgana.

    The term "knight" is rather about understanding of listeners of the story than about story itself... since Arthur was to live in the Dark Age after Romans, in reality "knight" should be Latin "comes" probably.

    Anyway, knights were part of secular feudal system, not of clergy. In practice, they never refused to fight even if fight was unjust and did not defend the poor.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @songbird, @Wokechoke

    Dux Bellorum.

  375. @sudden death
    There is no more natgas from RF at all in Germany and the sky isn't falling in EU as many willing victims, consuming RF produced mass propjunk, were so eager to declare just several months ago:

    https://www.cleanenergywire.org/sites/default/files/styles/gallery_image/public/paragraphs/images/bdew-origin-natural-gas-consumed-germany-2021-2022-monthly.jpg

    https://wolfstreet.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Europe-natural-gas-futures-2023-01-16.png

    Replies: @sudden death, @Ivashka the fool, @songbird

    Sure, they have replaced gas with coal. It is quite entertaining to watch German Green Party politicians twisting and turning to justify this.

    https://news.sky.com/story/greta-thunberg-detained-by-police-during-eco-protest-in-german-village-12788902

    Of course all politicians are hypocrites, comes with the job really, but the German Green Party comes across as an extreme exemple of hypocrisy. I suggest they rename themselves the Yellow Party.

    Although given the Cold War against China getting momentum that might not be a good idea after all.

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @Ivashka the fool


    Sure, they have replaced gas with coal.
     
    Said it as if it was some bad thing, lol

    Putin meantime should be given some memorial statue though, just for being capable to forcefully kick some amount of common sense finally into the skulls of ruling purebreed eurogreen idiots and making them use native coal industry instead of paying only for imported RF natgas;)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Wokechoke
    @Ivashka the fool

    The Brown Partei.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  376. @Ivashka the fool
    @sudden death

    Sure, they have replaced gas with coal. It is quite entertaining to watch German Green Party politicians twisting and turning to justify this.

    https://news.sky.com/story/greta-thunberg-detained-by-police-during-eco-protest-in-german-village-12788902

    Of course all politicians are hypocrites, comes with the job really, but the German Green Party comes across as an extreme exemple of hypocrisy. I suggest they rename themselves the Yellow Party.

    Although given the Cold War against China getting momentum that might not be a good idea after all.

    Replies: @sudden death, @Wokechoke

    Sure, they have replaced gas with coal.

    Said it as if it was some bad thing, lol

    Putin meantime should be given some memorial statue though, just for being capable to forcefully kick some amount of common sense finally into the skulls of ruling purebreed eurogreen idiots and making them use native coal industry instead of paying only for imported RF natgas;)

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @sudden death

    Putin and the Green Party leaders should all be reincarnated as polar bears during the final stages of global warming.

  377. @Greasy William
    @Sean


    If Russia starts to decisively lose, which it will in a long timeframe, the Kremlin will prefer using a nuclear weapon to the alternatives.
     
    I disagree. The Russians themselves say that nuclear weapons will only be used to prevent a total strategic defeat, ala Russia being driven out of all of Crimea and all of Donbas. There is no reason whatsoever to think that the Ukrainians are capable of pulling that off. The current Ukrainian army is too small and too poorly armed to have anymore large scale offensive success.

    I know your thesis is that the Ukraine can defeat Russia once it is supplied with sufficient qualities of US wonder weapons, but I don't see that ever happening. Even when/if the Ukrainian lines can no longer hold, the US would likely respond with threatening direct NATO intervention within the territory of Ukraine itself as a means to get Russia to agree to terms and I believe that Russia will be happy to make a deal.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @Sean

    The UK offer of a Squadron of Challenger 2 tanks, while welcome for the Ukies does point out the very real limitations of what’s really available to help them. The UK literally doesn’t have anything other than very very heavy tanks in very limited numbers. Much like the German Tiger. Good for an all out one off assault on Prokorovka at Kursk, but after that just used to plug gaps in the line of a constant retreat back to Berlin.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Wokechoke

    One commenter suggested that Britain has very limited stocks of ammunition for the main gun which is is unique to the Challenger. I suppose they want to use up the stocks to justify a faster schedule for the Challenger 3 upgrades.

    Replies: @Vishnugupta

  378. @Ivashka the fool
    @sudden death

    Sure, they have replaced gas with coal. It is quite entertaining to watch German Green Party politicians twisting and turning to justify this.

    https://news.sky.com/story/greta-thunberg-detained-by-police-during-eco-protest-in-german-village-12788902

    Of course all politicians are hypocrites, comes with the job really, but the German Green Party comes across as an extreme exemple of hypocrisy. I suggest they rename themselves the Yellow Party.

    Although given the Cold War against China getting momentum that might not be a good idea after all.

    Replies: @sudden death, @Wokechoke

    The Brown Partei.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Wokechoke

    I believe it was Le Pen who called the Greens a "watermelon" party : green on the outside, red on the inside.

  379. @songbird
    @A123

    Had the fear a few years back that Biden would never complete his term. That they would make him resign in order to put Harris in the position, and check the all the "first" boxes available to them.

    That was a long time before Kissinger came out and endorsed Ukraine joining NATO, and I didn't anticipate it.

    Replies: @A123

    Had the fear a few years back that Biden would never complete his term. That they would make him resign in order to put Harris in the position, and check the all the “first” boxes available to them.

    I suspect that this was always “The Plan”. Get Not-The-VP Harris beyond the 2 year mark so her elevation does not count against the 2 term limit in the Constitution. Set-up for 10 more years of DNC rule.

    However, they now realize that made a terrible mistake. She is hideously unpopular and cannot be controlled. Her gaffes are EPIC. She cannot be hidden in Delaware, away from public view.

    The desperate DNC back fill is, trying to keep Veggie Biden propped up until the Primaries are well underway. It is the only option they have to ditch Harris without alienating their base voters.

    PEACE 😇

  380. @sudden death
    @Ivashka the fool


    Sure, they have replaced gas with coal.
     
    Said it as if it was some bad thing, lol

    Putin meantime should be given some memorial statue though, just for being capable to forcefully kick some amount of common sense finally into the skulls of ruling purebreed eurogreen idiots and making them use native coal industry instead of paying only for imported RF natgas;)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Putin and the Green Party leaders should all be reincarnated as polar bears during the final stages of global warming.

  381. @Wokechoke
    @Ivashka the fool

    The Brown Partei.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    I believe it was Le Pen who called the Greens a “watermelon” party : green on the outside, red on the inside.

  382. @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-64300190



    https://tf-cmsv2-smithsonianmag-media.s3.amazonaws.com/filer/52/e4/52e44474-c2dc-41e0-bb77-42a904695196/this-image-shows-a-portrait-of-dragon-man-credit-chuang-zhao_web.jpg

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Blinky Bill

    I was about to give you a lashing, then the scales fell from my eyes and instead you shall receive a warm embrace brother Ivashka.

    [MORE]

    Tanquam ex ungue leonem.

    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Blinky Bill


    A local laborer found a nearly complete skull at the riverbank of Songhua River in 1933 when he was building the Dongjiang Bridge in Harbin (at the time part of Manchukuo) for the Japanese-aligned Manchukuo National Railway.

    Recognizing its importance, likely as a result of public interest in anthropology recently generated by the Peking Man in 1929, he hid it from the Manchukuo authorities in an abandoned well. After the Soviet invasion of Manchuria, ending the Japanese occupation of the region, he concealed his former employment from the Nationalist and later the Communist authorities.

    Consequently, he could not report the skull, lest he divulge his ties to the Japanese imperialists in explaining its origin.


    I shall refrain from saying anymore.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  383. @songbird
    @silviosilver


    How old were you when you saw it? I first saw it at eleven or twelve
     
    Caught a few scenes of it at about that age, but that was towards the end of the movie - its weakest part, IMO. It was only about 2-3 years ago that I watched the full film and saw the good parts.

    ‘Sword of the Valiant’ 1984, was another.
     
    Haven't seen it.

    Charlton Heston freeing the Moorish prisoners in El Cid had a similar impact on me.
     
    Another one I haven't seen, been meaning to watch it.


    If there’s ever anything like it again, I fear it won’t be for a long, long time.
     
    Oh, definitely. It was a product of its time, and that is one of the things that makes me a bit sad about it. It had a European stamp on it. It didn't feel as deracinated as a Hollywood production, or many things shot in Western Europe today. And I wish there had been more films like that, of a higher quality than the standard B-movie fare.

    A while back we just had The Green Knight, starring an Indian. Haven't seen it, but I doubt there has ever been a greater act of cultural vandalism, at least in terms of film. To go straight to Indian, in something that obviously has ancient and pagan roots. Standard disclaimer: wouldn't care if it had been a Bollywood film, but the offense is that it passed itself off as a European one.


    I’m not sure anyone could have done a whole lot better though. Given the subject matter and the scenery as it was, I think there was easily enough there to satisfy the deepest yearnings of blood and soil nationalist types
     
    You may be right.

    There weren't really any shots that rubbed me the wrong way, like when you see an arid California backdrop that is meant to be a forest in Britain (notable in The Adventures of Robin Hood 1938, which isn't a bad film) - they didn't have that.

    Guess I am kind of a weirdo, but I have an obsession with streams. I've spent a lot of time near them, and thinking about them, so I have an unnaturally high romantic view of them.

    In reality, I brought them up more because I was thinking of the Táin Bó Cúailnge. If that story were ever adapted to the screen, I think there would need to be a hyper focus on selecting the best location shots for river and stream crossings, and even the flow of the water.

    A lot of the shots would be technically pretty difficult. Must be hard to do stunt work in such places, sometimes the rocks can be as slippery as ice.

    Replies: @S, @silviosilver

    Another one I haven’t seen, been meaning to watch it.

    I watched it plenty of times as a kid, but I haven’t seen it for years. I have a feeling it would still hold up pretty well though (in a way that many medieval-themed films from that era just don’t).

    Another one I bet you haven’t seen is Robert Bresson’s “Lancelot du Lac” (1974). I wouldn’t bother though. Pretentious, emotionless tripe. Maybe some minimal redeeming value as “an aesthetic experience” overall, but absolutely nothing that would make me ever want to watch it again. (Not to be confused with a rarer French TV movie by the same name from 1970.)

    There weren’t really any shots that rubbed me the wrong way, like when you see an arid California backdrop that is meant to be a forest in Britain (notable in The Adventures of Robin Hood 1938, which isn’t a bad film) – they didn’t have that.

    Oh wow, I’d almost completely forgotten about this film. This is another one I watched over a dozen times as a kid. I don’t remember the arid scenery you’re talking about though.

    Guess I am kind of a weirdo, but I have an obsession with streams. I’ve spent a lot of time near them, and thinking about them, so I have an unnaturally high romantic view of them.

    What did you think of the scene where Uther is ambushed and he wades across the brook just before plunging the sword into the stone?

    AnotherPolishPerspective,

    I disagree. Arthur’s knights sit around circle, a symbol more pagan (eg. Basque lauburu) than Christian.

    The round table is supposed to imply that all those sitting around it are of equal status, which is more of a Christian than pagan them.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @silviosilver


    I don’t remember the arid scenery you’re talking about though.
     
    Doubtlessly, the wrong word. Grew up in 44" of precip a year. Ancestors got about 61".

    Can you believe I was talking about the scenes shot in Bidwell Park, where they had the men swinging down from trees? I think the right term here is "Mediterranean climate." They actually get about 27", but it still looks wrong to me. Too sunny. Too dusty - guessing they shot in the dry season, but, maybe, it just looks different all year round? Not the same amount of moss and canopy?

    Anyway, one of my pet peeves with Hollywood is everything always looks like it is in the wrong climate. Like, they'll shoot a show, like Night Rider where the character is supposed to be driving around the country. But you never see him in the woods of Maine, or driving through a snowstorm (guess the car couldn't handle it). It just all looks the same. Or Star Trek, when they are supposed to be going to different planets, and it is all shot within 30 miles of the studio.

    It just looks unmistakably like California to me. Maybe, someone from a different climate or the Med wouldn't find it as objectionable? I think another part of it is I am very sun sensitive, and I feel like I am being sunburned watching it. Maybe, it was an issue with using film, and they needed the light.

    “Lancelot du Lac” (1974).
     
    Haven't seen it. BTW, I didn't even realize that there were older movies focused on the Green Knight. Hopefully, I can track that other one you mentioned down.

    What did you think of the scene where Uther is ambushed and he wades across the brook just before plunging the sword into the stone?
     
    One of the great scenes of the movie. Good location shooting too. I like how Uther's pursuers go straight for the sword, after it is put into the stone, and don't even bother with Uther.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  384. @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool

    I was about to give you a lashing, then the scales fell from my eyes and instead you shall receive a warm embrace brother Ivashka.



    Tanquam ex ungue leonem.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

    [MORE]

    A local laborer found a nearly complete skull at the riverbank of Songhua River in 1933 when he was building the Dongjiang Bridge in Harbin (at the time part of Manchukuo) for the Japanese-aligned Manchukuo National Railway.

    Recognizing its importance, likely as a result of public interest in anthropology recently generated by the Peking Man in 1929, he hid it from the Manchukuo authorities in an abandoned well. After the Soviet invasion of Manchuria, ending the Japanese occupation of the region, he concealed his former employment from the Nationalist and later the Communist authorities.

    Consequently, he could not report the skull, lest he divulge his ties to the Japanese imperialists in explaining its origin.

    I shall refrain from saying anymore.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    So many interesting and significant things have happened in Harbin. Don't you think ?



    BTW a young Chinese lady I have met last year had family ties to that region and understood a little Russian. She had an interesting phenotype for a Han Chinese, her mother did not look that different from the Tatar neighbors who lived next door in Moscow in my youth. Her father came from an impoverished family of Inner Mongolia that claimed some princely ancestry. He didn't look that different from some of the Bashkirs I have personally met. I had an interesting conversation with her about the complex mix of ethnicities that have formed the Northern Chinese. She told me that in her opinion only the Northern Han were the true Chinese, that only them had the strength and the guts to build the country into an Empire. She looked at the Cantonese with somewhat of condescending disdain, telling me that they are "small, brown and only good at business and commerce". I was surprised to find that even among the Chinese youth, there were some that saw their homeland as deeply divided on regional identity grounds.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Blinky Bill

  385. @Wokechoke
    @Greasy William

    The UK offer of a Squadron of Challenger 2 tanks, while welcome for the Ukies does point out the very real limitations of what's really available to help them. The UK literally doesn't have anything other than very very heavy tanks in very limited numbers. Much like the German Tiger. Good for an all out one off assault on Prokorovka at Kursk, but after that just used to plug gaps in the line of a constant retreat back to Berlin.

    Replies: @QCIC

    One commenter suggested that Britain has very limited stocks of ammunition for the main gun which is is unique to the Challenger. I suppose they want to use up the stocks to justify a faster schedule for the Challenger 3 upgrades.

    • Replies: @Vishnugupta
    @QCIC

    The challenger 2 is the only major MBT which uses a rifled barrel gun.This leads to incompatibility with the rest of NATO which has standardized on 120 mm smoothbore and why this will eventually be replaced with a 120mm smoothbore gun.

    However presently this enables the challenger 2 to fire some very unique rounds such as HESH rounds which are extremely effective against fortifications.

    Replies: @Sean

  386. @sudden death
    @sudden death


    Natural gas storage facilities in Europe are in exceptionally good shape for this time of the year. In the European Union overall, storage facilities were 81.7% full on January 14, according to GIE (Gas Infrastructure Europe). This is how the 916 terawatt-hours (TWh) of natural gas in storage on January 14, compares to the levels at the same time of the year in prior years:

    76% above 2022
    32% above 2021
    1% above 2020
    30% above 2019
    44% above 2018
    Storage levels differed by countries, but all of them were in great shape, particularly in Germany, which has managed to actually increase its storage levels over the past few weeks during a period (winter) that would normally be the withdrawal period. As of January 14, per GIE:

    Germany: 90.5% full
    France: 79.7% full
    Italy: 79.3% full
    Spain: 93.6% full
    Netherlands: 75.8% full
    Poland: 95.6% full
    Sweden: 88.4% full
    Belgium: 88.6% full
    Austria: 87.3% full
    Denmark: 91.5%% full
    In terms of LNG pricing, the pressure has come off too. The price of the Japan Korea Marker (JKM) futures contract, at $26.80 per million Btu has plunged 62% from the crazy peak on August 31, 2022 (data via Investing.com):
     

    https://wolfstreet.com/2023/01/16/natural-gas-futures-in-europe-plunge-15-today-down-84-from-crazy-spike/

    Yeah, it's been way warmer than usual in EU, but guess it means God is on the Western side this time, heh ;)

    Replies: @QCIC

    Is Russia still supplying any gas or fuel to Ukraine?

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @QCIC

    Directly supplying no, but they keep transporting through UA pipeline oil into Hungary and pipeline natgas into Moldova, Slovakia and Austria.

    RF has rocketed and blown all working oil refineries last spring in UA though, so petroleum and diesel has to be imported now, IIRC mainly from EU and Azerbaijan.

  387. @Blinky Bill
    @Blinky Bill


    A local laborer found a nearly complete skull at the riverbank of Songhua River in 1933 when he was building the Dongjiang Bridge in Harbin (at the time part of Manchukuo) for the Japanese-aligned Manchukuo National Railway.

    Recognizing its importance, likely as a result of public interest in anthropology recently generated by the Peking Man in 1929, he hid it from the Manchukuo authorities in an abandoned well. After the Soviet invasion of Manchuria, ending the Japanese occupation of the region, he concealed his former employment from the Nationalist and later the Communist authorities.

    Consequently, he could not report the skull, lest he divulge his ties to the Japanese imperialists in explaining its origin.


    I shall refrain from saying anymore.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    So many interesting and significant things have happened in Harbin. Don’t you think ?

    [MORE]

    BTW a young Chinese lady I have met last year had family ties to that region and understood a little Russian. She had an interesting phenotype for a Han Chinese, her mother did not look that different from the Tatar neighbors who lived next door in Moscow in my youth. Her father came from an impoverished family of Inner Mongolia that claimed some princely ancestry. He didn’t look that different from some of the Bashkirs I have personally met. I had an interesting conversation with her about the complex mix of ethnicities that have formed the Northern Chinese. She told me that in her opinion only the Northern Han were the true Chinese, that only them had the strength and the guts to build the country into an Empire. She looked at the Cantonese with somewhat of condescending disdain, telling me that they are “small, brown and only good at business and commerce”. I was surprised to find that even among the Chinese youth, there were some that saw their homeland as deeply divided on regional identity grounds.

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Ivashka the fool

    The PRC founders are mainly from interior south, Hunan, Hubei, and Sichuan


    若道中華國果亡,除非湖南人死光

     

    Northern Chinese military units were not impressive in 20th CE. Zhang Xueliang's Northeastern Army was the best equipped in China in with a navy and air force. He started the 1929 Sino-Soviet War and got stomped; then folded like a deck of cards in 1931 against 関東軍 かんとうぐん Kantōgun.

    Guangdong is only one province in the coastal south. Guangxi Clique was the most fierce unit in the KMT Army under Li Zongren and 小諸葛.

    As for Guangdong itself, yes the stereotype mostly stands. But if your friend has any actual knowledge of Chinese history instead of talking out her ass, she would know the meaning of this phrase--


    “吾粤崎岖岭表,数千年来,与中原之关系甚浅薄。若夫以一身之言动、进退、生死,关系国家之安危、民族之隆替者,于古未始有之。有之,则袁督师其人也。”
     

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool


    So many interesting and significant things have happened in Harbin
     
    .

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5f/Harbin_1940_st.nicolas.jpg




    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a3/Nash_Put_newspaper.jpg/500px-Nash_Put_newspaper.jpg

    It is also where Pan-Asianist An Jung-geun, who spoke fluent Russian ended the life of Itō Hirobumi, the first Prime Minister of Japan.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/Ajg_calligraphy_ilil.jpg

    Some contemporary news of note, the Harbin Institute of Technology which was established in 1920 as the Harbin Sino-Russian School for Industry, in order to educate railway engineers. Is now in the forefront of China's research for Extreme Ultraviolet Lithography, the light source to be exact.
  388. @Sher Singh
    https://www.reddit.com/r/weightroom/comments/y3z9m5/which_workout_program_is_best_comparing_reviews/

    0.5% a week on average after novice stage.
    Amazing thread - currently on 2nd run of Bullmastiff & can confirm I hit the avg despite cutting.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4z7EXJ42pc

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Yes that is a good reddit thread.

    Did you know America’s most successful reigning professional athlete goes for resistance bands not free weights for his main strength training mode?

    (Tom Brady)

  389. @AP
    @Beckow


    Fine, keep on looking [good good], it is a big country, you have all those cars to drive around…quite a life, to each his own
     
    Most Americans are satisfied with crap food and they get what they want. But one can also get good food if one wants, it isn’t hard to find.

    we see it in the overall health, life expectancy below Europe or parts of Asia
     
    Overall US life expectancy is higher than that of your Slovakia, Poland, Hungary, the Baltics, etc.

    Life expectancy is dragged down somewhat because the highly segregated Black people keep shooting one another, unfortunately.

    The life expectancy of European Americans is almost a year higher than for Slovakia.

    You like to separate the European-descent parts into its own category
     
    Because America is highly racially segregated, particularly with the descendants of slaves. Although Euro Americans like Black music they live in different cities or neighborhoods in large cities and lead separate lives and radically different lifestyles (64% of Black parents are unmarried compared to 24% of Euro parents), speak differently, etc. Intermarriage rates are low.

    I don’t have time to calculate stats for Europeans + Asians + Latinos who mix more often, so I just use Euro-American statistics.

    It would be inaccurate to lump such different groups together.

    as if we would only consider Northern Italy
     
    If the differences between Northern and Southern Italians were as stark as between Euro Americans and African Americans it would indeed make sense to consider them separately. But they aren’t. Indeed, America also has regional as well as racial differences. New England Euros are probably more different from Southern ones than Swedes are from Danes. Certainly more so than Brits are from Australians.

    Suicide in the Euro Scandie countries is high, but it has nothing to do with ‘social-democracy’ or weather
     
    I now looked it up and I was mistaken when I said suicide rate was lower than in many Euro social democracies - the suicide rate for Euro Americans in 2020 was actually even higher than among Scandinavians. In Europe, only Russians, Lithuanians, and Ukrainians (in that order) have higher suicide rates then do Euro Americans. Though Belarusians and Latvians are nearly tied. Though I haven’t seen Scandinavian stats by ethnicity, I suspect native rates are higher than Somali ones.
    .

    Replies: @Beckow

    …Life expectancy is dragged down somewhat because the highly segregated Black people keep shooting one another

    That is statistically irrelevant, do the numbers, the impact is in small fractions of a year. It is amusing that you constantly harp on V4 when convenient and avoid like a plague comparing US with Western Europe. But that is what most people would think about: US compared to Italy-Germany and not Albania. If you boast that “we are better than Bulgaria!!!” you have already lost.

    V4 countries have an issue with smoking-alcohol and people over certain age are not treated properly by the medical system (75-80) – but they are fitter, skinnier, live healthier lives than Americans. (The ladies are way better looking, it is not even close.) Italy has 4 years longer life expectancy than US – how do you explain that? It is not the jungle shooting – it is that Americans overeat and eat garbage, no amount of medical care can fix it. The swollen-face look that most Americans now have shows what they are putting in their bodies.

    Differences exist everywhere, but to do a proper comparison you can’t exclude what doesn’t suit you: Lousiana blacks, big cities, LA cholo reservation, meth-infested Albaquerque, homeless tattoed white kids in Seattle…all of that is America. You need to own up to it. It has been spreading: oasis never spreads, the desert does. We know where this is going.

    Scandies croak a lot, they are weak, insecure people living comfortable lives. The fact that Euro-Americans now croak at higher rates is significant – something is rotten.

    US can’t afford to lose this war – the fallout would be catastrophic. So they are pushing for escalation, stalling, hoping for a miracle – if Russia keeps its cool they will win. What then? You have not put enough thought into it, you still don’t understand how self-defeating the decision to put Nato in Ukraine and then escalate was. This was done by very stupid (in a historical sense) people in Washington-London…they screwed up badly and they know it. Washington would give a lot to go back to 2013 or 2005, they would take that deal immediately. Russia no longer – that tells us all we need to know about who is winning…

    • Replies: @A123
    @Beckow


    US can’t afford to lose this war – the fallout would be catastrophic.
     
    Huh?

    Despite the massive cash transfer, the U.S. is not really "in the war". Money was crammed into the Omnibus is to preempt House Appropriations. The cash flow will be greatly diminished in any future package. Americans is leaving the war, and there will be little or no "fallout" in the U.S.

    What "fallout" do you envision?

    Yes. Not-The-President Biden's illegitimate regime will suffer additional humiliation. However, that has no impact on America as a whole.
    ___

    There will be consequences in Europe. Holders of Ukrainian identity documents will be permanently allowed to stay in the EU. This includes the vast number of MENA origin migrants with forged papers.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @sudden death

    , @AP
    @Beckow


    "…Life expectancy is dragged down somewhat because the highly segregated Black people keep shooting one another"

    That is statistically irrelevant, do the numbers, the impact is in small fractions of a year.
     
    It's about half a year (77.8) for Euro Americans, above the American national average (77.3). To compare - Croatia is 77.7, Slovakia 76.9, Latvia 75.4, Bulgaria 73.6.

    If you boast that “we are better than Bulgaria!!!” you have already lost.
     
    Euro Americans are also better than Slovaks.

    V4 countries have an issue with smoking-alcohol
     
    Smoking and excessive alcohol are disgusting habits. So is the American vice of overeating, of course.

    but they are fitter, skinnier, live healthier lives than Americans.
     
    American obesity varies by origins also. Euro American obesity rate is closer to European:

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/207436/overweight-and-obesity-rates-for-adults-by-ethnicity/

    It's 31.5%, versus 27.8% for Brits.

    And it varies by region. America is much larger than Europe, you know.

    https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/obesity-rate-by-state

    The people of Colorado are thinner than those of Czechia and Hungary. The people of New England/New York/New Jersey are thinner than those of the UK (and that is without even taking race into account). Also Florida and California.

    Differences exist everywhere, but to do a proper comparison you can’t exclude what doesn’t suit you: Lousiana blacks, big cities, LA cholo reservation, meth-infested Albaquerque, homeless tattoed white kids in Seattle…all of that is America.
     
    America is a huge country. I would have to drive a few hours to get to a region that is bad in the way you describe (small isolated segregated neighborhoods don't count).

    US can’t afford to lose this war
     
    US is spending only 6% of its defense budget on this war. In exchange it is wiping out Russia's military, testing its weapons in the field, and helping its own defense industry. If Russia wins it will be in possession of ruins, with a wrecked economy and military. If Russia loses we will see a rebirth of a sort of PLC and change in Europe that will benefit the USA. Either way, the American position improves.

    Replies: @Beckow

  390. @silviosilver
    @songbird


    Another one I haven’t seen, been meaning to watch it.
     
    I watched it plenty of times as a kid, but I haven't seen it for years. I have a feeling it would still hold up pretty well though (in a way that many medieval-themed films from that era just don't).

    Another one I bet you haven't seen is Robert Bresson's "Lancelot du Lac" (1974). I wouldn't bother though. Pretentious, emotionless tripe. Maybe some minimal redeeming value as "an aesthetic experience" overall, but absolutely nothing that would make me ever want to watch it again. (Not to be confused with a rarer French TV movie by the same name from 1970.)

    There weren’t really any shots that rubbed me the wrong way, like when you see an arid California backdrop that is meant to be a forest in Britain (notable in The Adventures of Robin Hood 1938, which isn’t a bad film) – they didn’t have that.
     
    Oh wow, I'd almost completely forgotten about this film. This is another one I watched over a dozen times as a kid. I don't remember the arid scenery you're talking about though.

    Guess I am kind of a weirdo, but I have an obsession with streams. I’ve spent a lot of time near them, and thinking about them, so I have an unnaturally high romantic view of them.
     
    What did you think of the scene where Uther is ambushed and he wades across the brook just before plunging the sword into the stone?


    AnotherPolishPerspective,

    I disagree. Arthur’s knights sit around circle, a symbol more pagan (eg. Basque lauburu) than Christian.
     
    The round table is supposed to imply that all those sitting around it are of equal status, which is more of a Christian than pagan them.

    Replies: @songbird

    I don’t remember the arid scenery you’re talking about though.

    Doubtlessly, the wrong word. Grew up in 44″ of precip a year. Ancestors got about 61″.

    Can you believe I was talking about the scenes shot in Bidwell Park, where they had the men swinging down from trees? I think the right term here is “Mediterranean climate.”

    [MORE]
    They actually get about 27″, but it still looks wrong to me. Too sunny. Too dusty – guessing they shot in the dry season, but, maybe, it just looks different all year round? Not the same amount of moss and canopy?

    Anyway, one of my pet peeves with Hollywood is everything always looks like it is in the wrong climate. Like, they’ll shoot a show, like Night Rider where the character is supposed to be driving around the country. But you never see him in the woods of Maine, or driving through a snowstorm (guess the car couldn’t handle it). It just all looks the same. Or Star Trek, when they are supposed to be going to different planets, and it is all shot within 30 miles of the studio.

    It just looks unmistakably like California to me. Maybe, someone from a different climate or the Med wouldn’t find it as objectionable? I think another part of it is I am very sun sensitive, and I feel like I am being sunburned watching it. Maybe, it was an issue with using film, and they needed the light.

    “Lancelot du Lac” (1974).

    Haven’t seen it. BTW, I didn’t even realize that there were older movies focused on the Green Knight. Hopefully, I can track that other one you mentioned down.

    What did you think of the scene where Uther is ambushed and he wades across the brook just before plunging the sword into the stone?

    One of the great scenes of the movie. Good location shooting too. I like how Uther’s pursuers go straight for the sword, after it is put into the stone, and don’t even bother with Uther.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @songbird


    BTW, I didn’t even realize that there were older movies focused on the Green Knight. Hopefully, I can track that other one you mentioned down.
     
    https://myflixer.vc/movie/sword-of-the-valiant-rol1m/1-full

    Since I brought it up, a word of warning is in order: don't expect too much. You wouldn't call it a comedy, but it employs quite a lot of wry humor and it's definitely not meant to be taken seriously, so if you're looking for an artistic production that will satisfy a yen for national mythology, this is most certainly not it.


    I like how Uther’s pursuers go straight for the sword, after it is put into the stone, and don’t even bother with Uther.
     
    It was also a plot weakness though. He's ambushed, dragged off his horse, and battered as he lies on the ground, and when his attackers' attention is diverted to Uther's guards, he is able to get up and retrieve the sword, which all the while was sitting out in the open, attached to his saddle. If the whole point is to get your hands on Excalibur, it's hard to believe his attackers would have missed it.

    Replies: @songbird

  391. Surprising to me that single parent homes in Russia are 18%

    If I didn’t already know it, I’d be surprised that the US is #1, and not some African country.

    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @songbird


    Born out of Wedlock as percentage of total.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fms_QILXEAIPd8P.jpg

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @songbird

  392. @Beckow
    @AP


    ...Life expectancy is dragged down somewhat because the highly segregated Black people keep shooting one another
     
    That is statistically irrelevant, do the numbers, the impact is in small fractions of a year. It is amusing that you constantly harp on V4 when convenient and avoid like a plague comparing US with Western Europe. But that is what most people would think about: US compared to Italy-Germany and not Albania. If you boast that "we are better than Bulgaria!!!" you have already lost.

    V4 countries have an issue with smoking-alcohol and people over certain age are not treated properly by the medical system (75-80) - but they are fitter, skinnier, live healthier lives than Americans. (The ladies are way better looking, it is not even close.) Italy has 4 years longer life expectancy than US - how do you explain that? It is not the jungle shooting - it is that Americans overeat and eat garbage, no amount of medical care can fix it. The swollen-face look that most Americans now have shows what they are putting in their bodies.

    Differences exist everywhere, but to do a proper comparison you can't exclude what doesn't suit you: Lousiana blacks, big cities, LA cholo reservation, meth-infested Albaquerque, homeless tattoed white kids in Seattle...all of that is America. You need to own up to it. It has been spreading: oasis never spreads, the desert does. We know where this is going.

    Scandies croak a lot, they are weak, insecure people living comfortable lives. The fact that Euro-Americans now croak at higher rates is significant - something is rotten.

    US can't afford to lose this war - the fallout would be catastrophic. So they are pushing for escalation, stalling, hoping for a miracle - if Russia keeps its cool they will win. What then? You have not put enough thought into it, you still don't understand how self-defeating the decision to put Nato in Ukraine and then escalate was. This was done by very stupid (in a historical sense) people in Washington-London...they screwed up badly and they know it. Washington would give a lot to go back to 2013 or 2005, they would take that deal immediately. Russia no longer - that tells us all we need to know about who is winning...

    Replies: @A123, @AP

    US can’t afford to lose this war – the fallout would be catastrophic.

    Huh?

    Despite the massive cash transfer, the U.S. is not really “in the war”. Money was crammed into the Omnibus is to preempt House Appropriations. The cash flow will be greatly diminished in any future package. Americans is leaving the war, and there will be little or no “fallout” in the U.S.

    What “fallout” do you envision?

    Yes. Not-The-President Biden’s illegitimate regime will suffer additional humiliation. However, that has no impact on America as a whole.
    ___

    There will be consequences in Europe. Holders of Ukrainian identity documents will be permanently allowed to stay in the EU. This includes the vast number of MENA origin migrants with forged papers.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @A123


    Americans is leaving the war
     
    English is not your first language?
  393. @QCIC
    @Wokechoke

    One commenter suggested that Britain has very limited stocks of ammunition for the main gun which is is unique to the Challenger. I suppose they want to use up the stocks to justify a faster schedule for the Challenger 3 upgrades.

    Replies: @Vishnugupta

    The challenger 2 is the only major MBT which uses a rifled barrel gun.This leads to incompatibility with the rest of NATO which has standardized on 120 mm smoothbore and why this will eventually be replaced with a 120mm smoothbore gun.

    However presently this enables the challenger 2 to fire some very unique rounds such as HESH rounds which are extremely effective against fortifications.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Vishnugupta

    I know someone who commanded British tanks and they are very, very unreliable with the gears/ transmission especially prone to problems. Replacement parts were hard to come by. I do think they can send a few to Ukraine but I'd bet the army is not going to part with their best ones, so they will break down right quick. HESH is effective against concrete bunkers and building strongpoints, ordinary HE works better against trenches. Tanks in Ukraine are to a great extent operating as assaults gun artillery and when firing from further back getting targeting info from drones.

    In Ukraine the tanks are operating differently than they were designed for. Dashing in (keeping trees occluding the anti tank missiles targeting system) is the latest tactic. And this is against strongpoints. The Russian tanks may be more fragile but they are also more agile cross country, and smaller. There are a lot of them.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

  394. @sudden death
    There is no more natgas from RF at all in Germany and the sky isn't falling in EU as many willing victims, consuming RF produced mass propjunk, were so eager to declare just several months ago:

    https://www.cleanenergywire.org/sites/default/files/styles/gallery_image/public/paragraphs/images/bdew-origin-natural-gas-consumed-germany-2021-2022-monthly.jpg

    https://wolfstreet.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Europe-natural-gas-futures-2023-01-16.png

    Replies: @sudden death, @Ivashka the fool, @songbird

    Now that Greta has been liquidated by the Bundespolizei, nothing is off the table, anymore.

  395. @Vishnugupta
    @QCIC

    The challenger 2 is the only major MBT which uses a rifled barrel gun.This leads to incompatibility with the rest of NATO which has standardized on 120 mm smoothbore and why this will eventually be replaced with a 120mm smoothbore gun.

    However presently this enables the challenger 2 to fire some very unique rounds such as HESH rounds which are extremely effective against fortifications.

    Replies: @Sean

    I know someone who commanded British tanks and they are very, very unreliable with the gears/ transmission especially prone to problems. Replacement parts were hard to come by. I do think they can send a few to Ukraine but I’d bet the army is not going to part with their best ones, so they will break down right quick. HESH is effective against concrete bunkers and building strongpoints, ordinary HE works better against trenches. Tanks in Ukraine are to a great extent operating as assaults gun artillery and when firing from further back getting targeting info from drones.

    In Ukraine the tanks are operating differently than they were designed for. Dashing in (keeping trees occluding the anti tank missiles targeting system) is the latest tactic. And this is against strongpoints. The Russian tanks may be more fragile but they are also more agile cross country, and smaller. There are a lot of them.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Sean

    World of Tanks figured out these tactics a number of years ago. Tanks are like Sniper gun platforms.

    They peekaboo around outcrops fire and retreat.

  396. @Greasy William
    @Sean


    If Russia starts to decisively lose, which it will in a long timeframe, the Kremlin will prefer using a nuclear weapon to the alternatives.
     
    I disagree. The Russians themselves say that nuclear weapons will only be used to prevent a total strategic defeat, ala Russia being driven out of all of Crimea and all of Donbas. There is no reason whatsoever to think that the Ukrainians are capable of pulling that off. The current Ukrainian army is too small and too poorly armed to have anymore large scale offensive success.

    I know your thesis is that the Ukraine can defeat Russia once it is supplied with sufficient qualities of US wonder weapons, but I don't see that ever happening. Even when/if the Ukrainian lines can no longer hold, the US would likely respond with threatening direct NATO intervention within the territory of Ukraine itself as a means to get Russia to agree to terms and I believe that Russia will be happy to make a deal.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @Sean

    The American strategy is for the Russians to become discouraged and quit, and walking them into such an endgame requires a fine balance in what Ukraine is given. Hence the US is finely balencing what is given to Ukraine so Russia will be slowly worn down, and not suffer any sudden disaster. However, some weapons might be more effective than America anticipated, so they are proceeding very cautiously.

    Even when/if the Ukrainian lines can no longer hold, the US would likely respond with threatening direct NATO intervention within the territory of Ukraine itself as a means to get Russia to agree to terms and I believe that Russia will be happy to make a deal.

    Maybe Russia would, but America is not looking to find out. Not a chance of the US armed forces being ordered into direct combat with the Russians in Ukraine. Really.

    Russians themselves say that nuclear weapons will only be used to prevent a total strategic defeat, ala Russia being driven out of all of Crimea and all of Donbas. There is no reason whatsoever to think that the Ukrainians are capable of pulling that off.

    The worse Ukraine does the more they will be given and America will under no circumstances allow anything that looks like it will turn into a Russian strategic success to be unanswered. There are things America can give Ukraine but has been denying them so far such as Army Tactical Missile System, and if it looks like Ukraine is in danger of collapsing America will supply it. And much else as well.

    In any event, it is already clear from the rate at which equipment is being destroyed that in the medium to long term Ukraine will burn through all its Soviet origin equipment and have to be given lots of American artillery, tanks, and planes. Once those more advanced arms are the mainstay of Ukraine’s armed forces they (with the unalloyed boon of US surveillance enabling real time targeting by Ukraine) will probably be more than a match for the Russians. At that point Russia may well be faced with swallowing an unbearable humiliation, or terminating the conflict by using a nuclear weapon on the Ukrainian armed forces. America wants to gradually demoralise Russia so it gives up, but I am not sure their mindset in relation to Ukraine will permit that.

    I know your thesis is that the Ukraine can defeat Russia once it is supplied with sufficient qualities of US wonder weapons

    As already mentioned I don’t think the US would give Ukraine wonder weapons that would let them trounce Russia in short order. What the US is trying to do is frustrate Russia not put them in a situation they might panic in. Let me put things this way; Russia will not be able to make any headway at all if it lets this war run on. It has to finish it ASAP and get the Dneiper as a barrier behind which to consolidate and incorporate East Ukraine into Russia. Whether the Kremlin will be able to get their steamroller moving fast enough for the conquest of east Ukraine fast enoughremains to be seen.

    • Replies: @216
    @Sean

    The failure to take Kiev in the first week of the war was a cataclysmic 1914 level failure. If Russia is not in firm control of Kiev there is no prospect of a diplomatic solution on favorable terms. Leaving any kind of a Ukrainian rump state which claims all of its 1954 borders will only encourage the West to try again. In the same visage, Kiev has stated that their desired endgame is a color revolution in Moscow, the partition of RF, and denuclearization. Russian success depends on Poland, Hungary and Romania annexing the rump Ukrainian territory which they previously controlled.

    In any event, the post-war states will be faced with a demographic hole, and they could easily repeat the West's greatest error of importing Replacements.

    Replies: @Sean

    , @A123
    @Sean


    Not a chance of the US armed forces being ordered into direct combat with the Russians in Ukraine. Really.
     
    100% correct.

    Deploying regular troops in significant numbers would require a Declaration of War, or at a minimum an Authorization for Use of Military Force [AUMF]. Regardless of the pressure the European Empire places on Not-The-President Biden, there is no chance to obtain an AUMF from Congress.


    The worse Ukraine does the more they will be given and America will under no circumstances allow anything that looks like it will turn into a Russian strategic success to be unanswered.
     
    Incorrect.

    America and the U.S. House is more than willing to let Russia have strategic success over the European Empire. Humiliating the illicit White House occupant would be a side bonus.

    While it will not be zero, the American money spigot is being wound shut. If the Paris/Brussels/Berlin axis want this war, the EU will have to fund it.


    Russia will not be able to make any headway at all if it lets this war run on. It has to finish it ASAP.
     
    Sorry. Again Incorrect.

    Time is on Putin's side. The money is running out on Kiev regime aggression. It is unlikely that the EU will step up to fill the gaping chasm created by U.S. cutbacks.

    With 0% chance of victory, Zelensky will exit "one way or another". The next Ukrainian administration will be agreement capable and cut a deal with Russia. Guessing timing is hard, but the window for sanity opens in the Fall/Winter timeframe.

    PEACE 😇

  397. @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    So many interesting and significant things have happened in Harbin. Don't you think ?



    BTW a young Chinese lady I have met last year had family ties to that region and understood a little Russian. She had an interesting phenotype for a Han Chinese, her mother did not look that different from the Tatar neighbors who lived next door in Moscow in my youth. Her father came from an impoverished family of Inner Mongolia that claimed some princely ancestry. He didn't look that different from some of the Bashkirs I have personally met. I had an interesting conversation with her about the complex mix of ethnicities that have formed the Northern Chinese. She told me that in her opinion only the Northern Han were the true Chinese, that only them had the strength and the guts to build the country into an Empire. She looked at the Cantonese with somewhat of condescending disdain, telling me that they are "small, brown and only good at business and commerce". I was surprised to find that even among the Chinese youth, there were some that saw their homeland as deeply divided on regional identity grounds.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Blinky Bill

    The PRC founders are mainly from interior south, Hunan, Hubei, and Sichuan

    若道中華國果亡,除非湖南人死光

    Northern Chinese military units were not impressive in 20th CE. Zhang Xueliang’s Northeastern Army was the best equipped in China in with a navy and air force. He started the 1929 Sino-Soviet War and got stomped; then folded like a deck of cards in 1931 against 関東軍 かんとうぐん Kantōgun.

    Guangdong is only one province in the coastal south. Guangxi Clique was the most fierce unit in the KMT Army under Li Zongren and 小諸葛.

    As for Guangdong itself, yes the stereotype mostly stands. But if your friend has any actual knowledge of Chinese history instead of talking out her ass, she would know the meaning of this phrase–

    “吾粤崎岖岭表,数千年来,与中原之关系甚浅薄。若夫以一身之言动、进退、生死,关系国家之安危、民族之隆替者,于古未始有之。有之,则袁督师其人也。”

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    I can confirm that she has little knowledge of Chinese history. That is why I found it really enjoyable to discuss China with her, because she talked about it in a very simple, non-intellectual way. She was candidly ignorant and everything she said was probably some stereotype that she acquired in her family and among her friends. Stereotypes are often more important than truth. In this case it suggested a level of regionalism that is seldom mentioned when China is discussed. Can you confirm that this regionalism exists or was this young lady's opinion a statistical outlier that was captured in my "sample of one" ?

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  398. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Ivashka the fool

    The PRC founders are mainly from interior south, Hunan, Hubei, and Sichuan


    若道中華國果亡,除非湖南人死光

     

    Northern Chinese military units were not impressive in 20th CE. Zhang Xueliang's Northeastern Army was the best equipped in China in with a navy and air force. He started the 1929 Sino-Soviet War and got stomped; then folded like a deck of cards in 1931 against 関東軍 かんとうぐん Kantōgun.

    Guangdong is only one province in the coastal south. Guangxi Clique was the most fierce unit in the KMT Army under Li Zongren and 小諸葛.

    As for Guangdong itself, yes the stereotype mostly stands. But if your friend has any actual knowledge of Chinese history instead of talking out her ass, she would know the meaning of this phrase--


    “吾粤崎岖岭表,数千年来,与中原之关系甚浅薄。若夫以一身之言动、进退、生死,关系国家之安危、民族之隆替者,于古未始有之。有之,则袁督师其人也。”
     

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    I can confirm that she has little knowledge of Chinese history. That is why I found it really enjoyable to discuss China with her, because she talked about it in a very simple, non-intellectual way. She was candidly ignorant and everything she said was probably some stereotype that she acquired in her family and among her friends. Stereotypes are often more important than truth. In this case it suggested a level of regionalism that is seldom mentioned when China is discussed. Can you confirm that this regionalism exists or was this young lady’s opinion a statistical outlier that was captured in my “sample of one” ?

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Ivashka the fool

    Northern chauvinism exists but for dumb reasons--

    1. All but the Han and Ming dynasties have been founded by northerners or Inner Asians,

    But, this has reasons extraneous to human capital-- historically cavalry dominated and the north had more access to horses.

    2. Northerners are taller and thus perceived to be more "honorary whites"

    Being taller amongst whites doesn't imply dominance. The historically dominant European military power was-- France.

    All but one of the Chinese men on this list are southerners:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world_records_in_Olympic_weightlifting

    3. North China Plains, Henan, was the cradle of Chinese civilization

    It's sad actually that Henan's fate is somewhat worse than its counterpart-- Greece, today known for poverty, bank busts, prostitution, and HIV epidemic.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  399. @Ivashka the fool
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    I can confirm that she has little knowledge of Chinese history. That is why I found it really enjoyable to discuss China with her, because she talked about it in a very simple, non-intellectual way. She was candidly ignorant and everything she said was probably some stereotype that she acquired in her family and among her friends. Stereotypes are often more important than truth. In this case it suggested a level of regionalism that is seldom mentioned when China is discussed. Can you confirm that this regionalism exists or was this young lady's opinion a statistical outlier that was captured in my "sample of one" ?

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Northern chauvinism exists but for dumb reasons–

    1. All but the Han and Ming dynasties have been founded by northerners or Inner Asians,

    But, this has reasons extraneous to human capital– historically cavalry dominated and the north had more access to horses.

    2. Northerners are taller and thus perceived to be more “honorary whites”

    Being taller amongst whites doesn’t imply dominance. The historically dominant European military power was– France.

    All but one of the Chinese men on this list are southerners:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world_records_in_Olympic_weightlifting

    3. North China Plains, Henan, was the cradle of Chinese civilization

    It’s sad actually that Henan’s fate is somewhat worse than its counterpart– Greece, today known for poverty, bank busts, prostitution, and HIV epidemic.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Do southern Chinese also have their own brand of regionalism / chauvinism ?

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  400. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Ivashka the fool

    Northern chauvinism exists but for dumb reasons--

    1. All but the Han and Ming dynasties have been founded by northerners or Inner Asians,

    But, this has reasons extraneous to human capital-- historically cavalry dominated and the north had more access to horses.

    2. Northerners are taller and thus perceived to be more "honorary whites"

    Being taller amongst whites doesn't imply dominance. The historically dominant European military power was-- France.

    All but one of the Chinese men on this list are southerners:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world_records_in_Olympic_weightlifting

    3. North China Plains, Henan, was the cradle of Chinese civilization

    It's sad actually that Henan's fate is somewhat worse than its counterpart-- Greece, today known for poverty, bank busts, prostitution, and HIV epidemic.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Do southern Chinese also have their own brand of regionalism / chauvinism ?

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Ivashka the fool

    Yes. Northern China have been ruled by Tatars for six out of the last ten centuries. Their language, Mandarin, is the least faithful to Classical Chinese of all dialects.

    And on the grounds of academic achievement, south (top) vs. north (bottom) in Northern Song jinshi Imperial Exam qualifiers.
    https://i.postimg.cc/HkHMTwny/123.png

    Mongols and Manchus did even poorer on the exams and needed quotas to be represented.

    But really, both north and south have equal dysfunctions. For all of the southern scholar-official's academic prestige it amounted largely to empty cramming of Confucian classics, the only mathematician of note in late Imperial was a Mongol aristocrat,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minggatu

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @sudden death

  401. There are things America can give Ukraine but has been denying them so far such as Army Tactical Missile System, and if it looks like Ukraine is in danger of collapsing America will supply it. And much else as well.

    A Ukrainian ACTAM attack on the Russian interior basically requires that Russia respond with missile attacks on Poland and Romania. I don’t think the US will ever provide Ukraine with this weapon. And even if it did, I think it would take years to build a Ukrainian army capable of overtaking Russia’s current positions.

    Further, if things ever get so bad for Ukraine that it appears the state is going to completely collapse, ACTAM systems will not be enough to save them.

  402. Well, I now have RWA’s permission to demand gratitude from any Iraqi for the American liberation of Baghdad from Saddam.

    Will RWA give the US gratitude for liberating the USSR from Marxism-Leninism, without which this “non-state” actors would not otherwise exist?

    Can we melt those Lenin statues down and recast them as Reagan statues?

    And this was a signal boost of a subversive Western communist, who should be summarily deported to any of the five surviving communist regimes.

    I have a hunch that any Westerner promoting fascism in Russia would be summarily deported.

  403. @songbird
    @silviosilver


    I don’t remember the arid scenery you’re talking about though.
     
    Doubtlessly, the wrong word. Grew up in 44" of precip a year. Ancestors got about 61".

    Can you believe I was talking about the scenes shot in Bidwell Park, where they had the men swinging down from trees? I think the right term here is "Mediterranean climate." They actually get about 27", but it still looks wrong to me. Too sunny. Too dusty - guessing they shot in the dry season, but, maybe, it just looks different all year round? Not the same amount of moss and canopy?

    Anyway, one of my pet peeves with Hollywood is everything always looks like it is in the wrong climate. Like, they'll shoot a show, like Night Rider where the character is supposed to be driving around the country. But you never see him in the woods of Maine, or driving through a snowstorm (guess the car couldn't handle it). It just all looks the same. Or Star Trek, when they are supposed to be going to different planets, and it is all shot within 30 miles of the studio.

    It just looks unmistakably like California to me. Maybe, someone from a different climate or the Med wouldn't find it as objectionable? I think another part of it is I am very sun sensitive, and I feel like I am being sunburned watching it. Maybe, it was an issue with using film, and they needed the light.

    “Lancelot du Lac” (1974).
     
    Haven't seen it. BTW, I didn't even realize that there were older movies focused on the Green Knight. Hopefully, I can track that other one you mentioned down.

    What did you think of the scene where Uther is ambushed and he wades across the brook just before plunging the sword into the stone?
     
    One of the great scenes of the movie. Good location shooting too. I like how Uther's pursuers go straight for the sword, after it is put into the stone, and don't even bother with Uther.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    BTW, I didn’t even realize that there were older movies focused on the Green Knight. Hopefully, I can track that other one you mentioned down.

    https://myflixer.vc/movie/sword-of-the-valiant-rol1m/1-full

    Since I brought it up, a word of warning is in order: don’t expect too much. You wouldn’t call it a comedy, but it employs quite a lot of wry humor and it’s definitely not meant to be taken seriously, so if you’re looking for an artistic production that will satisfy a yen for national mythology, this is most certainly not it.

    I like how Uther’s pursuers go straight for the sword, after it is put into the stone, and don’t even bother with Uther.

    It was also a plot weakness though. He’s ambushed, dragged off his horse, and battered as he lies on the ground, and when his attackers’ attention is diverted to Uther’s guards, he is able to get up and retrieve the sword, which all the while was sitting out in the open, attached to his saddle. If the whole point is to get your hands on Excalibur, it’s hard to believe his attackers would have missed it.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @silviosilver


    it was also a plot weakness though. He’s ambushed, dragged off his horse, and battered as he lies on the ground, and when his attackers’ attention is diverted to Uther’s guards
     
    Been scratching my head about that bit. Trying to explain it, or else figure out a better way to do it.

    For starters, I think a disguise (i.e., him not be recognized until he drew the sword) was out. Wouldn't be kingly enough, or like Uther (separate from that one obvious example, when he was feeling randy and had Merlin's help). So, that leaves us with the scene as it was plotted. But maybe not as it was choreographed or shot?

    I think kern (or lighter soldiers) reaching closer to the sword, but being whooped by people in armor, might have made sense in one way. But I don't think it would have fitted the style of the film, with its focus on heavy plate armor.

    So, I'd say that leaves us with choreographing the heavier soldiers. Definitely feel like the scene didn't feel very organic. Maybe, it is hard to do a lot of takes when people are wearing armor like that?

    But I think the real reason is that Boorman was trying to frame everything leading up to Uther driving the sword in the stone. That he wanted to give Uther his space, and his tragic pathos, and wanted the audience to see the sword out of his hand and lying on his riderless horse. A moment of quiet or stillness, if you will, to offset the motion of the later chase scene.

    Or, maybe, he is just a hack director, and I'm making excuses, but, either way, I guess I can forgive it.
  404. @Sean
    @Greasy William

    The American strategy is for the Russians to become discouraged and quit, and walking them into such an endgame requires a fine balance in what Ukraine is given. Hence the US is finely balencing what is given to Ukraine so Russia will be slowly worn down, and not suffer any sudden disaster. However, some weapons might be more effective than America anticipated, so they are proceeding very cautiously.


    Even when/if the Ukrainian lines can no longer hold, the US would likely respond with threatening direct NATO intervention within the territory of Ukraine itself as a means to get Russia to agree to terms and I believe that Russia will be happy to make a deal.
     
    Maybe Russia would, but America is not looking to find out. Not a chance of the US armed forces being ordered into direct combat with the Russians in Ukraine. Really.

    Russians themselves say that nuclear weapons will only be used to prevent a total strategic defeat, ala Russia being driven out of all of Crimea and all of Donbas. There is no reason whatsoever to think that the Ukrainians are capable of pulling that off.
     
    The worse Ukraine does the more they will be given and America will under no circumstances allow anything that looks like it will turn into a Russian strategic success to be unanswered. There are things America can give Ukraine but has been denying them so far such as Army Tactical Missile System, and if it looks like Ukraine is in danger of collapsing America will supply it. And much else as well.

    In any event, it is already clear from the rate at which equipment is being destroyed that in the medium to long term Ukraine will burn through all its Soviet origin equipment and have to be given lots of American artillery, tanks, and planes. Once those more advanced arms are the mainstay of Ukraine's armed forces they (with the unalloyed boon of US surveillance enabling real time targeting by Ukraine) will probably be more than a match for the Russians. At that point Russia may well be faced with swallowing an unbearable humiliation, or terminating the conflict by using a nuclear weapon on the Ukrainian armed forces. America wants to gradually demoralise Russia so it gives up, but I am not sure their mindset in relation to Ukraine will permit that.

    I know your thesis is that the Ukraine can defeat Russia once it is supplied with sufficient qualities of US wonder weapons
     
    As already mentioned I don't think the US would give Ukraine wonder weapons that would let them trounce Russia in short order. What the US is trying to do is frustrate Russia not put them in a situation they might panic in. Let me put things this way; Russia will not be able to make any headway at all if it lets this war run on. It has to finish it ASAP and get the Dneiper as a barrier behind which to consolidate and incorporate East Ukraine into Russia. Whether the Kremlin will be able to get their steamroller moving fast enough for the conquest of east Ukraine fast enoughremains to be seen.

    Replies: @216, @A123

    The failure to take Kiev in the first week of the war was a cataclysmic 1914 level failure. If Russia is not in firm control of Kiev there is no prospect of a diplomatic solution on favorable terms. Leaving any kind of a Ukrainian rump state which claims all of its 1954 borders will only encourage the West to try again. In the same visage, Kiev has stated that their desired endgame is a color revolution in Moscow, the partition of RF, and denuclearization. Russian success depends on Poland, Hungary and Romania annexing the rump Ukrainian territory which they previously controlled.

    In any event, the post-war states will be faced with a demographic hole, and they could easily repeat the West’s greatest error of importing Replacements.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @216


    The failure to take Kiev in the first week of the war was a cataclysmic 1914 level failure
     
    You can have a big invasion, or a surprise one. Not both.

    Leaving any kind of a Ukrainian rump state which claims all of its 1954 borders will only encourage the West to try again
     
    West Ukraine is unfeasible to incorporate into Russia.

    Russian success depends on Poland, Hungary and Romania annexing the rump Ukrainian territory which they previously controlled.
     
    They would then have a border with Russia.

    In any event, the post-war states will be faced with a demographic hole, and they could easily repeat the West’s greatest error of importing Replacements.
     

    I think Ukraine will not get a lot of refugees back, and will undergo that process. Russia has the inestimable advantage of no one wanting to go there. Germans have created y society very attractive to people from other countries, even Israelis. Success being failure?

    Time is on Putin’s side. The money is running out on Kiev regime aggression. It is unlikely that the EU will step up to fill the gaping chasm created by U.S. cutbacks
     
    “Men desire novelty to such an extent that those who are doing well wish for a change as much as those who are doing badly.” — Machiavelli

    I don't think the US sees the Ukraine war as onerous. Europe does though, but the US calls the shots.

    Replies: @216

  405. @Sean
    @Greasy William

    The American strategy is for the Russians to become discouraged and quit, and walking them into such an endgame requires a fine balance in what Ukraine is given. Hence the US is finely balencing what is given to Ukraine so Russia will be slowly worn down, and not suffer any sudden disaster. However, some weapons might be more effective than America anticipated, so they are proceeding very cautiously.


    Even when/if the Ukrainian lines can no longer hold, the US would likely respond with threatening direct NATO intervention within the territory of Ukraine itself as a means to get Russia to agree to terms and I believe that Russia will be happy to make a deal.
     
    Maybe Russia would, but America is not looking to find out. Not a chance of the US armed forces being ordered into direct combat with the Russians in Ukraine. Really.

    Russians themselves say that nuclear weapons will only be used to prevent a total strategic defeat, ala Russia being driven out of all of Crimea and all of Donbas. There is no reason whatsoever to think that the Ukrainians are capable of pulling that off.
     
    The worse Ukraine does the more they will be given and America will under no circumstances allow anything that looks like it will turn into a Russian strategic success to be unanswered. There are things America can give Ukraine but has been denying them so far such as Army Tactical Missile System, and if it looks like Ukraine is in danger of collapsing America will supply it. And much else as well.

    In any event, it is already clear from the rate at which equipment is being destroyed that in the medium to long term Ukraine will burn through all its Soviet origin equipment and have to be given lots of American artillery, tanks, and planes. Once those more advanced arms are the mainstay of Ukraine's armed forces they (with the unalloyed boon of US surveillance enabling real time targeting by Ukraine) will probably be more than a match for the Russians. At that point Russia may well be faced with swallowing an unbearable humiliation, or terminating the conflict by using a nuclear weapon on the Ukrainian armed forces. America wants to gradually demoralise Russia so it gives up, but I am not sure their mindset in relation to Ukraine will permit that.

    I know your thesis is that the Ukraine can defeat Russia once it is supplied with sufficient qualities of US wonder weapons
     
    As already mentioned I don't think the US would give Ukraine wonder weapons that would let them trounce Russia in short order. What the US is trying to do is frustrate Russia not put them in a situation they might panic in. Let me put things this way; Russia will not be able to make any headway at all if it lets this war run on. It has to finish it ASAP and get the Dneiper as a barrier behind which to consolidate and incorporate East Ukraine into Russia. Whether the Kremlin will be able to get their steamroller moving fast enough for the conquest of east Ukraine fast enoughremains to be seen.

    Replies: @216, @A123

    Not a chance of the US armed forces being ordered into direct combat with the Russians in Ukraine. Really.

    100% correct.

    Deploying regular troops in significant numbers would require a Declaration of War, or at a minimum an Authorization for Use of Military Force [AUMF]. Regardless of the pressure the European Empire places on Not-The-President Biden, there is no chance to obtain an AUMF from Congress.

    The worse Ukraine does the more they will be given and America will under no circumstances allow anything that looks like it will turn into a Russian strategic success to be unanswered.

    Incorrect.

    America and the U.S. House is more than willing to let Russia have strategic success over the European Empire. Humiliating the illicit White House occupant would be a side bonus.

    While it will not be zero, the American money spigot is being wound shut. If the Paris/Brussels/Berlin axis want this war, the EU will have to fund it.

    Russia will not be able to make any headway at all if it lets this war run on. It has to finish it ASAP.

    Sorry. Again Incorrect.

    Time is on Putin’s side. The money is running out on Kiev regime aggression. It is unlikely that the EU will step up to fill the gaping chasm created by U.S. cutbacks.

    With 0% chance of victory, Zelensky will exit “one way or another”. The next Ukrainian administration will be agreement capable and cut a deal with Russia. Guessing timing is hard, but the window for sanity opens in the Fall/Winter timeframe.

    PEACE 😇

  406. @Greasy William
    After what happened in Soledar and what appears to be happening in Siversk, it just seems like Ukraine cannot deal with Russia's artillery advantage. The Ukrainians are trying to fight like a Western army but Western armies rely on air superiority and maneuver to make up for lack of firepower. The Ukrainians have very little airpower and even if they are capable of maneuver, they can't use it in these urban battles.

    I'm very interested to see if Ukraine really does go forward with an offensive in the spring. If such an offensive is lost, it seems likely to be a very costly failure.

    Replies: @Wokechoke, @216

    In this retrofuture WW1 analogue we are living in, which side will introduce the neo-stormtrooper?

    This is the fighting that the cancelled XM25 launcher was made for, along with the cancelled Comanche helicopter.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @216

    You are asking a historical question which could be ridiculous when this is over with.

    Just wait until special forces jump out of Elon Musk's secret tunnels right behind the Russian lines like jack-in-the-boxes. It's going to be beyond the McGregor Ritter imagination to say nothing about the Russian general staff.

    Replies: @216

  407. @216
    @Sean

    The failure to take Kiev in the first week of the war was a cataclysmic 1914 level failure. If Russia is not in firm control of Kiev there is no prospect of a diplomatic solution on favorable terms. Leaving any kind of a Ukrainian rump state which claims all of its 1954 borders will only encourage the West to try again. In the same visage, Kiev has stated that their desired endgame is a color revolution in Moscow, the partition of RF, and denuclearization. Russian success depends on Poland, Hungary and Romania annexing the rump Ukrainian territory which they previously controlled.

    In any event, the post-war states will be faced with a demographic hole, and they could easily repeat the West's greatest error of importing Replacements.

    Replies: @Sean

    The failure to take Kiev in the first week of the war was a cataclysmic 1914 level failure

    You can have a big invasion, or a surprise one. Not both.

    Leaving any kind of a Ukrainian rump state which claims all of its 1954 borders will only encourage the West to try again

    West Ukraine is unfeasible to incorporate into Russia.

    Russian success depends on Poland, Hungary and Romania annexing the rump Ukrainian territory which they previously controlled.

    They would then have a border with Russia.

    In any event, the post-war states will be faced with a demographic hole, and they could easily repeat the West’s greatest error of importing Replacements.

    I think Ukraine will not get a lot of refugees back, and will undergo that process. Russia has the inestimable advantage of no one wanting to go there. Germans have created y society very attractive to people from other countries, even Israelis. Success being failure?

    Time is on Putin’s side. The money is running out on Kiev regime aggression. It is unlikely that the EU will step up to fill the gaping chasm created by U.S. cutbacks

    “Men desire novelty to such an extent that those who are doing well wish for a change as much as those who are doing badly.” — Machiavelli

    I don’t think the US sees the Ukraine war as onerous. Europe does though, but the US calls the shots.

    • Replies: @216
    @Sean

    The Japanese thought they got robbed in 1905 when TR gave them half of Sakhalin, the autocracy in Russia could not survive only walking away with its current territorial gains.

    The Baltic states have existing borders with Russia, and worse, two of them have substantial Russian ethnic minorities which should have been paid to repatriate. Yet this frontier is rather stable, unlike Lukashenko's migrant revenge at Warsaw. So I am not concerned that the loss of a buffer state will somehow scare Poland and Romania more, especially considering the new US bases there.

    A Russian victory will also discredit the hawks in East Europe, and regretfully empower the corruptible center-leftists more amenable to Moscow. More notably, it might help the AFD get into power in Germany.

  408. Most Ukie propaganda has been straight from cringe worthy Pallywood tropes.

    However, this one is actually clever. (1)

    Ukraine Reclassifies U.S. Tanks as “Recreational Vehicles” to Skirt Restrictions

    The Ukraine Defense Ministry even prepared a parody commercial to convince officials to send them.

    What really gets us is how footage of the tank is cut together with all the best truck commercial tropes like horses running in slow motion, a boy scout running with an American flag flowing behind him, and then more horses. The spot ends stating “Because the best things made in America shouldn’t stay in America.”

    No matter what your politics are, you’ve gotta admit this is pretty damn funny, though we should point out that, no, our Ultimate Car Rankings won’t be reclassifying M1 Abrams tanks as “full-size pickup trucks” anytime soon…

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.motortrend.com/news/ukraine-defense-ministry-m1a2-abrams-tank-recreational-utility-vehicle-commercial/

    [MORE]

  409. @216
    @Greasy William

    In this retrofuture WW1 analogue we are living in, which side will introduce the neo-stormtrooper?

    This is the fighting that the cancelled XM25 launcher was made for, along with the cancelled Comanche helicopter.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    You are asking a historical question which could be ridiculous when this is over with.

    Just wait until special forces jump out of Elon Musk’s secret tunnels right behind the Russian lines like jack-in-the-boxes. It’s going to be beyond the McGregor Ritter imagination to say nothing about the Russian general staff.

    • Replies: @216
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    My guess would be some kind of cloaking device, which has been a popular video game trope.

  410. @QCIC
    @sudden death

    Is Russia still supplying any gas or fuel to Ukraine?

    Replies: @sudden death

    Directly supplying no, but they keep transporting through UA pipeline oil into Hungary and pipeline natgas into Moldova, Slovakia and Austria.

    RF has rocketed and blown all working oil refineries last spring in UA though, so petroleum and diesel has to be imported now, IIRC mainly from EU and Azerbaijan.

  411. @Sean
    @216


    The failure to take Kiev in the first week of the war was a cataclysmic 1914 level failure
     
    You can have a big invasion, or a surprise one. Not both.

    Leaving any kind of a Ukrainian rump state which claims all of its 1954 borders will only encourage the West to try again
     
    West Ukraine is unfeasible to incorporate into Russia.

    Russian success depends on Poland, Hungary and Romania annexing the rump Ukrainian territory which they previously controlled.
     
    They would then have a border with Russia.

    In any event, the post-war states will be faced with a demographic hole, and they could easily repeat the West’s greatest error of importing Replacements.
     

    I think Ukraine will not get a lot of refugees back, and will undergo that process. Russia has the inestimable advantage of no one wanting to go there. Germans have created y society very attractive to people from other countries, even Israelis. Success being failure?

    Time is on Putin’s side. The money is running out on Kiev regime aggression. It is unlikely that the EU will step up to fill the gaping chasm created by U.S. cutbacks
     
    “Men desire novelty to such an extent that those who are doing well wish for a change as much as those who are doing badly.” — Machiavelli

    I don't think the US sees the Ukraine war as onerous. Europe does though, but the US calls the shots.

    Replies: @216

    The Japanese thought they got robbed in 1905 when TR gave them half of Sakhalin, the autocracy in Russia could not survive only walking away with its current territorial gains.

    The Baltic states have existing borders with Russia, and worse, two of them have substantial Russian ethnic minorities which should have been paid to repatriate. Yet this frontier is rather stable, unlike Lukashenko’s migrant revenge at Warsaw. So I am not concerned that the loss of a buffer state will somehow scare Poland and Romania more, especially considering the new US bases there.

    A Russian victory will also discredit the hawks in East Europe, and regretfully empower the corruptible center-leftists more amenable to Moscow. More notably, it might help the AFD get into power in Germany.

  412. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @216

    You are asking a historical question which could be ridiculous when this is over with.

    Just wait until special forces jump out of Elon Musk's secret tunnels right behind the Russian lines like jack-in-the-boxes. It's going to be beyond the McGregor Ritter imagination to say nothing about the Russian general staff.

    Replies: @216

    My guess would be some kind of cloaking device, which has been a popular video game trope.

  413. Today, President Andrés Manuel López Obrador, President Joseph R. Biden, and Prime Minister Justin Trudeau met in Mexico City for the 10th North American Leaders’ Summit (NALS). The leaders are determined to fortify our region’s security, prosperity, sustainability and inclusiveness through commitments across six pillars: 1) diversity, equity, and inclusion; 2) climate change and the environment; 3) competitiveness; 4) migration and development; 5) health; and 6) regional security.

    North America shares a unique history and culture that emphasizes innovation, equitable development, and mutually beneficial trade to create inclusive economic opportunities for the benefit of our people. We are not just neighbors and partners. Our people share bonds of family and friendship and value – above all else – freedom, justice, human rights, equality, and democracy. This is the North American DNA.

    [MORE]

    North American Union in our lifetime ?

    Now I understand better why they are pushing EU and RusFed towards mutual destruction. The best way of winning a competition is to kill your future competitors.

    I also understand better the whole anti-White woke shtick. You have to weaken the one ethnic identity that might strongly oppose this Union and it is mostly White Canadians and Americans.

    I am wondering what the flag of the NAU would be.

    Looks like I am not the only one to ask myself this question.

    https://www.quora.com/What-would-the-flag-of-the-hypothetical-North-American-Union-look-like

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @Ivashka the fool

    Did you figure out what all that lunatic alleged hard drive hacking accusations were about?;)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  414. @A123
    @Beckow


    US can’t afford to lose this war – the fallout would be catastrophic.
     
    Huh?

    Despite the massive cash transfer, the U.S. is not really "in the war". Money was crammed into the Omnibus is to preempt House Appropriations. The cash flow will be greatly diminished in any future package. Americans is leaving the war, and there will be little or no "fallout" in the U.S.

    What "fallout" do you envision?

    Yes. Not-The-President Biden's illegitimate regime will suffer additional humiliation. However, that has no impact on America as a whole.
    ___

    There will be consequences in Europe. Holders of Ukrainian identity documents will be permanently allowed to stay in the EU. This includes the vast number of MENA origin migrants with forged papers.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @sudden death

    Americans is leaving the war

    English is not your first language?

    • LOL: A123
  415. @Ivashka the fool

    Today, President Andrés Manuel López Obrador, President Joseph R. Biden, and Prime Minister Justin Trudeau met in Mexico City for the 10th North American Leaders’ Summit (NALS). The leaders are determined to fortify our region’s security, prosperity, sustainability and inclusiveness through commitments across six pillars: 1) diversity, equity, and inclusion; 2) climate change and the environment; 3) competitiveness; 4) migration and development; 5) health; and 6) regional security.

    North America shares a unique history and culture that emphasizes innovation, equitable development, and mutually beneficial trade to create inclusive economic opportunities for the benefit of our people. We are not just neighbors and partners. Our people share bonds of family and friendship and value – above all else – freedom, justice, human rights, equality, and democracy. This is the North American DNA.
     


    North American Union in our lifetime ?

    Now I understand better why they are pushing EU and RusFed towards mutual destruction. The best way of winning a competition is to kill your future competitors.

    I also understand better the whole anti-White woke shtick. You have to weaken the one ethnic identity that might strongly oppose this Union and it is mostly White Canadians and Americans.

    I am wondering what the flag of the NAU would be.

    Looks like I am not the only one to ask myself this question.

    https://www.quora.com/What-would-the-flag-of-the-hypothetical-North-American-Union-look-like

    Replies: @sudden death

    Did you figure out what all that lunatic alleged hard drive hacking accusations were about?;)

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @sudden death

    No. Not at all.

    I have been deeply troubled by Altan's accusations, the main reason being that he was among my favorite members of the UR AK's community. Him accusing me of hacking into his computer and being a complete fraud on top of that were somewhat of a traumatic event. I know that it might look silly, but Altan was someone I would have truly liked to have as a friend in real life, so his charge against me was quite shocking.

    I believe he might have been hacked through opening images containing malware on this forum. But I have never uploaded any image, I just paste the links to the pictures I share from the internet and that I find through Google search. Moreover I am hardly the only one sharing pictures on AKs community threads. Perhaps one of these images was corrupted and contained some malware ?

    Now about him writing that I was a fraud and lying about myself is utterly strange, everything I mentioned about my younger years in RusFed is true, the fact that we left in 1996 as a family with my parents and my younger brother is also true, so I don't understand what he's accusing me off. Of course I don't tell all about me, but why should I ? After all this is not a confessional but a more or less anonymous internet forum.

    He basically implied that I hated on him because he once mocked circumcision, but I don't give a flying f☆ck about people being circumcised or not (why should I care about others' penises ? I am not a homosexual and I don't have some "penis envy").

    Would that imply that he believed that I was some Jewish agent provocateur posing as a (former) Russian ethnic nationalist of somewhat eccentric and eclectic spiritual inclinations?

    I have no idea, but frankly it left me with a very bad aftertaste. If someone as intelligent as Altan could write those things about me, then perhaps my "virtual persona" was easily perceived as a negative one. Perhaps I was writing and posting things that were easily perceived as hurtful by people who read me here. Despite being tough in my younger years, I truly dislike being seen as a bully, being seen as a disrespectful and negative person.

    Hence the rebranding into a "fool's" identity that perhaps wouldn't be taken too seriously by anyone. I am here because there are lots of interesting intelligent people posting sometimes very interesting stuff, I try to contribute according to my quirks and weird idiosyncrasies. I don't want to annoy anyone.



    https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/575c175722482ea13706dd8a/1488820566475-9ZEYQ4JNA5S06CNAOT8Q/image-asset.jpeg

    Be careful with the picture above, haven't checked if it is infested with a malware or not...

    🙂

    Replies: @silviosilver

  416. Americans is leaving the war

    English is not your first language?

    Autocorrect is my nemesis. That should have read:

    America is leaving the war

    PEACE 😇

     

  417. @Sean
    @Vishnugupta

    I know someone who commanded British tanks and they are very, very unreliable with the gears/ transmission especially prone to problems. Replacement parts were hard to come by. I do think they can send a few to Ukraine but I'd bet the army is not going to part with their best ones, so they will break down right quick. HESH is effective against concrete bunkers and building strongpoints, ordinary HE works better against trenches. Tanks in Ukraine are to a great extent operating as assaults gun artillery and when firing from further back getting targeting info from drones.

    In Ukraine the tanks are operating differently than they were designed for. Dashing in (keeping trees occluding the anti tank missiles targeting system) is the latest tactic. And this is against strongpoints. The Russian tanks may be more fragile but they are also more agile cross country, and smaller. There are a lot of them.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    World of Tanks figured out these tactics a number of years ago. Tanks are like Sniper gun platforms.

    They peekaboo around outcrops fire and retreat.

  418. @sudden death
    @Ivashka the fool

    Did you figure out what all that lunatic alleged hard drive hacking accusations were about?;)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    No. Not at all.

    I have been deeply troubled by Altan’s accusations, the main reason being that he was among my favorite members of the UR AK’s community. Him accusing me of hacking into his computer and being a complete fraud on top of that were somewhat of a traumatic event. I know that it might look silly, but Altan was someone I would have truly liked to have as a friend in real life, so his charge against me was quite shocking.

    I believe he might have been hacked through opening images containing malware on this forum. But I have never uploaded any image, I just paste the links to the pictures I share from the internet and that I find through Google search. Moreover I am hardly the only one sharing pictures on AKs community threads. Perhaps one of these images was corrupted and contained some malware ?

    Now about him writing that I was a fraud and lying about myself is utterly strange, everything I mentioned about my younger years in RusFed is true, the fact that we left in 1996 as a family with my parents and my younger brother is also true, so I don’t understand what he’s accusing me off. Of course I don’t tell all about me, but why should I ? After all this is not a confessional but a more or less anonymous internet forum.

    He basically implied that I hated on him because he once mocked circumcision, but I don’t give a flying f☆ck about people being circumcised or not (why should I care about others’ penises ? I am not a homosexual and I don’t have some “penis envy”).

    Would that imply that he believed that I was some Jewish agent provocateur posing as a (former) Russian ethnic nationalist of somewhat eccentric and eclectic spiritual inclinations?

    I have no idea, but frankly it left me with a very bad aftertaste. If someone as intelligent as Altan could write those things about me, then perhaps my “virtual persona” was easily perceived as a negative one. Perhaps I was writing and posting things that were easily perceived as hurtful by people who read me here. Despite being tough in my younger years, I truly dislike being seen as a bully, being seen as a disrespectful and negative person.

    Hence the rebranding into a “fool’s” identity that perhaps wouldn’t be taken too seriously by anyone. I am here because there are lots of interesting intelligent people posting sometimes very interesting stuff, I try to contribute according to my quirks and weird idiosyncrasies. I don’t want to annoy anyone.

    [MORE]

    Be careful with the picture above, haven’t checked if it is infested with a malware or not…

    🙂

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    Let’s keep the discussion going on the new thread ?
     
    Okey-dokey.

    (It took a "fool" to suggest the obvious, hehe.)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  419. @Ivashka the fool
    @sudden death

    No. Not at all.

    I have been deeply troubled by Altan's accusations, the main reason being that he was among my favorite members of the UR AK's community. Him accusing me of hacking into his computer and being a complete fraud on top of that were somewhat of a traumatic event. I know that it might look silly, but Altan was someone I would have truly liked to have as a friend in real life, so his charge against me was quite shocking.

    I believe he might have been hacked through opening images containing malware on this forum. But I have never uploaded any image, I just paste the links to the pictures I share from the internet and that I find through Google search. Moreover I am hardly the only one sharing pictures on AKs community threads. Perhaps one of these images was corrupted and contained some malware ?

    Now about him writing that I was a fraud and lying about myself is utterly strange, everything I mentioned about my younger years in RusFed is true, the fact that we left in 1996 as a family with my parents and my younger brother is also true, so I don't understand what he's accusing me off. Of course I don't tell all about me, but why should I ? After all this is not a confessional but a more or less anonymous internet forum.

    He basically implied that I hated on him because he once mocked circumcision, but I don't give a flying f☆ck about people being circumcised or not (why should I care about others' penises ? I am not a homosexual and I don't have some "penis envy").

    Would that imply that he believed that I was some Jewish agent provocateur posing as a (former) Russian ethnic nationalist of somewhat eccentric and eclectic spiritual inclinations?

    I have no idea, but frankly it left me with a very bad aftertaste. If someone as intelligent as Altan could write those things about me, then perhaps my "virtual persona" was easily perceived as a negative one. Perhaps I was writing and posting things that were easily perceived as hurtful by people who read me here. Despite being tough in my younger years, I truly dislike being seen as a bully, being seen as a disrespectful and negative person.

    Hence the rebranding into a "fool's" identity that perhaps wouldn't be taken too seriously by anyone. I am here because there are lots of interesting intelligent people posting sometimes very interesting stuff, I try to contribute according to my quirks and weird idiosyncrasies. I don't want to annoy anyone.



    https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/575c175722482ea13706dd8a/1488820566475-9ZEYQ4JNA5S06CNAOT8Q/image-asset.jpeg

    Be careful with the picture above, haven't checked if it is infested with a malware or not...

    🙂

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Let’s keep the discussion going on the new thread ?

    Okey-dokey.

    (It took a “fool” to suggest the obvious, hehe.)

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    My main idea, streaming from APs debate with Dmitry and Aaron, was that the inequality is mainly a result of different peoples potential. Different people have different abilities and therefore their achievements would vary. That would obviously lead to very different social outcomes.

    Now, the question of why people have different abilities, physical or psychological, is a complex one. Still, I think we might all agree that it is a combination of both nature and nurture, and that both of these are casually determined. If we project the causative links back in time, we end up with reaching the level of biological evolution with all that it entails of survival of the fittest, of interspecies and intraspecies competition.

    Let's posit that a Creator is responsible for the existence of this Universe as both the first causative agent and its ground of being. It entails that inequality and competition are part and parcel of his Divine Plan. However, a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn't strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies. A world where the weak are prayed upon by the strong, all tooth and claw, and irredeemably too "tough love" to say the least.

    Why do we believe that God "loves us all" and why do we also believe in equality are the related questions that derive from the thoughts described above.

    Perhaps it would be a more "intellectually fulfilling" type of mental speculation (or mental masturbation if someone is cynical about it) to discuss the reasons that God would have had in his Divine Mind when deciding to create a world where no sentient being was identical and/or equal to any other.

    Replies: @AP, @AaronB, @silviosilver

  420. The best 9 minutes you can spend. It explains the fallacy of “wokeness” in an engaging manner.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    Konstantin Kisin, an immigrant to the UK and author of An Immigrant’s Love Letter to the West, has burst on the scene with a terrific performance at the Oxford Union last week, debating the motion “The House Believes Woke Culture Has Gone Too Far.”

    • Replies: @AP
    @A123

    He's very pro-Ukrainian, you sure you want to cite him?

    Replies: @A123

    , @Wokechoke
    @A123

    Woke Culture has only just started in the UK.

    Replies: @songbird

    , @Ray Caruso
    @A123

    You laugh at scripture because your religion is not Christianity but the kikesucker sect of liberalism. Everyone can see through you.

  421. @Ivashka the fool
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Do southern Chinese also have their own brand of regionalism / chauvinism ?

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Yes. Northern China have been ruled by Tatars for six out of the last ten centuries. Their language, Mandarin, is the least faithful to Classical Chinese of all dialects.

    And on the grounds of academic achievement, south (top) vs. north (bottom) in Northern Song jinshi Imperial Exam qualifiers.

    Mongols and Manchus did even poorer on the exams and needed quotas to be represented.

    But really, both north and south have equal dysfunctions. For all of the southern scholar-official’s academic prestige it amounted largely to empty cramming of Confucian classics, the only mathematician of note in late Imperial was a Mongol aristocrat,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minggatu

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Thanks for explaining all this. I always wonder how do Chinese manage to keep a united single country despite all these strong regional identity differences. Do you think that China might possibly break at the seams again one day if CCP doesn't deliver the sustained economic growth that the Chinese have come to be accustomed to ?

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    , @sudden death
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Bit offtopic and might not be area of your knowledge, but is there any original Mongol/Tatar written sources/fragments (maybe equivalents of scriptures/heroic sagas/annals) surviving regarding their own conquests/wars/raids into what now is considered geographical Europe - broadly all west of Ural mountains?

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  422. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Ivashka the fool

    Yes. Northern China have been ruled by Tatars for six out of the last ten centuries. Their language, Mandarin, is the least faithful to Classical Chinese of all dialects.

    And on the grounds of academic achievement, south (top) vs. north (bottom) in Northern Song jinshi Imperial Exam qualifiers.
    https://i.postimg.cc/HkHMTwny/123.png

    Mongols and Manchus did even poorer on the exams and needed quotas to be represented.

    But really, both north and south have equal dysfunctions. For all of the southern scholar-official's academic prestige it amounted largely to empty cramming of Confucian classics, the only mathematician of note in late Imperial was a Mongol aristocrat,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minggatu

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @sudden death

    Thanks for explaining all this. I always wonder how do Chinese manage to keep a united single country despite all these strong regional identity differences. Do you think that China might possibly break at the seams again one day if CCP doesn’t deliver the sustained economic growth that the Chinese have come to be accustomed to ?

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Ivashka the fool

    Not very easily, but--

    1. Its not simple north-south dichotomy, for example the Taipings were Cantonese, Hakka and Zhuang. The Qing was a coalition of Manchu-Mongol aristocrats, Han scholar-officials, and southern (Hunan, Anhui) regional militia commanders.

    The CCP-KMT civil war didn't really have an ethnic element.

    2. "Han" is by definition a secular identity. A Han who converts to Islam becomes a Hui (回 "return"). The Chinese character for meat 肉 ròu is the same as for pork.

    So there's no argument over theology, doctrines and schisms, etc.

    3. Unified written system. Writing the dialects is highly discouraged, so there's no alphabet differences.

    A disunified China is not necessarily a negative, the plurality of thought of the Spring and Autumn era has never been matched for two thousand years since Qin Unification,

    https://i.postimg.cc/D0MJ8Zbq/Birth-Places-of-Chinese-Philosophers.png
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundred_Schools_of_Thought

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  423. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Ivashka the fool

    Yes. Northern China have been ruled by Tatars for six out of the last ten centuries. Their language, Mandarin, is the least faithful to Classical Chinese of all dialects.

    And on the grounds of academic achievement, south (top) vs. north (bottom) in Northern Song jinshi Imperial Exam qualifiers.
    https://i.postimg.cc/HkHMTwny/123.png

    Mongols and Manchus did even poorer on the exams and needed quotas to be represented.

    But really, both north and south have equal dysfunctions. For all of the southern scholar-official's academic prestige it amounted largely to empty cramming of Confucian classics, the only mathematician of note in late Imperial was a Mongol aristocrat,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minggatu

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @sudden death

    Bit offtopic and might not be area of your knowledge, but is there any original Mongol/Tatar written sources/fragments (maybe equivalents of scriptures/heroic sagas/annals) surviving regarding their own conquests/wars/raids into what now is considered geographical Europe – broadly all west of Ural mountains?

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @sudden death

    Do you know this?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Secret_History_of_the_Mongols

    There's also a Russian drama series of their version of the Yuan Dynasty,

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smKlnlFFKnM

    Replies: @Wokechoke

  424. @sudden death
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Bit offtopic and might not be area of your knowledge, but is there any original Mongol/Tatar written sources/fragments (maybe equivalents of scriptures/heroic sagas/annals) surviving regarding their own conquests/wars/raids into what now is considered geographical Europe - broadly all west of Ural mountains?

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Do you know this?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Secret_History_of_the_Mongols

    There’s also a Russian drama series of their version of the Yuan Dynasty,

    [MORE]

    • Thanks: sudden death
    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    I was carefully binging on Russian and Ukie film and TV in 2001. I noticed that what we consume in the Anglosphere with Lord of the Rings and Game of Thrones as fantasy is merely Russian history. Even Conan the Barbarian is simply something that happened on the Volga where races clashed.

    I enjoyed Viking which is about Vladimir The Great, Grand Prince of the Rus. It’s basically a progression from Scandinavian exile to Polotsk then Kiev, killing his half brother Jaropok there fighting the horsey pechenegs then Crimea to chat with the Romans. The history was a little garbled but the story about Perun and human sacrifice was compelling. Vladimir turned the people to Christianity on a sort of Vikings Progress into warm civilised waters. Flawed but good mythopoetic history.

    There’s very little of this sort of film like Alfred or Harold let alone Edward Longshanks or Edward III.

  425. @silviosilver
    @songbird


    BTW, I didn’t even realize that there were older movies focused on the Green Knight. Hopefully, I can track that other one you mentioned down.
     
    https://myflixer.vc/movie/sword-of-the-valiant-rol1m/1-full

    Since I brought it up, a word of warning is in order: don't expect too much. You wouldn't call it a comedy, but it employs quite a lot of wry humor and it's definitely not meant to be taken seriously, so if you're looking for an artistic production that will satisfy a yen for national mythology, this is most certainly not it.


    I like how Uther’s pursuers go straight for the sword, after it is put into the stone, and don’t even bother with Uther.
     
    It was also a plot weakness though. He's ambushed, dragged off his horse, and battered as he lies on the ground, and when his attackers' attention is diverted to Uther's guards, he is able to get up and retrieve the sword, which all the while was sitting out in the open, attached to his saddle. If the whole point is to get your hands on Excalibur, it's hard to believe his attackers would have missed it.

    Replies: @songbird

    it was also a plot weakness though. He’s ambushed, dragged off his horse, and battered as he lies on the ground, and when his attackers’ attention is diverted to Uther’s guards

    Been scratching my head about that bit. Trying to explain it, or else figure out a better way to do it.

    [MORE]

    For starters, I think a disguise (i.e., him not be recognized until he drew the sword) was out. Wouldn’t be kingly enough, or like Uther (separate from that one obvious example, when he was feeling randy and had Merlin’s help). So, that leaves us with the scene as it was plotted. But maybe not as it was choreographed or shot?

    I think kern (or lighter soldiers) reaching closer to the sword, but being whooped by people in armor, might have made sense in one way. But I don’t think it would have fitted the style of the film, with its focus on heavy plate armor.

    So, I’d say that leaves us with choreographing the heavier soldiers. Definitely feel like the scene didn’t feel very organic. Maybe, it is hard to do a lot of takes when people are wearing armor like that?

    But I think the real reason is that Boorman was trying to frame everything leading up to Uther driving the sword in the stone. That he wanted to give Uther his space, and his tragic pathos, and wanted the audience to see the sword out of his hand and lying on his riderless horse. A moment of quiet or stillness, if you will, to offset the motion of the later chase scene.

    Or, maybe, he is just a hack director, and I’m making excuses, but, either way, I guess I can forgive it.

  426. @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    Let’s keep the discussion going on the new thread ?
     
    Okey-dokey.

    (It took a "fool" to suggest the obvious, hehe.)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    My main idea, streaming from APs debate with Dmitry and Aaron, was that the inequality is mainly a result of different peoples potential. Different people have different abilities and therefore their achievements would vary. That would obviously lead to very different social outcomes.

    Now, the question of why people have different abilities, physical or psychological, is a complex one. Still, I think we might all agree that it is a combination of both nature and nurture, and that both of these are casually determined. If we project the causative links back in time, we end up with reaching the level of biological evolution with all that it entails of survival of the fittest, of interspecies and intraspecies competition.

    Let’s posit that a Creator is responsible for the existence of this Universe as both the first causative agent and its ground of being. It entails that inequality and competition are part and parcel of his Divine Plan. However, a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn’t strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies. A world where the weak are prayed upon by the strong, all tooth and claw, and irredeemably too “tough love” to say the least.

    Why do we believe that God “loves us all” and why do we also believe in equality are the related questions that derive from the thoughts described above.

    Perhaps it would be a more “intellectually fulfilling” type of mental speculation (or mental masturbation if someone is cynical about it) to discuss the reasons that God would have had in his Divine Mind when deciding to create a world where no sentient being was identical and/or equal to any other.

    • Replies: @AP
    @Ivashka the fool


    Let’s posit that a Creator is responsible for the existence of this Universe as both the first causative agent and its ground of being. It entails that inequality and competition are part and parcel of his Divine Plan.
     
    Inequality yes. Competition, not necessarily.

    However, a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn’t strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies
     
    We are made unequal, and therefore inequality itself cannot be seen as necessarily bad, assuming as Christians do that God is loving. It is what one does with inequality that matters. Taking advantage of inequality to enslave and exploit others was considered virtuous in the pagan world, but according to Christian values such behavior is shameful. Instead, inequality obligates the strong and smart to take care of the weak and dumb and to play a leading role in improving this world. It is a wonderful gift to be able to do so.
    , @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, according to Christian theology this wasn't God's plan at all, to create a world of strife, competition, and inequality.

    It was indeed we who introduced that element, and God will help us eventually get out of our self created predicament, and realize his true intention for the world. (This may be read literally or as deep allegory)

    And perhaps the "proof" of this is the striking - even astonishing if the "standard" story you just adumbrated is true - fact that we are quite simply not happy and fulfilled when we engage in strife and competition and inequality, and we are only truly happy when we cultivate love, compassion, and egolessness.

    Having known so many powerful and wealthy men over extended periods of time from close up - the rage that frequently is thinly disguised just beneath the surface, the intense anxiety, the bouts of depression. This is only invisible from a distance - up close, you see it. And how many famous men have left accounts of their struggle with depression and nihilism and anxiety - and how many more did not discuss it. One of the striking features of the biographies of many famous men who dedicated their life to selfish ego ends is their confession of the sense of meaninglessness - the nihilism - they often felt (although perhaps depression is an acute form of nihilism). Should this not be taken as part of the total scientific picture - as a simple brute fact - about what the true structure of reality is? We don't integrate all the "facts" into our theories.

    One can even analyze it "structurally" - the psychological "structure" of wealth and power seeking (although Silvio doesn't like it when I do this) . What could motivate that but an insatiable craving for security? And what state of mind does that imply?

    Now look at the "standard" theory that you adumbrated. In that theory, we should be happiest and most fulfilled when pursuing selfish ego ends, securing survival, etc . But we're not.

    Look even at your self, with your talk of "genetic lineages", and the need to secure their survival (in this world of illusion moreover) - there is an unmistakable whiff of anxiety and depression and despair in your writings that comes from pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.

    The "Christian" theology actually ends up being more coherent and a better fit for the facts than the hard nosed "scientific" theology which seems to not be able to tell us how to live well.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Anon, @LatW

    , @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool

    I wonder if there are any folks around here in the know who could inform us of any strange astrological phenomena taking place at this time, because perhaps that could explain why I've been doing an awful lot of agreeing with AP recently. Whatever the underlying cause, I have to agree with his reply to this question too. Although I also feel his reply was perhaps a little hasty, as though this were a skeet shoot and we need to get this settled now.


    a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn’t strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies
     
    If I were to take my own shotgun out and pop off a few shells, I might enlarge your observation and say that virtually nothing about human existence appears consistent with an omnibenevolent God, and argue we can only salvage the notion by positing that, against the background of eternal rewards, any suffering in the here and now approaches zero. Going further, we might wonder why a perfect being would even bother creating a universe, let alone humans, since that creation appears to imply that he needed something he didn't have, which is difficult to square with the notion of complete perfection; and even greater difficulty is posed by his being upset by his creation, which would be like complaining about a lunch that you yourself have packed.

    But that seems like an answer a theological killjoy would give, and I don't want this to be a skeet shoot, so we may either stipulate that creation can be squared with perfection or, more tantalizingly, that God already knew everything but chose to create the universe in order not to know everything, to introduce freely willing subjects and see what would happen, and he's as interested in or as curious about the final outcome as we are.

    So why create unequal beings then? I think you're right to imply he had some choice in it. It doesn't automatically follow from the desire to create beings that they ought to be differentiated. He very well might have chosen to make us perfectly identical. But would that mean we wouldn't compete? Can't identical twins enjoy a game of chess? Perhaps we would compete, but explain away any differences in outcomes as the vagaries of chance.

    I used the example of a chess match, but that may not be best example of competition. No one really feels hard done by losing a chess match. The post-match antics of a triumphalist victor might humiliate us, but that is not a direct consequence of playing chess, in which the rules are fixed, known by all, and opportunities to cheat virtually non-existent. What about games in which the "rules" are vague and opportunities to cheat plentiful, including the biggest game, the game of life? There is a classic essay in business ethics by Albert Carr "Is Business Bluffing Ethical?", a question he answers in the affirmative, likening business competition to a poker match in which we expect our opponents are going to bluff us, and so we don't feel hurt when they do.

    Is life itself like one giant poker match? If we were all identical, we would presumably all give the same answer, whatever answer that was. Such a world, however, would be rather less interesting than our own world, in which we're forever negotiating with each other what the rules ought to be, and policing each other to ensure compliance with them. Maybe that is why God made us all different, so that we'd all have our different viewpoints and react differently to the moral guidelines he has set (or at least hinted at), and so that he could then "choose" those among us who freely and sufficiently aligned ourselves with his guidelines to bring nearer to him in the world to come.

    Replies: @AaronB, @Coconuts

  427. Has anyone seen The Three-Body Problem?

  428. @Beckow
    @AP


    ...Life expectancy is dragged down somewhat because the highly segregated Black people keep shooting one another
     
    That is statistically irrelevant, do the numbers, the impact is in small fractions of a year. It is amusing that you constantly harp on V4 when convenient and avoid like a plague comparing US with Western Europe. But that is what most people would think about: US compared to Italy-Germany and not Albania. If you boast that "we are better than Bulgaria!!!" you have already lost.

    V4 countries have an issue with smoking-alcohol and people over certain age are not treated properly by the medical system (75-80) - but they are fitter, skinnier, live healthier lives than Americans. (The ladies are way better looking, it is not even close.) Italy has 4 years longer life expectancy than US - how do you explain that? It is not the jungle shooting - it is that Americans overeat and eat garbage, no amount of medical care can fix it. The swollen-face look that most Americans now have shows what they are putting in their bodies.

    Differences exist everywhere, but to do a proper comparison you can't exclude what doesn't suit you: Lousiana blacks, big cities, LA cholo reservation, meth-infested Albaquerque, homeless tattoed white kids in Seattle...all of that is America. You need to own up to it. It has been spreading: oasis never spreads, the desert does. We know where this is going.

    Scandies croak a lot, they are weak, insecure people living comfortable lives. The fact that Euro-Americans now croak at higher rates is significant - something is rotten.

    US can't afford to lose this war - the fallout would be catastrophic. So they are pushing for escalation, stalling, hoping for a miracle - if Russia keeps its cool they will win. What then? You have not put enough thought into it, you still don't understand how self-defeating the decision to put Nato in Ukraine and then escalate was. This was done by very stupid (in a historical sense) people in Washington-London...they screwed up badly and they know it. Washington would give a lot to go back to 2013 or 2005, they would take that deal immediately. Russia no longer - that tells us all we need to know about who is winning...

    Replies: @A123, @AP

    “…Life expectancy is dragged down somewhat because the highly segregated Black people keep shooting one another”

    That is statistically irrelevant, do the numbers, the impact is in small fractions of a year.

    It’s about half a year (77.8) for Euro Americans, above the American national average (77.3). To compare – Croatia is 77.7, Slovakia 76.9, Latvia 75.4, Bulgaria 73.6.

    If you boast that “we are better than Bulgaria!!!” you have already lost.

    Euro Americans are also better than Slovaks.

    V4 countries have an issue with smoking-alcohol

    Smoking and excessive alcohol are disgusting habits. So is the American vice of overeating, of course.

    but they are fitter, skinnier, live healthier lives than Americans.

    American obesity varies by origins also. Euro American obesity rate is closer to European:

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/207436/overweight-and-obesity-rates-for-adults-by-ethnicity/

    It’s 31.5%, versus 27.8% for Brits.

    And it varies by region. America is much larger than Europe, you know.

    https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/obesity-rate-by-state

    The people of Colorado are thinner than those of Czechia and Hungary. The people of New England/New York/New Jersey are thinner than those of the UK (and that is without even taking race into account). Also Florida and California.

    Differences exist everywhere, but to do a proper comparison you can’t exclude what doesn’t suit you: Lousiana blacks, big cities, LA cholo reservation, meth-infested Albaquerque, homeless tattoed white kids in Seattle…all of that is America.

    America is a huge country. I would have to drive a few hours to get to a region that is bad in the way you describe (small isolated segregated neighborhoods don’t count).

    US can’t afford to lose this war

    US is spending only 6% of its defense budget on this war. In exchange it is wiping out Russia’s military, testing its weapons in the field, and helping its own defense industry. If Russia wins it will be in possession of ruins, with a wrecked economy and military. If Russia loses we will see a rebirth of a sort of PLC and change in Europe that will benefit the USA. Either way, the American position improves.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AP


    If Russia wins it will be in possession of ruins, with a wrecked economy and military.
     
    Not at all. It will have a winning military that would have just won the biggest war since WW2 (that Russia also won), own the most arable, fertile lands in proximity to Europe, huge resources in a thinly populated land, control of Azov and probably Black See...in other words more of what they already have.

    A defeat in Ukraine would have massive consequences for US: the loss of face after the fanatical support for Kiev, fear among allies, but above all the end of any dreams of world dominance and control.

    Loss in Ukraine would change the way US is perceived - given how much rides on the perceptions for US: the value of dollar, ongoing obedience, living standards, culture - Washington needs a continuing perception that US is "Number one in everything!!!", unbeatable, unchallenged. The loss would continue the unravelling of US global domination. It is definitely not a good thing, that's why the hysteria among neo-cons.

    If you can get yourself to celebrate that Euro-Americans have a 0.1 longer lives than Slovaks, you must be a pretty sad character. With all the wealth, the best medical care, blabla... 0.1 of a year? Are you serious?

    Replies: @AP

  429. @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    My main idea, streaming from APs debate with Dmitry and Aaron, was that the inequality is mainly a result of different peoples potential. Different people have different abilities and therefore their achievements would vary. That would obviously lead to very different social outcomes.

    Now, the question of why people have different abilities, physical or psychological, is a complex one. Still, I think we might all agree that it is a combination of both nature and nurture, and that both of these are casually determined. If we project the causative links back in time, we end up with reaching the level of biological evolution with all that it entails of survival of the fittest, of interspecies and intraspecies competition.

    Let's posit that a Creator is responsible for the existence of this Universe as both the first causative agent and its ground of being. It entails that inequality and competition are part and parcel of his Divine Plan. However, a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn't strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies. A world where the weak are prayed upon by the strong, all tooth and claw, and irredeemably too "tough love" to say the least.

    Why do we believe that God "loves us all" and why do we also believe in equality are the related questions that derive from the thoughts described above.

    Perhaps it would be a more "intellectually fulfilling" type of mental speculation (or mental masturbation if someone is cynical about it) to discuss the reasons that God would have had in his Divine Mind when deciding to create a world where no sentient being was identical and/or equal to any other.

    Replies: @AP, @AaronB, @silviosilver

    Let’s posit that a Creator is responsible for the existence of this Universe as both the first causative agent and its ground of being. It entails that inequality and competition are part and parcel of his Divine Plan.

    Inequality yes. Competition, not necessarily.

    However, a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn’t strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies

    We are made unequal, and therefore inequality itself cannot be seen as necessarily bad, assuming as Christians do that God is loving. It is what one does with inequality that matters. Taking advantage of inequality to enslave and exploit others was considered virtuous in the pagan world, but according to Christian values such behavior is shameful. Instead, inequality obligates the strong and smart to take care of the weak and dumb and to play a leading role in improving this world. It is a wonderful gift to be able to do so.

  430. @A123
    The best 9 minutes you can spend. It explains the fallacy of "wokeness" in an engaging manner.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    Konstantin Kisin, an immigrant to the UK and author of An Immigrant’s Love Letter to the West, has burst on the scene with a terrific performance at the Oxford Union last week, debating the motion “The House Believes Woke Culture Has Gone Too Far.”


    https://youtu.be/zJdqJu-6ZPo

    Replies: @AP, @Wokechoke, @Ray Caruso

    He’s very pro-Ukrainian, you sure you want to cite him?

    • Replies: @A123
    @AP


    He’s very pro-Ukrainian, you sure you want to cite him?
     
    Senseless "Woke Kiev" regime aggression is headed towards being a footnote in history texts. While expensive, it is not very relevant to the lives of ordinary Americans. The whole thing will be largely forgotten in a few years.

    The need to fight Woke authoritarianism will be with America for decades. An eloquent speaker against the madness is an asset. Hopefully, Kisin will remain active in this field after the non-issue of Ukraine returns to the obscurity from whence it came.

     

    @Wokechoke

    Woke Culture has only just started in the UK.
     
    "Started" is probably not the best term.

    Certainly, the Tories have dropped the ball. Woke Labour is coming back to select the next PM. Things are headed the wrong way.

    Populism needs a voice in the UK. The upcoming wipe out of the Conservatives will lead the party to reform. Or, it may permanently collapse, opening the way for a serious replacement.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  431. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    My main idea, streaming from APs debate with Dmitry and Aaron, was that the inequality is mainly a result of different peoples potential. Different people have different abilities and therefore their achievements would vary. That would obviously lead to very different social outcomes.

    Now, the question of why people have different abilities, physical or psychological, is a complex one. Still, I think we might all agree that it is a combination of both nature and nurture, and that both of these are casually determined. If we project the causative links back in time, we end up with reaching the level of biological evolution with all that it entails of survival of the fittest, of interspecies and intraspecies competition.

    Let's posit that a Creator is responsible for the existence of this Universe as both the first causative agent and its ground of being. It entails that inequality and competition are part and parcel of his Divine Plan. However, a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn't strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies. A world where the weak are prayed upon by the strong, all tooth and claw, and irredeemably too "tough love" to say the least.

    Why do we believe that God "loves us all" and why do we also believe in equality are the related questions that derive from the thoughts described above.

    Perhaps it would be a more "intellectually fulfilling" type of mental speculation (or mental masturbation if someone is cynical about it) to discuss the reasons that God would have had in his Divine Mind when deciding to create a world where no sentient being was identical and/or equal to any other.

    Replies: @AP, @AaronB, @silviosilver

    Well, according to Christian theology this wasn’t God’s plan at all, to create a world of strife, competition, and inequality.

    It was indeed we who introduced that element, and God will help us eventually get out of our self created predicament, and realize his true intention for the world. (This may be read literally or as deep allegory)

    And perhaps the “proof” of this is the striking – even astonishing if the “standard” story you just adumbrated is true – fact that we are quite simply not happy and fulfilled when we engage in strife and competition and inequality, and we are only truly happy when we cultivate love, compassion, and egolessness.

    Having known so many powerful and wealthy men over extended periods of time from close up – the rage that frequently is thinly disguised just beneath the surface, the intense anxiety, the bouts of depression. This is only invisible from a distance – up close, you see it. And how many famous men have left accounts of their struggle with depression and nihilism and anxiety – and how many more did not discuss it. One of the striking features of the biographies of many famous men who dedicated their life to selfish ego ends is their confession of the sense of meaninglessness – the nihilism – they often felt (although perhaps depression is an acute form of nihilism). Should this not be taken as part of the total scientific picture – as a simple brute fact – about what the true structure of reality is? We don’t integrate all the “facts” into our theories.

    One can even analyze it “structurally” – the psychological “structure” of wealth and power seeking (although Silvio doesn’t like it when I do this) . What could motivate that but an insatiable craving for security? And what state of mind does that imply?

    Now look at the “standard” theory that you adumbrated. In that theory, we should be happiest and most fulfilled when pursuing selfish ego ends, securing survival, etc . But we’re not.

    Look even at your self, with your talk of “genetic lineages”, and the need to secure their survival (in this world of illusion moreover) – there is an unmistakable whiff of anxiety and depression and despair in your writings that comes from pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.

    The “Christian” theology actually ends up being more coherent and a better fit for the facts than the hard nosed “scientific” theology which seems to not be able to tell us how to live well.

    • Agree: Philip Owen
    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @AaronB


    Look even at your self, with your talk of “genetic lineages”, and the need to secure their survival (in this world of illusion moreover) – there is an unmistakable whiff of anxiety and depression and despair in your writings that comes from pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.
     
    Ethnic nationalists usually care about the demographics of the lineages they belong to. This is a normal attitude for them to have and has nothing to do with despair or depression as long as the population they care about does well. Of course it is somewhat disenhartening to see what is going on in Eastern Slav countries nowadays. That is if someone cares about the well-being of the Eastern Slavs. OTOH, there were historically periods when the situation in historical Rus lands was much more threatening. Perhaps the things would ease up in the future.

    Now, about the anxiety. Of course, life in an unpredictable, impermanent and imperfect Universe might bring about a feeling of stress. We both know how it is addressed in the Buddhadharma. I try to cope with dukha using the Dharma's principles. I have the feeling that it works to some extent, although it is not perfect at all and I could do better. Of course this is only due to my laziness and lack of consistency in practice.

    But to come back to the discussion you have had with AP. You are as usual very full of yourself. As a Russian saying goes, some character traits cannot be healed, but you might be less categorical in your affirmations. Some of them are beyond the pale and undermine your arguments. The one about Bach's music and cathedrals being a product of rebellious art is typical of your flippancy. One has to know when one needs to stop when not trolling.

    Anyway, I know that debating you is futile because "the Jew in you is strong", I prefer reading your debates with AP who has the character needed to undergo these protracted and ultimately self-oriented discussions.

    Replies: @AaronB

    , @Anon
    @AaronB


    And perhaps the “proof” of this is the striking – even astonishing if the “standard” story you just adumbrated is true – fact that we are quite simply not happy and fulfilled when we engage in strife and competition and inequality, and we are only truly happy when we cultivate love, compassion, and egolessness.
     
    Sportsmen are truly miserable I tell you, none of them get any joy in competition.
    , @LatW
    @AaronB


    with your talk of “genetic lineages”, and the need to secure their survival [..] pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.
     
    The desire to preserve the "genetic lineages" resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego. You cannot blame a flower for wanting to receive water and sunlight and to grow.

    Replies: @AaronB, @Talha, @Yahya, @S

  432. @A123
    The best 9 minutes you can spend. It explains the fallacy of "wokeness" in an engaging manner.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    Konstantin Kisin, an immigrant to the UK and author of An Immigrant’s Love Letter to the West, has burst on the scene with a terrific performance at the Oxford Union last week, debating the motion “The House Believes Woke Culture Has Gone Too Far.”


    https://youtu.be/zJdqJu-6ZPo

    Replies: @AP, @Wokechoke, @Ray Caruso

    Woke Culture has only just started in the UK.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Wokechoke

    Guys like Kisin are the reason why the UK is in the shape it is in.

  433. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @sudden death

    Do you know this?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Secret_History_of_the_Mongols

    There's also a Russian drama series of their version of the Yuan Dynasty,

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smKlnlFFKnM

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    I was carefully binging on Russian and Ukie film and TV in 2001. I noticed that what we consume in the Anglosphere with Lord of the Rings and Game of Thrones as fantasy is merely Russian history. Even Conan the Barbarian is simply something that happened on the Volga where races clashed.

    I enjoyed Viking which is about Vladimir The Great, Grand Prince of the Rus. It’s basically a progression from Scandinavian exile to Polotsk then Kiev, killing his half brother Jaropok there fighting the horsey pechenegs then Crimea to chat with the Romans. The history was a little garbled but the story about Perun and human sacrifice was compelling. Vladimir turned the people to Christianity on a sort of Vikings Progress into warm civilised waters. Flawed but good mythopoetic history.

    There’s very little of this sort of film like Alfred or Harold let alone Edward Longshanks or Edward III.

  434. @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    My main idea, streaming from APs debate with Dmitry and Aaron, was that the inequality is mainly a result of different peoples potential. Different people have different abilities and therefore their achievements would vary. That would obviously lead to very different social outcomes.

    Now, the question of why people have different abilities, physical or psychological, is a complex one. Still, I think we might all agree that it is a combination of both nature and nurture, and that both of these are casually determined. If we project the causative links back in time, we end up with reaching the level of biological evolution with all that it entails of survival of the fittest, of interspecies and intraspecies competition.

    Let's posit that a Creator is responsible for the existence of this Universe as both the first causative agent and its ground of being. It entails that inequality and competition are part and parcel of his Divine Plan. However, a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn't strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies. A world where the weak are prayed upon by the strong, all tooth and claw, and irredeemably too "tough love" to say the least.

    Why do we believe that God "loves us all" and why do we also believe in equality are the related questions that derive from the thoughts described above.

    Perhaps it would be a more "intellectually fulfilling" type of mental speculation (or mental masturbation if someone is cynical about it) to discuss the reasons that God would have had in his Divine Mind when deciding to create a world where no sentient being was identical and/or equal to any other.

    Replies: @AP, @AaronB, @silviosilver

    I wonder if there are any folks around here in the know who could inform us of any strange astrological phenomena taking place at this time, because perhaps that could explain why I’ve been doing an awful lot of agreeing with AP recently. Whatever the underlying cause, I have to agree with his reply to this question too. Although I also feel his reply was perhaps a little hasty, as though this were a skeet shoot and we need to get this settled now.

    a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn’t strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies

    If I were to take my own shotgun out and pop off a few shells, I might enlarge your observation and say that virtually nothing about human existence appears consistent with an omnibenevolent God, and argue we can only salvage the notion by positing that, against the background of eternal rewards, any suffering in the here and now approaches zero. Going further, we might wonder why a perfect being would even bother creating a universe, let alone humans, since that creation appears to imply that he needed something he didn’t have, which is difficult to square with the notion of complete perfection; and even greater difficulty is posed by his being upset by his creation, which would be like complaining about a lunch that you yourself have packed.

    But that seems like an answer a theological killjoy would give, and I don’t want this to be a skeet shoot, so we may either stipulate that creation can be squared with perfection or, more tantalizingly, that God already knew everything but chose to create the universe in order not to know everything, to introduce freely willing subjects and see what would happen, and he’s as interested in or as curious about the final outcome as we are.

    So why create unequal beings then? I think you’re right to imply he had some choice in it. It doesn’t automatically follow from the desire to create beings that they ought to be differentiated. He very well might have chosen to make us perfectly identical. But would that mean we wouldn’t compete? Can’t identical twins enjoy a game of chess? Perhaps we would compete, but explain away any differences in outcomes as the vagaries of chance.

    I used the example of a chess match, but that may not be best example of competition. No one really feels hard done by losing a chess match. The post-match antics of a triumphalist victor might humiliate us, but that is not a direct consequence of playing chess, in which the rules are fixed, known by all, and opportunities to cheat virtually non-existent. What about games in which the “rules” are vague and opportunities to cheat plentiful, including the biggest game, the game of life? There is a classic essay in business ethics by Albert Carr “Is Business Bluffing Ethical?”, a question he answers in the affirmative, likening business competition to a poker match in which we expect our opponents are going to bluff us, and so we don’t feel hurt when they do.

    Is life itself like one giant poker match? If we were all identical, we would presumably all give the same answer, whatever answer that was. Such a world, however, would be rather less interesting than our own world, in which we’re forever negotiating with each other what the rules ought to be, and policing each other to ensure compliance with them. Maybe that is why God made us all different, so that we’d all have our different viewpoints and react differently to the moral guidelines he has set (or at least hinted at), and so that he could then “choose” those among us who freely and sufficiently aligned ourselves with his guidelines to bring nearer to him in the world to come.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @silviosilver


    Going further, we might wonder why a perfect being would even bother creating a universe, let alone humans, since that creation appears to imply that he needed something he didn’t have, which is difficult to square with the notion of complete perfection;
     
    He could have created as a pure act of generosity, a free gift, out of a feeling of superabundance, that does not diminish perfection but may be an implication of perfection.
    , @Coconuts
    @silviosilver


    I might enlarge your observation and say that virtually nothing about human existence appears consistent with an omnibenevolent God
     
    I think the problem comes with the additional divine attribute of omnipotence.

    In theory an omnipotent and omnibenevolent God would have to bring a universe into being that was infinitely perfect in every respect, but this would be a logical contradiction as it would involve a 'creation' indistinguishable from God. This entails any creation has to be limited and imperfect by definition.

    (If you accept the usual definition of omnipotence; it is limited in that it doesn't involve the ability to bring logical contradictions into being.)

    Something else, if you are a Platonist or Essentialist and you believe that God has the attributes sketched by Ivashka in reply 436 above, you may think that the essence or form of humanity must exist in the being of God, and there it will exist in a virtual but perfect form. If an infinite amount of perfect humanity already exists in God, the contingent copies of this form or essence that human beings represent won't add to or diminish the amount of perfect humanity that necessarily exists.

    The question becomes more about why these imperfect copies are brought into existence. A common response to that is given by HeavilyMarbledSteak in reply 445.

    Also, creating things like universes doesn't take God any time or involve any effort, this removes some reasons to believe God had cause to refrain from doing it at least.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  435. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool

    I wonder if there are any folks around here in the know who could inform us of any strange astrological phenomena taking place at this time, because perhaps that could explain why I've been doing an awful lot of agreeing with AP recently. Whatever the underlying cause, I have to agree with his reply to this question too. Although I also feel his reply was perhaps a little hasty, as though this were a skeet shoot and we need to get this settled now.


    a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn’t strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies
     
    If I were to take my own shotgun out and pop off a few shells, I might enlarge your observation and say that virtually nothing about human existence appears consistent with an omnibenevolent God, and argue we can only salvage the notion by positing that, against the background of eternal rewards, any suffering in the here and now approaches zero. Going further, we might wonder why a perfect being would even bother creating a universe, let alone humans, since that creation appears to imply that he needed something he didn't have, which is difficult to square with the notion of complete perfection; and even greater difficulty is posed by his being upset by his creation, which would be like complaining about a lunch that you yourself have packed.

    But that seems like an answer a theological killjoy would give, and I don't want this to be a skeet shoot, so we may either stipulate that creation can be squared with perfection or, more tantalizingly, that God already knew everything but chose to create the universe in order not to know everything, to introduce freely willing subjects and see what would happen, and he's as interested in or as curious about the final outcome as we are.

    So why create unequal beings then? I think you're right to imply he had some choice in it. It doesn't automatically follow from the desire to create beings that they ought to be differentiated. He very well might have chosen to make us perfectly identical. But would that mean we wouldn't compete? Can't identical twins enjoy a game of chess? Perhaps we would compete, but explain away any differences in outcomes as the vagaries of chance.

    I used the example of a chess match, but that may not be best example of competition. No one really feels hard done by losing a chess match. The post-match antics of a triumphalist victor might humiliate us, but that is not a direct consequence of playing chess, in which the rules are fixed, known by all, and opportunities to cheat virtually non-existent. What about games in which the "rules" are vague and opportunities to cheat plentiful, including the biggest game, the game of life? There is a classic essay in business ethics by Albert Carr "Is Business Bluffing Ethical?", a question he answers in the affirmative, likening business competition to a poker match in which we expect our opponents are going to bluff us, and so we don't feel hurt when they do.

    Is life itself like one giant poker match? If we were all identical, we would presumably all give the same answer, whatever answer that was. Such a world, however, would be rather less interesting than our own world, in which we're forever negotiating with each other what the rules ought to be, and policing each other to ensure compliance with them. Maybe that is why God made us all different, so that we'd all have our different viewpoints and react differently to the moral guidelines he has set (or at least hinted at), and so that he could then "choose" those among us who freely and sufficiently aligned ourselves with his guidelines to bring nearer to him in the world to come.

    Replies: @AaronB, @Coconuts

    Going further, we might wonder why a perfect being would even bother creating a universe, let alone humans, since that creation appears to imply that he needed something he didn’t have, which is difficult to square with the notion of complete perfection;

    He could have created as a pure act of generosity, a free gift, out of a feeling of superabundance, that does not diminish perfection but may be an implication of perfection.

  436. @A123
    The best 9 minutes you can spend. It explains the fallacy of "wokeness" in an engaging manner.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    Konstantin Kisin, an immigrant to the UK and author of An Immigrant’s Love Letter to the West, has burst on the scene with a terrific performance at the Oxford Union last week, debating the motion “The House Believes Woke Culture Has Gone Too Far.”


    https://youtu.be/zJdqJu-6ZPo

    Replies: @AP, @Wokechoke, @Ray Caruso

    You laugh at scripture because your religion is not Christianity but the kikesucker sect of liberalism. Everyone can see through you.

  437. @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-64300190



    https://tf-cmsv2-smithsonianmag-media.s3.amazonaws.com/filer/52/e4/52e44474-c2dc-41e0-bb77-42a904695196/this-image-shows-a-portrait-of-dragon-man-credit-chuang-zhao_web.jpg

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Blinky Bill

    I doubt these projection are any more accurate than the ones from the 1970’s. Back then the “International Community” were convinced that uncontrolled population growth would lead to China’s eventual collapse, an eternity of impoverishment.

    Today they wishcast once again, that China’s rapid depopulation will lead to its impoverishment and eventual collapse. This is a fundamental error, the correct take would have been to argue for at least the next decade, that China population stagnation will lead to its…

    [MORE]

    You get my point. On a more serious note for every million people China loses, the “International Community” insist on gaining two or three million more to balance things out.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    There are serious doubts to be had about the demographic statistics of RusFed since 1992, perhaps even the 1960-ies RSFSR. A couple of "conspiracy demographists" have come to the conclusion that the native population of RusFed might be as low as 110 million people, but that the population of (mostly) Central Asian migrant workers in RusFed has most probably crossed 10 million and might be even as high as 15 million people (large part of them being mostly relatively young men).

    A similar population overevaluation pattern is most likely true of Ukraine, where the birth rates crashed after the fall of the USSR and emigration must have had a significant impact of lowering the overall population even before the war that has now lead to the unfortunate exit of millions.

    Based on the examples of statistical mismanagement and/or demographic cheating of post-Soviet Slav republics, I am not sure whether the Chinese demographic statistics are entirely reliable. Especially the ones covering the more rural parts of the country and the internal migration of workers between the urban and the rural areas. In China the opposite trend might be true - the rural population might be somewhat underestimated.

    I also believe that you are right that for every million China might lose in population in the future, the Globalized West would receive two or three million of Chinese immigrants. Chinese immigrants are unlike the immigrants from poor third world countries. Chinese tend to structure the space they live in according to their needs and interests instead of just trying to fit in in a more or less passive and haphazard fashion. Perhaps the Globalized West should ponder a bit about what might happen on the immigration front if a serious economic downturn happens in mainland China. As the saying goes, they should be careful about what they wish for.

  438. @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool

    I wonder if there are any folks around here in the know who could inform us of any strange astrological phenomena taking place at this time, because perhaps that could explain why I've been doing an awful lot of agreeing with AP recently. Whatever the underlying cause, I have to agree with his reply to this question too. Although I also feel his reply was perhaps a little hasty, as though this were a skeet shoot and we need to get this settled now.


    a God that would had created a world where all living beings compete against each other, doesn’t strike me as very consistent with being a Loving Father that Christian theology implies
     
    If I were to take my own shotgun out and pop off a few shells, I might enlarge your observation and say that virtually nothing about human existence appears consistent with an omnibenevolent God, and argue we can only salvage the notion by positing that, against the background of eternal rewards, any suffering in the here and now approaches zero. Going further, we might wonder why a perfect being would even bother creating a universe, let alone humans, since that creation appears to imply that he needed something he didn't have, which is difficult to square with the notion of complete perfection; and even greater difficulty is posed by his being upset by his creation, which would be like complaining about a lunch that you yourself have packed.

    But that seems like an answer a theological killjoy would give, and I don't want this to be a skeet shoot, so we may either stipulate that creation can be squared with perfection or, more tantalizingly, that God already knew everything but chose to create the universe in order not to know everything, to introduce freely willing subjects and see what would happen, and he's as interested in or as curious about the final outcome as we are.

    So why create unequal beings then? I think you're right to imply he had some choice in it. It doesn't automatically follow from the desire to create beings that they ought to be differentiated. He very well might have chosen to make us perfectly identical. But would that mean we wouldn't compete? Can't identical twins enjoy a game of chess? Perhaps we would compete, but explain away any differences in outcomes as the vagaries of chance.

    I used the example of a chess match, but that may not be best example of competition. No one really feels hard done by losing a chess match. The post-match antics of a triumphalist victor might humiliate us, but that is not a direct consequence of playing chess, in which the rules are fixed, known by all, and opportunities to cheat virtually non-existent. What about games in which the "rules" are vague and opportunities to cheat plentiful, including the biggest game, the game of life? There is a classic essay in business ethics by Albert Carr "Is Business Bluffing Ethical?", a question he answers in the affirmative, likening business competition to a poker match in which we expect our opponents are going to bluff us, and so we don't feel hurt when they do.

    Is life itself like one giant poker match? If we were all identical, we would presumably all give the same answer, whatever answer that was. Such a world, however, would be rather less interesting than our own world, in which we're forever negotiating with each other what the rules ought to be, and policing each other to ensure compliance with them. Maybe that is why God made us all different, so that we'd all have our different viewpoints and react differently to the moral guidelines he has set (or at least hinted at), and so that he could then "choose" those among us who freely and sufficiently aligned ourselves with his guidelines to bring nearer to him in the world to come.

    Replies: @AaronB, @Coconuts

    I might enlarge your observation and say that virtually nothing about human existence appears consistent with an omnibenevolent God

    I think the problem comes with the additional divine attribute of omnipotence.

    In theory an omnipotent and omnibenevolent God would have to bring a universe into being that was infinitely perfect in every respect, but this would be a logical contradiction as it would involve a ‘creation’ indistinguishable from God. This entails any creation has to be limited and imperfect by definition.

    (If you accept the usual definition of omnipotence; it is limited in that it doesn’t involve the ability to bring logical contradictions into being.)

    Something else, if you are a Platonist or Essentialist and you believe that God has the attributes sketched by Ivashka in reply 436 above, you may think that the essence or form of humanity must exist in the being of God, and there it will exist in a virtual but perfect form. If an infinite amount of perfect humanity already exists in God, the contingent copies of this form or essence that human beings represent won’t add to or diminish the amount of perfect humanity that necessarily exists.

    The question becomes more about why these imperfect copies are brought into existence. A common response to that is given by HeavilyMarbledSteak in reply 445.

    Also, creating things like universes doesn’t take God any time or involve any effort, this removes some reasons to believe God had cause to refrain from doing it at least.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Coconuts

    Good to read you again Coconuts.

    What I suggested was that we don't understand what God might have wanted of his creation (the whole Universe). We are way too limited for that. This realm is truly too vast and complex for us to fathom the true meaning of it all. Especially when analyzed in a rational manner. Therefore we choose some simplifying generalizations that we apply to real life situations. But each one of these is unique if we look into their subtle details. The same is true about people. Silvio has written about identical twins, but it is known that even these are not truly identical, just very similar. Add to this the changing nature of reality, the panta rhei, and we come to a situation where debating about a state of affairs or some social problem (homelessness in our case) might seem somewhat futile. Especially if we add moral categories and religious teachings into the debate. Perhaps it is more interesting to think about how and why we should live in a world that is undergoing a permanent change and where every second, every being and every phenomenon are somewhat unique and often unpredictable. That is, if they truly are unique and not interchangeable.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  439. @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool

    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQNXSOhniU8A1MnlqkOlZZ1KIWdC3UikuH58Q&usqp.jpg

    I doubt these projection are any more accurate than the ones from the 1970's. Back then the "International Community" were convinced that uncontrolled population growth would lead to China's eventual collapse, an eternity of impoverishment.

    Today they wishcast once again, that China's rapid depopulation will lead to its impoverishment and eventual collapse. This is a fundamental error, the correct take would have been to argue for at least the next decade, that China population stagnation will lead to its...



    You get my point. On a more serious note for every million people China loses, the "International Community" insist on gaining two or three million more to balance things out.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    There are serious doubts to be had about the demographic statistics of RusFed since 1992, perhaps even the 1960-ies RSFSR. A couple of “conspiracy demographists” have come to the conclusion that the native population of RusFed might be as low as 110 million people, but that the population of (mostly) Central Asian migrant workers in RusFed has most probably crossed 10 million and might be even as high as 15 million people (large part of them being mostly relatively young men).

    A similar population overevaluation pattern is most likely true of Ukraine, where the birth rates crashed after the fall of the USSR and emigration must have had a significant impact of lowering the overall population even before the war that has now lead to the unfortunate exit of millions.

    Based on the examples of statistical mismanagement and/or demographic cheating of post-Soviet Slav republics, I am not sure whether the Chinese demographic statistics are entirely reliable. Especially the ones covering the more rural parts of the country and the internal migration of workers between the urban and the rural areas. In China the opposite trend might be true – the rural population might be somewhat underestimated.

    I also believe that you are right that for every million China might lose in population in the future, the Globalized West would receive two or three million of Chinese immigrants. Chinese immigrants are unlike the immigrants from poor third world countries. Chinese tend to structure the space they live in according to their needs and interests instead of just trying to fit in in a more or less passive and haphazard fashion. Perhaps the Globalized West should ponder a bit about what might happen on the immigration front if a serious economic downturn happens in mainland China. As the saying goes, they should be careful about what they wish for.

  440. @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, according to Christian theology this wasn't God's plan at all, to create a world of strife, competition, and inequality.

    It was indeed we who introduced that element, and God will help us eventually get out of our self created predicament, and realize his true intention for the world. (This may be read literally or as deep allegory)

    And perhaps the "proof" of this is the striking - even astonishing if the "standard" story you just adumbrated is true - fact that we are quite simply not happy and fulfilled when we engage in strife and competition and inequality, and we are only truly happy when we cultivate love, compassion, and egolessness.

    Having known so many powerful and wealthy men over extended periods of time from close up - the rage that frequently is thinly disguised just beneath the surface, the intense anxiety, the bouts of depression. This is only invisible from a distance - up close, you see it. And how many famous men have left accounts of their struggle with depression and nihilism and anxiety - and how many more did not discuss it. One of the striking features of the biographies of many famous men who dedicated their life to selfish ego ends is their confession of the sense of meaninglessness - the nihilism - they often felt (although perhaps depression is an acute form of nihilism). Should this not be taken as part of the total scientific picture - as a simple brute fact - about what the true structure of reality is? We don't integrate all the "facts" into our theories.

    One can even analyze it "structurally" - the psychological "structure" of wealth and power seeking (although Silvio doesn't like it when I do this) . What could motivate that but an insatiable craving for security? And what state of mind does that imply?

    Now look at the "standard" theory that you adumbrated. In that theory, we should be happiest and most fulfilled when pursuing selfish ego ends, securing survival, etc . But we're not.

    Look even at your self, with your talk of "genetic lineages", and the need to secure their survival (in this world of illusion moreover) - there is an unmistakable whiff of anxiety and depression and despair in your writings that comes from pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.

    The "Christian" theology actually ends up being more coherent and a better fit for the facts than the hard nosed "scientific" theology which seems to not be able to tell us how to live well.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Anon, @LatW

    Look even at your self, with your talk of “genetic lineages”, and the need to secure their survival (in this world of illusion moreover) – there is an unmistakable whiff of anxiety and depression and despair in your writings that comes from pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.

    Ethnic nationalists usually care about the demographics of the lineages they belong to. This is a normal attitude for them to have and has nothing to do with despair or depression as long as the population they care about does well. Of course it is somewhat disenhartening to see what is going on in Eastern Slav countries nowadays. That is if someone cares about the well-being of the Eastern Slavs. OTOH, there were historically periods when the situation in historical Rus lands was much more threatening. Perhaps the things would ease up in the future.

    Now, about the anxiety. Of course, life in an unpredictable, impermanent and imperfect Universe might bring about a feeling of stress. We both know how it is addressed in the Buddhadharma. I try to cope with dukha using the Dharma’s principles. I have the feeling that it works to some extent, although it is not perfect at all and I could do better. Of course this is only due to my laziness and lack of consistency in practice.

    But to come back to the discussion you have had with AP. You are as usual very full of yourself. As a Russian saying goes, some character traits cannot be healed, but you might be less categorical in your affirmations. Some of them are beyond the pale and undermine your arguments. The one about Bach’s music and cathedrals being a product of rebellious art is typical of your flippancy. One has to know when one needs to stop when not trolling.

    Anyway, I know that debating you is futile because “the Jew in you is strong”, I prefer reading your debates with AP who has the character needed to undergo these protracted and ultimately self-oriented discussions.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Yes, I'm just not sure that ethnic nationalism - at least if it's very attached and passionate, as yours is - is compatible with spirituality. From a Buddhist (and Christian) perspective it's clearly a source of attachment and suffering, so I was just surprised that you claim to be Buddhist but also a very passionate ethnic nationalist.

    The last time you posted under Bashibuzuk, you did not manifest the liberated joy of transcendent spirituality but a very dark, despairing, depressed view, which I thought was connected to your deep attachment to ethnic nationalism, which is a form of sublimated ego - and clinging to anything in this world, particularly ego, predictably results in suffering.

    (I'm not against a sort of lighthearted allegiance to country and race as contingent circumstances, but your ethnic nationalism is clearly essentialist and salvific, which I don't think can remotely be justified in terms of Buddhism (or Christianity, not that you're Christian))

    Of course, unenlightened creatures that we are, we often cannot help but cling to what is poison for us, myself included, and cannot free ourselves from thought-forms that do us no good.

    You are free to be an ethnic nationalist and I have no desire to stop you - but I am free to discuss it as it relates to Buddhism and suffering.


    As a Russian saying goes, some character traits cannot be healed, but you might be less categorical in your affirmations.
     
    Fair enough, but that's just you taking sides. AP was equally if not more categorical and full of himself - is that then the Jew in him?

    One classic way to undermine an opponent is to guilt him for being self-confident and assertive while ignoring or even encouraging the exact same qualities in the side you support.

    And you, by the way, are not exactly a shrinking violet :) How about we all just call it like we see it without trying to guilt each other for being straightforward? Maybe we can even appreciate each other for telling it - like we respectively think - it is.

    The theory of art I'm advancing with regard to Bach is one that will obviously be deeply offensive to ethnic nationalists who desire national consensus and bland uniformity - but the layers and tensions that compose a human collective are far more fruitful, creative, and fascinating.

    Not did I merely make categorical statements - I provided detailed arguments and logic. But again, you don't like it so you have to discredit :)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @AP

  441. @Coconuts
    @silviosilver


    I might enlarge your observation and say that virtually nothing about human existence appears consistent with an omnibenevolent God
     
    I think the problem comes with the additional divine attribute of omnipotence.

    In theory an omnipotent and omnibenevolent God would have to bring a universe into being that was infinitely perfect in every respect, but this would be a logical contradiction as it would involve a 'creation' indistinguishable from God. This entails any creation has to be limited and imperfect by definition.

    (If you accept the usual definition of omnipotence; it is limited in that it doesn't involve the ability to bring logical contradictions into being.)

    Something else, if you are a Platonist or Essentialist and you believe that God has the attributes sketched by Ivashka in reply 436 above, you may think that the essence or form of humanity must exist in the being of God, and there it will exist in a virtual but perfect form. If an infinite amount of perfect humanity already exists in God, the contingent copies of this form or essence that human beings represent won't add to or diminish the amount of perfect humanity that necessarily exists.

    The question becomes more about why these imperfect copies are brought into existence. A common response to that is given by HeavilyMarbledSteak in reply 445.

    Also, creating things like universes doesn't take God any time or involve any effort, this removes some reasons to believe God had cause to refrain from doing it at least.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Good to read you again Coconuts.

    What I suggested was that we don’t understand what God might have wanted of his creation (the whole Universe). We are way too limited for that. This realm is truly too vast and complex for us to fathom the true meaning of it all. Especially when analyzed in a rational manner. Therefore we choose some simplifying generalizations that we apply to real life situations. But each one of these is unique if we look into their subtle details. The same is true about people. Silvio has written about identical twins, but it is known that even these are not truly identical, just very similar. Add to this the changing nature of reality, the panta rhei, and we come to a situation where debating about a state of affairs or some social problem (homelessness in our case) might seem somewhat futile. Especially if we add moral categories and religious teachings into the debate. Perhaps it is more interesting to think about how and why we should live in a world that is undergoing a permanent change and where every second, every being and every phenomenon are somewhat unique and often unpredictable. That is, if they truly are unique and not interchangeable.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    Therefore we choose some simplifying generalizations that we apply to real life situations. But each one of these is unique if we look into their subtle details.
     
    If you continue that line of reasoning, you might ask in virtue of what does situation S at time T1 remain identical to S at time T2 such that you are justified in identifying it as situation S at both times? You might answer: if nothing has qualitatively changed about S between times T1 and T2, then S remains S. But doesn't something always change? Even if we have to go beyond the microscopic to detect it - the position of an electron, say - isn't that still a qualitative change?

    If you insist that S remains S despite that qualitative change, doesn't that then mean it is in virtue of some "essence" in S that it remains identifiable to you as S? And if S is arbitrarily permitted such an essence, why cannot one generalize further - into the realm of macroscopic qualitative change, say? Why should essence at one scale be permitted but denied at another scale?

    One way out of the jam might be to abandon the claim that any objects can ever be truly identified for any period of time whatsoever; in other words that any identifiable objects actually exist at all; which would seem to be nihilism in its purest form. In view of such a nihilism, it would require an act of considerable faith to believe that we even exist, that we possess something called a life, and that it is meaningful to discuss how that life might best be led; let alone that there's a God.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  442. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @Ivashka the fool
    @AaronB


    Look even at your self, with your talk of “genetic lineages”, and the need to secure their survival (in this world of illusion moreover) – there is an unmistakable whiff of anxiety and depression and despair in your writings that comes from pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.
     
    Ethnic nationalists usually care about the demographics of the lineages they belong to. This is a normal attitude for them to have and has nothing to do with despair or depression as long as the population they care about does well. Of course it is somewhat disenhartening to see what is going on in Eastern Slav countries nowadays. That is if someone cares about the well-being of the Eastern Slavs. OTOH, there were historically periods when the situation in historical Rus lands was much more threatening. Perhaps the things would ease up in the future.

    Now, about the anxiety. Of course, life in an unpredictable, impermanent and imperfect Universe might bring about a feeling of stress. We both know how it is addressed in the Buddhadharma. I try to cope with dukha using the Dharma's principles. I have the feeling that it works to some extent, although it is not perfect at all and I could do better. Of course this is only due to my laziness and lack of consistency in practice.

    But to come back to the discussion you have had with AP. You are as usual very full of yourself. As a Russian saying goes, some character traits cannot be healed, but you might be less categorical in your affirmations. Some of them are beyond the pale and undermine your arguments. The one about Bach's music and cathedrals being a product of rebellious art is typical of your flippancy. One has to know when one needs to stop when not trolling.

    Anyway, I know that debating you is futile because "the Jew in you is strong", I prefer reading your debates with AP who has the character needed to undergo these protracted and ultimately self-oriented discussions.

    Replies: @AaronB

    Yes, I’m just not sure that ethnic nationalism – at least if it’s very attached and passionate, as yours is – is compatible with spirituality. From a Buddhist (and Christian) perspective it’s clearly a source of attachment and suffering, so I was just surprised that you claim to be Buddhist but also a very passionate ethnic nationalist.

    The last time you posted under Bashibuzuk, you did not manifest the liberated joy of transcendent spirituality but a very dark, despairing, depressed view, which I thought was connected to your deep attachment to ethnic nationalism, which is a form of sublimated ego – and clinging to anything in this world, particularly ego, predictably results in suffering.

    (I’m not against a sort of lighthearted allegiance to country and race as contingent circumstances, but your ethnic nationalism is clearly essentialist and salvific, which I don’t think can remotely be justified in terms of Buddhism (or Christianity, not that you’re Christian))

    Of course, unenlightened creatures that we are, we often cannot help but cling to what is poison for us, myself included, and cannot free ourselves from thought-forms that do us no good.

    You are free to be an ethnic nationalist and I have no desire to stop you – but I am free to discuss it as it relates to Buddhism and suffering.

    As a Russian saying goes, some character traits cannot be healed, but you might be less categorical in your affirmations.

    Fair enough, but that’s just you taking sides. AP was equally if not more categorical and full of himself – is that then the Jew in him?

    One classic way to undermine an opponent is to guilt him for being self-confident and assertive while ignoring or even encouraging the exact same qualities in the side you support.

    And you, by the way, are not exactly a shrinking violet 🙂 How about we all just call it like we see it without trying to guilt each other for being straightforward? Maybe we can even appreciate each other for telling it – like we respectively think – it is.

    The theory of art I’m advancing with regard to Bach is one that will obviously be deeply offensive to ethnic nationalists who desire national consensus and bland uniformity – but the layers and tensions that compose a human collective are far more fruitful, creative, and fascinating.

    Not did I merely make categorical statements – I provided detailed arguments and logic. But again, you don’t like it so you have to discredit 🙂

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @AaronB

    Oy vey...

    Here we go again...

    😏

    Aaron, take the time to read my comments to AP. I have clearly written that I find some of your and Dmitry's arguments about Christian ethics quite compelling.

    Silvio is right, there's something weird going on in the stars given that I agree with you for once.

    Now, about Buddhism, Altan was absolutely right about both me and you being heretics from the classical teachings' point of view. And I have already written a couple of years ago that I would not discuss Dharma with you, and even much less so Ch'an.

    Anyway, we both know that "words have no meaning", right ?

    So why don't you tell me more about your hiking experience, instead of trying to steer me towards a futile discussion of what was right or wrong in my personal subjective interpretation of ethnic nationalism...

    🙂

    Replies: @AaronB

    , @Greasy William
    @AaronB


    which I thought was connected to your deep attachment to ethnic nationalism
     
    I used to be an ethnic nationalist and I was happier when I was. Now all I have is my hatred for white liberals and even that isn't nearly as fun as it used to be.

    Replies: @AaronB

    , @AP
    @AaronB


    AP was equally if not more categorical and full of himself
     
    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ's message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.

    The theory of art I’m advancing with regard to Bach is one that will obviously be deeply offensive to ethnic nationalists who desire national consensus and bland uniformity
     
    No, it's just dumbly arrogant.

    You claim that Bach rebelled against Christendom in his art and that his art was fundamentally opposed to it. In a way, you compared Bach to yourself, as a fellow rebel.

    Silvio said it better than I could:

    "A celebration of Jesus is a celebration of the Christian faith, and when that faith is celebrated by an artist [Bach] in the context of a Christian civilization, it is far more plausible that the artist approves of that civilization than disapproves of it, let alone stands in staunch opposition to the totality of it."

    Your response:

    Look at it this way – art is an act of imagination, in other words, it looks beyond the existing and factual to the possible.
     
    Sure.

    Political and social institutions are not built on ideals
     
    Of course they are. Certainly Christendom was. As was Communism, and Nazism. Even capitalism.

    Art and beauty – as acts of that faculty which let’s us soar beyond the existing into the realm of the ideal and possible – are then, clearly, necessarily in tension with actually existing conditions
     
    There is no tension between a Christian society and an art that celebrates Christ, merely because Christian rulers are busy with necessities such as tax collection and buildings roads and walls, n addition to lavishly sponsoring Christian arts and artists such as Bach. If Bach were forced to make furniture rather than compose music he might experience some inner tension, but there is no evidence and no reason to believe that he experienced tension by making Christian music for and within a Christian society, under the patronage of Christian rulers. Particularly tension towards that same Christian society.

    More specifically, the artists I cited, as a matter of concrete fact, created works that celebrate a value system that is in diametric opposition to the existing institutions, based as they are on power relations
     
    According to you personal interpretation, and not that of the Churches and society of Bach's time and place.

    And now the centerpiece of your arrogance:

    It doesn’t even matter if we resurrect Bach and he tells us plainly he did not see the civilization of his day as unjust and was not consciously trying to criticize it – his art embodies a criticism of it, and all that would mean is Bach wasn’t very politically perceptive.
     
    Yes, a non-Christian rando knows and understands better what Bach was about than even Bach himself.

    Great art is always greater than the intentions of it’s creator
     
    But not so great that AaronB hasn't figured out its true nature.

    Vatican and the Cathedrals did not exactly manifest a spirit of humility
     
    They celebrated God in beautiful ways.

    I do indeed contend that the Church from very early on went wrong and represented an illegitimate fusion of power and religion
     
    Indeed, AaronB thinks he knows better about the nature of Christianity than did the Church Fathers from early on. Because he read some Gospels himself.

    ::::::::::::::::::::::

    Incidentally, there was a discussion about virtues among the rich and the poor. I can't speak of the very rich, I only know a small handful of those and it may not be a representative sample. But in our Christian and immediately post-Christian society, the comfortable are more virtuous than the poor. This can be empirically measured.

    For example, divorce rate by profession. It is much lower among people such as engineers or physicians than among laborers:

    https://i.imgur.com/9VHd1ys.png

    Heroin use, more popular among poorer people:

    https://www.cdc.gov/vitalsigns/heroin/infographic.html

    Wealthier people have higher marriage rates and lower divorce rates:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32886585/

    Wealthy people 7 times less likely to grow up and commit violent crimes than poor people in Sweden:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4180846/

    Wealthier people less likely to kill their domestic partners in the USA, even when taking race into account:

    https://scholarworks.uni.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1009&context=ijghhd

    Poor people commit more of every type of crime in Toronto:

    https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/b5ab6df3741649c4bcc0a5fbd9e3b45b

    Both very rich and very poor had higher number of sexual partners:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32886585/

    Poor people more obese (thus, the sin of gluttony):

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7484407/#:~:text=Socioeconomic%20status%20(SES)%20is%20an,variable%20over%20time%20%5B2%5D.

    Poor adolescents more likely to commit all kinds of sex crimes than rich ones:

    https://heinonline.org/HOL/LandingPage?handle=hein.journals/ijotcc40&div=39&id=&page=

    I am deliberately using rich societies as examples because in such societies even the poor are not desperate. Nobody is starving to death in Sweden or Canada or the USA.

    :::::::::::::::

    I claimed that in a society that reflects Christian values, the more prosperous within that society are more likely to live by Christina virtues, such as not abusing one's body through drug abuse, not killing, getting married, etc. That is, they are less sinful than poor people. With the exception of the richest peoples' tendency to have as many sexual partners as do poor people (but fewer than do the middle classes), the data support that claim.

    Thus, it is correct to claim that the poor and more marginalized are in general more less virtuous and more sinful than the middle and upper classes. Which means that they are in more need of help and correction.

    Replies: @A123, @AaronB, @LatW

  443. @AP
    @A123

    He's very pro-Ukrainian, you sure you want to cite him?

    Replies: @A123

    He’s very pro-Ukrainian, you sure you want to cite him?

    Senseless “Woke Kiev” regime aggression is headed towards being a footnote in history texts. While expensive, it is not very relevant to the lives of ordinary Americans. The whole thing will be largely forgotten in a few years.

    The need to fight Woke authoritarianism will be with America for decades. An eloquent speaker against the madness is an asset. Hopefully, Kisin will remain active in this field after the non-issue of Ukraine returns to the obscurity from whence it came.

    Woke Culture has only just started in the UK.

    “Started” is probably not the best term.

    Certainly, the Tories have dropped the ball. Woke Labour is coming back to select the next PM. Things are headed the wrong way.

    Populism needs a voice in the UK. The upcoming wipe out of the Conservatives will lead the party to reform. Or, it may permanently collapse, opening the way for a serious replacement.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @A123


    Senseless “Woke Kiev” regime aggression is headed towards being a footnote in history texts. While expensive, it is not very relevant to the lives of ordinary Americans. The whole thing will be largely forgotten in a few years.
     
    Once again, you are stunning in your ability to reach new lows in your senseless quest to try and diminish the Ukrainian question.

    Woke Kiev” regime aggression is headed towards being a footnote in history texts.
     
    Firstly, I continually need to remind you that it is Russia that is the clear aggressor in this war, not Ukraine, something that even a child should be able to figure out. A footnote in history? This is really the telltale marker that your abilities to discern are vastly lacking. After 11 months of war, with both Ukraine and the West and Russia showing no signs of ending this war any time soon, both sides firmly digging in for a long war, you call this a "footnote"? It could all very well end up being the prelude to WWIII.

    Expensive?

    The OECD estimates that the world economy in 2023 will be US$2.8 trillion smaller than was estimated in December 2021, before Russian troops and tanks swarmed into neighbouring Ukraine.
    https://www.aspistrategist.org.au/the-ballooning-costs-of-the-ukraine-war/

    And this is only after 11 months of war. What will the costs be after 24 months, 36 months...48?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  444. @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Yes, I'm just not sure that ethnic nationalism - at least if it's very attached and passionate, as yours is - is compatible with spirituality. From a Buddhist (and Christian) perspective it's clearly a source of attachment and suffering, so I was just surprised that you claim to be Buddhist but also a very passionate ethnic nationalist.

    The last time you posted under Bashibuzuk, you did not manifest the liberated joy of transcendent spirituality but a very dark, despairing, depressed view, which I thought was connected to your deep attachment to ethnic nationalism, which is a form of sublimated ego - and clinging to anything in this world, particularly ego, predictably results in suffering.

    (I'm not against a sort of lighthearted allegiance to country and race as contingent circumstances, but your ethnic nationalism is clearly essentialist and salvific, which I don't think can remotely be justified in terms of Buddhism (or Christianity, not that you're Christian))

    Of course, unenlightened creatures that we are, we often cannot help but cling to what is poison for us, myself included, and cannot free ourselves from thought-forms that do us no good.

    You are free to be an ethnic nationalist and I have no desire to stop you - but I am free to discuss it as it relates to Buddhism and suffering.


    As a Russian saying goes, some character traits cannot be healed, but you might be less categorical in your affirmations.
     
    Fair enough, but that's just you taking sides. AP was equally if not more categorical and full of himself - is that then the Jew in him?

    One classic way to undermine an opponent is to guilt him for being self-confident and assertive while ignoring or even encouraging the exact same qualities in the side you support.

    And you, by the way, are not exactly a shrinking violet :) How about we all just call it like we see it without trying to guilt each other for being straightforward? Maybe we can even appreciate each other for telling it - like we respectively think - it is.

    The theory of art I'm advancing with regard to Bach is one that will obviously be deeply offensive to ethnic nationalists who desire national consensus and bland uniformity - but the layers and tensions that compose a human collective are far more fruitful, creative, and fascinating.

    Not did I merely make categorical statements - I provided detailed arguments and logic. But again, you don't like it so you have to discredit :)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @AP

    Oy vey…

    Here we go again…

    😏

    Aaron, take the time to read my comments to AP. I have clearly written that I find some of your and Dmitry’s arguments about Christian ethics quite compelling.

    Silvio is right, there’s something weird going on in the stars given that I agree with you for once.

    Now, about Buddhism, Altan was absolutely right about both me and you being heretics from the classical teachings’ point of view. And I have already written a couple of years ago that I would not discuss Dharma with you, and even much less so Ch’an.

    Anyway, we both know that “words have no meaning”, right ?

    So why don’t you tell me more about your hiking experience, instead of trying to steer me towards a futile discussion of what was right or wrong in my personal subjective interpretation of ethnic nationalism…

    🙂

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Yes, I did see that overall you agreed with me and Dmitry more than AP, which was remarkable, so I guess you're not simply taking sides with AP :) However it's clear your upset by my Bach remarks - but that's fine, I get it from your point of view. No worries.

    About Buddhism and Altan, it's the same thing with me and Christianity - I go back to the sources and am not so interested in the "institutional" church interpretation, which is generally substantially corrupted by politics and the need for social control. Altan is another AP like figure.

    It's ok, you don't have to discuss Dharma with me :) My interpretations are probably too shocking from the institutional pov anyways.


    Anyway, we both know that “words have no meaning”, right ?
     
    Indeed!

    As for steering you towards a discussion of ethnic nationalism, that's a bit unfair - my original (long) post to you was about entirely other matters and that was a small tidbit that you latched onto to the exclusion of all else.

    So why don’t you tell me more about your hiking experience
     
    Now this, is a fine suggestion indeed :) I plan on writing more on certain interesting experiences I've had last summer that stayed with me.

    All the best, Bashi.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  445. @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    So many interesting and significant things have happened in Harbin. Don't you think ?



    BTW a young Chinese lady I have met last year had family ties to that region and understood a little Russian. She had an interesting phenotype for a Han Chinese, her mother did not look that different from the Tatar neighbors who lived next door in Moscow in my youth. Her father came from an impoverished family of Inner Mongolia that claimed some princely ancestry. He didn't look that different from some of the Bashkirs I have personally met. I had an interesting conversation with her about the complex mix of ethnicities that have formed the Northern Chinese. She told me that in her opinion only the Northern Han were the true Chinese, that only them had the strength and the guts to build the country into an Empire. She looked at the Cantonese with somewhat of condescending disdain, telling me that they are "small, brown and only good at business and commerce". I was surprised to find that even among the Chinese youth, there were some that saw their homeland as deeply divided on regional identity grounds.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Blinky Bill

    So many interesting and significant things have happened in Harbin

    .

    [MORE]

    It is also where Pan-Asianist An Jung-geun, who spoke fluent Russian ended the life of Itō Hirobumi, the first Prime Minister of Japan.

    Some contemporary news of note, the Harbin Institute of Technology which was established in 1920 as the Harbin Sino-Russian School for Industry, in order to educate railway engineers. Is now in the forefront of China’s research for Extreme Ultraviolet Lithography, the light source to be exact.

    • Thanks: Ivashka the fool
  446. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @Ivashka the fool
    @AaronB

    Oy vey...

    Here we go again...

    😏

    Aaron, take the time to read my comments to AP. I have clearly written that I find some of your and Dmitry's arguments about Christian ethics quite compelling.

    Silvio is right, there's something weird going on in the stars given that I agree with you for once.

    Now, about Buddhism, Altan was absolutely right about both me and you being heretics from the classical teachings' point of view. And I have already written a couple of years ago that I would not discuss Dharma with you, and even much less so Ch'an.

    Anyway, we both know that "words have no meaning", right ?

    So why don't you tell me more about your hiking experience, instead of trying to steer me towards a futile discussion of what was right or wrong in my personal subjective interpretation of ethnic nationalism...

    🙂

    Replies: @AaronB

    Yes, I did see that overall you agreed with me and Dmitry more than AP, which was remarkable, so I guess you’re not simply taking sides with AP 🙂 However it’s clear your upset by my Bach remarks – but that’s fine, I get it from your point of view. No worries.

    About Buddhism and Altan, it’s the same thing with me and Christianity – I go back to the sources and am not so interested in the “institutional” church interpretation, which is generally substantially corrupted by politics and the need for social control. Altan is another AP like figure.

    It’s ok, you don’t have to discuss Dharma with me 🙂 My interpretations are probably too shocking from the institutional pov anyways.

    Anyway, we both know that “words have no meaning”, right ?

    Indeed!

    As for steering you towards a discussion of ethnic nationalism, that’s a bit unfair – my original (long) post to you was about entirely other matters and that was a small tidbit that you latched onto to the exclusion of all else.

    So why don’t you tell me more about your hiking experience

    Now this, is a fine suggestion indeed 🙂 I plan on writing more on certain interesting experiences I’ve had last summer that stayed with me.

    All the best, Bashi.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @AaronB

    I am not taking sides in your debate with AP at all. I think both you and AP were right in your own manner. It's just that I happen to see our Lord's message similar to the way you and Dmitry see it. But then I am no Christian, so my opinions don't really matter. BTW you're not a Christian either, so perhaps discussing and debating something more related to your spiritual identity would be more appropriate.

    And yeah, your hiking stories and your descriptions of nature are always very interesting and I would say uplifting. Waiting to read more about it.

    Replies: @AaronB, @AP

  447. @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Yes, I did see that overall you agreed with me and Dmitry more than AP, which was remarkable, so I guess you're not simply taking sides with AP :) However it's clear your upset by my Bach remarks - but that's fine, I get it from your point of view. No worries.

    About Buddhism and Altan, it's the same thing with me and Christianity - I go back to the sources and am not so interested in the "institutional" church interpretation, which is generally substantially corrupted by politics and the need for social control. Altan is another AP like figure.

    It's ok, you don't have to discuss Dharma with me :) My interpretations are probably too shocking from the institutional pov anyways.


    Anyway, we both know that “words have no meaning”, right ?
     
    Indeed!

    As for steering you towards a discussion of ethnic nationalism, that's a bit unfair - my original (long) post to you was about entirely other matters and that was a small tidbit that you latched onto to the exclusion of all else.

    So why don’t you tell me more about your hiking experience
     
    Now this, is a fine suggestion indeed :) I plan on writing more on certain interesting experiences I've had last summer that stayed with me.

    All the best, Bashi.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    I am not taking sides in your debate with AP at all. I think both you and AP were right in your own manner. It’s just that I happen to see our Lord’s message similar to the way you and Dmitry see it. But then I am no Christian, so my opinions don’t really matter. BTW you’re not a Christian either, so perhaps discussing and debating something more related to your spiritual identity would be more appropriate.

    And yeah, your hiking stories and your descriptions of nature are always very interesting and I would say uplifting. Waiting to read more about it.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Thank you for your kind reply.

    To be perfectly honest, I actually think all the subtle theology in the world cannot replace a good hiking story :) Life is in the living, not the thinking about. And I think there is more genuine religion in a hike done with reverence than in an entire library on theology. I am gratified to hear that you - and others here - enjoy my hiking stories.

    My spiritual identity? I am a syncretist - perhaps unfortunately - and cannot settle in any one spiritual identity. I tried. But I get something from Taoism I don't get in Christianity, and vice versa. I need all the world's great traditions to teach me.

    Thanks for the exchange which ended up being pleasant - all the best.

    , @AP
    @Ivashka the fool


    I think both you and AP were right in your own manner. It’s just that I happen to see our Lord’s message similar to the way you and Dmitry see it
     
    So three non-Christians interpret Christianity in a way that opposes what actual Christians believe.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  448. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @Ivashka the fool
    @AaronB

    I am not taking sides in your debate with AP at all. I think both you and AP were right in your own manner. It's just that I happen to see our Lord's message similar to the way you and Dmitry see it. But then I am no Christian, so my opinions don't really matter. BTW you're not a Christian either, so perhaps discussing and debating something more related to your spiritual identity would be more appropriate.

    And yeah, your hiking stories and your descriptions of nature are always very interesting and I would say uplifting. Waiting to read more about it.

    Replies: @AaronB, @AP

    Thank you for your kind reply.

    To be perfectly honest, I actually think all the subtle theology in the world cannot replace a good hiking story 🙂 Life is in the living, not the thinking about. And I think there is more genuine religion in a hike done with reverence than in an entire library on theology. I am gratified to hear that you – and others here – enjoy my hiking stories.

    My spiritual identity? I am a syncretist – perhaps unfortunately – and cannot settle in any one spiritual identity. I tried. But I get something from Taoism I don’t get in Christianity, and vice versa. I need all the world’s great traditions to teach me.

    Thanks for the exchange which ended up being pleasant – all the best.

  449. @Ivashka the fool
    @Coconuts

    Good to read you again Coconuts.

    What I suggested was that we don't understand what God might have wanted of his creation (the whole Universe). We are way too limited for that. This realm is truly too vast and complex for us to fathom the true meaning of it all. Especially when analyzed in a rational manner. Therefore we choose some simplifying generalizations that we apply to real life situations. But each one of these is unique if we look into their subtle details. The same is true about people. Silvio has written about identical twins, but it is known that even these are not truly identical, just very similar. Add to this the changing nature of reality, the panta rhei, and we come to a situation where debating about a state of affairs or some social problem (homelessness in our case) might seem somewhat futile. Especially if we add moral categories and religious teachings into the debate. Perhaps it is more interesting to think about how and why we should live in a world that is undergoing a permanent change and where every second, every being and every phenomenon are somewhat unique and often unpredictable. That is, if they truly are unique and not interchangeable.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Therefore we choose some simplifying generalizations that we apply to real life situations. But each one of these is unique if we look into their subtle details.

    If you continue that line of reasoning, you might ask in virtue of what does situation S at time T1 remain identical to S at time T2 such that you are justified in identifying it as situation S at both times? You might answer: if nothing has qualitatively changed about S between times T1 and T2, then S remains S. But doesn’t something always change? Even if we have to go beyond the microscopic to detect it – the position of an electron, say – isn’t that still a qualitative change?

    If you insist that S remains S despite that qualitative change, doesn’t that then mean it is in virtue of some “essence” in S that it remains identifiable to you as S? And if S is arbitrarily permitted such an essence, why cannot one generalize further – into the realm of macroscopic qualitative change, say? Why should essence at one scale be permitted but denied at another scale?

    One way out of the jam might be to abandon the claim that any objects can ever be truly identified for any period of time whatsoever; in other words that any identifiable objects actually exist at all; which would seem to be nihilism in its purest form. In view of such a nihilism, it would require an act of considerable faith to believe that we even exist, that we possess something called a life, and that it is meaningful to discuss how that life might best be led; let alone that there’s a God.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver


    One way out of the jam might be to abandon the claim that any objects can ever be truly identified for any period of time whatsoever; in other words that any identifiable objects actually exist at all; which would seem to be nihilism in its purest form. In view of such a nihilism, it would require an act of considerable faith to believe that we even exist, that we possess something called a life, and that it is meaningful to discuss how that life might best be led; let alone that there’s a God.
     
    Have you ever read the Vajraccheddika Prajnaparamita Sutra (also known as the Diamond Sutra) ?

    https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Vajracchedik%C4%81_Praj%C3%B1%C4%81p%C4%81ramit%C4%81_S%C5%ABtra

    That's more or less the teaching: that our perception cannot truly apprehend the Real, and that our terminology is just a collection of approximate and unsubstantiated assertions about what is real.

    All conditioned dharmas
    Are like dreams, illusions, bubbles, or shadows;
    Like drops of dew, or like flashes of lightning;
    Thusly should they be contemplated.
     
    I was (re)reading it lately in a very good Russian translation by Evgeny Torchinov and his colleagues.

    https://www.labirint.ru/books/76047/

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evgeny_Torchinov

    Torchinov was an amazing expert on Chinese and other Eastern religious traditions.

    An example of his insightful writing:

    http://anthropology.ru/ru/text/torchinov-ea/doktrina-proishozhdeniya-zla-v-lurianskoy-i-sabbatianskoy-kabbale-i-v-buddiyskom

  450. [MORE]

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    A man I know worked in Lybia in the early 80ies. Told me it was mainly positive and that he enjoyed his stay.

    According to him populist strongmen are what suits Arabs best. I tend to agree with him on personal experience grounds. The Berber are somewhat different, but they are a minority nowadays in these lands.



    https://youtu.be/AwuB5WPbRhc

    The Leader of Al Fateh Revolution... !

    RIP

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Yahya

  451. @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    Therefore we choose some simplifying generalizations that we apply to real life situations. But each one of these is unique if we look into their subtle details.
     
    If you continue that line of reasoning, you might ask in virtue of what does situation S at time T1 remain identical to S at time T2 such that you are justified in identifying it as situation S at both times? You might answer: if nothing has qualitatively changed about S between times T1 and T2, then S remains S. But doesn't something always change? Even if we have to go beyond the microscopic to detect it - the position of an electron, say - isn't that still a qualitative change?

    If you insist that S remains S despite that qualitative change, doesn't that then mean it is in virtue of some "essence" in S that it remains identifiable to you as S? And if S is arbitrarily permitted such an essence, why cannot one generalize further - into the realm of macroscopic qualitative change, say? Why should essence at one scale be permitted but denied at another scale?

    One way out of the jam might be to abandon the claim that any objects can ever be truly identified for any period of time whatsoever; in other words that any identifiable objects actually exist at all; which would seem to be nihilism in its purest form. In view of such a nihilism, it would require an act of considerable faith to believe that we even exist, that we possess something called a life, and that it is meaningful to discuss how that life might best be led; let alone that there's a God.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    One way out of the jam might be to abandon the claim that any objects can ever be truly identified for any period of time whatsoever; in other words that any identifiable objects actually exist at all; which would seem to be nihilism in its purest form. In view of such a nihilism, it would require an act of considerable faith to believe that we even exist, that we possess something called a life, and that it is meaningful to discuss how that life might best be led; let alone that there’s a God.

    Have you ever read the Vajraccheddika Prajnaparamita Sutra (also known as the Diamond Sutra) ?

    https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Vajracchedik%C4%81_Praj%C3%B1%C4%81p%C4%81ramit%C4%81_S%C5%ABtra

    That’s more or less the teaching: that our perception cannot truly apprehend the Real, and that our terminology is just a collection of approximate and unsubstantiated assertions about what is real.

    All conditioned dharmas
    Are like dreams, illusions, bubbles, or shadows;
    Like drops of dew, or like flashes of lightning;
    Thusly should they be contemplated.

    I was (re)reading it lately in a very good Russian translation by Evgeny Torchinov and his colleagues.

    https://www.labirint.ru/books/76047/

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evgeny_Torchinov

    Torchinov was an amazing expert on Chinese and other Eastern religious traditions.

    An example of his insightful writing:

    http://anthropology.ru/ru/text/torchinov-ea/doktrina-proishozhdeniya-zla-v-lurianskoy-i-sabbatianskoy-kabbale-i-v-buddiyskom

    • Thanks: Blinky Bill
  452. That policewoman who cheated on her husband with her 6 coworkers is a good illustration in point of favor of my idea to send all women with tattoos to a new country called Tattooine.

  453. @Wokechoke
    @A123

    Woke Culture has only just started in the UK.

    Replies: @songbird

    Guys like Kisin are the reason why the UK is in the shape it is in.

  454. Y’all’s theology is rubbish.

    This is explained so that a 12-year-old may grok in the Book of Job. God’s will is not for us to comprehend. end_of_file

    (They interviewed the National Geographic green eye Afghan girl twenty years after the famous photo. They found her in a refugee camp in Pakistan. Her chance of ever celebrating her 70th birthday is miniscule. She is illiterate. She was asked about the cosmic injustice of her life. I forget the exact wording used by the national geographic journalist. Her answer: “God’s will”.)

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Tangential, but I'm really amused by all these people on twitter posting pics of NZ's Jacinda Adern in her 20s and then comparing them to her current pics (40s) and saying that she sold her soul and became Gollum.

    https://twitter.com/thevivafrei/status/1615913588513710081?s=20&t=HlOgWIV-ZDEk54xVpuUOug

    BTW, she has resigned.

    Replies: @Beckow

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    https://dhjhkxawhe8q4.cloudfront.net/yup-wp/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/27160816/1280px-Job_and_his_friends-e1596219704724-1024x491.jpg

    Sigh...

    , @Talha
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Excellent quote and thanks for the reminder. These are the hidden awliyah of Allah swt. They are content with His Will and Decree and consider the only calamity to befall them is when they fall out of His obedience and earn Divine displeasure. Otherwise, they bear these trials with a sweet patience and only draw closer to Him and are raised in rank with each breath they draw.

    Peace.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @S
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    OT...It's not something I'd put a whole lot of stock in, but any thoughts on the idea that there may have been, even unbeknownst consciously to the alleged murderer and likely somewhat deranged Kohberger himself, an occult element to the Idaho student murders, specifically that the murders at 1122 King Rd in Moscow, Idaho represented a symbolic Masonic 'killing of the King' in commemoration of the Nov 22 (11/22) Kennedy assassination, the 1918 murder of the Czar Nicholas II and family in 1918, and perhaps a yet to happen assassination in Moscow, Russia?

    Despite the title of the linked video, I personally think there's plenty of responsibility to share regarding Masonry and the present situation, and am plenty content with a republic. I post it due to the creator's claimed Orthodox Christian beliefs and his explanation of the 'killing of the King' concept.

    https://youtu.be/hrmwKUK3VPE



    Kohberger's Washington state apartment with It's Masonic like 'G'.


    http://139.59.164.119/cars-https-i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/12/30/19/66055879-11585985-image-a-97_1672428627759.jpg

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-u7uhmrVBhao/T3L_5yp8gPI/AAAAAAAAAB4/o3LRUY0kOlU/s320/images.jpeg

    Replies: @S

  455. @Emil Nikola Richard
    Y'all's theology is rubbish.

    This is explained so that a 12-year-old may grok in the Book of Job. God's will is not for us to comprehend. end_of_file

    (They interviewed the National Geographic green eye Afghan girl twenty years after the famous photo. They found her in a refugee camp in Pakistan. Her chance of ever celebrating her 70th birthday is miniscule. She is illiterate. She was asked about the cosmic injustice of her life. I forget the exact wording used by the national geographic journalist. Her answer: "God's will".)

    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2021/11/26/multimedia/26xp-afghangirl-promo/26xp-afghangirl-promo-mediumSquareAt3X.jpg

    Replies: @songbird, @Ivashka the fool, @Talha, @S

    Tangential, but I’m really amused by all these people on twitter posting pics of NZ’s Jacinda Adern in her 20s and then comparing them to her current pics (40s) and saying that she sold her soul and became Gollum.

    [MORE]

    BTW, she has resigned.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @songbird


    ...she sold her soul and became Gollum
     
    She was born that way. It was there 20 years ago: acquisitive, shifty look, toothy, the pretense of seriousness and 'work'...

    These hussies don't actually sell themselves, they are simply always on offer - it is a rolling prostitute life. Why? because they are greedy, scared, too stupid to exist in any other way. What distinguishes them is that they have enough brain cells to function, but none are left for critical thinking. They tend to be very earnest but also lazy. This type has always been selected to front institutions. There was that UK lady as a PM few months ago, a perfect example. Most current 'men in positions of power' are the same. That's the fate of mature societies, Medievial church croaked from the same dissease.

  456. While being in Kenya on photo safari I learned about the crash of Ukrainian helicopter with their interior minister. FYI, in the USSR there were lots of jokes involving Armenian radio. Here is the relevant one. Armenian radio is asked what is the difference between a tragedy and a catastrophe. They answer: we will explain using examples.
    Example one. Your wife has left you. This is a tragedy, but not a catastrophe.
    Example two. A plane with government delegation crashed. This is a catastrophe, but not a tragedy.

    Helicopter crashed killing Ukrainian interior minister, his deputy, and some other officials. Could not have happened to better people. I wish the same to all officials of Kiev regime. Helicopter crashed on a kindergarten, killing and wounding several children. This is bad, the children aren’t guilty of anything

    • Replies: @Jazman
    @AnonfromTN

    Look like interior minister and his gangsters were asking too much money to cover corruption with western weaponry

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @AnonfromTN

    I didn't look into it, but perhaps you could tell me whether Arestovitch resigned prior or after the helicopter crashed.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  457. @songbird
    Surprising to me that single parent homes in Russia are 18%

    If I didn't already know it, I'd be surprised that the US is #1, and not some African country.

    https://twitter.com/monitoringbias/status/1615373378323374080?s=20&t=ua2rqjz9Olw3_iA8hUvPkg

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

    [MORE]

    Born out of Wedlock as percentage of total.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill



    https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/7/2017/11/PF_11.29.17_muslims-update-23.png

    Inna l'fathu qareeb in'sha'Allah !

    Replies: @S

    , @songbird
    @Blinky Bill

    Pretty shocking map. BTW, matches my highly incidental impression of East Germans taking a cynical approach to the system. (not saying that they are necessarily wrong)

    @Beckow
    It is funny when they call her "Jacinda Acorn."

    Wish we had hard data on the sociosexuality of these different pols. Would certainly guess that Jacinda Ardern and Sanna Marin have ridden the ___ carousel. I will spare you hearing me propose certain others.

  458. @Emil Nikola Richard
    Y'all's theology is rubbish.

    This is explained so that a 12-year-old may grok in the Book of Job. God's will is not for us to comprehend. end_of_file

    (They interviewed the National Geographic green eye Afghan girl twenty years after the famous photo. They found her in a refugee camp in Pakistan. Her chance of ever celebrating her 70th birthday is miniscule. She is illiterate. She was asked about the cosmic injustice of her life. I forget the exact wording used by the national geographic journalist. Her answer: "God's will".)

    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2021/11/26/multimedia/26xp-afghangirl-promo/26xp-afghangirl-promo-mediumSquareAt3X.jpg

    Replies: @songbird, @Ivashka the fool, @Talha, @S

    Sigh…

  459. @Blinky Bill
    @songbird


    Born out of Wedlock as percentage of total.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fms_QILXEAIPd8P.jpg

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @songbird

    [MORE]

    Inna l’fathu qareeb in’sha’Allah !

    • LOL: Talha
    • Replies: @S
    @Ivashka the fool

    The wars the Western powers have been fighting in the Middle East and the influx of Moslem settlers and colonists (known by a euphemism as 'migrants') into Western Europe, with the purported 'asylum seekers' acting as a flimsy figleaf, are I believe ultimately temporary, and are simply a means to an end.

    That end being to generate hate (which the 'powers that be' feed off of becoming ever stronger), which is to be the primary motivating factor for Europeans and Moslems to fight each other in WWIII. The goal is the destruction of what remains of organic European and Middle Eastern identities. As part of that it wouldn't at all surprise me if both the Vatican and Mecca have already been targeted for destruction by nuclear missiles.

    Should things get that far, in the vacuum thus created I suppose the elites and hangers on pushing WWIII may have some newly concocted global religion they will introduce along with their new world state, or, 'empire', as they sometimes call it.

  460. @AnonfromTN
    While being in Kenya on photo safari I learned about the crash of Ukrainian helicopter with their interior minister. FYI, in the USSR there were lots of jokes involving Armenian radio. Here is the relevant one. Armenian radio is asked what is the difference between a tragedy and a catastrophe. They answer: we will explain using examples.
    Example one. Your wife has left you. This is a tragedy, but not a catastrophe.
    Example two. A plane with government delegation crashed. This is a catastrophe, but not a tragedy.

    Helicopter crashed killing Ukrainian interior minister, his deputy, and some other officials. Could not have happened to better people. I wish the same to all officials of Kiev regime. Helicopter crashed on a kindergarten, killing and wounding several children. This is bad, the children aren’t guilty of anything

    Replies: @Jazman, @Ivashka the fool

    Look like interior minister and his gangsters were asking too much money to cover corruption with western weaponry

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Jazman

    Yea, he got greedy. Could also have been the money for drug trafficking: Ukraine is the hub of all sorts of criminal activity

  461. Anon[312] • Disclaimer says:

    Inequality is inherent in any individual act of creation. A divinity creating clones of itself has manifested a difference between creator and created, an unequal relationship. The answer to the question of why a divinity would create a universe with inequality is that inequality is required if a creator is to create. To contradict this, we have to posit creation not as the act of a divinity(at least not the sort of divinity people usually imagine), but instead as a kind of force outside of space, time, and usual ideas of causation, such that there is no distinguishing between the creator and his creations. This would contradict Christian theology(not the being outside of time and space part obviously) it seems to me.

    Implicit in your question is the notion that inequality is unjust, or is somehow inferior to equality. Nothing could be further from the truth. Equality simply means the absence of difference. Using again the argument from the previous paragraph, implicit in the argument that equality is just, would be that God’s creation is unjust. The simple conclusion to a Christian(or any other religion with a divine creator and a moralistic view of the universe) is that equality is therefore not just.

    This brings us to the problem of evil. Even though I have argued inequality is not evil, let’s play devil’s advocate and assume that it is. For centuries people(not just Christians) have considered the existence of evil a philosophical problem. I don’t see evil as a philosophical problem, but I am not a Christian. However, even if I were, I would not consider the existence of evil a problem to Christian theology, because Christian morality is [obviously] dualist. Evil is necessary for Christian morality and Christian views on the nature of the universe. That really should end the question for all time as far as I am concerned. If you cannot accept the notion of absolute good and absolute evil, you are not a Christian. Why does evil exist in man’s world according to Christianity? It exists because good and evil are opposing forces embedded in man’s world.

    When people claim evil in the world is inconsistent with an omnipotent and omnibenevolent god, they are not making a logical argument. What these people are actually saying is that *they* can imagine a world that is more just than the one created by God. We presumably cannot experience such a universe, so they are just making an assumption(a hubristic assumption imo). Moreover, such an argument is literally a heresy.

    Usually when a Christian responds to an atheist’s question with words to the effect: “we cannot understand God’s will,” this response is taken to be unsophisticated and unpersuasive. But an atheist will offer a very similar statement when someone asks why the Big Bang happened in the way it did and not some other way. Christianity has a moralistic view of the world. Critics of Christianity use this fact to criticize Christianity. They suggest a more just world wouldn’t have x y z. But their argument is no more logical than saying it would be better if instead of the Big Bang, we had x y z. It is actually the liberal(which is what these people are ultimately, there sorts of arguments have nothing to do with atheism) who is illogical here(and a prig to boot).

    So far this post is addressing the question of inequality and its relation to an omnipotent and omnibenevolent god from a somewhat abstract perspective. Although it’s dubious, nevertheless people always want to insert their own feelings and experiences in to settle the question. Even though there is no logical necessity to do so, I will try to make similar arguments as above, but from a more down to earth perspective addressing the question of omnibenevolence*.

    First, I’ll address equality. If we look at what sort of actions are required to bring about** equality, people would recoil at the notion of this as justice. For the sake of equality of opportunity, only clones would be allowed to be birthed, parents would not be allowed to show attention to their offspring because they would be given better treatment than comparatively disadvantaged children, all acts of self-betterment would be outlawed etc. But even all of these manifestly unjust acts would fail to bring about true equality. Ultimately, the only true equality is nothingness, where dualities of justice/injustice are irrelevant. So not only is equality not just, it is not even desirable. Inequality is necessary.

    Equality is not just. From my perspective, if equality isn’t just, there is no problem with a loving god who creates an unequal universe. But that argument doesn’t seem to resonate with people. The minute someone conjures an image of infants born without limbs and asks why the Christian God would allow this, many will find it emotionally difficult to accept arguments about equality. Here we can address the problem of evil in a different way.

    Let’s assume two ordinary, decent people birth a child. Like any other ordinary people, they love their child, they are after all biologically predisposed to. But let’s suppose that child grows up to be a serial killer. No experience of that child’s has led to this behavior, it is just by nature of the child’s biology that the individual takes pleasure in torturing and killing other beings. Also, the individual in question is highly proficient at what they do, so are a threat to society.

    The parents still love the child, even if horrified by what they do, but decide to best course of action is to let justice take its course. They may even believe the necessary course of action is for their child to be put to death because they are a threat to society. By doing this, they are making their child endure suffering. Are we to believe that the parents in question are carrying out this course of action because of a lack of love? Or do we admit the possibility that the parents can both love their child and recognize the just course of action to remove this menace to society. I would argue we should acknowledge this possibility.

    The divine God who is the final judge of all things will likewise make the correct judgment here, and if one accepts Christian views on morality, no being would be more fit to judge this scenario than an all-loving figure.

    The existence of evil is not a contradiction to the notion of an omnibenevolent god, but in certain moralistic viewpoints, it is actually an argument for the necessity of an omnibenevolent god. If no evil exists, there is no reason whatsoever for an omnibenevolent god. Good and evil can both exist in God’s creations, but this does not mean God equally favors the good and the evil.

    *Humans are not omnipotent, and the closest thing to a down to earth analogy here is simply to suggest that we cannot know the outcome of an alternative possibility unless we experience them, otherwise we are just engaging in fantasy. Fantasy is fine, but it is philosophy.
    **actually just get us closer to equality

  462. Anon[312] • Disclaimer says:
    @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, according to Christian theology this wasn't God's plan at all, to create a world of strife, competition, and inequality.

    It was indeed we who introduced that element, and God will help us eventually get out of our self created predicament, and realize his true intention for the world. (This may be read literally or as deep allegory)

    And perhaps the "proof" of this is the striking - even astonishing if the "standard" story you just adumbrated is true - fact that we are quite simply not happy and fulfilled when we engage in strife and competition and inequality, and we are only truly happy when we cultivate love, compassion, and egolessness.

    Having known so many powerful and wealthy men over extended periods of time from close up - the rage that frequently is thinly disguised just beneath the surface, the intense anxiety, the bouts of depression. This is only invisible from a distance - up close, you see it. And how many famous men have left accounts of their struggle with depression and nihilism and anxiety - and how many more did not discuss it. One of the striking features of the biographies of many famous men who dedicated their life to selfish ego ends is their confession of the sense of meaninglessness - the nihilism - they often felt (although perhaps depression is an acute form of nihilism). Should this not be taken as part of the total scientific picture - as a simple brute fact - about what the true structure of reality is? We don't integrate all the "facts" into our theories.

    One can even analyze it "structurally" - the psychological "structure" of wealth and power seeking (although Silvio doesn't like it when I do this) . What could motivate that but an insatiable craving for security? And what state of mind does that imply?

    Now look at the "standard" theory that you adumbrated. In that theory, we should be happiest and most fulfilled when pursuing selfish ego ends, securing survival, etc . But we're not.

    Look even at your self, with your talk of "genetic lineages", and the need to secure their survival (in this world of illusion moreover) - there is an unmistakable whiff of anxiety and depression and despair in your writings that comes from pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.

    The "Christian" theology actually ends up being more coherent and a better fit for the facts than the hard nosed "scientific" theology which seems to not be able to tell us how to live well.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Anon, @LatW

    And perhaps the “proof” of this is the striking – even astonishing if the “standard” story you just adumbrated is true – fact that we are quite simply not happy and fulfilled when we engage in strife and competition and inequality, and we are only truly happy when we cultivate love, compassion, and egolessness.

    Sportsmen are truly miserable I tell you, none of them get any joy in competition.

  463. @songbird
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Tangential, but I'm really amused by all these people on twitter posting pics of NZ's Jacinda Adern in her 20s and then comparing them to her current pics (40s) and saying that she sold her soul and became Gollum.

    https://twitter.com/thevivafrei/status/1615913588513710081?s=20&t=HlOgWIV-ZDEk54xVpuUOug

    BTW, she has resigned.

    Replies: @Beckow

    …she sold her soul and became Gollum

    She was born that way. It was there 20 years ago: acquisitive, shifty look, toothy, the pretense of seriousness and ‘work’…

    These hussies don’t actually sell themselves, they are simply always on offer – it is a rolling prostitute life. Why? because they are greedy, scared, too stupid to exist in any other way. What distinguishes them is that they have enough brain cells to function, but none are left for critical thinking. They tend to be very earnest but also lazy. This type has always been selected to front institutions. There was that UK lady as a PM few months ago, a perfect example. Most current ‘men in positions of power’ are the same. That’s the fate of mature societies, Medievial church croaked from the same dissease.

  464. @AP
    @Beckow


    "…Life expectancy is dragged down somewhat because the highly segregated Black people keep shooting one another"

    That is statistically irrelevant, do the numbers, the impact is in small fractions of a year.
     
    It's about half a year (77.8) for Euro Americans, above the American national average (77.3). To compare - Croatia is 77.7, Slovakia 76.9, Latvia 75.4, Bulgaria 73.6.

    If you boast that “we are better than Bulgaria!!!” you have already lost.
     
    Euro Americans are also better than Slovaks.

    V4 countries have an issue with smoking-alcohol
     
    Smoking and excessive alcohol are disgusting habits. So is the American vice of overeating, of course.

    but they are fitter, skinnier, live healthier lives than Americans.
     
    American obesity varies by origins also. Euro American obesity rate is closer to European:

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/207436/overweight-and-obesity-rates-for-adults-by-ethnicity/

    It's 31.5%, versus 27.8% for Brits.

    And it varies by region. America is much larger than Europe, you know.

    https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/obesity-rate-by-state

    The people of Colorado are thinner than those of Czechia and Hungary. The people of New England/New York/New Jersey are thinner than those of the UK (and that is without even taking race into account). Also Florida and California.

    Differences exist everywhere, but to do a proper comparison you can’t exclude what doesn’t suit you: Lousiana blacks, big cities, LA cholo reservation, meth-infested Albaquerque, homeless tattoed white kids in Seattle…all of that is America.
     
    America is a huge country. I would have to drive a few hours to get to a region that is bad in the way you describe (small isolated segregated neighborhoods don't count).

    US can’t afford to lose this war
     
    US is spending only 6% of its defense budget on this war. In exchange it is wiping out Russia's military, testing its weapons in the field, and helping its own defense industry. If Russia wins it will be in possession of ruins, with a wrecked economy and military. If Russia loses we will see a rebirth of a sort of PLC and change in Europe that will benefit the USA. Either way, the American position improves.

    Replies: @Beckow

    If Russia wins it will be in possession of ruins, with a wrecked economy and military.

    Not at all. It will have a winning military that would have just won the biggest war since WW2 (that Russia also won), own the most arable, fertile lands in proximity to Europe, huge resources in a thinly populated land, control of Azov and probably Black See…in other words more of what they already have.

    A defeat in Ukraine would have massive consequences for US: the loss of face after the fanatical support for Kiev, fear among allies, but above all the end of any dreams of world dominance and control.

    Loss in Ukraine would change the way US is perceived – given how much rides on the perceptions for US: the value of dollar, ongoing obedience, living standards, culture – Washington needs a continuing perception that US is “Number one in everything!!!”, unbeatable, unchallenged. The loss would continue the unravelling of US global domination. It is definitely not a good thing, that’s why the hysteria among neo-cons.

    If you can get yourself to celebrate that Euro-Americans have a 0.1 longer lives than Slovaks, you must be a pretty sad character. With all the wealth, the best medical care, blabla… 0.1 of a year? Are you serious?

    • Replies: @AP
    @Beckow


    If Russia wins it will be in possession of ruins, with a wrecked economy and military.

    Not at all. It will have a winning military
     
    A decimated one.

    own the most arable, fertile lands in proximity to Europe,
     
    And a wrecked economy.

    Loss in Ukraine would change the way US is perceived
     
    US isn't directly involved. This isn't Vietnam.

    given how much rides on the perceptions for US:
     
    If the stakes are as high as you claim, the US will certainly not allow Ukraine to lose and it has the means to guarantee a Russian loss. I don't think the stakes are nearly as high as you claim for the USA, but let's hope the US leadership believes they are.

    If you can get yourself to celebrate that Euro-Americans have a 0.1 longer lives than Slovaks
     
    Euro Americans live about a year longer than Slovaks.

    With all the wealth, the best medical care, blabla… 0.1 of a year
     
    You rally couldn't help but throw a lie into your post, could you?

    Life expectancy Euro Americans: 77.8
    Life expectancy Slovakia: 76.9

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Beckow

  465. @AnonfromTN
    While being in Kenya on photo safari I learned about the crash of Ukrainian helicopter with their interior minister. FYI, in the USSR there were lots of jokes involving Armenian radio. Here is the relevant one. Armenian radio is asked what is the difference between a tragedy and a catastrophe. They answer: we will explain using examples.
    Example one. Your wife has left you. This is a tragedy, but not a catastrophe.
    Example two. A plane with government delegation crashed. This is a catastrophe, but not a tragedy.

    Helicopter crashed killing Ukrainian interior minister, his deputy, and some other officials. Could not have happened to better people. I wish the same to all officials of Kiev regime. Helicopter crashed on a kindergarten, killing and wounding several children. This is bad, the children aren’t guilty of anything

    Replies: @Jazman, @Ivashka the fool

    I didn’t look into it, but perhaps you could tell me whether Arestovitch resigned prior or after the helicopter crashed.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Ivashka the fool

    I think he resigned before, because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk (told the truth for a change, which is unacceptable in Ukraine). That helo crash was a response to interior minister demand for a cut in money for selling Western weapons sent to Ukraine to third countries and/or in drug trafficking money made by Uki ministry of defence

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @LatW, @sudden death

  466. @Emil Nikola Richard
    Y'all's theology is rubbish.

    This is explained so that a 12-year-old may grok in the Book of Job. God's will is not for us to comprehend. end_of_file

    (They interviewed the National Geographic green eye Afghan girl twenty years after the famous photo. They found her in a refugee camp in Pakistan. Her chance of ever celebrating her 70th birthday is miniscule. She is illiterate. She was asked about the cosmic injustice of her life. I forget the exact wording used by the national geographic journalist. Her answer: "God's will".)

    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2021/11/26/multimedia/26xp-afghangirl-promo/26xp-afghangirl-promo-mediumSquareAt3X.jpg

    Replies: @songbird, @Ivashka the fool, @Talha, @S

    Excellent quote and thanks for the reminder. These are the hidden awliyah of Allah swt. They are content with His Will and Decree and consider the only calamity to befall them is when they fall out of His obedience and earn Divine displeasure. Otherwise, they bear these trials with a sweet patience and only draw closer to Him and are raised in rank with each breath they draw.

    Peace.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Talha



    https://youtu.be/00ginFTRb6M

  467. @A123
    @AP


    He’s very pro-Ukrainian, you sure you want to cite him?
     
    Senseless "Woke Kiev" regime aggression is headed towards being a footnote in history texts. While expensive, it is not very relevant to the lives of ordinary Americans. The whole thing will be largely forgotten in a few years.

    The need to fight Woke authoritarianism will be with America for decades. An eloquent speaker against the madness is an asset. Hopefully, Kisin will remain active in this field after the non-issue of Ukraine returns to the obscurity from whence it came.

     

    @Wokechoke

    Woke Culture has only just started in the UK.
     
    "Started" is probably not the best term.

    Certainly, the Tories have dropped the ball. Woke Labour is coming back to select the next PM. Things are headed the wrong way.

    Populism needs a voice in the UK. The upcoming wipe out of the Conservatives will lead the party to reform. Or, it may permanently collapse, opening the way for a serious replacement.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Senseless “Woke Kiev” regime aggression is headed towards being a footnote in history texts. While expensive, it is not very relevant to the lives of ordinary Americans. The whole thing will be largely forgotten in a few years.

    Once again, you are stunning in your ability to reach new lows in your senseless quest to try and diminish the Ukrainian question.

    Woke Kiev” regime aggression is headed towards being a footnote in history texts.

    Firstly, I continually need to remind you that it is Russia that is the clear aggressor in this war, not Ukraine, something that even a child should be able to figure out. A footnote in history? This is really the telltale marker that your abilities to discern are vastly lacking. After 11 months of war, with both Ukraine and the West and Russia showing no signs of ending this war any time soon, both sides firmly digging in for a long war, you call this a “footnote”? It could all very well end up being the prelude to WWIII.

    Expensive?

    The OECD estimates that the world economy in 2023 will be US$2.8 trillion smaller than was estimated in December 2021, before Russian troops and tanks swarmed into neighbouring Ukraine.
    https://www.aspistrategist.org.au/the-ballooning-costs-of-the-ukraine-war/

    And this is only after 11 months of war. What will the costs be after 24 months, 36 months…48?

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack

    Let me remind you that the war was started in 2014 by Ukraine, which was an aggressor against Donbass

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  468. @Talha
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Excellent quote and thanks for the reminder. These are the hidden awliyah of Allah swt. They are content with His Will and Decree and consider the only calamity to befall them is when they fall out of His obedience and earn Divine displeasure. Otherwise, they bear these trials with a sweet patience and only draw closer to Him and are raised in rank with each breath they draw.

    Peace.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    [MORE]

    • Thanks: Talha
  469. @Blinky Bill
    https://twitter.com/AfricanHub_/status/1579081989231366144?s=20&t=Vh319t42p6a8dWntlOp3Og

    https://twitter.com/ryankakiuchan/status/1615699109452840961?s=20&t=HKaT6BBttwy_X1mqyF_huA

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    A man I know worked in Lybia in the early 80ies. Told me it was mainly positive and that he enjoyed his stay.

    According to him populist strongmen are what suits Arabs best. I tend to agree with him on personal experience grounds. The Berber are somewhat different, but they are a minority nowadays in these lands.

    [MORE]

    The Leader of Al Fateh Revolution… !

    RIP

    • Thanks: Blinky Bill
    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool

    You don't know how disappointed I was after watching this on Netflix.




    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTU8cuNBfu5A2MX-CyPphq0uMpqycHWDcc3nw&usqp.jpg

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    According to him populist strongmen are what suits Arabs best.
     
    Moderate, technocratic monarchies work better on average than other forms of government in the region. Best-run Arab nations today: Jordan, United Arab Emirates, Oman. The Jordanian monarchy in particular stands out as being consistently competent and stable. Oman and United Arab Emirates had 1-2 generations of good governance; but it remains to be seen how they will fair over the long run.

    Worst leaders in the Arab world tend to be populist strongmen: Gaddafi, Nasser and Hussein. Nasser lost the war against Israel, despite possessing the upper-hand, and drove away talented minorities along with their skills and capital. Hussein was a psycho who massacred a lot of Kurds and Iranians and unwisely provoked the Israeli-American neocon regime to invade and dismantle his country. Gaddafi was a babbling nutter who got lucky with his oil reserves.

    To be fair; populist strongmen did also implement positive policies. Nasser extended education to the masses, Hussein encouraged the arts, and Gaddafi maintained order in a tribally fractious land. That said, that they were unwisely deposed by the American Empire doesn’t mean they were good or any way competent. Both Iraq and Libya would’ve likely done better under a Hashemite or Alawite rulership. Egypt too would’ve been less susceptible to the malign influences of Socialism and Islamism had it kept its monarchy.

    Saudi Arabia’s leadership is flawed; but they’ve maintained stability for 70-some years now despite the many predictions of societal collapse and an Islamist takeover. King Faisal of Saudi Arabia was one the greatest 20th century Arab leaders.

    https://youtu.be/qnqjQqFQZJ0

    And Allah knows best.

    Samo Burja on the understated success of Morocco’s monarchy in cultivating exports:

    https://twitter.com/samoburja/status/1615948524079968256?s=61&t=lTXntZi_s6ZU_mUyyKS0WA

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Emil Nikola Richard

  470. @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    A man I know worked in Lybia in the early 80ies. Told me it was mainly positive and that he enjoyed his stay.

    According to him populist strongmen are what suits Arabs best. I tend to agree with him on personal experience grounds. The Berber are somewhat different, but they are a minority nowadays in these lands.



    https://youtu.be/AwuB5WPbRhc

    The Leader of Al Fateh Revolution... !

    RIP

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Yahya

    You don’t know how disappointed I was after watching this on Netflix.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    Certainly not as disappointed as I was when I learned that Gaddafi's son Saadi had dated Ksyusha Sobchak.

    https://www.spb.kp.ru/daily/23304/114752/

  471. @Ivashka the fool
    @AnonfromTN

    I didn't look into it, but perhaps you could tell me whether Arestovitch resigned prior or after the helicopter crashed.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    I think he resigned before, because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk (told the truth for a change, which is unacceptable in Ukraine). That helo crash was a response to interior minister demand for a cut in money for selling Western weapons sent to Ukraine to third countries and/or in drug trafficking money made by Uki ministry of defence

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @AnonfromTN

    Helicopter trips are notoriously dangerous for aspiring politicians, especially of military background.

    http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/ilyanaymushin/77611468/78221/78221_900.jpg

    If I was a politician I would only travel by armored train.

    https://beta.ctvnews.ca/content/dam/ctvnews/images/2019/4/24/1_4392324.jpg

    As the Russian saying goes: travel slowly - you'll go far ! (Тише едешь - дальше будешь).

    , @LatW
    @AnonfromTN


    I think he resigned before, because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk
     
    He apologized and resigned immediately after he had said those things about the rocket on the Feigin show. It's puzzling why he spoke of this, without knowing all the details (he talks so much that it is possible that he simply made a mistake, but even if this were true, it would still be a mistake to talk about it).

    The Ukrainians do not have the capability to match or deter this kind of a missile - it was X22, an old missile, designed to take out large aircraft carriers in open seas. This missile is not intelligent and can strike within a large radius, it is absolutely insane to use it on a residential area (or any ground target). It is a large residential area, they could've hit another house. They dropped a whole ton on a podyezd and smashed the whole podyezd into the ground. RIP.

    Arestovych resigning doesn't mean he'll stop talking. He'll talk more freely now.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Ivashka the fool

    , @sudden death
    @AnonfromTN


    because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk
     
    Regurgitation of RF made propjunk is strongly not recommended, because it is apparent they can't afford to cite or show correctly even those things which may be perverted as being useful to Z purposes.

    Leaving aside the very truthufulness of it or not, what has been said in that live stream by participating Arestovich sounded way different than above citation - UA anti-air rocket shot down flying RF rocket in the air, which then fell on the building and blew up. Bit later he specifically wrote in his social media that without any doubt all responsibility for such situation and victims goes only for attacking side, but not the one which is defending itself from flying rockets by destroying them in the air while flying.

  472. @Mr. Hack
    @A123


    Senseless “Woke Kiev” regime aggression is headed towards being a footnote in history texts. While expensive, it is not very relevant to the lives of ordinary Americans. The whole thing will be largely forgotten in a few years.
     
    Once again, you are stunning in your ability to reach new lows in your senseless quest to try and diminish the Ukrainian question.

    Woke Kiev” regime aggression is headed towards being a footnote in history texts.
     
    Firstly, I continually need to remind you that it is Russia that is the clear aggressor in this war, not Ukraine, something that even a child should be able to figure out. A footnote in history? This is really the telltale marker that your abilities to discern are vastly lacking. After 11 months of war, with both Ukraine and the West and Russia showing no signs of ending this war any time soon, both sides firmly digging in for a long war, you call this a "footnote"? It could all very well end up being the prelude to WWIII.

    Expensive?

    The OECD estimates that the world economy in 2023 will be US$2.8 trillion smaller than was estimated in December 2021, before Russian troops and tanks swarmed into neighbouring Ukraine.
    https://www.aspistrategist.org.au/the-ballooning-costs-of-the-ukraine-war/

    And this is only after 11 months of war. What will the costs be after 24 months, 36 months...48?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Let me remind you that the war was started in 2014 by Ukraine, which was an aggressor against Donbass

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    Let me remind you that Russia first sent in its advisors and rabble rousers to Donbas to organize and first foment the war. Nowhere in the world that I know of, does any country allow a constituent part of its whole to break away with the help of an outside party, no plebiscite being held, and remain completely complacent. Get real Professor.

  473. @Jazman
    @AnonfromTN

    Look like interior minister and his gangsters were asking too much money to cover corruption with western weaponry

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Yea, he got greedy. Could also have been the money for drug trafficking: Ukraine is the hub of all sorts of criminal activity

  474. @AnonfromTN
    @Ivashka the fool

    I think he resigned before, because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk (told the truth for a change, which is unacceptable in Ukraine). That helo crash was a response to interior minister demand for a cut in money for selling Western weapons sent to Ukraine to third countries and/or in drug trafficking money made by Uki ministry of defence

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @LatW, @sudden death

    Helicopter trips are notoriously dangerous for aspiring politicians, especially of military background.

    If I was a politician I would only travel by armored train.

    As the Russian saying goes: travel slowly – you’ll go far ! (Тише едешь – дальше будешь).

  475. @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool

    You don't know how disappointed I was after watching this on Netflix.




    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTU8cuNBfu5A2MX-CyPphq0uMpqycHWDcc3nw&usqp.jpg

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Certainly not as disappointed as I was when I learned that Gaddafi’s son Saadi had dated Ksyusha Sobchak.

    https://www.spb.kp.ru/daily/23304/114752/

    • LOL: Yevardian
  476. @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    A man I know worked in Lybia in the early 80ies. Told me it was mainly positive and that he enjoyed his stay.

    According to him populist strongmen are what suits Arabs best. I tend to agree with him on personal experience grounds. The Berber are somewhat different, but they are a minority nowadays in these lands.



    https://youtu.be/AwuB5WPbRhc

    The Leader of Al Fateh Revolution... !

    RIP

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Yahya

    According to him populist strongmen are what suits Arabs best.

    Moderate, technocratic monarchies work better on average than other forms of government in the region. Best-run Arab nations today: Jordan, United Arab Emirates, Oman. The Jordanian monarchy in particular stands out as being consistently competent and stable. Oman and United Arab Emirates had 1-2 generations of good governance; but it remains to be seen how they will fair over the long run.

    Worst leaders in the Arab world tend to be populist strongmen: Gaddafi, Nasser and Hussein. Nasser lost the war against Israel, despite possessing the upper-hand, and drove away talented minorities along with their skills and capital. Hussein was a psycho who massacred a lot of Kurds and Iranians and unwisely provoked the Israeli-American neocon regime to invade and dismantle his country. Gaddafi was a babbling nutter who got lucky with his oil reserves.

    To be fair; populist strongmen did also implement positive policies. Nasser extended education to the masses, Hussein encouraged the arts, and Gaddafi maintained order in a tribally fractious land. That said, that they were unwisely deposed by the American Empire doesn’t mean they were good or any way competent. Both Iraq and Libya would’ve likely done better under a Hashemite or Alawite rulership. Egypt too would’ve been less susceptible to the malign influences of Socialism and Islamism had it kept its monarchy.

    Saudi Arabia’s leadership is flawed; but they’ve maintained stability for 70-some years now despite the many predictions of societal collapse and an Islamist takeover. King Faisal of Saudi Arabia was one the greatest 20th century Arab leaders.

    And Allah knows best.

    [MORE]

    Samo Burja on the understated success of Morocco’s monarchy in cultivating exports:

    • Agree: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    I agree that Moroccans are today doing better on development level than their Algerian neighbors and rivals who had a head start after the independence, but were harmed by their bloody islamist insurrection / civil war in the 90ies.

    I should have kept strongmen, but shouldn't have mentioned populists. I include Arab kings among the strongmen, if they're weak they won't last long. Think of Hassan II of Morocco, he was absolutely ruthless and Moroccans bowed, kissed his hand and called him Mowlay (Master).

    An Algerian friend once told me that they had two great politicians: the idealistic Ben Bella (a friend of Che Guevara) and the ruthless Boumediene who led a military coup against Ben Bella. Despite Ben Bella being a very decent man with high aspirations for popular democracy, it is Boumediene the dictator that Algerians remember and regret to this very day.

    Arabs are unfit for democracy, at least they were unfit when I lived in France, visited Maghreb and personally knew some of them. They candidly admitted this as a matter of fact situation. Perhaps your generation would one day prove me wrong.

    And God guides whom ever He pleases.

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    What kind of a Polish person do you estimate this to be?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJk1f2foV1U&ab_channel=AeonByteGnosticRadio

    Replies: @Yahya

  477. @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Yes, I'm just not sure that ethnic nationalism - at least if it's very attached and passionate, as yours is - is compatible with spirituality. From a Buddhist (and Christian) perspective it's clearly a source of attachment and suffering, so I was just surprised that you claim to be Buddhist but also a very passionate ethnic nationalist.

    The last time you posted under Bashibuzuk, you did not manifest the liberated joy of transcendent spirituality but a very dark, despairing, depressed view, which I thought was connected to your deep attachment to ethnic nationalism, which is a form of sublimated ego - and clinging to anything in this world, particularly ego, predictably results in suffering.

    (I'm not against a sort of lighthearted allegiance to country and race as contingent circumstances, but your ethnic nationalism is clearly essentialist and salvific, which I don't think can remotely be justified in terms of Buddhism (or Christianity, not that you're Christian))

    Of course, unenlightened creatures that we are, we often cannot help but cling to what is poison for us, myself included, and cannot free ourselves from thought-forms that do us no good.

    You are free to be an ethnic nationalist and I have no desire to stop you - but I am free to discuss it as it relates to Buddhism and suffering.


    As a Russian saying goes, some character traits cannot be healed, but you might be less categorical in your affirmations.
     
    Fair enough, but that's just you taking sides. AP was equally if not more categorical and full of himself - is that then the Jew in him?

    One classic way to undermine an opponent is to guilt him for being self-confident and assertive while ignoring or even encouraging the exact same qualities in the side you support.

    And you, by the way, are not exactly a shrinking violet :) How about we all just call it like we see it without trying to guilt each other for being straightforward? Maybe we can even appreciate each other for telling it - like we respectively think - it is.

    The theory of art I'm advancing with regard to Bach is one that will obviously be deeply offensive to ethnic nationalists who desire national consensus and bland uniformity - but the layers and tensions that compose a human collective are far more fruitful, creative, and fascinating.

    Not did I merely make categorical statements - I provided detailed arguments and logic. But again, you don't like it so you have to discredit :)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @AP

    which I thought was connected to your deep attachment to ethnic nationalism

    I used to be an ethnic nationalist and I was happier when I was. Now all I have is my hatred for white liberals and even that isn’t nearly as fun as it used to be.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @Greasy William

    Ahh, that's because you replaced one attachment with another, hate being inverse ethno-nationalism :)

  478. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    According to him populist strongmen are what suits Arabs best.
     
    Moderate, technocratic monarchies work better on average than other forms of government in the region. Best-run Arab nations today: Jordan, United Arab Emirates, Oman. The Jordanian monarchy in particular stands out as being consistently competent and stable. Oman and United Arab Emirates had 1-2 generations of good governance; but it remains to be seen how they will fair over the long run.

    Worst leaders in the Arab world tend to be populist strongmen: Gaddafi, Nasser and Hussein. Nasser lost the war against Israel, despite possessing the upper-hand, and drove away talented minorities along with their skills and capital. Hussein was a psycho who massacred a lot of Kurds and Iranians and unwisely provoked the Israeli-American neocon regime to invade and dismantle his country. Gaddafi was a babbling nutter who got lucky with his oil reserves.

    To be fair; populist strongmen did also implement positive policies. Nasser extended education to the masses, Hussein encouraged the arts, and Gaddafi maintained order in a tribally fractious land. That said, that they were unwisely deposed by the American Empire doesn’t mean they were good or any way competent. Both Iraq and Libya would’ve likely done better under a Hashemite or Alawite rulership. Egypt too would’ve been less susceptible to the malign influences of Socialism and Islamism had it kept its monarchy.

    Saudi Arabia’s leadership is flawed; but they’ve maintained stability for 70-some years now despite the many predictions of societal collapse and an Islamist takeover. King Faisal of Saudi Arabia was one the greatest 20th century Arab leaders.

    https://youtu.be/qnqjQqFQZJ0

    And Allah knows best.

    Samo Burja on the understated success of Morocco’s monarchy in cultivating exports:

    https://twitter.com/samoburja/status/1615948524079968256?s=61&t=lTXntZi_s6ZU_mUyyKS0WA

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Emil Nikola Richard

    I agree that Moroccans are today doing better on development level than their Algerian neighbors and rivals who had a head start after the independence, but were harmed by their bloody islamist insurrection / civil war in the 90ies.

    I should have kept strongmen, but shouldn’t have mentioned populists. I include Arab kings among the strongmen, if they’re weak they won’t last long. Think of Hassan II of Morocco, he was absolutely ruthless and Moroccans bowed, kissed his hand and called him Mowlay (Master).

    An Algerian friend once told me that they had two great politicians: the idealistic Ben Bella (a friend of Che Guevara) and the ruthless Boumediene who led a military coup against Ben Bella. Despite Ben Bella being a very decent man with high aspirations for popular democracy, it is Boumediene the dictator that Algerians remember and regret to this very day.

    Arabs are unfit for democracy, at least they were unfit when I lived in France, visited Maghreb and personally knew some of them. They candidly admitted this as a matter of fact situation. Perhaps your generation would one day prove me wrong.

    And God guides whom ever He pleases.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    An Algerian friend once told me that they had two great politicians:
     
    Three: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emir_Abdelkader

    A man of great humanity and integrity.


    I should have kept strongmen, but shouldn’t have mentioned populists. I include Arab kings among the strongmen, if they’re weak they won’t last long.
     
    The history of political leadership in the Arab world is rather similar to many regions around the world; mostly mediocrities, a fair number of ghastly characters and very rarely, an honest and intelligent leader. The proportion of ghastly characters is slightly more than Western democracies due to a lack of checks and balances and few restraints on arbitrary power. On the other hand, the high degree of concentration in power has allowed a few competent leaders to single-handedly drag their nations to modernity, and in some cases to maximize their potential given human capital constraints.

    Ten examples of such excellent Arab heads of state:

    1) Foud Chehab (strongman)
    2) Muhammad Ali Pasha (monarch)
    3) Hamid Bourghiba (strongman)
    4) Sultan Qabboos (monarch)
    5) Zahir al-Umar (strongman)
    6) Sheikh Mohamad bin Rashid (monarch)
    7) King Faisal of Iraq (monarch)
    8) King Abdullah I of Jordan (monarch)
    9) King Faisal of Saudi Arabia (monarch)
    10) Fakhr El-Din (monarch)

    As you can see, they were disproportionately of the royal bent; and two of the three enlightened strongmen, Fouad Chehab and Zahir Al-Umar, were drawn from the old Levantine ruling elite. Only Hamid Bourghiba was born to a poor family of no particular noble lineage. Ironically his Kemalist ideology of female emancipation and staunch secularism would probably put him as most far removed ideologically from the general populace. But overall; none of the great Arab leaders were populist panderers to Boobus Arabicus, to borrow a phrase from H.L. Mencken. And only Fouad Chehab had to contend with appealing to the median voter to gain support for his initiatives; the rest were free from popular constraints.

    The great benefit of the monarchial system; other than not having to pander to popular opinion; is the moderation and technocratic bent of nearly all monarchs. Especially in the 20th century Arab world; the monarchs tended to be uniformly hostile to Islamism and Communism. In the present day you can also observe that otherwise intellectually mediocre monarchs like the ones found in UAE, Jordan and Morocco can steer the ship of state fairly competently by appointing capable technocrats and delegating authority downwards. In Saudi Arabia the cabinet is usually filled with PhD's and graduates of American Ivy Leagues.

    The monarch, aided by his high upbringing, is also more likely to cultivate an elevated taste and impart the refinement onto the nation at large, to great aesthetic benefit. This was true of a monarchs such as Louis XIV of France and Frederick The Great of Prussia. In the Middle East, Sultan Qaboos and Mohammad Reza Shah of Iran were keen on encouraging high-culture activities in their nations.

    The monarchal system however does encounter the perennial threat of the Bad Emperor; though in my view the threat of ghastly kings has greatly reduced in the era of globalization and international pressure. Dictators like Saddam or Gaddafi would more likely be immune from outside pressure due to popular appeal; thus more susceptible to violating human rights. Kings have their exalted reputations to maintain; notice how MBS for example back-tracked and cowered in fear of international opinion after the Khashoggi debacle. Conversely, the non-monarchal Gaddafi and Saddam continued with their madness to the very end.


    Arabs are unfit for democracy,
     
    The question of "fit" or "unfit" imo should be rephrased to "what works best under the circumstances". Lebanon is a democracy and was the most prosperous non-oil Arab state for much of the 20th and 21st century. Conversely, Egypt was authoritarian and lagged Lebanon in nearly all indicators. One could've looked at these data points and concluded that Egypt should've adopted democracy to become more like Lebanon. But the cultural differences would've lead to a different outcome. Lebanon was primed for democracy by the Jesuit educational influence which infused Western values into the Lebanese polity and allowed for compatibility with the democratic system. Egypt had no such cultural conditioning thus did not value critical ingredients such as freedom of expression and protection of minority rights; making it more prone to demagoguery and a descent to majoritarian oppression.

    Whether one polity is fit or unfit for democracy has as much to do with culture as genetics. It took a long time for democracy to develop in Western Europe. The universal-franchise Western democracy of today would be a mystery to a Englishman living in the 18th century. Even then the concept of protection of minority rights was somewhat shaky; the Gordon Riots of 1780 were a popular backlash to the Papist Reforms which eased discrimination laws against Catholics in Great Britain and Ireland.

    In theory, the conditions necessary for a functioning democracy could develop over time in the Arab world. But the present situation makes a monarchal system preferable. Cicero contends that the ideal form of government is a combination of monarchy, democracy, and aristocracy. I would tend to agree with him in a general sense; only that sometimes the circumstances make only one system preferable.

    But ultimately, I think the discerning George C. Lewis was right: the quality of the people matters more than the system of government.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Ivashka the fool

  479. Nasser lost the war against Israel, despite possessing the upper-hand

    Nasser definitely did not have the upper hand. His army was in no shape to fight a conventional war and he knew it. Events just got away from him. It happens

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Greasy William


    Nasser definitely did not have the upper hand. His army was in no shape to fight a conventional war and he knew it.
     
    You’re right actually. Egypt’s 150-180K strong army was outnumbered by Israel’s 250K troops. Egypt’s military also suffered from poor training, low mechanization, and a politicized command echelon. Moreover, its ammunition was depleted from the war in Yemen. But the biggest disadvantage Egypt had during the war was simply a lack of motivation; Egyptian troops were fighting on behalf of Palestinians; whereas Israelis were fighting for their themselves.

    Events just got away from him.
     
    He fanned the flames of war though and was first to strike; so he deserves blame for going unprepared.
  480. @Greasy William

    Nasser lost the war against Israel, despite possessing the upper-hand
     
    Nasser definitely did not have the upper hand. His army was in no shape to fight a conventional war and he knew it. Events just got away from him. It happens

    Replies: @Yahya

    Nasser definitely did not have the upper hand. His army was in no shape to fight a conventional war and he knew it.

    You’re right actually. Egypt’s 150-180K strong army was outnumbered by Israel’s 250K troops. Egypt’s military also suffered from poor training, low mechanization, and a politicized command echelon. Moreover, its ammunition was depleted from the war in Yemen. But the biggest disadvantage Egypt had during the war was simply a lack of motivation; Egyptian troops were fighting on behalf of Palestinians; whereas Israelis were fighting for their themselves.

    Events just got away from him.

    He fanned the flames of war though and was first to strike; so he deserves blame for going unprepared.

  481. @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack

    Let me remind you that the war was started in 2014 by Ukraine, which was an aggressor against Donbass

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Let me remind you that Russia first sent in its advisors and rabble rousers to Donbas to organize and first foment the war. Nowhere in the world that I know of, does any country allow a constituent part of its whole to break away with the help of an outside party, no plebiscite being held, and remain completely complacent. Get real Professor.

  482. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    According to him populist strongmen are what suits Arabs best.
     
    Moderate, technocratic monarchies work better on average than other forms of government in the region. Best-run Arab nations today: Jordan, United Arab Emirates, Oman. The Jordanian monarchy in particular stands out as being consistently competent and stable. Oman and United Arab Emirates had 1-2 generations of good governance; but it remains to be seen how they will fair over the long run.

    Worst leaders in the Arab world tend to be populist strongmen: Gaddafi, Nasser and Hussein. Nasser lost the war against Israel, despite possessing the upper-hand, and drove away talented minorities along with their skills and capital. Hussein was a psycho who massacred a lot of Kurds and Iranians and unwisely provoked the Israeli-American neocon regime to invade and dismantle his country. Gaddafi was a babbling nutter who got lucky with his oil reserves.

    To be fair; populist strongmen did also implement positive policies. Nasser extended education to the masses, Hussein encouraged the arts, and Gaddafi maintained order in a tribally fractious land. That said, that they were unwisely deposed by the American Empire doesn’t mean they were good or any way competent. Both Iraq and Libya would’ve likely done better under a Hashemite or Alawite rulership. Egypt too would’ve been less susceptible to the malign influences of Socialism and Islamism had it kept its monarchy.

    Saudi Arabia’s leadership is flawed; but they’ve maintained stability for 70-some years now despite the many predictions of societal collapse and an Islamist takeover. King Faisal of Saudi Arabia was one the greatest 20th century Arab leaders.

    https://youtu.be/qnqjQqFQZJ0

    And Allah knows best.

    Samo Burja on the understated success of Morocco’s monarchy in cultivating exports:

    https://twitter.com/samoburja/status/1615948524079968256?s=61&t=lTXntZi_s6ZU_mUyyKS0WA

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Emil Nikola Richard

    What kind of a Polish person do you estimate this to be?

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    What kind of a Polish person do you estimate this to be?
     
    That kind that escaped extermination by Hitler.
  483. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    What kind of a Polish person do you estimate this to be?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJk1f2foV1U&ab_channel=AeonByteGnosticRadio

    Replies: @Yahya

    What kind of a Polish person do you estimate this to be?

    That kind that escaped extermination by Hitler.

  484. @Blinky Bill
    @songbird


    Born out of Wedlock as percentage of total.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fms_QILXEAIPd8P.jpg

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @songbird

    Pretty shocking map. BTW, matches my highly incidental impression of East Germans taking a cynical approach to the system. (not saying that they are necessarily wrong)


    It is funny when they call her “Jacinda Acorn.”

    Wish we had hard data on the sociosexuality of these different pols. Would certainly guess that Jacinda Ardern and Sanna Marin have ridden the ___ carousel. I will spare you hearing me propose certain others.

  485. Should each country has its own “IQ clock”, to bring attention to dysgenics?

    Helmuth Nyborg says that IQ is “decreasing every day.” Put enough decimal places on it and you could represent it.

  486. @AnonfromTN
    @Ivashka the fool

    I think he resigned before, because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk (told the truth for a change, which is unacceptable in Ukraine). That helo crash was a response to interior minister demand for a cut in money for selling Western weapons sent to Ukraine to third countries and/or in drug trafficking money made by Uki ministry of defence

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @LatW, @sudden death

    I think he resigned before, because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk

    He apologized and resigned immediately after he had said those things about the rocket on the Feigin show. It’s puzzling why he spoke of this, without knowing all the details (he talks so much that it is possible that he simply made a mistake, but even if this were true, it would still be a mistake to talk about it).

    The Ukrainians do not have the capability to match or deter this kind of a missile – it was X22, an old missile, designed to take out large aircraft carriers in open seas. This missile is not intelligent and can strike within a large radius, it is absolutely insane to use it on a residential area (or any ground target). It is a large residential area, they could’ve hit another house. They dropped a whole ton on a podyezd and smashed the whole podyezd into the ground. RIP.

    Arestovych resigning doesn’t mean he’ll stop talking. He’ll talk more freely now.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @LatW


    It’s puzzling why he spoke of this, without knowing all the details
     
    Because he's a loudmouth moron
    , @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    Arestovych (or is it Arestovitch?) is a very intelligent and charismatic man. He has spoken in defense of the Russian language and culture in Ukraine from the excessive tribalism that is understandably demonstrated by some Ukrainian nationalists. It is the sensible thing to do. Russian speakers would self-identify as Ukrainians more than before the war, but they will not disappear. Moreover, Russians who would look for an Eastern Slav country that is organized along European values, will look to Ukraine when the war is over. If they see only hate and ressentment this would turn them off and push them in the embrace of Prigozhin (who is a Jew) and the like.

    Arestovitch has clearly shown that he is an able politician and I think that he is already preparing his future. I don't think he made a mistake when he talked about the anti- aerial defense rocket in Dnepropetrovsk, these things have happened before and will happen again in the future, war brings a lot of suffering to civilians, some of it might be due to friendly fire. I think he knew what he was doing when he talked to Feigin and I believe the same about his resignation. BTW the man is supposedly a bisexual, which is in line with the current Davos consensus. If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.

    Replies: @LatW, @A123

  487. @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, according to Christian theology this wasn't God's plan at all, to create a world of strife, competition, and inequality.

    It was indeed we who introduced that element, and God will help us eventually get out of our self created predicament, and realize his true intention for the world. (This may be read literally or as deep allegory)

    And perhaps the "proof" of this is the striking - even astonishing if the "standard" story you just adumbrated is true - fact that we are quite simply not happy and fulfilled when we engage in strife and competition and inequality, and we are only truly happy when we cultivate love, compassion, and egolessness.

    Having known so many powerful and wealthy men over extended periods of time from close up - the rage that frequently is thinly disguised just beneath the surface, the intense anxiety, the bouts of depression. This is only invisible from a distance - up close, you see it. And how many famous men have left accounts of their struggle with depression and nihilism and anxiety - and how many more did not discuss it. One of the striking features of the biographies of many famous men who dedicated their life to selfish ego ends is their confession of the sense of meaninglessness - the nihilism - they often felt (although perhaps depression is an acute form of nihilism). Should this not be taken as part of the total scientific picture - as a simple brute fact - about what the true structure of reality is? We don't integrate all the "facts" into our theories.

    One can even analyze it "structurally" - the psychological "structure" of wealth and power seeking (although Silvio doesn't like it when I do this) . What could motivate that but an insatiable craving for security? And what state of mind does that imply?

    Now look at the "standard" theory that you adumbrated. In that theory, we should be happiest and most fulfilled when pursuing selfish ego ends, securing survival, etc . But we're not.

    Look even at your self, with your talk of "genetic lineages", and the need to secure their survival (in this world of illusion moreover) - there is an unmistakable whiff of anxiety and depression and despair in your writings that comes from pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.

    The "Christian" theology actually ends up being more coherent and a better fit for the facts than the hard nosed "scientific" theology which seems to not be able to tell us how to live well.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Anon, @LatW

    with your talk of “genetic lineages”, and the need to secure their survival [..] pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.

    The desire to preserve the “genetic lineages” resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego. You cannot blame a flower for wanting to receive water and sunlight and to grow.

    • Agree: Ivashka the fool, S, songbird
    • Replies: @AaronB
    @LatW

    I'm not blaming anyone.

    All I'm saying is that according to Buddhism, the more we cling to ego, and the more we cling to outward form, the more we suffer. And Bashi claimed to be a Buddhist, so I wasn't sure how he squared that with his very passionate ethno-nationalism.

    But I also understand that people are complicated and full of layers and contradictions, and that's ok.

    In terms of growing, according to how I understand spirituality, it is insight into the paradox that in order to flourish we must not cling to life - as Jesus said, give up your life in order to live.

    I don't mean, that one should not have a natural human affection for hearth and home, the place of ones birth and it's customs and landscape and ways, and the people there - that is healthy, although according to Buddhism even this should not be too strong.

    But Bashi, I think, looks to ethno-nationalism as a form of salvation - and that is to be attached to an illusion and court suffering, according to Buddhism. Which again, is of course his right, and things are complicated.

    For myself, I dabbled in ethno-nationalism, and it made me an angrier, more defensive person constantly seeing insults to my group - I'm glad I'm no longer attached to that particular illusion, although I retain a certain fondness for scenes of my childhood. I'm also perhaps weird - at least here - in that I just can't seem to dislike people of other races.

    But as I said somewhere else, we're all on a different karmic journey, with different spiritual lessons to learn - so what's appropriate for one, is not for another.

    , @Talha
    @LatW

    The interesting thing about children is that it is in our primordial and innate nature to want them to perpetuate ourselves in both a material sense as well as a spiritual sense. The material sense needs no explanation, it is the same desire that a wolf or cat or elephant have. But, raising children with efforts to make them righteous and pious takes effort, but that effort results in one's children, the seeds one has sown and tilled, becoming a spiritual crop that one harvests in the next life:
    “When the human being dies, his deeds end except for three: ongoing charity [like a well he dug that people benefit from after he passed], beneficial knowledge [like a cure for a disease that humans continue to benefit from], or a righteous child who prays for him.”- reported in Muslim

    Peace.

    For the average person throughout history, #3 is the most likely. Every day I read a portion of the Qur'an and ask that its rewards be accrued to my parents and their parents going back up my family tree. They prayed and struggled so that I could be here and the least I can do is perpetuate their accrual of rewards for good deeds even when they have no more ability to do so themselves. I sat down my children and told them that prayers for me is the least they can do for the sacrifices their mother and I have made for them. And it is my hope they will perpetuate this in my future generations until the end of the world. There need not be a contradiction in one perpetuating one's lineage for both worldly and spiritual aims...in fact the two are inextricably linked together.

    , @Yahya
    @LatW


    The desire to preserve the “genetic lineages” resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego.
     
    Actually only a tiny (probably <1%) percentage of the population cares about genetic lineage. Most people are too short-minded to think from a long-term perspective. Notice how literally zero politicians running for office ever mention "genetic lineage" or euphemistic alternatives to appeal to voters. It's always "jobs" and "housing" etc.

    Greg Cochran mentioned that race is a weak unit for people to band together around. He used the ancient Middle Easterners lack of unity at the face of Greek conquests as an example of weak racial bonds. The denizens of Unzistan are atypical in being concerned with the preservation of genetic lineages on a racial level.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Talha, @LatW

    , @S
    @LatW

    One of the biggest unaddressed divides within humanity is the one between those who accept the organic whole that both nature and nurture are of a roughly equal importance, and those who think nurture by itself is almost everything, and that physically people are more or less interchangeable, or, fungible.

    It doesn't have to be either/or as the world is a big place with abundant resources.

    What should of been arranged long ago between the two groups is an amicable parting of the ways.

    Of course, if someone is totalitarian and wants total world power for themselves, such an arrangement might not be possible.

  488. @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill



    https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/7/2017/11/PF_11.29.17_muslims-update-23.png

    Inna l'fathu qareeb in'sha'Allah !

    Replies: @S

    The wars the Western powers have been fighting in the Middle East and the influx of Moslem settlers and colonists (known by a euphemism as ‘migrants’) into Western Europe, with the purported ‘asylum seekers’ acting as a flimsy figleaf, are I believe ultimately temporary, and are simply a means to an end.

    That end being to generate hate (which the ‘powers that be’ feed off of becoming ever stronger), which is to be the primary motivating factor for Europeans and Moslems to fight each other in WWIII. The goal is the destruction of what remains of organic European and Middle Eastern identities. As part of that it wouldn’t at all surprise me if both the Vatican and Mecca have already been targeted for destruction by nuclear missiles.

    Should things get that far, in the vacuum thus created I suppose the elites and hangers on pushing WWIII may have some newly concocted global religion they will introduce along with their new world state, or, ’empire’, as they sometimes call it.

  489. @LatW
    @AnonfromTN


    I think he resigned before, because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk
     
    He apologized and resigned immediately after he had said those things about the rocket on the Feigin show. It's puzzling why he spoke of this, without knowing all the details (he talks so much that it is possible that he simply made a mistake, but even if this were true, it would still be a mistake to talk about it).

    The Ukrainians do not have the capability to match or deter this kind of a missile - it was X22, an old missile, designed to take out large aircraft carriers in open seas. This missile is not intelligent and can strike within a large radius, it is absolutely insane to use it on a residential area (or any ground target). It is a large residential area, they could've hit another house. They dropped a whole ton on a podyezd and smashed the whole podyezd into the ground. RIP.

    Arestovych resigning doesn't mean he'll stop talking. He'll talk more freely now.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Ivashka the fool

    It’s puzzling why he spoke of this, without knowing all the details

    Because he’s a loudmouth moron

  490. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @LatW
    @AaronB


    with your talk of “genetic lineages”, and the need to secure their survival [..] pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.
     
    The desire to preserve the "genetic lineages" resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego. You cannot blame a flower for wanting to receive water and sunlight and to grow.

    Replies: @AaronB, @Talha, @Yahya, @S

    I’m not blaming anyone.

    All I’m saying is that according to Buddhism, the more we cling to ego, and the more we cling to outward form, the more we suffer. And Bashi claimed to be a Buddhist, so I wasn’t sure how he squared that with his very passionate ethno-nationalism.

    But I also understand that people are complicated and full of layers and contradictions, and that’s ok.

    In terms of growing, according to how I understand spirituality, it is insight into the paradox that in order to flourish we must not cling to life – as Jesus said, give up your life in order to live.

    I don’t mean, that one should not have a natural human affection for hearth and home, the place of ones birth and it’s customs and landscape and ways, and the people there – that is healthy, although according to Buddhism even this should not be too strong.

    But Bashi, I think, looks to ethno-nationalism as a form of salvation – and that is to be attached to an illusion and court suffering, according to Buddhism. Which again, is of course his right, and things are complicated.

    For myself, I dabbled in ethno-nationalism, and it made me an angrier, more defensive person constantly seeing insults to my group – I’m glad I’m no longer attached to that particular illusion, although I retain a certain fondness for scenes of my childhood. I’m also perhaps weird – at least here – in that I just can’t seem to dislike people of other races.

    But as I said somewhere else, we’re all on a different karmic journey, with different spiritual lessons to learn – so what’s appropriate for one, is not for another.

  491. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @Greasy William
    @AaronB


    which I thought was connected to your deep attachment to ethnic nationalism
     
    I used to be an ethnic nationalist and I was happier when I was. Now all I have is my hatred for white liberals and even that isn't nearly as fun as it used to be.

    Replies: @AaronB

    Ahh, that’s because you replaced one attachment with another, hate being inverse ethno-nationalism 🙂

  492. @LatW
    @AaronB


    with your talk of “genetic lineages”, and the need to secure their survival [..] pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.
     
    The desire to preserve the "genetic lineages" resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego. You cannot blame a flower for wanting to receive water and sunlight and to grow.

    Replies: @AaronB, @Talha, @Yahya, @S

    The interesting thing about children is that it is in our primordial and innate nature to want them to perpetuate ourselves in both a material sense as well as a spiritual sense. The material sense needs no explanation, it is the same desire that a wolf or cat or elephant have. But, raising children with efforts to make them righteous and pious takes effort, but that effort results in one’s children, the seeds one has sown and tilled, becoming a spiritual crop that one harvests in the next life:
    “When the human being dies, his deeds end except for three: ongoing charity [like a well he dug that people benefit from after he passed], beneficial knowledge [like a cure for a disease that humans continue to benefit from], or a righteous child who prays for him.”- reported in Muslim

    Peace.

    [MORE]

    For the average person throughout history, #3 is the most likely. Every day I read a portion of the Qur’an and ask that its rewards be accrued to my parents and their parents going back up my family tree. They prayed and struggled so that I could be here and the least I can do is perpetuate their accrual of rewards for good deeds even when they have no more ability to do so themselves. I sat down my children and told them that prayers for me is the least they can do for the sacrifices their mother and I have made for them. And it is my hope they will perpetuate this in my future generations until the end of the world. There need not be a contradiction in one perpetuating one’s lineage for both worldly and spiritual aims…in fact the two are inextricably linked together.

  493. @Beckow
    @AP


    If Russia wins it will be in possession of ruins, with a wrecked economy and military.
     
    Not at all. It will have a winning military that would have just won the biggest war since WW2 (that Russia also won), own the most arable, fertile lands in proximity to Europe, huge resources in a thinly populated land, control of Azov and probably Black See...in other words more of what they already have.

    A defeat in Ukraine would have massive consequences for US: the loss of face after the fanatical support for Kiev, fear among allies, but above all the end of any dreams of world dominance and control.

    Loss in Ukraine would change the way US is perceived - given how much rides on the perceptions for US: the value of dollar, ongoing obedience, living standards, culture - Washington needs a continuing perception that US is "Number one in everything!!!", unbeatable, unchallenged. The loss would continue the unravelling of US global domination. It is definitely not a good thing, that's why the hysteria among neo-cons.

    If you can get yourself to celebrate that Euro-Americans have a 0.1 longer lives than Slovaks, you must be a pretty sad character. With all the wealth, the best medical care, blabla... 0.1 of a year? Are you serious?

    Replies: @AP

    If Russia wins it will be in possession of ruins, with a wrecked economy and military.

    Not at all. It will have a winning military

    A decimated one.

    own the most arable, fertile lands in proximity to Europe,

    And a wrecked economy.

    Loss in Ukraine would change the way US is perceived

    US isn’t directly involved. This isn’t Vietnam.

    given how much rides on the perceptions for US:

    If the stakes are as high as you claim, the US will certainly not allow Ukraine to lose and it has the means to guarantee a Russian loss. I don’t think the stakes are nearly as high as you claim for the USA, but let’s hope the US leadership believes they are.

    If you can get yourself to celebrate that Euro-Americans have a 0.1 longer lives than Slovaks

    Euro Americans live about a year longer than Slovaks.

    With all the wealth, the best medical care, blabla… 0.1 of a year

    You rally couldn’t help but throw a lie into your post, could you?

    Life expectancy Euro Americans: 77.8
    Life expectancy Slovakia: 76.9

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @AP


    A decimated one.
     
    The Russian military is stronger now than when the war began. When this war ends, it will be stronger still. Although military strength really isn't so important, the late Soviet military may have been the strongest in the world in some respects and the empire still collapsed.

    And a wrecked economy.
     
    Er, a stagnant economy. But Russia's economy was already stagnant before the war. The Russian economy is explicitly built for stability at the expense of growth. It's a strange model and it comes with a host of its own problems, but it suits Russia's purposes. Russia is increasingly returning both politically and economically to the late Tsarist era.

    US isn’t directly involved. This isn’t Vietnam.
     
    Oh stop. This war is basically the Ukrainians do the dying but the US does the paying. If Ukraine loses, no country will ever again be able to depend on US protection.

    If the stakes are as high as you claim, the US will certainly not allow Ukraine to lose and it has the means to guarantee a Russian loss
     
    Does it though? Or have internal political divisions within the US now too severely inhibited its ability to effectively fight for what the US leadership regards as its interests?

    And what can the US even do? No amount of money and weapons is going to defeat Russia. Ultimately, stopping Russia means the United States providing at least some level of air support to the Ukrainians. There is no other way to drive the Russians out of the country and such an eventuality may prove necessary merely to prevent Russia from conquering Ukraine entirely.

    If that is what is required, what will the US do so? I think it will at least threaten to do so in the case of a Ukrainian military collapse but to actually liberate conquered Ukrainian territory? No, I don't think so.
    , @Beckow
    @AP

    I am not sure what you mean by 'devastated' or 'decimated'. Wars are destructive, you can say the same about any war from Napoleon to US in Iraq-Afghanistan. They have casualties and costs. Why would that make any difference to owning the greatest piece of chernozem land and in having a winning army? It is again your sad sour grapes that you escape to when you lose.

    US is involved in an almost existential way and they are trying to drag Europeans into it - look at the gment-media-culture hysteria. If you think that after a loss in Ukraine they will be able to simply walk away from it you don't understand human nature or how history works.


    US will certainly not allow Ukraine to lose and it has the means to guarantee a Russian loss
     
    Does it? So where are those means? No Nato soldiers will go to fight (maybe the Polish fools, they can never resist a suicide mission), the arms won't make much difference, and using nukes would be an overkill (for who controls Bakhmut?)... so what are the means? The most likely scenario is Russia grinding down Ukie army, taking what it wants or thinks it can control, and the West pretending that there was a "comprehensive deal" - that nobody won or lost, let's move on...

    The terms like "comprehensive settlement" are already popping up (Macron...), that is a sure sign that Washington is looking for an exit. Given the insane projection the Western propaganda does we can easily see what they are thinking by what they say that Russia is doing...it is another sign of their complete mental bankruptcy. So they will settle, Russia will effectively win, and the real losers will by the Ukies...how is any of this good for them?

    Replies: @A123

  494. @Ivashka the fool
    @AaronB

    I am not taking sides in your debate with AP at all. I think both you and AP were right in your own manner. It's just that I happen to see our Lord's message similar to the way you and Dmitry see it. But then I am no Christian, so my opinions don't really matter. BTW you're not a Christian either, so perhaps discussing and debating something more related to your spiritual identity would be more appropriate.

    And yeah, your hiking stories and your descriptions of nature are always very interesting and I would say uplifting. Waiting to read more about it.

    Replies: @AaronB, @AP

    I think both you and AP were right in your own manner. It’s just that I happen to see our Lord’s message similar to the way you and Dmitry see it

    So three non-Christians interpret Christianity in a way that opposes what actual Christians believe.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @AP

    Yeah, I know it might look a bit distasteful. That's why my first comment was to point to Dmitry and Aaron that they kind of behave as the Judaizer heretics did in the fifteenth century Novgorod. Criticizing the Church from a point of view of a foreign dogma. OTOH, as I wrote I don't think the debate was theological, it was more a socio-psychological discussion.

    And frankly, I don't think I wrote anything that would contradict the opinions of Fr. Alexander Saltykov who baptized me many years ago. He taught in the theological Institute in Moscow and comes from the Saltykov aristocratic family. He is a staunch defender of the Orthodox Faith, but I am quite certain that he would have agreed that our Lord defended the downtrodden and the weak more than He admired or justified the actions of the strong and the mighty.

    There was a time when the Kadashi Church, dating back to the seventeenth century, the one where Fr. Alexander serves, was menaced by the real estate developers who wanted to demolish a part of this old Moskovite neighborhood and build luxury condos for the nouveaux riches, and Fr. Alexander stood against the riot police with his parishioners. They were able to preserve several old buildings that are not far from the Tretiakov Gallery and to impose a real estate development plan that was more sensible.

    That's the spirit of the Old Orthodox Church that stood against the tyrannical tendencies of the state and the wealth. Unfortunately, after the Raskol this spirit was greatly reduced among the Nikonian Orthodox Christians, and was mainly to be found among the Old Believers.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  495. @LatW
    @AnonfromTN


    I think he resigned before, because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk
     
    He apologized and resigned immediately after he had said those things about the rocket on the Feigin show. It's puzzling why he spoke of this, without knowing all the details (he talks so much that it is possible that he simply made a mistake, but even if this were true, it would still be a mistake to talk about it).

    The Ukrainians do not have the capability to match or deter this kind of a missile - it was X22, an old missile, designed to take out large aircraft carriers in open seas. This missile is not intelligent and can strike within a large radius, it is absolutely insane to use it on a residential area (or any ground target). It is a large residential area, they could've hit another house. They dropped a whole ton on a podyezd and smashed the whole podyezd into the ground. RIP.

    Arestovych resigning doesn't mean he'll stop talking. He'll talk more freely now.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Ivashka the fool

    Arestovych (or is it Arestovitch?) is a very intelligent and charismatic man. He has spoken in defense of the Russian language and culture in Ukraine from the excessive tribalism that is understandably demonstrated by some Ukrainian nationalists. It is the sensible thing to do. Russian speakers would self-identify as Ukrainians more than before the war, but they will not disappear. Moreover, Russians who would look for an Eastern Slav country that is organized along European values, will look to Ukraine when the war is over. If they see only hate and ressentment this would turn them off and push them in the embrace of Prigozhin (who is a Jew) and the like.

    Arestovitch has clearly shown that he is an able politician and I think that he is already preparing his future. I don’t think he made a mistake when he talked about the anti- aerial defense rocket in Dnepropetrovsk, these things have happened before and will happen again in the future, war brings a lot of suffering to civilians, some of it might be due to friendly fire. I think he knew what he was doing when he talked to Feigin and I believe the same about his resignation. BTW the man is supposedly a bisexual, which is in line with the current Davos consensus. If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Arestovych (or is it Arestovitch?) is a very intelligent and charismatic man.
     
    Agree, he is also very popular across large swaths of former USSR. Regardless of some questions about his biography, he is very valuable (according to his own words, he is among the top 5 targets on Kremlin's assassination list).

    He has spoken in defense of the Russian language and culture in Ukraine from the excessive tribalism that is understandably demonstrated by some Ukrainian nationalists.
     
    Before Feb 24, I would have also agreed that "excessive tribalism" needs to be somehow balanced out. At this point, I can't lecture to the Ukrainians about this. But, yes, he has spoken out on behalf of the Russian language, but remember that his approach is more along the lines of civic nationalism, he views all Ukrainians as Ukrainians, unlike many people on this board, who view "the people of Donbas" as a separate group and even people in places such as Dnipro and Kharkiv as a separate non-loyal Russophone group (when in fact they were simply Russian speaking Ukrainians all along). The most absurd thing is that de facto most of them were always bilingual and they could've just kept these Donbas areas bilingual.

    Russian speakers would self-identify as Ukrainians more than before the war, but they will not disappear.
     
    Yes, at this point they already do identify as such and, no, they will not disappear despite this Kremlin's savage campaign to physically eliminate them along with their homes (or to push them out of their homes). Also, a larger number of them will live within the EU than before. They need to be given certain choices.

    Moreover, Russians who would look for an Eastern Slav country that is organized along European values, will look to Ukraine when the war is over.
     
    They already are. Some of them did this already before the war. There are some very positive developments in this regard because these Russians seem to be quite content.

    If they see only hate and ressentment this would turn them off and push them in the embrace of Prigozhin (who is a Jew) and the like.
     
    I don't think they should be pushed away (then they will be lost), but I'm not counting on Ukrainians to properly handle this, they will have severe PTSD, it might be too much to ask. But I agree with your point, it's just a matter of technicalities of how to pull it off. And, yes, I recently learned Prigozhin is Jewish (which explains a lot, what he is doing can only be described as the worst type of human trafficking and this is not new). Prigozhin is a seasoned criminal so I don't think even vatniks are crazy enough to tolerate him as a leader of the whole nation (Putin just uses him as a пугало (scarecrow?) for the West), besides the General Staff might take him out eventually. But, you're right, there could be someone else with a similarly crazy profile.

    Arestovitch has clearly shown that he is an able politician and I think that he is already preparing his future
     
    Well, he has stated his goals before, they are ambitious. I'm not sure his bio is in line with those, but who knows. The outcry after these anti-air defense comments was quite bad, he may lose some of his popularity.

    I don’t think he made a mistake when he talked about the anti- aerial defense rocket in Dnepropetrovsk, these things have happened before and will happen again in the future
     
    Unfortunately, yes, this happens (it's a very intense artillery war, unfortunately - these things shouldn't even be allowed close to residential places). From what I understood, the Ukrainian side does not have the means to stop this kind of a missile, and this missile is not intended for ground targets. It was made to smash an aircraft carrier. I don't think the damage would've been so severe if parts of an anti-air defense rocket would have fallen on the house - the house got literally pushed into the ground.


    I think he knew what he was doing when he talked to Feigin and I believe the same about his resignation.
     
    The resignation itself is not such a big deal, since he was just some ad hoc advisor, it was not a full time post with large responsibilities, afaik. He likes being a gatekeeper and to bring the first info, but this just highlights how open Ukraine's media is, they just talk so openly about everything. This might be a handicap during the war, but on the other hand, it's good for the public to know this. Personally, I don't even think they should've spoken so openly about the weapons' deliveries from the West either, but there is a very open public diplomacy aspect there because the European and American public, in general, supports this more than the actual politicians.

    Anyway, I value him for his intuitive insights, not so much for his public diplomacy "skills".

    BTW the man is supposedly a bisexual
     
    He has an "open" personality (and he was an "actor"), but I'm not yet convinced he's a "diverse male". I recently heard that the video that supposedly proves he had a contact with another man is a so called deep fake. I used to think the video was of one of their security operations (he used to be in the secret service) where they used a "honey trap" (him being the "honey"). But who knows.

    If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.
     
    He might need a little bit more pedigree for that but because Ukraine has such special status now he could do it. Don't think he has the personality type for that though. I think the politicians from the European Solidarity might be better candidates for that. Arestovych has spoken positively of conservative values and I think he's a bit too Ukraine-centric to be a proper WEF candidate.

    Replies: @AP, @AnonfromTN

    , @A123
    @Ivashka the fool


    If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.
     
    It is important to note that the WEF declares "Young Global Leaders" by surprise. There is no prior approval or opportunity to decline. Therefore, a biography with the YGL tag is an involuntary historical attribute.

    It has little to no predictive value as to future policy or beliefs.

    PEACE 😇
  496. @AP
    @Ivashka the fool


    I think both you and AP were right in your own manner. It’s just that I happen to see our Lord’s message similar to the way you and Dmitry see it
     
    So three non-Christians interpret Christianity in a way that opposes what actual Christians believe.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Yeah, I know it might look a bit distasteful. That’s why my first comment was to point to Dmitry and Aaron that they kind of behave as the Judaizer heretics did in the fifteenth century Novgorod. Criticizing the Church from a point of view of a foreign dogma. OTOH, as I wrote I don’t think the debate was theological, it was more a socio-psychological discussion.

    And frankly, I don’t think I wrote anything that would contradict the opinions of Fr. Alexander Saltykov who baptized me many years ago. He taught in the theological Institute in Moscow and comes from the Saltykov aristocratic family. He is a staunch defender of the Orthodox Faith, but I am quite certain that he would have agreed that our Lord defended the downtrodden and the weak more than He admired or justified the actions of the strong and the mighty.

    There was a time when the Kadashi Church, dating back to the seventeenth century, the one where Fr. Alexander serves, was menaced by the real estate developers who wanted to demolish a part of this old Moskovite neighborhood and build luxury condos for the nouveaux riches, and Fr. Alexander stood against the riot police with his parishioners. They were able to preserve several old buildings that are not far from the Tretiakov Gallery and to impose a real estate development plan that was more sensible.

    That’s the spirit of the Old Orthodox Church that stood against the tyrannical tendencies of the state and the wealth. Unfortunately, after the Raskol this spirit was greatly reduced among the Nikonian Orthodox Christians, and was mainly to be found among the Old Believers.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Ivashka the fool

    A minor correction, it was not riot police that people stood against in Kakashi, it was a private security company hired by the real estate developers. The police got involved when the things really started to become ugly. Anyway, I was already living abroad for quite some time already when it happened. But I still remember how it all started in Kakashi when Fr Alexander battled for the retrocessionof the temple and attaining territory to the ROC. It took years of effort, some mafia type guys with Caucasus connections wanted to build a casino (I kid you not) on the plot just beside the church itself. That's post-Soviet 90ies in Moscow in a nut shell.

    And yet here we are 30 years later :

    https://www.kadashi.ru/

    I go there any times I go back to Moscow. I give what I can for the upkeep of the temple. It's such a beautiful place. Haven't been there since the Covid started. By my parents were there recently.

  497. @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    I agree that Moroccans are today doing better on development level than their Algerian neighbors and rivals who had a head start after the independence, but were harmed by their bloody islamist insurrection / civil war in the 90ies.

    I should have kept strongmen, but shouldn't have mentioned populists. I include Arab kings among the strongmen, if they're weak they won't last long. Think of Hassan II of Morocco, he was absolutely ruthless and Moroccans bowed, kissed his hand and called him Mowlay (Master).

    An Algerian friend once told me that they had two great politicians: the idealistic Ben Bella (a friend of Che Guevara) and the ruthless Boumediene who led a military coup against Ben Bella. Despite Ben Bella being a very decent man with high aspirations for popular democracy, it is Boumediene the dictator that Algerians remember and regret to this very day.

    Arabs are unfit for democracy, at least they were unfit when I lived in France, visited Maghreb and personally knew some of them. They candidly admitted this as a matter of fact situation. Perhaps your generation would one day prove me wrong.

    And God guides whom ever He pleases.

    Replies: @Yahya

    An Algerian friend once told me that they had two great politicians:

    Three: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emir_Abdelkader

    A man of great humanity and integrity.

    I should have kept strongmen, but shouldn’t have mentioned populists. I include Arab kings among the strongmen, if they’re weak they won’t last long.

    The history of political leadership in the Arab world is rather similar to many regions around the world; mostly mediocrities, a fair number of ghastly characters and very rarely, an honest and intelligent leader. The proportion of ghastly characters is slightly more than Western democracies due to a lack of checks and balances and few restraints on arbitrary power. On the other hand, the high degree of concentration in power has allowed a few competent leaders to single-handedly drag their nations to modernity, and in some cases to maximize their potential given human capital constraints.

    Ten examples of such excellent Arab heads of state:

    1) Foud Chehab (strongman)
    2) Muhammad Ali Pasha (monarch)
    3) Hamid Bourghiba (strongman)
    4) Sultan Qabboos (monarch)
    5) Zahir al-Umar (strongman)
    6) Sheikh Mohamad bin Rashid (monarch)
    7) King Faisal of Iraq (monarch)
    8) King Abdullah I of Jordan (monarch)
    9) King Faisal of Saudi Arabia (monarch)
    10) Fakhr El-Din (monarch)

    As you can see, they were disproportionately of the royal bent; and two of the three enlightened strongmen, Fouad Chehab and Zahir Al-Umar, were drawn from the old Levantine ruling elite. Only Hamid Bourghiba was born to a poor family of no particular noble lineage. Ironically his Kemalist ideology of female emancipation and staunch secularism would probably put him as most far removed ideologically from the general populace. But overall; none of the great Arab leaders were populist panderers to Boobus Arabicus, to borrow a phrase from H.L. Mencken. And only Fouad Chehab had to contend with appealing to the median voter to gain support for his initiatives; the rest were free from popular constraints.

    The great benefit of the monarchial system; other than not having to pander to popular opinion; is the moderation and technocratic bent of nearly all monarchs. Especially in the 20th century Arab world; the monarchs tended to be uniformly hostile to Islamism and Communism. In the present day you can also observe that otherwise intellectually mediocre monarchs like the ones found in UAE, Jordan and Morocco can steer the ship of state fairly competently by appointing capable technocrats and delegating authority downwards. In Saudi Arabia the cabinet is usually filled with PhD’s and graduates of American Ivy Leagues.

    The monarch, aided by his high upbringing, is also more likely to cultivate an elevated taste and impart the refinement onto the nation at large, to great aesthetic benefit. This was true of a monarchs such as Louis XIV of France and Frederick The Great of Prussia. In the Middle East, Sultan Qaboos and Mohammad Reza Shah of Iran were keen on encouraging high-culture activities in their nations.

    The monarchal system however does encounter the perennial threat of the Bad Emperor; though in my view the threat of ghastly kings has greatly reduced in the era of globalization and international pressure. Dictators like Saddam or Gaddafi would more likely be immune from outside pressure due to popular appeal; thus more susceptible to violating human rights. Kings have their exalted reputations to maintain; notice how MBS for example back-tracked and cowered in fear of international opinion after the Khashoggi debacle. Conversely, the non-monarchal Gaddafi and Saddam continued with their madness to the very end.

    Arabs are unfit for democracy,

    The question of “fit” or “unfit” imo should be rephrased to “what works best under the circumstances”. Lebanon is a democracy and was the most prosperous non-oil Arab state for much of the 20th and 21st century. Conversely, Egypt was authoritarian and lagged Lebanon in nearly all indicators. One could’ve looked at these data points and concluded that Egypt should’ve adopted democracy to become more like Lebanon. But the cultural differences would’ve lead to a different outcome. Lebanon was primed for democracy by the Jesuit educational influence which infused Western values into the Lebanese polity and allowed for compatibility with the democratic system. Egypt had no such cultural conditioning thus did not value critical ingredients such as freedom of expression and protection of minority rights; making it more prone to demagoguery and a descent to majoritarian oppression.

    Whether one polity is fit or unfit for democracy has as much to do with culture as genetics. It took a long time for democracy to develop in Western Europe. The universal-franchise Western democracy of today would be a mystery to a Englishman living in the 18th century. Even then the concept of protection of minority rights was somewhat shaky; the Gordon Riots of 1780 were a popular backlash to the Papist Reforms which eased discrimination laws against Catholics in Great Britain and Ireland.

    In theory, the conditions necessary for a functioning democracy could develop over time in the Arab world. But the present situation makes a monarchal system preferable. Cicero contends that the ideal form of government is a combination of monarchy, democracy, and aristocracy. I would tend to agree with him in a general sense; only that sometimes the circumstances make only one system preferable.

    But ultimately, I think the discerning George C. Lewis was right: the quality of the people matters more than the system of government.

    • Thanks: Miro23
    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Yahya


    Lebanon is a democracy and was the most prosperous non-oil Arab state for much of the 20th and 21st century
     
    1. The Lebanese endlessly love to larp has non Arabs. I can't stand the Lebanese.
    2. Lebanese democracy only functioned well so long as it had a Christian majority, so it really can't be compared to the other Arab states.

    the quality of the people matters more than the system of government
     
    Only to a point. Witness North vs South Korea or even China vs Taiwan.

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    You're absolutely right about Emir Abdelkader !

    The man was a hero, a poet and a Sufi mystic. I had the pleasure of reading some of his letters and poetry translated in French once. When he lived in exile in Syria he along his men saved local Christians from a rioting Muslim mob. AFAIK he is buried in the same mosque where Ibn Al Arabi is. If only more Muslims were like him, this world would be a better place and their countries would be much more pleasant. Unfortunately this is not the case. BTW he exchanged letters with Imam Shamil- the Avarian leader of the Caucasus people who fought against the Tsarist troops. And amusingly enough Abdelkader has been initiated into a Masonic lodge while kept in captivity in France. An interesting man.

    About Arab politics, I really have too little information and a limited interest. All I know is that there are supposedly more than 400 million Arab people around the world, let's say that around 1/4 of them are able-bodied men - that would be some 100 million. And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham (that would be Arabs and Jews). So from a pure will to power pov, every Isreali Jew is worth more than a dozen Arabs.

    Anyway, this family feud between the feeble willed multitudes of Arabs and the strong willed minority of Jews, poisons the existence of other people around the world. It's time you Semites find a solution to the problem. Either kill each other, or make peace for the Demiurge's sake, or let the Persians put some order in that land.

    🙂

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Yahya

  498. @AP
    @Beckow


    If Russia wins it will be in possession of ruins, with a wrecked economy and military.

    Not at all. It will have a winning military
     
    A decimated one.

    own the most arable, fertile lands in proximity to Europe,
     
    And a wrecked economy.

    Loss in Ukraine would change the way US is perceived
     
    US isn't directly involved. This isn't Vietnam.

    given how much rides on the perceptions for US:
     
    If the stakes are as high as you claim, the US will certainly not allow Ukraine to lose and it has the means to guarantee a Russian loss. I don't think the stakes are nearly as high as you claim for the USA, but let's hope the US leadership believes they are.

    If you can get yourself to celebrate that Euro-Americans have a 0.1 longer lives than Slovaks
     
    Euro Americans live about a year longer than Slovaks.

    With all the wealth, the best medical care, blabla… 0.1 of a year
     
    You rally couldn't help but throw a lie into your post, could you?

    Life expectancy Euro Americans: 77.8
    Life expectancy Slovakia: 76.9

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Beckow

    A decimated one.

    The Russian military is stronger now than when the war began. When this war ends, it will be stronger still. Although military strength really isn’t so important, the late Soviet military may have been the strongest in the world in some respects and the empire still collapsed.

    And a wrecked economy.

    Er, a stagnant economy. But Russia’s economy was already stagnant before the war. The Russian economy is explicitly built for stability at the expense of growth. It’s a strange model and it comes with a host of its own problems, but it suits Russia’s purposes. Russia is increasingly returning both politically and economically to the late Tsarist era.

    US isn’t directly involved. This isn’t Vietnam.

    Oh stop. This war is basically the Ukrainians do the dying but the US does the paying. If Ukraine loses, no country will ever again be able to depend on US protection.

    If the stakes are as high as you claim, the US will certainly not allow Ukraine to lose and it has the means to guarantee a Russian loss

    Does it though? Or have internal political divisions within the US now too severely inhibited its ability to effectively fight for what the US leadership regards as its interests?

    And what can the US even do? No amount of money and weapons is going to defeat Russia. Ultimately, stopping Russia means the United States providing at least some level of air support to the Ukrainians. There is no other way to drive the Russians out of the country and such an eventuality may prove necessary merely to prevent Russia from conquering Ukraine entirely.

    If that is what is required, what will the US do so? I think it will at least threaten to do so in the case of a Ukrainian military collapse but to actually liberate conquered Ukrainian territory? No, I don’t think so.

  499. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    An Algerian friend once told me that they had two great politicians:
     
    Three: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emir_Abdelkader

    A man of great humanity and integrity.


    I should have kept strongmen, but shouldn’t have mentioned populists. I include Arab kings among the strongmen, if they’re weak they won’t last long.
     
    The history of political leadership in the Arab world is rather similar to many regions around the world; mostly mediocrities, a fair number of ghastly characters and very rarely, an honest and intelligent leader. The proportion of ghastly characters is slightly more than Western democracies due to a lack of checks and balances and few restraints on arbitrary power. On the other hand, the high degree of concentration in power has allowed a few competent leaders to single-handedly drag their nations to modernity, and in some cases to maximize their potential given human capital constraints.

    Ten examples of such excellent Arab heads of state:

    1) Foud Chehab (strongman)
    2) Muhammad Ali Pasha (monarch)
    3) Hamid Bourghiba (strongman)
    4) Sultan Qabboos (monarch)
    5) Zahir al-Umar (strongman)
    6) Sheikh Mohamad bin Rashid (monarch)
    7) King Faisal of Iraq (monarch)
    8) King Abdullah I of Jordan (monarch)
    9) King Faisal of Saudi Arabia (monarch)
    10) Fakhr El-Din (monarch)

    As you can see, they were disproportionately of the royal bent; and two of the three enlightened strongmen, Fouad Chehab and Zahir Al-Umar, were drawn from the old Levantine ruling elite. Only Hamid Bourghiba was born to a poor family of no particular noble lineage. Ironically his Kemalist ideology of female emancipation and staunch secularism would probably put him as most far removed ideologically from the general populace. But overall; none of the great Arab leaders were populist panderers to Boobus Arabicus, to borrow a phrase from H.L. Mencken. And only Fouad Chehab had to contend with appealing to the median voter to gain support for his initiatives; the rest were free from popular constraints.

    The great benefit of the monarchial system; other than not having to pander to popular opinion; is the moderation and technocratic bent of nearly all monarchs. Especially in the 20th century Arab world; the monarchs tended to be uniformly hostile to Islamism and Communism. In the present day you can also observe that otherwise intellectually mediocre monarchs like the ones found in UAE, Jordan and Morocco can steer the ship of state fairly competently by appointing capable technocrats and delegating authority downwards. In Saudi Arabia the cabinet is usually filled with PhD's and graduates of American Ivy Leagues.

    The monarch, aided by his high upbringing, is also more likely to cultivate an elevated taste and impart the refinement onto the nation at large, to great aesthetic benefit. This was true of a monarchs such as Louis XIV of France and Frederick The Great of Prussia. In the Middle East, Sultan Qaboos and Mohammad Reza Shah of Iran were keen on encouraging high-culture activities in their nations.

    The monarchal system however does encounter the perennial threat of the Bad Emperor; though in my view the threat of ghastly kings has greatly reduced in the era of globalization and international pressure. Dictators like Saddam or Gaddafi would more likely be immune from outside pressure due to popular appeal; thus more susceptible to violating human rights. Kings have their exalted reputations to maintain; notice how MBS for example back-tracked and cowered in fear of international opinion after the Khashoggi debacle. Conversely, the non-monarchal Gaddafi and Saddam continued with their madness to the very end.


    Arabs are unfit for democracy,
     
    The question of "fit" or "unfit" imo should be rephrased to "what works best under the circumstances". Lebanon is a democracy and was the most prosperous non-oil Arab state for much of the 20th and 21st century. Conversely, Egypt was authoritarian and lagged Lebanon in nearly all indicators. One could've looked at these data points and concluded that Egypt should've adopted democracy to become more like Lebanon. But the cultural differences would've lead to a different outcome. Lebanon was primed for democracy by the Jesuit educational influence which infused Western values into the Lebanese polity and allowed for compatibility with the democratic system. Egypt had no such cultural conditioning thus did not value critical ingredients such as freedom of expression and protection of minority rights; making it more prone to demagoguery and a descent to majoritarian oppression.

    Whether one polity is fit or unfit for democracy has as much to do with culture as genetics. It took a long time for democracy to develop in Western Europe. The universal-franchise Western democracy of today would be a mystery to a Englishman living in the 18th century. Even then the concept of protection of minority rights was somewhat shaky; the Gordon Riots of 1780 were a popular backlash to the Papist Reforms which eased discrimination laws against Catholics in Great Britain and Ireland.

    In theory, the conditions necessary for a functioning democracy could develop over time in the Arab world. But the present situation makes a monarchal system preferable. Cicero contends that the ideal form of government is a combination of monarchy, democracy, and aristocracy. I would tend to agree with him in a general sense; only that sometimes the circumstances make only one system preferable.

    But ultimately, I think the discerning George C. Lewis was right: the quality of the people matters more than the system of government.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Ivashka the fool

    Lebanon is a democracy and was the most prosperous non-oil Arab state for much of the 20th and 21st century

    1. The Lebanese endlessly love to larp has non Arabs. I can’t stand the Lebanese.
    2. Lebanese democracy only functioned well so long as it had a Christian majority, so it really can’t be compared to the other Arab states.

    the quality of the people matters more than the system of government

    Only to a point. Witness North vs South Korea or even China vs Taiwan.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Greasy William


    Only to a point.
     
    Operative word in my sentence was more.

    Witness North vs South Korea
     
    Human capital puts a ceiling on developmental potential. Rwanda cannot become a First World Country in the next 50 years, no matter the effectiveness of their governance. North Korea has that potential; and only a moderately capitalist regime will suffice to achieve that goal. No special competence is needed.

    1. The Lebanese endlessly love to larp has non Arabs.
     
    Only some Christian emigres and a few highly-educated types.

    Lebanese masses view themselves as Arabs.

    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs. This is a music video by one such calls for "the Arab nation" to combat Israel.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jK388GEWiE&t=359s&ab_channel=anti-imperialism


    I can’t stand the Lebanese.
     
    The Lebanese are stereotyped as effeminate and humorless in Egypt.

    But also good-looking and sophisticated.

    You'll like the Lebanese better if you focus on the female half of the population.

    https://i.ibb.co/TKSbYkv/main-qimg-35fbbae8c75e3a301b6e5a9cd1a96c73-lq.jpg

    Replies: @AP, @Greasy William

  500. European Christians see the existential threat : (1)

    Majority of Europeans see illegal immigration as a top concern facing continent and want to preserve Christian culture, poll finds

    Countries with high levels of concern include those with the most progressive governments, including Sweden (78 percent), Germany (75 percent), France (73 percent), and the Netherlands (68 percent), according to the Századvég survey.

    The question is, “When will they get rid of SJW Islamic leaders?”

    Countries that start de-Islamification now will do better than those who wait. Sweden could easily wind up as a failed state like Lebanon.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    (1) https://rmx.news/crime/majority-of-europeans-see-illegal-immigration-as-a-top-concern-facing-continent-and-want-to-preserve-christian-culture-poll-finds/

  501. @Ivashka the fool
    @AP

    Yeah, I know it might look a bit distasteful. That's why my first comment was to point to Dmitry and Aaron that they kind of behave as the Judaizer heretics did in the fifteenth century Novgorod. Criticizing the Church from a point of view of a foreign dogma. OTOH, as I wrote I don't think the debate was theological, it was more a socio-psychological discussion.

    And frankly, I don't think I wrote anything that would contradict the opinions of Fr. Alexander Saltykov who baptized me many years ago. He taught in the theological Institute in Moscow and comes from the Saltykov aristocratic family. He is a staunch defender of the Orthodox Faith, but I am quite certain that he would have agreed that our Lord defended the downtrodden and the weak more than He admired or justified the actions of the strong and the mighty.

    There was a time when the Kadashi Church, dating back to the seventeenth century, the one where Fr. Alexander serves, was menaced by the real estate developers who wanted to demolish a part of this old Moskovite neighborhood and build luxury condos for the nouveaux riches, and Fr. Alexander stood against the riot police with his parishioners. They were able to preserve several old buildings that are not far from the Tretiakov Gallery and to impose a real estate development plan that was more sensible.

    That's the spirit of the Old Orthodox Church that stood against the tyrannical tendencies of the state and the wealth. Unfortunately, after the Raskol this spirit was greatly reduced among the Nikonian Orthodox Christians, and was mainly to be found among the Old Believers.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    A minor correction, it was not riot police that people stood against in Kakashi, it was a private security company hired by the real estate developers. The police got involved when the things really started to become ugly. Anyway, I was already living abroad for quite some time already when it happened. But I still remember how it all started in Kakashi when Fr Alexander battled for the retrocessionof the temple and attaining territory to the ROC. It took years of effort, some mafia type guys with Caucasus connections wanted to build a casino (I kid you not) on the plot just beside the church itself. That’s post-Soviet 90ies in Moscow in a nut shell.

    And yet here we are 30 years later :

    https://www.kadashi.ru/

    I go there any times I go back to Moscow. I give what I can for the upkeep of the temple. It’s such a beautiful place. Haven’t been there since the Covid started. By my parents were there recently.

  502. @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    Arestovych (or is it Arestovitch?) is a very intelligent and charismatic man. He has spoken in defense of the Russian language and culture in Ukraine from the excessive tribalism that is understandably demonstrated by some Ukrainian nationalists. It is the sensible thing to do. Russian speakers would self-identify as Ukrainians more than before the war, but they will not disappear. Moreover, Russians who would look for an Eastern Slav country that is organized along European values, will look to Ukraine when the war is over. If they see only hate and ressentment this would turn them off and push them in the embrace of Prigozhin (who is a Jew) and the like.

    Arestovitch has clearly shown that he is an able politician and I think that he is already preparing his future. I don't think he made a mistake when he talked about the anti- aerial defense rocket in Dnepropetrovsk, these things have happened before and will happen again in the future, war brings a lot of suffering to civilians, some of it might be due to friendly fire. I think he knew what he was doing when he talked to Feigin and I believe the same about his resignation. BTW the man is supposedly a bisexual, which is in line with the current Davos consensus. If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.

    Replies: @LatW, @A123

    Arestovych (or is it Arestovitch?) is a very intelligent and charismatic man.

    Agree, he is also very popular across large swaths of former USSR. Regardless of some questions about his biography, he is very valuable (according to his own words, he is among the top 5 targets on Kremlin’s assassination list).

    He has spoken in defense of the Russian language and culture in Ukraine from the excessive tribalism that is understandably demonstrated by some Ukrainian nationalists.

    Before Feb 24, I would have also agreed that “excessive tribalism” needs to be somehow balanced out. At this point, I can’t lecture to the Ukrainians about this. But, yes, he has spoken out on behalf of the Russian language, but remember that his approach is more along the lines of civic nationalism, he views all Ukrainians as Ukrainians, unlike many people on this board, who view “the people of Donbas” as a separate group and even people in places such as Dnipro and Kharkiv as a separate non-loyal Russophone group (when in fact they were simply Russian speaking Ukrainians all along). The most absurd thing is that de facto most of them were always bilingual and they could’ve just kept these Donbas areas bilingual.

    Russian speakers would self-identify as Ukrainians more than before the war, but they will not disappear.

    Yes, at this point they already do identify as such and, no, they will not disappear despite this Kremlin’s savage campaign to physically eliminate them along with their homes (or to push them out of their homes). Also, a larger number of them will live within the EU than before. They need to be given certain choices.

    Moreover, Russians who would look for an Eastern Slav country that is organized along European values, will look to Ukraine when the war is over.

    They already are. Some of them did this already before the war. There are some very positive developments in this regard because these Russians seem to be quite content.

    If they see only hate and ressentment this would turn them off and push them in the embrace of Prigozhin (who is a Jew) and the like.

    I don’t think they should be pushed away (then they will be lost), but I’m not counting on Ukrainians to properly handle this, they will have severe PTSD, it might be too much to ask. But I agree with your point, it’s just a matter of technicalities of how to pull it off. And, yes, I recently learned Prigozhin is Jewish (which explains a lot, what he is doing can only be described as the worst type of human trafficking and this is not new). Prigozhin is a seasoned criminal so I don’t think even vatniks are crazy enough to tolerate him as a leader of the whole nation (Putin just uses him as a пугало (scarecrow?) for the West), besides the General Staff might take him out eventually. But, you’re right, there could be someone else with a similarly crazy profile.

    Arestovitch has clearly shown that he is an able politician and I think that he is already preparing his future

    Well, he has stated his goals before, they are ambitious. I’m not sure his bio is in line with those, but who knows. The outcry after these anti-air defense comments was quite bad, he may lose some of his popularity.

    I don’t think he made a mistake when he talked about the anti- aerial defense rocket in Dnepropetrovsk, these things have happened before and will happen again in the future

    Unfortunately, yes, this happens (it’s a very intense artillery war, unfortunately – these things shouldn’t even be allowed close to residential places). From what I understood, the Ukrainian side does not have the means to stop this kind of a missile, and this missile is not intended for ground targets. It was made to smash an aircraft carrier. I don’t think the damage would’ve been so severe if parts of an anti-air defense rocket would have fallen on the house – the house got literally pushed into the ground.

    I think he knew what he was doing when he talked to Feigin and I believe the same about his resignation.

    The resignation itself is not such a big deal, since he was just some ad hoc advisor, it was not a full time post with large responsibilities, afaik. He likes being a gatekeeper and to bring the first info, but this just highlights how open Ukraine’s media is, they just talk so openly about everything. This might be a handicap during the war, but on the other hand, it’s good for the public to know this. Personally, I don’t even think they should’ve spoken so openly about the weapons’ deliveries from the West either, but there is a very open public diplomacy aspect there because the European and American public, in general, supports this more than the actual politicians.

    Anyway, I value him for his intuitive insights, not so much for his public diplomacy “skills”.

    BTW the man is supposedly a bisexual

    He has an “open” personality (and he was an “actor”), but I’m not yet convinced he’s a “diverse male”. I recently heard that the video that supposedly proves he had a contact with another man is a so called deep fake. I used to think the video was of one of their security operations (he used to be in the secret service) where they used a “honey trap” (him being the “honey”). But who knows.

    If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.

    He might need a little bit more pedigree for that but because Ukraine has such special status now he could do it. Don’t think he has the personality type for that though. I think the politicians from the European Solidarity might be better candidates for that. Arestovych has spoken positively of conservative values and I think he’s a bit too Ukraine-centric to be a proper WEF candidate.

    • Replies: @AP
    @LatW


    "If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to."

    He might need a little bit more pedigree for that but because Ukraine has such special status now he could do it. Don’t think he has the personality type for that though. I think the politicians from the European Solidarity might be better candidates for that. Arestovych has spoken positively of conservative values and I think he’s a bit too Ukraine-centric to be a proper WEF candidate.
     
    He's a Belarussian nobleman.

    https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rola_(herb_szlachecki)

    If PLC is restored maybe he can replace Lukashenka. Arestowicz spent part of his childhood in Belarus.

    Replies: @LatW

    , @AnonfromTN
    @LatW

    Why argue about Arestovych now? The craziest Ukies put him on the “Mirotvorets” site. So, as far as Nazis are concerned, his goose is cooked. Considering his record, he won’t emerge in reformatted Ukraine, either.

    Replies: @LondonBob

  503. @Greasy William
    @Yahya


    Lebanon is a democracy and was the most prosperous non-oil Arab state for much of the 20th and 21st century
     
    1. The Lebanese endlessly love to larp has non Arabs. I can't stand the Lebanese.
    2. Lebanese democracy only functioned well so long as it had a Christian majority, so it really can't be compared to the other Arab states.

    the quality of the people matters more than the system of government
     
    Only to a point. Witness North vs South Korea or even China vs Taiwan.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Only to a point.

    Operative word in my sentence was more.

    Witness North vs South Korea

    Human capital puts a ceiling on developmental potential. Rwanda cannot become a First World Country in the next 50 years, no matter the effectiveness of their governance. North Korea has that potential; and only a moderately capitalist regime will suffice to achieve that goal. No special competence is needed.

    1. The Lebanese endlessly love to larp has non Arabs.

    Only some Christian emigres and a few highly-educated types.

    Lebanese masses view themselves as Arabs.

    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs. This is a music video by one such calls for “the Arab nation” to combat Israel.

    I can’t stand the Lebanese.

    The Lebanese are stereotyped as effeminate and humorless in Egypt.

    But also good-looking and sophisticated.

    You’ll like the Lebanese better if you focus on the female half of the population.

    [MORE]

    • Agree: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @AP
    @Yahya


    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs
     
    In Detroit that has a vey large Arab-speaking population the Lebanese Christians often claim to be Phoenicians, while the ones from Iraq describe themselves as Chaldeans rather than Arabs and claim descent from ancient Babylonians. Both groups feel that their homelands were invaded by Arabs whom they look down on.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Another Polish Perspective

    , @Greasy William
    @Yahya


    Operative word in my sentence was more.
     
    Just so long as we understand each other

    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs.
     
    Back in my Jewish nationalist days I interacted with many Christian, anti Israel Lebanese online. Their Arab identity is very nominal. I know they call themselves Arab but they also kinda see themselves as part European and they have a ridiculous and totally unjustified superiority complex towards other Arabs. The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, "white liberals" are not a race). Awful people.

    This is a music video by one such calls for “the Arab nation” to combat Israel.
     
    The only one I like is the one in the green and even she appears to have slight subcanthal tilt. I have no interest whatsoever in the other two. Both the song as well as the music video are garbage. If Arabs really took Arab nationalism seriously they would put a Jew in charge since they themselves obviously can't do it properly.

    In fact, this video essentially exemplifies everything I cannot stand about Lebanese people, the last remnant of the odious Canaanites. Thank you for this. What year is it from?

    You’ll like the Lebanese better if you focus on the female half of the population.
     
    No, the women are a million times worse than the men. I could occasionally find some common ground with the guys but never with the women.

    Rwanda cannot become a First World Country in the next 50 years, no matter the effectiveness of their governance.
     
    Racist much? I disagree.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Talha, @silviosilver

  504. AP says:
    @AaronB
    @Ivashka the fool

    Yes, I'm just not sure that ethnic nationalism - at least if it's very attached and passionate, as yours is - is compatible with spirituality. From a Buddhist (and Christian) perspective it's clearly a source of attachment and suffering, so I was just surprised that you claim to be Buddhist but also a very passionate ethnic nationalist.

    The last time you posted under Bashibuzuk, you did not manifest the liberated joy of transcendent spirituality but a very dark, despairing, depressed view, which I thought was connected to your deep attachment to ethnic nationalism, which is a form of sublimated ego - and clinging to anything in this world, particularly ego, predictably results in suffering.

    (I'm not against a sort of lighthearted allegiance to country and race as contingent circumstances, but your ethnic nationalism is clearly essentialist and salvific, which I don't think can remotely be justified in terms of Buddhism (or Christianity, not that you're Christian))

    Of course, unenlightened creatures that we are, we often cannot help but cling to what is poison for us, myself included, and cannot free ourselves from thought-forms that do us no good.

    You are free to be an ethnic nationalist and I have no desire to stop you - but I am free to discuss it as it relates to Buddhism and suffering.


    As a Russian saying goes, some character traits cannot be healed, but you might be less categorical in your affirmations.
     
    Fair enough, but that's just you taking sides. AP was equally if not more categorical and full of himself - is that then the Jew in him?

    One classic way to undermine an opponent is to guilt him for being self-confident and assertive while ignoring or even encouraging the exact same qualities in the side you support.

    And you, by the way, are not exactly a shrinking violet :) How about we all just call it like we see it without trying to guilt each other for being straightforward? Maybe we can even appreciate each other for telling it - like we respectively think - it is.

    The theory of art I'm advancing with regard to Bach is one that will obviously be deeply offensive to ethnic nationalists who desire national consensus and bland uniformity - but the layers and tensions that compose a human collective are far more fruitful, creative, and fascinating.

    Not did I merely make categorical statements - I provided detailed arguments and logic. But again, you don't like it so you have to discredit :)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @AP

    AP was equally if not more categorical and full of himself

    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ’s message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.

    The theory of art I’m advancing with regard to Bach is one that will obviously be deeply offensive to ethnic nationalists who desire national consensus and bland uniformity

    No, it’s just dumbly arrogant.

    You claim that Bach rebelled against Christendom in his art and that his art was fundamentally opposed to it. In a way, you compared Bach to yourself, as a fellow rebel.

    Silvio said it better than I could:

    “A celebration of Jesus is a celebration of the Christian faith, and when that faith is celebrated by an artist [Bach] in the context of a Christian civilization, it is far more plausible that the artist approves of that civilization than disapproves of it, let alone stands in staunch opposition to the totality of it.”

    Your response:

    Look at it this way – art is an act of imagination, in other words, it looks beyond the existing and factual to the possible.

    Sure.

    Political and social institutions are not built on ideals

    Of course they are. Certainly Christendom was. As was Communism, and Nazism. Even capitalism.

    Art and beauty – as acts of that faculty which let’s us soar beyond the existing into the realm of the ideal and possible – are then, clearly, necessarily in tension with actually existing conditions

    There is no tension between a Christian society and an art that celebrates Christ, merely because Christian rulers are busy with necessities such as tax collection and buildings roads and walls, n addition to lavishly sponsoring Christian arts and artists such as Bach. If Bach were forced to make furniture rather than compose music he might experience some inner tension, but there is no evidence and no reason to believe that he experienced tension by making Christian music for and within a Christian society, under the patronage of Christian rulers. Particularly tension towards that same Christian society.

    More specifically, the artists I cited, as a matter of concrete fact, created works that celebrate a value system that is in diametric opposition to the existing institutions, based as they are on power relations

    According to you personal interpretation, and not that of the Churches and society of Bach’s time and place.

    And now the centerpiece of your arrogance:

    It doesn’t even matter if we resurrect Bach and he tells us plainly he did not see the civilization of his day as unjust and was not consciously trying to criticize it – his art embodies a criticism of it, and all that would mean is Bach wasn’t very politically perceptive.

    Yes, a non-Christian rando knows and understands better what Bach was about than even Bach himself.

    Great art is always greater than the intentions of it’s creator

    But not so great that AaronB hasn’t figured out its true nature.

    Vatican and the Cathedrals did not exactly manifest a spirit of humility

    They celebrated God in beautiful ways.

    I do indeed contend that the Church from very early on went wrong and represented an illegitimate fusion of power and religion

    Indeed, AaronB thinks he knows better about the nature of Christianity than did the Church Fathers from early on. Because he read some Gospels himself.

    ::::::::::::::::::::::

    Incidentally, there was a discussion about virtues among the rich and the poor. I can’t speak of the very rich, I only know a small handful of those and it may not be a representative sample. But in our Christian and immediately post-Christian society, the comfortable are more virtuous than the poor. This can be empirically measured.

    For example, divorce rate by profession. It is much lower among people such as engineers or physicians than among laborers:

    Heroin use, more popular among poorer people:

    https://www.cdc.gov/vitalsigns/heroin/infographic.html

    Wealthier people have higher marriage rates and lower divorce rates:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32886585/

    Wealthy people 7 times less likely to grow up and commit violent crimes than poor people in Sweden:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4180846/

    Wealthier people less likely to kill their domestic partners in the USA, even when taking race into account:

    https://scholarworks.uni.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1009&context=ijghhd

    Poor people commit more of every type of crime in Toronto:

    https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/b5ab6df3741649c4bcc0a5fbd9e3b45b

    Both very rich and very poor had higher number of sexual partners:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32886585/

    Poor people more obese (thus, the sin of gluttony):

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7484407/#:~:text=Socioeconomic%20status%20(SES)%20is%20an,variable%20over%20time%20%5B2%5D.

    Poor adolescents more likely to commit all kinds of sex crimes than rich ones:

    https://heinonline.org/HOL/LandingPage?handle=hein.journals/ijotcc40&div=39&id=&page=

    I am deliberately using rich societies as examples because in such societies even the poor are not desperate. Nobody is starving to death in Sweden or Canada or the USA.

    :::::::::::::::

    I claimed that in a society that reflects Christian values, the more prosperous within that society are more likely to live by Christina virtues, such as not abusing one’s body through drug abuse, not killing, getting married, etc. That is, they are less sinful than poor people. With the exception of the richest peoples’ tendency to have as many sexual partners as do poor people (but fewer than do the middle classes), the data support that claim.

    Thus, it is correct to claim that the poor and more marginalized are in general more less virtuous and more sinful than the middle and upper classes. Which means that they are in more need of help and correction.

    • Thanks: Miro23
    • Replies: @A123
    @AP


    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ’s message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.
     
    As Christian... I must Object.

    Having multiple Bibles allows those who believe in Jesus to question the "Church that put together those Gospels". All Bibles are the works of fallible men. There is no "incredible arrogance" in questioning a specious interpretation or bogus translation.

    When Church aligns with God... It is Good.
    When Church does not align with God... The Church is at fault.


    Pope Muhammad Francis's hatred of Jesus Christ vividly shows the horror of a failed Church. The Church of England also embraces anti-God deviance.

    Are these TRUTHS not obvious for all to see?

    PEACE 😇
    , @AaronB
    @AP


    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ’s message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.
     
    Perhaps then, AP, you are not arrogant enough, and you can use a little of my Jewish arrogance :)

    I'm beginning to think Dmitry was the better psychologist here and understood you better than I did. I thought you were this devilishly cunning fellow who was trying to subvert religion, but Dmitry thought you were a simple and ignorant person.

    Perhaps I succumbed - for once - to the atmosphere of conspiracy theories so prevalent on this site, which I am usually proof against, and saw malign intent and masterful strategy where there was simply tragic human finitude.

    I understand you differently now, and see as a completely different type - it was your moving encomium to wealth and comfort, so innocent, so optimistic, so pure, so sincere and uncomplicated, so childish, that has given me a different perspective on you.

    You, AP, did everything right - you followed blindly the dictates of your culture and society, without questioning it. You were a good boy. You did what everyone said was the right thing, what everyone said would lead to happiness and satisfaction. You studied hard, got a good job, pursued money, lived comfortably, worked hard, advanced in your career, worshipped the State cult exactly as the authorities said you should. You were respectable, damn it.

    And yet, somehow, it was all empty - you didn't feel the happiness you were promised. Nothing ever happened, and life stagnated. In the words Thoreau used to describe the mainstream man, you lived a life of "quiet desperation".

    Still, you're the one who is supposed to be happy, by rights - someone like me, who laughs at respectability, who has all the wrong opinions, who goes adventuring in the wilderness half the year, who does everything wrong, is supposed to be miserable, by God.

    And homeless people? By God, they're just desserts is to suffer - yet maybe, perhaps, some of them are actually much happier than AP :) And that cannot be. The sheer gall of it.

    Therefore, those homeless who have chosen their lot must be forcibly made to live like AP as much as possible - and AaronB must cease his wilderness expeditions and start focusing on being economically productive, just like AP :) It is for their own good, really - but more importantly, the idea that they are the happy ones cannot be permitted to stand.

    I am, unfortunately, very, very familiar with this mentality. I have friends who take "pity" on me and try and get me married, and live "normally" - when, eventually, they realize that I am actually much happier than they are, the shock and rage are almost comical.

    There is in this world, in a way, a "conspiracy against happiness" - most people are broken by society, and cannot resist it's dictates, and then set about trying to make sure no one else escapes. If I am not happy, none can be.

    Had you had a little more intestinal fortitude, AP, a little more arrogance, independence, and rebelliousness, you would have been able to resist social conditioning.

    It is merely a pity, and a sad but all too familiar commentary on human finitude and limitation. And I am here, as much as possible, to ensure future APs have the courage to resist.

    Cheers.

    Replies: @AP, @silviosilver

    , @LatW
    @AP


    I claimed that in a society that reflects Christian values, the more prosperous within that society are more likely to live by Christina virtues, such as not abusing one’s body through drug abuse, not killing, getting married, etc. That is, they are less sinful than poor people.
     
    The problem with societies such as the US, that are very stratified at this point (which wasn't always the case), is that the upper classes have failed in their duty to show a good example to others.

    Traditionally, the upper classes lead by example, but today the upper classes promote questionable values, while they themselves do not follow those in their private lives (knowing full well that they are detrimental to success). Peer pressure is also very important and in more egalitarian societies, such as in Northern Europe, almost everyone is middle class and they follow the general habits of that class so they are able to avoid the negatives.

    So it's not necessarily always the case that the rich are somehow innately more virtuous because they follow Christian principles more and the poor are moral failures. It's just that the rich (as well as the upper 5%-20% or so) look out for themselves and at the same time in many cases promote negative (libertine) values for everyone else.

    Replies: @LatW, @AP

  505. @Yahya
    @Greasy William


    Only to a point.
     
    Operative word in my sentence was more.

    Witness North vs South Korea
     
    Human capital puts a ceiling on developmental potential. Rwanda cannot become a First World Country in the next 50 years, no matter the effectiveness of their governance. North Korea has that potential; and only a moderately capitalist regime will suffice to achieve that goal. No special competence is needed.

    1. The Lebanese endlessly love to larp has non Arabs.
     
    Only some Christian emigres and a few highly-educated types.

    Lebanese masses view themselves as Arabs.

    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs. This is a music video by one such calls for "the Arab nation" to combat Israel.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jK388GEWiE&t=359s&ab_channel=anti-imperialism


    I can’t stand the Lebanese.
     
    The Lebanese are stereotyped as effeminate and humorless in Egypt.

    But also good-looking and sophisticated.

    You'll like the Lebanese better if you focus on the female half of the population.

    https://i.ibb.co/TKSbYkv/main-qimg-35fbbae8c75e3a301b6e5a9cd1a96c73-lq.jpg

    Replies: @AP, @Greasy William

    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs

    In Detroit that has a vey large Arab-speaking population the Lebanese Christians often claim to be Phoenicians, while the ones from Iraq describe themselves as Chaldeans rather than Arabs and claim descent from ancient Babylonians. Both groups feel that their homelands were invaded by Arabs whom they look down on.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @AP

    You missed the part about emigres in the sentence above.

    I don't get the impression that Lebanese Christians feel "invaded" by Lebanese Muslims.

    Chaldeans i'm not familiar with.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP

    Why some Christians would freely describe themselves as Babylonians is beyond me. Don't they know that Babylon is a bad guy (bad woman) of the Christian eschatology...? Didn't they hear about the Great Whore of Babylon (Revelation 17)?

    3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
    4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
    5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth.

  506. According to this, the giant beaver didn’t build dams because that’s a defense mechanism against predation, and it was too formidable to fear anything:

    • Thanks: Ivashka the fool
  507. @LatW
    @AaronB


    with your talk of “genetic lineages”, and the need to secure their survival [..] pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.
     
    The desire to preserve the "genetic lineages" resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego. You cannot blame a flower for wanting to receive water and sunlight and to grow.

    Replies: @AaronB, @Talha, @Yahya, @S

    The desire to preserve the “genetic lineages” resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego.

    Actually only a tiny (probably <1%) percentage of the population cares about genetic lineage. Most people are too short-minded to think from a long-term perspective. Notice how literally zero politicians running for office ever mention "genetic lineage" or euphemistic alternatives to appeal to voters. It's always "jobs" and "housing" etc.

    Greg Cochran mentioned that race is a weak unit for people to band together around. He used the ancient Middle Easterners lack of unity at the face of Greek conquests as an example of weak racial bonds. The denizens of Unzistan are atypical in being concerned with the preservation of genetic lineages on a racial level.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    You mistake the popular for the significant.

    A lot of people on teh internets like cute kitten videos, and very few are interested in Gnostic scriptures. Does it mean that cute kitten had a deeper impact on human history and culture than let's say Valentine the Gnostic ?

    My rule of thumb is: if it is widely popular - then it is most probably boring and vulgar. If it is only found among people of a certain cultural and intellectual level - then it might be worth learning about.

    Speaking of which:



    https://youtu.be/faOUDoRmK_E

    This is highbrow elite entertainment !

    🙂

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @Talha
    @Yahya


    atypical in being concerned with the preservation of genetic lineages on a racial level.

     

    Atypical times...this is usually the sign of a society/civilization in a defensive posture, especially when you add in the aspect of fertility in a terminal nosedive. Conquest cultures/civilizations of the past thought nothing about spreading their genetics far and wide among the conquered. Vikings, Mongols, Arabs, Spaniards, Comanches...you name it. Up to and after the Korean War, one of the main reasons why laws were being changed to allow non-white immigration into the US were the needs of GIs bringing home Asian “war brides” - I had an exchange with Mr. Unz about this a while back with citations to articles.

    Patriarchal cultures are generally concerned with preserving their genetic lineage as progenitors; racial/ethnic purity is not really a concern.

    Wa salaam.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @LatW
    @Yahya


    Actually only a tiny (probably <1%) percentage of the population cares about genetic lineage. Most people are too short-minded to think from a long-term perspective. Notice how literally zero politicians running for office ever mention "genetic lineage" or euphemistic alternatives to appeal to voters.
     
    I can't speak about North America or your country, Egypt. And obviously European politicians are rarely even allowed to talk that way.

    But from a very narrow North Eastern European woman's perspective, I can tell you that many women (and even many men), who are the gatekeepers for sexual selection, do care very much about ancestral genetic lineages. They may not view it that way subjectively, may not even be fully aware of it, and they definitely do not openly phrase it that way, but let me assure you that, from their purely personal choices, this is very much the case (and I hope it stays that way).

  508. @AP
    @Yahya


    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs
     
    In Detroit that has a vey large Arab-speaking population the Lebanese Christians often claim to be Phoenicians, while the ones from Iraq describe themselves as Chaldeans rather than Arabs and claim descent from ancient Babylonians. Both groups feel that their homelands were invaded by Arabs whom they look down on.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Another Polish Perspective

    You missed the part about emigres in the sentence above.

    I don’t get the impression that Lebanese Christians feel “invaded” by Lebanese Muslims.

    Chaldeans i’m not familiar with.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    Maronite Lebanese I have personally known don't really like their Shia compatriots. Orthodox Lebanese much less so. Interestingly enough, I have also known a couple Shia Lebanese, a guy who was not religious at all and a hijab wearing young lady, very well behaved people both of them.

    Replies: @A123

  509. @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Arestovych (or is it Arestovitch?) is a very intelligent and charismatic man.
     
    Agree, he is also very popular across large swaths of former USSR. Regardless of some questions about his biography, he is very valuable (according to his own words, he is among the top 5 targets on Kremlin's assassination list).

    He has spoken in defense of the Russian language and culture in Ukraine from the excessive tribalism that is understandably demonstrated by some Ukrainian nationalists.
     
    Before Feb 24, I would have also agreed that "excessive tribalism" needs to be somehow balanced out. At this point, I can't lecture to the Ukrainians about this. But, yes, he has spoken out on behalf of the Russian language, but remember that his approach is more along the lines of civic nationalism, he views all Ukrainians as Ukrainians, unlike many people on this board, who view "the people of Donbas" as a separate group and even people in places such as Dnipro and Kharkiv as a separate non-loyal Russophone group (when in fact they were simply Russian speaking Ukrainians all along). The most absurd thing is that de facto most of them were always bilingual and they could've just kept these Donbas areas bilingual.

    Russian speakers would self-identify as Ukrainians more than before the war, but they will not disappear.
     
    Yes, at this point they already do identify as such and, no, they will not disappear despite this Kremlin's savage campaign to physically eliminate them along with their homes (or to push them out of their homes). Also, a larger number of them will live within the EU than before. They need to be given certain choices.

    Moreover, Russians who would look for an Eastern Slav country that is organized along European values, will look to Ukraine when the war is over.
     
    They already are. Some of them did this already before the war. There are some very positive developments in this regard because these Russians seem to be quite content.

    If they see only hate and ressentment this would turn them off and push them in the embrace of Prigozhin (who is a Jew) and the like.
     
    I don't think they should be pushed away (then they will be lost), but I'm not counting on Ukrainians to properly handle this, they will have severe PTSD, it might be too much to ask. But I agree with your point, it's just a matter of technicalities of how to pull it off. And, yes, I recently learned Prigozhin is Jewish (which explains a lot, what he is doing can only be described as the worst type of human trafficking and this is not new). Prigozhin is a seasoned criminal so I don't think even vatniks are crazy enough to tolerate him as a leader of the whole nation (Putin just uses him as a пугало (scarecrow?) for the West), besides the General Staff might take him out eventually. But, you're right, there could be someone else with a similarly crazy profile.

    Arestovitch has clearly shown that he is an able politician and I think that he is already preparing his future
     
    Well, he has stated his goals before, they are ambitious. I'm not sure his bio is in line with those, but who knows. The outcry after these anti-air defense comments was quite bad, he may lose some of his popularity.

    I don’t think he made a mistake when he talked about the anti- aerial defense rocket in Dnepropetrovsk, these things have happened before and will happen again in the future
     
    Unfortunately, yes, this happens (it's a very intense artillery war, unfortunately - these things shouldn't even be allowed close to residential places). From what I understood, the Ukrainian side does not have the means to stop this kind of a missile, and this missile is not intended for ground targets. It was made to smash an aircraft carrier. I don't think the damage would've been so severe if parts of an anti-air defense rocket would have fallen on the house - the house got literally pushed into the ground.


    I think he knew what he was doing when he talked to Feigin and I believe the same about his resignation.
     
    The resignation itself is not such a big deal, since he was just some ad hoc advisor, it was not a full time post with large responsibilities, afaik. He likes being a gatekeeper and to bring the first info, but this just highlights how open Ukraine's media is, they just talk so openly about everything. This might be a handicap during the war, but on the other hand, it's good for the public to know this. Personally, I don't even think they should've spoken so openly about the weapons' deliveries from the West either, but there is a very open public diplomacy aspect there because the European and American public, in general, supports this more than the actual politicians.

    Anyway, I value him for his intuitive insights, not so much for his public diplomacy "skills".

    BTW the man is supposedly a bisexual
     
    He has an "open" personality (and he was an "actor"), but I'm not yet convinced he's a "diverse male". I recently heard that the video that supposedly proves he had a contact with another man is a so called deep fake. I used to think the video was of one of their security operations (he used to be in the secret service) where they used a "honey trap" (him being the "honey"). But who knows.

    If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.
     
    He might need a little bit more pedigree for that but because Ukraine has such special status now he could do it. Don't think he has the personality type for that though. I think the politicians from the European Solidarity might be better candidates for that. Arestovych has spoken positively of conservative values and I think he's a bit too Ukraine-centric to be a proper WEF candidate.

    Replies: @AP, @AnonfromTN

    “If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.”

    He might need a little bit more pedigree for that but because Ukraine has such special status now he could do it. Don’t think he has the personality type for that though. I think the politicians from the European Solidarity might be better candidates for that. Arestovych has spoken positively of conservative values and I think he’s a bit too Ukraine-centric to be a proper WEF candidate.

    He’s a Belarussian nobleman.

    https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rola_(herb_szlachecki)

    If PLC is restored maybe he can replace Lukashenka. Arestowicz spent part of his childhood in Belarus.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @AP

    I'm aware that he's part Belarusian with those roots (same as Podolyak, apparently, and it shows). My point was that he wouldn't care about Western credentials (such as this forum that was mentioned above). The types that do are mostly those who speak English or French very well and who have a London School of Economics degree. He is not one of those types, since he has a local military background, and he is a Ukraine-centric Russophone civic nationalist. Which is exciting because it gives us hope that he could deliver something more interesting than what we've seen before with many E.Euro politicians.

  510. @Yahya
    @Greasy William


    Only to a point.
     
    Operative word in my sentence was more.

    Witness North vs South Korea
     
    Human capital puts a ceiling on developmental potential. Rwanda cannot become a First World Country in the next 50 years, no matter the effectiveness of their governance. North Korea has that potential; and only a moderately capitalist regime will suffice to achieve that goal. No special competence is needed.

    1. The Lebanese endlessly love to larp has non Arabs.
     
    Only some Christian emigres and a few highly-educated types.

    Lebanese masses view themselves as Arabs.

    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs. This is a music video by one such calls for "the Arab nation" to combat Israel.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jK388GEWiE&t=359s&ab_channel=anti-imperialism


    I can’t stand the Lebanese.
     
    The Lebanese are stereotyped as effeminate and humorless in Egypt.

    But also good-looking and sophisticated.

    You'll like the Lebanese better if you focus on the female half of the population.

    https://i.ibb.co/TKSbYkv/main-qimg-35fbbae8c75e3a301b6e5a9cd1a96c73-lq.jpg

    Replies: @AP, @Greasy William

    Operative word in my sentence was more.

    Just so long as we understand each other

    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs.

    Back in my Jewish nationalist days I interacted with many Christian, anti Israel Lebanese online. Their Arab identity is very nominal. I know they call themselves Arab but they also kinda see themselves as part European and they have a ridiculous and totally unjustified superiority complex towards other Arabs. The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, “white liberals” are not a race). Awful people.

    This is a music video by one such calls for “the Arab nation” to combat Israel.

    The only one I like is the one in the green and even she appears to have slight subcanthal tilt. I have no interest whatsoever in the other two. Both the song as well as the music video are garbage. If Arabs really took Arab nationalism seriously they would put a Jew in charge since they themselves obviously can’t do it properly.

    In fact, this video essentially exemplifies everything I cannot stand about Lebanese people, the last remnant of the odious Canaanites. Thank you for this. What year is it from?

    You’ll like the Lebanese better if you focus on the female half of the population.

    No, the women are a million times worse than the men. I could occasionally find some common ground with the guys but never with the women.

    Rwanda cannot become a First World Country in the next 50 years, no matter the effectiveness of their governance.

    Racist much? I disagree.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Greasy William


    In fact, this video essentially exemplifies everything I cannot stand about Lebanese people, the last remnant of the odious Canaanites
     
    The word Canaanite is a meta-ethnic term that encompasses the various ethnicities of the Lower Levant region. It included the Ancient Hebrews; of which modern Jews and Palestinians are descended from. Allah has created you three peoples from the soil of Canaan; though you do not believe; so Allah has concealed this from you.

    https://youtu.be/_StyDnK27jk

    https://youtu.be/7lqEOR9UuBg


    What year is it from?
     
    1990.

    I agree the song is schlocky.

    The lyrics were written by a Libyan poet. You can read the translation here: https://lyricstranslate.com/en/wein-el-malayeen-where-are-millions.html#songtranslation

    The singer on the left is Libyan, in the center is Lebanese, and on the right is Syrian.

    The lady in the middle is the most famous out of the three. She belongs to Lebanon's venerable Christian elite. She’s called Julia Boutros.

    "Where Are The Million?" was one of her worst songs; and unsurprisingly, the song which is most viewed on YouTube.

    She’s put out better music in her later years. I recommend the following if you’re interested:

    1) Entasar Lebnan
    2) E7zar
    3) Ya Ayoha El Kibar
    4) Ahibai
    5) Watani
    6) Atleq Niranak
    7) Ghabet Shams El Haq
    8) Ya Thowar El Ard
    9) Noqawem
    10) Ya Ossas
    11) Moqawem
    12) Ya Shaabi
    13) Al Haq Silahi
    14) Aba Majdak

    She’s performed a lot of live orchestral concerts over the past few years. This one held in a Roman auditorium was her best:

    https://youtu.be/X9wR8MGwfEE

    The vocals and orchestration in some of her older concerts were quite good; but the sound engineering was disappointing. She was edging on 50 years old in some of her latest concerts, so she looks a bit worse than when she was younger; but she is always immaculately dressed, modest and graceful in demeanor. I'm surprised you did not find her attractive. Perhaps she looks better to your eyes in another outfit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ow0RCAB0aGQ&ab_channel=JuliaBoutros

    The above song is entitled "Atlek Niranak" which can be translated as "Fire Your Weapons". In it she chastises "the enemy" for "coming to us, hallucinating"; and urges the Lebanese Armed Forces to "fire away, don't show mercy" until the enemy (Israel) is "dead in your land, or defeated". She's performed multiple other nationalistic songs lambasting Israel and in support of Lebanese militias like Hezbollah. I was slightly disturbed at first by some of the quasi-fascistic lyrics; which stood in stark contrast to the refined atmosphere of the concerts she sang in. But I've since gotten used to it. While I wouldn't necessarily agree with the aggressive intention of the words, it's probably good that Lebanon's elites have a good sense of peoplehood; and can identify which groups mean them harm. Your comments on the Lebanese reinforce this.

    Israel hasn’t outputted much sophisticated music yet; just crappy Mizrahi pop stuff. Hatikvah is quite good; but it was lifted from a Czech composer. My favorite piece of Jewish music is Sholom Aleykhem; performed by Itzhak Perlman.

    https://youtu.be/5hMOcDDYFXU

    I also liked Regine Zylberberg's rendition of My Yiddishe Momme; and Maurice El-Medioni's Ahla Wa Sahla. But none of these songs are Israeli. I'm interested in recommendations of good Israeli songs.


    The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, “white liberals” are not a race). Awful people.
     
    Racist much? I disagree.

    Racist much? I disagree.
     
    You don’t think HBD is valid?

    Replies: @Greasy William

    , @Talha
    @Greasy William


    The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity
     
    Whaaat??!! How did Persians lose first spot?

    I thought you wanted Persians exterminated to the last man...what happened?

    Peace.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    , @silviosilver
    @Greasy William


    Back in my Jewish nationalist days
     
    I'm curious, why'd you give that up? What do you call yourself now?

    The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, “white liberals” are not a race). Awful people.
     
    Heh, a man after my own heart. More realistically, first prize in this category perennially belongs to the Africanus, but among actual humans ( :) ) it's hard to top them Lebanese bastards. I make an exception for the Christians, whom I like much better, but the rest can go FOAD.

    In my aimless drifter years wasted as a young man, I was good friends with a bunch of Lebanese muzzes. At a stretch, I could say some good things about them, but overall I have nothing but straight up regret. I ran into one of them a couple of years ago. I heard someone call out my name and looked, but didn't recognize anyone. I always get a bad feeling when this happens, because if they recognize me (which is easy, I look the same) but I don't recognize them, it means I knew them from my distant past, and there's essentially no one I want to know from back then. So I braced myself, but it went okay, was mercifully brief, and no bs promises to catch up again.


    Both the song as well as the music video are garbage.
     
    @1:50, the dude with the slingshot. Go get 'em tiger. (Bit of Australiana for you, that weapon was known by one and all as a "shanghai" when I was a kid, maybe still is. Kids would make them from bicycle innertubes and fire marbles, among other projectiles.)

    Agree about the song. 90% of arab music sounds like that to me; I have a hard time telling the difference between them. Very occasionally, I find something that I actually enjoy, though the thrill passes quickly.

    I'm in Yahya's bad books again, so he probably won't reply, but there was some arab movie I saw many years ago (20?), I'm guessing it was probably Egyptian, since 95% of arab movies are Egyptian. I don't think I saw the whole thing, just a scene in which some musician or aspiring musician was, I think, trying to impress his host at the house he was visiting - or maybe it was a music producer he was visiting - and anyway, he starts singing this very simple song that I still remember and which I often think of whenever I hear arab music playing. I don't know the actual words in arabic, but it sounded to me like "sidi wer wer, sidi wer wer, sidi wera wera wera sidi wer wer," and then a "choir" (or "back up" singers) repeated it that line. The host/producer was rolling his eyes, unimpressed; I'm guessing the film was some comedy. I wonder if Yahya knows the song or what the movie was?

    Replies: @Yahya

  511. @AP
    @AaronB


    AP was equally if not more categorical and full of himself
     
    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ's message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.

    The theory of art I’m advancing with regard to Bach is one that will obviously be deeply offensive to ethnic nationalists who desire national consensus and bland uniformity
     
    No, it's just dumbly arrogant.

    You claim that Bach rebelled against Christendom in his art and that his art was fundamentally opposed to it. In a way, you compared Bach to yourself, as a fellow rebel.

    Silvio said it better than I could:

    "A celebration of Jesus is a celebration of the Christian faith, and when that faith is celebrated by an artist [Bach] in the context of a Christian civilization, it is far more plausible that the artist approves of that civilization than disapproves of it, let alone stands in staunch opposition to the totality of it."

    Your response:

    Look at it this way – art is an act of imagination, in other words, it looks beyond the existing and factual to the possible.
     
    Sure.

    Political and social institutions are not built on ideals
     
    Of course they are. Certainly Christendom was. As was Communism, and Nazism. Even capitalism.

    Art and beauty – as acts of that faculty which let’s us soar beyond the existing into the realm of the ideal and possible – are then, clearly, necessarily in tension with actually existing conditions
     
    There is no tension between a Christian society and an art that celebrates Christ, merely because Christian rulers are busy with necessities such as tax collection and buildings roads and walls, n addition to lavishly sponsoring Christian arts and artists such as Bach. If Bach were forced to make furniture rather than compose music he might experience some inner tension, but there is no evidence and no reason to believe that he experienced tension by making Christian music for and within a Christian society, under the patronage of Christian rulers. Particularly tension towards that same Christian society.

    More specifically, the artists I cited, as a matter of concrete fact, created works that celebrate a value system that is in diametric opposition to the existing institutions, based as they are on power relations
     
    According to you personal interpretation, and not that of the Churches and society of Bach's time and place.

    And now the centerpiece of your arrogance:

    It doesn’t even matter if we resurrect Bach and he tells us plainly he did not see the civilization of his day as unjust and was not consciously trying to criticize it – his art embodies a criticism of it, and all that would mean is Bach wasn’t very politically perceptive.
     
    Yes, a non-Christian rando knows and understands better what Bach was about than even Bach himself.

    Great art is always greater than the intentions of it’s creator
     
    But not so great that AaronB hasn't figured out its true nature.

    Vatican and the Cathedrals did not exactly manifest a spirit of humility
     
    They celebrated God in beautiful ways.

    I do indeed contend that the Church from very early on went wrong and represented an illegitimate fusion of power and religion
     
    Indeed, AaronB thinks he knows better about the nature of Christianity than did the Church Fathers from early on. Because he read some Gospels himself.

    ::::::::::::::::::::::

    Incidentally, there was a discussion about virtues among the rich and the poor. I can't speak of the very rich, I only know a small handful of those and it may not be a representative sample. But in our Christian and immediately post-Christian society, the comfortable are more virtuous than the poor. This can be empirically measured.

    For example, divorce rate by profession. It is much lower among people such as engineers or physicians than among laborers:

    https://i.imgur.com/9VHd1ys.png

    Heroin use, more popular among poorer people:

    https://www.cdc.gov/vitalsigns/heroin/infographic.html

    Wealthier people have higher marriage rates and lower divorce rates:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32886585/

    Wealthy people 7 times less likely to grow up and commit violent crimes than poor people in Sweden:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4180846/

    Wealthier people less likely to kill their domestic partners in the USA, even when taking race into account:

    https://scholarworks.uni.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1009&context=ijghhd

    Poor people commit more of every type of crime in Toronto:

    https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/b5ab6df3741649c4bcc0a5fbd9e3b45b

    Both very rich and very poor had higher number of sexual partners:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32886585/

    Poor people more obese (thus, the sin of gluttony):

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7484407/#:~:text=Socioeconomic%20status%20(SES)%20is%20an,variable%20over%20time%20%5B2%5D.

    Poor adolescents more likely to commit all kinds of sex crimes than rich ones:

    https://heinonline.org/HOL/LandingPage?handle=hein.journals/ijotcc40&div=39&id=&page=

    I am deliberately using rich societies as examples because in such societies even the poor are not desperate. Nobody is starving to death in Sweden or Canada or the USA.

    :::::::::::::::

    I claimed that in a society that reflects Christian values, the more prosperous within that society are more likely to live by Christina virtues, such as not abusing one's body through drug abuse, not killing, getting married, etc. That is, they are less sinful than poor people. With the exception of the richest peoples' tendency to have as many sexual partners as do poor people (but fewer than do the middle classes), the data support that claim.

    Thus, it is correct to claim that the poor and more marginalized are in general more less virtuous and more sinful than the middle and upper classes. Which means that they are in more need of help and correction.

    Replies: @A123, @AaronB, @LatW

    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ’s message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.

    As Christian… I must Object.

    Having multiple Bibles allows those who believe in Jesus to question the “Church that put together those Gospels”. All Bibles are the works of fallible men. There is no “incredible arrogance” in questioning a specious interpretation or bogus translation.

    When Church aligns with God… It is Good.
    When Church does not align with God… The Church is at fault.

    Pope Muhammad Francis’s hatred of Jesus Christ vividly shows the horror of a failed Church. The Church of England also embraces anti-God deviance.

    Are these TRUTHS not obvious for all to see?

    PEACE 😇

  512. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @AP
    @AaronB


    AP was equally if not more categorical and full of himself
     
    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ's message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.

    The theory of art I’m advancing with regard to Bach is one that will obviously be deeply offensive to ethnic nationalists who desire national consensus and bland uniformity
     
    No, it's just dumbly arrogant.

    You claim that Bach rebelled against Christendom in his art and that his art was fundamentally opposed to it. In a way, you compared Bach to yourself, as a fellow rebel.

    Silvio said it better than I could:

    "A celebration of Jesus is a celebration of the Christian faith, and when that faith is celebrated by an artist [Bach] in the context of a Christian civilization, it is far more plausible that the artist approves of that civilization than disapproves of it, let alone stands in staunch opposition to the totality of it."

    Your response:

    Look at it this way – art is an act of imagination, in other words, it looks beyond the existing and factual to the possible.
     
    Sure.

    Political and social institutions are not built on ideals
     
    Of course they are. Certainly Christendom was. As was Communism, and Nazism. Even capitalism.

    Art and beauty – as acts of that faculty which let’s us soar beyond the existing into the realm of the ideal and possible – are then, clearly, necessarily in tension with actually existing conditions
     
    There is no tension between a Christian society and an art that celebrates Christ, merely because Christian rulers are busy with necessities such as tax collection and buildings roads and walls, n addition to lavishly sponsoring Christian arts and artists such as Bach. If Bach were forced to make furniture rather than compose music he might experience some inner tension, but there is no evidence and no reason to believe that he experienced tension by making Christian music for and within a Christian society, under the patronage of Christian rulers. Particularly tension towards that same Christian society.

    More specifically, the artists I cited, as a matter of concrete fact, created works that celebrate a value system that is in diametric opposition to the existing institutions, based as they are on power relations
     
    According to you personal interpretation, and not that of the Churches and society of Bach's time and place.

    And now the centerpiece of your arrogance:

    It doesn’t even matter if we resurrect Bach and he tells us plainly he did not see the civilization of his day as unjust and was not consciously trying to criticize it – his art embodies a criticism of it, and all that would mean is Bach wasn’t very politically perceptive.
     
    Yes, a non-Christian rando knows and understands better what Bach was about than even Bach himself.

    Great art is always greater than the intentions of it’s creator
     
    But not so great that AaronB hasn't figured out its true nature.

    Vatican and the Cathedrals did not exactly manifest a spirit of humility
     
    They celebrated God in beautiful ways.

    I do indeed contend that the Church from very early on went wrong and represented an illegitimate fusion of power and religion
     
    Indeed, AaronB thinks he knows better about the nature of Christianity than did the Church Fathers from early on. Because he read some Gospels himself.

    ::::::::::::::::::::::

    Incidentally, there was a discussion about virtues among the rich and the poor. I can't speak of the very rich, I only know a small handful of those and it may not be a representative sample. But in our Christian and immediately post-Christian society, the comfortable are more virtuous than the poor. This can be empirically measured.

    For example, divorce rate by profession. It is much lower among people such as engineers or physicians than among laborers:

    https://i.imgur.com/9VHd1ys.png

    Heroin use, more popular among poorer people:

    https://www.cdc.gov/vitalsigns/heroin/infographic.html

    Wealthier people have higher marriage rates and lower divorce rates:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32886585/

    Wealthy people 7 times less likely to grow up and commit violent crimes than poor people in Sweden:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4180846/

    Wealthier people less likely to kill their domestic partners in the USA, even when taking race into account:

    https://scholarworks.uni.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1009&context=ijghhd

    Poor people commit more of every type of crime in Toronto:

    https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/b5ab6df3741649c4bcc0a5fbd9e3b45b

    Both very rich and very poor had higher number of sexual partners:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32886585/

    Poor people more obese (thus, the sin of gluttony):

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7484407/#:~:text=Socioeconomic%20status%20(SES)%20is%20an,variable%20over%20time%20%5B2%5D.

    Poor adolescents more likely to commit all kinds of sex crimes than rich ones:

    https://heinonline.org/HOL/LandingPage?handle=hein.journals/ijotcc40&div=39&id=&page=

    I am deliberately using rich societies as examples because in such societies even the poor are not desperate. Nobody is starving to death in Sweden or Canada or the USA.

    :::::::::::::::

    I claimed that in a society that reflects Christian values, the more prosperous within that society are more likely to live by Christina virtues, such as not abusing one's body through drug abuse, not killing, getting married, etc. That is, they are less sinful than poor people. With the exception of the richest peoples' tendency to have as many sexual partners as do poor people (but fewer than do the middle classes), the data support that claim.

    Thus, it is correct to claim that the poor and more marginalized are in general more less virtuous and more sinful than the middle and upper classes. Which means that they are in more need of help and correction.

    Replies: @A123, @AaronB, @LatW

    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ’s message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.

    Perhaps then, AP, you are not arrogant enough, and you can use a little of my Jewish arrogance 🙂

    I’m beginning to think Dmitry was the better psychologist here and understood you better than I did. I thought you were this devilishly cunning fellow who was trying to subvert religion, but Dmitry thought you were a simple and ignorant person.

    Perhaps I succumbed – for once – to the atmosphere of conspiracy theories so prevalent on this site, which I am usually proof against, and saw malign intent and masterful strategy where there was simply tragic human finitude.

    I understand you differently now, and see as a completely different type – it was your moving encomium to wealth and comfort, so innocent, so optimistic, so pure, so sincere and uncomplicated, so childish, that has given me a different perspective on you.

    You, AP, did everything right – you followed blindly the dictates of your culture and society, without questioning it. You were a good boy. You did what everyone said was the right thing, what everyone said would lead to happiness and satisfaction. You studied hard, got a good job, pursued money, lived comfortably, worked hard, advanced in your career, worshipped the State cult exactly as the authorities said you should. You were respectable, damn it.

    And yet, somehow, it was all empty – you didn’t feel the happiness you were promised. Nothing ever happened, and life stagnated. In the words Thoreau used to describe the mainstream man, you lived a life of “quiet desperation”.

    Still, you’re the one who is supposed to be happy, by rights – someone like me, who laughs at respectability, who has all the wrong opinions, who goes adventuring in the wilderness half the year, who does everything wrong, is supposed to be miserable, by God.

    And homeless people? By God, they’re just desserts is to suffer – yet maybe, perhaps, some of them are actually much happier than AP 🙂 And that cannot be. The sheer gall of it.

    Therefore, those homeless who have chosen their lot must be forcibly made to live like AP as much as possible – and AaronB must cease his wilderness expeditions and start focusing on being economically productive, just like AP 🙂 It is for their own good, really – but more importantly, the idea that they are the happy ones cannot be permitted to stand.

    I am, unfortunately, very, very familiar with this mentality. I have friends who take “pity” on me and try and get me married, and live “normally” – when, eventually, they realize that I am actually much happier than they are, the shock and rage are almost comical.

    There is in this world, in a way, a “conspiracy against happiness” – most people are broken by society, and cannot resist it’s dictates, and then set about trying to make sure no one else escapes. If I am not happy, none can be.

    Had you had a little more intestinal fortitude, AP, a little more arrogance, independence, and rebelliousness, you would have been able to resist social conditioning.

    It is merely a pity, and a sad but all too familiar commentary on human finitude and limitation. And I am here, as much as possible, to ensure future APs have the courage to resist.

    Cheers.

    • LOL: Ivashka the fool, AP
    • Replies: @AP
    @AaronB


    it was your moving encomium to wealth and comfort
     
    I simply provided empirical facts that demonstrate your arrogance and that the poor are more prone to sin than are the middle and upper classes, who are more virtuous.

    You don't like to be confronted by facts.

    In presenting you with such facts, I caused you to respond with a lengthy and comical diatribe in which through a fantasy about me you revealed your own fears. Apparently your family and friends all tried to turn you into a normal and productive member of society. You admitted to having a very solidly bourgeois origin. For some reason this is a problem for you (your hatred of authority suggests why), so you rebel by running away. But you can't run away from yourself. You will always be this bourgeois, this consumer at your core. You run to the hills but treat the experience like a 4K television. This may be why people with genuine East-infused spirituality are almost always annoyed by you, the inauthentic tourist into their world.

    Here is a funny quote by the Czech author, Kundera. It's about people like you:

    "A long time a go a certain Cynic philosopher proudly paraded around Athens in a moth-eaten coat, hoping that everyone would admire his contempt for convention. When Socrates met him, he said: Through the hole in your coat I see your vanity. Your dirt, too, dear sir, is self-indulgent and your self-indulgence is dirty."

    Replies: @AaronB

    , @silviosilver
    @AaronB


    You, AP, did everything right – you followed blindly the dictates of your culture and society, without questioning it.
     
    How do you know he "blindly" followed it? How do you know he didn't question it and, having questioned it, having examined various alternatives, agreed that it was sound advice? Was everything our elders advised us to do necessarily bullshit, such that it ought to have been stubbornly resisted simply because our elders advised it?

    And yet, somehow, it was all empty – you didn’t feel the happiness you were promised. Nothing ever happened, and life stagnated. In the words Thoreau used to describe the mainstream man, you lived a life of “quiet desperation”.
     
    You sound very sure of yourself. Am I to understand you employed the same means of inquiry here as you did when you intuited the "internal logic" driving the creative endeavors of artists long dead, namely "it's plausible, and it would please me if it were true, so I'm running with it"?

    And Thoreau, Schmoreau. Listen bucko, I took the alternative route in life. Or the "scenic route," as I'd humorously call it, in a bid to keep the looming avalanche of regret at bay. "Quiet desperation" huh? Lol, I bet anyone who's experienced the real fucking thing - mass anxiety levels of desperation - would settle for the quiet variety in a heartbeat. And what grand adventures did I have anyway? What the actual living fuck did I ever do that I couldn't have done while maintaining a sense of balance and proportion, so that today I'd be light years closer to the very career, family and community goals I'm now playing desperado-style catch-up to achieve - and not because of any cockamamie notions of "social pressure" (in Libtardia? yeah right) to achieve them, but because I myself recognize them as worthy ideals.

    If I sound angry, sorry. I'm certainly not angry at you. I'm actually grinning bittersweetly as I type these words. Sweetly because I grant there were some good times, and that to an extent I can take some pride in having marched to the beat of my own drum. And bitterly because of me it may be said, there are fools, there are damn fools, and there is silviosilver. "The kid had everything going for him - he threw it all away." But oh well, it's not so bad. The irrepressible optimist is right to insist that life goes on.

    someone like me, who laughs at respectability, who has all the wrong opinions, who goes adventuring in the wilderness half the year, who does everything wrong, is supposed to be miserable, by God.
     
    You're living in a time warp. The last time that was true, the internet was still on dial-up. That set of standards has completely fallen by the wayside.

    and AaronB must cease his wilderness expeditions and start focusing on being economically productive, just like AP 🙂 It is for their own good, really – but more importantly, the idea that they are the happy ones cannot be permitted to stand.
     
    Sorry to break it to you, Walter Mitty, but that's all in your head. No one's stopping you from doing what you want. ("Call the authorities, Aaron's off 4WDing again!") If all it takes to spoil your fun is someone disapproving of your choices, then I think you've got some "issues" you need to sort through. (I recommend Nathaniel Branden!)

    I have friends who take “pity” on me and try and get me married, and live “normally” – when, eventually, they realize that I am actually much happier than they are, the shock and rage are almost comical.
     
    Interesting. I've had the opposite experience, especially with friends a bit older than me, who had achieved a measure of success by (old-school) conventional standards - careers, families, mortgages etc. When they'd spout guff like "Ah silv you don't know how lucky you are that you never married" or "Ah silv, if I could do it all again, I wouldn't have had kids", then silviosilver, that greatest of fools, would fight to choke back the glee, delighted to have the wisdom of his life choices so authentically confirmed in the pained exhalations of his friends.

    Had you had a little more intestinal fortitude, AP, a little more arrogance, independence, and rebelliousness, you would have been able to resist social conditioning.
     
    I for one am grateful AP proved such a "wimp." I would take a society composed of AP's over a society of silviosilvers or AaronB's any day. It may be less fun (that LOL he attached to your post may well be the first time I've seen him laugh), but it'd be a happier, wealthier and wiser society.

    Replies: @AaronB, @AP

  513. @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    Arestovych (or is it Arestovitch?) is a very intelligent and charismatic man. He has spoken in defense of the Russian language and culture in Ukraine from the excessive tribalism that is understandably demonstrated by some Ukrainian nationalists. It is the sensible thing to do. Russian speakers would self-identify as Ukrainians more than before the war, but they will not disappear. Moreover, Russians who would look for an Eastern Slav country that is organized along European values, will look to Ukraine when the war is over. If they see only hate and ressentment this would turn them off and push them in the embrace of Prigozhin (who is a Jew) and the like.

    Arestovitch has clearly shown that he is an able politician and I think that he is already preparing his future. I don't think he made a mistake when he talked about the anti- aerial defense rocket in Dnepropetrovsk, these things have happened before and will happen again in the future, war brings a lot of suffering to civilians, some of it might be due to friendly fire. I think he knew what he was doing when he talked to Feigin and I believe the same about his resignation. BTW the man is supposedly a bisexual, which is in line with the current Davos consensus. If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.

    Replies: @LatW, @A123

    If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.

    It is important to note that the WEF declares “Young Global Leaders” by surprise. There is no prior approval or opportunity to decline. Therefore, a biography with the YGL tag is an involuntary historical attribute.

    It has little to no predictive value as to future policy or beliefs.

    PEACE 😇

  514. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    An Algerian friend once told me that they had two great politicians:
     
    Three: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emir_Abdelkader

    A man of great humanity and integrity.


    I should have kept strongmen, but shouldn’t have mentioned populists. I include Arab kings among the strongmen, if they’re weak they won’t last long.
     
    The history of political leadership in the Arab world is rather similar to many regions around the world; mostly mediocrities, a fair number of ghastly characters and very rarely, an honest and intelligent leader. The proportion of ghastly characters is slightly more than Western democracies due to a lack of checks and balances and few restraints on arbitrary power. On the other hand, the high degree of concentration in power has allowed a few competent leaders to single-handedly drag their nations to modernity, and in some cases to maximize their potential given human capital constraints.

    Ten examples of such excellent Arab heads of state:

    1) Foud Chehab (strongman)
    2) Muhammad Ali Pasha (monarch)
    3) Hamid Bourghiba (strongman)
    4) Sultan Qabboos (monarch)
    5) Zahir al-Umar (strongman)
    6) Sheikh Mohamad bin Rashid (monarch)
    7) King Faisal of Iraq (monarch)
    8) King Abdullah I of Jordan (monarch)
    9) King Faisal of Saudi Arabia (monarch)
    10) Fakhr El-Din (monarch)

    As you can see, they were disproportionately of the royal bent; and two of the three enlightened strongmen, Fouad Chehab and Zahir Al-Umar, were drawn from the old Levantine ruling elite. Only Hamid Bourghiba was born to a poor family of no particular noble lineage. Ironically his Kemalist ideology of female emancipation and staunch secularism would probably put him as most far removed ideologically from the general populace. But overall; none of the great Arab leaders were populist panderers to Boobus Arabicus, to borrow a phrase from H.L. Mencken. And only Fouad Chehab had to contend with appealing to the median voter to gain support for his initiatives; the rest were free from popular constraints.

    The great benefit of the monarchial system; other than not having to pander to popular opinion; is the moderation and technocratic bent of nearly all monarchs. Especially in the 20th century Arab world; the monarchs tended to be uniformly hostile to Islamism and Communism. In the present day you can also observe that otherwise intellectually mediocre monarchs like the ones found in UAE, Jordan and Morocco can steer the ship of state fairly competently by appointing capable technocrats and delegating authority downwards. In Saudi Arabia the cabinet is usually filled with PhD's and graduates of American Ivy Leagues.

    The monarch, aided by his high upbringing, is also more likely to cultivate an elevated taste and impart the refinement onto the nation at large, to great aesthetic benefit. This was true of a monarchs such as Louis XIV of France and Frederick The Great of Prussia. In the Middle East, Sultan Qaboos and Mohammad Reza Shah of Iran were keen on encouraging high-culture activities in their nations.

    The monarchal system however does encounter the perennial threat of the Bad Emperor; though in my view the threat of ghastly kings has greatly reduced in the era of globalization and international pressure. Dictators like Saddam or Gaddafi would more likely be immune from outside pressure due to popular appeal; thus more susceptible to violating human rights. Kings have their exalted reputations to maintain; notice how MBS for example back-tracked and cowered in fear of international opinion after the Khashoggi debacle. Conversely, the non-monarchal Gaddafi and Saddam continued with their madness to the very end.


    Arabs are unfit for democracy,
     
    The question of "fit" or "unfit" imo should be rephrased to "what works best under the circumstances". Lebanon is a democracy and was the most prosperous non-oil Arab state for much of the 20th and 21st century. Conversely, Egypt was authoritarian and lagged Lebanon in nearly all indicators. One could've looked at these data points and concluded that Egypt should've adopted democracy to become more like Lebanon. But the cultural differences would've lead to a different outcome. Lebanon was primed for democracy by the Jesuit educational influence which infused Western values into the Lebanese polity and allowed for compatibility with the democratic system. Egypt had no such cultural conditioning thus did not value critical ingredients such as freedom of expression and protection of minority rights; making it more prone to demagoguery and a descent to majoritarian oppression.

    Whether one polity is fit or unfit for democracy has as much to do with culture as genetics. It took a long time for democracy to develop in Western Europe. The universal-franchise Western democracy of today would be a mystery to a Englishman living in the 18th century. Even then the concept of protection of minority rights was somewhat shaky; the Gordon Riots of 1780 were a popular backlash to the Papist Reforms which eased discrimination laws against Catholics in Great Britain and Ireland.

    In theory, the conditions necessary for a functioning democracy could develop over time in the Arab world. But the present situation makes a monarchal system preferable. Cicero contends that the ideal form of government is a combination of monarchy, democracy, and aristocracy. I would tend to agree with him in a general sense; only that sometimes the circumstances make only one system preferable.

    But ultimately, I think the discerning George C. Lewis was right: the quality of the people matters more than the system of government.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Ivashka the fool

    You’re absolutely right about Emir Abdelkader !

    The man was a hero, a poet and a Sufi mystic. I had the pleasure of reading some of his letters and poetry translated in French once. When he lived in exile in Syria he along his men saved local Christians from a rioting Muslim mob. AFAIK he is buried in the same mosque where Ibn Al Arabi is. If only more Muslims were like him, this world would be a better place and their countries would be much more pleasant. Unfortunately this is not the case. BTW he exchanged letters with Imam Shamil- the Avarian leader of the Caucasus people who fought against the Tsarist troops. And amusingly enough Abdelkader has been initiated into a Masonic lodge while kept in captivity in France. An interesting man.

    About Arab politics, I really have too little information and a limited interest. All I know is that there are supposedly more than 400 million Arab people around the world, let’s say that around 1/4 of them are able-bodied men – that would be some 100 million. And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham (that would be Arabs and Jews). So from a pure will to power pov, every Isreali Jew is worth more than a dozen Arabs.

    Anyway, this family feud between the feeble willed multitudes of Arabs and the strong willed minority of Jews, poisons the existence of other people around the world. It’s time you Semites find a solution to the problem. Either kill each other, or make peace for the Demiurge’s sake, or let the Persians put some order in that land.

    🙂

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    About Arab politics, I really have too little information and a limited interest. All I know is that there are supposedly more than 400 million Arab people around the world, let’s say that around 1/4 of them are able-bodied men – that would be some 100 million. And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham (that would be Arabs and Jews).
     
    It's quite apparent you have a limited interest, otherwise it'd be hard to believe you could take such a simplistic view of things. A high school student would probably be embarrassed to submit this thesis, even for no other reason than the intuitive feeling that there's got to be me more to the story.

    Put aside "the Arabs" for a moment, and just consider the billion or whatever Muslims, probably none of whom are happy that the holy land fell into Jewish hands. Do you really suppose they wake up each morning asking themselves what they can do today to help wrest control of Palestine? Even if you imagine they're as ethnocentrically motivated as you - and your comments in the past about muslims suggests you do believe something close to this - it doesn't make sense to pretend that's what they been trying to do all this time. People from the wider muslim world - and we can specify here particularly from the Arab part of it - who feel that strongly about the issue tend to join movements like the Muslim Brotherhood or ISIS, but even there Israel/Palestine is not the primary focus of their efforts.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    BTW he exchanged letters with Imam Shamil- the Avarian leader of the Caucasus people who fought against the Tsarist troops.
     
    A great man too; an embodiment of the Aristotelian virtues. In the words of Tolstoy: "Yet it stood firm and did not surrender to man who had destroyed all its brothers around it… “What vitality!” I thought. “Man has conquered everything and destroyed millions of plants, yet this one won’t submit.” If Hollywood was worth its salt; they would've made a movie about him. His story is greater than fiction.

    And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham

     

    Well as Napoleon perceptively noted “in war the moral is to the physical as three is to one". There's always going to be an asymmetry in motivation between Arab forces and Israel; regardless of numbers or machinery. The Israelis are fighting for their sole homeland; and on a fundamental level their right to exist. Arab forces are fighting on behalf of Palestinians; who though they may be of the same ethnicity; are still a separate people from Lebanese, Egyptians, Iraqis etc. Moreover, Israel's manpower doesn't just number 8 million; they have the wealthy Jewish diaspora, who in addition to providing monetary aid have co-opted the world's superpower into backing Israel in every conflict.

    We can see today how Russia struggles against a nation 4 times lesser in size. There is a motivational disparity; and the Ukrainians are backed up by Western arms and intelligence.

    When Egypt was fighting for its own territory; they made the Israelis shit their pants in '73. Hezbollah likewise successfully resisted Israeli incursions on Lebanese territory; despite being outgunned. Motivation makes all the difference.


    Anyway, this family feud between the feeble willed multitudes of Arabs and the strong willed minority of Jews, poisons the existence of other people around the world.
     
    I see, we are going to be lectured by Slavs on poisonous family feuds.

    If you respect your ancestors, not a nation, not some people far away, not a culture, not even a religion – just your ancestors – those who lived before you, so you can live today – then you should care about these things.
     
    You make a good point about respect for one's ancestors. But I don't see the usefulness of haplogroups in determining present-day identity. My R1a paternal lineage, shared by most Russians but only a small minority of Arabs, would mean I would have to care more for Russians than Egyptians or Arabians. While I respect and admire the Russian ethnos; they are not my people - Egyptians are. So yes I will take pride in Naguib Mahfouz and Queen Nefertiti; and even Queen Zenobia and Butrus Al-Bustani. My identity is Arab not Indo-European.

    Thanks for the information on the ancient presence of R1A in the Middle East. With regards to my own ancestry; my R1A lineage could have Indo-Iranian origins, since my family name is derived from this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoja. We do not belong to a tribe in Saudi; but are what's known as Khadiri people; that is urban Hijazis who have origins from outside the peninsula.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Mr. Hack

  515. @LatW
    @AaronB


    with your talk of “genetic lineages”, and the need to secure their survival [..] pursuing what is a sublimated form of personal ego ends, after all.
     
    The desire to preserve the "genetic lineages" resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego. You cannot blame a flower for wanting to receive water and sunlight and to grow.

    Replies: @AaronB, @Talha, @Yahya, @S

    One of the biggest unaddressed divides within humanity is the one between those who accept the organic whole that both nature and nurture are of a roughly equal importance, and those who think nurture by itself is almost everything, and that physically people are more or less interchangeable, or, fungible.

    It doesn’t have to be either/or as the world is a big place with abundant resources.

    What should of been arranged long ago between the two groups is an amicable parting of the ways.

    Of course, if someone is totalitarian and wants total world power for themselves, such an arrangement might not be possible.

  516. @Yahya
    @AP

    You missed the part about emigres in the sentence above.

    I don't get the impression that Lebanese Christians feel "invaded" by Lebanese Muslims.

    Chaldeans i'm not familiar with.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Maronite Lebanese I have personally known don’t really like their Shia compatriots. Orthodox Lebanese much less so. Interestingly enough, I have also known a couple Shia Lebanese, a guy who was not religious at all and a hijab wearing young lady, very well behaved people both of them.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Ivashka the fool

    Lebanon was an unstable mistake as formed by the French. Maronite Christians, Sunni Muslims, and Druze were what Frank Herbert described:


    "In politics, the tripod is he most unstable of all structures. It's be bad enough without the complication of a feudal trade culture which turns its back on most science."
     
    The Nasrallah-shima blast that destroyed the port of Beirut is 100% in the name of Muhammad (and Khamenei). Shia made the "tri" into a "quad".

    The future of Lebanon is partition. Druze and Christians excluding the horror of Satan/Allah/Lucifer from Christendom.

    PEACE 😇

  517. @Yahya
    @LatW


    The desire to preserve the “genetic lineages” resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego.
     
    Actually only a tiny (probably <1%) percentage of the population cares about genetic lineage. Most people are too short-minded to think from a long-term perspective. Notice how literally zero politicians running for office ever mention "genetic lineage" or euphemistic alternatives to appeal to voters. It's always "jobs" and "housing" etc.

    Greg Cochran mentioned that race is a weak unit for people to band together around. He used the ancient Middle Easterners lack of unity at the face of Greek conquests as an example of weak racial bonds. The denizens of Unzistan are atypical in being concerned with the preservation of genetic lineages on a racial level.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Talha, @LatW

    You mistake the popular for the significant.

    A lot of people on teh internets like cute kitten videos, and very few are interested in Gnostic scriptures. Does it mean that cute kitten had a deeper impact on human history and culture than let’s say Valentine the Gnostic ?

    My rule of thumb is: if it is widely popular – then it is most probably boring and vulgar. If it is only found among people of a certain cultural and intellectual level – then it might be worth learning about.

    Speaking of which:

    [MORE]

    This is highbrow elite entertainment !

    🙂

    • Thanks: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    You mistake the popular for the significant.
     
    I do not.

    I’ll reply to your post on the Arab-Israeli conflict tomorrow.


    are related to these other guys in the following pic:
     
    That’s why personally I don’t care much about “muh haplogroups”. My paternal haplogroup is R1A, but if I dig deep down; I don’t really care about the preservation of Indians or Eastern Slavs. I would prefer to see them survive and prosper; but I have no emotional stake in the outcome. But for Arabs I do care. That’s why ethnicity trumps paternal lineage for me.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  518. @Yahya
    @LatW


    The desire to preserve the “genetic lineages” resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego.
     
    Actually only a tiny (probably <1%) percentage of the population cares about genetic lineage. Most people are too short-minded to think from a long-term perspective. Notice how literally zero politicians running for office ever mention "genetic lineage" or euphemistic alternatives to appeal to voters. It's always "jobs" and "housing" etc.

    Greg Cochran mentioned that race is a weak unit for people to band together around. He used the ancient Middle Easterners lack of unity at the face of Greek conquests as an example of weak racial bonds. The denizens of Unzistan are atypical in being concerned with the preservation of genetic lineages on a racial level.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Talha, @LatW

    atypical in being concerned with the preservation of genetic lineages on a racial level.

    Atypical times…this is usually the sign of a society/civilization in a defensive posture, especially when you add in the aspect of fertility in a terminal nosedive. Conquest cultures/civilizations of the past thought nothing about spreading their genetics far and wide among the conquered. Vikings, Mongols, Arabs, Spaniards, Comanches…you name it. Up to and after the Korean War, one of the main reasons why laws were being changed to allow non-white immigration into the US were the needs of GIs bringing home Asian “war brides” – I had an exchange with Mr. Unz about this a while back with citations to articles.

    Patriarchal cultures are generally concerned with preserving their genetic lineage as progenitors; racial/ethnic purity is not really a concern.

    Wa salaam.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Talha

    Who told you that racial purity is a concern of people interested in Y haplogroups and genetic lineages?

    Look, a simple example - most Western European males are Y haplogroup R1b. And so are the greater part of the Chadic speaking Hausa people. The Western European males, although white and speaking mostly Indo-European languages (ignore the Basque, they're an outlier... sorry Mikel) are descended from the same Yamnaya lineage as the Black Hausa pastoralists of Chad.

    The guys in the picture below

    https://dailytrust.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Hausa.jpg

    are related to these other guys in the following pic:

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EsXEcUIW4AIPQqT.jpg

    And that's how their common ancestors looked like (sorry it's a pic of an unclad woman):

    https://i0.wp.com/archaeology.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/Illustration-8.jpg

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-6454345/amp/DNA-reveals-18-year-old-farmer-Ava-died-4-250-years-ago-daughter-immigrants.html

    With ancestors coming from a culture which oldest artifacts have been found in Northern Morocco quite close to the Jibal Al Tarek.

    See, no racism here at all, only a clearer understanding of who's who and how did we get here.

    That's lineage for you - as in a link between the past and the future.

    🙂

    Replies: @Talha

  519. @Greasy William
    @Yahya


    Operative word in my sentence was more.
     
    Just so long as we understand each other

    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs.
     
    Back in my Jewish nationalist days I interacted with many Christian, anti Israel Lebanese online. Their Arab identity is very nominal. I know they call themselves Arab but they also kinda see themselves as part European and they have a ridiculous and totally unjustified superiority complex towards other Arabs. The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, "white liberals" are not a race). Awful people.

    This is a music video by one such calls for “the Arab nation” to combat Israel.
     
    The only one I like is the one in the green and even she appears to have slight subcanthal tilt. I have no interest whatsoever in the other two. Both the song as well as the music video are garbage. If Arabs really took Arab nationalism seriously they would put a Jew in charge since they themselves obviously can't do it properly.

    In fact, this video essentially exemplifies everything I cannot stand about Lebanese people, the last remnant of the odious Canaanites. Thank you for this. What year is it from?

    You’ll like the Lebanese better if you focus on the female half of the population.
     
    No, the women are a million times worse than the men. I could occasionally find some common ground with the guys but never with the women.

    Rwanda cannot become a First World Country in the next 50 years, no matter the effectiveness of their governance.
     
    Racist much? I disagree.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Talha, @silviosilver

    In fact, this video essentially exemplifies everything I cannot stand about Lebanese people, the last remnant of the odious Canaanites

    The word Canaanite is a meta-ethnic term that encompasses the various ethnicities of the Lower Levant region. It included the Ancient Hebrews; of which modern Jews and Palestinians are descended from. Allah has created you three peoples from the soil of Canaan; though you do not believe; so Allah has concealed this from you.

    What year is it from?

    1990.

    I agree the song is schlocky.

    The lyrics were written by a Libyan poet. You can read the translation here: https://lyricstranslate.com/en/wein-el-malayeen-where-are-millions.html#songtranslation

    The singer on the left is Libyan, in the center is Lebanese, and on the right is Syrian.

    The lady in the middle is the most famous out of the three. She belongs to Lebanon’s venerable Christian elite. She’s called Julia Boutros.

    “Where Are The Million?” was one of her worst songs; and unsurprisingly, the song which is most viewed on YouTube.

    She’s put out better music in her later years. I recommend the following if you’re interested:

    1) Entasar Lebnan
    2) E7zar
    3) Ya Ayoha El Kibar
    4) Ahibai
    5) Watani
    6) Atleq Niranak
    7) Ghabet Shams El Haq
    8) Ya Thowar El Ard
    9) Noqawem
    10) Ya Ossas
    11) Moqawem
    12) Ya Shaabi
    13) Al Haq Silahi
    14) Aba Majdak

    She’s performed a lot of live orchestral concerts over the past few years. This one held in a Roman auditorium was her best:

    [MORE]

    The vocals and orchestration in some of her older concerts were quite good; but the sound engineering was disappointing. She was edging on 50 years old in some of her latest concerts, so she looks a bit worse than when she was younger; but she is always immaculately dressed, modest and graceful in demeanor. I’m surprised you did not find her attractive. Perhaps she looks better to your eyes in another outfit.

    The above song is entitled “Atlek Niranak” which can be translated as “Fire Your Weapons”. In it she chastises “the enemy” for “coming to us, hallucinating”; and urges the Lebanese Armed Forces to “fire away, don’t show mercy” until the enemy (Israel) is “dead in your land, or defeated”. She’s performed multiple other nationalistic songs lambasting Israel and in support of Lebanese militias like Hezbollah. I was slightly disturbed at first by some of the quasi-fascistic lyrics; which stood in stark contrast to the refined atmosphere of the concerts she sang in. But I’ve since gotten used to it. While I wouldn’t necessarily agree with the aggressive intention of the words, it’s probably good that Lebanon’s elites have a good sense of peoplehood; and can identify which groups mean them harm. Your comments on the Lebanese reinforce this.

    Israel hasn’t outputted much sophisticated music yet; just crappy Mizrahi pop stuff. Hatikvah is quite good; but it was lifted from a Czech composer. My favorite piece of Jewish music is Sholom Aleykhem; performed by Itzhak Perlman.

    I also liked Regine Zylberberg’s rendition of My Yiddishe Momme; and Maurice El-Medioni’s Ahla Wa Sahla. But none of these songs are Israeli. I’m interested in recommendations of good Israeli songs.

    The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, “white liberals” are not a race). Awful people.

    Racist much? I disagree.

    Racist much? I disagree.

    You don’t think HBD is valid?

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Yahya


    Israel hasn’t outputted much sophisticated music yet; just crappy Mizrahi pop stuff.
     
    I'm glad you share my low opinion of Mizrahi music. To me, all music and culture (including Jewish music and culture) from the Levant, North Africa, Arabia and the Caucasus is basically the same and, other than the food, I don't like any of it.

    I’m interested in recommendations of good Israeli songs.
     
    You're talking to the wrong guy. I don't like anything outside of pre 9/11 American culture. That and some Kpop.

    I was slightly disturbed at first by some of the quasi-fascistic lyrics
     
    "Quasi fascist" is a great way to describe the Lebanese, yes.

    In it she chastises “the enemy” for “coming to us, hallucinating
     
    lol wut? I suspect even Nasrallah rolled his eyes at that one. When it comes to Israel v Lebanon there is 0 question that Lebanon is the aggressor. Nasrallah has gone so far as to explicitly say as much. Ben Gurion admitted that the Zionist settlers were the aggressors v the Palestinians, so it wouldn't kill the Lebanese to show a little honesty for their own part.

    I recommend the following if you’re interested:
     
    Are we talking about music or looks? I'm not a music guy. As far as looks go, my favorite Lebanese singer was Fairouz. She was like a suped up Anne Frank. Totally my type.

    The singer on the left is Libyan, in the center is Lebanese, and on the right is Syrian
     
    So the one in the green is Syrian? She's hot. She looks like she probably has an attitude too, which I like.

    I’m surprised you did not find her attractive
     
    I like Middle Eastern women but I'm just not a fan of the type of Middle Eastern women that Middle Easterners themselves seem like the most. Lebanon has some actress named Haifa something who supposedly all the Lebanese girls wanted to look like back 10 to 20 and she never did anything for me at all. Lebanese and Palestinians are the kinda people who the typical girls you see getting interviewed on the street in YT vids mog the shit out of the famous actresses and singers.

    Although I'm not sure if maybe this song is from the time when Israel occupied southern Lebanon in which case the lyrics would at least make sense

    The word Canaanite is a meta-ethnic term that encompasses the various ethnicities of the Lower Levant region
     
    The Canaanites are from Ham, they aren't Semites. Ancient Canaan only contained, AFAIK, Canaanites (Ham), Israelites (Shem) and Philistines (Japheth). We aren't talking about a very big region. I have never heard the Canaanite designation applied to the latter 2 groups.

    Replies: @Yahya

  520. @Greasy William
    @Yahya


    Operative word in my sentence was more.
     
    Just so long as we understand each other

    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs.
     
    Back in my Jewish nationalist days I interacted with many Christian, anti Israel Lebanese online. Their Arab identity is very nominal. I know they call themselves Arab but they also kinda see themselves as part European and they have a ridiculous and totally unjustified superiority complex towards other Arabs. The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, "white liberals" are not a race). Awful people.

    This is a music video by one such calls for “the Arab nation” to combat Israel.
     
    The only one I like is the one in the green and even she appears to have slight subcanthal tilt. I have no interest whatsoever in the other two. Both the song as well as the music video are garbage. If Arabs really took Arab nationalism seriously they would put a Jew in charge since they themselves obviously can't do it properly.

    In fact, this video essentially exemplifies everything I cannot stand about Lebanese people, the last remnant of the odious Canaanites. Thank you for this. What year is it from?

    You’ll like the Lebanese better if you focus on the female half of the population.
     
    No, the women are a million times worse than the men. I could occasionally find some common ground with the guys but never with the women.

    Rwanda cannot become a First World Country in the next 50 years, no matter the effectiveness of their governance.
     
    Racist much? I disagree.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Talha, @silviosilver

    The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity

    Whaaat??!! How did Persians lose first spot?

    I thought you wanted Persians exterminated to the last man…what happened?

    Peace.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Talha

    1. Iranians. There is no such thing as Persians.
    2. I don't believe in any of that blood and soil bullshit anymore and I'm embarrassed I ever did in the first place. People are people.

  521. @Yahya
    @Greasy William


    In fact, this video essentially exemplifies everything I cannot stand about Lebanese people, the last remnant of the odious Canaanites
     
    The word Canaanite is a meta-ethnic term that encompasses the various ethnicities of the Lower Levant region. It included the Ancient Hebrews; of which modern Jews and Palestinians are descended from. Allah has created you three peoples from the soil of Canaan; though you do not believe; so Allah has concealed this from you.

    https://youtu.be/_StyDnK27jk

    https://youtu.be/7lqEOR9UuBg


    What year is it from?
     
    1990.

    I agree the song is schlocky.

    The lyrics were written by a Libyan poet. You can read the translation here: https://lyricstranslate.com/en/wein-el-malayeen-where-are-millions.html#songtranslation

    The singer on the left is Libyan, in the center is Lebanese, and on the right is Syrian.

    The lady in the middle is the most famous out of the three. She belongs to Lebanon's venerable Christian elite. She’s called Julia Boutros.

    "Where Are The Million?" was one of her worst songs; and unsurprisingly, the song which is most viewed on YouTube.

    She’s put out better music in her later years. I recommend the following if you’re interested:

    1) Entasar Lebnan
    2) E7zar
    3) Ya Ayoha El Kibar
    4) Ahibai
    5) Watani
    6) Atleq Niranak
    7) Ghabet Shams El Haq
    8) Ya Thowar El Ard
    9) Noqawem
    10) Ya Ossas
    11) Moqawem
    12) Ya Shaabi
    13) Al Haq Silahi
    14) Aba Majdak

    She’s performed a lot of live orchestral concerts over the past few years. This one held in a Roman auditorium was her best:

    https://youtu.be/X9wR8MGwfEE

    The vocals and orchestration in some of her older concerts were quite good; but the sound engineering was disappointing. She was edging on 50 years old in some of her latest concerts, so she looks a bit worse than when she was younger; but she is always immaculately dressed, modest and graceful in demeanor. I'm surprised you did not find her attractive. Perhaps she looks better to your eyes in another outfit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ow0RCAB0aGQ&ab_channel=JuliaBoutros

    The above song is entitled "Atlek Niranak" which can be translated as "Fire Your Weapons". In it she chastises "the enemy" for "coming to us, hallucinating"; and urges the Lebanese Armed Forces to "fire away, don't show mercy" until the enemy (Israel) is "dead in your land, or defeated". She's performed multiple other nationalistic songs lambasting Israel and in support of Lebanese militias like Hezbollah. I was slightly disturbed at first by some of the quasi-fascistic lyrics; which stood in stark contrast to the refined atmosphere of the concerts she sang in. But I've since gotten used to it. While I wouldn't necessarily agree with the aggressive intention of the words, it's probably good that Lebanon's elites have a good sense of peoplehood; and can identify which groups mean them harm. Your comments on the Lebanese reinforce this.

    Israel hasn’t outputted much sophisticated music yet; just crappy Mizrahi pop stuff. Hatikvah is quite good; but it was lifted from a Czech composer. My favorite piece of Jewish music is Sholom Aleykhem; performed by Itzhak Perlman.

    https://youtu.be/5hMOcDDYFXU

    I also liked Regine Zylberberg's rendition of My Yiddishe Momme; and Maurice El-Medioni's Ahla Wa Sahla. But none of these songs are Israeli. I'm interested in recommendations of good Israeli songs.


    The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, “white liberals” are not a race). Awful people.
     
    Racist much? I disagree.

    Racist much? I disagree.
     
    You don’t think HBD is valid?

    Replies: @Greasy William

    Israel hasn’t outputted much sophisticated music yet; just crappy Mizrahi pop stuff.

    I’m glad you share my low opinion of Mizrahi music. To me, all music and culture (including Jewish music and culture) from the Levant, North Africa, Arabia and the Caucasus is basically the same and, other than the food, I don’t like any of it.

    I’m interested in recommendations of good Israeli songs.

    You’re talking to the wrong guy. I don’t like anything outside of pre 9/11 American culture. That and some Kpop.

    I was slightly disturbed at first by some of the quasi-fascistic lyrics

    “Quasi fascist” is a great way to describe the Lebanese, yes.

    In it she chastises “the enemy” for “coming to us, hallucinating

    lol wut? I suspect even Nasrallah rolled his eyes at that one. When it comes to Israel v Lebanon there is 0 question that Lebanon is the aggressor. Nasrallah has gone so far as to explicitly say as much. Ben Gurion admitted that the Zionist settlers were the aggressors v the Palestinians, so it wouldn’t kill the Lebanese to show a little honesty for their own part.

    I recommend the following if you’re interested:

    Are we talking about music or looks? I’m not a music guy. As far as looks go, my favorite Lebanese singer was Fairouz. She was like a suped up Anne Frank. Totally my type.

    The singer on the left is Libyan, in the center is Lebanese, and on the right is Syrian

    So the one in the green is Syrian? She’s hot. She looks like she probably has an attitude too, which I like.

    I’m surprised you did not find her attractive

    I like Middle Eastern women but I’m just not a fan of the type of Middle Eastern women that Middle Easterners themselves seem like the most. Lebanon has some actress named Haifa something who supposedly all the Lebanese girls wanted to look like back 10 to 20 and she never did anything for me at all. Lebanese and Palestinians are the kinda people who the typical girls you see getting interviewed on the street in YT vids mog the shit out of the famous actresses and singers.

    Although I’m not sure if maybe this song is from the time when Israel occupied southern Lebanon in which case the lyrics would at least make sense

    The word Canaanite is a meta-ethnic term that encompasses the various ethnicities of the Lower Levant region

    The Canaanites are from Ham, they aren’t Semites. Ancient Canaan only contained, AFAIK, Canaanites (Ham), Israelites (Shem) and Philistines (Japheth). We aren’t talking about a very big region. I have never heard the Canaanite designation applied to the latter 2 groups.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Greasy William


    I’m glad you share my low opinion of Mizrahi music. To me, all music and culture (including Jewish music and culture) from the Levant, North Africa, Arabia and the Caucasus is basically the same and, other than the food, I don’t like any of it.
     
    Well there are some worthy cultural goods coming out of those regions. You just need to dig a bit deeper to find the high-culture stuff. I've made a few recommendations if you're interested:

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5671484

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5676539

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5676710

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-198/#comment-5581415

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-193/#comment-5474079

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5682747


    When it comes to Israel v Lebanon there is 0 question that Lebanon is the aggressor.

     

    I beg to differ; the Israelis violated Lebanese sovereignty by invading and occupying their territory. They even allied themselves with a Christian fascist militia and abetted the massacre of innocent Palestinian refugees: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabra_and_Shatila_massacre

    Lebanon has conducted no comparable violations in Israeli territory.


    As far as looks go, my favorite Lebanese singer was Fairouz.
     
    Quirky choice; I don't think she's considered to be conventionally beautiful. She's decent; i'd give her a 7 by normal people standards; but a 5 by celebrity standards.

    She looks very "Semitic" if you know what I mean. I like that phenotype as well; it looks regal and ancient:

    https://twitter.com/Rim_Turkmani/status/1550808911590064130?s=20&t=nLeRHBIQEczlniyCFrRYFg


    Although I’m not sure if maybe this song is from the time when Israel occupied southern Lebanon in which case the lyrics would at least make sense
     
    She rose to fame during the Israeli occupation of Southern Lebanon; when she released a song called غابت شمس الحق or "The Sun Of Justice Has Set".

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUpTCNmvh04&ab_channel=ahmadjibren

    She still sings this song to cheering crowds of Lebanese people; 40 years later.


    Lebanon has some actress named Haifa something who supposedly all the Lebanese girls wanted to look like back 10 to 20 and she never did anything for me at all.

     

    Haifa Wehbe.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMpg3DzSiB4&ab_channel=OzqurLibanais

    She's a Lebanese Muslim who was notorious for being sluttier than the Christians. I think every Arab boy grew up with a crush on her. There's another Lebanese (Christian) singer called Nancy Ajram who was also a huge sex symbol in the 2000s:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_hDSoSjvQE&ab_channel=NancyAjram

    Each of them dumber than the other. But when I was a kid it was common to debate "which one is hotter, the Christian or the Muslim?"

    So Greasy, which one would you bang?

  522. @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    Maronite Lebanese I have personally known don't really like their Shia compatriots. Orthodox Lebanese much less so. Interestingly enough, I have also known a couple Shia Lebanese, a guy who was not religious at all and a hijab wearing young lady, very well behaved people both of them.

    Replies: @A123

    Lebanon was an unstable mistake as formed by the French. Maronite Christians, Sunni Muslims, and Druze were what Frank Herbert described:

    “In politics, the tripod is he most unstable of all structures. It’s be bad enough without the complication of a feudal trade culture which turns its back on most science.”

    The Nasrallah-shima blast that destroyed the port of Beirut is 100% in the name of Muhammad (and Khamenei). Shia made the “tri” into a “quad”.

    The future of Lebanon is partition. Druze and Christians excluding the horror of Satan/Allah/Lucifer from Christendom.

    PEACE 😇

  523. @Talha
    @Greasy William


    The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity
     
    Whaaat??!! How did Persians lose first spot?

    I thought you wanted Persians exterminated to the last man...what happened?

    Peace.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    1. Iranians. There is no such thing as Persians.
    2. I don’t believe in any of that blood and soil bullshit anymore and I’m embarrassed I ever did in the first place. People are people.

    • Thanks: Talha
  524. I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    Video Link

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he’s talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I’m curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Ron Unz

    Mr Unz, I read some Russian Telegram channels of mostly nationalist persuasion every day. People who are in Ukraine today, fighting or helping the civilian population. Almost everyone agrees that things do not look good for RusFed. Ukrainian army has been badly bled, but Russians have been too. The difference is that Ukraine will receive NATO's military assistance, while nobody gonna help RusFed. Their economy is starting to feel the pain, people are becoming aware of the price they will have to pay. Most Russian population didn't sign for a protracted bloody fighting and an economic decline. The guys in the Kremlin thought that they will roll in, like in Kazakhstan, change the Ukrainian government, impose Minsk 2 and federalization of Ukraine and roll out back home while keeping Crimea. They have committed a fatal mistake.

    , @Greasy William
    @Ron Unz

    I'm so tired of MacGregor's bullshit


    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he’s talking about
     
    Yes, exactly. The problem is, he doesn't. Both he and Ritter should not be given a platform to spread their nonsense.

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less.
     
    The latter claim is believable if it excludes mercenaries and militias, the former claim is in cloud cuckoo land. 100k Ukrainians casualties total and 45k dead at most. The Ukrainian lines are holding and will continue to hold. The heavy Ukrainian losses in the last several weeks are because Zelensky is a vainglorious idiot who is insisting on defending an indefensible position because of his obsession with optics.

    If Russia wants to conquer all of Ukraine, or even just Kiev, it needs a million properly armed and trained guys in theatre. Anything short of that and Russia has to settle for some form of stalemate. It would take at least a year to build such an army and probably more like 3. And by then the Ukrainian army will also be much bigger and better equipped.
    , @Sean
    @Ron Unz

    His point about Ukraine's huge losses are essentially irrelevant, but he is worried by the path the West is sliding down. I think Ukraine has the population to replace losses, but is dependent on Western arms to keep replacing the old equipment being destroyed in fighting. According to Merkel's former advisor retried general Vad , eventually Russia is going to face a Ukraine entirely armed with Western state of the art weapons, and be trounced. Are they going to accept that? No one knows; how could they?

    , @Chebyshev
    @Ron Unz

    He sounds smart and knowledgeable, and sounds like he hasn’t imbibed all the anti-Russian propaganda, so I believe him. I guess this means the dollar would collapse.

    There won’t be a bunch of Jewish Bolsheviks to kill Putin (and millions of others) like there was with Tsar Nicholas II.

    , @Antiwar7
    @Ron Unz

    Macgregor was in charge of all Nato targeting during the Kosovo war, so I think he knows what he's talking about. Plus, he refers to active contacts he still has in the forces.

    If the West is so powerful, why no Ukrainian gains since Kharkov and the Russian pullback from Kherson?

    , @QCIC
    @Ron Unz

    I wish commenters would not pontificate about the SMO without acknowledging that Russia has not been fighting a standard war, though that may be looming.

    150,000 is a lot of bodies, have we seen evidence of that? 300,000 wounded implies a lot of hospital activity, have we seen that?

    I suspect the Russia KIA number does not include militia and local fighters from Donbass. Still, after factoring in the population difference (roughly 150M vs 30M) the casualty ratio is very bad for Ukraine. Ukrainians are protecting their homeland, but many of the Russians feel the same way, based on a wider conception of the homeland.

    I think Russia wants to keep up the pressure until Ukraine capitulates, but only in a way that makes the new Ukrainian government responsible for keeping order post-SMO and suppressing NeoNazi guerrillas.

    Replies: @Beckow

    , @Mikel
    @Ron Unz


    I’m curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.
     
    They're possibly not as strong as the claims of Qanon, Alex Jones or the Truth Jihadist, but after 11 months of watching the Russian military performance, primarily through Russian sources, they do evoke the same kind of mental unsoundness.

    Replies: @Ron Unz

    , @LatW
    @Ron Unz

    It would be interesting if he could present anything tangible as to the veracity of the casualty numbers that he proposes.

    Replies: @Sean

    , @Antiwar7
    @Ron Unz

    Here's another data point to look at.

    Russia has been reasonably successful in its last interventions: Syria, Belarus, Kazakhstan.

    The US/West less so: Libya, Hong Kong, Afghanistan.

    , @Wokechoke
    @Ron Unz

    MacGregor is the minority report of the Pentagon.

    What were the casualties of the first 12 months in the WWI on the western front?

    , @Miro23
    @Ron Unz

    Col. Douglas Macgregor has the top level experience, and has been saying for some time that Russia has the strategic advantage: better military industrial capacity, better supply situation and now, the right equipment and right troops in the right places. So, in his opinion, it's just a matter of time until Ukraine capitulates - or Nuland/ Kagan do something crazy and nuclear (always possible). He does allow that possibility.

    The latest news seems to show the Russians advancing and the Ukrainians in trouble.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aES277w1lOI

    Looking at Macgregor's latest videos, he regards the supply of advanced Western equipment as too little and too late. Also, it requires too much training, its often non-compatible, hard to get to the right place and lacks the air cover it was designed for.

  525. @Talha
    @Yahya


    atypical in being concerned with the preservation of genetic lineages on a racial level.

     

    Atypical times...this is usually the sign of a society/civilization in a defensive posture, especially when you add in the aspect of fertility in a terminal nosedive. Conquest cultures/civilizations of the past thought nothing about spreading their genetics far and wide among the conquered. Vikings, Mongols, Arabs, Spaniards, Comanches...you name it. Up to and after the Korean War, one of the main reasons why laws were being changed to allow non-white immigration into the US were the needs of GIs bringing home Asian “war brides” - I had an exchange with Mr. Unz about this a while back with citations to articles.

    Patriarchal cultures are generally concerned with preserving their genetic lineage as progenitors; racial/ethnic purity is not really a concern.

    Wa salaam.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Who told you that racial purity is a concern of people interested in Y haplogroups and genetic lineages?

    Look, a simple example – most Western European males are Y haplogroup R1b. And so are the greater part of the Chadic speaking Hausa people. The Western European males, although white and speaking mostly Indo-European languages (ignore the Basque, they’re an outlier… sorry Mikel) are descended from the same Yamnaya lineage as the Black Hausa pastoralists of Chad.

    The guys in the picture below

    are related to these other guys in the following pic:

    And that’s how their common ancestors looked like (sorry it’s a pic of an unclad woman):

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-6454345/amp/DNA-reveals-18-year-old-farmer-Ava-died-4-250-years-ago-daughter-immigrants.html

    With ancestors coming from a culture which oldest artifacts have been found in Northern Morocco quite close to the Jibal Al Tarek.

    See, no racism here at all, only a clearer understanding of who’s who and how did we get here.

    That’s lineage for you – as in a link between the past and the future.

    🙂

    • Thanks: Talha
    • Replies: @Talha
    @Ivashka the fool

    That makes more sense honestly, and seems to be the historic pattern.

    I assume you are also planning to be a progenitor and preserver of your lineage? 💪👍

    Peace.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  526. @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    You mistake the popular for the significant.

    A lot of people on teh internets like cute kitten videos, and very few are interested in Gnostic scriptures. Does it mean that cute kitten had a deeper impact on human history and culture than let's say Valentine the Gnostic ?

    My rule of thumb is: if it is widely popular - then it is most probably boring and vulgar. If it is only found among people of a certain cultural and intellectual level - then it might be worth learning about.

    Speaking of which:



    https://youtu.be/faOUDoRmK_E

    This is highbrow elite entertainment !

    🙂

    Replies: @Yahya

    You mistake the popular for the significant.

    I do not.

    I’ll reply to your post on the Arab-Israeli conflict tomorrow.

    are related to these other guys in the following pic:

    That’s why personally I don’t care much about “muh haplogroups”. My paternal haplogroup is R1A, but if I dig deep down; I don’t really care about the preservation of Indians or Eastern Slavs. I would prefer to see them survive and prosper; but I have no emotional stake in the outcome. But for Arabs I do care. That’s why ethnicity trumps paternal lineage for me.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    You should read Klyosov about the R1a haplogroup found in the Middle East.



    Among the Arabs, it mostly has nothing do with the Saqaliba slaves, but often goes as far back as the Hittite Empire. Did you know that according to the Bible, when Abraham decided to organize a burial for Sarah, he purchased the plot of land for the grave from a Hittite landowner ?

    Abraham was an immigrant in that land around Hebron, where Indo-European Hittites were already established landowners for generations.

    Your ancestors might have literally been there before Abraham, before Jews and Arabs have become a thing there. If you respect your ancestors, not a nation, not some people far away, not a culture, not even a religion - just your ancestors - those who lived before you, so you can live today - then you should care about these things.

    I respect my ancestors. That's why they used to call us pagans gentiles - from gentes - the latin word for a group of people related through their male ancestor.

    As a Muslim you can say that your ancestors don't matter, because they supposedly lived in the Ahd al Jahiliyah - the Age of Ignorance. That Islam and Arabic culture brought forth light to these lands. But if you have a modicum of education, as you seem to have, you would know that these claims are BS. You would know that all the Arabs did is to impose some order into a very troubled region and infuse new energy in the old established and somewhat tired cultures.

    And then after some 300 years of domination, the Arabs were replaced at the helm by the A'ajam - the non-Arab Muslims: Turks, Berbers, Mongols (who came as pagan Tengriists, but converted to Islam) Persians, Circassians and so on and so forth. Arabs lost their prominence as the White majority is losing it in the West today. And if it was not for its role as the ritual language of Qur'an and Salat, Arabic would have been replaced just like Aramaic before. And it was the Ahd Al Inhitat - the Age of Decadence of Arab and Islamic culture, lasting centuries.

    Where your Indo-European ancestors lasted millenia, your current cultural and religious identity didn't even stand the test of a thousand years before becoming weakened and degenerate, kicked around by its former servants and slaves.

    What are you proud of exactly by putting forward this identity of yours ?

    Egyptian serials, Saudi Oil rigs ?

    Naguib Mahfouz ?

    You are not all that, you are first and foremost your blood - your ancestors live through you. Whether you like it or not.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  527. @Ivashka the fool
    @Talha

    Who told you that racial purity is a concern of people interested in Y haplogroups and genetic lineages?

    Look, a simple example - most Western European males are Y haplogroup R1b. And so are the greater part of the Chadic speaking Hausa people. The Western European males, although white and speaking mostly Indo-European languages (ignore the Basque, they're an outlier... sorry Mikel) are descended from the same Yamnaya lineage as the Black Hausa pastoralists of Chad.

    The guys in the picture below

    https://dailytrust.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Hausa.jpg

    are related to these other guys in the following pic:

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EsXEcUIW4AIPQqT.jpg

    And that's how their common ancestors looked like (sorry it's a pic of an unclad woman):

    https://i0.wp.com/archaeology.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/Illustration-8.jpg

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-6454345/amp/DNA-reveals-18-year-old-farmer-Ava-died-4-250-years-ago-daughter-immigrants.html

    With ancestors coming from a culture which oldest artifacts have been found in Northern Morocco quite close to the Jibal Al Tarek.

    See, no racism here at all, only a clearer understanding of who's who and how did we get here.

    That's lineage for you - as in a link between the past and the future.

    🙂

    Replies: @Talha

    That makes more sense honestly, and seems to be the historic pattern.

    I assume you are also planning to be a progenitor and preserver of your lineage? 💪👍

    Peace.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Talha

    I have four kids.

    God willing, my ancestors' lineage will live on.

    But no one can be sure of what future brings, we live in uncertain and dangerous times.

    Replies: @Talha

  528. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    Mr Unz, I read some Russian Telegram channels of mostly nationalist persuasion every day. People who are in Ukraine today, fighting or helping the civilian population. Almost everyone agrees that things do not look good for RusFed. Ukrainian army has been badly bled, but Russians have been too. The difference is that Ukraine will receive NATO’s military assistance, while nobody gonna help RusFed. Their economy is starting to feel the pain, people are becoming aware of the price they will have to pay. Most Russian population didn’t sign for a protracted bloody fighting and an economic decline. The guys in the Kremlin thought that they will roll in, like in Kazakhstan, change the Ukrainian government, impose Minsk 2 and federalization of Ukraine and roll out back home while keeping Crimea. They have committed a fatal mistake.

  529. @Talha
    @Ivashka the fool

    That makes more sense honestly, and seems to be the historic pattern.

    I assume you are also planning to be a progenitor and preserver of your lineage? 💪👍

    Peace.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    I have four kids.

    God willing, my ancestors’ lineage will live on.

    But no one can be sure of what future brings, we live in uncertain and dangerous times.

    • Replies: @Talha
    @Ivashka the fool

    Awesome! MashaAllah! As one father of four to another; may Allah swt protect your children and your lineage and make them dutiful to their parents and a blessing for you in this world and the next! 🤲

    Peace.

  530. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    I’m so tired of MacGregor’s bullshit

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he’s talking about

    Yes, exactly. The problem is, he doesn’t. Both he and Ritter should not be given a platform to spread their nonsense.

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less.

    The latter claim is believable if it excludes mercenaries and militias, the former claim is in cloud cuckoo land. 100k Ukrainians casualties total and 45k dead at most. The Ukrainian lines are holding and will continue to hold. The heavy Ukrainian losses in the last several weeks are because Zelensky is a vainglorious idiot who is insisting on defending an indefensible position because of his obsession with optics.

    If Russia wants to conquer all of Ukraine, or even just Kiev, it needs a million properly armed and trained guys in theatre. Anything short of that and Russia has to settle for some form of stalemate. It would take at least a year to build such an army and probably more like 3. And by then the Ukrainian army will also be much bigger and better equipped.

    • Agree: Ivashka the fool
  531. @Ivashka the fool
    @Talha

    I have four kids.

    God willing, my ancestors' lineage will live on.

    But no one can be sure of what future brings, we live in uncertain and dangerous times.

    Replies: @Talha

    Awesome! MashaAllah! As one father of four to another; may Allah swt protect your children and your lineage and make them dutiful to their parents and a blessing for you in this world and the next! 🤲

    Peace.

    • Thanks: Ivashka the fool
  532. @AaronB
    @AP


    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ’s message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.
     
    Perhaps then, AP, you are not arrogant enough, and you can use a little of my Jewish arrogance :)

    I'm beginning to think Dmitry was the better psychologist here and understood you better than I did. I thought you were this devilishly cunning fellow who was trying to subvert religion, but Dmitry thought you were a simple and ignorant person.

    Perhaps I succumbed - for once - to the atmosphere of conspiracy theories so prevalent on this site, which I am usually proof against, and saw malign intent and masterful strategy where there was simply tragic human finitude.

    I understand you differently now, and see as a completely different type - it was your moving encomium to wealth and comfort, so innocent, so optimistic, so pure, so sincere and uncomplicated, so childish, that has given me a different perspective on you.

    You, AP, did everything right - you followed blindly the dictates of your culture and society, without questioning it. You were a good boy. You did what everyone said was the right thing, what everyone said would lead to happiness and satisfaction. You studied hard, got a good job, pursued money, lived comfortably, worked hard, advanced in your career, worshipped the State cult exactly as the authorities said you should. You were respectable, damn it.

    And yet, somehow, it was all empty - you didn't feel the happiness you were promised. Nothing ever happened, and life stagnated. In the words Thoreau used to describe the mainstream man, you lived a life of "quiet desperation".

    Still, you're the one who is supposed to be happy, by rights - someone like me, who laughs at respectability, who has all the wrong opinions, who goes adventuring in the wilderness half the year, who does everything wrong, is supposed to be miserable, by God.

    And homeless people? By God, they're just desserts is to suffer - yet maybe, perhaps, some of them are actually much happier than AP :) And that cannot be. The sheer gall of it.

    Therefore, those homeless who have chosen their lot must be forcibly made to live like AP as much as possible - and AaronB must cease his wilderness expeditions and start focusing on being economically productive, just like AP :) It is for their own good, really - but more importantly, the idea that they are the happy ones cannot be permitted to stand.

    I am, unfortunately, very, very familiar with this mentality. I have friends who take "pity" on me and try and get me married, and live "normally" - when, eventually, they realize that I am actually much happier than they are, the shock and rage are almost comical.

    There is in this world, in a way, a "conspiracy against happiness" - most people are broken by society, and cannot resist it's dictates, and then set about trying to make sure no one else escapes. If I am not happy, none can be.

    Had you had a little more intestinal fortitude, AP, a little more arrogance, independence, and rebelliousness, you would have been able to resist social conditioning.

    It is merely a pity, and a sad but all too familiar commentary on human finitude and limitation. And I am here, as much as possible, to ensure future APs have the courage to resist.

    Cheers.

    Replies: @AP, @silviosilver

    it was your moving encomium to wealth and comfort

    I simply provided empirical facts that demonstrate your arrogance and that the poor are more prone to sin than are the middle and upper classes, who are more virtuous.

    You don’t like to be confronted by facts.

    In presenting you with such facts, I caused you to respond with a lengthy and comical diatribe in which through a fantasy about me you revealed your own fears. Apparently your family and friends all tried to turn you into a normal and productive member of society. You admitted to having a very solidly bourgeois origin. For some reason this is a problem for you (your hatred of authority suggests why), so you rebel by running away. But you can’t run away from yourself. You will always be this bourgeois, this consumer at your core. You run to the hills but treat the experience like a 4K television. This may be why people with genuine East-infused spirituality are almost always annoyed by you, the inauthentic tourist into their world.

    Here is a funny quote by the Czech author, Kundera. It’s about people like you:

    “A long time a go a certain Cynic philosopher proudly paraded around Athens in a moth-eaten coat, hoping that everyone would admire his contempt for convention. When Socrates met him, he said: Through the hole in your coat I see your vanity. Your dirt, too, dear sir, is self-indulgent and your self-indulgence is dirty.”

    • Agree: Sher Singh, Miro23
    • Replies: @AaronB
    @AP

    Well, you got me. I'm quite the inferior person - inauthentic, vain, incapable of transcending my bourgeois background, and the rich are more virtuous than the poor. I concede, I concede :)

    At a certain point in my life I decided it's better to be happy than superior, and that the need to be superior is one of those illusions society traps you with.

    AP, I wish you luck with your greater virtue and all around general superiority. For myself I will simply continue choosing happiness, and if I can give anyone who would also choose happiness over superiority but is afraid to do so because of social pressure the courage to do so, I will consider it time well spent, both as an act of compassion and as making the world better.

    The world is better with more happy people and less superior people.

    Once again, thanks for the exchange - I found it fruitful.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  533. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    His point about Ukraine’s huge losses are essentially irrelevant, but he is worried by the path the West is sliding down. I think Ukraine has the population to replace losses, but is dependent on Western arms to keep replacing the old equipment being destroyed in fighting. According to Merkel’s former advisor retried general Vad , eventually Russia is going to face a Ukraine entirely armed with Western state of the art weapons, and be trounced. Are they going to accept that? No one knows; how could they?

  534. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    You mistake the popular for the significant.
     
    I do not.

    I’ll reply to your post on the Arab-Israeli conflict tomorrow.


    are related to these other guys in the following pic:
     
    That’s why personally I don’t care much about “muh haplogroups”. My paternal haplogroup is R1A, but if I dig deep down; I don’t really care about the preservation of Indians or Eastern Slavs. I would prefer to see them survive and prosper; but I have no emotional stake in the outcome. But for Arabs I do care. That’s why ethnicity trumps paternal lineage for me.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    You should read Klyosov about the R1a haplogroup found in the Middle East.

    [MORE]

    Among the Arabs, it mostly has nothing do with the Saqaliba slaves, but often goes as far back as the Hittite Empire. Did you know that according to the Bible, when Abraham decided to organize a burial for Sarah, he purchased the plot of land for the grave from a Hittite landowner ?

    Abraham was an immigrant in that land around Hebron, where Indo-European Hittites were already established landowners for generations.

    Your ancestors might have literally been there before Abraham, before Jews and Arabs have become a thing there. If you respect your ancestors, not a nation, not some people far away, not a culture, not even a religion – just your ancestors – those who lived before you, so you can live today – then you should care about these things.

    I respect my ancestors. That’s why they used to call us pagans gentiles – from gentes – the latin word for a group of people related through their male ancestor.

    As a Muslim you can say that your ancestors don’t matter, because they supposedly lived in the Ahd al Jahiliyah – the Age of Ignorance. That Islam and Arabic culture brought forth light to these lands. But if you have a modicum of education, as you seem to have, you would know that these claims are BS. You would know that all the Arabs did is to impose some order into a very troubled region and infuse new energy in the old established and somewhat tired cultures.

    And then after some 300 years of domination, the Arabs were replaced at the helm by the A’ajam – the non-Arab Muslims: Turks, Berbers, Mongols (who came as pagan Tengriists, but converted to Islam) Persians, Circassians and so on and so forth. Arabs lost their prominence as the White majority is losing it in the West today. And if it was not for its role as the ritual language of Qur’an and Salat, Arabic would have been replaced just like Aramaic before. And it was the Ahd Al Inhitat – the Age of Decadence of Arab and Islamic culture, lasting centuries.

    Where your Indo-European ancestors lasted millenia, your current cultural and religious identity didn’t even stand the test of a thousand years before becoming weakened and degenerate, kicked around by its former servants and slaves.

    What are you proud of exactly by putting forward this identity of yours ?

    Egyptian serials, Saudi Oil rigs ?

    Naguib Mahfouz ?

    You are not all that, you are first and foremost your blood – your ancestors live through you. Whether you like it or not.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    There are many R1a in Hungary who don't even speak Indo-European language. They are still R1a though.

    But you are postulating that genetic lineage is somehow cultural lineage and thus we should somehow cultivate the first cultures of a given genetic lineage? Like a genetic lineage must be always connected with the same cultural memes?

    Why should Abraham buying a plot of land in Hebron be relevant here?
    There is a fringe tradition in Judaism which says that since Abraham bought the land there, Hebron is not a part of land given by God to his descendants. And well, today Hebron is not in Israel.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  535. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @AP
    @AaronB


    it was your moving encomium to wealth and comfort
     
    I simply provided empirical facts that demonstrate your arrogance and that the poor are more prone to sin than are the middle and upper classes, who are more virtuous.

    You don't like to be confronted by facts.

    In presenting you with such facts, I caused you to respond with a lengthy and comical diatribe in which through a fantasy about me you revealed your own fears. Apparently your family and friends all tried to turn you into a normal and productive member of society. You admitted to having a very solidly bourgeois origin. For some reason this is a problem for you (your hatred of authority suggests why), so you rebel by running away. But you can't run away from yourself. You will always be this bourgeois, this consumer at your core. You run to the hills but treat the experience like a 4K television. This may be why people with genuine East-infused spirituality are almost always annoyed by you, the inauthentic tourist into their world.

    Here is a funny quote by the Czech author, Kundera. It's about people like you:

    "A long time a go a certain Cynic philosopher proudly paraded around Athens in a moth-eaten coat, hoping that everyone would admire his contempt for convention. When Socrates met him, he said: Through the hole in your coat I see your vanity. Your dirt, too, dear sir, is self-indulgent and your self-indulgence is dirty."

    Replies: @AaronB

    Well, you got me. I’m quite the inferior person – inauthentic, vain, incapable of transcending my bourgeois background, and the rich are more virtuous than the poor. I concede, I concede 🙂

    At a certain point in my life I decided it’s better to be happy than superior, and that the need to be superior is one of those illusions society traps you with.

    AP, I wish you luck with your greater virtue and all around general superiority. For myself I will simply continue choosing happiness, and if I can give anyone who would also choose happiness over superiority but is afraid to do so because of social pressure the courage to do so, I will consider it time well spent, both as an act of compassion and as making the world better.

    The world is better with more happy people and less superior people.

    Once again, thanks for the exchange – I found it fruitful.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @AaronB

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/781981619073318943/1065929268003086389/TA0939.jpg

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/781981619073318943/1065929268267323402/2006px-HinduSwastika.svg.png

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/781981619073318943/1065929268682571886/Singh_GaoRakshak.png

    The Khalsa is merciful it does not make the tormented wait till death for hellfire.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    Replies: @AaronB, @Another Polish Perspective

  536. @AP
    @LatW


    "If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to."

    He might need a little bit more pedigree for that but because Ukraine has such special status now he could do it. Don’t think he has the personality type for that though. I think the politicians from the European Solidarity might be better candidates for that. Arestovych has spoken positively of conservative values and I think he’s a bit too Ukraine-centric to be a proper WEF candidate.
     
    He's a Belarussian nobleman.

    https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rola_(herb_szlachecki)

    If PLC is restored maybe he can replace Lukashenka. Arestowicz spent part of his childhood in Belarus.

    Replies: @LatW

    I’m aware that he’s part Belarusian with those roots (same as Podolyak, apparently, and it shows). My point was that he wouldn’t care about Western credentials (such as this forum that was mentioned above). The types that do are mostly those who speak English or French very well and who have a London School of Economics degree. He is not one of those types, since he has a local military background, and he is a Ukraine-centric Russophone civic nationalist. Which is exciting because it gives us hope that he could deliver something more interesting than what we’ve seen before with many E.Euro politicians.

  537. @Yahya
    @LatW


    The desire to preserve the “genetic lineages” resonates with others in that particular group and is shared by many, not just one person, one ego.
     
    Actually only a tiny (probably <1%) percentage of the population cares about genetic lineage. Most people are too short-minded to think from a long-term perspective. Notice how literally zero politicians running for office ever mention "genetic lineage" or euphemistic alternatives to appeal to voters. It's always "jobs" and "housing" etc.

    Greg Cochran mentioned that race is a weak unit for people to band together around. He used the ancient Middle Easterners lack of unity at the face of Greek conquests as an example of weak racial bonds. The denizens of Unzistan are atypical in being concerned with the preservation of genetic lineages on a racial level.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Talha, @LatW

    Actually only a tiny (probably <1%) percentage of the population cares about genetic lineage. Most people are too short-minded to think from a long-term perspective. Notice how literally zero politicians running for office ever mention "genetic lineage" or euphemistic alternatives to appeal to voters.

    I can’t speak about North America or your country, Egypt. And obviously European politicians are rarely even allowed to talk that way.

    But from a very narrow North Eastern European woman’s perspective, I can tell you that many women (and even many men), who are the gatekeepers for sexual selection, do care very much about ancestral genetic lineages. They may not view it that way subjectively, may not even be fully aware of it, and they definitely do not openly phrase it that way, but let me assure you that, from their purely personal choices, this is very much the case (and I hope it stays that way).

    • Agree: S
  538. @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    You're absolutely right about Emir Abdelkader !

    The man was a hero, a poet and a Sufi mystic. I had the pleasure of reading some of his letters and poetry translated in French once. When he lived in exile in Syria he along his men saved local Christians from a rioting Muslim mob. AFAIK he is buried in the same mosque where Ibn Al Arabi is. If only more Muslims were like him, this world would be a better place and their countries would be much more pleasant. Unfortunately this is not the case. BTW he exchanged letters with Imam Shamil- the Avarian leader of the Caucasus people who fought against the Tsarist troops. And amusingly enough Abdelkader has been initiated into a Masonic lodge while kept in captivity in France. An interesting man.

    About Arab politics, I really have too little information and a limited interest. All I know is that there are supposedly more than 400 million Arab people around the world, let's say that around 1/4 of them are able-bodied men - that would be some 100 million. And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham (that would be Arabs and Jews). So from a pure will to power pov, every Isreali Jew is worth more than a dozen Arabs.

    Anyway, this family feud between the feeble willed multitudes of Arabs and the strong willed minority of Jews, poisons the existence of other people around the world. It's time you Semites find a solution to the problem. Either kill each other, or make peace for the Demiurge's sake, or let the Persians put some order in that land.

    🙂

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Yahya

    About Arab politics, I really have too little information and a limited interest. All I know is that there are supposedly more than 400 million Arab people around the world, let’s say that around 1/4 of them are able-bodied men – that would be some 100 million. And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham (that would be Arabs and Jews).

    It’s quite apparent you have a limited interest, otherwise it’d be hard to believe you could take such a simplistic view of things. A high school student would probably be embarrassed to submit this thesis, even for no other reason than the intuitive feeling that there’s got to be me more to the story.

    Put aside “the Arabs” for a moment, and just consider the billion or whatever Muslims, probably none of whom are happy that the holy land fell into Jewish hands. Do you really suppose they wake up each morning asking themselves what they can do today to help wrest control of Palestine? Even if you imagine they’re as ethnocentrically motivated as you – and your comments in the past about muslims suggests you do believe something close to this – it doesn’t make sense to pretend that’s what they been trying to do all this time. People from the wider muslim world – and we can specify here particularly from the Arab part of it – who feel that strongly about the issue tend to join movements like the Muslim Brotherhood or ISIS, but even there Israel/Palestine is not the primary focus of their efforts.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver


    Do you really suppose they wake up each morning asking themselves what they can do today to help wrest control of Palestine? Even if you imagine they’re as ethnocentrically motivated as you – and your comments in the past about muslims suggests you do believe something close to this – it doesn’t make sense to pretend that’s what they been trying to do all this time.
     
    No most Muslims, let alone Arabs, just drift about their lives as everyone else does. And that is precisely the problem: as Muslims they shouldn't live that way until the Al Aqsa Mosque at least is liberated from the Israeli hold. But Muslims "swallowed" which makes most of them contemptible. Not because of their ethnicity, but because of their lack of respect and zeal towards their Din.

    This of course applies even more to the Arabs, whom on top of being Muslims are supposed to be descendants of Abraham. In fact, Laurent Gyenot has made a very compelling case for the Jewish ethnicity being derived from the iron age tribes of what is nowadays northern Saudi Arabia. And that is actually confirmed by population genetics and archeology. That is, Arabs in a larger sense existed before the Jews appeared, and are ancestral to to the Jews. But most Arabs don't care about their ancestors. Most Muslims don't care about theirs. That is why they are a weak although numerous people.

    A tree without roots cannot keep growing towards the sun, a people without ancestry has no future. Jews understand this, it is part of their religion and culture, Arabs don't. The difference is for everyone to behold.



    https://youtu.be/WKQWjkq7qlo

    They should think of Palestine every waken hour of their lives until the problem is solved. But they prefer obsessing about Lebanese starlets and Turkish serials, while they spend American dollars in a Jewish owned financial system. Ibn Khaldoun was right when he wrote that they are living through an historical stage of decay and degradation. They are corrupt.

    As a Maghrebi saying goes : better a handful of bees than a bucket of flies.
  539. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    He sounds smart and knowledgeable, and sounds like he hasn’t imbibed all the anti-Russian propaganda, so I believe him. I guess this means the dollar would collapse.

    There won’t be a bunch of Jewish Bolsheviks to kill Putin (and millions of others) like there was with Tsar Nicholas II.

  540. @Greasy William
    @Yahya


    Operative word in my sentence was more.
     
    Just so long as we understand each other

    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs.
     
    Back in my Jewish nationalist days I interacted with many Christian, anti Israel Lebanese online. Their Arab identity is very nominal. I know they call themselves Arab but they also kinda see themselves as part European and they have a ridiculous and totally unjustified superiority complex towards other Arabs. The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, "white liberals" are not a race). Awful people.

    This is a music video by one such calls for “the Arab nation” to combat Israel.
     
    The only one I like is the one in the green and even she appears to have slight subcanthal tilt. I have no interest whatsoever in the other two. Both the song as well as the music video are garbage. If Arabs really took Arab nationalism seriously they would put a Jew in charge since they themselves obviously can't do it properly.

    In fact, this video essentially exemplifies everything I cannot stand about Lebanese people, the last remnant of the odious Canaanites. Thank you for this. What year is it from?

    You’ll like the Lebanese better if you focus on the female half of the population.
     
    No, the women are a million times worse than the men. I could occasionally find some common ground with the guys but never with the women.

    Rwanda cannot become a First World Country in the next 50 years, no matter the effectiveness of their governance.
     
    Racist much? I disagree.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Talha, @silviosilver

    Back in my Jewish nationalist days

    I’m curious, why’d you give that up? What do you call yourself now?

    The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, “white liberals” are not a race). Awful people.

    Heh, a man after my own heart. More realistically, first prize in this category perennially belongs to the Africanus, but among actual humans ( 🙂 ) it’s hard to top them Lebanese bastards. I make an exception for the Christians, whom I like much better, but the rest can go FOAD.

    In my aimless drifter years wasted as a young man, I was good friends with a bunch of Lebanese muzzes. At a stretch, I could say some good things about them, but overall I have nothing but straight up regret. I ran into one of them a couple of years ago. I heard someone call out my name and looked, but didn’t recognize anyone. I always get a bad feeling when this happens, because if they recognize me (which is easy, I look the same) but I don’t recognize them, it means I knew them from my distant past, and there’s essentially no one I want to know from back then. So I braced myself, but it went okay, was mercifully brief, and no bs promises to catch up again.

    Both the song as well as the music video are garbage.

    @1:50, the dude with the slingshot. Go get ’em tiger. (Bit of Australiana for you, that weapon was known by one and all as a “shanghai” when I was a kid, maybe still is. Kids would make them from bicycle innertubes and fire marbles, among other projectiles.)

    Agree about the song. 90% of arab music sounds like that to me; I have a hard time telling the difference between them. Very occasionally, I find something that I actually enjoy, though the thrill passes quickly.

    I’m in Yahya’s bad books again, so he probably won’t reply, but there was some arab movie I saw many years ago (20?), I’m guessing it was probably Egyptian, since 95% of arab movies are Egyptian. I don’t think I saw the whole thing, just a scene in which some musician or aspiring musician was, I think, trying to impress his host at the house he was visiting – or maybe it was a music producer he was visiting – and anyway, he starts singing this very simple song that I still remember and which I often think of whenever I hear arab music playing. I don’t know the actual words in arabic, but it sounded to me like “sidi wer wer, sidi wer wer, sidi wera wera wera sidi wer wer,” and then a “choir” (or “back up” singers) repeated it that line. The host/producer was rolling his eyes, unimpressed; I’m guessing the film was some comedy. I wonder if Yahya knows the song or what the movie was?

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    I wonder if Yahya knows the song or what the movie was?
     
    Well you've given me almost nothing to go on. I need to at least know the name of the movie.

    Most songs in Arabic movies tend to be schlocky. Again, the obscure orchestras and singers is where the quality is at.

    I know you weren't interested in my previous recommendations; so this is more for Mr. Hack and Barbarossa (where has he gone?).

    1) Fakarouni

    One of the all-time great songs of Egyptian classical music.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDrPsZxk-WM&t=573s&ab_channel=UmmKulthum-%D8%A7%D9%85%D9%83%D9%84%D8%AB%D9%88%D9%85

    Its original form is 1 hour long; so like Western classical music; you have to skip around a bit to the sections which resonate with you melodically.

    These are the time-stamps I skip to:

    9:30
    13:10
    19:27
    26:27

    This is an excellent compressed rendition by the National Arab Orchestra.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piNFUb2Suv4&ab_channel=NationalArabOrchestra

    It introduces harmony and homophony and is excellently captured by the sound engineers.

    2) Lebanese folklore

    40 minutes of Lebanese folklore; performed by legendary singer and Greasy Williams' crush Fariouz.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoEdqflkdo8&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=156&t=1133s&ab_channel=GabiTayan

    You also have to skip around a bit to the good parts. Vocals are excellent; and the instrumentation calmly serene.

    3) Hijaz

    An exquisite piece of art music; performed by a Syrian and German duo in a pizza oven.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBeB0TAcDj8&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=173&ab_channel=chiarasomajni

    Watch the cello rubatto in 6:30.

    4) Mesopotamia

    A sublime piece of art music by the Assyrian oud maestro Munir Bashir.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oS8O0TusvAQ&t=990s&ab_channel=WorldWholeMusic

    Good for listening while reading the Epic of Gilgamesh. It will transport you back in time.

    5) Longa Chahinaz

    A piece from the Ottoman period. Here performed by the Syrian Ornina Orchestra:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiIXwX7m1tI&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=185&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9

    Longa Farahfaza, a brother piece to Chahinaz, performed by a French pianist and Moroccan oudist.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1akjsLKgSY&ab_channel=Jean-PhilippeCollard-Neven

    Replies: @silviosilver

  541. I’m curious, why’d you give that up?

    Just grew out of it.

    I think there is a problem with the way that society views “racism”. Racism is viewed as a type of moral failing and I never bought that. I still don’t. Instead I view racial/ethnic hatred as simply nonsensical on a factual level. Although I’m still a resolute misanthrope, I genuinely do see all people as my literal cousins so anything to do with race/ethnicity/nationality just seems silly to me. That poorly made vid of the one hot Arab girl with the two mediocre Arab girls singing about fighting Zionism would have made me angry a few years ago, but now I see it and just feel sorry for them for embarrassing themselves like that. It’s so childish.

    And I want to stress again, there is no moral dimension to this. It’s a perspective, not a belief. And if I’m being honest, I was happier when I was more racist.

    Ultimately I want to return to the pre Tower of Babel world with no nations and no governments when everybody just lives how they want to. I do recognize, however, that man is not ready for that and maybe he never will be, so on a practical level it is better to keep the nation state. But I view that as the least bad option, not an ideal. I definitely don’t believe any nation has a right to a given territory and I think this stuff with Russia/Ukraine shows how dangerous such beliefs are.

    What do you call yourself now?

    I’m still a believing, if non observant, Jew, except with an added heavy dose of fatalism and nihilism. But that just could be the depression.

    Agree about the song. 90% of arab music sounds like that to me. I’m not saying they are the same, just that I have a hard time telling the difference.

    Arab/Mizrahi/Caucasus music all sounds the same to me. It seriously sounds like they just have different variations of the same song. I don’t get it at all. Even rap has more variety than Middle Eastern music. And rap is at least catchy sometimes

  542. @AaronB
    @AP

    Well, you got me. I'm quite the inferior person - inauthentic, vain, incapable of transcending my bourgeois background, and the rich are more virtuous than the poor. I concede, I concede :)

    At a certain point in my life I decided it's better to be happy than superior, and that the need to be superior is one of those illusions society traps you with.

    AP, I wish you luck with your greater virtue and all around general superiority. For myself I will simply continue choosing happiness, and if I can give anyone who would also choose happiness over superiority but is afraid to do so because of social pressure the courage to do so, I will consider it time well spent, both as an act of compassion and as making the world better.

    The world is better with more happy people and less superior people.

    Once again, thanks for the exchange - I found it fruitful.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    [MORE]

    The Khalsa is merciful it does not make the tormented wait till death for hellfire.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @Sher Singh

    And the sect of the HeavilyMarbledSteak spotted a Sikh in possession of a cow and yet not eating of it, yea, even though it was heavily marbled and thus prime steak, and looked delicious, and they did capture that miscreant sikh and gouge out his eyes and hang him for not appreciating delicious food, and did slaughter the cow and eat it unto the last bone - and behold, it was a heavily marbled cow yielding many fine steaks, all well marbled.

    And then an army of Sikhs descended upon the sect of the HeavilyMarbledSteak, who did number but a dozen, but the feeble armed Sikhs who did not eat cow were weak of arm and slack of temper, on account of not eating meat, and a great slaughter of Sikhs was made that day, and all their cows were seized and eaten - and yea, the Lord made it that each one was heavily marbled indeed!

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Sher Singh

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @Sher Singh

    Is swastika not just Hindu but a Sikh symbol too...?

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  543. @AP
    @Yahya


    Many of the Christians elites identify as Arabs
     
    In Detroit that has a vey large Arab-speaking population the Lebanese Christians often claim to be Phoenicians, while the ones from Iraq describe themselves as Chaldeans rather than Arabs and claim descent from ancient Babylonians. Both groups feel that their homelands were invaded by Arabs whom they look down on.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Another Polish Perspective

    Why some Christians would freely describe themselves as Babylonians is beyond me. Don’t they know that Babylon is a bad guy (bad woman) of the Christian eschatology…? Didn’t they hear about the Great Whore of Babylon (Revelation 17)?

    3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
    4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
    5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth.

  544. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @Sher Singh
    @AaronB

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/781981619073318943/1065929268003086389/TA0939.jpg

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/781981619073318943/1065929268267323402/2006px-HinduSwastika.svg.png

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/781981619073318943/1065929268682571886/Singh_GaoRakshak.png

    The Khalsa is merciful it does not make the tormented wait till death for hellfire.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    Replies: @AaronB, @Another Polish Perspective

    And the sect of the HeavilyMarbledSteak spotted a Sikh in possession of a cow and yet not eating of it, yea, even though it was heavily marbled and thus prime steak, and looked delicious, and they did capture that miscreant sikh and gouge out his eyes and hang him for not appreciating delicious food, and did slaughter the cow and eat it unto the last bone – and behold, it was a heavily marbled cow yielding many fine steaks, all well marbled.

    And then an army of Sikhs descended upon the sect of the HeavilyMarbledSteak, who did number but a dozen, but the feeble armed Sikhs who did not eat cow were weak of arm and slack of temper, on account of not eating meat, and a great slaughter of Sikhs was made that day, and all their cows were seized and eaten – and yea, the Lord made it that each one was heavily marbled indeed!

    • Agree: Mikel
    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @AaronB

    Then the Guru spake unto Aaron, "Behold, in my dream I was standing on the banks of the Indus. Seven cows, plump and attractive, came up out of the Indus and fed in the reed grass. Seven other cows came up after them, poor and very ugly and thin, such as I had never seen in all the land of Punjab. And the thin, ugly cows ate up the first seven plump cows, but when they had eaten them no one would have known that they had eaten them, for they were still as ugly as at the beginning. Then I awoke.

    Then Aaron spake unto the Guru: "God has revealed to the Guru what he is about to do. The seven lean cows are seven races that will feast on your cows; seven are the corners of the world to which the sikhs shall scatter to witness the feasting; and seven are the words that God will permit the sikh to post in impotent remonstrance." And hearing this the Guru sunk to his knees and wept, for his heart told him that Aaaron had spoken truly.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @Sher Singh
    @AaronB

    ਪੁਨ ਕਰ ਜੋਰਿ ਬਤਾਇਸਿ ਬਾਤਿ । "ਨਿਕਟ ਦੁਸ਼ਟ ਗੋ ਕਰਤੇ ਘਾਤਿ । ਤਿਨ ਕੇ ਬਸ ਨਹਿ ਆਵਤਿ ਸੋਈ । ਕਤਰਿ ਓਜ ਕੋ ਮੈਂ ਤਹਿ ਜੋਈ" ।੩।⁣
    After [saluting Guru Hargobind] he clasped his hands and began to say, "There are vile people close to here butchering cows and they are trying to get hold of more cows with great effort.⁣

    ਸੁਨਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਸੋ ਆਗੇ ਕਰ੍ਯੋ । ਹਯ ਧਵਾਇ ਚਾਲੇ ਰਿਸਿ ਧਰ੍ਯੋ । ਹੁਤੇ ਨਿਕਟ ਹੀ ਜਾਇ ਨਿਹਾਰੇ । ਖੜਗ ਨਿਕਾਸ੍ਯੋ ਤਤਛਿਨ ਮਾਰੇ ।੪।⁣
    Listening to this Satiguru Hargobind mounted his horse and proceeded ahead with great anger, seeing where they were they closed the distance, taking out his sword he quickly slaughtered them. ⁣

    ਭਾਜ ਚਲੇ ਕੁਛ ਘੇਰਿ ਪ੍ਰਹਾਰੇ । ਖੰਡ ਖੰਡ ਕਰਿ ਧਰ ਪਰ ਡਾਰੈ ।⁣
    Some of them ran away, but they were flanked, surrounded and attacked, they were chopped down and then into pieces. ⁣

  545. @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    You should read Klyosov about the R1a haplogroup found in the Middle East.



    Among the Arabs, it mostly has nothing do with the Saqaliba slaves, but often goes as far back as the Hittite Empire. Did you know that according to the Bible, when Abraham decided to organize a burial for Sarah, he purchased the plot of land for the grave from a Hittite landowner ?

    Abraham was an immigrant in that land around Hebron, where Indo-European Hittites were already established landowners for generations.

    Your ancestors might have literally been there before Abraham, before Jews and Arabs have become a thing there. If you respect your ancestors, not a nation, not some people far away, not a culture, not even a religion - just your ancestors - those who lived before you, so you can live today - then you should care about these things.

    I respect my ancestors. That's why they used to call us pagans gentiles - from gentes - the latin word for a group of people related through their male ancestor.

    As a Muslim you can say that your ancestors don't matter, because they supposedly lived in the Ahd al Jahiliyah - the Age of Ignorance. That Islam and Arabic culture brought forth light to these lands. But if you have a modicum of education, as you seem to have, you would know that these claims are BS. You would know that all the Arabs did is to impose some order into a very troubled region and infuse new energy in the old established and somewhat tired cultures.

    And then after some 300 years of domination, the Arabs were replaced at the helm by the A'ajam - the non-Arab Muslims: Turks, Berbers, Mongols (who came as pagan Tengriists, but converted to Islam) Persians, Circassians and so on and so forth. Arabs lost their prominence as the White majority is losing it in the West today. And if it was not for its role as the ritual language of Qur'an and Salat, Arabic would have been replaced just like Aramaic before. And it was the Ahd Al Inhitat - the Age of Decadence of Arab and Islamic culture, lasting centuries.

    Where your Indo-European ancestors lasted millenia, your current cultural and religious identity didn't even stand the test of a thousand years before becoming weakened and degenerate, kicked around by its former servants and slaves.

    What are you proud of exactly by putting forward this identity of yours ?

    Egyptian serials, Saudi Oil rigs ?

    Naguib Mahfouz ?

    You are not all that, you are first and foremost your blood - your ancestors live through you. Whether you like it or not.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    There are many R1a in Hungary who don’t even speak Indo-European language. They are still R1a though.

    But you are postulating that genetic lineage is somehow cultural lineage and thus we should somehow cultivate the first cultures of a given genetic lineage? Like a genetic lineage must be always connected with the same cultural memes?

    Why should Abraham buying a plot of land in Hebron be relevant here?
    There is a fringe tradition in Judaism which says that since Abraham bought the land there, Hebron is not a part of land given by God to his descendants. And well, today Hebron is not in Israel.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    But you are postulating that genetic lineage is somehow cultural lineage and thus we should somehow cultivate the first cultures of a given genetic lineage? Like a genetic lineage must be always connected with the same cultural memes?
     
    Absolutely not. I have never written something along these lines. The memetics are an entirely different thing. They are best preserved through myths and spiritual beliefs. That is why in the ideal world one would want both his lineage and the faith and myths of one's ancestors to survive and live towards the future - to preserve as much as possible of the ancestral experience. Out of respect, but also because before the Globalization, when people more or less stayed put in the same environment for generations, these myths and the memes they represent has an adaptative value and increased the survival of one's lineage.

    Now, in time a given population would develop a character, a psychological bend, due to both their nature and nurture, that is their population genetics and their environment. In the past it often coincided with the haplogroups, although haplogroups do not encode functional genomic units and contribute nothing to genetic expression and phenotype. They are just markers of a common origin. It's just that genetic admixture was less pervasive than it is today.

    Nowadays, most people don't know who the grandparents of their grandparents were, let alone their ancestors a few centuries ago. And even when they know, they just don't care what their ancestors believed and what principles they built their life upon. These people disregard the sacrifices and achievements made by their ancestors. Because accross history, just surviving was something of a feat sometimes.

    We live because they lived, struggled, sometimes won and sometimes coped with losses. We ought remember that and give some credit. Question is why don't we ?

    And the answer is: the spiritual Abrahamic monoculture and its severing of the roots of the native populations wherever it comes. It is something of a viral memetic complex that turns anyone it infects into a "spiritual descendant of Abraham", that is into someone who spiritually renounced his ancestry and flocked to the spiritual lineage of the YHWH people. Their egregore (or their mass subconscious) is therefore redirected towards feeding and abetting the archetypes of alien origin. They become the nutrients and the fertilizer on which an alien culture grows and flourishes, while the culture of their ancestors slowly, but surely fades away.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  546. @Sher Singh
    @AaronB

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/781981619073318943/1065929268003086389/TA0939.jpg

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/781981619073318943/1065929268267323402/2006px-HinduSwastika.svg.png

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/781981619073318943/1065929268682571886/Singh_GaoRakshak.png

    The Khalsa is merciful it does not make the tormented wait till death for hellfire.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    Replies: @AaronB, @Another Polish Perspective

    Is swastika not just Hindu but a Sikh symbol too…?

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Swastika is an universal symbol. It is archetypal to a point that it is found among very diverse populations. But it was most strongly identified with by the Indo-European population in its most strict sense - i.e. Aryans. It doesn't mean Aryans invented swastika, it was there before them because it connects to the archetypal images of change in the human subconscious. But Aryans ended up adopting it as a sacred symbol. A symbol that has been defiled by Nazism and is now become anathema to the Woke and the "right thinking". It's a good thing that Asian cultures do not care about the neurotic and shame driven Eurocentric rejection of this venerable symbol by the White. Buddhist, Hindu and Jain people continue serenely using swastika in the symbolic and ritual aspects of their cultures and they do the right thing. We should thank them for preserving this beautiful symbol that would otherwise have been canceled into oblivion.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  547. @Emil Nikola Richard
    Y'all's theology is rubbish.

    This is explained so that a 12-year-old may grok in the Book of Job. God's will is not for us to comprehend. end_of_file

    (They interviewed the National Geographic green eye Afghan girl twenty years after the famous photo. They found her in a refugee camp in Pakistan. Her chance of ever celebrating her 70th birthday is miniscule. She is illiterate. She was asked about the cosmic injustice of her life. I forget the exact wording used by the national geographic journalist. Her answer: "God's will".)

    https://static01.nyt.com/images/2021/11/26/multimedia/26xp-afghangirl-promo/26xp-afghangirl-promo-mediumSquareAt3X.jpg

    Replies: @songbird, @Ivashka the fool, @Talha, @S

    OT…It’s not something I’d put a whole lot of stock in, but any thoughts on the idea that there may have been, even unbeknownst consciously to the alleged murderer and likely somewhat deranged Kohberger himself, an occult element to the Idaho student murders, specifically that the murders at 1122 King Rd in Moscow, Idaho represented a symbolic Masonic ‘killing of the King’ in commemoration of the Nov 22 (11/22) Kennedy assassination, the 1918 murder of the Czar Nicholas II and family in 1918, and perhaps a yet to happen assassination in Moscow, Russia?

    Despite the title of the linked video, I personally think there’s plenty of responsibility to share regarding Masonry and the present situation, and am plenty content with a republic. I post it due to the creator’s claimed Orthodox Christian beliefs and his explanation of the ‘killing of the King’ concept.

    [MORE]

    Kohberger’s Washington state apartment with It’s Masonic like ‘G’.

    • Replies: @S
    @S

    In regards to the previous post, the photo of Kohberger's Washington state apartment didn't link...



    https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2023/01/Kohberger-dorm-idaho-murders-05.jpg

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-u7uhmrVBhao/T3L_5yp8gPI/AAAAAAAAAB4/o3LRUY0kOlU/s320/images.jpeg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  548. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    There are many R1a in Hungary who don't even speak Indo-European language. They are still R1a though.

    But you are postulating that genetic lineage is somehow cultural lineage and thus we should somehow cultivate the first cultures of a given genetic lineage? Like a genetic lineage must be always connected with the same cultural memes?

    Why should Abraham buying a plot of land in Hebron be relevant here?
    There is a fringe tradition in Judaism which says that since Abraham bought the land there, Hebron is not a part of land given by God to his descendants. And well, today Hebron is not in Israel.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    But you are postulating that genetic lineage is somehow cultural lineage and thus we should somehow cultivate the first cultures of a given genetic lineage? Like a genetic lineage must be always connected with the same cultural memes?

    Absolutely not. I have never written something along these lines. The memetics are an entirely different thing. They are best preserved through myths and spiritual beliefs. That is why in the ideal world one would want both his lineage and the faith and myths of one’s ancestors to survive and live towards the future – to preserve as much as possible of the ancestral experience. Out of respect, but also because before the Globalization, when people more or less stayed put in the same environment for generations, these myths and the memes they represent has an adaptative value and increased the survival of one’s lineage.

    [MORE]

    Now, in time a given population would develop a character, a psychological bend, due to both their nature and nurture, that is their population genetics and their environment. In the past it often coincided with the haplogroups, although haplogroups do not encode functional genomic units and contribute nothing to genetic expression and phenotype. They are just markers of a common origin. It’s just that genetic admixture was less pervasive than it is today.

    Nowadays, most people don’t know who the grandparents of their grandparents were, let alone their ancestors a few centuries ago. And even when they know, they just don’t care what their ancestors believed and what principles they built their life upon. These people disregard the sacrifices and achievements made by their ancestors. Because accross history, just surviving was something of a feat sometimes.

    We live because they lived, struggled, sometimes won and sometimes coped with losses. We ought remember that and give some credit. Question is why don’t we ?

    And the answer is: the spiritual Abrahamic monoculture and its severing of the roots of the native populations wherever it comes. It is something of a viral memetic complex that turns anyone it infects into a “spiritual descendant of Abraham”, that is into someone who spiritually renounced his ancestry and flocked to the spiritual lineage of the YHWH people. Their egregore (or their mass subconscious) is therefore redirected towards feeding and abetting the archetypes of alien origin. They become the nutrients and the fertilizer on which an alien culture grows and flourishes, while the culture of their ancestors slowly, but surely fades away.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    Now, in time a given population would develop a character, a psychological bend, due to both their nature and nurture, that is their population genetics and their environment.
     
    Germans and Austrians tried to follow this line of thought with their concept of Voelkerpsychologie, a kind of geography-informed anthropology. But it had to something with ideas of holistic biology developed in Germany at that time by Jakob von Uexkuell.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jakob_Johann_von_Uexk%C3%BCll

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V%C3%B6lkerpsychologie

    The immediate topics in Völkerpsychologie are language, myth, and custom.

    The concept stayed up until Nazi times: I once read a German book on Yugoslavia/Southern Slavs and another one on Greece which dwelled much on the theme of 'mountain people" as core to their national characters.


    Nowadays, most people don’t know who the grandparents of their grandparents were, let alone their ancestors a few centuries ago. And even when they know, they just don’t care what their ancestors believed and what principles they built their life upon. These people disregard the sacrifices and achievements made by their ancestors
     
    Luckily, you do have cultures that worship ancestors so you can compare: that are East Asian Cultures, China, Vietnam etc. You even have one prophet of this worship: Confucius.
    But I wouldn't say that this worship makes these lands more liveable or more accomplished or more spiritually harmonious. In fact, religions like Buddhism and Taoism tried to limit ancestor worship.
  549. @S
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    OT...It's not something I'd put a whole lot of stock in, but any thoughts on the idea that there may have been, even unbeknownst consciously to the alleged murderer and likely somewhat deranged Kohberger himself, an occult element to the Idaho student murders, specifically that the murders at 1122 King Rd in Moscow, Idaho represented a symbolic Masonic 'killing of the King' in commemoration of the Nov 22 (11/22) Kennedy assassination, the 1918 murder of the Czar Nicholas II and family in 1918, and perhaps a yet to happen assassination in Moscow, Russia?

    Despite the title of the linked video, I personally think there's plenty of responsibility to share regarding Masonry and the present situation, and am plenty content with a republic. I post it due to the creator's claimed Orthodox Christian beliefs and his explanation of the 'killing of the King' concept.

    https://youtu.be/hrmwKUK3VPE



    Kohberger's Washington state apartment with It's Masonic like 'G'.


    http://139.59.164.119/cars-https-i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/12/30/19/66055879-11585985-image-a-97_1672428627759.jpg

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-u7uhmrVBhao/T3L_5yp8gPI/AAAAAAAAAB4/o3LRUY0kOlU/s320/images.jpeg

    Replies: @S

    In regards to the previous post, the photo of Kohberger’s Washington state apartment didn’t link…

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @S

    Building G is an accident in that it was the address of the available apartment the guy rented the last time he was looking for an apartment.

    Matthew Johnson has a lot of interesting content and a lot of insane bitter ranting. Promotion of monarchical systems in 2023 or whenever he recorded that is like nostalgia for world gone with the wind. Entertaining but You Can't Be Serious.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0hK1wyrrAU&ab_channel=Wimbledon

    My favorite killing of the king is Saul Bellow Henderson the Rain King.

    Replies: @S

  550. @AaronB
    @AP


    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ’s message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.
     
    Perhaps then, AP, you are not arrogant enough, and you can use a little of my Jewish arrogance :)

    I'm beginning to think Dmitry was the better psychologist here and understood you better than I did. I thought you were this devilishly cunning fellow who was trying to subvert religion, but Dmitry thought you were a simple and ignorant person.

    Perhaps I succumbed - for once - to the atmosphere of conspiracy theories so prevalent on this site, which I am usually proof against, and saw malign intent and masterful strategy where there was simply tragic human finitude.

    I understand you differently now, and see as a completely different type - it was your moving encomium to wealth and comfort, so innocent, so optimistic, so pure, so sincere and uncomplicated, so childish, that has given me a different perspective on you.

    You, AP, did everything right - you followed blindly the dictates of your culture and society, without questioning it. You were a good boy. You did what everyone said was the right thing, what everyone said would lead to happiness and satisfaction. You studied hard, got a good job, pursued money, lived comfortably, worked hard, advanced in your career, worshipped the State cult exactly as the authorities said you should. You were respectable, damn it.

    And yet, somehow, it was all empty - you didn't feel the happiness you were promised. Nothing ever happened, and life stagnated. In the words Thoreau used to describe the mainstream man, you lived a life of "quiet desperation".

    Still, you're the one who is supposed to be happy, by rights - someone like me, who laughs at respectability, who has all the wrong opinions, who goes adventuring in the wilderness half the year, who does everything wrong, is supposed to be miserable, by God.

    And homeless people? By God, they're just desserts is to suffer - yet maybe, perhaps, some of them are actually much happier than AP :) And that cannot be. The sheer gall of it.

    Therefore, those homeless who have chosen their lot must be forcibly made to live like AP as much as possible - and AaronB must cease his wilderness expeditions and start focusing on being economically productive, just like AP :) It is for their own good, really - but more importantly, the idea that they are the happy ones cannot be permitted to stand.

    I am, unfortunately, very, very familiar with this mentality. I have friends who take "pity" on me and try and get me married, and live "normally" - when, eventually, they realize that I am actually much happier than they are, the shock and rage are almost comical.

    There is in this world, in a way, a "conspiracy against happiness" - most people are broken by society, and cannot resist it's dictates, and then set about trying to make sure no one else escapes. If I am not happy, none can be.

    Had you had a little more intestinal fortitude, AP, a little more arrogance, independence, and rebelliousness, you would have been able to resist social conditioning.

    It is merely a pity, and a sad but all too familiar commentary on human finitude and limitation. And I am here, as much as possible, to ensure future APs have the courage to resist.

    Cheers.

    Replies: @AP, @silviosilver

    You, AP, did everything right – you followed blindly the dictates of your culture and society, without questioning it.

    How do you know he “blindly” followed it? How do you know he didn’t question it and, having questioned it, having examined various alternatives, agreed that it was sound advice? Was everything our elders advised us to do necessarily bullshit, such that it ought to have been stubbornly resisted simply because our elders advised it?

    And yet, somehow, it was all empty – you didn’t feel the happiness you were promised. Nothing ever happened, and life stagnated. In the words Thoreau used to describe the mainstream man, you lived a life of “quiet desperation”.

    You sound very sure of yourself. Am I to understand you employed the same means of inquiry here as you did when you intuited the “internal logic” driving the creative endeavors of artists long dead, namely “it’s plausible, and it would please me if it were true, so I’m running with it”?

    And Thoreau, Schmoreau. Listen bucko, I took the alternative route in life. Or the “scenic route,” as I’d humorously call it, in a bid to keep the looming avalanche of regret at bay. “Quiet desperation” huh? Lol, I bet anyone who’s experienced the real fucking thing – mass anxiety levels of desperation – would settle for the quiet variety in a heartbeat. And what grand adventures did I have anyway? What the actual living fuck did I ever do that I couldn’t have done while maintaining a sense of balance and proportion, so that today I’d be light years closer to the very career, family and community goals I’m now playing desperado-style catch-up to achieve – and not because of any cockamamie notions of “social pressure” (in Libtardia? yeah right) to achieve them, but because I myself recognize them as worthy ideals.

    If I sound angry, sorry. I’m certainly not angry at you. I’m actually grinning bittersweetly as I type these words. Sweetly because I grant there were some good times, and that to an extent I can take some pride in having marched to the beat of my own drum. And bitterly because of me it may be said, there are fools, there are damn fools, and there is silviosilver. “The kid had everything going for him – he threw it all away.” But oh well, it’s not so bad. The irrepressible optimist is right to insist that life goes on.

    someone like me, who laughs at respectability, who has all the wrong opinions, who goes adventuring in the wilderness half the year, who does everything wrong, is supposed to be miserable, by God.

    You’re living in a time warp. The last time that was true, the internet was still on dial-up. That set of standards has completely fallen by the wayside.

    and AaronB must cease his wilderness expeditions and start focusing on being economically productive, just like AP 🙂 It is for their own good, really – but more importantly, the idea that they are the happy ones cannot be permitted to stand.

    Sorry to break it to you, Walter Mitty, but that’s all in your head. No one’s stopping you from doing what you want. (“Call the authorities, Aaron’s off 4WDing again!”) If all it takes to spoil your fun is someone disapproving of your choices, then I think you’ve got some “issues” you need to sort through. (I recommend Nathaniel Branden!)

    I have friends who take “pity” on me and try and get me married, and live “normally” – when, eventually, they realize that I am actually much happier than they are, the shock and rage are almost comical.

    Interesting. I’ve had the opposite experience, especially with friends a bit older than me, who had achieved a measure of success by (old-school) conventional standards – careers, families, mortgages etc. When they’d spout guff like “Ah silv you don’t know how lucky you are that you never married” or “Ah silv, if I could do it all again, I wouldn’t have had kids”, then silviosilver, that greatest of fools, would fight to choke back the glee, delighted to have the wisdom of his life choices so authentically confirmed in the pained exhalations of his friends.

    Had you had a little more intestinal fortitude, AP, a little more arrogance, independence, and rebelliousness, you would have been able to resist social conditioning.

    I for one am grateful AP proved such a “wimp.” I would take a society composed of AP’s over a society of silviosilvers or AaronB’s any day. It may be less fun (that LOL he attached to your post may well be the first time I’ve seen him laugh), but it’d be a happier, wealthier and wiser society.

    • Agree: Ivashka the fool
    • Thanks: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @AaronB
    @silviosilver

    You're not wrong, you should be able to live according to your lights and I don't really want to convert anyone even if I'm writing as if I do.

    Even if someone is living a life of quiet desperation if he simply can't see through the illusions of life and the social game then that's the best life for him - it would be torture to live like me and I would never try and make him. But for someone who sees past the illusions it's impossible to go back to that kind of life.

    The way I see it, society should be composed of symbiotic layers at least for the time being. Even if I think the destiny of humanity is to evolve beyond these illusions the fact is that right now lots of people can't see past certain illusions, and they should have the right to do their thing.

    The problem is, modern society completely disvalues the sort of life I'm describing to the point of denying it even exists as a legitimate alternative - remember, this whole thing started with AP denying that Jesus actually recommended the sort of life that he plainly and unambiguously did.

    So unfortunately it's your side that's being "imperialistic" here.

    Now, even though I think people like you should be allowed to live according to your lights, you shouldn't have an unlimited right to organize society according to your principles and there should be some level of spiritual check from people like me - and I think that's to yours and everyone's benefit.

    But it's modern society that has stopped compromising, not my people - think of classic Chinese society. If you were highly intelligent you served the court in your prime years, but as you grew older you had the option of retiring to the mountains to live in poverty like a Taoist hermit "an old man laughing in the mountains", having shed your illusions about the social game. Not everyone took this option, but many did, and it was considered totally laudable and legitimate. Moreover, the values of the Taoist hermit percolated back into the court and had a softening and refining and ameliorating effect for everyone.

    A figure like AP could only arise in the late modern period, someone who completely denies any legitimacy whatsoever to escape from the social game ever, for anyone, at any time.

    The old compromises and symbiosis have broken down in modernity - because modernity is a totalizing and imperializing culture akin to the slave empires of the ancient Near East, Sumerians and Assyrians and Babylonians.

    All societies used to have some kind of compromise with the two "ways", monks, yogis, nomads, and merchants, warriors, courts, etc. And the second side was not closed off to the influence of the first, which ameliorated it's innate harshness.

    So it's important today to insist on the legitimacy and viability of the old alternative to mainstream society because - I'm sorry if I myself come off as "imperializing" here but I don't mean to :) Rest assured I totally respect you're right to do you - I even told you I don't think racists should be forced to live among races they dislike, even though I think spiritual evolution means transcending illusions like racism eventually.

    I'm merely trying to defend an option, one that took me a serious struggle to wrest from a social environment that utterly denied it's legitimacy, and not to force it on anyone for whom it would be utterly uncongenial, even impossible, but to give succor and courage to those who like me need it to struggle against a hostile social environment.

    In today's times, we - the happy few :), to quote Stendahl - must make ourselves public and give support and succour to each other, and we even have a social duty - not to foist our values on the unwilling, God forbid - but to introduce this alternative spirit into society for the purposes of amelioration and softening.

    There used to be a whole Romantic Movement providing this service - where has it gone? It must be resurrected - it won't destroy the foundations of your society, Silvio, have no fear, but it will soften it, and provide the necessary escape for those who are ready to take that step.

    , @AP
    @silviosilver

    Everything you wrote was correct in this post.


    How do you know he “blindly” followed it? How do you know he didn’t question it and, having questioned it, having examined various alternatives, agreed that it was sound advice?
     
    If one has to run away in order to achieve “transcendence” or “authenticity” than that authenticity is weak or fake, dependent on external factors rather than on something within oneself. Someone capable of these things can do them in any environment, be it a factory or office or shop, while being productive (that is, giving back to the community rather than just taking its fruits). AaronB is as spiritual in his flight from civilization, as are his equals - middle aged bourgeois women making eat-pray-love vacations in India or Africa, except he probably doesn’t have sex with the locals. It is no wonder that the person with whom he has the least contentious interactions is the materialist atheist Mikel (whom I do not criticize here, because he seems to be authentic and honest to himself).

    Maybe because none of my ancestors were bourgeois, we don’t feel the need to distance ourselves from the modern capitalist system here, as if to prove something by rejecting it. Objectively, as I wrote, it’s the best tool invented to maximize material prosperity and thereby to eliminate tragedies such as famines and real impoverishment (not the fake voluntary and self-indulgent kind). One must really hate people to condemn such a system or even to refuse to participate in it, in order to pursue a life of self-indulgence, living off fruits that others have planted while whining about the planters and telling oneself lies about somehow being more intuitive or transcendent than they are.

    Feudalism had its own advantages (beauty probably peaked in that world) and we did no worse under that system, but it is not coming back and we do not choose when we are born but live the best we can in the place we find ourselves in. We once built conservatories and schools, financed churches, composed music, performed music, served as military officers or priests. In the current efficient system we outsource much (but not all!) such work through high tax rates and election choices while enjoying the prosperity that we share with others, in the most prosperous age in human history. A prosperity that need not be expressed solely in material pleasures or possessions (this is probably the only way that someone like AaronB can understand prosperity), it can be transformed into much more.

    The bourgeois’s flight into the wilderness is not Christlike at all. It reveals an inability to love others. Flight from marriage means the person can’t appreciate one other’s soul enough to spend a lifetime exploring it and the world together. Choosing childlessness is to prevent bringing another soul into this world and a flight from a fundamental and truly transformative human experience, which may be scary for some. This is why abortion, in addition to murder, is an act of extreme cowardice and denial. Flight from work reflects the inability or laziness to see beauty in seemingly mundane settings and interactions, as well as obvious selfishness.

    Replies: @Mikel

  551. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Sher Singh

    Is swastika not just Hindu but a Sikh symbol too...?

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Swastika is an universal symbol. It is archetypal to a point that it is found among very diverse populations. But it was most strongly identified with by the Indo-European population in its most strict sense – i.e. Aryans. It doesn’t mean Aryans invented swastika, it was there before them because it connects to the archetypal images of change in the human subconscious. But Aryans ended up adopting it as a sacred symbol. A symbol that has been defiled by Nazism and is now become anathema to the Woke and the “right thinking”. It’s a good thing that Asian cultures do not care about the neurotic and shame driven Eurocentric rejection of this venerable symbol by the White. Buddhist, Hindu and Jain people continue serenely using swastika in the symbolic and ritual aspects of their cultures and they do the right thing. We should thank them for preserving this beautiful symbol that would otherwise have been canceled into oblivion.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    But it was most strongly identified with by the Indo-European population in its most strict sense – i.e. Aryans.
     
    Now yes, but in the past it was a symbol of pre-Indo-European cultures conquered by Aryans. The Aryans apparently took over this symbol for reasons unknown (infiltration by their victims?). This is why I think its use by Aryans is questionable at least.

    It was originally a solar symbol, invoking closed cycle. The closed cycle/circle representing circular time was typical symbol in these pre-Indo-European cultures, as reflected through concepts of reincarnation, cult of spring ("The Rite of Spring" of Stravinsky, which originally was to be named "The Great [human] sacrifice" haha), moon calendar etc.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  552. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    But you are postulating that genetic lineage is somehow cultural lineage and thus we should somehow cultivate the first cultures of a given genetic lineage? Like a genetic lineage must be always connected with the same cultural memes?
     
    Absolutely not. I have never written something along these lines. The memetics are an entirely different thing. They are best preserved through myths and spiritual beliefs. That is why in the ideal world one would want both his lineage and the faith and myths of one's ancestors to survive and live towards the future - to preserve as much as possible of the ancestral experience. Out of respect, but also because before the Globalization, when people more or less stayed put in the same environment for generations, these myths and the memes they represent has an adaptative value and increased the survival of one's lineage.

    Now, in time a given population would develop a character, a psychological bend, due to both their nature and nurture, that is their population genetics and their environment. In the past it often coincided with the haplogroups, although haplogroups do not encode functional genomic units and contribute nothing to genetic expression and phenotype. They are just markers of a common origin. It's just that genetic admixture was less pervasive than it is today.

    Nowadays, most people don't know who the grandparents of their grandparents were, let alone their ancestors a few centuries ago. And even when they know, they just don't care what their ancestors believed and what principles they built their life upon. These people disregard the sacrifices and achievements made by their ancestors. Because accross history, just surviving was something of a feat sometimes.

    We live because they lived, struggled, sometimes won and sometimes coped with losses. We ought remember that and give some credit. Question is why don't we ?

    And the answer is: the spiritual Abrahamic monoculture and its severing of the roots of the native populations wherever it comes. It is something of a viral memetic complex that turns anyone it infects into a "spiritual descendant of Abraham", that is into someone who spiritually renounced his ancestry and flocked to the spiritual lineage of the YHWH people. Their egregore (or their mass subconscious) is therefore redirected towards feeding and abetting the archetypes of alien origin. They become the nutrients and the fertilizer on which an alien culture grows and flourishes, while the culture of their ancestors slowly, but surely fades away.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Now, in time a given population would develop a character, a psychological bend, due to both their nature and nurture, that is their population genetics and their environment.

    Germans and Austrians tried to follow this line of thought with their concept of Voelkerpsychologie, a kind of geography-informed anthropology. But it had to something with ideas of holistic biology developed in Germany at that time by Jakob von Uexkuell.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jakob_Johann_von_Uexk%C3%BCll

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V%C3%B6lkerpsychologie

    The immediate topics in Völkerpsychologie are language, myth, and custom.

    The concept stayed up until Nazi times: I once read a German book on Yugoslavia/Southern Slavs and another one on Greece which dwelled much on the theme of ‘mountain people” as core to their national characters.

    Nowadays, most people don’t know who the grandparents of their grandparents were, let alone their ancestors a few centuries ago. And even when they know, they just don’t care what their ancestors believed and what principles they built their life upon. These people disregard the sacrifices and achievements made by their ancestors

    Luckily, you do have cultures that worship ancestors so you can compare: that are East Asian Cultures, China, Vietnam etc. You even have one prophet of this worship: Confucius.
    But I wouldn’t say that this worship makes these lands more liveable or more accomplished or more spiritually harmonious. In fact, religions like Buddhism and Taoism tried to limit ancestor worship.

  553. @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    About Arab politics, I really have too little information and a limited interest. All I know is that there are supposedly more than 400 million Arab people around the world, let’s say that around 1/4 of them are able-bodied men – that would be some 100 million. And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham (that would be Arabs and Jews).
     
    It's quite apparent you have a limited interest, otherwise it'd be hard to believe you could take such a simplistic view of things. A high school student would probably be embarrassed to submit this thesis, even for no other reason than the intuitive feeling that there's got to be me more to the story.

    Put aside "the Arabs" for a moment, and just consider the billion or whatever Muslims, probably none of whom are happy that the holy land fell into Jewish hands. Do you really suppose they wake up each morning asking themselves what they can do today to help wrest control of Palestine? Even if you imagine they're as ethnocentrically motivated as you - and your comments in the past about muslims suggests you do believe something close to this - it doesn't make sense to pretend that's what they been trying to do all this time. People from the wider muslim world - and we can specify here particularly from the Arab part of it - who feel that strongly about the issue tend to join movements like the Muslim Brotherhood or ISIS, but even there Israel/Palestine is not the primary focus of their efforts.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Do you really suppose they wake up each morning asking themselves what they can do today to help wrest control of Palestine? Even if you imagine they’re as ethnocentrically motivated as you – and your comments in the past about muslims suggests you do believe something close to this – it doesn’t make sense to pretend that’s what they been trying to do all this time.

    No most Muslims, let alone Arabs, just drift about their lives as everyone else does. And that is precisely the problem: as Muslims they shouldn’t live that way until the Al Aqsa Mosque at least is liberated from the Israeli hold. But Muslims “swallowed” which makes most of them contemptible. Not because of their ethnicity, but because of their lack of respect and zeal towards their Din.

    This of course applies even more to the Arabs, whom on top of being Muslims are supposed to be descendants of Abraham. In fact, Laurent Gyenot has made a very compelling case for the Jewish ethnicity being derived from the iron age tribes of what is nowadays northern Saudi Arabia. And that is actually confirmed by population genetics and archeology. That is, Arabs in a larger sense existed before the Jews appeared, and are ancestral to to the Jews. But most Arabs don’t care about their ancestors. Most Muslims don’t care about theirs. That is why they are a weak although numerous people.

    A tree without roots cannot keep growing towards the sun, a people without ancestry has no future. Jews understand this, it is part of their religion and culture, Arabs don’t. The difference is for everyone to behold.

    [MORE]

    They should think of Palestine every waken hour of their lives until the problem is solved. But they prefer obsessing about Lebanese starlets and Turkish serials, while they spend American dollars in a Jewish owned financial system. Ibn Khaldoun was right when he wrote that they are living through an historical stage of decay and degradation. They are corrupt.

    As a Maghrebi saying goes : better a handful of bees than a bucket of flies.

  554. @AaronB
    @Sher Singh

    And the sect of the HeavilyMarbledSteak spotted a Sikh in possession of a cow and yet not eating of it, yea, even though it was heavily marbled and thus prime steak, and looked delicious, and they did capture that miscreant sikh and gouge out his eyes and hang him for not appreciating delicious food, and did slaughter the cow and eat it unto the last bone - and behold, it was a heavily marbled cow yielding many fine steaks, all well marbled.

    And then an army of Sikhs descended upon the sect of the HeavilyMarbledSteak, who did number but a dozen, but the feeble armed Sikhs who did not eat cow were weak of arm and slack of temper, on account of not eating meat, and a great slaughter of Sikhs was made that day, and all their cows were seized and eaten - and yea, the Lord made it that each one was heavily marbled indeed!

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Sher Singh

    Then the Guru spake unto Aaron, “Behold, in my dream I was standing on the banks of the Indus. Seven cows, plump and attractive, came up out of the Indus and fed in the reed grass. Seven other cows came up after them, poor and very ugly and thin, such as I had never seen in all the land of Punjab. And the thin, ugly cows ate up the first seven plump cows, but when they had eaten them no one would have known that they had eaten them, for they were still as ugly as at the beginning. Then I awoke.

    Then Aaron spake unto the Guru: “God has revealed to the Guru what he is about to do. The seven lean cows are seven races that will feast on your cows; seven are the corners of the world to which the sikhs shall scatter to witness the feasting; and seven are the words that God will permit the sikh to post in impotent remonstrance.” And hearing this the Guru sunk to his knees and wept, for his heart told him that Aaaron had spoken truly.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    https://twitter.com/JDKnox4/status/1458940077757935620

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @silviosilver

    We know this is a fable because real gurus only weep when the government hoodlums come to confiscate their property.

  555. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Swastika is an universal symbol. It is archetypal to a point that it is found among very diverse populations. But it was most strongly identified with by the Indo-European population in its most strict sense - i.e. Aryans. It doesn't mean Aryans invented swastika, it was there before them because it connects to the archetypal images of change in the human subconscious. But Aryans ended up adopting it as a sacred symbol. A symbol that has been defiled by Nazism and is now become anathema to the Woke and the "right thinking". It's a good thing that Asian cultures do not care about the neurotic and shame driven Eurocentric rejection of this venerable symbol by the White. Buddhist, Hindu and Jain people continue serenely using swastika in the symbolic and ritual aspects of their cultures and they do the right thing. We should thank them for preserving this beautiful symbol that would otherwise have been canceled into oblivion.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    But it was most strongly identified with by the Indo-European population in its most strict sense – i.e. Aryans.

    Now yes, but in the past it was a symbol of pre-Indo-European cultures conquered by Aryans. The Aryans apparently took over this symbol for reasons unknown (infiltration by their victims?). This is why I think its use by Aryans is questionable at least.

    It was originally a solar symbol, invoking closed cycle. The closed cycle/circle representing circular time was typical symbol in these pre-Indo-European cultures, as reflected through concepts of reincarnation, cult of spring (“The Rite of Spring” of Stravinsky, which originally was to be named “The Great [human] sacrifice” haha), moon calendar etc.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    A good example of non-Aryan swastika:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lauburu

    It is also present in the Celtic cross through its "circle".

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Mr. Hack

  556. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @silviosilver
    @AaronB


    You, AP, did everything right – you followed blindly the dictates of your culture and society, without questioning it.
     
    How do you know he "blindly" followed it? How do you know he didn't question it and, having questioned it, having examined various alternatives, agreed that it was sound advice? Was everything our elders advised us to do necessarily bullshit, such that it ought to have been stubbornly resisted simply because our elders advised it?

    And yet, somehow, it was all empty – you didn’t feel the happiness you were promised. Nothing ever happened, and life stagnated. In the words Thoreau used to describe the mainstream man, you lived a life of “quiet desperation”.
     
    You sound very sure of yourself. Am I to understand you employed the same means of inquiry here as you did when you intuited the "internal logic" driving the creative endeavors of artists long dead, namely "it's plausible, and it would please me if it were true, so I'm running with it"?

    And Thoreau, Schmoreau. Listen bucko, I took the alternative route in life. Or the "scenic route," as I'd humorously call it, in a bid to keep the looming avalanche of regret at bay. "Quiet desperation" huh? Lol, I bet anyone who's experienced the real fucking thing - mass anxiety levels of desperation - would settle for the quiet variety in a heartbeat. And what grand adventures did I have anyway? What the actual living fuck did I ever do that I couldn't have done while maintaining a sense of balance and proportion, so that today I'd be light years closer to the very career, family and community goals I'm now playing desperado-style catch-up to achieve - and not because of any cockamamie notions of "social pressure" (in Libtardia? yeah right) to achieve them, but because I myself recognize them as worthy ideals.

    If I sound angry, sorry. I'm certainly not angry at you. I'm actually grinning bittersweetly as I type these words. Sweetly because I grant there were some good times, and that to an extent I can take some pride in having marched to the beat of my own drum. And bitterly because of me it may be said, there are fools, there are damn fools, and there is silviosilver. "The kid had everything going for him - he threw it all away." But oh well, it's not so bad. The irrepressible optimist is right to insist that life goes on.

    someone like me, who laughs at respectability, who has all the wrong opinions, who goes adventuring in the wilderness half the year, who does everything wrong, is supposed to be miserable, by God.
     
    You're living in a time warp. The last time that was true, the internet was still on dial-up. That set of standards has completely fallen by the wayside.

    and AaronB must cease his wilderness expeditions and start focusing on being economically productive, just like AP 🙂 It is for their own good, really – but more importantly, the idea that they are the happy ones cannot be permitted to stand.
     
    Sorry to break it to you, Walter Mitty, but that's all in your head. No one's stopping you from doing what you want. ("Call the authorities, Aaron's off 4WDing again!") If all it takes to spoil your fun is someone disapproving of your choices, then I think you've got some "issues" you need to sort through. (I recommend Nathaniel Branden!)

    I have friends who take “pity” on me and try and get me married, and live “normally” – when, eventually, they realize that I am actually much happier than they are, the shock and rage are almost comical.
     
    Interesting. I've had the opposite experience, especially with friends a bit older than me, who had achieved a measure of success by (old-school) conventional standards - careers, families, mortgages etc. When they'd spout guff like "Ah silv you don't know how lucky you are that you never married" or "Ah silv, if I could do it all again, I wouldn't have had kids", then silviosilver, that greatest of fools, would fight to choke back the glee, delighted to have the wisdom of his life choices so authentically confirmed in the pained exhalations of his friends.

    Had you had a little more intestinal fortitude, AP, a little more arrogance, independence, and rebelliousness, you would have been able to resist social conditioning.
     
    I for one am grateful AP proved such a "wimp." I would take a society composed of AP's over a society of silviosilvers or AaronB's any day. It may be less fun (that LOL he attached to your post may well be the first time I've seen him laugh), but it'd be a happier, wealthier and wiser society.

    Replies: @AaronB, @AP

    You’re not wrong, you should be able to live according to your lights and I don’t really want to convert anyone even if I’m writing as if I do.

    Even if someone is living a life of quiet desperation if he simply can’t see through the illusions of life and the social game then that’s the best life for him – it would be torture to live like me and I would never try and make him. But for someone who sees past the illusions it’s impossible to go back to that kind of life.

    The way I see it, society should be composed of symbiotic layers at least for the time being. Even if I think the destiny of humanity is to evolve beyond these illusions the fact is that right now lots of people can’t see past certain illusions, and they should have the right to do their thing.

    The problem is, modern society completely disvalues the sort of life I’m describing to the point of denying it even exists as a legitimate alternative – remember, this whole thing started with AP denying that Jesus actually recommended the sort of life that he plainly and unambiguously did.

    So unfortunately it’s your side that’s being “imperialistic” here.

    Now, even though I think people like you should be allowed to live according to your lights, you shouldn’t have an unlimited right to organize society according to your principles and there should be some level of spiritual check from people like me – and I think that’s to yours and everyone’s benefit.

    But it’s modern society that has stopped compromising, not my people – think of classic Chinese society. If you were highly intelligent you served the court in your prime years, but as you grew older you had the option of retiring to the mountains to live in poverty like a Taoist hermit “an old man laughing in the mountains”, having shed your illusions about the social game. Not everyone took this option, but many did, and it was considered totally laudable and legitimate. Moreover, the values of the Taoist hermit percolated back into the court and had a softening and refining and ameliorating effect for everyone.

    A figure like AP could only arise in the late modern period, someone who completely denies any legitimacy whatsoever to escape from the social game ever, for anyone, at any time.

    The old compromises and symbiosis have broken down in modernity – because modernity is a totalizing and imperializing culture akin to the slave empires of the ancient Near East, Sumerians and Assyrians and Babylonians.

    All societies used to have some kind of compromise with the two “ways”, monks, yogis, nomads, and merchants, warriors, courts, etc. And the second side was not closed off to the influence of the first, which ameliorated it’s innate harshness.

    So it’s important today to insist on the legitimacy and viability of the old alternative to mainstream society because – I’m sorry if I myself come off as “imperializing” here but I don’t mean to 🙂 Rest assured I totally respect you’re right to do you – I even told you I don’t think racists should be forced to live among races they dislike, even though I think spiritual evolution means transcending illusions like racism eventually.

    I’m merely trying to defend an option, one that took me a serious struggle to wrest from a social environment that utterly denied it’s legitimacy, and not to force it on anyone for whom it would be utterly uncongenial, even impossible, but to give succor and courage to those who like me need it to struggle against a hostile social environment.

    In today’s times, we – the happy few :), to quote Stendahl – must make ourselves public and give support and succour to each other, and we even have a social duty – not to foist our values on the unwilling, God forbid – but to introduce this alternative spirit into society for the purposes of amelioration and softening.

    There used to be a whole Romantic Movement providing this service – where has it gone? It must be resurrected – it won’t destroy the foundations of your society, Silvio, have no fear, but it will soften it, and provide the necessary escape for those who are ready to take that step.

  557. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    But it was most strongly identified with by the Indo-European population in its most strict sense – i.e. Aryans.
     
    Now yes, but in the past it was a symbol of pre-Indo-European cultures conquered by Aryans. The Aryans apparently took over this symbol for reasons unknown (infiltration by their victims?). This is why I think its use by Aryans is questionable at least.

    It was originally a solar symbol, invoking closed cycle. The closed cycle/circle representing circular time was typical symbol in these pre-Indo-European cultures, as reflected through concepts of reincarnation, cult of spring ("The Rite of Spring" of Stravinsky, which originally was to be named "The Great [human] sacrifice" haha), moon calendar etc.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    A good example of non-Aryan swastika:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lauburu

    It is also present in the Celtic cross through its “circle”.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Did you miss the part of my comment where I have written: "Swastika is an universal symbol. It is archetypal to a point that it is found among very diverse populations." ? It's in the first three lines.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    , @Mr. Hack
    @Another Polish Perspective

    The swastika symbol has been used within different religious and cultural expressions throughout the world. tenSwasteika symbols are (were?) prominently exhibited within the dome of St.Sophia Cathedral in Kyiv. I remember reading about it a dozen or so years ago, and the discussion revolved aroundthe possibility of having these symbols removed by the thought police.I'm not sure whether the removal ever transpired?.

    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-VtGe2baI36o/V5a57YLPwgI/AAAAAAAADHI/xyKFU6qCEaYpg1l61_bV8CxCGRPFA6lXACLcB/s1600/Image-83.jpg

    A rare photo indeed!

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  558. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    A good example of non-Aryan swastika:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lauburu

    It is also present in the Celtic cross through its "circle".

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Mr. Hack

    Did you miss the part of my comment where I have written: “Swastika is an universal symbol. It is archetypal to a point that it is found among very diverse populations.” ? It’s in the first three lines.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, yes to some extent, since you stressed it to be sacred only for Aryans, which I disagree with.


    But Aryans ended up adopting it as a sacred symbol.
     
    I also disagree with the idea that swastika is somehow archetypal for a life of human being. His life is linear, not circular. To overcome this, the ARTIFICIAL, faith-based concept of reincarnation is postulated. As a curiosity and coincidence, reincarnation most of the time strangely happens among close kin - so the Tibetan Buddhists usually search for reincarnations of their lamas among those lamas families.
    Anyway, the deification of the matter-of-fact thing like the cycle of nature is actually quite strange; spring never changes, does not depend on you, does not respond to you, so why worship it at all ?

    As for your earlier remark, namely


    It is something of a viral memetic complex that turns anyone it infects into a “spiritual descendant of Abraham”, that is into someone who spiritually renounced his ancestry and flocked to the spiritual lineage of the YHWH people.
     
    Why do you think this would be the case? Couldn't these people see Yahwe to be a stronger god than their own ancestral gods..? Nevertheless, renouncing gods is not necessarily renouncing your ancestry (unless you see these gods as your "spiritual ancestry" as you seem t0).... many old customs continue anyway, like cousin marriage which is effectively breeding for genetic purity. So even if their mouths say we are one with umma, their customs say "we are very unique in umma, not at all like others". In this sense this spiritual ancestry (let's consider cousin marriage spiritual ancestry of many since most of people do not look at it in terms of genetics) is very strong, since people do practice it despite the lack of clear reasoning why but with a clear reasoning why not (health problems).

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  559. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Did you miss the part of my comment where I have written: "Swastika is an universal symbol. It is archetypal to a point that it is found among very diverse populations." ? It's in the first three lines.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Well, yes to some extent, since you stressed it to be sacred only for Aryans, which I disagree with.

    But Aryans ended up adopting it as a sacred symbol.

    I also disagree with the idea that swastika is somehow archetypal for a life of human being. His life is linear, not circular. To overcome this, the ARTIFICIAL, faith-based concept of reincarnation is postulated. As a curiosity and coincidence, reincarnation most of the time strangely happens among close kin – so the Tibetan Buddhists usually search for reincarnations of their lamas among those lamas families.
    Anyway, the deification of the matter-of-fact thing like the cycle of nature is actually quite strange; spring never changes, does not depend on you, does not respond to you, so why worship it at all ?

    As for your earlier remark, namely

    It is something of a viral memetic complex that turns anyone it infects into a “spiritual descendant of Abraham”, that is into someone who spiritually renounced his ancestry and flocked to the spiritual lineage of the YHWH people.

    Why do you think this would be the case? Couldn’t these people see Yahwe to be a stronger god than their own ancestral gods..? Nevertheless, renouncing gods is not necessarily renouncing your ancestry (unless you see these gods as your “spiritual ancestry” as you seem t0)…. many old customs continue anyway, like cousin marriage which is effectively breeding for genetic purity. So even if their mouths say we are one with umma, their customs say “we are very unique in umma, not at all like others”. In this sense this spiritual ancestry (let’s consider cousin marriage spiritual ancestry of many since most of people do not look at it in terms of genetics) is very strong, since people do practice it despite the lack of clear reasoning why but with a clear reasoning why not (health problems).

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Most Pagans defied their ancestors. We don't need cousin marriage because the haplogroups are widespread. We worship Nature because it is the closest we can come to God. God's creation (emanation in fact, in a Platonic sense) is God's manifestation to Himself. God is (in a multitude of forms), while we exist because He is. All structured pagan religions had a higher Creator / Nourisher deity (Ishvara in Sanskrit). The Balto-Slav had Sviatovit, but the exact theological structure of their beliefs was erased by centuries of Christian warfare against them and we have lost access to the most important aspects of our ancestors' memetic space. This is cultural genocide. It is a crime that has only been perpetuated due to the betrayal of elites. Now Christians and Muslims experience the same betrayal by their elites that our Pagan ancestors experienced in their time. What goes around, comes around. That is why it is good to keep the circle symbol and the swastika sacred, to remind us that on a genetic lineage's lifespan (millenia), history is somewhat cyclical. Therefore it's better to follow the golden rule of ethics and never do to others what you do not want others doing to you or your descendants.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Ivashka the fool

  560. @Greasy William
    @Yahya


    Israel hasn’t outputted much sophisticated music yet; just crappy Mizrahi pop stuff.
     
    I'm glad you share my low opinion of Mizrahi music. To me, all music and culture (including Jewish music and culture) from the Levant, North Africa, Arabia and the Caucasus is basically the same and, other than the food, I don't like any of it.

    I’m interested in recommendations of good Israeli songs.
     
    You're talking to the wrong guy. I don't like anything outside of pre 9/11 American culture. That and some Kpop.

    I was slightly disturbed at first by some of the quasi-fascistic lyrics
     
    "Quasi fascist" is a great way to describe the Lebanese, yes.

    In it she chastises “the enemy” for “coming to us, hallucinating
     
    lol wut? I suspect even Nasrallah rolled his eyes at that one. When it comes to Israel v Lebanon there is 0 question that Lebanon is the aggressor. Nasrallah has gone so far as to explicitly say as much. Ben Gurion admitted that the Zionist settlers were the aggressors v the Palestinians, so it wouldn't kill the Lebanese to show a little honesty for their own part.

    I recommend the following if you’re interested:
     
    Are we talking about music or looks? I'm not a music guy. As far as looks go, my favorite Lebanese singer was Fairouz. She was like a suped up Anne Frank. Totally my type.

    The singer on the left is Libyan, in the center is Lebanese, and on the right is Syrian
     
    So the one in the green is Syrian? She's hot. She looks like she probably has an attitude too, which I like.

    I’m surprised you did not find her attractive
     
    I like Middle Eastern women but I'm just not a fan of the type of Middle Eastern women that Middle Easterners themselves seem like the most. Lebanon has some actress named Haifa something who supposedly all the Lebanese girls wanted to look like back 10 to 20 and she never did anything for me at all. Lebanese and Palestinians are the kinda people who the typical girls you see getting interviewed on the street in YT vids mog the shit out of the famous actresses and singers.

    Although I'm not sure if maybe this song is from the time when Israel occupied southern Lebanon in which case the lyrics would at least make sense

    The word Canaanite is a meta-ethnic term that encompasses the various ethnicities of the Lower Levant region
     
    The Canaanites are from Ham, they aren't Semites. Ancient Canaan only contained, AFAIK, Canaanites (Ham), Israelites (Shem) and Philistines (Japheth). We aren't talking about a very big region. I have never heard the Canaanite designation applied to the latter 2 groups.

    Replies: @Yahya

    I’m glad you share my low opinion of Mizrahi music. To me, all music and culture (including Jewish music and culture) from the Levant, North Africa, Arabia and the Caucasus is basically the same and, other than the food, I don’t like any of it.

    Well there are some worthy cultural goods coming out of those regions. You just need to dig a bit deeper to find the high-culture stuff. I’ve made a few recommendations if you’re interested:

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5671484

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5676539

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5676710

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-198/#comment-5581415

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-193/#comment-5474079

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5682747

    When it comes to Israel v Lebanon there is 0 question that Lebanon is the aggressor.

    I beg to differ; the Israelis violated Lebanese sovereignty by invading and occupying their territory. They even allied themselves with a Christian fascist militia and abetted the massacre of innocent Palestinian refugees: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabra_and_Shatila_massacre

    Lebanon has conducted no comparable violations in Israeli territory.

    As far as looks go, my favorite Lebanese singer was Fairouz.

    Quirky choice; I don’t think she’s considered to be conventionally beautiful. She’s decent; i’d give her a 7 by normal people standards; but a 5 by celebrity standards.

    She looks very “Semitic” if you know what I mean. I like that phenotype as well; it looks regal and ancient:

    Although I’m not sure if maybe this song is from the time when Israel occupied southern Lebanon in which case the lyrics would at least make sense

    She rose to fame during the Israeli occupation of Southern Lebanon; when she released a song called غابت شمس الحق or “The Sun Of Justice Has Set”.

    She still sings this song to cheering crowds of Lebanese people; 40 years later.

    [MORE]

    Lebanon has some actress named Haifa something who supposedly all the Lebanese girls wanted to look like back 10 to 20 and she never did anything for me at all.

    Haifa Wehbe.

    She’s a Lebanese Muslim who was notorious for being sluttier than the Christians. I think every Arab boy grew up with a crush on her. There’s another Lebanese (Christian) singer called Nancy Ajram who was also a huge sex symbol in the 2000s:

    Each of them dumber than the other. But when I was a kid it was common to debate “which one is hotter, the Christian or the Muslim?”

    So Greasy, which one would you bang?

  561. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, yes to some extent, since you stressed it to be sacred only for Aryans, which I disagree with.


    But Aryans ended up adopting it as a sacred symbol.
     
    I also disagree with the idea that swastika is somehow archetypal for a life of human being. His life is linear, not circular. To overcome this, the ARTIFICIAL, faith-based concept of reincarnation is postulated. As a curiosity and coincidence, reincarnation most of the time strangely happens among close kin - so the Tibetan Buddhists usually search for reincarnations of their lamas among those lamas families.
    Anyway, the deification of the matter-of-fact thing like the cycle of nature is actually quite strange; spring never changes, does not depend on you, does not respond to you, so why worship it at all ?

    As for your earlier remark, namely


    It is something of a viral memetic complex that turns anyone it infects into a “spiritual descendant of Abraham”, that is into someone who spiritually renounced his ancestry and flocked to the spiritual lineage of the YHWH people.
     
    Why do you think this would be the case? Couldn't these people see Yahwe to be a stronger god than their own ancestral gods..? Nevertheless, renouncing gods is not necessarily renouncing your ancestry (unless you see these gods as your "spiritual ancestry" as you seem t0).... many old customs continue anyway, like cousin marriage which is effectively breeding for genetic purity. So even if their mouths say we are one with umma, their customs say "we are very unique in umma, not at all like others". In this sense this spiritual ancestry (let's consider cousin marriage spiritual ancestry of many since most of people do not look at it in terms of genetics) is very strong, since people do practice it despite the lack of clear reasoning why but with a clear reasoning why not (health problems).

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Most Pagans defied their ancestors. We don’t need cousin marriage because the haplogroups are widespread. We worship Nature because it is the closest we can come to God. God’s creation (emanation in fact, in a Platonic sense) is God’s manifestation to Himself. God is (in a multitude of forms), while we exist because He is. All structured pagan religions had a higher Creator / Nourisher deity (Ishvara in Sanskrit). The Balto-Slav had Sviatovit, but the exact theological structure of their beliefs was erased by centuries of Christian warfare against them and we have lost access to the most important aspects of our ancestors’ memetic space. This is cultural genocide. It is a crime that has only been perpetuated due to the betrayal of elites. Now Christians and Muslims experience the same betrayal by their elites that our Pagan ancestors experienced in their time. What goes around, comes around. That is why it is good to keep the circle symbol and the swastika sacred, to remind us that on a genetic lineage’s lifespan (millenia), history is somewhat cyclical. Therefore it’s better to follow the golden rule of ethics and never do to others what you do not want others doing to you or your descendants.

    • Agree: LatW
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    We don’t need cousin marriage because the haplogroups are widespread
     
    .

    Only if you live among themselves, and you don't want to preserve recessive traits.


    The Balto-Slav had Sviatovit, but the exact theological structure of their beliefs was erased by centuries of Christian warfare against them and we have lost access to the most important aspects of our ancestors’ memetic space. This is cultural genocide. It is a crime that has only been perpetuated due to the betrayal of elites.
     
    This is true (eg. archaeology discovered very few pagan remains in Poland), but also very dramatic. I reckon then that you are a would-be pagan; you simply cannot fulfil your wish since the doctrine of your ancestral worship was lost. Alas, you really are devoted to your ancestors!
    But don't blame all pagan elites! Some certainly fought to preserve their beliefs. You surely heard about Obotrites fighting with German crusades. They lost with swords in their hands, if that consoles you.
    The Polish Romantic poet, Juliusz Słowacki, wrote a play about similar fight, "Lilla Weneda" (about the semi-mythical tribe of Wents/Wenedes), a fight at which stake are ancestral traditions. Maybe you would like it.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @Ivashka the fool

    My corrector decided to play tricks on me. It should be read: "Most Pagans deified their ancestors"

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  562. Rim Turkani’s mother: 5/10. Would not bang.

    So Greasy, which one would you bang?

    Ajram is a plain Jane but I gotta admit that Haifa looks pretty good in that video. She may be one of those women who has a face that doesn’t necessarily photograph well but is much more attractive when seen in motion. She also has a sexiness that surpasses her raw beauty, sort of a bizarro version of someone like Taylor Swift who is incredibly beautiful but has the all the sex appeal of a cardboard box*.

    She still sings this song to cheering crowds of Lebanese people; 40 years later.

    She looks really good in that picture. Who is the Syrian girl in the green from the video?

    They even allied themselves with a Christian fascist militia

    Yeah whatever ended up happening to those guys? I know some fled to Israel but did the others just reconcile with the Muslims? Lebanese Christians are probably the world’s most antisemitic population so I would imagine they would no longer be welcome by their coreligionists in Lebanon after they allied with Israel.

    when she released a song called غابت شمس الحق or “The Sun Of Justice Has Set”.

    What a melodramatic whore. Reminds me of every Lebanese girl I’ve ever argued with online. I absolutely cannot stand Lebanese Christians.

    *may be somewhat unfair to cardboard boxes

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Greasy William

    > She also has a sexiness that surpasses her raw beauty, sort of a bizarro version of someone like Taylor Swift who is incredibly beautiful but has the all the sex appeal of a cardboard box

    Taylor Swift is too tall to maintain unconscious control of her own toe tips and fingertips. There are women that tall who can dance but it is extremely rare. If you never saw her moving you might find her very beautiful.

    Lucky for her mass entertainment is a monopoly and some brain dead committee feeds her to the useless media consumers as if she had any objective market value. You can find superior entertainment at almost any high school semester talent show. For sure there was better entertainment at mine and I did not attend a large high school.

    , @Yahya
    @Greasy William


    Rim Turkani’s mother: 5/10. Would not bang.

     

    It appears we have irreconcilable differences in taste in female beauty. I prefer dignified and elegant women over the sexy types. Rim Turkmani's mother is beautiful by any standard, a solid 8.5 in my book. Perhaps she looks better to you from this angle:


    https://i.ibb.co/6r4z0hK/FYdh3j-AWQAMm5v-P.jpg


    Nancy Ajram is most definitely not "plain Jane". A 9.5 bordering on 10. Taylor Swift is indeed beautiful; but less so than Ajram, in my opinion. The most beautiful woman i've seen is Mariam Fakhr Eddine:


    https://identity-mag.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/22807_1.jpg


    The Arabic and Slavic features form an exquisite blend.


    . Who is the Syrian girl in the green from the video?
     
    Amal Arafa.

    What is your rating of the following women:

    1) Nadine Labaki
    2) Queen Rania
    3) Asma Assad
    4) Leila Hatami
    5) Najla Ben Abdullah
    6) Rahma Riyad
    7) Gal Gadot
    8) Shadia
    9) Mona Zaki
    10) Walaa Sharif


    Yeah whatever ended up happening to those guys?
     
    They faded gently into the good night.

    The Christians wised-up and realized it was a mistake to strike a Faustian bargain with the Devil.

    Replies: @Greasy William

  563. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Most Pagans defied their ancestors. We don't need cousin marriage because the haplogroups are widespread. We worship Nature because it is the closest we can come to God. God's creation (emanation in fact, in a Platonic sense) is God's manifestation to Himself. God is (in a multitude of forms), while we exist because He is. All structured pagan religions had a higher Creator / Nourisher deity (Ishvara in Sanskrit). The Balto-Slav had Sviatovit, but the exact theological structure of their beliefs was erased by centuries of Christian warfare against them and we have lost access to the most important aspects of our ancestors' memetic space. This is cultural genocide. It is a crime that has only been perpetuated due to the betrayal of elites. Now Christians and Muslims experience the same betrayal by their elites that our Pagan ancestors experienced in their time. What goes around, comes around. That is why it is good to keep the circle symbol and the swastika sacred, to remind us that on a genetic lineage's lifespan (millenia), history is somewhat cyclical. Therefore it's better to follow the golden rule of ethics and never do to others what you do not want others doing to you or your descendants.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Ivashka the fool

    We don’t need cousin marriage because the haplogroups are widespread

    .

    Only if you live among themselves, and you don’t want to preserve recessive traits.

    The Balto-Slav had Sviatovit, but the exact theological structure of their beliefs was erased by centuries of Christian warfare against them and we have lost access to the most important aspects of our ancestors’ memetic space. This is cultural genocide. It is a crime that has only been perpetuated due to the betrayal of elites.

    This is true (eg. archaeology discovered very few pagan remains in Poland), but also very dramatic. I reckon then that you are a would-be pagan; you simply cannot fulfil your wish since the doctrine of your ancestral worship was lost. Alas, you really are devoted to your ancestors!
    But don’t blame all pagan elites! Some certainly fought to preserve their beliefs. You surely heard about Obotrites fighting with German crusades. They lost with swords in their hands, if that consoles you.
    The Polish Romantic poet, Juliusz Słowacki, wrote a play about similar fight, “Lilla Weneda” (about the semi-mythical tribe of Wents/Wenedes), a fight at which stake are ancestral traditions. Maybe you would like it.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    The Wends were not semi-mythical. I wrote extensively about them in the past. Yes the Rugians fought to the bitter end and were for this respected by the other Pagans that were still to be found at the times not only in the Balto-Slav lands, but in Scandinavia too. The Arkona temple received gifts not only from Wends, but from the Norse too.

    The betrayal was gradual, the baptism of Rus and the Lechites was part of the process. If the Balto-Slav elites would have held to their millenia old beliefs, the Christian missionaries would have failed and the Teutonic Knight crusaders wouldn't have been able to set foot in the lands where the ancestors of the Balto-Slav were native since times immemorial.

    But elites betrayed for political, social and economic reasons, not because they thought that the alien doctrine was greater. They did it for power and gain. They were not saints, but scoundrels. Same as today in the Christian and Muslim lands. The thunder cross keeps turning.

    Replies: @AP

  564. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Most Pagans defied their ancestors. We don't need cousin marriage because the haplogroups are widespread. We worship Nature because it is the closest we can come to God. God's creation (emanation in fact, in a Platonic sense) is God's manifestation to Himself. God is (in a multitude of forms), while we exist because He is. All structured pagan religions had a higher Creator / Nourisher deity (Ishvara in Sanskrit). The Balto-Slav had Sviatovit, but the exact theological structure of their beliefs was erased by centuries of Christian warfare against them and we have lost access to the most important aspects of our ancestors' memetic space. This is cultural genocide. It is a crime that has only been perpetuated due to the betrayal of elites. Now Christians and Muslims experience the same betrayal by their elites that our Pagan ancestors experienced in their time. What goes around, comes around. That is why it is good to keep the circle symbol and the swastika sacred, to remind us that on a genetic lineage's lifespan (millenia), history is somewhat cyclical. Therefore it's better to follow the golden rule of ethics and never do to others what you do not want others doing to you or your descendants.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Ivashka the fool

    My corrector decided to play tricks on me. It should be read: “Most Pagans deified their ancestors”

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Yeah, I got it. I wrote once an essay on "Emperor Worship in the Roman Empire versus the Hellenistic Cult of Rulers" ;)

  565. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    We don’t need cousin marriage because the haplogroups are widespread
     
    .

    Only if you live among themselves, and you don't want to preserve recessive traits.


    The Balto-Slav had Sviatovit, but the exact theological structure of their beliefs was erased by centuries of Christian warfare against them and we have lost access to the most important aspects of our ancestors’ memetic space. This is cultural genocide. It is a crime that has only been perpetuated due to the betrayal of elites.
     
    This is true (eg. archaeology discovered very few pagan remains in Poland), but also very dramatic. I reckon then that you are a would-be pagan; you simply cannot fulfil your wish since the doctrine of your ancestral worship was lost. Alas, you really are devoted to your ancestors!
    But don't blame all pagan elites! Some certainly fought to preserve their beliefs. You surely heard about Obotrites fighting with German crusades. They lost with swords in their hands, if that consoles you.
    The Polish Romantic poet, Juliusz Słowacki, wrote a play about similar fight, "Lilla Weneda" (about the semi-mythical tribe of Wents/Wenedes), a fight at which stake are ancestral traditions. Maybe you would like it.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    The Wends were not semi-mythical. I wrote extensively about them in the past. Yes the Rugians fought to the bitter end and were for this respected by the other Pagans that were still to be found at the times not only in the Balto-Slav lands, but in Scandinavia too. The Arkona temple received gifts not only from Wends, but from the Norse too.

    The betrayal was gradual, the baptism of Rus and the Lechites was part of the process. If the Balto-Slav elites would have held to their millenia old beliefs, the Christian missionaries would have failed and the Teutonic Knight crusaders wouldn’t have been able to set foot in the lands where the ancestors of the Balto-Slav were native since times immemorial.

    But elites betrayed for political, social and economic reasons, not because they thought that the alien doctrine was greater. They did it for power and gain. They were not saints, but scoundrels. Same as today in the Christian and Muslim lands. The thunder cross keeps turning.

    • Replies: @AP
    @Ivashka the fool


    The Wends were not semi-mythical. I wrote extensively about them in the past
     
    Yes, and thank you for that. From someone whose paternal Wendish ancestors joined the Rus adventurers in coming to Novgorod and from there went to Kiev. And one of them, about 300 years ago in gratitude to God for his survival (will not get into details), decreed that the oldest son would be a priest. And so it was for 16 generations until my father’s generation.

    The betrayal was gradual, the baptism of Rus and the Lechites was part of the process. If the Balto-Slav elites would have held to their millenia old beliefs, the Christian missionaries would have failed and the Teutonic Knight crusaders wouldn’t have been able to set foot in the lands where the ancestors of the Balto-Slav were native since times immemorial
     
    Of all the old pagan peoples, only the massive population of India in its isolated Subcontinent managed to preserve its old beliefs. Even the mighty Persians lost their Zoroastrianism. If the Slavs had not accepted Christianity they would have become Muslims instead. No one could withstand one or the other, that’s just the way it was.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  566. @Ivashka the fool
    @Ivashka the fool

    My corrector decided to play tricks on me. It should be read: "Most Pagans deified their ancestors"

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Yeah, I got it. I wrote once an essay on “Emperor Worship in the Roman Empire versus the Hellenistic Cult of Rulers” 😉

  567. @S
    @S

    In regards to the previous post, the photo of Kohberger's Washington state apartment didn't link...



    https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2023/01/Kohberger-dorm-idaho-murders-05.jpg

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-u7uhmrVBhao/T3L_5yp8gPI/AAAAAAAAAB4/o3LRUY0kOlU/s320/images.jpeg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Building G is an accident in that it was the address of the available apartment the guy rented the last time he was looking for an apartment.

    Matthew Johnson has a lot of interesting content and a lot of insane bitter ranting. Promotion of monarchical systems in 2023 or whenever he recorded that is like nostalgia for world gone with the wind. Entertaining but You Can’t Be Serious.

    My favorite killing of the king is Saul Bellow Henderson the Rain King.

    • Replies: @S
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Yes, I'm quite aware about the 'G' being an address designation, and is part of why I said at the beginning of the entry I'd not put too much stock in the idea of the murder being an occult event.

    However, in studying the Kennedy assassination, which has a huge amount of symbolism attached to many of it's parts, I've concluded there may be more of an occult element involved in certain major events irrespective of whether the event participants are aware of it or not, than people might be comfortable in acknowledging.

    Thanks for the Saul Bellow reference; I wasn't familiar with him. I did like the part at his Wiki entry below. In English Lit we were forced to look for hidden symbolism supposedly placed in certain books, which did indeed take 'all the fun' out of simply reading the stories for enjoyment.


    A week before the novel appeared in book stores, Saul Bellow published an article in the New York Times titled “The Search for Symbols, a Writer Warns, Misses All the Fun and Fact of the Story.” Here, Bellow warns readers against looking too deeply for symbols in literature.
     
  568. @silviosilver
    @AaronB

    Then the Guru spake unto Aaron, "Behold, in my dream I was standing on the banks of the Indus. Seven cows, plump and attractive, came up out of the Indus and fed in the reed grass. Seven other cows came up after them, poor and very ugly and thin, such as I had never seen in all the land of Punjab. And the thin, ugly cows ate up the first seven plump cows, but when they had eaten them no one would have known that they had eaten them, for they were still as ugly as at the beginning. Then I awoke.

    Then Aaron spake unto the Guru: "God has revealed to the Guru what he is about to do. The seven lean cows are seven races that will feast on your cows; seven are the corners of the world to which the sikhs shall scatter to witness the feasting; and seven are the words that God will permit the sikh to post in impotent remonstrance." And hearing this the Guru sunk to his knees and wept, for his heart told him that Aaaron had spoken truly.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Emil Nikola Richard

  569. @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Arestovych (or is it Arestovitch?) is a very intelligent and charismatic man.
     
    Agree, he is also very popular across large swaths of former USSR. Regardless of some questions about his biography, he is very valuable (according to his own words, he is among the top 5 targets on Kremlin's assassination list).

    He has spoken in defense of the Russian language and culture in Ukraine from the excessive tribalism that is understandably demonstrated by some Ukrainian nationalists.
     
    Before Feb 24, I would have also agreed that "excessive tribalism" needs to be somehow balanced out. At this point, I can't lecture to the Ukrainians about this. But, yes, he has spoken out on behalf of the Russian language, but remember that his approach is more along the lines of civic nationalism, he views all Ukrainians as Ukrainians, unlike many people on this board, who view "the people of Donbas" as a separate group and even people in places such as Dnipro and Kharkiv as a separate non-loyal Russophone group (when in fact they were simply Russian speaking Ukrainians all along). The most absurd thing is that de facto most of them were always bilingual and they could've just kept these Donbas areas bilingual.

    Russian speakers would self-identify as Ukrainians more than before the war, but they will not disappear.
     
    Yes, at this point they already do identify as such and, no, they will not disappear despite this Kremlin's savage campaign to physically eliminate them along with their homes (or to push them out of their homes). Also, a larger number of them will live within the EU than before. They need to be given certain choices.

    Moreover, Russians who would look for an Eastern Slav country that is organized along European values, will look to Ukraine when the war is over.
     
    They already are. Some of them did this already before the war. There are some very positive developments in this regard because these Russians seem to be quite content.

    If they see only hate and ressentment this would turn them off and push them in the embrace of Prigozhin (who is a Jew) and the like.
     
    I don't think they should be pushed away (then they will be lost), but I'm not counting on Ukrainians to properly handle this, they will have severe PTSD, it might be too much to ask. But I agree with your point, it's just a matter of technicalities of how to pull it off. And, yes, I recently learned Prigozhin is Jewish (which explains a lot, what he is doing can only be described as the worst type of human trafficking and this is not new). Prigozhin is a seasoned criminal so I don't think even vatniks are crazy enough to tolerate him as a leader of the whole nation (Putin just uses him as a пугало (scarecrow?) for the West), besides the General Staff might take him out eventually. But, you're right, there could be someone else with a similarly crazy profile.

    Arestovitch has clearly shown that he is an able politician and I think that he is already preparing his future
     
    Well, he has stated his goals before, they are ambitious. I'm not sure his bio is in line with those, but who knows. The outcry after these anti-air defense comments was quite bad, he may lose some of his popularity.

    I don’t think he made a mistake when he talked about the anti- aerial defense rocket in Dnepropetrovsk, these things have happened before and will happen again in the future
     
    Unfortunately, yes, this happens (it's a very intense artillery war, unfortunately - these things shouldn't even be allowed close to residential places). From what I understood, the Ukrainian side does not have the means to stop this kind of a missile, and this missile is not intended for ground targets. It was made to smash an aircraft carrier. I don't think the damage would've been so severe if parts of an anti-air defense rocket would have fallen on the house - the house got literally pushed into the ground.


    I think he knew what he was doing when he talked to Feigin and I believe the same about his resignation.
     
    The resignation itself is not such a big deal, since he was just some ad hoc advisor, it was not a full time post with large responsibilities, afaik. He likes being a gatekeeper and to bring the first info, but this just highlights how open Ukraine's media is, they just talk so openly about everything. This might be a handicap during the war, but on the other hand, it's good for the public to know this. Personally, I don't even think they should've spoken so openly about the weapons' deliveries from the West either, but there is a very open public diplomacy aspect there because the European and American public, in general, supports this more than the actual politicians.

    Anyway, I value him for his intuitive insights, not so much for his public diplomacy "skills".

    BTW the man is supposedly a bisexual
     
    He has an "open" personality (and he was an "actor"), but I'm not yet convinced he's a "diverse male". I recently heard that the video that supposedly proves he had a contact with another man is a so called deep fake. I used to think the video was of one of their security operations (he used to be in the secret service) where they used a "honey trap" (him being the "honey"). But who knows.

    If he was not a WEF Young Global Leader already, then he sure might become one if he wants to.
     
    He might need a little bit more pedigree for that but because Ukraine has such special status now he could do it. Don't think he has the personality type for that though. I think the politicians from the European Solidarity might be better candidates for that. Arestovych has spoken positively of conservative values and I think he's a bit too Ukraine-centric to be a proper WEF candidate.

    Replies: @AP, @AnonfromTN

    Why argue about Arestovych now? The craziest Ukies put him on the “Mirotvorets” site. So, as far as Nazis are concerned, his goose is cooked. Considering his record, he won’t emerge in reformatted Ukraine, either.

    • Replies: @LondonBob
    @AnonfromTN

    Arestovich sees the writing on the wall, wasn't he a protege of Dugin's once?

    Crikey!



    https://twitter.com/squatsons/status/1616540788250533890?s=20&t=8S9vnF1dGbj5UNR6U1NoFA

  570. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    Macgregor was in charge of all Nato targeting during the Kosovo war, so I think he knows what he’s talking about. Plus, he refers to active contacts he still has in the forces.

    If the West is so powerful, why no Ukrainian gains since Kharkov and the Russian pullback from Kherson?

  571. Sher Singh says:
    @AaronB
    @Sher Singh

    And the sect of the HeavilyMarbledSteak spotted a Sikh in possession of a cow and yet not eating of it, yea, even though it was heavily marbled and thus prime steak, and looked delicious, and they did capture that miscreant sikh and gouge out his eyes and hang him for not appreciating delicious food, and did slaughter the cow and eat it unto the last bone - and behold, it was a heavily marbled cow yielding many fine steaks, all well marbled.

    And then an army of Sikhs descended upon the sect of the HeavilyMarbledSteak, who did number but a dozen, but the feeble armed Sikhs who did not eat cow were weak of arm and slack of temper, on account of not eating meat, and a great slaughter of Sikhs was made that day, and all their cows were seized and eaten - and yea, the Lord made it that each one was heavily marbled indeed!

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Sher Singh

    ਪੁਨ ਕਰ ਜੋਰਿ ਬਤਾਇਸਿ ਬਾਤਿ । “ਨਿਕਟ ਦੁਸ਼ਟ ਗੋ ਕਰਤੇ ਘਾਤਿ । ਤਿਨ ਕੇ ਬਸ ਨਹਿ ਆਵਤਿ ਸੋਈ । ਕਤਰਿ ਓਜ ਕੋ ਮੈਂ ਤਹਿ ਜੋਈ” ।੩।⁣
    After [saluting Guru Hargobind] he clasped his hands and began to say, “There are vile people close to here butchering cows and they are trying to get hold of more cows with great effort.⁣

    ਸੁਨਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਸੋ ਆਗੇ ਕਰ੍ਯੋ । ਹਯ ਧਵਾਇ ਚਾਲੇ ਰਿਸਿ ਧਰ੍ਯੋ । ਹੁਤੇ ਨਿਕਟ ਹੀ ਜਾਇ ਨਿਹਾਰੇ । ਖੜਗ ਨਿਕਾਸ੍ਯੋ ਤਤਛਿਨ ਮਾਰੇ ।੪।⁣
    Listening to this Satiguru Hargobind mounted his horse and proceeded ahead with great anger, seeing where they were they closed the distance, taking out his sword he quickly slaughtered them. ⁣

    ਭਾਜ ਚਲੇ ਕੁਛ ਘੇਰਿ ਪ੍ਰਹਾਰੇ । ਖੰਡ ਖੰਡ ਕਰਿ ਧਰ ਪਰ ਡਾਰੈ ।⁣
    Some of them ran away, but they were flanked, surrounded and attacked, they were chopped down and then into pieces. ⁣

  572. @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    You're absolutely right about Emir Abdelkader !

    The man was a hero, a poet and a Sufi mystic. I had the pleasure of reading some of his letters and poetry translated in French once. When he lived in exile in Syria he along his men saved local Christians from a rioting Muslim mob. AFAIK he is buried in the same mosque where Ibn Al Arabi is. If only more Muslims were like him, this world would be a better place and their countries would be much more pleasant. Unfortunately this is not the case. BTW he exchanged letters with Imam Shamil- the Avarian leader of the Caucasus people who fought against the Tsarist troops. And amusingly enough Abdelkader has been initiated into a Masonic lodge while kept in captivity in France. An interesting man.

    About Arab politics, I really have too little information and a limited interest. All I know is that there are supposedly more than 400 million Arab people around the world, let's say that around 1/4 of them are able-bodied men - that would be some 100 million. And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham (that would be Arabs and Jews). So from a pure will to power pov, every Isreali Jew is worth more than a dozen Arabs.

    Anyway, this family feud between the feeble willed multitudes of Arabs and the strong willed minority of Jews, poisons the existence of other people around the world. It's time you Semites find a solution to the problem. Either kill each other, or make peace for the Demiurge's sake, or let the Persians put some order in that land.

    🙂

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Yahya

    BTW he exchanged letters with Imam Shamil- the Avarian leader of the Caucasus people who fought against the Tsarist troops.

    A great man too; an embodiment of the Aristotelian virtues. In the words of Tolstoy: “Yet it stood firm and did not surrender to man who had destroyed all its brothers around it… “What vitality!” I thought. “Man has conquered everything and destroyed millions of plants, yet this one won’t submit.” If Hollywood was worth its salt; they would’ve made a movie about him. His story is greater than fiction.

    And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham

    Well as Napoleon perceptively noted “in war the moral is to the physical as three is to one”. There’s always going to be an asymmetry in motivation between Arab forces and Israel; regardless of numbers or machinery. The Israelis are fighting for their sole homeland; and on a fundamental level their right to exist. Arab forces are fighting on behalf of Palestinians; who though they may be of the same ethnicity; are still a separate people from Lebanese, Egyptians, Iraqis etc. Moreover, Israel’s manpower doesn’t just number 8 million; they have the wealthy Jewish diaspora, who in addition to providing monetary aid have co-opted the world’s superpower into backing Israel in every conflict.

    We can see today how Russia struggles against a nation 4 times lesser in size. There is a motivational disparity; and the Ukrainians are backed up by Western arms and intelligence.

    When Egypt was fighting for its own territory; they made the Israelis shit their pants in ’73. Hezbollah likewise successfully resisted Israeli incursions on Lebanese territory; despite being outgunned. Motivation makes all the difference.

    Anyway, this family feud between the feeble willed multitudes of Arabs and the strong willed minority of Jews, poisons the existence of other people around the world.

    I see, we are going to be lectured by Slavs on poisonous family feuds.

    If you respect your ancestors, not a nation, not some people far away, not a culture, not even a religion – just your ancestors – those who lived before you, so you can live today – then you should care about these things.

    You make a good point about respect for one’s ancestors. But I don’t see the usefulness of haplogroups in determining present-day identity. My R1a paternal lineage, shared by most Russians but only a small minority of Arabs, would mean I would have to care more for Russians than Egyptians or Arabians. While I respect and admire the Russian ethnos; they are not my people – Egyptians are. So yes I will take pride in Naguib Mahfouz and Queen Nefertiti; and even Queen Zenobia and Butrus Al-Bustani. My identity is Arab not Indo-European.

    Thanks for the information on the ancient presence of R1A in the Middle East. With regards to my own ancestry; my R1A lineage could have Indo-Iranian origins, since my family name is derived from this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoja. We do not belong to a tribe in Saudi; but are what’s known as Khadiri people; that is urban Hijazis who have origins from outside the peninsula.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    Well, then your ancestors should be Y haplogroup R1a Z93. In that case your Indo-Iranian ancestors diverged from the Slavs thousands of years ago. Aryan, just call them Aryan. But if you prefer being a Semite, then jedem das seine...

    Replies: @silviosilver

    , @Mr. Hack
    @Yahya


    The Khojas live today in East Africa, India, Pakistan, Europe, and North America, and show a strong commitment to the values of Muslim philanthropy in their business entrepreneurship and contribution to societies in which they live.
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoja

    Are there more Khojas that live in Egypt that you apparently identify with?


    You make a good point about respect for one’s ancestors. But I don’t see the usefulness of haplogroups in determining present-day identity. My R1a paternal lineage, shared by most Russians but only a small minority of Arabs, would mean I would have to care more for Russians than Egyptians or Arabians. While I respect and admire the Russian ethnos; they are not my people – Egyptians are.
     
    You make a pretty strong case for your position here. Furthermore, you seem to be a very cultured and intelligent young man who seems to be well on your way towards the sun without needing to tap into the mythical powers of your supposed aryan ancestors (mostly the ability to survive?).

    A tree without roots cannot keep growing towards the sun, a people without ancestry has no future.
     
    Although you seem to respect your ancestors to some extent, your example seems to stand in stark contrast to that of what Ivashka seems to be propagating as fundamental cultural orthodoxy ( I tend to support your point of view here).

    Replies: @Yahya

  573. @silviosilver
    @AaronB

    Then the Guru spake unto Aaron, "Behold, in my dream I was standing on the banks of the Indus. Seven cows, plump and attractive, came up out of the Indus and fed in the reed grass. Seven other cows came up after them, poor and very ugly and thin, such as I had never seen in all the land of Punjab. And the thin, ugly cows ate up the first seven plump cows, but when they had eaten them no one would have known that they had eaten them, for they were still as ugly as at the beginning. Then I awoke.

    Then Aaron spake unto the Guru: "God has revealed to the Guru what he is about to do. The seven lean cows are seven races that will feast on your cows; seven are the corners of the world to which the sikhs shall scatter to witness the feasting; and seven are the words that God will permit the sikh to post in impotent remonstrance." And hearing this the Guru sunk to his knees and wept, for his heart told him that Aaaron had spoken truly.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Emil Nikola Richard

    We know this is a fable because real gurus only weep when the government hoodlums come to confiscate their property.

  574. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    BTW he exchanged letters with Imam Shamil- the Avarian leader of the Caucasus people who fought against the Tsarist troops.
     
    A great man too; an embodiment of the Aristotelian virtues. In the words of Tolstoy: "Yet it stood firm and did not surrender to man who had destroyed all its brothers around it… “What vitality!” I thought. “Man has conquered everything and destroyed millions of plants, yet this one won’t submit.” If Hollywood was worth its salt; they would've made a movie about him. His story is greater than fiction.

    And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham

     

    Well as Napoleon perceptively noted “in war the moral is to the physical as three is to one". There's always going to be an asymmetry in motivation between Arab forces and Israel; regardless of numbers or machinery. The Israelis are fighting for their sole homeland; and on a fundamental level their right to exist. Arab forces are fighting on behalf of Palestinians; who though they may be of the same ethnicity; are still a separate people from Lebanese, Egyptians, Iraqis etc. Moreover, Israel's manpower doesn't just number 8 million; they have the wealthy Jewish diaspora, who in addition to providing monetary aid have co-opted the world's superpower into backing Israel in every conflict.

    We can see today how Russia struggles against a nation 4 times lesser in size. There is a motivational disparity; and the Ukrainians are backed up by Western arms and intelligence.

    When Egypt was fighting for its own territory; they made the Israelis shit their pants in '73. Hezbollah likewise successfully resisted Israeli incursions on Lebanese territory; despite being outgunned. Motivation makes all the difference.


    Anyway, this family feud between the feeble willed multitudes of Arabs and the strong willed minority of Jews, poisons the existence of other people around the world.
     
    I see, we are going to be lectured by Slavs on poisonous family feuds.

    If you respect your ancestors, not a nation, not some people far away, not a culture, not even a religion – just your ancestors – those who lived before you, so you can live today – then you should care about these things.
     
    You make a good point about respect for one's ancestors. But I don't see the usefulness of haplogroups in determining present-day identity. My R1a paternal lineage, shared by most Russians but only a small minority of Arabs, would mean I would have to care more for Russians than Egyptians or Arabians. While I respect and admire the Russian ethnos; they are not my people - Egyptians are. So yes I will take pride in Naguib Mahfouz and Queen Nefertiti; and even Queen Zenobia and Butrus Al-Bustani. My identity is Arab not Indo-European.

    Thanks for the information on the ancient presence of R1A in the Middle East. With regards to my own ancestry; my R1A lineage could have Indo-Iranian origins, since my family name is derived from this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoja. We do not belong to a tribe in Saudi; but are what's known as Khadiri people; that is urban Hijazis who have origins from outside the peninsula.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Mr. Hack

    Well, then your ancestors should be Y haplogroup R1a Z93. In that case your Indo-Iranian ancestors diverged from the Slavs thousands of years ago. Aryan, just call them Aryan. But if you prefer being a Semite, then jedem das seine

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    Well, then your ancestors should be Y haplogroup R1a Z93.
     
    Everyone's heard of "Fermi's Paradox," but have you heard of Fermi's Paradox as it relates to time travel - if it is possible, where are all the people from the future? Well, I think George Lucas might have been one, not because of the spaceships and laser blasters, but because of the names he gave the androids - C-3PO and R2-D2 - "relicts" from a future in which humans identify themselves by their haplogroups.

    On a serious note, how can you tell if a haplogroup is being preserved or not? Wouldn't that require everyone to be genetically assayed (and multiple times, just to be sure)?

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  575. @Greasy William
    Rim Turkani's mother: 5/10. Would not bang.

    So Greasy, which one would you bang?
     
    Ajram is a plain Jane but I gotta admit that Haifa looks pretty good in that video. She may be one of those women who has a face that doesn't necessarily photograph well but is much more attractive when seen in motion. She also has a sexiness that surpasses her raw beauty, sort of a bizarro version of someone like Taylor Swift who is incredibly beautiful but has the all the sex appeal of a cardboard box*.

    She still sings this song to cheering crowds of Lebanese people; 40 years later.
     
    She looks really good in that picture. Who is the Syrian girl in the green from the video?

    They even allied themselves with a Christian fascist militia
     
    Yeah whatever ended up happening to those guys? I know some fled to Israel but did the others just reconcile with the Muslims? Lebanese Christians are probably the world's most antisemitic population so I would imagine they would no longer be welcome by their coreligionists in Lebanon after they allied with Israel.

    when she released a song called غابت شمس الحق or “The Sun Of Justice Has Set”.
     
    What a melodramatic whore. Reminds me of every Lebanese girl I've ever argued with online. I absolutely cannot stand Lebanese Christians.


    *may be somewhat unfair to cardboard boxes

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Yahya

    > She also has a sexiness that surpasses her raw beauty, sort of a bizarro version of someone like Taylor Swift who is incredibly beautiful but has the all the sex appeal of a cardboard box

    Taylor Swift is too tall to maintain unconscious control of her own toe tips and fingertips. There are women that tall who can dance but it is extremely rare. If you never saw her moving you might find her very beautiful.

    Lucky for her mass entertainment is a monopoly and some brain dead committee feeds her to the useless media consumers as if she had any objective market value. You can find superior entertainment at almost any high school semester talent show. For sure there was better entertainment at mine and I did not attend a large high school.

  576. @Greasy William
    Rim Turkani's mother: 5/10. Would not bang.

    So Greasy, which one would you bang?
     
    Ajram is a plain Jane but I gotta admit that Haifa looks pretty good in that video. She may be one of those women who has a face that doesn't necessarily photograph well but is much more attractive when seen in motion. She also has a sexiness that surpasses her raw beauty, sort of a bizarro version of someone like Taylor Swift who is incredibly beautiful but has the all the sex appeal of a cardboard box*.

    She still sings this song to cheering crowds of Lebanese people; 40 years later.
     
    She looks really good in that picture. Who is the Syrian girl in the green from the video?

    They even allied themselves with a Christian fascist militia
     
    Yeah whatever ended up happening to those guys? I know some fled to Israel but did the others just reconcile with the Muslims? Lebanese Christians are probably the world's most antisemitic population so I would imagine they would no longer be welcome by their coreligionists in Lebanon after they allied with Israel.

    when she released a song called غابت شمس الحق or “The Sun Of Justice Has Set”.
     
    What a melodramatic whore. Reminds me of every Lebanese girl I've ever argued with online. I absolutely cannot stand Lebanese Christians.


    *may be somewhat unfair to cardboard boxes

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Yahya

    Rim Turkani’s mother: 5/10. Would not bang.

    It appears we have irreconcilable differences in taste in female beauty. I prefer dignified and elegant women over the sexy types. Rim Turkmani’s mother is beautiful by any standard, a solid 8.5 in my book. Perhaps she looks better to you from this angle:

    Nancy Ajram is most definitely not “plain Jane”. A 9.5 bordering on 10. Taylor Swift is indeed beautiful; but less so than Ajram, in my opinion. The most beautiful woman i’ve seen is Mariam Fakhr Eddine:

    The Arabic and Slavic features form an exquisite blend.

    . Who is the Syrian girl in the green from the video?

    Amal Arafa.

    What is your rating of the following women:

    1) Nadine Labaki
    2) Queen Rania
    3) Asma Assad
    4) Leila Hatami
    5) Najla Ben Abdullah
    6) Rahma Riyad
    7) Gal Gadot
    8) Shadia
    9) Mona Zaki
    10) Walaa Sharif

    Yeah whatever ended up happening to those guys?

    They faded gently into the good night.

    The Christians wised-up and realized it was a mistake to strike a Faustian bargain with the Devil.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Yahya

    Nadine Labaki: pretty
    Queen Rania: pretty but I don't think she's as beautiful as she's claimed to be
    Mrs. Assad: See Rania. Asma doesn't even look Middle Eastern to me
    Leila Hatami: YES! Iranian women ftw
    Najla Ben Abdullah: pretty
    Rahma Riyad: pretty and sultry, could pass for Indian/Pakistani. Sexy at a level that is greater than her raw beauty
    Gal Gadot: Pretty pre surgery, one of the 5 most beautiful faces I've ever seen post surgery
    Shadia: Very pretty. Totally my type
    Mona Zaki: pretty
    Walaa Sharif: very pretty. That Nasser type jaw is a bit much but it also kinda works for her

    One Egyptian woman who I find extremely attractive is Aya Hijazi.

    I've always been super partial to this Moroccan girl: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hV4z64tfhU8&t

  577. How practical would it be to drain the Sea of Azov? (average depth only 7m – quite shallow as far as these things go, though it goes down as far as 14m max)

    Could it have been done for the money and resources spent on the war?

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @songbird

    Why would anyone in his/her right mind want to do that? Rivers, lakes, and seas were used for transportation since times immemorial.

    After everything the US and its NATO sidekicks did there is only one way to end this war: unconditional capitulation of Kiev regime

    Replies: @songbird

  578. @silviosilver
    @AaronB


    You, AP, did everything right – you followed blindly the dictates of your culture and society, without questioning it.
     
    How do you know he "blindly" followed it? How do you know he didn't question it and, having questioned it, having examined various alternatives, agreed that it was sound advice? Was everything our elders advised us to do necessarily bullshit, such that it ought to have been stubbornly resisted simply because our elders advised it?

    And yet, somehow, it was all empty – you didn’t feel the happiness you were promised. Nothing ever happened, and life stagnated. In the words Thoreau used to describe the mainstream man, you lived a life of “quiet desperation”.
     
    You sound very sure of yourself. Am I to understand you employed the same means of inquiry here as you did when you intuited the "internal logic" driving the creative endeavors of artists long dead, namely "it's plausible, and it would please me if it were true, so I'm running with it"?

    And Thoreau, Schmoreau. Listen bucko, I took the alternative route in life. Or the "scenic route," as I'd humorously call it, in a bid to keep the looming avalanche of regret at bay. "Quiet desperation" huh? Lol, I bet anyone who's experienced the real fucking thing - mass anxiety levels of desperation - would settle for the quiet variety in a heartbeat. And what grand adventures did I have anyway? What the actual living fuck did I ever do that I couldn't have done while maintaining a sense of balance and proportion, so that today I'd be light years closer to the very career, family and community goals I'm now playing desperado-style catch-up to achieve - and not because of any cockamamie notions of "social pressure" (in Libtardia? yeah right) to achieve them, but because I myself recognize them as worthy ideals.

    If I sound angry, sorry. I'm certainly not angry at you. I'm actually grinning bittersweetly as I type these words. Sweetly because I grant there were some good times, and that to an extent I can take some pride in having marched to the beat of my own drum. And bitterly because of me it may be said, there are fools, there are damn fools, and there is silviosilver. "The kid had everything going for him - he threw it all away." But oh well, it's not so bad. The irrepressible optimist is right to insist that life goes on.

    someone like me, who laughs at respectability, who has all the wrong opinions, who goes adventuring in the wilderness half the year, who does everything wrong, is supposed to be miserable, by God.
     
    You're living in a time warp. The last time that was true, the internet was still on dial-up. That set of standards has completely fallen by the wayside.

    and AaronB must cease his wilderness expeditions and start focusing on being economically productive, just like AP 🙂 It is for their own good, really – but more importantly, the idea that they are the happy ones cannot be permitted to stand.
     
    Sorry to break it to you, Walter Mitty, but that's all in your head. No one's stopping you from doing what you want. ("Call the authorities, Aaron's off 4WDing again!") If all it takes to spoil your fun is someone disapproving of your choices, then I think you've got some "issues" you need to sort through. (I recommend Nathaniel Branden!)

    I have friends who take “pity” on me and try and get me married, and live “normally” – when, eventually, they realize that I am actually much happier than they are, the shock and rage are almost comical.
     
    Interesting. I've had the opposite experience, especially with friends a bit older than me, who had achieved a measure of success by (old-school) conventional standards - careers, families, mortgages etc. When they'd spout guff like "Ah silv you don't know how lucky you are that you never married" or "Ah silv, if I could do it all again, I wouldn't have had kids", then silviosilver, that greatest of fools, would fight to choke back the glee, delighted to have the wisdom of his life choices so authentically confirmed in the pained exhalations of his friends.

    Had you had a little more intestinal fortitude, AP, a little more arrogance, independence, and rebelliousness, you would have been able to resist social conditioning.
     
    I for one am grateful AP proved such a "wimp." I would take a society composed of AP's over a society of silviosilvers or AaronB's any day. It may be less fun (that LOL he attached to your post may well be the first time I've seen him laugh), but it'd be a happier, wealthier and wiser society.

    Replies: @AaronB, @AP

    Everything you wrote was correct in this post.

    How do you know he “blindly” followed it? How do you know he didn’t question it and, having questioned it, having examined various alternatives, agreed that it was sound advice?

    If one has to run away in order to achieve “transcendence” or “authenticity” than that authenticity is weak or fake, dependent on external factors rather than on something within oneself. Someone capable of these things can do them in any environment, be it a factory or office or shop, while being productive (that is, giving back to the community rather than just taking its fruits). AaronB is as spiritual in his flight from civilization, as are his equals – middle aged bourgeois women making eat-pray-love vacations in India or Africa, except he probably doesn’t have sex with the locals. It is no wonder that the person with whom he has the least contentious interactions is the materialist atheist Mikel (whom I do not criticize here, because he seems to be authentic and honest to himself).

    Maybe because none of my ancestors were bourgeois, we don’t feel the need to distance ourselves from the modern capitalist system here, as if to prove something by rejecting it. Objectively, as I wrote, it’s the best tool invented to maximize material prosperity and thereby to eliminate tragedies such as famines and real impoverishment (not the fake voluntary and self-indulgent kind). One must really hate people to condemn such a system or even to refuse to participate in it, in order to pursue a life of self-indulgence, living off fruits that others have planted while whining about the planters and telling oneself lies about somehow being more intuitive or transcendent than they are.

    Feudalism had its own advantages (beauty probably peaked in that world) and we did no worse under that system, but it is not coming back and we do not choose when we are born but live the best we can in the place we find ourselves in. We once built conservatories and schools, financed churches, composed music, performed music, served as military officers or priests. In the current efficient system we outsource much (but not all!) such work through high tax rates and election choices while enjoying the prosperity that we share with others, in the most prosperous age in human history. A prosperity that need not be expressed solely in material pleasures or possessions (this is probably the only way that someone like AaronB can understand prosperity), it can be transformed into much more.

    The bourgeois’s flight into the wilderness is not Christlike at all. It reveals an inability to love others. Flight from marriage means the person can’t appreciate one other’s soul enough to spend a lifetime exploring it and the world together. Choosing childlessness is to prevent bringing another soul into this world and a flight from a fundamental and truly transformative human experience, which may be scary for some. This is why abortion, in addition to murder, is an act of extreme cowardice and denial. Flight from work reflects the inability or laziness to see beauty in seemingly mundane settings and interactions, as well as obvious selfishness.

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @AP


    It is no wonder that the person with whom he has the least contentious interactions is the materialist atheist Mikel
     
    No, it has nothing to do with my involuntary atheism/existentialism. It's just that we share the same passion for the natural landscapes of the US West (not a very materialistic thing to feel the same calling for). That makes me overlook the many differences that we have and actually wonder what else we may have in common. I guess I would regard his posts in a totally different light if he was as indifferent to natural beauty as Silviosilver is. But I would still find him interesting to read, as I do Silviosilver. I also admire his ability to be constantly reading a tremendous amount of profound, intellectually demanding books. I doubt you would be debating him yourself if you didn't find his opinions challenging enough to spend your time on.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @AaronB

  579. @songbird
    How practical would it be to drain the Sea of Azov? (average depth only 7m - quite shallow as far as these things go, though it goes down as far as 14m max)

    Could it have been done for the money and resources spent on the war?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Why would anyone in his/her right mind want to do that? Rivers, lakes, and seas were used for transportation since times immemorial.

    After everything the US and its NATO sidekicks did there is only one way to end this war: unconditional capitulation of Kiev regime

    • LOL: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @songbird
    @AnonfromTN


    Why would anyone in his/her right mind want to do that?
     
    What is worth more? 39,000 km2 of new land, or not building a few locks to lower and raise ships?

    Holland is the second-largest food exporter in the world. 21% of its population lives on land below mean sea level. 65% of its land is below high tide.

    After everything the US and its NATO sidekicks did there is only one way to end this war: unconditional capitulation of Kiev regime
     
    Ze and his coterie will never surrender as long as they are being paid. Even if Kiev were taken (and it doesn't seem likely to me, right now) they would just form a government-in-exile.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

  580. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    I wish commenters would not pontificate about the SMO without acknowledging that Russia has not been fighting a standard war, though that may be looming.

    150,000 is a lot of bodies, have we seen evidence of that? 300,000 wounded implies a lot of hospital activity, have we seen that?

    I suspect the Russia KIA number does not include militia and local fighters from Donbass. Still, after factoring in the population difference (roughly 150M vs 30M) the casualty ratio is very bad for Ukraine. Ukrainians are protecting their homeland, but many of the Russians feel the same way, based on a wider conception of the homeland.

    I think Russia wants to keep up the pressure until Ukraine capitulates, but only in a way that makes the new Ukrainian government responsible for keeping order post-SMO and suppressing NeoNazi guerrillas.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @QCIC


    Russia has not been fighting a standard war, though that may be looming.
     
    Every war is different, what is a standard war? There are some metrics: basically is Russia better off today than on 2/22/22? Day-by-day, who is gaining? Well, Russia is better off - Nato is out of the Ukraine dreamscape, Donbas is stronger and protected, plus control of the Azov See...day-by-day the gains are now Russia's.

    Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.
     
    Russia is inevitably stronger on the ground and the Nato weapons are not going to change it - anything Nato does, Russia can match and escalate. Russia was hoping that Ukies would collapse and they didn't, but all else is going as one would expect: a slow grind, huge casualties, media hysteria by the losing side. To collapse an army takes a lot and Ukies are a stubborn bunch.

    Casualties matter and a sense that they are pointless and there will be no victory will eventually kick in. How many men from Lviv or Odessa want to die to keep Kramatorsk under Kiev control? How many would do it if they were not forced? Why would 'better weapons' (a questionable meme) make any difference in that? If we look at long protracted bloody wars (WW1, Vietnam for US...) the willingness to die decreased dramatically with time. The early war days have a mindless air about them, not quite seeing the reality and blood...sooner or later the factual bloody reality reasserts itself.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  581. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    BTW he exchanged letters with Imam Shamil- the Avarian leader of the Caucasus people who fought against the Tsarist troops.
     
    A great man too; an embodiment of the Aristotelian virtues. In the words of Tolstoy: "Yet it stood firm and did not surrender to man who had destroyed all its brothers around it… “What vitality!” I thought. “Man has conquered everything and destroyed millions of plants, yet this one won’t submit.” If Hollywood was worth its salt; they would've made a movie about him. His story is greater than fiction.

    And these 100 million Arabs are not capable of kicking out the 6 milion Israeli form the place YHWH supposedly promised to the children of Abraham

     

    Well as Napoleon perceptively noted “in war the moral is to the physical as three is to one". There's always going to be an asymmetry in motivation between Arab forces and Israel; regardless of numbers or machinery. The Israelis are fighting for their sole homeland; and on a fundamental level their right to exist. Arab forces are fighting on behalf of Palestinians; who though they may be of the same ethnicity; are still a separate people from Lebanese, Egyptians, Iraqis etc. Moreover, Israel's manpower doesn't just number 8 million; they have the wealthy Jewish diaspora, who in addition to providing monetary aid have co-opted the world's superpower into backing Israel in every conflict.

    We can see today how Russia struggles against a nation 4 times lesser in size. There is a motivational disparity; and the Ukrainians are backed up by Western arms and intelligence.

    When Egypt was fighting for its own territory; they made the Israelis shit their pants in '73. Hezbollah likewise successfully resisted Israeli incursions on Lebanese territory; despite being outgunned. Motivation makes all the difference.


    Anyway, this family feud between the feeble willed multitudes of Arabs and the strong willed minority of Jews, poisons the existence of other people around the world.
     
    I see, we are going to be lectured by Slavs on poisonous family feuds.

    If you respect your ancestors, not a nation, not some people far away, not a culture, not even a religion – just your ancestors – those who lived before you, so you can live today – then you should care about these things.
     
    You make a good point about respect for one's ancestors. But I don't see the usefulness of haplogroups in determining present-day identity. My R1a paternal lineage, shared by most Russians but only a small minority of Arabs, would mean I would have to care more for Russians than Egyptians or Arabians. While I respect and admire the Russian ethnos; they are not my people - Egyptians are. So yes I will take pride in Naguib Mahfouz and Queen Nefertiti; and even Queen Zenobia and Butrus Al-Bustani. My identity is Arab not Indo-European.

    Thanks for the information on the ancient presence of R1A in the Middle East. With regards to my own ancestry; my R1A lineage could have Indo-Iranian origins, since my family name is derived from this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoja. We do not belong to a tribe in Saudi; but are what's known as Khadiri people; that is urban Hijazis who have origins from outside the peninsula.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Mr. Hack

    The Khojas live today in East Africa, India, Pakistan, Europe, and North America, and show a strong commitment to the values of Muslim philanthropy in their business entrepreneurship and contribution to societies in which they live.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoja

    Are there more Khojas that live in Egypt that you apparently identify with?

    You make a good point about respect for one’s ancestors. But I don’t see the usefulness of haplogroups in determining present-day identity. My R1a paternal lineage, shared by most Russians but only a small minority of Arabs, would mean I would have to care more for Russians than Egyptians or Arabians. While I respect and admire the Russian ethnos; they are not my people – Egyptians are.

    You make a pretty strong case for your position here. Furthermore, you seem to be a very cultured and intelligent young man who seems to be well on your way towards the sun without needing to tap into the mythical powers of your supposed aryan ancestors (mostly the ability to survive?).

    A tree without roots cannot keep growing towards the sun, a people without ancestry has no future.

    Although you seem to respect your ancestors to some extent, your example seems to stand in stark contrast to that of what Ivashka seems to be propagating as fundamental cultural orthodoxy ( I tend to support your point of view here).

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Mr. Hack


    Are there more Khojas that live in Egypt that you apparently identify with?
     
    Who said I identify with them? There are zero Khojas in Egypt. My Khoja line is paternal. I mentioned before my father is Saudi Arabian of Perso-Indian origins. My maternal line is Turco-Egyptian. I'm a mixed-bag of ancestries. But my native tongue is Semitic; and I was socialized among an Egyptian milieu. Thus I consider myself to be an Arab. I identify more with the Lebanese and Palestinians than Turks, Iranians or Indians.

    Ivashka is disappointed in my decision to identify as a Semite rather than an Aryan. He thinks it's more logical to take pride in my Indo-European lineage. But I beg to differ. I'm sure he is aware that Semites too possess a long and glorious history; perhaps even moreso than Aryans. (I use the term "Semites" here to encompass pre-Arab ethnicites, that were, under strict definitions, not necessarily Semitic-speakers; but of the same Levant_Neolithic and Iran_Neolithic racial stock as modern Arabs.)

    When my Indo-Iranian ancestors were roaming around the steppes and forests of Eurasia in unaccomplished ways; my Egyptian ancestors were building colossal monuments that have withstood the test of time. Everyone recognizes Ancient Egypt as the lodestar of antiquity; and very few bother with the history of Aryans. Today in Germany; the most prominent artifact in their museums is the bust of Nefertiti; not some pagan artifact.


    https://cdn.prod.www.spiegel.de/images/744ef395-0001-0004-0000-000000024832_w1600_r1.6055045871559632_fpx66_fpy50.jpg


    Hitler once wrote a letter to Egyptian authorities, explaining why he would never give back the prized possession: “Do you know what I’m going to do one day? I’m going to build a new Egyptian museum in Berlin,” Hitler wrote in a letter to the Egyptians. “I dream of it. Inside I will build a chamber, crowned by a large dome. In the middle, this wonder, Nefertiti will be enthroned. I will never relinquish the head of the queen.”

    It represents timeless beauty; the epitome of tranquility and harmony. No artifact from the ancient period can surpass it. I consider it an honor to be born in the small stretch of the Nile where some of my ancestors have been building a civilization for 5,000 years. Egypt is at a low civilizational ebb at the moment; so sure, it could be better to identify with Aryan populations. But I don't think I'll ever be able to replicate the sort of feeling I get when passing by the Great Pyramid at Giza. To be rooted in 5,000 years of civilization is better than roaming around the forest or desert. That's why my Egyptian identity takes precedence over my Aryan or Arabian ones.

    I suspect Ivashka also, deep down in his heart; knows that ethnicity is more important than paternal lineage. His words and actions point to this implicitly. He has said before he is an ethnic nationalist, not an R1A nationalist. I doubt he cares much about preserving the Sindhi people for posterity. He has also mocked AP's attempts to designate Dostoevsky as Ukrainian. If Ivashka's identification with haplogroups was strong; he wouldn't have cared much. But he is a loyal Russian. And that imo is a more robust basis for identity than haplogroups.

    Ultimately, I think one should always strive to dampen ethnic and ancestral feelings of pride. It's important to have a sense of peoplehood, and to be cognizant of one's ancestors; such that you strive to improve your ethnos in the same manner they did. But moderation is key here; the extreme forms of pride in one's ethnicity or ancestors can be negative and harmful.

    The Prophet Muhammad (عَلَيْهِ ٱلسَّلَامُ) knew the Arab tribes considered their ethnicity and ancestral descent to be a major source of pride; so he reminded them that no amount of pride in one's father can compensate for sinful actions.

    “Now then, surely your being ‘Arab is not the basis for your personality nor a part of your essence, rather, it is the language which you speak. So then whosoever is negligent in his actions, then the pride that he has from his father (being an ‘Arab) will not help him in the least and will not make up for the defects in his (religious) actions).”4

    The Quran reiterates the message that all humans were created from mud, and only virtuous piety separates one man from another:

    أَيُّهٌا النٌّاسُ! إِنَّ اللٌّهَ قَدْ أَذْهَبَ عَنْكُمْ نَخْوَةَ الْجٌاهِلِيَّةَ وَ تَفٌاخُرَهٌا بِآبٌائِهٌا أَلاَ إِنَّكُمْ مِنْ آدَمَ و آدَمُ مِنْ طِيْنٍ. أَلاٌ إِنَّ خَيْرَ عِبٌادِ اللٌّهِ عَبْدٌ اتِّقٌاهُ

    “O’ Mankind! Surely Allah has removed the pride and conceit that existed within you during the days of Ignorance in relation to your fore-fathers. Surely all of you are from (Prophet) Adam and Adam was (created) from mud. Surely the best servant of Allah is that servant who has consciousness of Him.”3

    And Allah is all-knowing and wise.

    Replies: @songbird

  582. @QCIC
    @Ron Unz

    I wish commenters would not pontificate about the SMO without acknowledging that Russia has not been fighting a standard war, though that may be looming.

    150,000 is a lot of bodies, have we seen evidence of that? 300,000 wounded implies a lot of hospital activity, have we seen that?

    I suspect the Russia KIA number does not include militia and local fighters from Donbass. Still, after factoring in the population difference (roughly 150M vs 30M) the casualty ratio is very bad for Ukraine. Ukrainians are protecting their homeland, but many of the Russians feel the same way, based on a wider conception of the homeland.

    I think Russia wants to keep up the pressure until Ukraine capitulates, but only in a way that makes the new Ukrainian government responsible for keeping order post-SMO and suppressing NeoNazi guerrillas.

    Replies: @Beckow

    Russia has not been fighting a standard war, though that may be looming.

    Every war is different, what is a standard war? There are some metrics: basically is Russia better off today than on 2/22/22? Day-by-day, who is gaining? Well, Russia is better off – Nato is out of the Ukraine dreamscape, Donbas is stronger and protected, plus control of the Azov See…day-by-day the gains are now Russia’s.

    Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    Russia is inevitably stronger on the ground and the Nato weapons are not going to change it – anything Nato does, Russia can match and escalate. Russia was hoping that Ukies would collapse and they didn’t, but all else is going as one would expect: a slow grind, huge casualties, media hysteria by the losing side. To collapse an army takes a lot and Ukies are a stubborn bunch.

    Casualties matter and a sense that they are pointless and there will be no victory will eventually kick in. How many men from Lviv or Odessa want to die to keep Kramatorsk under Kiev control? How many would do it if they were not forced? Why would ‘better weapons‘ (a questionable meme) make any difference in that? If we look at long protracted bloody wars (WW1, Vietnam for US…) the willingness to die decreased dramatically with time. The early war days have a mindless air about them, not quite seeing the reality and blood…sooner or later the factual bloody reality reasserts itself.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    Day-by-day, who is gaining? Well, Russia is better off – Nato is out of the Ukraine dreamscape, Donbas is stronger and protected, plus control of the Azov See…day-by-day the gains are now Russia’s.
     
    Pure nonsense. Russia wins one small battle and all of the fruitcakes come out of the woodwork spouting off all sorts of nonsense.

    NATO out of Ukraine? Does this really need to be discussed? Ukraine is daily receiveing more and more weaponry from its NATO partners. Even the old "realist" Kissinger has recently changed his tune and thinks that Ukrainian membership into NATO is the right course to follow.

    Donbas is stronger and protected?

    With how much of the region still under the control of Kyiv forces? Sure, in the last week or so Russian forces have made some small advances, but this is bound to change.

    https://preview.redd.it/asjam6w8grba1.jpg?width=2953&format=pjpg&auto=webp&v=enabled&s=7484a1488cdd4f61734a7bd4daf4c2b625bd70a4

    Replies: @QCIC

  583. @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    Well, then your ancestors should be Y haplogroup R1a Z93. In that case your Indo-Iranian ancestors diverged from the Slavs thousands of years ago. Aryan, just call them Aryan. But if you prefer being a Semite, then jedem das seine...

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Well, then your ancestors should be Y haplogroup R1a Z93.

    Everyone’s heard of “Fermi’s Paradox,” but have you heard of Fermi’s Paradox as it relates to time travel – if it is possible, where are all the people from the future? Well, I think George Lucas might have been one, not because of the spaceships and laser blasters, but because of the names he gave the androids – C-3PO and R2-D2 – “relicts” from a future in which humans identify themselves by their haplogroups.

    On a serious note, how can you tell if a haplogroup is being preserved or not? Wouldn’t that require everyone to be genetically assayed (and multiple times, just to be sure)?

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @silviosilver


    the names he gave the androids – C-3PO and R2-D2 – “relicts” from a future in which humans identify themselves by their haplogroups.

     

    OK that is a good one.

    Your time travel is pure fantasy however. The thing with physical law is humans cannot violate it in reality. Begin with Thermodynamics Number Two.
  584. @silviosilver
    @Greasy William


    Back in my Jewish nationalist days
     
    I'm curious, why'd you give that up? What do you call yourself now?

    The Lebanese are, without question, my least favorite group of human beings (in terms of race/ethnicity, “white liberals” are not a race). Awful people.
     
    Heh, a man after my own heart. More realistically, first prize in this category perennially belongs to the Africanus, but among actual humans ( :) ) it's hard to top them Lebanese bastards. I make an exception for the Christians, whom I like much better, but the rest can go FOAD.

    In my aimless drifter years wasted as a young man, I was good friends with a bunch of Lebanese muzzes. At a stretch, I could say some good things about them, but overall I have nothing but straight up regret. I ran into one of them a couple of years ago. I heard someone call out my name and looked, but didn't recognize anyone. I always get a bad feeling when this happens, because if they recognize me (which is easy, I look the same) but I don't recognize them, it means I knew them from my distant past, and there's essentially no one I want to know from back then. So I braced myself, but it went okay, was mercifully brief, and no bs promises to catch up again.


    Both the song as well as the music video are garbage.
     
    @1:50, the dude with the slingshot. Go get 'em tiger. (Bit of Australiana for you, that weapon was known by one and all as a "shanghai" when I was a kid, maybe still is. Kids would make them from bicycle innertubes and fire marbles, among other projectiles.)

    Agree about the song. 90% of arab music sounds like that to me; I have a hard time telling the difference between them. Very occasionally, I find something that I actually enjoy, though the thrill passes quickly.

    I'm in Yahya's bad books again, so he probably won't reply, but there was some arab movie I saw many years ago (20?), I'm guessing it was probably Egyptian, since 95% of arab movies are Egyptian. I don't think I saw the whole thing, just a scene in which some musician or aspiring musician was, I think, trying to impress his host at the house he was visiting - or maybe it was a music producer he was visiting - and anyway, he starts singing this very simple song that I still remember and which I often think of whenever I hear arab music playing. I don't know the actual words in arabic, but it sounded to me like "sidi wer wer, sidi wer wer, sidi wera wera wera sidi wer wer," and then a "choir" (or "back up" singers) repeated it that line. The host/producer was rolling his eyes, unimpressed; I'm guessing the film was some comedy. I wonder if Yahya knows the song or what the movie was?

    Replies: @Yahya

    I wonder if Yahya knows the song or what the movie was?

    Well you’ve given me almost nothing to go on. I need to at least know the name of the movie.

    Most songs in Arabic movies tend to be schlocky. Again, the obscure orchestras and singers is where the quality is at.

    I know you weren’t interested in my previous recommendations; so this is more for Mr. Hack and Barbarossa (where has he gone?).

    [MORE]

    1) Fakarouni

    One of the all-time great songs of Egyptian classical music.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDrPsZxk-WM&t=573s&ab_channel=UmmKulthum-%D8%A7%D9%85%D9%83%D9%84%D8%AB%D9%88%D9%85

    Its original form is 1 hour long; so like Western classical music; you have to skip around a bit to the sections which resonate with you melodically.

    These are the time-stamps I skip to:

    9:30
    13:10
    19:27
    26:27

    This is an excellent compressed rendition by the National Arab Orchestra.

    It introduces harmony and homophony and is excellently captured by the sound engineers.

    2) Lebanese folklore

    40 minutes of Lebanese folklore; performed by legendary singer and Greasy Williams’ crush Fariouz.

    You also have to skip around a bit to the good parts. Vocals are excellent; and the instrumentation calmly serene.

    3) Hijaz

    An exquisite piece of art music; performed by a Syrian and German duo in a pizza oven.

    Watch the cello rubatto in 6:30.

    4) Mesopotamia

    A sublime piece of art music by the Assyrian oud maestro Munir Bashir.

    Good for listening while reading the Epic of Gilgamesh. It will transport you back in time.

    5) Longa Chahinaz

    A piece from the Ottoman period. Here performed by the Syrian Ornina Orchestra:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiIXwX7m1tI&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=185&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9

    Longa Farahfaza, a brother piece to Chahinaz, performed by a French pianist and Moroccan oudist.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    Well you’ve given me almost nothing to go on.
     
    I know, but I thought it was worth asking because if it was shown on the multicultural channel here (SBS), it was presumably a bit of a hit in the home country, not some obscure flick no one's seen.

    Anyway, I actually I managed to find it: فيلم محطة الأنس It appears to have been some musical comedy. The song I was I referring to starts at around the 1:19 mark.

    It often astonishes me how little detail it takes for someone to remember a movie. There was an Australian internet forum back in the heyday of internet forums that used to have "what movie is this?" threads, from which I received some good answers to my inquiries, one in particular on the basis of no more detail than I gave you for this one. [Just checked: Whirlpool, apparently still active]

    I think I said something like "Saw it with my parents on TV when I was a kid, and my parents said they'd seen it before, guessing probably around the early 80s. At the end, a group of people emerges from what might have been a tunnel, into an open road in the countryside and they walk off into the distance with the sun glaring in front of them. I remember feeling relief that 'they made it, the survived' so maybe a disaster movie." That is absolutely fuck all to go on, but someone managed to give me the title. (Actually, I feel like watching it, but I've forgotten its name again lol.)

    Replies: @Yahya

  585. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @S

    Building G is an accident in that it was the address of the available apartment the guy rented the last time he was looking for an apartment.

    Matthew Johnson has a lot of interesting content and a lot of insane bitter ranting. Promotion of monarchical systems in 2023 or whenever he recorded that is like nostalgia for world gone with the wind. Entertaining but You Can't Be Serious.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0hK1wyrrAU&ab_channel=Wimbledon

    My favorite killing of the king is Saul Bellow Henderson the Rain King.

    Replies: @S

    Yes, I’m quite aware about the ‘G’ being an address designation, and is part of why I said at the beginning of the entry I’d not put too much stock in the idea of the murder being an occult event.

    However, in studying the Kennedy assassination, which has a huge amount of symbolism attached to many of it’s parts, I’ve concluded there may be more of an occult element involved in certain major events irrespective of whether the event participants are aware of it or not, than people might be comfortable in acknowledging.

    Thanks for the Saul Bellow reference; I wasn’t familiar with him. I did like the part at his Wiki entry below. In English Lit we were forced to look for hidden symbolism supposedly placed in certain books, which did indeed take ‘all the fun’ out of simply reading the stories for enjoyment.

    A week before the novel appeared in book stores, Saul Bellow published an article in the New York Times titled “The Search for Symbols, a Writer Warns, Misses All the Fun and Fact of the Story.” Here, Bellow warns readers against looking too deeply for symbols in literature.

  586. @AnonfromTN
    @songbird

    Why would anyone in his/her right mind want to do that? Rivers, lakes, and seas were used for transportation since times immemorial.

    After everything the US and its NATO sidekicks did there is only one way to end this war: unconditional capitulation of Kiev regime

    Replies: @songbird

    Why would anyone in his/her right mind want to do that?

    What is worth more? 39,000 km2 of new land, or not building a few locks to lower and raise ships?

    Holland is the second-largest food exporter in the world. 21% of its population lives on land below mean sea level. 65% of its land is below high tide.

    After everything the US and its NATO sidekicks did there is only one way to end this war: unconditional capitulation of Kiev regime

    Ze and his coterie will never surrender as long as they are being paid. Even if Kiev were taken (and it doesn’t seem likely to me, right now) they would just form a government-in-exile.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @songbird

    Sure, the third government in exile after Guaido and Tikhanovskaya. With the same “powers” and “success”.

    , @Mr. Hack
    @songbird


    Ze and his coterie will never surrender as long as they are being paid. Even if Kiev were taken (and it doesn’t seem likely to me, right now) they would just form a government-in-exile.
     
    Whose getting paid, and how much are they being paid? Just your active imagination, or is there really something to it?

    Replies: @songbird

  587. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    A good example of non-Aryan swastika:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lauburu

    It is also present in the Celtic cross through its "circle".

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Mr. Hack

    The swastika symbol has been used within different religious and cultural expressions throughout the world. tenSwasteika symbols are (were?) prominently exhibited within the dome of St.Sophia Cathedral in Kyiv. I remember reading about it a dozen or so years ago, and the discussion revolved aroundthe possibility of having these symbols removed by the thought police.I’m not sure whether the removal ever transpired?.


    A rare photo indeed!

    • Thanks: LatW
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Mr. Hack

    Strange indeed. It looks like someone wanted to equate swastika with cross since they TOGETHER build a circle. It is interesting also that the symbols of circle (swastika and cross within circle) create themselves circle: the part is like the whole. It almost looks like some kind of pagan input. Nothing like that in Poland, maybe there is some peculiar Orthodox tradition behind it...

    Do you have a full photo? What is in the centre?

    If there were zodiacal animals associated with evangelists nearby, you could say it represents the cosmic image from Revelation 4:6-7.

    6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind.
    7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  588. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    I’m curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    They’re possibly not as strong as the claims of Qanon, Alex Jones or the Truth Jihadist, but after 11 months of watching the Russian military performance, primarily through Russian sources, they do evoke the same kind of mental unsoundness.

    • Replies: @Ron Unz
    @Mikel


    They’re possibly not as strong as the claims of Qanon, Alex Jones or the Truth Jihadist, but after 11 months of watching the Russian military performance, primarily through Russian sources, they do evoke the same kind of mental unsoundness.
     
    Well, I think pretty much all the QAnon people were just random, often anonymous nuts on Social Media and the rest of the Internet. Meanwhile, someone like Col. Macgregor is a very highly-regarded mainstream military expert, with all sorts of high-level contacts across NATO and the military establishment.

    I'm not a military expert and I don't have those contacts, so I can't really say whether he's right or wrong. But frankly, I'd put his opinion above those random Russian activists you and others mention who have been chattering away on Telegram.

    It seems to me that if Macgregor had started to conclude that what he's been saying over the last few months had been mistaken, he'd pull back and stop doing interviews, hoping that after six months or a year, people would forget his incorrect assessments. Instead, he's going full-steam ahead, leading me to believe that he still is firmly convinced he's right.

    Deciding who actually won a war seems about the most objective thing in the world. So Macgregor and a few other people say one thing, while our entire MSM and most of the commenters here say the other. I think we'll know soon enough who was actually right and who was wrong.

    Replies: @Mikel, @Sean

  589. @AP
    @Beckow


    If Russia wins it will be in possession of ruins, with a wrecked economy and military.

    Not at all. It will have a winning military
     
    A decimated one.

    own the most arable, fertile lands in proximity to Europe,
     
    And a wrecked economy.

    Loss in Ukraine would change the way US is perceived
     
    US isn't directly involved. This isn't Vietnam.

    given how much rides on the perceptions for US:
     
    If the stakes are as high as you claim, the US will certainly not allow Ukraine to lose and it has the means to guarantee a Russian loss. I don't think the stakes are nearly as high as you claim for the USA, but let's hope the US leadership believes they are.

    If you can get yourself to celebrate that Euro-Americans have a 0.1 longer lives than Slovaks
     
    Euro Americans live about a year longer than Slovaks.

    With all the wealth, the best medical care, blabla… 0.1 of a year
     
    You rally couldn't help but throw a lie into your post, could you?

    Life expectancy Euro Americans: 77.8
    Life expectancy Slovakia: 76.9

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Beckow

    I am not sure what you mean by ‘devastated‘ or ‘decimated‘. Wars are destructive, you can say the same about any war from Napoleon to US in Iraq-Afghanistan. They have casualties and costs. Why would that make any difference to owning the greatest piece of chernozem land and in having a winning army? It is again your sad sour grapes that you escape to when you lose.

    US is involved in an almost existential way and they are trying to drag Europeans into it – look at the gment-media-culture hysteria. If you think that after a loss in Ukraine they will be able to simply walk away from it you don’t understand human nature or how history works.

    US will certainly not allow Ukraine to lose and it has the means to guarantee a Russian loss

    Does it? So where are those means? No Nato soldiers will go to fight (maybe the Polish fools, they can never resist a suicide mission), the arms won’t make much difference, and using nukes would be an overkill (for who controls Bakhmut?)… so what are the means? The most likely scenario is Russia grinding down Ukie army, taking what it wants or thinks it can control, and the West pretending that there was a “comprehensive deal” – that nobody won or lost, let’s move on…

    The terms like “comprehensive settlement” are already popping up (Macron…), that is a sure sign that Washington is looking for an exit. Given the insane projection the Western propaganda does we can easily see what they are thinking by what they say that Russia is doing…it is another sign of their complete mental bankruptcy. So they will settle, Russia will effectively win, and the real losers will by the Ukies…how is any of this good for them?

    • Replies: @A123
    @Beckow


    US is involved in an almost existential way
     
    As an American, I can tell you that this is *NOT* the case.

    It is a budget item. A superficial (though very expensive) 🇺🇦fad🇺🇦. America is going to walk away, and virtually no one will care. Remember, most Americans cannot locate Ukraine on a globe.

    No one likes to be tied to losses, so there will be an Orwellian 1984 retcon to create mental and emotional separation from the European Elite's fiasco. Any story that begins,"Not-The-President Biden was manipulated...", immediately has massive credibility.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Beckow

  590. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    The Wends were not semi-mythical. I wrote extensively about them in the past. Yes the Rugians fought to the bitter end and were for this respected by the other Pagans that were still to be found at the times not only in the Balto-Slav lands, but in Scandinavia too. The Arkona temple received gifts not only from Wends, but from the Norse too.

    The betrayal was gradual, the baptism of Rus and the Lechites was part of the process. If the Balto-Slav elites would have held to their millenia old beliefs, the Christian missionaries would have failed and the Teutonic Knight crusaders wouldn't have been able to set foot in the lands where the ancestors of the Balto-Slav were native since times immemorial.

    But elites betrayed for political, social and economic reasons, not because they thought that the alien doctrine was greater. They did it for power and gain. They were not saints, but scoundrels. Same as today in the Christian and Muslim lands. The thunder cross keeps turning.

    Replies: @AP

    The Wends were not semi-mythical. I wrote extensively about them in the past

    Yes, and thank you for that. From someone whose paternal Wendish ancestors joined the Rus adventurers in coming to Novgorod and from there went to Kiev. And one of them, about 300 years ago in gratitude to God for his survival (will not get into details), decreed that the oldest son would be a priest. And so it was for 16 generations until my father’s generation.

    The betrayal was gradual, the baptism of Rus and the Lechites was part of the process. If the Balto-Slav elites would have held to their millenia old beliefs, the Christian missionaries would have failed and the Teutonic Knight crusaders wouldn’t have been able to set foot in the lands where the ancestors of the Balto-Slav were native since times immemorial

    Of all the old pagan peoples, only the massive population of India in its isolated Subcontinent managed to preserve its old beliefs. Even the mighty Persians lost their Zoroastrianism. If the Slavs had not accepted Christianity they would have become Muslims instead. No one could withstand one or the other, that’s just the way it was.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP


    From someone whose paternal Wendish ancestors joined the Rus adventurers in coming to Novgorod and from there went to Kiev.
     
    AP, how do you know that your ancestors were Wendish..?
    In "Lila Weneda" story, it is the Slavs (Lechites) at the behest of their Nordic queen (!), who attack Wends.
    However strange the idea of union/alliance between Slavs and Norse may look to many at the time of Juliusz Słowacki, the newest archaeological research, together with the complete lack of Viking raids on Poland, seem to confirm the close relationship between Poland and Denmark during the time of the first Piast rulers, and makes plausible the hypothesis that the daughter of Mieszko I was the mother of the king Canut the Great, the king of Denmark, England, and Norway.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%9Awi%C4%99tos%C5%82awa

    Replies: @AP

  591. @Beckow
    @QCIC


    Russia has not been fighting a standard war, though that may be looming.
     
    Every war is different, what is a standard war? There are some metrics: basically is Russia better off today than on 2/22/22? Day-by-day, who is gaining? Well, Russia is better off - Nato is out of the Ukraine dreamscape, Donbas is stronger and protected, plus control of the Azov See...day-by-day the gains are now Russia's.

    Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.
     
    Russia is inevitably stronger on the ground and the Nato weapons are not going to change it - anything Nato does, Russia can match and escalate. Russia was hoping that Ukies would collapse and they didn't, but all else is going as one would expect: a slow grind, huge casualties, media hysteria by the losing side. To collapse an army takes a lot and Ukies are a stubborn bunch.

    Casualties matter and a sense that they are pointless and there will be no victory will eventually kick in. How many men from Lviv or Odessa want to die to keep Kramatorsk under Kiev control? How many would do it if they were not forced? Why would 'better weapons' (a questionable meme) make any difference in that? If we look at long protracted bloody wars (WW1, Vietnam for US...) the willingness to die decreased dramatically with time. The early war days have a mindless air about them, not quite seeing the reality and blood...sooner or later the factual bloody reality reasserts itself.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Day-by-day, who is gaining? Well, Russia is better off – Nato is out of the Ukraine dreamscape, Donbas is stronger and protected, plus control of the Azov See…day-by-day the gains are now Russia’s.

    Pure nonsense. Russia wins one small battle and all of the fruitcakes come out of the woodwork spouting off all sorts of nonsense.

    NATO out of Ukraine? Does this really need to be discussed? Ukraine is daily receiveing more and more weaponry from its NATO partners. Even the old “realist” Kissinger has recently changed his tune and thinks that Ukrainian membership into NATO is the right course to follow.

    Donbas is stronger and protected?

    With how much of the region still under the control of Kyiv forces? Sure, in the last week or so Russian forces have made some small advances, but this is bound to change.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Mr. Hack

    This war is different in that substantial military assets have been mobilized but the Russian force has worked to minimize civilian casualties more than in other wars I can recall.

    But what to make of it?

    Sure it is stressful worrying about the plight of the Ukrainians and Russians who were driven into this mess. Yes, we can worry a bit about nuclear armageddon.

    In the meantime we know that Western media is unreliable.

    The Russian media seems more credible in some cases, but it is still a war. They cannot be relied upon, either. It is probably against the law for them to go off narrative, effectively similar to the West.

    The informal anecdotes from all sides are helpful to answer some questions, but remember that they may also be censored and scripted. In any event, they can be used to support whatever narrative is chosen.

    Wait and see.

    +++

    Can someone post before and after pictures of the damaged apartment building in Dnipro?

  592. @songbird
    @AnonfromTN


    Why would anyone in his/her right mind want to do that?
     
    What is worth more? 39,000 km2 of new land, or not building a few locks to lower and raise ships?

    Holland is the second-largest food exporter in the world. 21% of its population lives on land below mean sea level. 65% of its land is below high tide.

    After everything the US and its NATO sidekicks did there is only one way to end this war: unconditional capitulation of Kiev regime
     
    Ze and his coterie will never surrender as long as they are being paid. Even if Kiev were taken (and it doesn't seem likely to me, right now) they would just form a government-in-exile.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

    Sure, the third government in exile after Guaido and Tikhanovskaya. With the same “powers” and “success”.

  593. I think Macgregor may be right in the extreme long term: assuming that Russia could complete a timely total mobilisation process, it will win against any plausible Ukraine effort suplemented by the current level of US support. However, Russia is has not yet begun such an absolute mobilisation, and the terms of the correlation of forces is inexorably altering as ‘Ukraine’ turns into an assemblage of Western technology welded by Ukrainians. The better Russia does the more Ukraine will be given by the West, which is possibly a reason for Russia going so slowly.

    In the Wagner PMC’s fictional movie about their combat in Ukraine, the war is presented as being between essentially one people that happens to be divided by being in different states. And the Ukrainians have no Western arms at all. That is not unrealistic because so far the American help has been extremely restricted, and excluded the most advanced and useful weapons, especially offensive ones that can be used to choke off supply to and then breach Russian lines, such as Abrams tanks and the Army Tactical Missile System.

    Macgregor says Ukraine has reached the peak of its capabilities, yet for all his valid points about Russia having the troop numbers and military materiel in relation to Ukraine, it has an open ended commitment from America to keep it in the war. Eventually all Ukraine’s original (Soviet ) equipment will be destroyed on combat , and that will require supplying grudgingly at first but in large quantities later — F16s, Abrams tanks, and many other things. Otherwise maintaining Ukraine in the fray long term will be impossible.

    Russia will not be able to cope with a Ukraine fielding such advanced weapons, and so it will stop advancing. . A stalemate is the preferred outcome for American strategists but getting the fine balance of supply restriction while ensuring Ukraine is not defeated before new and increased arms supply reaches Ukraine will be difficult. The great unknown is what will happen if and when Ukraine not only stops the Russians, but starts pushing the Russian army back, which I think is going to be hard to avoid if the priority is supplying enough for preventing Ukraine being knocked out of the war.

    I would note that in the video Macgregor expresses concern about the use of nuclear weapons by America, but as stated above there are many conventional options for the US help to Ukraine that Washington is still holding back; Ukraine has not been given Abrams tanks and the reason would seem the US is afraid they would be too effectively used in offensives. Although he ostensibly anticipates the US going nuclear, that is far fetched. in my opinion, deep down Macgregor thinks America will take its indirect help for Ukraine too far, and Russia will end up using a nuclear weapon on an advancing Ukrainian army. Avery novel and dangerous situation would then be created, because the US would have to do something directly.

  594. @songbird
    @AnonfromTN


    Why would anyone in his/her right mind want to do that?
     
    What is worth more? 39,000 km2 of new land, or not building a few locks to lower and raise ships?

    Holland is the second-largest food exporter in the world. 21% of its population lives on land below mean sea level. 65% of its land is below high tide.

    After everything the US and its NATO sidekicks did there is only one way to end this war: unconditional capitulation of Kiev regime
     
    Ze and his coterie will never surrender as long as they are being paid. Even if Kiev were taken (and it doesn't seem likely to me, right now) they would just form a government-in-exile.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

    Ze and his coterie will never surrender as long as they are being paid. Even if Kiev were taken (and it doesn’t seem likely to me, right now) they would just form a government-in-exile.

    Whose getting paid, and how much are they being paid? Just your active imagination, or is there really something to it?

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Mr. Hack

    I don't think that it is a controversial take to say that Ukraine is being propped up, and its ability to make war has been decoupled from its natural economy, thus greatly prolonging its ability to fight and the length of the war.

    Furthermore, I don't believe its leadership is more perfect than our own. I think people in the elite are skimming and making deals for influence and gaining celebrity. Why would they want to end the war for some simple metric like number of dead, or suffering of its people?

    This is the same country that had a firm where Biden's drug-addled son was some well-paid exec, even the MSM acknowledges that.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  595. @Mr. Hack
    @Another Polish Perspective

    The swastika symbol has been used within different religious and cultural expressions throughout the world. tenSwasteika symbols are (were?) prominently exhibited within the dome of St.Sophia Cathedral in Kyiv. I remember reading about it a dozen or so years ago, and the discussion revolved aroundthe possibility of having these symbols removed by the thought police.I'm not sure whether the removal ever transpired?.

    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-VtGe2baI36o/V5a57YLPwgI/AAAAAAAADHI/xyKFU6qCEaYpg1l61_bV8CxCGRPFA6lXACLcB/s1600/Image-83.jpg

    A rare photo indeed!

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Strange indeed. It looks like someone wanted to equate swastika with cross since they TOGETHER build a circle. It is interesting also that the symbols of circle (swastika and cross within circle) create themselves circle: the part is like the whole. It almost looks like some kind of pagan input. Nothing like that in Poland, maybe there is some peculiar Orthodox tradition behind it…

    Do you have a full photo? What is in the centre?

    If there were zodiacal animals associated with evangelists nearby, you could say it represents the cosmic image from Revelation 4:6-7.

    6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind.
    7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Another Polish Perspective

    I dug around a little bit more and was able to locate a twitter thread that included some more information about the swastika symbol found within several Eastern churches. The feed author calls them "yargs" I think?...The imagery seems to be indeed related to cross imagery, however, I don't know the exact meaning of it all:

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ep5Qz6-W8AI-lEo?format=jpg&name=360x360

    https://twitter.com/EternalYarila/status/1341600396339535872

  596. Why has the Eye of Sauron risen on the other side of the Turkish Straights? And what does it portend?

    [MORE]

  597. @Beckow
    @AP

    I am not sure what you mean by 'devastated' or 'decimated'. Wars are destructive, you can say the same about any war from Napoleon to US in Iraq-Afghanistan. They have casualties and costs. Why would that make any difference to owning the greatest piece of chernozem land and in having a winning army? It is again your sad sour grapes that you escape to when you lose.

    US is involved in an almost existential way and they are trying to drag Europeans into it - look at the gment-media-culture hysteria. If you think that after a loss in Ukraine they will be able to simply walk away from it you don't understand human nature or how history works.


    US will certainly not allow Ukraine to lose and it has the means to guarantee a Russian loss
     
    Does it? So where are those means? No Nato soldiers will go to fight (maybe the Polish fools, they can never resist a suicide mission), the arms won't make much difference, and using nukes would be an overkill (for who controls Bakhmut?)... so what are the means? The most likely scenario is Russia grinding down Ukie army, taking what it wants or thinks it can control, and the West pretending that there was a "comprehensive deal" - that nobody won or lost, let's move on...

    The terms like "comprehensive settlement" are already popping up (Macron...), that is a sure sign that Washington is looking for an exit. Given the insane projection the Western propaganda does we can easily see what they are thinking by what they say that Russia is doing...it is another sign of their complete mental bankruptcy. So they will settle, Russia will effectively win, and the real losers will by the Ukies...how is any of this good for them?

    Replies: @A123

    US is involved in an almost existential way

    As an American, I can tell you that this is *NOT* the case.

    It is a budget item. A superficial (though very expensive) 🇺🇦fad🇺🇦. America is going to walk away, and virtually no one will care. Remember, most Americans cannot locate Ukraine on a globe.

    No one likes to be tied to losses, so there will be an Orwellian 1984 retcon to create mental and emotional separation from the European Elite’s fiasco. Any story that begins,“Not-The-President Biden was manipulated…”, immediately has massive credibility.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @A123

    By "US" I meant the Washington ruling class - they are fully committed, this is "it" for them. Whether they manage to take along the 99% of Americans who are not involved we don't know. But based on the level of media and government control (close to total when it comes to anything Russian) and the blase uninformed and emotionally manipulated nature of the people, it wouldn't surprise me if the people went along.

    In any case, the rulers can't afford to lose this one and have no way of winning it. That creates a dilemma - will they escalate to the big boom in order not to lose face? And will Russia play along? Or is there some less dramatic way out?

    We don't know, but this is the most dangerous moment in human history. We are at this point because a bunch of retards with maps in Washington-London decided it was a good idea to expand Nato into Ukraine and checkmate Russia. Instead we got this mess.

    Replies: @A123

  598. @Mr. Hack
    @Yahya


    The Khojas live today in East Africa, India, Pakistan, Europe, and North America, and show a strong commitment to the values of Muslim philanthropy in their business entrepreneurship and contribution to societies in which they live.
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoja

    Are there more Khojas that live in Egypt that you apparently identify with?


    You make a good point about respect for one’s ancestors. But I don’t see the usefulness of haplogroups in determining present-day identity. My R1a paternal lineage, shared by most Russians but only a small minority of Arabs, would mean I would have to care more for Russians than Egyptians or Arabians. While I respect and admire the Russian ethnos; they are not my people – Egyptians are.
     
    You make a pretty strong case for your position here. Furthermore, you seem to be a very cultured and intelligent young man who seems to be well on your way towards the sun without needing to tap into the mythical powers of your supposed aryan ancestors (mostly the ability to survive?).

    A tree without roots cannot keep growing towards the sun, a people without ancestry has no future.
     
    Although you seem to respect your ancestors to some extent, your example seems to stand in stark contrast to that of what Ivashka seems to be propagating as fundamental cultural orthodoxy ( I tend to support your point of view here).

    Replies: @Yahya

    Are there more Khojas that live in Egypt that you apparently identify with?

    Who said I identify with them? There are zero Khojas in Egypt. My Khoja line is paternal. I mentioned before my father is Saudi Arabian of Perso-Indian origins. My maternal line is Turco-Egyptian. I’m a mixed-bag of ancestries. But my native tongue is Semitic; and I was socialized among an Egyptian milieu. Thus I consider myself to be an Arab. I identify more with the Lebanese and Palestinians than Turks, Iranians or Indians.

    Ivashka is disappointed in my decision to identify as a Semite rather than an Aryan. He thinks it’s more logical to take pride in my Indo-European lineage. But I beg to differ. I’m sure he is aware that Semites too possess a long and glorious history; perhaps even moreso than Aryans. (I use the term “Semites” here to encompass pre-Arab ethnicites, that were, under strict definitions, not necessarily Semitic-speakers; but of the same Levant_Neolithic and Iran_Neolithic racial stock as modern Arabs.)

    When my Indo-Iranian ancestors were roaming around the steppes and forests of Eurasia in unaccomplished ways; my Egyptian ancestors were building colossal monuments that have withstood the test of time. Everyone recognizes Ancient Egypt as the lodestar of antiquity; and very few bother with the history of Aryans. Today in Germany; the most prominent artifact in their museums is the bust of Nefertiti; not some pagan artifact.

    Hitler once wrote a letter to Egyptian authorities, explaining why he would never give back the prized possession: “Do you know what I’m going to do one day? I’m going to build a new Egyptian museum in Berlin,” Hitler wrote in a letter to the Egyptians. “I dream of it. Inside I will build a chamber, crowned by a large dome. In the middle, this wonder, Nefertiti will be enthroned. I will never relinquish the head of the queen.”

    It represents timeless beauty; the epitome of tranquility and harmony. No artifact from the ancient period can surpass it. I consider it an honor to be born in the small stretch of the Nile where some of my ancestors have been building a civilization for 5,000 years. Egypt is at a low civilizational ebb at the moment; so sure, it could be better to identify with Aryan populations. But I don’t think I’ll ever be able to replicate the sort of feeling I get when passing by the Great Pyramid at Giza. To be rooted in 5,000 years of civilization is better than roaming around the forest or desert. That’s why my Egyptian identity takes precedence over my Aryan or Arabian ones.

    I suspect Ivashka also, deep down in his heart; knows that ethnicity is more important than paternal lineage. His words and actions point to this implicitly. He has said before he is an ethnic nationalist, not an R1A nationalist. I doubt he cares much about preserving the Sindhi people for posterity. He has also mocked AP’s attempts to designate Dostoevsky as Ukrainian. If Ivashka’s identification with haplogroups was strong; he wouldn’t have cared much. But he is a loyal Russian. And that imo is a more robust basis for identity than haplogroups.

    Ultimately, I think one should always strive to dampen ethnic and ancestral feelings of pride. It’s important to have a sense of peoplehood, and to be cognizant of one’s ancestors; such that you strive to improve your ethnos in the same manner they did. But moderation is key here; the extreme forms of pride in one’s ethnicity or ancestors can be negative and harmful.

    The Prophet Muhammad (عَلَيْهِ ٱلسَّلَامُ) knew the Arab tribes considered their ethnicity and ancestral descent to be a major source of pride; so he reminded them that no amount of pride in one’s father can compensate for sinful actions.

    “Now then, surely your being ‘Arab is not the basis for your personality nor a part of your essence, rather, it is the language which you speak. So then whosoever is negligent in his actions, then the pride that he has from his father (being an ‘Arab) will not help him in the least and will not make up for the defects in his (religious) actions).”4

    The Quran reiterates the message that all humans were created from mud, and only virtuous piety separates one man from another:

    أَيُّهٌا النٌّاسُ! إِنَّ اللٌّهَ قَدْ أَذْهَبَ عَنْكُمْ نَخْوَةَ الْجٌاهِلِيَّةَ وَ تَفٌاخُرَهٌا بِآبٌائِهٌا أَلاَ إِنَّكُمْ مِنْ آدَمَ و آدَمُ مِنْ طِيْنٍ. أَلاٌ إِنَّ خَيْرَ عِبٌادِ اللٌّهِ عَبْدٌ اتِّقٌاهُ

    “O’ Mankind! Surely Allah has removed the pride and conceit that existed within you during the days of Ignorance in relation to your fore-fathers. Surely all of you are from (Prophet) Adam and Adam was (created) from mud. Surely the best servant of Allah is that servant who has consciousness of Him.”3

    And Allah is all-knowing and wise.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Yahya

    What were Egyptians doing when Göbekli Tepe was built?

    Replies: @Yahya, @Emil Nikola Richard

  599. @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    Well, then your ancestors should be Y haplogroup R1a Z93.
     
    Everyone's heard of "Fermi's Paradox," but have you heard of Fermi's Paradox as it relates to time travel - if it is possible, where are all the people from the future? Well, I think George Lucas might have been one, not because of the spaceships and laser blasters, but because of the names he gave the androids - C-3PO and R2-D2 - "relicts" from a future in which humans identify themselves by their haplogroups.

    On a serious note, how can you tell if a haplogroup is being preserved or not? Wouldn't that require everyone to be genetically assayed (and multiple times, just to be sure)?

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    the names he gave the androids – C-3PO and R2-D2 – “relicts” from a future in which humans identify themselves by their haplogroups.

    OK that is a good one.

    Your time travel is pure fantasy however. The thing with physical law is humans cannot violate it in reality. Begin with Thermodynamics Number Two.

  600. @AP
    @Ivashka the fool


    The Wends were not semi-mythical. I wrote extensively about them in the past
     
    Yes, and thank you for that. From someone whose paternal Wendish ancestors joined the Rus adventurers in coming to Novgorod and from there went to Kiev. And one of them, about 300 years ago in gratitude to God for his survival (will not get into details), decreed that the oldest son would be a priest. And so it was for 16 generations until my father’s generation.

    The betrayal was gradual, the baptism of Rus and the Lechites was part of the process. If the Balto-Slav elites would have held to their millenia old beliefs, the Christian missionaries would have failed and the Teutonic Knight crusaders wouldn’t have been able to set foot in the lands where the ancestors of the Balto-Slav were native since times immemorial
     
    Of all the old pagan peoples, only the massive population of India in its isolated Subcontinent managed to preserve its old beliefs. Even the mighty Persians lost their Zoroastrianism. If the Slavs had not accepted Christianity they would have become Muslims instead. No one could withstand one or the other, that’s just the way it was.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    From someone whose paternal Wendish ancestors joined the Rus adventurers in coming to Novgorod and from there went to Kiev.

    AP, how do you know that your ancestors were Wendish..?
    In “Lila Weneda” story, it is the Slavs (Lechites) at the behest of their Nordic queen (!), who attack Wends.
    However strange the idea of union/alliance between Slavs and Norse may look to many at the time of Juliusz Słowacki, the newest archaeological research, together with the complete lack of Viking raids on Poland, seem to confirm the close relationship between Poland and Denmark during the time of the first Piast rulers, and makes plausible the hypothesis that the daughter of Mieszko I was the mother of the king Canut the Great, the king of Denmark, England, and Norway.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%9Awi%C4%99tos%C5%82awa

    • Replies: @AP
    @Another Polish Perspective


    AP, how do you know that your ancestors were Wendish..?
     


    According to family legend passed down over centuries by paternal ancestors were Varangians who came down to Kiev from the North. And indeed all of us who resemble our father/grandfather even have a Nordic appearance. When as a teenager I travelled around and partied in Europe I was most often mistaken for a Swede, sometimes a German.

    When I took a detailed DNA test it sort of matched. A small cluster near Kiev, very large cluster in Novgorod to Pskov (areas of Varangian settlement), and numerous various hits across the Baltic. But the Haplogroup was a specific R1a associated with Wends. Ivashka explained that a lot of Wends joined Scandinavian Rus on their adventures in East Slavic lands.

    Not sure how to explain the Nordic appearance; perhaps the Wendish ancestor took a Norse wife. More recently, paternal great-grandfather some German descent, from the daughter of a Sudeten German officer stationed at Przemysl. Either way one would think that this phenotype would have been washed away in a sea of Slavs.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  601. @Mr. Hack
    @songbird


    Ze and his coterie will never surrender as long as they are being paid. Even if Kiev were taken (and it doesn’t seem likely to me, right now) they would just form a government-in-exile.
     
    Whose getting paid, and how much are they being paid? Just your active imagination, or is there really something to it?

    Replies: @songbird

    I don’t think that it is a controversial take to say that Ukraine is being propped up, and its ability to make war has been decoupled from its natural economy, thus greatly prolonging its ability to fight and the length of the war.

    Furthermore, I don’t believe its leadership is more perfect than our own. I think people in the elite are skimming and making deals for influence and gaining celebrity. Why would they want to end the war for some simple metric like number of dead, or suffering of its people?

    This is the same country that had a firm where Biden’s drug-addled son was some well-paid exec, even the MSM acknowledges that.

    • Agree: A123
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @songbird

    No, I wouldn't count it as controversial to point out that Ukraine is being "propped up" with western guns and ammo. Funds to help out with humanitarian needs too. If you're insinuating that the current leadership is involved in skimming funds to line its own pockets, then I think you would need to provide some some sort of proof that this sort of activity is taking place in order to make it believable. If all you're saying is that the current crop of politicians are only jockeying for "influence and celebrity" I would say, what else is new under the sun? You made it sound like (at least to me) that Zelensky and his close adivsors are being paid somehow in under the table payoffs to keep the war going on.

    https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/b/corruption-bribery-concept-people-business-suits-giving-bribe-behind-back-cartoon-vector-illustration-83371405.jpg
    Where's the beef?

    Biden's son's payoffs for access were during Yanukovych's tenure, and we can see how that all ended up.

  602. @Yahya
    @Mr. Hack


    Are there more Khojas that live in Egypt that you apparently identify with?
     
    Who said I identify with them? There are zero Khojas in Egypt. My Khoja line is paternal. I mentioned before my father is Saudi Arabian of Perso-Indian origins. My maternal line is Turco-Egyptian. I'm a mixed-bag of ancestries. But my native tongue is Semitic; and I was socialized among an Egyptian milieu. Thus I consider myself to be an Arab. I identify more with the Lebanese and Palestinians than Turks, Iranians or Indians.

    Ivashka is disappointed in my decision to identify as a Semite rather than an Aryan. He thinks it's more logical to take pride in my Indo-European lineage. But I beg to differ. I'm sure he is aware that Semites too possess a long and glorious history; perhaps even moreso than Aryans. (I use the term "Semites" here to encompass pre-Arab ethnicites, that were, under strict definitions, not necessarily Semitic-speakers; but of the same Levant_Neolithic and Iran_Neolithic racial stock as modern Arabs.)

    When my Indo-Iranian ancestors were roaming around the steppes and forests of Eurasia in unaccomplished ways; my Egyptian ancestors were building colossal monuments that have withstood the test of time. Everyone recognizes Ancient Egypt as the lodestar of antiquity; and very few bother with the history of Aryans. Today in Germany; the most prominent artifact in their museums is the bust of Nefertiti; not some pagan artifact.


    https://cdn.prod.www.spiegel.de/images/744ef395-0001-0004-0000-000000024832_w1600_r1.6055045871559632_fpx66_fpy50.jpg


    Hitler once wrote a letter to Egyptian authorities, explaining why he would never give back the prized possession: “Do you know what I’m going to do one day? I’m going to build a new Egyptian museum in Berlin,” Hitler wrote in a letter to the Egyptians. “I dream of it. Inside I will build a chamber, crowned by a large dome. In the middle, this wonder, Nefertiti will be enthroned. I will never relinquish the head of the queen.”

    It represents timeless beauty; the epitome of tranquility and harmony. No artifact from the ancient period can surpass it. I consider it an honor to be born in the small stretch of the Nile where some of my ancestors have been building a civilization for 5,000 years. Egypt is at a low civilizational ebb at the moment; so sure, it could be better to identify with Aryan populations. But I don't think I'll ever be able to replicate the sort of feeling I get when passing by the Great Pyramid at Giza. To be rooted in 5,000 years of civilization is better than roaming around the forest or desert. That's why my Egyptian identity takes precedence over my Aryan or Arabian ones.

    I suspect Ivashka also, deep down in his heart; knows that ethnicity is more important than paternal lineage. His words and actions point to this implicitly. He has said before he is an ethnic nationalist, not an R1A nationalist. I doubt he cares much about preserving the Sindhi people for posterity. He has also mocked AP's attempts to designate Dostoevsky as Ukrainian. If Ivashka's identification with haplogroups was strong; he wouldn't have cared much. But he is a loyal Russian. And that imo is a more robust basis for identity than haplogroups.

    Ultimately, I think one should always strive to dampen ethnic and ancestral feelings of pride. It's important to have a sense of peoplehood, and to be cognizant of one's ancestors; such that you strive to improve your ethnos in the same manner they did. But moderation is key here; the extreme forms of pride in one's ethnicity or ancestors can be negative and harmful.

    The Prophet Muhammad (عَلَيْهِ ٱلسَّلَامُ) knew the Arab tribes considered their ethnicity and ancestral descent to be a major source of pride; so he reminded them that no amount of pride in one's father can compensate for sinful actions.

    “Now then, surely your being ‘Arab is not the basis for your personality nor a part of your essence, rather, it is the language which you speak. So then whosoever is negligent in his actions, then the pride that he has from his father (being an ‘Arab) will not help him in the least and will not make up for the defects in his (religious) actions).”4

    The Quran reiterates the message that all humans were created from mud, and only virtuous piety separates one man from another:

    أَيُّهٌا النٌّاسُ! إِنَّ اللٌّهَ قَدْ أَذْهَبَ عَنْكُمْ نَخْوَةَ الْجٌاهِلِيَّةَ وَ تَفٌاخُرَهٌا بِآبٌائِهٌا أَلاَ إِنَّكُمْ مِنْ آدَمَ و آدَمُ مِنْ طِيْنٍ. أَلاٌ إِنَّ خَيْرَ عِبٌادِ اللٌّهِ عَبْدٌ اتِّقٌاهُ

    “O’ Mankind! Surely Allah has removed the pride and conceit that existed within you during the days of Ignorance in relation to your fore-fathers. Surely all of you are from (Prophet) Adam and Adam was (created) from mud. Surely the best servant of Allah is that servant who has consciousness of Him.”3

    And Allah is all-knowing and wise.

    Replies: @songbird

    What were Egyptians doing when Göbekli Tepe was built?

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @songbird


    What were Egyptians doing when Göbekli Tepe was built?
     
    Nothing much; just making pots, tending their tools and scavenging around.

    “Egypt” began around 6000 BC when people from the Near East (Levant_N) migrated and formed the first settlements in Egypt proper. The next 3,000 years saw a gradual laying of the foundations of Egyptian civilization. Narmer unified Egypt around 3100-2900 BC and formed the first nation-state (as opposed to city-state) in history.

    Replies: @songbird

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird

    https://www.unz.com/ghood/whos-afraid-of-an-ancient-apocalypse/

  603. @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    Day-by-day, who is gaining? Well, Russia is better off – Nato is out of the Ukraine dreamscape, Donbas is stronger and protected, plus control of the Azov See…day-by-day the gains are now Russia’s.
     
    Pure nonsense. Russia wins one small battle and all of the fruitcakes come out of the woodwork spouting off all sorts of nonsense.

    NATO out of Ukraine? Does this really need to be discussed? Ukraine is daily receiveing more and more weaponry from its NATO partners. Even the old "realist" Kissinger has recently changed his tune and thinks that Ukrainian membership into NATO is the right course to follow.

    Donbas is stronger and protected?

    With how much of the region still under the control of Kyiv forces? Sure, in the last week or so Russian forces have made some small advances, but this is bound to change.

    https://preview.redd.it/asjam6w8grba1.jpg?width=2953&format=pjpg&auto=webp&v=enabled&s=7484a1488cdd4f61734a7bd4daf4c2b625bd70a4

    Replies: @QCIC

    This war is different in that substantial military assets have been mobilized but the Russian force has worked to minimize civilian casualties more than in other wars I can recall.

    But what to make of it?

    Sure it is stressful worrying about the plight of the Ukrainians and Russians who were driven into this mess. Yes, we can worry a bit about nuclear armageddon.

    In the meantime we know that Western media is unreliable.

    The Russian media seems more credible in some cases, but it is still a war. They cannot be relied upon, either. It is probably against the law for them to go off narrative, effectively similar to the West.

    The informal anecdotes from all sides are helpful to answer some questions, but remember that they may also be censored and scripted. In any event, they can be used to support whatever narrative is chosen.

    Wait and see.

    +++

    Can someone post before and after pictures of the damaged apartment building in Dnipro?

  604. @songbird
    @Yahya

    What were Egyptians doing when Göbekli Tepe was built?

    Replies: @Yahya, @Emil Nikola Richard

    What were Egyptians doing when Göbekli Tepe was built?

    Nothing much; just making pots, tending their tools and scavenging around.

    “Egypt” began around 6000 BC when people from the Near East (Levant_N) migrated and formed the first settlements in Egypt proper. The next 3,000 years saw a gradual laying of the foundations of Egyptian civilization. Narmer unified Egypt around 3100-2900 BC and formed the first nation-state (as opposed to city-state) in history.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Yahya

    Possibly, the annual floods were a negative before they became a positive.


    When my Indo-Iranian ancestors were roaming around the steppes and forests of Eurasia in unaccomplished ways
     
    Well, we are going into geo-determinsim again, but I contend PIE were domesticating the horse and possibly inventing the wheel, or at least axled vehicles.

    Definitely not minor things, when you consider their impact. Especially, after the horse plow was invented, or even just thinking how engines were first defined in horse power.

    Replies: @Yahya

  605. @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP


    From someone whose paternal Wendish ancestors joined the Rus adventurers in coming to Novgorod and from there went to Kiev.
     
    AP, how do you know that your ancestors were Wendish..?
    In "Lila Weneda" story, it is the Slavs (Lechites) at the behest of their Nordic queen (!), who attack Wends.
    However strange the idea of union/alliance between Slavs and Norse may look to many at the time of Juliusz Słowacki, the newest archaeological research, together with the complete lack of Viking raids on Poland, seem to confirm the close relationship between Poland and Denmark during the time of the first Piast rulers, and makes plausible the hypothesis that the daughter of Mieszko I was the mother of the king Canut the Great, the king of Denmark, England, and Norway.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%9Awi%C4%99tos%C5%82awa

    Replies: @AP

    AP, how do you know that your ancestors were Wendish..?

    [MORE]

    According to family legend passed down over centuries by paternal ancestors were Varangians who came down to Kiev from the North. And indeed all of us who resemble our father/grandfather even have a Nordic appearance. When as a teenager I travelled around and partied in Europe I was most often mistaken for a Swede, sometimes a German.

    When I took a detailed DNA test it sort of matched. A small cluster near Kiev, very large cluster in Novgorod to Pskov (areas of Varangian settlement), and numerous various hits across the Baltic. But the Haplogroup was a specific R1a associated with Wends. Ivashka explained that a lot of Wends joined Scandinavian Rus on their adventures in East Slavic lands.

    Not sure how to explain the Nordic appearance; perhaps the Wendish ancestor took a Norse wife. More recently, paternal great-grandfather some German descent, from the daughter of a Sudeten German officer stationed at Przemysl. Either way one would think that this phenotype would have been washed away in a sea of Slavs.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP

    Well, Slavs are R1a too; half of male Poland is R1a.

    It looks like you are a Scandi/Varangian. Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then. The fact that your ancestor came from the area possibly associated with them does not make you automatically a Wend since they were finally conquered; you could come from conquerors of Wends, not Wends themselves.

    Anyway, it is the first time I hear that some subclade R1a is associated with Wends; that is a tall order anyway since archaeology did not definitely "find" Wends, there are several hypotheses who they were. My favourite one says that they were Celtic people living in the area of Great Poland (Wielkopolska) and Pomerania before Slavs (Lechites etc). It somehow corresponds with the legend of Wineta, the great Vendish emporium, which was to be destroyed by Northmen.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vineta

    Anyway, the people who were obsessed with Wends were not Poles, but Germans, who, as I remember from reading some book on German chronicles, especially lusted after Wendish women, who were to be lustful and voluptuous. This element, however, is not present in "Lila Weneda" where Wends are peaceful, artistic types, so that even Lechites king "Lech" does not want to attack them but his Nordic wife, Gwinona, threatens him with leaving him and thus breaking alliance with Norse, if he does not attack Wends (well, maybe she was jealous of these Wendish women).
    So at least the play preserves the German/Nordic obsessive concern with Wends.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @AP, @Ivashka the fool

  606. @Yahya
    @songbird


    What were Egyptians doing when Göbekli Tepe was built?
     
    Nothing much; just making pots, tending their tools and scavenging around.

    “Egypt” began around 6000 BC when people from the Near East (Levant_N) migrated and formed the first settlements in Egypt proper. The next 3,000 years saw a gradual laying of the foundations of Egyptian civilization. Narmer unified Egypt around 3100-2900 BC and formed the first nation-state (as opposed to city-state) in history.

    Replies: @songbird

    Possibly, the annual floods were a negative before they became a positive.

    When my Indo-Iranian ancestors were roaming around the steppes and forests of Eurasia in unaccomplished ways

    Well, we are going into geo-determinsim again, but I contend PIE were domesticating the horse and possibly inventing the wheel, or at least axled vehicles.

    Definitely not minor things, when you consider their impact. Especially, after the horse plow was invented, or even just thinking how engines were first defined in horse power.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @songbird


    but I contend PIE were domesticating the horse and possibly inventing the wheel, or at least axled vehicles.
     
    The wheel was invented in Mesopotamia first; around 4200-4000 BC. It was also used, and possibly invented independently, in India and China. Indo-Europeans were first to domesticate the horse.

    Herodotus summed it up best: "Egypt is the gift of the Nile". It was also a gift of Mesopotamia; having learnt the basic rudiments of writing, agriculture, architecture and metallurgy from the Mesopotamians. The Mesopotamians were the pioneers of civilization; the ancient Near East was downstream of their accomplishments. Egypt surpassed Iraq/Ur/Babylon by virtue of its ability to unify into a mega-state; which in turn was aided by its population density around the Nile.

    Egyptian elite culture also adopted a range of Mesopotamian imagery, especially artistic motifs to represent complex or difficult concepts, such as the notion of kingship itself (a rosette) or the reconciliation of opposing forces by the ruler (two intertwined beasts).


    https://artincontext.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Ancient-Art-of-Mesopotamia.jpg


    The Mesopotamians were the OGs of the Ancient World.


    https://www.wondriumdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/The-History-of-Ancient-Egypt_Warfare-in-Ancient-Egypt-Chariots-Archers-and-Infantry_QBS_Thumb.jpg


    The Indo-Europeans brought Chariots to Egypt; but that was much later, when Egypt had been a full-fledged civilization for 2,000+ years,

    Replies: @TalhaAtUnz2

  607. @AP
    @Another Polish Perspective


    AP, how do you know that your ancestors were Wendish..?
     


    According to family legend passed down over centuries by paternal ancestors were Varangians who came down to Kiev from the North. And indeed all of us who resemble our father/grandfather even have a Nordic appearance. When as a teenager I travelled around and partied in Europe I was most often mistaken for a Swede, sometimes a German.

    When I took a detailed DNA test it sort of matched. A small cluster near Kiev, very large cluster in Novgorod to Pskov (areas of Varangian settlement), and numerous various hits across the Baltic. But the Haplogroup was a specific R1a associated with Wends. Ivashka explained that a lot of Wends joined Scandinavian Rus on their adventures in East Slavic lands.

    Not sure how to explain the Nordic appearance; perhaps the Wendish ancestor took a Norse wife. More recently, paternal great-grandfather some German descent, from the daughter of a Sudeten German officer stationed at Przemysl. Either way one would think that this phenotype would have been washed away in a sea of Slavs.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Well, Slavs are R1a too; half of male Poland is R1a.

    It looks like you are a Scandi/Varangian. Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then. The fact that your ancestor came from the area possibly associated with them does not make you automatically a Wend since they were finally conquered; you could come from conquerors of Wends, not Wends themselves.

    Anyway, it is the first time I hear that some subclade R1a is associated with Wends; that is a tall order anyway since archaeology did not definitely “find” Wends, there are several hypotheses who they were. My favourite one says that they were Celtic people living in the area of Great Poland (Wielkopolska) and Pomerania before Slavs (Lechites etc). It somehow corresponds with the legend of Wineta, the great Vendish emporium, which was to be destroyed by Northmen.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vineta

    Anyway, the people who were obsessed with Wends were not Poles, but Germans, who, as I remember from reading some book on German chronicles, especially lusted after Wendish women, who were to be lustful and voluptuous. This element, however, is not present in “Lila Weneda” where Wends are peaceful, artistic types, so that even Lechites king “Lech” does not want to attack them but his Nordic wife, Gwinona, threatens him with leaving him and thus breaking alliance with Norse, if he does not attack Wends (well, maybe she was jealous of these Wendish women).
    So at least the play preserves the German/Nordic obsessive concern with Wends.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    So, to be more in line with legends, it is your Nordic ancestor who should take Wendish wife, not a Wendish ancestor marrying a Nordic woman (for her, it would be like marrying slave-type man).

    , @AP
    @Another Polish Perspective


    It looks like you are a Scandi/Varangian. Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then
     
    Whatever algorithm the company (or its volunteers) used determined that my patrilineal subclade was an R1a associated with Wends. The distribution pattern matched historical areas associated with Varangian settlement.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @LatW

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then.
     
    No. Wends = Venety = Anty = proto-Slavs then Balto-Slav, then Western Slavs and Balts.

    Celts originated in the area of contact between Indo-European R1a people descended from the Corded Ware Culture and R1b people descended from the Bell Beaker Culture whom might have not spoken an Indo-European language at the time. This region gave birth to the Unetice Culture, which was the cradle of the ancient European religion. From there appeared the Hallstatt and La Tène Celts who spoke ancient Celtic - an Indo-European language. The ancient Celts had a caste system typical of the Indo-European ethnic groups. The warrior elite and priestly class (Druids) ruled upon mostly R1b people, but we have no idea what were the haplogroups of the elite and / or whether all Celts were R1b.

    The Veneti you write about, from whom the name of Venice and of La Vendée originated, controlled the amber trade between the Baltic and the Mediterranean seas and were skilled seafaring people. We have no information on their ethnic background, the fact that they lived in Italo - Celtic-speaking areas doesn't mean at all that they were of haplogroup R1b.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veneti_(Gaul)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adriatic_Veneti

    Of note, Adriatic Veneti had their own script and their language was Indo-European, but distinct from Celtic.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  608. @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP

    Well, Slavs are R1a too; half of male Poland is R1a.

    It looks like you are a Scandi/Varangian. Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then. The fact that your ancestor came from the area possibly associated with them does not make you automatically a Wend since they were finally conquered; you could come from conquerors of Wends, not Wends themselves.

    Anyway, it is the first time I hear that some subclade R1a is associated with Wends; that is a tall order anyway since archaeology did not definitely "find" Wends, there are several hypotheses who they were. My favourite one says that they were Celtic people living in the area of Great Poland (Wielkopolska) and Pomerania before Slavs (Lechites etc). It somehow corresponds with the legend of Wineta, the great Vendish emporium, which was to be destroyed by Northmen.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vineta

    Anyway, the people who were obsessed with Wends were not Poles, but Germans, who, as I remember from reading some book on German chronicles, especially lusted after Wendish women, who were to be lustful and voluptuous. This element, however, is not present in "Lila Weneda" where Wends are peaceful, artistic types, so that even Lechites king "Lech" does not want to attack them but his Nordic wife, Gwinona, threatens him with leaving him and thus breaking alliance with Norse, if he does not attack Wends (well, maybe she was jealous of these Wendish women).
    So at least the play preserves the German/Nordic obsessive concern with Wends.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @AP, @Ivashka the fool

    So, to be more in line with legends, it is your Nordic ancestor who should take Wendish wife, not a Wendish ancestor marrying a Nordic woman (for her, it would be like marrying slave-type man).

  609. @Mikel
    @Ron Unz


    I’m curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.
     
    They're possibly not as strong as the claims of Qanon, Alex Jones or the Truth Jihadist, but after 11 months of watching the Russian military performance, primarily through Russian sources, they do evoke the same kind of mental unsoundness.

    Replies: @Ron Unz

    They’re possibly not as strong as the claims of Qanon, Alex Jones or the Truth Jihadist, but after 11 months of watching the Russian military performance, primarily through Russian sources, they do evoke the same kind of mental unsoundness.

    Well, I think pretty much all the QAnon people were just random, often anonymous nuts on Social Media and the rest of the Internet. Meanwhile, someone like Col. Macgregor is a very highly-regarded mainstream military expert, with all sorts of high-level contacts across NATO and the military establishment.

    I’m not a military expert and I don’t have those contacts, so I can’t really say whether he’s right or wrong. But frankly, I’d put his opinion above those random Russian activists you and others mention who have been chattering away on Telegram.

    It seems to me that if Macgregor had started to conclude that what he’s been saying over the last few months had been mistaken, he’d pull back and stop doing interviews, hoping that after six months or a year, people would forget his incorrect assessments. Instead, he’s going full-steam ahead, leading me to believe that he still is firmly convinced he’s right.

    Deciding who actually won a war seems about the most objective thing in the world. So Macgregor and a few other people say one thing, while our entire MSM and most of the commenters here say the other. I think we’ll know soon enough who was actually right and who was wrong.

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @Ron Unz


    I think we’ll know soon enough who was actually right and who was wrong.
     
    I remember you saying the same thing on this very blog some months ago when McGregor was also predicting a quick Russian victory. What we actually saw was a calamitous Russian retreat instead, including from regions they had just declared part of Russia.

    Some of the "chattering random Russian activists" that I have been following are the former host of this blog and several participants in Putin's SMO, including Russian Colonel Girkin, who has the same rank as McGregor but is much better acquainted with the situation in Ukraine, having been the commander of the pro-Russian forces in Donbas in 2014 and having taken part in the current hostilities as a volunteer. They strongly disagree with McGregor, even though you might remember that in the first months of the war Karlin used to come here to warn us about the "shock and disbelief" that we would soon experience. He now keeps comparing Putin and his entourage to monkeys in his Twitter account.

    One of the participants in the SMO that I've been following (not sure if it was Strelkov or Murza, a lieutenant of the LNR army) once said that McGregor must be working for the CIA and trying to sow despair in the Russian public opinion with his constant optimistic predictions that never come true. I don't believe that but such is the disconnect between his analyses and the reality on the ground.

    Russia may still somehow manage to pull some sort of victory, as it has done in past conflicts, but the catastrophic failure of its special military operation in its first 11 months is not even open to debate. Empirical facts accepted by all sides speak for themselves. That's why I've come to put McGregor in the same category as Qanon or Alex Jones, even though I used to like the guy when he just called for good relations with Russia before the war started.

    Replies: @Sean

    , @Sean
    @Ron Unz


    Well, I think pretty much all the QAnon people were just random, often anonymous nuts on Social Media
     
    Frank Cali, acting boss of the Gambino crime family, was targeted and murdered by a devotee of QAnon.

    Deciding who actually won a war seems about the most objective thing in the world. So Macgregor and a few other people say one thing, while our entire MSM and most of the commenters here say the other. I think we’ll know soon enough who was actually right and who was wrong
     
    Russia is going slowly and so is the US; neither one wants to panic the other. As for Ukraine it is getting wrecked, and I think it is already clear that Zelensky (the most inexperienced person ever to lead a country), greatly underestimated just how far Putin was willing to go.

    It remains to be seen who will 'win (relatively speaking), because Russia's initial objectives are now unattainable, but the expectation that the West can roll back the Russian occupied territory to have an intact pre 2014 Ukraine is unreasonable; unless it is thought the US would deliberately put Putin in a situation where nuclear weapon use on the Ukrainian army would be a temptation.
  610. @songbird
    @Yahya

    What were Egyptians doing when Göbekli Tepe was built?

    Replies: @Yahya, @Emil Nikola Richard

    • Thanks: songbird
  611. @Ron Unz
    @Mikel


    They’re possibly not as strong as the claims of Qanon, Alex Jones or the Truth Jihadist, but after 11 months of watching the Russian military performance, primarily through Russian sources, they do evoke the same kind of mental unsoundness.
     
    Well, I think pretty much all the QAnon people were just random, often anonymous nuts on Social Media and the rest of the Internet. Meanwhile, someone like Col. Macgregor is a very highly-regarded mainstream military expert, with all sorts of high-level contacts across NATO and the military establishment.

    I'm not a military expert and I don't have those contacts, so I can't really say whether he's right or wrong. But frankly, I'd put his opinion above those random Russian activists you and others mention who have been chattering away on Telegram.

    It seems to me that if Macgregor had started to conclude that what he's been saying over the last few months had been mistaken, he'd pull back and stop doing interviews, hoping that after six months or a year, people would forget his incorrect assessments. Instead, he's going full-steam ahead, leading me to believe that he still is firmly convinced he's right.

    Deciding who actually won a war seems about the most objective thing in the world. So Macgregor and a few other people say one thing, while our entire MSM and most of the commenters here say the other. I think we'll know soon enough who was actually right and who was wrong.

    Replies: @Mikel, @Sean

    I think we’ll know soon enough who was actually right and who was wrong.

    I remember you saying the same thing on this very blog some months ago when McGregor was also predicting a quick Russian victory. What we actually saw was a calamitous Russian retreat instead, including from regions they had just declared part of Russia.

    Some of the “chattering random Russian activists” that I have been following are the former host of this blog and several participants in Putin’s SMO, including Russian Colonel Girkin, who has the same rank as McGregor but is much better acquainted with the situation in Ukraine, having been the commander of the pro-Russian forces in Donbas in 2014 and having taken part in the current hostilities as a volunteer. They strongly disagree with McGregor, even though you might remember that in the first months of the war Karlin used to come here to warn us about the “shock and disbelief” that we would soon experience. He now keeps comparing Putin and his entourage to monkeys in his Twitter account.

    One of the participants in the SMO that I’ve been following (not sure if it was Strelkov or Murza, a lieutenant of the LNR army) once said that McGregor must be working for the CIA and trying to sow despair in the Russian public opinion with his constant optimistic predictions that never come true. I don’t believe that but such is the disconnect between his analyses and the reality on the ground.

    Russia may still somehow manage to pull some sort of victory, as it has done in past conflicts, but the catastrophic failure of its special military operation in its first 11 months is not even open to debate. Empirical facts accepted by all sides speak for themselves. That’s why I’ve come to put McGregor in the same category as Qanon or Alex Jones, even though I used to like the guy when he just called for good relations with Russia before the war started.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Mikel

    Girkin as been protected for his heroic role in 2014 by orders from Putin. Girkin is the only one of the orginal rebel commander still alive the others were all assassinated by the GRU. The Kremlin's attitude to Girkin is changing. Antway re-enactor Girkin is a romantic. The reality is service in the Russia army was traditionally regarded as a death sentence. The WW2 Soviet drove their own civilians through minefields to clear them


    Russia may still somehow manage to pull some sort of victory, as it has done in past conflicts, but the catastrophic failure of its special military operation in its first 11 months is not even open to debate
     
    Perhaps one ought to remember that the Russians are the great exponents of scorched earth and even burning down their own capital (which was done by criminals released from prison for that purpose), in preference to capitulating.

    General (ret.) Vad, a former top level military advisor to Merkel thinks that the West's (Us's) open ended supply of replacements for what old Soviet era arms are being used up by Ukraine is putting Putin on a clear path to facing an unbeatable Western equipped Ukrainian army, and the temptation to resort to nuclear weapons use. Macgregor actually says he thinks nuclear weapons will be used in the interview Ron posted.

    Replies: @sudden death

  612. @Ron Unz
    @Mikel


    They’re possibly not as strong as the claims of Qanon, Alex Jones or the Truth Jihadist, but after 11 months of watching the Russian military performance, primarily through Russian sources, they do evoke the same kind of mental unsoundness.
     
    Well, I think pretty much all the QAnon people were just random, often anonymous nuts on Social Media and the rest of the Internet. Meanwhile, someone like Col. Macgregor is a very highly-regarded mainstream military expert, with all sorts of high-level contacts across NATO and the military establishment.

    I'm not a military expert and I don't have those contacts, so I can't really say whether he's right or wrong. But frankly, I'd put his opinion above those random Russian activists you and others mention who have been chattering away on Telegram.

    It seems to me that if Macgregor had started to conclude that what he's been saying over the last few months had been mistaken, he'd pull back and stop doing interviews, hoping that after six months or a year, people would forget his incorrect assessments. Instead, he's going full-steam ahead, leading me to believe that he still is firmly convinced he's right.

    Deciding who actually won a war seems about the most objective thing in the world. So Macgregor and a few other people say one thing, while our entire MSM and most of the commenters here say the other. I think we'll know soon enough who was actually right and who was wrong.

    Replies: @Mikel, @Sean

    Well, I think pretty much all the QAnon people were just random, often anonymous nuts on Social Media

    Frank Cali, acting boss of the Gambino crime family, was targeted and murdered by a devotee of QAnon.

    Deciding who actually won a war seems about the most objective thing in the world. So Macgregor and a few other people say one thing, while our entire MSM and most of the commenters here say the other. I think we’ll know soon enough who was actually right and who was wrong

    Russia is going slowly and so is the US; neither one wants to panic the other. As for Ukraine it is getting wrecked, and I think it is already clear that Zelensky (the most inexperienced person ever to lead a country), greatly underestimated just how far Putin was willing to go.

    It remains to be seen who will ‘win (relatively speaking), because Russia’s initial objectives are now unattainable, but the expectation that the West can roll back the Russian occupied territory to have an intact pre 2014 Ukraine is unreasonable; unless it is thought the US would deliberately put Putin in a situation where nuclear weapon use on the Ukrainian army would be a temptation.

  613. @songbird
    @Mr. Hack

    I don't think that it is a controversial take to say that Ukraine is being propped up, and its ability to make war has been decoupled from its natural economy, thus greatly prolonging its ability to fight and the length of the war.

    Furthermore, I don't believe its leadership is more perfect than our own. I think people in the elite are skimming and making deals for influence and gaining celebrity. Why would they want to end the war for some simple metric like number of dead, or suffering of its people?

    This is the same country that had a firm where Biden's drug-addled son was some well-paid exec, even the MSM acknowledges that.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    No, I wouldn’t count it as controversial to point out that Ukraine is being “propped up” with western guns and ammo. Funds to help out with humanitarian needs too. If you’re insinuating that the current leadership is involved in skimming funds to line its own pockets, then I think you would need to provide some some sort of proof that this sort of activity is taking place in order to make it believable. If all you’re saying is that the current crop of politicians are only jockeying for “influence and celebrity” I would say, what else is new under the sun? You made it sound like (at least to me) that Zelensky and his close adivsors are being paid somehow in under the table payoffs to keep the war going on.

    Where’s the beef?

    Biden’s son’s payoffs for access were during Yanukovych’s tenure, and we can see how that all ended up.

  614. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    It would be interesting if he could present anything tangible as to the veracity of the casualty numbers that he proposes.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @LatW

    I am not convinced the number of casualties is all that immediately crucial although it will be a short to medium term advantage. Ukraine is not a small country and its materiel losses are going to be gains in the long term as superiors Western arms become the majority of the Ukrainian arsenal. Russia does have far more artillery (x 10 approx). The losses on the Ukrainian side must be higher since the pull back from Kiev. Milley said both sides have suffered 100K casualties, of which many recent Russian casualties are Wagner ex-cons who deaths are a saving to the Russian taxpayer and at least in part taking also the place of ordinary sons, father and husbands. I think Magregor is right that Russia has an definite advantage at present, but whether it will be able to press it home in a timely fashion remains to be seen,

  615. @Mikel
    @Ron Unz


    I think we’ll know soon enough who was actually right and who was wrong.
     
    I remember you saying the same thing on this very blog some months ago when McGregor was also predicting a quick Russian victory. What we actually saw was a calamitous Russian retreat instead, including from regions they had just declared part of Russia.

    Some of the "chattering random Russian activists" that I have been following are the former host of this blog and several participants in Putin's SMO, including Russian Colonel Girkin, who has the same rank as McGregor but is much better acquainted with the situation in Ukraine, having been the commander of the pro-Russian forces in Donbas in 2014 and having taken part in the current hostilities as a volunteer. They strongly disagree with McGregor, even though you might remember that in the first months of the war Karlin used to come here to warn us about the "shock and disbelief" that we would soon experience. He now keeps comparing Putin and his entourage to monkeys in his Twitter account.

    One of the participants in the SMO that I've been following (not sure if it was Strelkov or Murza, a lieutenant of the LNR army) once said that McGregor must be working for the CIA and trying to sow despair in the Russian public opinion with his constant optimistic predictions that never come true. I don't believe that but such is the disconnect between his analyses and the reality on the ground.

    Russia may still somehow manage to pull some sort of victory, as it has done in past conflicts, but the catastrophic failure of its special military operation in its first 11 months is not even open to debate. Empirical facts accepted by all sides speak for themselves. That's why I've come to put McGregor in the same category as Qanon or Alex Jones, even though I used to like the guy when he just called for good relations with Russia before the war started.

    Replies: @Sean

    Girkin as been protected for his heroic role in 2014 by orders from Putin. Girkin is the only one of the orginal rebel commander still alive the others were all assassinated by the GRU. The Kremlin’s attitude to Girkin is changing. Antway re-enactor Girkin is a romantic. The reality is service in the Russia army was traditionally regarded as a death sentence. The WW2 Soviet drove their own civilians through minefields to clear them

    Russia may still somehow manage to pull some sort of victory, as it has done in past conflicts, but the catastrophic failure of its special military operation in its first 11 months is not even open to debate

    Perhaps one ought to remember that the Russians are the great exponents of scorched earth and even burning down their own capital (which was done by criminals released from prison for that purpose), in preference to capitulating.

    General (ret.) Vad, a former top level military advisor to Merkel thinks that the West’s (Us’s) open ended supply of replacements for what old Soviet era arms are being used up by Ukraine is putting Putin on a clear path to facing an unbeatable Western equipped Ukrainian army, and the temptation to resort to nuclear weapons use. Macgregor actually says he thinks nuclear weapons will be used in the interview Ron posted.

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @Sean


    even burning down their own capital
     
    Moscow was not the capital in 1812.
  616. @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP

    Well, Slavs are R1a too; half of male Poland is R1a.

    It looks like you are a Scandi/Varangian. Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then. The fact that your ancestor came from the area possibly associated with them does not make you automatically a Wend since they were finally conquered; you could come from conquerors of Wends, not Wends themselves.

    Anyway, it is the first time I hear that some subclade R1a is associated with Wends; that is a tall order anyway since archaeology did not definitely "find" Wends, there are several hypotheses who they were. My favourite one says that they were Celtic people living in the area of Great Poland (Wielkopolska) and Pomerania before Slavs (Lechites etc). It somehow corresponds with the legend of Wineta, the great Vendish emporium, which was to be destroyed by Northmen.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vineta

    Anyway, the people who were obsessed with Wends were not Poles, but Germans, who, as I remember from reading some book on German chronicles, especially lusted after Wendish women, who were to be lustful and voluptuous. This element, however, is not present in "Lila Weneda" where Wends are peaceful, artistic types, so that even Lechites king "Lech" does not want to attack them but his Nordic wife, Gwinona, threatens him with leaving him and thus breaking alliance with Norse, if he does not attack Wends (well, maybe she was jealous of these Wendish women).
    So at least the play preserves the German/Nordic obsessive concern with Wends.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @AP, @Ivashka the fool

    It looks like you are a Scandi/Varangian. Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then

    Whatever algorithm the company (or its volunteers) used determined that my patrilineal subclade was an R1a associated with Wends. The distribution pattern matched historical areas associated with Varangian settlement.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP

    Did the company use the very name "Wends"...? Or it is your interpretation...?

    Replies: @AP

    , @LatW
    @AP


    Whatever algorithm the company (or its volunteers) used determined that my patrilineal subclade was an R1a associated with Wends.
     
    The company that you did the test with, they had an ethnic category called "Wends"? Or did it just show the markers and the region?

    Replies: @AP

  617. Sounds like the NATO proxy forces are crumbling now, Zaporozhye front, Soeldar taken very quickly, Dima of Military Summary was saying Soledar would take a month, Bakhmut looking like it is on the verge of encirclement.

    Interesting tidbit.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @LondonBob


    Zaporozhye front
     
    https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1616522490037129218
  618. @AP
    @Another Polish Perspective


    It looks like you are a Scandi/Varangian. Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then
     
    Whatever algorithm the company (or its volunteers) used determined that my patrilineal subclade was an R1a associated with Wends. The distribution pattern matched historical areas associated with Varangian settlement.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @LatW

    Did the company use the very name “Wends”…? Or it is your interpretation…?

    • Replies: @AP
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Yes, they used Wends.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  619. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Mr. Hack

    Strange indeed. It looks like someone wanted to equate swastika with cross since they TOGETHER build a circle. It is interesting also that the symbols of circle (swastika and cross within circle) create themselves circle: the part is like the whole. It almost looks like some kind of pagan input. Nothing like that in Poland, maybe there is some peculiar Orthodox tradition behind it...

    Do you have a full photo? What is in the centre?

    If there were zodiacal animals associated with evangelists nearby, you could say it represents the cosmic image from Revelation 4:6-7.

    6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind.
    7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    I dug around a little bit more and was able to locate a twitter thread that included some more information about the swastika symbol found within several Eastern churches. The feed author calls them “yargs” I think?…The imagery seems to be indeed related to cross imagery, however, I don’t know the exact meaning of it all:

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ep5Qz6-W8AI-lEo?format=jpg&name=360×360

    https://twitter.com/EternalYarila/status/1341600396339535872

  620. @AnonfromTN
    @LatW

    Why argue about Arestovych now? The craziest Ukies put him on the “Mirotvorets” site. So, as far as Nazis are concerned, his goose is cooked. Considering his record, he won’t emerge in reformatted Ukraine, either.

    Replies: @LondonBob

    Arestovich sees the writing on the wall, wasn’t he a protege of Dugin’s once?

    Crikey!

    [MORE]

  621. @AP
    @Another Polish Perspective


    It looks like you are a Scandi/Varangian. Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then
     
    Whatever algorithm the company (or its volunteers) used determined that my patrilineal subclade was an R1a associated with Wends. The distribution pattern matched historical areas associated with Varangian settlement.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @LatW

    Whatever algorithm the company (or its volunteers) used determined that my patrilineal subclade was an R1a associated with Wends.

    The company that you did the test with, they had an ethnic category called “Wends”? Or did it just show the markers and the region?

    • Replies: @AP
    @LatW

    No, it was written under the detailed subclade by perhaps some volunteers who were into R1a research.

  622. @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP

    Did the company use the very name "Wends"...? Or it is your interpretation...?

    Replies: @AP

    Yes, they used Wends.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP

    Amazing. It looks like when you have your company, you can foster your favourite partisan theories. In other words, private science. In which year did you make your test?
    And according to this company, where and when did Wends live...?

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  623. Ivashka is disappointed in my decision to identify as a Semite rather than an Aryan.

    I am not. To each his own.

    [MORE]

    Egyptians were not Semitic and neither were they Negroid. They were of a mixed ethnic stock: Afro-asiatic (proto-Berber), mixed with Yamnaya – descended pastoralists and the ancestors of modern day Nilotic populations.

    They saw nomadic Semites and Nubians as inferior. Did you ever look at King Tut’s sandals ? A Semite and a Negro are pictured on them so the young Pharaoh could with his every step trample the enemies of Egypt under his feet

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shasu

    OTOH Aryan people of the Levant interacted with Egyptians as equals :

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hittites

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maathorneferure

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Aryan_superstrate_in_Mitanni

    Central Asian Indo-Iranians conquered BMAC and what was left of the Indus Valley Civilization.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bactria%E2%80%93Margiana_Archaeological_Complex

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indus_Valley_Civilisation

    Those who roamed the Great Steppe developed cavalry warfare, built the Sintashta – Arkaim culture and led both to the Vedic – Aryans and the Avesta – Aryans who have produced the greatest religious teachings of their time.

    https://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-places-asia/sintashta-culture-0016210

    http://www.heritageinstitute.com/zoroastrianism/aryans/airyanavaeja.htm

    https://historypak.com/vedic-aryans-2/

    If you want to learn more about your ancestors, educate yourself.

    https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_R1a_Y-DNA.shtml

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Ivashka the fool

    This reply was addressed to Yahya.

    , @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    Egyptians were not Semitic
     
    I know; that's why I specified that my use of the term "Semitic" was broad; encompassing ancestors of present-day Arabs; even if they didn't speak a Semitic tongue.

    mixed with Yamnaya – descended pastoralists
     
    Ancient Egyptians were Yamnaya admixed? This is news to me.

    https://media.springernature.com/full/springer-static/image/art%3A10.1038%2Fncomms15694/MediaObjects/41467_2017_Article_BFncomms15694_Fig4_HTML.jpg?as=webp

    https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms15694

    Ancient Egyptians were descended from Neolithic Levantine and Iranian farmer populations; with a small print of sub-Saharan DNA. I wrote an in-depth post on this here: https://www.unz.com/isteve/egyptians-angry-at-kevin-hart-for-being-an-afrocentrist/#comment-5729767

    This Tunisian dude on Twitter posts some genotype and phenotype-related topics:

    https://twitter.com/hannibulk/status/1616559701201768462?s=20&t=dd1e5z3Y_r90Oc1A13WECQ

    He is a rare Maghrébin breed - a Christian.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Mr. Hack
    @Ivashka the fool


    Did you ever look at King Tut’s sandals ?
     
    Most haven't but you have. To your reputation for thoroughness I say Bravo, the living embodiment of "punctilious"! :-)

    As you probably remember, I've always been one of your biggest fans here at this site, and really enjoyed all of our conversations in the past. One of the reasons that I admired you was your overall gentle nature and ability to take any criticism in stride. I do notice a pronounced change in your attitude, now that you've returned. You seem somewhat harsher in tone in your interactions with others here. What's up with that? I've always really liked your superior intellect coupled with your image of a humble family man readying himself and his family for a picnic trip somewhere away from it all. Before you and AaronB recently showed up here again, Yahya started to show up here more and more with his interesting comments, like a breath of fresh air. The blog seems livelier again, and I'm glad that you've returned!
  624. @AP
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Yes, they used Wends.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Amazing. It looks like when you have your company, you can foster your favourite partisan theories. In other words, private science. In which year did you make your test?
    And according to this company, where and when did Wends live…?

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    The Germans called the Balto-Slav Wenden and they called Celts Welchen (hence Vlakhs in Russian for Romanians and Welch in UK ).

    How come you are so abysmally ignorant of the Balto-Slav ancient history ?

    They don't teach you guys about ancient Balto-Slav in school ?

    Is it due to the Catholic influence in Poland and the fact that Wends were Pagan till the bitter end ?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends

    https://www.wendishheritage.org.au/research/who-are-the-wends/a-detailed-history/

    https://historicus.media/veneti_sklavini_anti_Svoyi_i_chujie/

    If you have trouble reading the Slav alphabet (Cyrillic) just cut and paste in Google Translate.

    🙂

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @AP

  625. @AP
    @AaronB


    AP was equally if not more categorical and full of himself
     
    I humbly defer to the Church about the meaning of Christ's message. I do not have the incredible arrogance to read some excerpts from what Jesus said according to the Gospels and claim to know better about His message than the very same Church that put together those Gospels.

    The theory of art I’m advancing with regard to Bach is one that will obviously be deeply offensive to ethnic nationalists who desire national consensus and bland uniformity
     
    No, it's just dumbly arrogant.

    You claim that Bach rebelled against Christendom in his art and that his art was fundamentally opposed to it. In a way, you compared Bach to yourself, as a fellow rebel.

    Silvio said it better than I could:

    "A celebration of Jesus is a celebration of the Christian faith, and when that faith is celebrated by an artist [Bach] in the context of a Christian civilization, it is far more plausible that the artist approves of that civilization than disapproves of it, let alone stands in staunch opposition to the totality of it."

    Your response:

    Look at it this way – art is an act of imagination, in other words, it looks beyond the existing and factual to the possible.
     
    Sure.

    Political and social institutions are not built on ideals
     
    Of course they are. Certainly Christendom was. As was Communism, and Nazism. Even capitalism.

    Art and beauty – as acts of that faculty which let’s us soar beyond the existing into the realm of the ideal and possible – are then, clearly, necessarily in tension with actually existing conditions
     
    There is no tension between a Christian society and an art that celebrates Christ, merely because Christian rulers are busy with necessities such as tax collection and buildings roads and walls, n addition to lavishly sponsoring Christian arts and artists such as Bach. If Bach were forced to make furniture rather than compose music he might experience some inner tension, but there is no evidence and no reason to believe that he experienced tension by making Christian music for and within a Christian society, under the patronage of Christian rulers. Particularly tension towards that same Christian society.

    More specifically, the artists I cited, as a matter of concrete fact, created works that celebrate a value system that is in diametric opposition to the existing institutions, based as they are on power relations
     
    According to you personal interpretation, and not that of the Churches and society of Bach's time and place.

    And now the centerpiece of your arrogance:

    It doesn’t even matter if we resurrect Bach and he tells us plainly he did not see the civilization of his day as unjust and was not consciously trying to criticize it – his art embodies a criticism of it, and all that would mean is Bach wasn’t very politically perceptive.
     
    Yes, a non-Christian rando knows and understands better what Bach was about than even Bach himself.

    Great art is always greater than the intentions of it’s creator
     
    But not so great that AaronB hasn't figured out its true nature.

    Vatican and the Cathedrals did not exactly manifest a spirit of humility
     
    They celebrated God in beautiful ways.

    I do indeed contend that the Church from very early on went wrong and represented an illegitimate fusion of power and religion
     
    Indeed, AaronB thinks he knows better about the nature of Christianity than did the Church Fathers from early on. Because he read some Gospels himself.

    ::::::::::::::::::::::

    Incidentally, there was a discussion about virtues among the rich and the poor. I can't speak of the very rich, I only know a small handful of those and it may not be a representative sample. But in our Christian and immediately post-Christian society, the comfortable are more virtuous than the poor. This can be empirically measured.

    For example, divorce rate by profession. It is much lower among people such as engineers or physicians than among laborers:

    https://i.imgur.com/9VHd1ys.png

    Heroin use, more popular among poorer people:

    https://www.cdc.gov/vitalsigns/heroin/infographic.html

    Wealthier people have higher marriage rates and lower divorce rates:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32886585/

    Wealthy people 7 times less likely to grow up and commit violent crimes than poor people in Sweden:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4180846/

    Wealthier people less likely to kill their domestic partners in the USA, even when taking race into account:

    https://scholarworks.uni.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1009&context=ijghhd

    Poor people commit more of every type of crime in Toronto:

    https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/b5ab6df3741649c4bcc0a5fbd9e3b45b

    Both very rich and very poor had higher number of sexual partners:

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32886585/

    Poor people more obese (thus, the sin of gluttony):

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7484407/#:~:text=Socioeconomic%20status%20(SES)%20is%20an,variable%20over%20time%20%5B2%5D.

    Poor adolescents more likely to commit all kinds of sex crimes than rich ones:

    https://heinonline.org/HOL/LandingPage?handle=hein.journals/ijotcc40&div=39&id=&page=

    I am deliberately using rich societies as examples because in such societies even the poor are not desperate. Nobody is starving to death in Sweden or Canada or the USA.

    :::::::::::::::

    I claimed that in a society that reflects Christian values, the more prosperous within that society are more likely to live by Christina virtues, such as not abusing one's body through drug abuse, not killing, getting married, etc. That is, they are less sinful than poor people. With the exception of the richest peoples' tendency to have as many sexual partners as do poor people (but fewer than do the middle classes), the data support that claim.

    Thus, it is correct to claim that the poor and more marginalized are in general more less virtuous and more sinful than the middle and upper classes. Which means that they are in more need of help and correction.

    Replies: @A123, @AaronB, @LatW

    I claimed that in a society that reflects Christian values, the more prosperous within that society are more likely to live by Christina virtues, such as not abusing one’s body through drug abuse, not killing, getting married, etc. That is, they are less sinful than poor people.

    The problem with societies such as the US, that are very stratified at this point (which wasn’t always the case), is that the upper classes have failed in their duty to show a good example to others.

    Traditionally, the upper classes lead by example, but today the upper classes promote questionable values, while they themselves do not follow those in their private lives (knowing full well that they are detrimental to success). Peer pressure is also very important and in more egalitarian societies, such as in Northern Europe, almost everyone is middle class and they follow the general habits of that class so they are able to avoid the negatives.

    So it’s not necessarily always the case that the rich are somehow innately more virtuous because they follow Christian principles more and the poor are moral failures. It’s just that the rich (as well as the upper 5%-20% or so) look out for themselves and at the same time in many cases promote negative (libertine) values for everyone else.

    • Agree: Ivashka the fool
    • Replies: @LatW
    @LatW

    P.s. And for those who do not have the resources (not just financial but also moral class and family backing) and above all self discipline, following these widely promoted libertine values are a recipe for disaster.

    , @AP
    @LatW

    I agree with everything you've written here. One of the negative aspects of AaronB is that he is of a solid upper middle class background who benefited from his family's virtuous behaviors, yet celebrates the sinful behavior of the poor, rather than encouraging them to do better.

    Replies: @AaronB

  626. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    Here’s another data point to look at.

    Russia has been reasonably successful in its last interventions: Syria, Belarus, Kazakhstan.

    The US/West less so: Libya, Hong Kong, Afghanistan.

  627. @LatW
    @AP


    I claimed that in a society that reflects Christian values, the more prosperous within that society are more likely to live by Christina virtues, such as not abusing one’s body through drug abuse, not killing, getting married, etc. That is, they are less sinful than poor people.
     
    The problem with societies such as the US, that are very stratified at this point (which wasn't always the case), is that the upper classes have failed in their duty to show a good example to others.

    Traditionally, the upper classes lead by example, but today the upper classes promote questionable values, while they themselves do not follow those in their private lives (knowing full well that they are detrimental to success). Peer pressure is also very important and in more egalitarian societies, such as in Northern Europe, almost everyone is middle class and they follow the general habits of that class so they are able to avoid the negatives.

    So it's not necessarily always the case that the rich are somehow innately more virtuous because they follow Christian principles more and the poor are moral failures. It's just that the rich (as well as the upper 5%-20% or so) look out for themselves and at the same time in many cases promote negative (libertine) values for everyone else.

    Replies: @LatW, @AP

    P.s. And for those who do not have the resources (not just financial but also moral class and family backing) and above all self discipline, following these widely promoted libertine values are a recipe for disaster.

  628. @LatW
    @AP


    Whatever algorithm the company (or its volunteers) used determined that my patrilineal subclade was an R1a associated with Wends.
     
    The company that you did the test with, they had an ethnic category called "Wends"? Or did it just show the markers and the region?

    Replies: @AP

    No, it was written under the detailed subclade by perhaps some volunteers who were into R1a research.

  629. @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP

    Well, Slavs are R1a too; half of male Poland is R1a.

    It looks like you are a Scandi/Varangian. Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then. The fact that your ancestor came from the area possibly associated with them does not make you automatically a Wend since they were finally conquered; you could come from conquerors of Wends, not Wends themselves.

    Anyway, it is the first time I hear that some subclade R1a is associated with Wends; that is a tall order anyway since archaeology did not definitely "find" Wends, there are several hypotheses who they were. My favourite one says that they were Celtic people living in the area of Great Poland (Wielkopolska) and Pomerania before Slavs (Lechites etc). It somehow corresponds with the legend of Wineta, the great Vendish emporium, which was to be destroyed by Northmen.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vineta

    Anyway, the people who were obsessed with Wends were not Poles, but Germans, who, as I remember from reading some book on German chronicles, especially lusted after Wendish women, who were to be lustful and voluptuous. This element, however, is not present in "Lila Weneda" where Wends are peaceful, artistic types, so that even Lechites king "Lech" does not want to attack them but his Nordic wife, Gwinona, threatens him with leaving him and thus breaking alliance with Norse, if he does not attack Wends (well, maybe she was jealous of these Wendish women).
    So at least the play preserves the German/Nordic obsessive concern with Wends.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @AP, @Ivashka the fool

    Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then.

    No. Wends = Venety = Anty = proto-Slavs then Balto-Slav, then Western Slavs and Balts.

    Celts originated in the area of contact between Indo-European R1a people descended from the Corded Ware Culture and R1b people descended from the Bell Beaker Culture whom might have not spoken an Indo-European language at the time. This region gave birth to the Unetice Culture, which was the cradle of the ancient European religion. From there appeared the Hallstatt and La Tène Celts who spoke ancient Celtic – an Indo-European language. The ancient Celts had a caste system typical of the Indo-European ethnic groups. The warrior elite and priestly class (Druids) ruled upon mostly R1b people, but we have no idea what were the haplogroups of the elite and / or whether all Celts were R1b.

    The Veneti you write about, from whom the name of Venice and of La Vendée originated, controlled the amber trade between the Baltic and the Mediterranean seas and were skilled seafaring people. We have no information on their ethnic background, the fact that they lived in Italo – Celtic-speaking areas doesn’t mean at all that they were of haplogroup R1b.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veneti_(Gaul)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adriatic_Veneti

    Of note, Adriatic Veneti had their own script and their language was Indo-European, but distinct from Celtic.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, there is a theory (academic one, but decidedly not a part of mainstream) that Veneti/Wends tribes lived from Slovenia up to Baltic; this would explain Adriatic Venice and Baltic Veneta on two sides of Europe.

    What is more or less certain is that they existed before the Slavs. This is why I have some doubts concerning Wends being fully Indo-European. The pattern of the stories about them is that they are being conquered by Indo-Europeans, so that would suggest that they may be pre-Indo-Europeans. In "Lilla Weneda" play their attributes are harp and snake, also associated with older pre-Aryan civilizations.

    If, however, Wends were to be Indo-Europeans, there should be some trace of them displacing some other people. But the legends do not reach beyond Wends, as if Wends were the original people of the land. Also, it would mean that Indo-European invasion did not leave a trace in mythology, a conclusion which is hard to accept too.

    Yes, some claim that Unetice is the cradle of Celts. But around unz forums you may meet a guy named Odyssey. He is a pan-Serbian guy who claims that Slavs originated as Serbs in Lepenski Vir; Serbs are therefore primal Slavs. Well, this Unetice culture looks to me more like proto-Celtic but Jedem das Seine, as you like to repeat Buchenwald's motto. Anyway, I am bringing this up to show that if the matter of indigenousness is the matter of choosing your "origin" culture (like making Slavs indigenous to Europe by claiming they come from Lepenski Vir), this completely displaces the real problem of genetic displacement in Europe and Indo-European invasion.
    I wouldn't anyway fully rely on identifications by "cultures" - as I already pointed out above, R1a Hungarians speak non-Indo-European language.

    And the caste system wasn't typical for Indo-Europeans - they were much more egalitarian. The caste system seems to dominate composed societies of Aryan conquerors and non-Aryan conquered (like India) or pure non-Aryan societies like Minoans, which again would follow strict maternal lineages through cousin marriages - that creates many shades of "purity" and thus social stratification.

    https://www.sott.net/article/476337-First-cousin-marriages-frequent-in-Minoan-Crete-ancient-DNA-analysis-reveals

  630. @Ivashka the fool

    Ivashka is disappointed in my decision to identify as a Semite rather than an Aryan.
     
    I am not. To each his own.



    Egyptians were not Semitic and neither were they Negroid. They were of a mixed ethnic stock: Afro-asiatic (proto-Berber), mixed with Yamnaya - descended pastoralists and the ancestors of modern day Nilotic populations.

    They saw nomadic Semites and Nubians as inferior. Did you ever look at King Tut's sandals ? A Semite and a Negro are pictured on them so the young Pharaoh could with his every step trample the enemies of Egypt under his feet

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shasu

    https://preview.redd.it/xjd5aboiiu971.jpg?auto=webp&s=4c56eb909e6ae1f0545967b2e4317ff7b585450c

    OTOH Aryan people of the Levant interacted with Egyptians as equals :

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hittites

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maathorneferure

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Aryan_superstrate_in_Mitanni

    Central Asian Indo-Iranians conquered BMAC and what was left of the Indus Valley Civilization.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bactria%E2%80%93Margiana_Archaeological_Complex

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indus_Valley_Civilisation

    Those who roamed the Great Steppe developed cavalry warfare, built the Sintashta - Arkaim culture and led both to the Vedic - Aryans and the Avesta - Aryans who have produced the greatest religious teachings of their time.

    https://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-places-asia/sintashta-culture-0016210

    http://www.heritageinstitute.com/zoroastrianism/aryans/airyanavaeja.htm

    https://historypak.com/vedic-aryans-2/

    If you want to learn more about your ancestors, educate yourself.

    https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_R1a_Y-DNA.shtml

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Yahya, @Mr. Hack

    This reply was addressed to Yahya.

  631. @Sean
    @Mikel

    Girkin as been protected for his heroic role in 2014 by orders from Putin. Girkin is the only one of the orginal rebel commander still alive the others were all assassinated by the GRU. The Kremlin's attitude to Girkin is changing. Antway re-enactor Girkin is a romantic. The reality is service in the Russia army was traditionally regarded as a death sentence. The WW2 Soviet drove their own civilians through minefields to clear them


    Russia may still somehow manage to pull some sort of victory, as it has done in past conflicts, but the catastrophic failure of its special military operation in its first 11 months is not even open to debate
     
    Perhaps one ought to remember that the Russians are the great exponents of scorched earth and even burning down their own capital (which was done by criminals released from prison for that purpose), in preference to capitulating.

    General (ret.) Vad, a former top level military advisor to Merkel thinks that the West's (Us's) open ended supply of replacements for what old Soviet era arms are being used up by Ukraine is putting Putin on a clear path to facing an unbeatable Western equipped Ukrainian army, and the temptation to resort to nuclear weapons use. Macgregor actually says he thinks nuclear weapons will be used in the interview Ron posted.

    Replies: @sudden death

    even burning down their own capital

    Moscow was not the capital in 1812.

  632. @LatW
    @Ron Unz

    It would be interesting if he could present anything tangible as to the veracity of the casualty numbers that he proposes.

    Replies: @Sean

    I am not convinced the number of casualties is all that immediately crucial although it will be a short to medium term advantage. Ukraine is not a small country and its materiel losses are going to be gains in the long term as superiors Western arms become the majority of the Ukrainian arsenal. Russia does have far more artillery (x 10 approx). The losses on the Ukrainian side must be higher since the pull back from Kiev. Milley said both sides have suffered 100K casualties, of which many recent Russian casualties are Wagner ex-cons who deaths are a saving to the Russian taxpayer and at least in part taking also the place of ordinary sons, father and husbands. I think Magregor is right that Russia has an definite advantage at present, but whether it will be able to press it home in a timely fashion remains to be seen,

  633. @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP

    Amazing. It looks like when you have your company, you can foster your favourite partisan theories. In other words, private science. In which year did you make your test?
    And according to this company, where and when did Wends live...?

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    The Germans called the Balto-Slav Wenden and they called Celts Welchen (hence Vlakhs in Russian for Romanians and Welch in UK ).

    How come you are so abysmally ignorant of the Balto-Slav ancient history ?

    They don’t teach you guys about ancient Balto-Slav in school ?

    Is it due to the Catholic influence in Poland and the fact that Wends were Pagan till the bitter end ?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends

    https://www.wendishheritage.org.au/research/who-are-the-wends/a-detailed-history/

    https://historicus.media/veneti_sklavini_anti_Svoyi_i_chujie/

    If you have trouble reading the Slav alphabet (Cyrillic) just cut and paste in Google Translate.

    🙂

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    The Germans called the Balto-Slav Wenden and rhey called Celts Welchen (hence Vlakhs in Russian for Romanians and Welch in UK ).

    How come you are so abysmally ignorant of the Balto-Slav ancient history ?
     

    I am not sure whether we talk about the same people; I meant people who lived in Western-North Poland before Lechites, so to say. Germans could very well call Obotrites "Wends" but this is not Kabbalah - name alone does not decide everything.

    They don’t teach you guys about ancient Balto-Slav in school ?
     
    No, they don't.

    Is it due to the Catholic influence in Poland and the fact that Wends were Pagan till the bitter end ?

     

    In fact, we like Obotrites in Poland - they did fight Germans, after all ;)
    Why are Russians always so obsessed with Polish Catholicism?! Poles are not (or minimally) obsessed with Russian Orthodoxy.

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @AP
    @Ivashka the fool

    I don't want to identify the specific subclade, but it was downstream of Z92. Apparently the Pushkin family and mine shared a common paternal ancestor around 50 AD (according to the test of a distant cousin descended from Gregory Morhinin (Pushka), founder of the Pushkin family).

    What do you know of Z92?

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  634. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Wends are a bit mysterious identity, probably Celtic one; they should be R1b then.
     
    No. Wends = Venety = Anty = proto-Slavs then Balto-Slav, then Western Slavs and Balts.

    Celts originated in the area of contact between Indo-European R1a people descended from the Corded Ware Culture and R1b people descended from the Bell Beaker Culture whom might have not spoken an Indo-European language at the time. This region gave birth to the Unetice Culture, which was the cradle of the ancient European religion. From there appeared the Hallstatt and La Tène Celts who spoke ancient Celtic - an Indo-European language. The ancient Celts had a caste system typical of the Indo-European ethnic groups. The warrior elite and priestly class (Druids) ruled upon mostly R1b people, but we have no idea what were the haplogroups of the elite and / or whether all Celts were R1b.

    The Veneti you write about, from whom the name of Venice and of La Vendée originated, controlled the amber trade between the Baltic and the Mediterranean seas and were skilled seafaring people. We have no information on their ethnic background, the fact that they lived in Italo - Celtic-speaking areas doesn't mean at all that they were of haplogroup R1b.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veneti_(Gaul)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adriatic_Veneti

    Of note, Adriatic Veneti had their own script and their language was Indo-European, but distinct from Celtic.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Well, there is a theory (academic one, but decidedly not a part of mainstream) that Veneti/Wends tribes lived from Slovenia up to Baltic; this would explain Adriatic Venice and Baltic Veneta on two sides of Europe.

    What is more or less certain is that they existed before the Slavs. This is why I have some doubts concerning Wends being fully Indo-European. The pattern of the stories about them is that they are being conquered by Indo-Europeans, so that would suggest that they may be pre-Indo-Europeans. In “Lilla Weneda” play their attributes are harp and snake, also associated with older pre-Aryan civilizations.

    If, however, Wends were to be Indo-Europeans, there should be some trace of them displacing some other people. But the legends do not reach beyond Wends, as if Wends were the original people of the land. Also, it would mean that Indo-European invasion did not leave a trace in mythology, a conclusion which is hard to accept too.

    Yes, some claim that Unetice is the cradle of Celts. But around unz forums you may meet a guy named Odyssey. He is a pan-Serbian guy who claims that Slavs originated as Serbs in Lepenski Vir; Serbs are therefore primal Slavs. Well, this Unetice culture looks to me more like proto-Celtic but Jedem das Seine, as you like to repeat Buchenwald’s motto. Anyway, I am bringing this up to show that if the matter of indigenousness is the matter of choosing your “origin” culture (like making Slavs indigenous to Europe by claiming they come from Lepenski Vir), this completely displaces the real problem of genetic displacement in Europe and Indo-European invasion.
    I wouldn’t anyway fully rely on identifications by “cultures” – as I already pointed out above, R1a Hungarians speak non-Indo-European language.

    And the caste system wasn’t typical for Indo-Europeans – they were much more egalitarian. The caste system seems to dominate composed societies of Aryan conquerors and non-Aryan conquered (like India) or pure non-Aryan societies like Minoans, which again would follow strict maternal lineages through cousin marriages – that creates many shades of “purity” and thus social stratification.

    https://www.sott.net/article/476337-First-cousin-marriages-frequent-in-Minoan-Crete-ancient-DNA-analysis-reveals

  635. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    MacGregor is the minority report of the Pentagon.

    What were the casualties of the first 12 months in the WWI on the western front?

  636. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    The Germans called the Balto-Slav Wenden and they called Celts Welchen (hence Vlakhs in Russian for Romanians and Welch in UK ).

    How come you are so abysmally ignorant of the Balto-Slav ancient history ?

    They don't teach you guys about ancient Balto-Slav in school ?

    Is it due to the Catholic influence in Poland and the fact that Wends were Pagan till the bitter end ?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends

    https://www.wendishheritage.org.au/research/who-are-the-wends/a-detailed-history/

    https://historicus.media/veneti_sklavini_anti_Svoyi_i_chujie/

    If you have trouble reading the Slav alphabet (Cyrillic) just cut and paste in Google Translate.

    🙂

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @AP

    The Germans called the Balto-Slav Wenden and rhey called Celts Welchen (hence Vlakhs in Russian for Romanians and Welch in UK ).

    How come you are so abysmally ignorant of the Balto-Slav ancient history ?

    I am not sure whether we talk about the same people; I meant people who lived in Western-North Poland before Lechites, so to say. Germans could very well call Obotrites “Wends” but this is not Kabbalah – name alone does not decide everything.

    They don’t teach you guys about ancient Balto-Slav in school ?

    No, they don’t.

    Is it due to the Catholic influence in Poland and the fact that Wends were Pagan till the bitter end ?

    In fact, we like Obotrites in Poland – they did fight Germans, after all 😉
    Why are Russians always so obsessed with Polish Catholicism?! Poles are not (or minimally) obsessed with Russian Orthodoxy.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Why are Russians always so obsessed with Polish Catholicism?! Poles are not (or minimally) obsessed with Russian Orthodoxy.
     
    There was a Russian commentor ("Gerard") around here who used to trash on Poles every two comments; even when the topic was unrelated. In the world cup he urged everyone to support Saudi Arabia against "Polish swine". I laughed for a good minute from that.

    I watched the first two Dekalog episodes. You were right; the series is better than Three Colors; the characters resonate more and the pathos is stronger in each episode, despite the length being shorter than a movie.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  637. @LatW
    @AP


    I claimed that in a society that reflects Christian values, the more prosperous within that society are more likely to live by Christina virtues, such as not abusing one’s body through drug abuse, not killing, getting married, etc. That is, they are less sinful than poor people.
     
    The problem with societies such as the US, that are very stratified at this point (which wasn't always the case), is that the upper classes have failed in their duty to show a good example to others.

    Traditionally, the upper classes lead by example, but today the upper classes promote questionable values, while they themselves do not follow those in their private lives (knowing full well that they are detrimental to success). Peer pressure is also very important and in more egalitarian societies, such as in Northern Europe, almost everyone is middle class and they follow the general habits of that class so they are able to avoid the negatives.

    So it's not necessarily always the case that the rich are somehow innately more virtuous because they follow Christian principles more and the poor are moral failures. It's just that the rich (as well as the upper 5%-20% or so) look out for themselves and at the same time in many cases promote negative (libertine) values for everyone else.

    Replies: @LatW, @AP

    I agree with everything you’ve written here. One of the negative aspects of AaronB is that he is of a solid upper middle class background who benefited from his family’s virtuous behaviors, yet celebrates the sinful behavior of the poor, rather than encouraging them to do better.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @AP


    One of the negative aspects of AaronB is that he is of a solid upper middle class background who benefited from his family’s virtuous behaviors, yet celebrates the sinful behavior of the poor, rather than encouraging them to do better.
     
    Not that I'm a saint lol, or anywhere near a saint, nor do I aspire to be a saint, but studies have been done that show that over three quarters of medieval saints came from wealthy and privileged backgrounds, and gave it all up for a life of poverty. St Francis of Assisi - one of my favorites - is one vivid example.

    Perhaps, those who have tasted wealth and comfort and power, are better positioned to truly asses it's true value in the economy of human happiness and true satisfaction?

    More in line with my aspirations, in China, it was precisely the elite mandarin intellectuals who lived most of their lives cosseted in comfort and privilege amid the elaborate refinement of the court - beautiful women, wine, silk beds, refined food, books, paintings - who developed a tradition of giving it all up to live "laughing alone in the mountains" as Taoist hermits in simplicity and poverty as old men (when you'd think comfort would be most desirable) and who even while in court nurtured a Taoist artistic and philosophic tradition that cherished the wilderness and escape from the artificiality of court and city life, and the burdens of earthly work which are after all ephemeral, in order to contemplate the Infinite and become one with the Tao amid rugged and remote mountain scenes.

    In Hindu society, a tradition developed among the wealthy upper class Brahmins to take up Sanyasin as one got older - shock and horror, AP! to give over management of ones wealthy and complex household to ones eldest son, and go wandering the Himalayas in a loincloth, a dirty and ragged Dharma bum blissfully free from the cares of the world - which are after all ephemeral - and contemplate the Infinite amid snowcapped peaks, towering waterfalls, icy streams and roaring rivers, and the delicious deep pine forests so characteristic of the Himalayas.

    And these were old men, AP, when you'd think comfort and security were most desirable, and one can bask in the dignity, respect, and honor society bestows on the old after a long life spent in it's service, amid plentiful children and grandchildren - but no, they gave all that up to be - mere bums - and society recognized this as laudable!

    Society actually thought there was something more important than this, AP. Perhaps these schemes are more palatable to you because release came after a period of service to the State - after one had "paid ones mite" to the State, as it were - but in fact, opportunities existed for anyone from any class to abandon the only life you recognize as legitimate at any time, and be socially validated.

    I'm ancient Greece and Rome, a whole line of philosophers and poets praised the simple life of poverty - Horace, recognized as the preeminent poet of Rome's Golden Age and a one-time regular at court life, wrote poems celebrating the simple life of poverty and contemplation that later northern European aristocrats found fascinating and infinitely valuable.

    Perhaps all these great men in all these different parts of the world, from different civilizations, saw something in the life of contemplation vs a life of activity that escapes you, AP?

    But I am somewhat more sympathetic to you when you say you do not come from bourgeois stock but had to claw your way into it - perhaps your lineage - to use Bashi's absurd terminology for once - is not yet ready for a life of contemplation but must still slug it out in the dusty fields of the active life, where all is ephemeral.

    And that is ok - we all have our "karmic arc", as it were, and clearly you still have spiritual lessons to learn in a life of action, before you can rise to the perception of it's ephemeral nature and are ready for contemplation of the Infinite.

    But you will :) It's the destiny of the great evolution of humanity. Ultimately God gathers us all back into Himself.

    Replies: @LatW, @AP

  638. @LondonBob
    Sounds like the NATO proxy forces are crumbling now, Zaporozhye front, Soeldar taken very quickly, Dima of Military Summary was saying Soledar would take a month, Bakhmut looking like it is on the verge of encirclement.

    Interesting tidbit.



    https://twitter.com/GeromanAT/status/1616534547553812489?s=20&t=_nPV1rqyNpNaXj-FTRMrMw

    Replies: @sudden death

    Zaporozhye front

  639. @Ivashka the fool

    Ivashka is disappointed in my decision to identify as a Semite rather than an Aryan.
     
    I am not. To each his own.



    Egyptians were not Semitic and neither were they Negroid. They were of a mixed ethnic stock: Afro-asiatic (proto-Berber), mixed with Yamnaya - descended pastoralists and the ancestors of modern day Nilotic populations.

    They saw nomadic Semites and Nubians as inferior. Did you ever look at King Tut's sandals ? A Semite and a Negro are pictured on them so the young Pharaoh could with his every step trample the enemies of Egypt under his feet

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shasu

    https://preview.redd.it/xjd5aboiiu971.jpg?auto=webp&s=4c56eb909e6ae1f0545967b2e4317ff7b585450c

    OTOH Aryan people of the Levant interacted with Egyptians as equals :

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hittites

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maathorneferure

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Aryan_superstrate_in_Mitanni

    Central Asian Indo-Iranians conquered BMAC and what was left of the Indus Valley Civilization.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bactria%E2%80%93Margiana_Archaeological_Complex

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indus_Valley_Civilisation

    Those who roamed the Great Steppe developed cavalry warfare, built the Sintashta - Arkaim culture and led both to the Vedic - Aryans and the Avesta - Aryans who have produced the greatest religious teachings of their time.

    https://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-places-asia/sintashta-culture-0016210

    http://www.heritageinstitute.com/zoroastrianism/aryans/airyanavaeja.htm

    https://historypak.com/vedic-aryans-2/

    If you want to learn more about your ancestors, educate yourself.

    https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_R1a_Y-DNA.shtml

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Yahya, @Mr. Hack

    Egyptians were not Semitic

    I know; that’s why I specified that my use of the term “Semitic” was broad; encompassing ancestors of present-day Arabs; even if they didn’t speak a Semitic tongue.

    mixed with Yamnaya – descended pastoralists

    Ancient Egyptians were Yamnaya admixed? This is news to me.

    https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms15694

    Ancient Egyptians were descended from Neolithic Levantine and Iranian farmer populations; with a small print of sub-Saharan DNA. I wrote an in-depth post on this here: https://www.unz.com/isteve/egyptians-angry-at-kevin-hart-for-being-an-afrocentrist/#comment-5729767

    [MORE]

    This Tunisian dude on Twitter posts some genotype and phenotype-related topics:

    https://twitter.com/hannibulk/status/1616559701201768462?s=20&t=dd1e5z3Y_r90Oc1A13WECQ

    He is a rare Maghrébin breed – a Christian.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    I disregard admixture and only care about the haplogroups. Admixture is variable, haplogroups are not. The Sub-Saharan admixture you wrote about is the one found today in the Hausa pastoralists and the Nilotic people. The Hausa are largely of Y haplogroup R1a, just like Yamnaya were. Some Yamnaya moved accross Caucasus, then south into Anatolia, the Fertile Crescent and into Egypt and then North Africa. They intermixed with local Negroid populations along the way. Some probably asmixed more, other less. The proto-Bell Beaker folks that suddenly surfaced around Gibraltar and moved into Portugal and Extremadura from where the conquered Western Europe and genocided and/or assimilated its native ethnic groups were swarthy, and had Negroid traits but weren't Black. Probably some northern offshoot of the same population that adapted to a maritime subsistence. See the article about the Bronze Age Scottish Bell Beaker lady that has been phenotyped and reconstructed and that presents a Mediterranean phenotype that would not at all be surprising in a modern day Moroccan.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achavanich_Beaker_Burial


    However, in 2017, Inigo Olalde from the Reich Laboratory at Harvard Medical School discovered, based on her ancient DNA, that Ava in actuality had very different coloring, most likely with black hair, brown eyes and tanned skin.[9][10]
     

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  640. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    The Germans called the Balto-Slav Wenden and rhey called Celts Welchen (hence Vlakhs in Russian for Romanians and Welch in UK ).

    How come you are so abysmally ignorant of the Balto-Slav ancient history ?
     

    I am not sure whether we talk about the same people; I meant people who lived in Western-North Poland before Lechites, so to say. Germans could very well call Obotrites "Wends" but this is not Kabbalah - name alone does not decide everything.

    They don’t teach you guys about ancient Balto-Slav in school ?
     
    No, they don't.

    Is it due to the Catholic influence in Poland and the fact that Wends were Pagan till the bitter end ?

     

    In fact, we like Obotrites in Poland - they did fight Germans, after all ;)
    Why are Russians always so obsessed with Polish Catholicism?! Poles are not (or minimally) obsessed with Russian Orthodoxy.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Why are Russians always so obsessed with Polish Catholicism?! Poles are not (or minimally) obsessed with Russian Orthodoxy.

    There was a Russian commentor (“Gerard”) around here who used to trash on Poles every two comments; even when the topic was unrelated. In the world cup he urged everyone to support Saudi Arabia against “Polish swine”. I laughed for a good minute from that.

    I watched the first two Dekalog episodes. You were right; the series is better than Three Colors; the characters resonate more and the pathos is stronger in each episode, despite the length being shorter than a movie.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    I am sometimes surprised how strong hatred Poland can sometimes arise in people (moreover, often having nothing to do with Poland); it is almost as if Poles were Jews...

    "Dekalog" was made as TV series; this is why its episodes aren't too long. However,
    "A Short Film about Killing" also had its cinematic version: it was the first Kieslowski movie which was noticed in the West.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Yahya

  641. @Ivashka the fool

    Ivashka is disappointed in my decision to identify as a Semite rather than an Aryan.
     
    I am not. To each his own.



    Egyptians were not Semitic and neither were they Negroid. They were of a mixed ethnic stock: Afro-asiatic (proto-Berber), mixed with Yamnaya - descended pastoralists and the ancestors of modern day Nilotic populations.

    They saw nomadic Semites and Nubians as inferior. Did you ever look at King Tut's sandals ? A Semite and a Negro are pictured on them so the young Pharaoh could with his every step trample the enemies of Egypt under his feet

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shasu

    https://preview.redd.it/xjd5aboiiu971.jpg?auto=webp&s=4c56eb909e6ae1f0545967b2e4317ff7b585450c

    OTOH Aryan people of the Levant interacted with Egyptians as equals :

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hittites

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maathorneferure

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Aryan_superstrate_in_Mitanni

    Central Asian Indo-Iranians conquered BMAC and what was left of the Indus Valley Civilization.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bactria%E2%80%93Margiana_Archaeological_Complex

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indus_Valley_Civilisation

    Those who roamed the Great Steppe developed cavalry warfare, built the Sintashta - Arkaim culture and led both to the Vedic - Aryans and the Avesta - Aryans who have produced the greatest religious teachings of their time.

    https://www.ancient-origins.net/ancient-places-asia/sintashta-culture-0016210

    http://www.heritageinstitute.com/zoroastrianism/aryans/airyanavaeja.htm

    https://historypak.com/vedic-aryans-2/

    If you want to learn more about your ancestors, educate yourself.

    https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_R1a_Y-DNA.shtml

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Yahya, @Mr. Hack

    Did you ever look at King Tut’s sandals ?

    Most haven’t but you have. To your reputation for thoroughness I say Bravo, the living embodiment of “punctilious”! 🙂

    As you probably remember, I’ve always been one of your biggest fans here at this site, and really enjoyed all of our conversations in the past. One of the reasons that I admired you was your overall gentle nature and ability to take any criticism in stride. I do notice a pronounced change in your attitude, now that you’ve returned. You seem somewhat harsher in tone in your interactions with others here. What’s up with that? I’ve always really liked your superior intellect coupled with your image of a humble family man readying himself and his family for a picnic trip somewhere away from it all. Before you and AaronB recently showed up here again, Yahya started to show up here more and more with his interesting comments, like a breath of fresh air. The blog seems livelier again, and I’m glad that you’ve returned!

    • Agree: Yahya
  642. @songbird
    @Yahya

    Possibly, the annual floods were a negative before they became a positive.


    When my Indo-Iranian ancestors were roaming around the steppes and forests of Eurasia in unaccomplished ways
     
    Well, we are going into geo-determinsim again, but I contend PIE were domesticating the horse and possibly inventing the wheel, or at least axled vehicles.

    Definitely not minor things, when you consider their impact. Especially, after the horse plow was invented, or even just thinking how engines were first defined in horse power.

    Replies: @Yahya

    but I contend PIE were domesticating the horse and possibly inventing the wheel, or at least axled vehicles.

    The wheel was invented in Mesopotamia first; around 4200-4000 BC. It was also used, and possibly invented independently, in India and China. Indo-Europeans were first to domesticate the horse.

    Herodotus summed it up best: “Egypt is the gift of the Nile”. It was also a gift of Mesopotamia; having learnt the basic rudiments of writing, agriculture, architecture and metallurgy from the Mesopotamians. The Mesopotamians were the pioneers of civilization; the ancient Near East was downstream of their accomplishments. Egypt surpassed Iraq/Ur/Babylon by virtue of its ability to unify into a mega-state; which in turn was aided by its population density around the Nile.

    Egyptian elite culture also adopted a range of Mesopotamian imagery, especially artistic motifs to represent complex or difficult concepts, such as the notion of kingship itself (a rosette) or the reconciliation of opposing forces by the ruler (two intertwined beasts).

    The Mesopotamians were the OGs of the Ancient World.

    The Indo-Europeans brought Chariots to Egypt; but that was much later, when Egypt had been a full-fledged civilization for 2,000+ years,

    • Thanks: songbird
    • Replies: @TalhaAtUnz2
    @Yahya

    Sargon the Akkadian is the most chad name for an imperial founder, prove me wrong.

    Also, this “Karlin Community” seems to be quite devoid of...any Karlins...🤔

    It’s like how Ronald McDonald is nowhere to be found around McDonald’s. Bizarre turn of events, this.

    Wa salaam.

    Not sure why I can’t post under my original moniker.

  643. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    Egyptians were not Semitic
     
    I know; that's why I specified that my use of the term "Semitic" was broad; encompassing ancestors of present-day Arabs; even if they didn't speak a Semitic tongue.

    mixed with Yamnaya – descended pastoralists
     
    Ancient Egyptians were Yamnaya admixed? This is news to me.

    https://media.springernature.com/full/springer-static/image/art%3A10.1038%2Fncomms15694/MediaObjects/41467_2017_Article_BFncomms15694_Fig4_HTML.jpg?as=webp

    https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms15694

    Ancient Egyptians were descended from Neolithic Levantine and Iranian farmer populations; with a small print of sub-Saharan DNA. I wrote an in-depth post on this here: https://www.unz.com/isteve/egyptians-angry-at-kevin-hart-for-being-an-afrocentrist/#comment-5729767

    This Tunisian dude on Twitter posts some genotype and phenotype-related topics:

    https://twitter.com/hannibulk/status/1616559701201768462?s=20&t=dd1e5z3Y_r90Oc1A13WECQ

    He is a rare Maghrébin breed - a Christian.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    I disregard admixture and only care about the haplogroups. Admixture is variable, haplogroups are not. The Sub-Saharan admixture you wrote about is the one found today in the Hausa pastoralists and the Nilotic people. The Hausa are largely of Y haplogroup R1a, just like Yamnaya were. Some Yamnaya moved accross Caucasus, then south into Anatolia, the Fertile Crescent and into Egypt and then North Africa. They intermixed with local Negroid populations along the way. Some probably asmixed more, other less. The proto-Bell Beaker folks that suddenly surfaced around Gibraltar and moved into Portugal and Extremadura from where the conquered Western Europe and genocided and/or assimilated its native ethnic groups were swarthy, and had Negroid traits but weren’t Black. Probably some northern offshoot of the same population that adapted to a maritime subsistence. See the article about the Bronze Age Scottish Bell Beaker lady that has been phenotyped and reconstructed and that presents a Mediterranean phenotype that would not at all be surprising in a modern day Moroccan.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achavanich_Beaker_Burial

    However, in 2017, Inigo Olalde from the Reich Laboratory at Harvard Medical School discovered, based on her ancient DNA, that Ava in actuality had very different coloring, most likely with black hair, brown eyes and tanned skin.[9][10]

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Ivashka the fool

    Literally no one is autistic enough to build an identity off haplogroups & admixture charts.
    Cease this wignat nonsense.

    Anyway, Egyptians did not practice Cow Slaughter & neither do Iran/India.
    That is enough.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

  644. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    The Germans called the Balto-Slav Wenden and they called Celts Welchen (hence Vlakhs in Russian for Romanians and Welch in UK ).

    How come you are so abysmally ignorant of the Balto-Slav ancient history ?

    They don't teach you guys about ancient Balto-Slav in school ?

    Is it due to the Catholic influence in Poland and the fact that Wends were Pagan till the bitter end ?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends

    https://www.wendishheritage.org.au/research/who-are-the-wends/a-detailed-history/

    https://historicus.media/veneti_sklavini_anti_Svoyi_i_chujie/

    If you have trouble reading the Slav alphabet (Cyrillic) just cut and paste in Google Translate.

    🙂

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @AP

    I don’t want to identify the specific subclade, but it was downstream of Z92. Apparently the Pushkin family and mine shared a common paternal ancestor around 50 AD (according to the test of a distant cousin descended from Gregory Morhinin (Pushka), founder of the Pushkin family).

    What do you know of Z92?

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @AP

    How many STRs have you explored ?

    Y haplogroup R1a Z92 is probably the oldest among the Balto-Slav haplogroups.



    https://forum.molgen.org/index.php/topic,7667.0.html?PHPSESSID=c877c06695dbf3bd0be3d0cf04053350

    Probably dating back to Tripolye - derived Globular Amphora Culture influenced Corded Ware folks interactions with the pre-Indo-European Narva Culture.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rzucewo_culture

    Congratulations, you are indeed a pure Balto-Slav / Wend. In fact, one of the oldest clades of Indo-European people (I do not include Bell Beaker folks among the Indo-European).

    Forget about the Scandinavian ancestry, it was the other way around. Your ancestors most probably invaded the poor proto-Norse while they moved in as Battle Axe Culture people.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_Axe_culture

    https://bigenc.ru/archeology/text/2131292

    Wonder if some of your ancestors crushed the bones of the Western invaders at the battle of Tollense:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tollense_valley_battlefield

    (Funny how the Bell Beaker descended idiots twist the narrative:

    https://www.ancient-origins.net/news-history-archaeology/europes-oldest-massacre-0014460

    1400 merchants armed to the teeth...

    LOL)

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  645. @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Why are Russians always so obsessed with Polish Catholicism?! Poles are not (or minimally) obsessed with Russian Orthodoxy.
     
    There was a Russian commentor ("Gerard") around here who used to trash on Poles every two comments; even when the topic was unrelated. In the world cup he urged everyone to support Saudi Arabia against "Polish swine". I laughed for a good minute from that.

    I watched the first two Dekalog episodes. You were right; the series is better than Three Colors; the characters resonate more and the pathos is stronger in each episode, despite the length being shorter than a movie.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    I am sometimes surprised how strong hatred Poland can sometimes arise in people (moreover, often having nothing to do with Poland); it is almost as if Poles were Jews…

    “Dekalog” was made as TV series; this is why its episodes aren’t too long. However,
    “A Short Film about Killing” also had its cinematic version: it was the first Kieslowski movie which was noticed in the West.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Where did I hate on Polska ?

    I was just surprised that they do not teach you the prehistory of your people. Of all the Slavs the Poles should be the ones to claim the Tollense battle, the Corded Ware, the Unitice and the Lusatian Cultures.

    If they tell nothing of the above in school then there must be a reason.

    (And I think I know what this reason is... )

    🙂

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    , @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    it is almost as if Poles were Jews…
     
    Almost as if they were...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEL0RL_bBkw&ab_channel=OlgaMieleszczuk

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Dmitry

  646. @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    I disregard admixture and only care about the haplogroups. Admixture is variable, haplogroups are not. The Sub-Saharan admixture you wrote about is the one found today in the Hausa pastoralists and the Nilotic people. The Hausa are largely of Y haplogroup R1a, just like Yamnaya were. Some Yamnaya moved accross Caucasus, then south into Anatolia, the Fertile Crescent and into Egypt and then North Africa. They intermixed with local Negroid populations along the way. Some probably asmixed more, other less. The proto-Bell Beaker folks that suddenly surfaced around Gibraltar and moved into Portugal and Extremadura from where the conquered Western Europe and genocided and/or assimilated its native ethnic groups were swarthy, and had Negroid traits but weren't Black. Probably some northern offshoot of the same population that adapted to a maritime subsistence. See the article about the Bronze Age Scottish Bell Beaker lady that has been phenotyped and reconstructed and that presents a Mediterranean phenotype that would not at all be surprising in a modern day Moroccan.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achavanich_Beaker_Burial


    However, in 2017, Inigo Olalde from the Reich Laboratory at Harvard Medical School discovered, based on her ancient DNA, that Ava in actuality had very different coloring, most likely with black hair, brown eyes and tanned skin.[9][10]
     

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    Literally no one is autistic enough to build an identity off haplogroups & admixture charts.
    Cease this wignat nonsense.

    Anyway, Egyptians did not practice Cow Slaughter & neither do Iran/India.
    That is enough.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    • Agree: Yahya
    • LOL: Ivashka the fool
  647. @AP
    @Ivashka the fool

    I don't want to identify the specific subclade, but it was downstream of Z92. Apparently the Pushkin family and mine shared a common paternal ancestor around 50 AD (according to the test of a distant cousin descended from Gregory Morhinin (Pushka), founder of the Pushkin family).

    What do you know of Z92?

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    How many STRs have you explored ?

    Y haplogroup R1a Z92 is probably the oldest among the Balto-Slav haplogroups.

    [MORE]

    https://forum.molgen.org/index.php/topic,7667.0.html?PHPSESSID=c877c06695dbf3bd0be3d0cf04053350

    Probably dating back to Tripolye – derived Globular Amphora Culture influenced Corded Ware folks interactions with the pre-Indo-European Narva Culture.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rzucewo_culture

    Congratulations, you are indeed a pure Balto-Slav / Wend. In fact, one of the oldest clades of Indo-European people (I do not include Bell Beaker folks among the Indo-European).

    Forget about the Scandinavian ancestry, it was the other way around. Your ancestors most probably invaded the poor proto-Norse while they moved in as Battle Axe Culture people.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_Axe_culture

    https://bigenc.ru/archeology/text/2131292

    Wonder if some of your ancestors crushed the bones of the Western invaders at the battle of Tollense:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tollense_valley_battlefield

    (Funny how the Bell Beaker descended idiots twist the narrative:

    https://www.ancient-origins.net/news-history-archaeology/europes-oldest-massacre-0014460

    1400 merchants armed to the teeth…

    LOL)

    • Thanks: AP
    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Ivashka the fool



    https://twitter.com/arya_amsha/status/1426403583696670720?s=20

    https://twitter.com/arya_amsha/status/1421083022024052738?s=20

    https://twitter.com/arya_amsha/status/1605526873676451840

    https://twitter.com/arya_amsha/status/1334096066019426304

    https://twitter.com/arya_amsha/status/1428252034457763844?s=20

  648. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    I am sometimes surprised how strong hatred Poland can sometimes arise in people (moreover, often having nothing to do with Poland); it is almost as if Poles were Jews...

    "Dekalog" was made as TV series; this is why its episodes aren't too long. However,
    "A Short Film about Killing" also had its cinematic version: it was the first Kieslowski movie which was noticed in the West.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Yahya

    Where did I hate on Polska ?

    I was just surprised that they do not teach you the prehistory of your people. Of all the Slavs the Poles should be the ones to claim the Tollense battle, the Corded Ware, the Unitice and the Lusatian Cultures.

    If they tell nothing of the above in school then there must be a reason.

    (And I think I know what this reason is… )

    🙂

    • LOL: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, https://www.unz.com/aanglin/wef-polish-president-urges-more-military-support-for-zelenskopolis/

    ...many haters of Poland there!

    You are just typical Russian, thinking about in Poland primarily in terms of Catholicism, whereas Catholicism in Poland as a semi-national identity is really the time between the Counter-Reformation and Partitions.

    Well, they probably don't teach about those archaeological cultures in school (with small exceptions, for example Lusatian culture's Biskupin is NOT Polish, probably due to Lusatians cremations habits) because they have bigger problems at home, so to say. The official school version claims that Poland was a union of smaller tribes like Lędzianie, Ślężanie, Wiślanie etc... but archaeology has been unable to provide enough proofs for their existence.

    The newest version of Polish origins, not yet in school books, suggests that Poland was a creation of Great Moravians, who left Great Moravia. The arguments for that are, for example, the same building techniques in Great Moravia and early Polish grody, and slave trade as substantial source of income in early Poland and Great Moravia (since you don't enslave your own people, the enslavers must have come from somewhere else).
    Interestingly this theory is somehow supported by one of legends dealing with Polish origins, namely, "There were once three brothers: Lech, Czech, Rus. They went in three different directions and founded 3 countries: Poland, Czechia (Bohemia), and Kiev Russia (alternative version to Varangians here)". However, the legend never says who was the father of 3 brothers . Well, now we know: he was some Great Moravia ruler/prince!

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Ivashka the fool

  649. @Ivashka the fool
    @AP

    How many STRs have you explored ?

    Y haplogroup R1a Z92 is probably the oldest among the Balto-Slav haplogroups.



    https://forum.molgen.org/index.php/topic,7667.0.html?PHPSESSID=c877c06695dbf3bd0be3d0cf04053350

    Probably dating back to Tripolye - derived Globular Amphora Culture influenced Corded Ware folks interactions with the pre-Indo-European Narva Culture.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rzucewo_culture

    Congratulations, you are indeed a pure Balto-Slav / Wend. In fact, one of the oldest clades of Indo-European people (I do not include Bell Beaker folks among the Indo-European).

    Forget about the Scandinavian ancestry, it was the other way around. Your ancestors most probably invaded the poor proto-Norse while they moved in as Battle Axe Culture people.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_Axe_culture

    https://bigenc.ru/archeology/text/2131292

    Wonder if some of your ancestors crushed the bones of the Western invaders at the battle of Tollense:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tollense_valley_battlefield

    (Funny how the Bell Beaker descended idiots twist the narrative:

    https://www.ancient-origins.net/news-history-archaeology/europes-oldest-massacre-0014460

    1400 merchants armed to the teeth...

    LOL)

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    [MORE]

    • Thanks: Ivashka the fool
  650. @Ivashka the fool
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Thanks for explaining all this. I always wonder how do Chinese manage to keep a united single country despite all these strong regional identity differences. Do you think that China might possibly break at the seams again one day if CCP doesn't deliver the sustained economic growth that the Chinese have come to be accustomed to ?

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Not very easily, but–

    1. Its not simple north-south dichotomy, for example the Taipings were Cantonese, Hakka and Zhuang. The Qing was a coalition of Manchu-Mongol aristocrats, Han scholar-officials, and southern (Hunan, Anhui) regional militia commanders.

    The CCP-KMT civil war didn’t really have an ethnic element.

    2. “Han” is by definition a secular identity. A Han who converts to Islam becomes a Hui (回 “return”). The Chinese character for meat 肉 ròu is the same as for pork.

    So there’s no argument over theology, doctrines and schisms, etc.

    3. Unified written system. Writing the dialects is highly discouraged, so there’s no alphabet differences.

    A disunified China is not necessarily a negative, the plurality of thought of the Spring and Autumn era has never been matched for two thousand years since Qin Unification,


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundred_Schools_of_Thought

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    So there’s no argument over theology, doctrines and schisms, etc.
     
    Even between the Han and the Hui ?
  651. @Yahya
    @Greasy William


    Rim Turkani’s mother: 5/10. Would not bang.

     

    It appears we have irreconcilable differences in taste in female beauty. I prefer dignified and elegant women over the sexy types. Rim Turkmani's mother is beautiful by any standard, a solid 8.5 in my book. Perhaps she looks better to you from this angle:


    https://i.ibb.co/6r4z0hK/FYdh3j-AWQAMm5v-P.jpg


    Nancy Ajram is most definitely not "plain Jane". A 9.5 bordering on 10. Taylor Swift is indeed beautiful; but less so than Ajram, in my opinion. The most beautiful woman i've seen is Mariam Fakhr Eddine:


    https://identity-mag.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/22807_1.jpg


    The Arabic and Slavic features form an exquisite blend.


    . Who is the Syrian girl in the green from the video?
     
    Amal Arafa.

    What is your rating of the following women:

    1) Nadine Labaki
    2) Queen Rania
    3) Asma Assad
    4) Leila Hatami
    5) Najla Ben Abdullah
    6) Rahma Riyad
    7) Gal Gadot
    8) Shadia
    9) Mona Zaki
    10) Walaa Sharif


    Yeah whatever ended up happening to those guys?
     
    They faded gently into the good night.

    The Christians wised-up and realized it was a mistake to strike a Faustian bargain with the Devil.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    Nadine Labaki: pretty
    Queen Rania: pretty but I don’t think she’s as beautiful as she’s claimed to be
    Mrs. Assad: See Rania. Asma doesn’t even look Middle Eastern to me
    Leila Hatami: YES! Iranian women ftw
    Najla Ben Abdullah: pretty
    Rahma Riyad: pretty and sultry, could pass for Indian/Pakistani. Sexy at a level that is greater than her raw beauty
    Gal Gadot: Pretty pre surgery, one of the 5 most beautiful faces I’ve ever seen post surgery
    Shadia: Very pretty. Totally my type
    Mona Zaki: pretty
    Walaa Sharif: very pretty. That Nasser type jaw is a bit much but it also kinda works for her

    One Egyptian woman who I find extremely attractive is Aya Hijazi.

    I’ve always been super partial to this Moroccan girl:

    • Thanks: Yahya
  652. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Ivashka the fool

    Not very easily, but--

    1. Its not simple north-south dichotomy, for example the Taipings were Cantonese, Hakka and Zhuang. The Qing was a coalition of Manchu-Mongol aristocrats, Han scholar-officials, and southern (Hunan, Anhui) regional militia commanders.

    The CCP-KMT civil war didn't really have an ethnic element.

    2. "Han" is by definition a secular identity. A Han who converts to Islam becomes a Hui (回 "return"). The Chinese character for meat 肉 ròu is the same as for pork.

    So there's no argument over theology, doctrines and schisms, etc.

    3. Unified written system. Writing the dialects is highly discouraged, so there's no alphabet differences.

    A disunified China is not necessarily a negative, the plurality of thought of the Spring and Autumn era has never been matched for two thousand years since Qin Unification,

    https://i.postimg.cc/D0MJ8Zbq/Birth-Places-of-Chinese-Philosophers.png
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundred_Schools_of_Thought

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    So there’s no argument over theology, doctrines and schisms, etc.

    Even between the Han and the Hui ?

  653. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    I wonder if Yahya knows the song or what the movie was?
     
    Well you've given me almost nothing to go on. I need to at least know the name of the movie.

    Most songs in Arabic movies tend to be schlocky. Again, the obscure orchestras and singers is where the quality is at.

    I know you weren't interested in my previous recommendations; so this is more for Mr. Hack and Barbarossa (where has he gone?).

    1) Fakarouni

    One of the all-time great songs of Egyptian classical music.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDrPsZxk-WM&t=573s&ab_channel=UmmKulthum-%D8%A7%D9%85%D9%83%D9%84%D8%AB%D9%88%D9%85

    Its original form is 1 hour long; so like Western classical music; you have to skip around a bit to the sections which resonate with you melodically.

    These are the time-stamps I skip to:

    9:30
    13:10
    19:27
    26:27

    This is an excellent compressed rendition by the National Arab Orchestra.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piNFUb2Suv4&ab_channel=NationalArabOrchestra

    It introduces harmony and homophony and is excellently captured by the sound engineers.

    2) Lebanese folklore

    40 minutes of Lebanese folklore; performed by legendary singer and Greasy Williams' crush Fariouz.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoEdqflkdo8&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=156&t=1133s&ab_channel=GabiTayan

    You also have to skip around a bit to the good parts. Vocals are excellent; and the instrumentation calmly serene.

    3) Hijaz

    An exquisite piece of art music; performed by a Syrian and German duo in a pizza oven.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBeB0TAcDj8&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=173&ab_channel=chiarasomajni

    Watch the cello rubatto in 6:30.

    4) Mesopotamia

    A sublime piece of art music by the Assyrian oud maestro Munir Bashir.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oS8O0TusvAQ&t=990s&ab_channel=WorldWholeMusic

    Good for listening while reading the Epic of Gilgamesh. It will transport you back in time.

    5) Longa Chahinaz

    A piece from the Ottoman period. Here performed by the Syrian Ornina Orchestra:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiIXwX7m1tI&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=185&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9

    Longa Farahfaza, a brother piece to Chahinaz, performed by a French pianist and Moroccan oudist.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1akjsLKgSY&ab_channel=Jean-PhilippeCollard-Neven

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Well you’ve given me almost nothing to go on.

    I know, but I thought it was worth asking because if it was shown on the multicultural channel here (SBS), it was presumably a bit of a hit in the home country, not some obscure flick no one’s seen.

    Anyway, I actually I managed to find it: فيلم محطة الأنس It appears to have been some musical comedy. The song I was I referring to starts at around the 1:19 mark.

    It often astonishes me how little detail it takes for someone to remember a movie. There was an Australian internet forum back in the heyday of internet forums that used to have “what movie is this?” threads, from which I received some good answers to my inquiries, one in particular on the basis of no more detail than I gave you for this one. [Just checked: Whirlpool, apparently still active]

    I think I said something like “Saw it with my parents on TV when I was a kid, and my parents said they’d seen it before, guessing probably around the early 80s. At the end, a group of people emerges from what might have been a tunnel, into an open road in the countryside and they walk off into the distance with the sun glaring in front of them. I remember feeling relief that ‘they made it, the survived’ so maybe a disaster movie.” That is absolutely fuck all to go on, but someone managed to give me the title. (Actually, I feel like watching it, but I’ve forgotten its name again lol.)

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Anyway, I actually I managed to find it: فيلم محطة الأنس It appears to have been some musical comedy. The song I was I referring to starts at around the 1:19 mark.
     
    The song sounds like a generic movie intro piece. Don’t think it’s a proper full-length song; if it is I have no clue what its name is.

    This composer produces a lot of TV scores in a similar vein to the song you posted:

    https://youtu.be/OOF4semjAJU

    I’m not a fan of this musical style tbh.

    The movie you mentioned is known but not one of the great classics of Egyptian cinema.

    If you’re interested in Egyptian classics this is a good list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_100_Egyptian_films

    I recommend starting with Youssef Chahine; Egypt’s greatest director.

    Some of his movies are available on Netflix with English subtitles. Alexandria, Why? Is my favorite thus far. Djamilah is available on YouTube with English subs. It’s about the Algerian independence. The cinematography is weak though.

    https://youtu.be/TcfEvyl6qmc

    On the whole; I prefer movies from other Arab countries. Not a big fan of the Egyptian style of cinematography. Egypt functions as the Hollywood of the Arab world; so a lot of the movies are designed for mass consumption; they tend to a low level. The few movies coming out of the Levant tend to be of higher artistic quality.

    I recommend watching the works of the Nazarene trio: Hanni Abu Assad, Elia Suleiman, Michel Khleifi. Hani Abu Assad’s Paradise Now is an interesting dive into the world of resistance fighters / terrorists, and is available on Netflix. Elia Suleiman’s movies tend to be on the artsy side; but the dry humor is sophisticated and the cinematography is sublime.

    I’ve only watched one of Michel Khleifi’s works; called Wedding In Galilee. It’s a very good film that would have been even better had the casting been more judicious. It appears that Khleifi went the Robert Bresson route of hiring amateurs instead of real actors; perhaps in the hope of making it seem more realistic. But the technique largely fails; the schlocky acting induces cringe makes things look less realistic. I was however pleased with his decision to hire two hotties to portray the main characters Sumaya and Samira; who rarely for an Arab movie, appeared nude in the film. A very pleasant surprise.


    https://www.workersliberty.org/files/pictures/Galilee.jpg


    All three of these directors are from Nazareth; a laudably artistic town.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  654. Looks like the Russians are advancing in the area South East of Zaporizhzhia Sich attempting to capture Orikhiv. Area is apparently lightly defended.

    I noticed on the maps that further east of here New York and Toretsk are also gradually being surrounded.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Wokechoke

    so is this the winter offensive?

    ISW says that Putin is going to try to win the war this year, although they don't believe he will be successful and I share their opinion.

    I guess the goal here would be to break through in the south and then encircle at least part of the Donbas front, right? It seems like the RuAF is back in action.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

  655. @Wokechoke
    Looks like the Russians are advancing in the area South East of Zaporizhzhia Sich attempting to capture Orikhiv. Area is apparently lightly defended.

    I noticed on the maps that further east of here New York and Toretsk are also gradually being surrounded.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    so is this the winter offensive?

    ISW says that Putin is going to try to win the war this year, although they don’t believe he will be successful and I share their opinion.

    I guess the goal here would be to break through in the south and then encircle at least part of the Donbas front, right? It seems like the RuAF is back in action.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Greasy William

    The Troops the Russians are moving north from Melitopol are heading toward Zap Sich. Zap is on the wrong side of the Dneiper.

    The Clearance of Donetsk appears to be happening from New York to Toretsk to Soledar.

    The Ukies will attempt a counter attack in Summer.

  656. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @AP
    @LatW

    I agree with everything you've written here. One of the negative aspects of AaronB is that he is of a solid upper middle class background who benefited from his family's virtuous behaviors, yet celebrates the sinful behavior of the poor, rather than encouraging them to do better.

    Replies: @AaronB

    One of the negative aspects of AaronB is that he is of a solid upper middle class background who benefited from his family’s virtuous behaviors, yet celebrates the sinful behavior of the poor, rather than encouraging them to do better.

    Not that I’m a saint lol, or anywhere near a saint, nor do I aspire to be a saint, but studies have been done that show that over three quarters of medieval saints came from wealthy and privileged backgrounds, and gave it all up for a life of poverty. St Francis of Assisi – one of my favorites – is one vivid example.

    Perhaps, those who have tasted wealth and comfort and power, are better positioned to truly asses it’s true value in the economy of human happiness and true satisfaction?

    More in line with my aspirations, in China, it was precisely the elite mandarin intellectuals who lived most of their lives cosseted in comfort and privilege amid the elaborate refinement of the court – beautiful women, wine, silk beds, refined food, books, paintings – who developed a tradition of giving it all up to live “laughing alone in the mountains” as Taoist hermits in simplicity and poverty as old men (when you’d think comfort would be most desirable) and who even while in court nurtured a Taoist artistic and philosophic tradition that cherished the wilderness and escape from the artificiality of court and city life, and the burdens of earthly work which are after all ephemeral, in order to contemplate the Infinite and become one with the Tao amid rugged and remote mountain scenes.

    In Hindu society, a tradition developed among the wealthy upper class Brahmins to take up Sanyasin as one got older – shock and horror, AP! to give over management of ones wealthy and complex household to ones eldest son, and go wandering the Himalayas in a loincloth, a dirty and ragged Dharma bum blissfully free from the cares of the world – which are after all ephemeral – and contemplate the Infinite amid snowcapped peaks, towering waterfalls, icy streams and roaring rivers, and the delicious deep pine forests so characteristic of the Himalayas.

    And these were old men, AP, when you’d think comfort and security were most desirable, and one can bask in the dignity, respect, and honor society bestows on the old after a long life spent in it’s service, amid plentiful children and grandchildren – but no, they gave all that up to be – mere bums – and society recognized this as laudable!

    Society actually thought there was something more important than this, AP. Perhaps these schemes are more palatable to you because release came after a period of service to the State – after one had “paid ones mite” to the State, as it were – but in fact, opportunities existed for anyone from any class to abandon the only life you recognize as legitimate at any time, and be socially validated.

    I’m ancient Greece and Rome, a whole line of philosophers and poets praised the simple life of poverty – Horace, recognized as the preeminent poet of Rome’s Golden Age and a one-time regular at court life, wrote poems celebrating the simple life of poverty and contemplation that later northern European aristocrats found fascinating and infinitely valuable.

    Perhaps all these great men in all these different parts of the world, from different civilizations, saw something in the life of contemplation vs a life of activity that escapes you, AP?

    But I am somewhat more sympathetic to you when you say you do not come from bourgeois stock but had to claw your way into it – perhaps your lineage – to use Bashi’s absurd terminology for once – is not yet ready for a life of contemplation but must still slug it out in the dusty fields of the active life, where all is ephemeral.

    And that is ok – we all have our “karmic arc”, as it were, and clearly you still have spiritual lessons to learn in a life of action, before you can rise to the perception of it’s ephemeral nature and are ready for contemplation of the Infinite.

    But you will 🙂 It’s the destiny of the great evolution of humanity. Ultimately God gathers us all back into Himself.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @AaronB


    And these were old men, when you’d think comfort and security were most desirable, and one can bask in the dignity, respect, and honor society bestows on the old after a long life spent in it’s service, amid plentiful children and grandchildren – but no, they gave all that up to be – mere bums – and society recognized this as laudable!
     
    It might actually be more liberating at this very old age. Besides, men in their prime are valued and looked up to more by society than elders, unless these elders are wisemen or seers. And most likely, these men did not live as bums but had a simple, but comfortable abode surrounded by a lovely landscape where they could devote all the time to themselves and to observing Nature.

    Presumably, it would be much harder for a man who is, let's say, 28, 40 or even 50, to give up wealth, beautiful women or other comforts or earthly joys, so to speak. So I wouldn't say this is some sort of an "achievement", overcoming of oneself or some sacrifice, rather just a departure into a more serene, spiritual realm to spend one's older days. It's good to have that space to connect with the sublime at that age.

    All due respect, but I would value a younger man who left all those behind at his prime than a much older guy. A younger person can also experience epiphanies. Granted, the young have pure, open minds and are also unencumbered, similar to the elderly. But a young mind perceives the world acutely, absorbs the world more intensely.

    You also mentioned sainthood. All due respect, but sainthood involves much, much more than what you describe. Sainthood isn't achieved merely by abandoning society and living as an hermit. Sainthood derives from a life filled with utmost service to others, to humanity, to real people. Often sainthood involves very serious hardship that transcends human experience.

    Replies: @LatW, @AaronB, @TalhaAtUnz2, @silviosilver

    , @AP
    @AaronB

    1. These old guys you described had done things before settling into their life of contemplation. They had long lives spent in service, children, and grandchildren. What did you accomplish before you started bumming around?

    2. Those old guys presumably weren't using drugs, robbing one another, engaging in sexual assault as a large number of modern homeless whom you admire are doing.

    3. I expect to relax in quiet contemplation also at that age. Maybe buy a home in the northern less busy parts of Lake Garda.


    you say you do not come from bourgeois stock
     
    I am 3/4 nobleman and 1/4 peasant. Neither one fits the bourgeois nor has any desire to claw into it. You on the other hand aren't escaping it, your desperate attempt to run away proves it.

    Replies: @AaronB

  657. @Yahya
    @songbird


    but I contend PIE were domesticating the horse and possibly inventing the wheel, or at least axled vehicles.
     
    The wheel was invented in Mesopotamia first; around 4200-4000 BC. It was also used, and possibly invented independently, in India and China. Indo-Europeans were first to domesticate the horse.

    Herodotus summed it up best: "Egypt is the gift of the Nile". It was also a gift of Mesopotamia; having learnt the basic rudiments of writing, agriculture, architecture and metallurgy from the Mesopotamians. The Mesopotamians were the pioneers of civilization; the ancient Near East was downstream of their accomplishments. Egypt surpassed Iraq/Ur/Babylon by virtue of its ability to unify into a mega-state; which in turn was aided by its population density around the Nile.

    Egyptian elite culture also adopted a range of Mesopotamian imagery, especially artistic motifs to represent complex or difficult concepts, such as the notion of kingship itself (a rosette) or the reconciliation of opposing forces by the ruler (two intertwined beasts).


    https://artincontext.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Ancient-Art-of-Mesopotamia.jpg


    The Mesopotamians were the OGs of the Ancient World.


    https://www.wondriumdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/The-History-of-Ancient-Egypt_Warfare-in-Ancient-Egypt-Chariots-Archers-and-Infantry_QBS_Thumb.jpg


    The Indo-Europeans brought Chariots to Egypt; but that was much later, when Egypt had been a full-fledged civilization for 2,000+ years,

    Replies: @TalhaAtUnz2

    Sargon the Akkadian is the most chad name for an imperial founder, prove me wrong.

    Also, this “Karlin Community” seems to be quite devoid of…any Karlins…🤔

    It’s like how Ronald McDonald is nowhere to be found around McDonald’s. Bizarre turn of events, this.

    Wa salaam.

    Not sure why I can’t post under my original moniker.

  658. Also, this “Karlin Community” seems to be quite devoid of…any Karlins…

    He had a falling out with his readers

    • Replies: @TalhaAtUnz2
    @Greasy William

    I see, I guess a departure less convivial than that of another blog host, AE. I guess that’s the breaks.

    Peace.

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Greasy William


    He had a falling out with his readers
     
    I would not put it like that at all.

    More like he tossed all his readers out of his fantasy luxury yacht or lifeboat or whatever he thinks he is propelling his ego with. I forget his exact message in this regard but it was something which I read as "none of you is in my league or fit to be in my entourage". He thinks he is bigger than unz.com. Or thought he did.

    Bitcoin is bouncing back. Maybe he could too.

    Replies: @Yahya, @AP

  659. @AaronB
    @AP


    One of the negative aspects of AaronB is that he is of a solid upper middle class background who benefited from his family’s virtuous behaviors, yet celebrates the sinful behavior of the poor, rather than encouraging them to do better.
     
    Not that I'm a saint lol, or anywhere near a saint, nor do I aspire to be a saint, but studies have been done that show that over three quarters of medieval saints came from wealthy and privileged backgrounds, and gave it all up for a life of poverty. St Francis of Assisi - one of my favorites - is one vivid example.

    Perhaps, those who have tasted wealth and comfort and power, are better positioned to truly asses it's true value in the economy of human happiness and true satisfaction?

    More in line with my aspirations, in China, it was precisely the elite mandarin intellectuals who lived most of their lives cosseted in comfort and privilege amid the elaborate refinement of the court - beautiful women, wine, silk beds, refined food, books, paintings - who developed a tradition of giving it all up to live "laughing alone in the mountains" as Taoist hermits in simplicity and poverty as old men (when you'd think comfort would be most desirable) and who even while in court nurtured a Taoist artistic and philosophic tradition that cherished the wilderness and escape from the artificiality of court and city life, and the burdens of earthly work which are after all ephemeral, in order to contemplate the Infinite and become one with the Tao amid rugged and remote mountain scenes.

    In Hindu society, a tradition developed among the wealthy upper class Brahmins to take up Sanyasin as one got older - shock and horror, AP! to give over management of ones wealthy and complex household to ones eldest son, and go wandering the Himalayas in a loincloth, a dirty and ragged Dharma bum blissfully free from the cares of the world - which are after all ephemeral - and contemplate the Infinite amid snowcapped peaks, towering waterfalls, icy streams and roaring rivers, and the delicious deep pine forests so characteristic of the Himalayas.

    And these were old men, AP, when you'd think comfort and security were most desirable, and one can bask in the dignity, respect, and honor society bestows on the old after a long life spent in it's service, amid plentiful children and grandchildren - but no, they gave all that up to be - mere bums - and society recognized this as laudable!

    Society actually thought there was something more important than this, AP. Perhaps these schemes are more palatable to you because release came after a period of service to the State - after one had "paid ones mite" to the State, as it were - but in fact, opportunities existed for anyone from any class to abandon the only life you recognize as legitimate at any time, and be socially validated.

    I'm ancient Greece and Rome, a whole line of philosophers and poets praised the simple life of poverty - Horace, recognized as the preeminent poet of Rome's Golden Age and a one-time regular at court life, wrote poems celebrating the simple life of poverty and contemplation that later northern European aristocrats found fascinating and infinitely valuable.

    Perhaps all these great men in all these different parts of the world, from different civilizations, saw something in the life of contemplation vs a life of activity that escapes you, AP?

    But I am somewhat more sympathetic to you when you say you do not come from bourgeois stock but had to claw your way into it - perhaps your lineage - to use Bashi's absurd terminology for once - is not yet ready for a life of contemplation but must still slug it out in the dusty fields of the active life, where all is ephemeral.

    And that is ok - we all have our "karmic arc", as it were, and clearly you still have spiritual lessons to learn in a life of action, before you can rise to the perception of it's ephemeral nature and are ready for contemplation of the Infinite.

    But you will :) It's the destiny of the great evolution of humanity. Ultimately God gathers us all back into Himself.

    Replies: @LatW, @AP

    And these were old men, when you’d think comfort and security were most desirable, and one can bask in the dignity, respect, and honor society bestows on the old after a long life spent in it’s service, amid plentiful children and grandchildren – but no, they gave all that up to be – mere bums – and society recognized this as laudable!

    It might actually be more liberating at this very old age. Besides, men in their prime are valued and looked up to more by society than elders, unless these elders are wisemen or seers. And most likely, these men did not live as bums but had a simple, but comfortable abode surrounded by a lovely landscape where they could devote all the time to themselves and to observing Nature.

    Presumably, it would be much harder for a man who is, let’s say, 28, 40 or even 50, to give up wealth, beautiful women or other comforts or earthly joys, so to speak. So I wouldn’t say this is some sort of an “achievement”, overcoming of oneself or some sacrifice, rather just a departure into a more serene, spiritual realm to spend one’s older days. It’s good to have that space to connect with the sublime at that age.

    All due respect, but I would value a younger man who left all those behind at his prime than a much older guy. A younger person can also experience epiphanies. Granted, the young have pure, open minds and are also unencumbered, similar to the elderly. But a young mind perceives the world acutely, absorbs the world more intensely.

    You also mentioned sainthood. All due respect, but sainthood involves much, much more than what you describe. Sainthood isn’t achieved merely by abandoning society and living as an hermit. Sainthood derives from a life filled with utmost service to others, to humanity, to real people. Often sainthood involves very serious hardship that transcends human experience.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @LatW

    A wealthy professional or a devoted parent, while finding a break from daily life through forest bathing, can experience an epiphany (deep spiritual insight). One doesn't need to abandon society and worldly obligations for that.

    Replies: @AaronB

    , @AaronB
    @LatW

    You make a good point, but let's develop this theme a bit further and see if we can come up with a more comprehensive and rounded view.

    Typically, youth is far more accepting of adventure and hardship than old age, where you are more frail and tired, and where typically people crave comfort and security far more. Would you disagree with this?

    It is far more difficult for an old man to wear a loincloth and wander the mountains, sleeping on a bed of pine needles, eating skimpy food that you can't always count on getting, suffering through the heat of the summer and the cold of the winter, without being able to count on the support of family and friends. This is much more a young man's game.

    And it's important to clarify exactly what sort of life they gave it all up for - you seem to imagine it was retirement to a comfortable, well appointed, country estate. Lol no.

    In the Hindu tradition, the essence was to strip oneself of all but the bare essentials so there is nothing between you and the Divine. Poverty was essential.

    In the Chinese, one aspired to live in a bare bones thatched hut that leaked in the rain, had no insulation, sleep on a straw mat, have perhaps one Buddhist sutra or Taoist scroll, and spend your days wandering the mountains. Food was scanty and barely sufficient, often harvested from the mountain itself.

    The point was - Nature in its magnificence was all one needed and the more stuff you had the less you were One with it.

    The life was one of extreme deprivation and uncertainty and physically demanding as well.

    And even while at court, men cherished an artistic and philosophical tradition that held this life as the highest, and yearned for when they could adopt it.

    Next, let us consider the question of reward - typically, the young man competes and works and the true reward of his labors only comes later in life, when he is established and successful. That's when he has the most money, status, honor, and respect, and can really enjoy what he worked for.

    To give all that up? Maybe there something more important.

    Two more crucial points must be made -

    One, men did not take up this life in extreme old age, although it extended into old age - they began it typically in their late 40s and 50s when men are considered at the peak of their worth, mature, experienced, fully mastered their profession, with social connections, etc.

    Moreover, countless young men took up the life too, and this was socially validated - one of China's greatest poets and one of my favorite, Tao Chien, was repeatedly invited to a position and court but despised it so much that he fled back to his ancestral farm which was mired in poverty, his house in disrepair with barely enough to eat, in a depopulated part of the country, and where he lived in abject poverty - but delighted in endless changing of the seasons and wandering the countryside (he did have a family though).

    He described his time at court as his tem year mistake.

    Finally, as to sainthood requiring service to the community - in a way yes, but not as you think. Countless Christian saints lived in remote islands or caves with barely any contact with any community, especially in the earlier years of Christianity. And lets not forget the Desert Father's here! And yet this itself was felt to be a service to the community and mankind, because living a holy life was intrinsically valuable and reflected well on all mankind. The point was not tangible social utility. In addition, their mere example was felt to be comforting and consoling and provided a valuable signpost to the true ends of life for everyone, which not activity in this world but becoming One with the Infinite.

    The Chinese hermits would often write poems in their retreat that would be read by later generations at court, inspiring them to take up a similar life when they could.

    Of course, many saints also participated in communal life on the fringes and offered advice and consolation, especially later.

    It was only much later as the winds of modernity began swelling on the horizon ominously that it became more and more to be felt that without some tangible social utility the life of the saint or hermit had no utility - but that was the advent of the movement towards nihilism, culminating today.

    Replies: @AP, @LatW

    , @TalhaAtUnz2
    @LatW


    Sainthood isn’t achieved merely by abandoning society and living as an hermit. Sainthood derives from a life filled with utmost service to others, to humanity, to real people. Often sainthood involves very serious hardship that transcends human experience.
     
    Often bearing the trials that come with dealing with others with a sense of grace and dignity.

    Peace.

    I recently heard an anecdote from a young shaykh about one of his teachers, an elderly shaykh from Yemen from the B’Alawi tradition. Even in his old age, he holds gatherings, meets with people, listens to their problems, etc. One day, after a gathering, he was getting into the back seat of a car to be driven back. Being elderly, he was getting into the car supporting himself by holding onto the open door. As he was getting himself inside, an enthusiastic young man wanted to meet him and get some advice. It was dark, and the young man thought he was being helpful by closing the door for the shaykh, having no idea that he smashed the shaykh’s fingers between the door and the frame. The shaykh didn’t say anything and continued saying his goodbyes to the young man until the driver pulled away. Once they were fat enough, he asked the driver if he wouldn’t mind pulling over so he could open the door. When the driver asked why, he mentioned that his fingers were stuck in the door. The driver said; Shaykh! Why didn’t you say something earlier?!

    So he said; If I had mentioned this when the young man was around, he would have been so embarrassed and felt so guilty, that he may not ever be willing to meet with me again.
    , @silviosilver
    @LatW


    But a young mind perceives the world acutely, absorbs the world more intensely.
     
    As well as more narrowly, rashly, and impractically. Although at least, being young, they have much time to atone for the folly. It is the young mind that insists on imbibing the wisdom of the ages, enabling it to resist the siren call of youthful idealism, that I reserve my respect for.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  660. Anatoly Karlin now posing as an animal rights activist / pro-vegetarian. Yet another of his identity changes. total schizoid. Only a few years ago he was attacking vegetarians and vegans caling them “losers” and saying he eats beef.

    A tale of two tweets:

    Take your meds anatoly!

    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Anatoly_Karlin#Anti-veganism_and_anti-vegetarianism

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Goldeneye4

    Traditionally, a lot of political power in Scotland was in beeves, so it is strange to see Edinburgh move to try to make it into soy.
    https://youtu.be/xR1YEOrYOdw

    , @silviosilver
    @Goldeneye4

    Where's the contradiction? The 2023 tweets are descriptive, not prescriptive. I dislike it, but I agree with his prognosis. Imagine in the very distant future humankind (hopefully sans les groids :) ) sets off for other star systems in generation ships; it appears extremely doubtful we'd be lugging animal stocks along for the ride.

    As for 2019 voiding the efforts of vegan losers tweet, thanks, it's nice to be reminded of some the reasons we all used to think highly of him. Personally, I'd be willing to trade the lives of animals for the lives of vegans, one-for-one. Any takers?

    (Note to any aspiring diss right politicians. This is how you win over the hindoo/sikh constituency: one vegan for one cow. Kill two birds with one stone. Oops, was that offensive? Make it: feed two birds with one scone.)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Sher Singh

    , @TalhaAtUnz2
    @Goldeneye4

    Quite interesting...what an evolution over the last few years...🤔

    Is he still a tranhumanist enthusiast and cheerleading for the Singularity?

    Peace.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    , @QCIC
    @Goldeneye4

    No contradiction, this is easy--> AK found a girlfriend. Probably not the girl from McDonalds as it was known back then.

    Eat more kale!

    Death to incels!

    Slava Rossiya!

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  661. I might have been right about Arestovitch and the helicopter crash. Especially moving because in the beginning of the discussion he mentions yours truly as the national subconscious archetype of the Russian people. I am truly flattered.

    Jokes aside, strong interview, if not killed this guy will go far. References to archetypes and an intuitive feeling of where the whole situation is going and how it could be turned around. I like the man.

    For Russian speakers only, sorry but they don’t even try speaking Ukrainian. Those who will be capable of watching, thinking and realizing what game they’re playing would realize why they speak the “language of the enemy”

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Especially moving because in the beginning of the discussion he mentions yours truly as the national subconscious archetype of the Russian people. I am truly flattered.
     
    LOL. They do these chat series where they all sit around the table eating cake (must be Kiev torte) and discuss these grandiose geopolitical visions for Ukraine. I guess as a Russian, one must be mellow and tolerant enough, as well as with a sense of humor, to not be triggered and truly enjoy some of these gems they produce.

    References to archetypes and an intuitive feeling of where the whole situation is going and how it could be turned around. I like the man.
     
    Me too. Definitely not boring.

    This archetype that he talks about that is supposedly characteristic of the Ukrainian nation is not really unique to just them. Other EE nations sometimes take out their worst emotions on their own and envy their own most (this is a huge flaw). Plus, everyone was very traumatized by what happened in Dnipro.

    thinking and realizing what game they’re playing would realize why they speak the “language of the enemy”
     
    Well, the Russophone Kyiv has produced some strong, ambitious patriots. :) I still have to get used to how he and other Russophone Ukrainians call Russians "they", while speaking their language. It simply means that no one has a monopoly on the Russian language. I guess when you aspire to be the real heir of the Kievan Rus, it doesn't matter which Rus language you speak.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  662. @LatW
    @AaronB


    And these were old men, when you’d think comfort and security were most desirable, and one can bask in the dignity, respect, and honor society bestows on the old after a long life spent in it’s service, amid plentiful children and grandchildren – but no, they gave all that up to be – mere bums – and society recognized this as laudable!
     
    It might actually be more liberating at this very old age. Besides, men in their prime are valued and looked up to more by society than elders, unless these elders are wisemen or seers. And most likely, these men did not live as bums but had a simple, but comfortable abode surrounded by a lovely landscape where they could devote all the time to themselves and to observing Nature.

    Presumably, it would be much harder for a man who is, let's say, 28, 40 or even 50, to give up wealth, beautiful women or other comforts or earthly joys, so to speak. So I wouldn't say this is some sort of an "achievement", overcoming of oneself or some sacrifice, rather just a departure into a more serene, spiritual realm to spend one's older days. It's good to have that space to connect with the sublime at that age.

    All due respect, but I would value a younger man who left all those behind at his prime than a much older guy. A younger person can also experience epiphanies. Granted, the young have pure, open minds and are also unencumbered, similar to the elderly. But a young mind perceives the world acutely, absorbs the world more intensely.

    You also mentioned sainthood. All due respect, but sainthood involves much, much more than what you describe. Sainthood isn't achieved merely by abandoning society and living as an hermit. Sainthood derives from a life filled with utmost service to others, to humanity, to real people. Often sainthood involves very serious hardship that transcends human experience.

    Replies: @LatW, @AaronB, @TalhaAtUnz2, @silviosilver

    A wealthy professional or a devoted parent, while finding a break from daily life through forest bathing, can experience an epiphany (deep spiritual insight). One doesn’t need to abandon society and worldly obligations for that.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @LatW

    For some that may be all they can have, a brief connection to the Infinite.

    But to these societies I was describing, connection to the Infinite was the true point of life - not social activity in this world - and one who understands this this would never be content with a brief forest bath.

    Social activity had its place - but no one ever felt it was the true end of life until modern times, which are not coincidentally struggling with nihilism.

    Perhaps we overcome our APs and reintroduce the possibility that the true ends of life are beyond the social realm...

  663. @Greasy William
    @Wokechoke

    so is this the winter offensive?

    ISW says that Putin is going to try to win the war this year, although they don't believe he will be successful and I share their opinion.

    I guess the goal here would be to break through in the south and then encircle at least part of the Donbas front, right? It seems like the RuAF is back in action.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    The Troops the Russians are moving north from Melitopol are heading toward Zap Sich. Zap is on the wrong side of the Dneiper.

    The Clearance of Donetsk appears to be happening from New York to Toretsk to Soledar.

    The Ukies will attempt a counter attack in Summer.

  664. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @LatW
    @AaronB


    And these were old men, when you’d think comfort and security were most desirable, and one can bask in the dignity, respect, and honor society bestows on the old after a long life spent in it’s service, amid plentiful children and grandchildren – but no, they gave all that up to be – mere bums – and society recognized this as laudable!
     
    It might actually be more liberating at this very old age. Besides, men in their prime are valued and looked up to more by society than elders, unless these elders are wisemen or seers. And most likely, these men did not live as bums but had a simple, but comfortable abode surrounded by a lovely landscape where they could devote all the time to themselves and to observing Nature.

    Presumably, it would be much harder for a man who is, let's say, 28, 40 or even 50, to give up wealth, beautiful women or other comforts or earthly joys, so to speak. So I wouldn't say this is some sort of an "achievement", overcoming of oneself or some sacrifice, rather just a departure into a more serene, spiritual realm to spend one's older days. It's good to have that space to connect with the sublime at that age.

    All due respect, but I would value a younger man who left all those behind at his prime than a much older guy. A younger person can also experience epiphanies. Granted, the young have pure, open minds and are also unencumbered, similar to the elderly. But a young mind perceives the world acutely, absorbs the world more intensely.

    You also mentioned sainthood. All due respect, but sainthood involves much, much more than what you describe. Sainthood isn't achieved merely by abandoning society and living as an hermit. Sainthood derives from a life filled with utmost service to others, to humanity, to real people. Often sainthood involves very serious hardship that transcends human experience.

    Replies: @LatW, @AaronB, @TalhaAtUnz2, @silviosilver

    You make a good point, but let’s develop this theme a bit further and see if we can come up with a more comprehensive and rounded view.

    Typically, youth is far more accepting of adventure and hardship than old age, where you are more frail and tired, and where typically people crave comfort and security far more. Would you disagree with this?

    It is far more difficult for an old man to wear a loincloth and wander the mountains, sleeping on a bed of pine needles, eating skimpy food that you can’t always count on getting, suffering through the heat of the summer and the cold of the winter, without being able to count on the support of family and friends. This is much more a young man’s game.

    And it’s important to clarify exactly what sort of life they gave it all up for – you seem to imagine it was retirement to a comfortable, well appointed, country estate. Lol no.

    In the Hindu tradition, the essence was to strip oneself of all but the bare essentials so there is nothing between you and the Divine. Poverty was essential.

    In the Chinese, one aspired to live in a bare bones thatched hut that leaked in the rain, had no insulation, sleep on a straw mat, have perhaps one Buddhist sutra or Taoist scroll, and spend your days wandering the mountains. Food was scanty and barely sufficient, often harvested from the mountain itself.

    The point was – Nature in its magnificence was all one needed and the more stuff you had the less you were One with it.

    The life was one of extreme deprivation and uncertainty and physically demanding as well.

    And even while at court, men cherished an artistic and philosophical tradition that held this life as the highest, and yearned for when they could adopt it.

    Next, let us consider the question of reward – typically, the young man competes and works and the true reward of his labors only comes later in life, when he is established and successful. That’s when he has the most money, status, honor, and respect, and can really enjoy what he worked for.

    To give all that up? Maybe there something more important.

    Two more crucial points must be made –

    One, men did not take up this life in extreme old age, although it extended into old age – they began it typically in their late 40s and 50s when men are considered at the peak of their worth, mature, experienced, fully mastered their profession, with social connections, etc.

    Moreover, countless young men took up the life too, and this was socially validated – one of China’s greatest poets and one of my favorite, Tao Chien, was repeatedly invited to a position and court but despised it so much that he fled back to his ancestral farm which was mired in poverty, his house in disrepair with barely enough to eat, in a depopulated part of the country, and where he lived in abject poverty – but delighted in endless changing of the seasons and wandering the countryside (he did have a family though).

    He described his time at court as his tem year mistake.

    Finally, as to sainthood requiring service to the community – in a way yes, but not as you think. Countless Christian saints lived in remote islands or caves with barely any contact with any community, especially in the earlier years of Christianity. And lets not forget the Desert Father’s here! And yet this itself was felt to be a service to the community and mankind, because living a holy life was intrinsically valuable and reflected well on all mankind. The point was not tangible social utility. In addition, their mere example was felt to be comforting and consoling and provided a valuable signpost to the true ends of life for everyone, which not activity in this world but becoming One with the Infinite.

    The Chinese hermits would often write poems in their retreat that would be read by later generations at court, inspiring them to take up a similar life when they could.

    Of course, many saints also participated in communal life on the fringes and offered advice and consolation, especially later.

    It was only much later as the winds of modernity began swelling on the horizon ominously that it became more and more to be felt that without some tangible social utility the life of the saint or hermit had no utility – but that was the advent of the movement towards nihilism, culminating today.

    • Replies: @AP
    @AaronB


    Countless Christian saints lived in remote islands or caves with barely any contact with any community, especially in the earlier years of Christianity. And lets not forget the Desert Father’s here!
     
    They were engaged in deep prayer, not tourism. And you?

    And lets not forget the Desert Father’s here!
     
    Also, engaged in deep prayer, rather than fun and interesting hiking.

    The Chinese hermits would often write poems in their retreat that would be read by later generations at court
     
    Are you doing something similar?

    The point was not tangible social utility
     
    Nor was the point deliberate avoidance of social utility for the sake of a consumer wilderness experience.

    You are just being a bourgeois consumer when you are out there, but in your arrogance compare yourself to these saints and poets.

    In other words, you are the opposite of those saints and poets. You are all about self-indulgence and pride:

    “A long time a go a certain Cynic philosopher proudly paraded around Athens in a moth-eaten coat, hoping that everyone would admire his contempt for convention. When Socrates met him, he said: Through the hole in your coat I see your vanity. Your dirt, too, dear sir, is self-indulgent and your self-indulgence is dirty."

    Replies: @AaronB

    , @LatW
    @AaronB


    Typically, youth is far more accepting of adventure and hardship than old age, where you are more frail and tired, and where typically people crave comfort and security far more. Would you disagree with this?
     
    It depends. At a very old age, one has already completed their adventures and has been able to enjoy certain things at the peak of their life. It might be easier at that point to leave those things behind, they may even appear as a burden, the middle age is when you try to cope with life's big problems and try to solve them, at an older age, I imagine, one would prefer to let go of them and maybe turn to more spiritual endeavors.

    In the Old Prussian religion, the skygod was represented in three forms - as a youth wearing a green wreath, as a man in his prime, God Perkunas (Father Thunder), wearing a wreath of red flames (intense life at one's prime), and, finally, as an old man, wearing a white headscarf as a symbol of the underworld. This symbolism seems quite fitting.

    As to comfort and security, one doesn't really need all that much to feel somewhat secure and comfortable. Once, when traveling through the West, we encountered an older guy who was the guardian of the campgrounds, and he was all alone there, in his rather comfortable but modest trailer, with a beautiful, large, white hound. The woods where he lived were very wild, dense, full of wild animals. He had very little but he was totally fine. He was well into his 60s, maybe even older and doing quite well. A younger person may not be as inclined to choose such a lifestyle, especially if they had a spouse, children, a few more milestones to achieve in their career, maybe other aspirations.

    In the Hindu tradition, the essence was to strip oneself of all but the bare essentials so there is nothing between you and the Divine. Poverty was essential.
     
    Well, this is ascetic praxis, poverty is not a goal in itself here, just a kind of a spiritual tool, a means to an end.

    spend your days wandering the mountains. Food was scanty and barely sufficient, often harvested from the mountain itself.
     
    There is the Japanese shinto tradition of mountain worship. Sangaku shinkō. The mountains are divine and the abode of ancestral spirits. With streams that run through the mountain and the forests nearby. There are resources there, even if scarce, it is called "ascetic cuisine". The Japanese even create modern cuisine reminiscent of these ancient spiritual practices:

    https://www.tsuruokagastronomy.com/shojin-ryori

    "Since days of old, mountain priests (yamabushi) have only eaten ascetic meals served at temple lodgings. They believed that eating meals sourced from the mountains they wandered would help them form better connections to their natural landscape, as well as absorb the mountain’s spiritual energy, ultimately allowing them to appreciate nature’s blessings more fully."

    In the US there are streams that run through rocks, there are pools filled with glacial water coming from the mountains. The water is ice cold, but on a hot summer day, once you get used to it, you can fully immerse yourself in it and it can be an amazing, refreshing experience.

    One, men did not take up this life in extreme old age, although it extended into old age – they began it typically in their late 40s and 50s when men are considered at the peak of their worth, mature, experienced, fully mastered their profession, with social connections, etc.
     
    If so, then I accept your argument. I had previously thought you meant really old age, as I said above, to give things up in your 40s, 50s is a bit early and could be a bit of a sacrifice.

    Finally, as to sainthood requiring service to the community – in a way yes, but not as you think. Countless Christian saints lived in remote islands or caves with barely any contact with any community, especially in the earlier years of Christianity. And yet this itself was felt to be a service to the community and mankind, because living a holy life was intrinsically valuable and reflected well on all mankind.
     
    This is true, this was intrinsically valuable, as an example of purity and chastity. This still remains to some extent in our secular society, when even if not religious, people view a priest as intrinsically valuable (even aside from their actual service).

    It was only much later as the winds of modernity began swelling on the horizon ominously that it became more and more to be felt that without some tangible social utility the life of the saint or hermit had no utility – but that was the advent of the movement towards nihilism, culminating today.
     
    I understand your point, but being an hermit is not for everyone. And just because someone chooses to live outside of society or to live in poverty, doesn't mean they should be elevated, as it seemed you insisted in the other thread. But it might be that you meant the idea as such, not actual examples of real people.

    Replies: @AaronB

  665. @Greasy William

    Also, this “Karlin Community” seems to be quite devoid of…any Karlins…
     
    He had a falling out with his readers

    Replies: @TalhaAtUnz2, @Emil Nikola Richard

    I see, I guess a departure less convivial than that of another blog host, AE. I guess that’s the breaks.

    Peace.

  666. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @LatW
    @LatW

    A wealthy professional or a devoted parent, while finding a break from daily life through forest bathing, can experience an epiphany (deep spiritual insight). One doesn't need to abandon society and worldly obligations for that.

    Replies: @AaronB

    For some that may be all they can have, a brief connection to the Infinite.

    But to these societies I was describing, connection to the Infinite was the true point of life – not social activity in this world – and one who understands this this would never be content with a brief forest bath.

    Social activity had its place – but no one ever felt it was the true end of life until modern times, which are not coincidentally struggling with nihilism.

    Perhaps we overcome our APs and reintroduce the possibility that the true ends of life are beyond the social realm…

  667. Re ‘Alec Baldwin to be charged with involuntary manslaughter’. The prosecution think because they have evidence of him making inaccurate statements about how he handled the trigger and hammer of the gun in the fatal on set incident nothing he says will count, and so he can be found guilty of reckless disregard for another’s safety, but they are totally wrong in my opinion because what Baldwin had no way to know that was he was handling was potentially lethal.

    I read up on the professional protocols years in relation to the accidental death of Brandon Lee by gunshot on a film set. It was true even back then and was even more true after the death of Lee that live rounds of firearm ammunition are NEVER permitted on a film set, so they cannot be loaded into a gun by mistake,. Blanks and dummy rounds are carefully marked with a color code to avoid confusion as to what is being taken onto a film set does not include live rounds. These precautions are the professional responsibility of the weapons master, who hence is making sure the ‘weapons’ on set are not really weapons at all, but props that (even if there is an oversight) might at most go bang.

    Therefore Baldwin had a reasonable expectation that he could not possibly shoot anyone with the gun no matter how he manipulated it because it was, like all guns on film sets, in effect a harmless prop. That Baldwin is mistaken about whether he had his finger on the trigger is essentially irrelevant to whether he had a reasonable expectation the prop could not possibly be a loaded with a live round gun.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Sean


    in my opinion because what Baldwin had no way to know that was he was handling was potentially lethal.
     
    This is a dumb opinion.

    He has been around guns his entire life. He has heard safety protocols repeated 100000 X and this is not rocket science. It's not like he is an illiterate ghetto negro.

    Replies: @Sean

  668. @Goldeneye4
    Anatoly Karlin now posing as an animal rights activist / pro-vegetarian. Yet another of his identity changes. total schizoid. Only a few years ago he was attacking vegetarians and vegans caling them "losers" and saying he eats beef.

    A tale of two tweets:

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/1616478750467555345

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/1171771252488515585

    Take your meds anatoly!

    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Anatoly_Karlin#Anti-veganism_and_anti-vegetarianism

    Replies: @songbird, @silviosilver, @TalhaAtUnz2, @QCIC

    Traditionally, a lot of political power in Scotland was in beeves, so it is strange to see Edinburgh move to try to make it into soy.

    [MORE]

  669. @LatW
    @AaronB


    And these were old men, when you’d think comfort and security were most desirable, and one can bask in the dignity, respect, and honor society bestows on the old after a long life spent in it’s service, amid plentiful children and grandchildren – but no, they gave all that up to be – mere bums – and society recognized this as laudable!
     
    It might actually be more liberating at this very old age. Besides, men in their prime are valued and looked up to more by society than elders, unless these elders are wisemen or seers. And most likely, these men did not live as bums but had a simple, but comfortable abode surrounded by a lovely landscape where they could devote all the time to themselves and to observing Nature.

    Presumably, it would be much harder for a man who is, let's say, 28, 40 or even 50, to give up wealth, beautiful women or other comforts or earthly joys, so to speak. So I wouldn't say this is some sort of an "achievement", overcoming of oneself or some sacrifice, rather just a departure into a more serene, spiritual realm to spend one's older days. It's good to have that space to connect with the sublime at that age.

    All due respect, but I would value a younger man who left all those behind at his prime than a much older guy. A younger person can also experience epiphanies. Granted, the young have pure, open minds and are also unencumbered, similar to the elderly. But a young mind perceives the world acutely, absorbs the world more intensely.

    You also mentioned sainthood. All due respect, but sainthood involves much, much more than what you describe. Sainthood isn't achieved merely by abandoning society and living as an hermit. Sainthood derives from a life filled with utmost service to others, to humanity, to real people. Often sainthood involves very serious hardship that transcends human experience.

    Replies: @LatW, @AaronB, @TalhaAtUnz2, @silviosilver

    Sainthood isn’t achieved merely by abandoning society and living as an hermit. Sainthood derives from a life filled with utmost service to others, to humanity, to real people. Often sainthood involves very serious hardship that transcends human experience.

    Often bearing the trials that come with dealing with others with a sense of grace and dignity.

    Peace.

    [MORE]

    I recently heard an anecdote from a young shaykh about one of his teachers, an elderly shaykh from Yemen from the B’Alawi tradition. Even in his old age, he holds gatherings, meets with people, listens to their problems, etc. One day, after a gathering, he was getting into the back seat of a car to be driven back. Being elderly, he was getting into the car supporting himself by holding onto the open door. As he was getting himself inside, an enthusiastic young man wanted to meet him and get some advice. It was dark, and the young man thought he was being helpful by closing the door for the shaykh, having no idea that he smashed the shaykh’s fingers between the door and the frame. The shaykh didn’t say anything and continued saying his goodbyes to the young man until the driver pulled away. Once they were fat enough, he asked the driver if he wouldn’t mind pulling over so he could open the door. When the driver asked why, he mentioned that his fingers were stuck in the door. The driver said; Shaykh! Why didn’t you say something earlier?!

    So he said; If I had mentioned this when the young man was around, he would have been so embarrassed and felt so guilty, that he may not ever be willing to meet with me again.

    • Thanks: LatW
  670. @AaronB
    @AP


    One of the negative aspects of AaronB is that he is of a solid upper middle class background who benefited from his family’s virtuous behaviors, yet celebrates the sinful behavior of the poor, rather than encouraging them to do better.
     
    Not that I'm a saint lol, or anywhere near a saint, nor do I aspire to be a saint, but studies have been done that show that over three quarters of medieval saints came from wealthy and privileged backgrounds, and gave it all up for a life of poverty. St Francis of Assisi - one of my favorites - is one vivid example.

    Perhaps, those who have tasted wealth and comfort and power, are better positioned to truly asses it's true value in the economy of human happiness and true satisfaction?

    More in line with my aspirations, in China, it was precisely the elite mandarin intellectuals who lived most of their lives cosseted in comfort and privilege amid the elaborate refinement of the court - beautiful women, wine, silk beds, refined food, books, paintings - who developed a tradition of giving it all up to live "laughing alone in the mountains" as Taoist hermits in simplicity and poverty as old men (when you'd think comfort would be most desirable) and who even while in court nurtured a Taoist artistic and philosophic tradition that cherished the wilderness and escape from the artificiality of court and city life, and the burdens of earthly work which are after all ephemeral, in order to contemplate the Infinite and become one with the Tao amid rugged and remote mountain scenes.

    In Hindu society, a tradition developed among the wealthy upper class Brahmins to take up Sanyasin as one got older - shock and horror, AP! to give over management of ones wealthy and complex household to ones eldest son, and go wandering the Himalayas in a loincloth, a dirty and ragged Dharma bum blissfully free from the cares of the world - which are after all ephemeral - and contemplate the Infinite amid snowcapped peaks, towering waterfalls, icy streams and roaring rivers, and the delicious deep pine forests so characteristic of the Himalayas.

    And these were old men, AP, when you'd think comfort and security were most desirable, and one can bask in the dignity, respect, and honor society bestows on the old after a long life spent in it's service, amid plentiful children and grandchildren - but no, they gave all that up to be - mere bums - and society recognized this as laudable!

    Society actually thought there was something more important than this, AP. Perhaps these schemes are more palatable to you because release came after a period of service to the State - after one had "paid ones mite" to the State, as it were - but in fact, opportunities existed for anyone from any class to abandon the only life you recognize as legitimate at any time, and be socially validated.

    I'm ancient Greece and Rome, a whole line of philosophers and poets praised the simple life of poverty - Horace, recognized as the preeminent poet of Rome's Golden Age and a one-time regular at court life, wrote poems celebrating the simple life of poverty and contemplation that later northern European aristocrats found fascinating and infinitely valuable.

    Perhaps all these great men in all these different parts of the world, from different civilizations, saw something in the life of contemplation vs a life of activity that escapes you, AP?

    But I am somewhat more sympathetic to you when you say you do not come from bourgeois stock but had to claw your way into it - perhaps your lineage - to use Bashi's absurd terminology for once - is not yet ready for a life of contemplation but must still slug it out in the dusty fields of the active life, where all is ephemeral.

    And that is ok - we all have our "karmic arc", as it were, and clearly you still have spiritual lessons to learn in a life of action, before you can rise to the perception of it's ephemeral nature and are ready for contemplation of the Infinite.

    But you will :) It's the destiny of the great evolution of humanity. Ultimately God gathers us all back into Himself.

    Replies: @LatW, @AP

    1. These old guys you described had done things before settling into their life of contemplation. They had long lives spent in service, children, and grandchildren. What did you accomplish before you started bumming around?

    2. Those old guys presumably weren’t using drugs, robbing one another, engaging in sexual assault as a large number of modern homeless whom you admire are doing.

    3. I expect to relax in quiet contemplation also at that age. Maybe buy a home in the northern less busy parts of Lake Garda.

    you say you do not come from bourgeois stock

    I am 3/4 nobleman and 1/4 peasant. Neither one fits the bourgeois nor has any desire to claw into it. You on the other hand aren’t escaping it, your desperate attempt to run away proves it.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @AP

    1) Perhaps this is one form of social compromise then. Pay your mite to Leviathan, then pursue the true ends of human life, contemplation. It's a start :)

    Of course, provision must be made for those who feel a strong vocation to a life of contemplation at an earlier age, but that can be extended once we secure the above described beachhead within mainstream society.

    2) Well, many Hindu yogis were doing drugs, and limited drug use has its place in shamanic traditions.

    But the excessive drug use is an attempt to escape from a society entirely based on not recognizing the true ends of human life. A society that freely offers a route to a life of contemplation - or less loftily, simply a route out of the rat race which destroys our souls - will see a precipitous drop in drug use and general dysfunctional behavior.

    It is only a society that insists on seeing the rat race as the only legitimate path that engenders mass drug use and anti-social behavior.

    At the moment, our dysfunctional drug users are also our canaries in the coal mine - they embody a stark warning to us and a clarion call to wake up, but we - in our thickheadedness - treat it merely as a problem of social technique.

    We moderns have not yet recovered the ability to go "meta" and question our values, an ability gradually lost as modernity impoverished our conceptual categories.

    This advanced cognitive technique cannot survive in an era of impoverished factual language.

    3) Ah, but I want to see you taking up a loin cloth and sleeping on a bed of pine needles :) And in your 50s, not old age.

    Yes, you are a nobleman, but that occupation has sadly gone defunct, just as 18th century carriage builder is no longer a viable occupation.

    Today, the elite are the bourgeois - whose values and mentality you naturally seek to embody. I think you are using some dim family tradition of past glory to motivate a social striving that is as sordid as it has always been.

    But traditionally, the nobility despised bourgeois values of striving and hard work, and at least aspired to lives of refined leisure - a preserve free from the taint of sordid social striving - and were more likely to become contemplatives or sybarites, both occupations closer to the homeless you despise than your bourgeois social striving.

    I almost wish you were a nobleman, and it wasn't just some dim family tradition with no relevance to today.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @AP

  671. @Goldeneye4
    Anatoly Karlin now posing as an animal rights activist / pro-vegetarian. Yet another of his identity changes. total schizoid. Only a few years ago he was attacking vegetarians and vegans caling them "losers" and saying he eats beef.

    A tale of two tweets:

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/1616478750467555345

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/1171771252488515585

    Take your meds anatoly!

    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Anatoly_Karlin#Anti-veganism_and_anti-vegetarianism

    Replies: @songbird, @silviosilver, @TalhaAtUnz2, @QCIC

    Where’s the contradiction? The 2023 tweets are descriptive, not prescriptive. I dislike it, but I agree with his prognosis. Imagine in the very distant future humankind (hopefully sans les groids 🙂 ) sets off for other star systems in generation ships; it appears extremely doubtful we’d be lugging animal stocks along for the ride.

    As for 2019 voiding the efforts of vegan losers tweet, thanks, it’s nice to be reminded of some the reasons we all used to think highly of him. Personally, I’d be willing to trade the lives of animals for the lives of vegans, one-for-one. Any takers?

    (Note to any aspiring diss right politicians. This is how you win over the hindoo/sikh constituency: one vegan for one cow. Kill two birds with one stone. Oops, was that offensive? Make it: feed two birds with one scone.)

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    Note to any aspiring politician - do not side with the diss right, especially in Moscow. As my father used to say : "It is good to be a Communist and to live in Paris." We can adapt it jnto the current situation and make it into : "It is good to be a right winger nationalist and to live in Bnei Brak".

    , @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    😉

    https://twitter.com/eclipsethis2003/status/1616427743800971264?s=46&t=Ib0POWhtRAKp47idtwixPg

  672. @Goldeneye4
    Anatoly Karlin now posing as an animal rights activist / pro-vegetarian. Yet another of his identity changes. total schizoid. Only a few years ago he was attacking vegetarians and vegans caling them "losers" and saying he eats beef.

    A tale of two tweets:

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/1616478750467555345

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/1171771252488515585

    Take your meds anatoly!

    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Anatoly_Karlin#Anti-veganism_and_anti-vegetarianism

    Replies: @songbird, @silviosilver, @TalhaAtUnz2, @QCIC

    Quite interesting…what an evolution over the last few years…🤔

    Is he still a tranhumanist enthusiast and cheerleading for the Singularity?

    Peace.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @TalhaAtUnz2

    yes he is.


    I spoke with him a year ago. He's doing fine

  673. @AaronB
    @LatW

    You make a good point, but let's develop this theme a bit further and see if we can come up with a more comprehensive and rounded view.

    Typically, youth is far more accepting of adventure and hardship than old age, where you are more frail and tired, and where typically people crave comfort and security far more. Would you disagree with this?

    It is far more difficult for an old man to wear a loincloth and wander the mountains, sleeping on a bed of pine needles, eating skimpy food that you can't always count on getting, suffering through the heat of the summer and the cold of the winter, without being able to count on the support of family and friends. This is much more a young man's game.

    And it's important to clarify exactly what sort of life they gave it all up for - you seem to imagine it was retirement to a comfortable, well appointed, country estate. Lol no.

    In the Hindu tradition, the essence was to strip oneself of all but the bare essentials so there is nothing between you and the Divine. Poverty was essential.

    In the Chinese, one aspired to live in a bare bones thatched hut that leaked in the rain, had no insulation, sleep on a straw mat, have perhaps one Buddhist sutra or Taoist scroll, and spend your days wandering the mountains. Food was scanty and barely sufficient, often harvested from the mountain itself.

    The point was - Nature in its magnificence was all one needed and the more stuff you had the less you were One with it.

    The life was one of extreme deprivation and uncertainty and physically demanding as well.

    And even while at court, men cherished an artistic and philosophical tradition that held this life as the highest, and yearned for when they could adopt it.

    Next, let us consider the question of reward - typically, the young man competes and works and the true reward of his labors only comes later in life, when he is established and successful. That's when he has the most money, status, honor, and respect, and can really enjoy what he worked for.

    To give all that up? Maybe there something more important.

    Two more crucial points must be made -

    One, men did not take up this life in extreme old age, although it extended into old age - they began it typically in their late 40s and 50s when men are considered at the peak of their worth, mature, experienced, fully mastered their profession, with social connections, etc.

    Moreover, countless young men took up the life too, and this was socially validated - one of China's greatest poets and one of my favorite, Tao Chien, was repeatedly invited to a position and court but despised it so much that he fled back to his ancestral farm which was mired in poverty, his house in disrepair with barely enough to eat, in a depopulated part of the country, and where he lived in abject poverty - but delighted in endless changing of the seasons and wandering the countryside (he did have a family though).

    He described his time at court as his tem year mistake.

    Finally, as to sainthood requiring service to the community - in a way yes, but not as you think. Countless Christian saints lived in remote islands or caves with barely any contact with any community, especially in the earlier years of Christianity. And lets not forget the Desert Father's here! And yet this itself was felt to be a service to the community and mankind, because living a holy life was intrinsically valuable and reflected well on all mankind. The point was not tangible social utility. In addition, their mere example was felt to be comforting and consoling and provided a valuable signpost to the true ends of life for everyone, which not activity in this world but becoming One with the Infinite.

    The Chinese hermits would often write poems in their retreat that would be read by later generations at court, inspiring them to take up a similar life when they could.

    Of course, many saints also participated in communal life on the fringes and offered advice and consolation, especially later.

    It was only much later as the winds of modernity began swelling on the horizon ominously that it became more and more to be felt that without some tangible social utility the life of the saint or hermit had no utility - but that was the advent of the movement towards nihilism, culminating today.

    Replies: @AP, @LatW

    Countless Christian saints lived in remote islands or caves with barely any contact with any community, especially in the earlier years of Christianity. And lets not forget the Desert Father’s here!

    They were engaged in deep prayer, not tourism. And you?

    And lets not forget the Desert Father’s here!

    Also, engaged in deep prayer, rather than fun and interesting hiking.

    The Chinese hermits would often write poems in their retreat that would be read by later generations at court

    Are you doing something similar?

    The point was not tangible social utility

    Nor was the point deliberate avoidance of social utility for the sake of a consumer wilderness experience.

    You are just being a bourgeois consumer when you are out there, but in your arrogance compare yourself to these saints and poets.

    In other words, you are the opposite of those saints and poets. You are all about self-indulgence and pride:

    “A long time a go a certain Cynic philosopher proudly paraded around Athens in a moth-eaten coat, hoping that everyone would admire his contempt for convention. When Socrates met him, he said: Through the hole in your coat I see your vanity. Your dirt, too, dear sir, is self-indulgent and your self-indulgence is dirty.”

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @AP

    Sure, they were engaged in deep prayer - have you heard of the form of prayer known as contemplation, often regarded as the highest form of prayer? It is very central to the Christian tradition, especially your Orthodox, but in my view it achieved it's highest expression in certain Chan and Taoist sects.

    In contemplation, you.....do nothing. You relax, still your mind, or simply watch it, and simply be. Preferably in some natural setting. Without the "active", grasping element of the mind constantly interfering, your original nature as God intended may come to the fore, and your essential connection to the Divine and all of creation may manifest.

    It is, from the bourgeois perspective, a form of pure bummitude :) Only a bum would be so unproductive.

    Are you aware that the early Christian writings on fleeing to the desert stressed one of its main purposes was to realize our "true natures" as God intended free from the dross of civilization, with it's selfishness, ego, striving?

    And yes, this kind of prayer I do as much as I can in the wilderness.

    Not all Chinese hermits wrote poems. Those who had the talent. Their mere example was of incalculable value, their mere realization of the true ends of life was fruitful for all humanity.

    And my "missives" to Unz are my poetry :)

    The fruits of my forays into solitude.


    You are just being a bourgeois consumer when you are out there, but in your arrogance compare yourself to these saints and poets
     
    I already admitted I am a nothing :) I am doing it for all the wrong reasons, merely a consumer buying a status item to gain social validation in the Unz community :)

    In all seriousness, as a modern, and as a weak person of little worth, I can only manifest this noble ancient lifestyle in a broken and fractured and heavily impure and compromised way. You're quite correct.

    But the message - that I will l, and can, maintain.
  674. @Goldeneye4
    Anatoly Karlin now posing as an animal rights activist / pro-vegetarian. Yet another of his identity changes. total schizoid. Only a few years ago he was attacking vegetarians and vegans caling them "losers" and saying he eats beef.

    A tale of two tweets:

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/1616478750467555345

    https://twitter.com/powerfultakes/status/1171771252488515585

    Take your meds anatoly!

    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Anatoly_Karlin#Anti-veganism_and_anti-vegetarianism

    Replies: @songbird, @silviosilver, @TalhaAtUnz2, @QCIC

    No contradiction, this is easy–> AK found a girlfriend. Probably not the girl from McDonalds as it was known back then.

    Eat more kale!

    Death to incels!

    Slava Rossiya!

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @QCIC

    AK understood what's right for him when his friend took a dive from his eight floor balcony in Moscow and when the war in Ukraine started going south. Now he tweets what needs to be tweeted to virtue signal to "the adult in the room" that he has changed for the better and is ready to go along with the plan, promote it if needed and hopefully play a part. He actually started his transformation during the January 6th Capitol ploy, and was well advanced into his metamorphosis when he cheered Biden stealing the election. But now he has truly joined the "right side of history". Tolik is a good boy now. The chrysalis has finally broken and out of it came a beautiful butterfly...

    Replies: @QCIC

  675. @TalhaAtUnz2
    @Goldeneye4

    Quite interesting...what an evolution over the last few years...🤔

    Is he still a tranhumanist enthusiast and cheerleading for the Singularity?

    Peace.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    yes he is.

    I spoke with him a year ago. He’s doing fine

  676. @LatW
    @AaronB


    And these were old men, when you’d think comfort and security were most desirable, and one can bask in the dignity, respect, and honor society bestows on the old after a long life spent in it’s service, amid plentiful children and grandchildren – but no, they gave all that up to be – mere bums – and society recognized this as laudable!
     
    It might actually be more liberating at this very old age. Besides, men in their prime are valued and looked up to more by society than elders, unless these elders are wisemen or seers. And most likely, these men did not live as bums but had a simple, but comfortable abode surrounded by a lovely landscape where they could devote all the time to themselves and to observing Nature.

    Presumably, it would be much harder for a man who is, let's say, 28, 40 or even 50, to give up wealth, beautiful women or other comforts or earthly joys, so to speak. So I wouldn't say this is some sort of an "achievement", overcoming of oneself or some sacrifice, rather just a departure into a more serene, spiritual realm to spend one's older days. It's good to have that space to connect with the sublime at that age.

    All due respect, but I would value a younger man who left all those behind at his prime than a much older guy. A younger person can also experience epiphanies. Granted, the young have pure, open minds and are also unencumbered, similar to the elderly. But a young mind perceives the world acutely, absorbs the world more intensely.

    You also mentioned sainthood. All due respect, but sainthood involves much, much more than what you describe. Sainthood isn't achieved merely by abandoning society and living as an hermit. Sainthood derives from a life filled with utmost service to others, to humanity, to real people. Often sainthood involves very serious hardship that transcends human experience.

    Replies: @LatW, @AaronB, @TalhaAtUnz2, @silviosilver

    But a young mind perceives the world acutely, absorbs the world more intensely.

    As well as more narrowly, rashly, and impractically. Although at least, being young, they have much time to atone for the folly. It is the young mind that insists on imbibing the wisdom of the ages, enabling it to resist the siren call of youthful idealism, that I reserve my respect for.

    • Agree: Ivashka the fool
    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    Daniil Andreyiev once wrote about the dangers of youth - the "pits for the young ones to fall". He was right. Problem is, nowadays a lot of people never grow up, they just grow older. Growing up is always allowing one's inner child to die. Some people cannot stand the prospect of their finitude.

  677. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @AP
    @AaronB

    1. These old guys you described had done things before settling into their life of contemplation. They had long lives spent in service, children, and grandchildren. What did you accomplish before you started bumming around?

    2. Those old guys presumably weren't using drugs, robbing one another, engaging in sexual assault as a large number of modern homeless whom you admire are doing.

    3. I expect to relax in quiet contemplation also at that age. Maybe buy a home in the northern less busy parts of Lake Garda.


    you say you do not come from bourgeois stock
     
    I am 3/4 nobleman and 1/4 peasant. Neither one fits the bourgeois nor has any desire to claw into it. You on the other hand aren't escaping it, your desperate attempt to run away proves it.

    Replies: @AaronB

    1) Perhaps this is one form of social compromise then. Pay your mite to Leviathan, then pursue the true ends of human life, contemplation. It’s a start 🙂

    Of course, provision must be made for those who feel a strong vocation to a life of contemplation at an earlier age, but that can be extended once we secure the above described beachhead within mainstream society.

    2) Well, many Hindu yogis were doing drugs, and limited drug use has its place in shamanic traditions.

    But the excessive drug use is an attempt to escape from a society entirely based on not recognizing the true ends of human life. A society that freely offers a route to a life of contemplation – or less loftily, simply a route out of the rat race which destroys our souls – will see a precipitous drop in drug use and general dysfunctional behavior.

    It is only a society that insists on seeing the rat race as the only legitimate path that engenders mass drug use and anti-social behavior.

    At the moment, our dysfunctional drug users are also our canaries in the coal mine – they embody a stark warning to us and a clarion call to wake up, but we – in our thickheadedness – treat it merely as a problem of social technique.

    We moderns have not yet recovered the ability to go “meta” and question our values, an ability gradually lost as modernity impoverished our conceptual categories.

    This advanced cognitive technique cannot survive in an era of impoverished factual language.

    3) Ah, but I want to see you taking up a loin cloth and sleeping on a bed of pine needles 🙂 And in your 50s, not old age.

    Yes, you are a nobleman, but that occupation has sadly gone defunct, just as 18th century carriage builder is no longer a viable occupation.

    Today, the elite are the bourgeois – whose values and mentality you naturally seek to embody. I think you are using some dim family tradition of past glory to motivate a social striving that is as sordid as it has always been.

    But traditionally, the nobility despised bourgeois values of striving and hard work, and at least aspired to lives of refined leisure – a preserve free from the taint of sordid social striving – and were more likely to become contemplatives or sybarites, both occupations closer to the homeless you despise than your bourgeois social striving.

    I almost wish you were a nobleman, and it wasn’t just some dim family tradition with no relevance to today.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @AaronB


    Of course, provision must be made for those who feel a strong vocation to a life of contemplation at an earlier age,
     
    There it is, the money quote. And it really is a "money" quote. Pay up, fund my "vocation" - my life of easy leisure, which for the sake of conning you, I shall pretend is a life of spartan self-sacrifice.

    I know you hate being pinned down on concrete specificities, but here the question must be put simply and straightforwardly: what's in it for the rest of society? Those Taoist hermits you rave on about, what's been their legacy? If they had never existed, this world would be worse off how exactly? (Note: this isn't a question about how the world would have fared without their philosophy, but about going off to live as hermits.)


    A society that freely offers a route to a life of contemplation – or less loftily, simply a route out of the rat race which destroys our souls – will see a precipitous drop in drug use and general dysfunctional behavior.
     
    Dream on.

    Rather than six months in the wilderness, next time how about six months on urban safari? Why not spend some actual time in the company of your fellow travelers? Are you afraid it might prove a sobering experience?


    At the moment, our dysfunctional drug users are also our canaries in the coal mine – they embody a stark warning to us and a clarion call to wake up, but we – in our thickheadedness – treat it merely as a problem of social technique.
     
    Aaron's variation on the commie criminals-are-noble-revolutionaries theme. And just as wrongheaded.

    But traditionally, the nobility despised bourgeois values of striving and hard work, and at least aspired to lives of refined leisure – a preserve free from the taint of sordid social striving – and were more likely to become contemplatives or sybarites, both occupations closer to the homeless you despise than your bourgeois social striving.
     
    Confirmation bias on steroids, just like your art/civilization "theory."

    Replies: @AaronB

    , @AP
    @AaronB


    At the moment, our dysfunctional drug users are also our canaries in the coal mine – they embody a stark warning to us and a clarion call to wake up, but we – in our thickheadedness – treat it merely as a problem of social technique.
     
    They are suffering people who engage in self-indulgent sins that harm them. The humane and loving thing to do is to help them, not celebrate their degradation.

    nobleman, but that occupation has sadly gone defunct
     
    The bourgeois can only think in bourgeois terms. It is not an "occupation" and not everything is an "occupation."

    But traditionally, the nobility despised bourgeois values of striving and hard work, and at least aspired to lives of refined leisure
     
    What nonsense.

    Traditionally the nobility were focused on service, from highest to lowest. And this meant a lot of hard work. I knew my grandfather well, he worked 60-80 hours weekly building up and creating institutions that benefited the people (I will be vague about this to avoid doxxing) and refusing offers to sell out that were worth tens of millions. Yes, he had servants and a driver, but this doesn't preclude hard work. Military officers, a common vocation among noblemen, gave their lives in service unflinchingly. Greek Catholic priests of gentry background, in addition to engaging in the usual parish work, organized schools for the villagers, agitated against evils such as alcoholism, even used their lands as "model farms" to teach the peasants better agricultural methods. Running cities and counties required hard work. My relatives did all of these things. Not a single one was a lazy degenerate. The Christian idea “Where much is given, much is expected” was a way of life. How different from the times of wicked Rome.

    The bourgeois usurpers created fairytales of leisure and parasitism which you, the bourgeois, take for granted. And you, the bourgeois, can only think of hard work as "striving."

    Of course, the bourgeois system has in the end proved to a very efficient way of building up universal prosperity and ameliorating suffering, much better at that than the old order, so I do not condemn it. In its own impersonal way it has been far more effective than the nobility had been in hundreds of years when it comes to helping others. Credit should be given where it is due. But you are a bourgeois who has rejected the one great thing the bourgeois have done: harness striving for the greater good. You just want to consume.

    And of course one can work hard and help others in the modern bourgeois world. Not only in obvious fields such as research or medicine.

  678. @QCIC
    @Goldeneye4

    No contradiction, this is easy--> AK found a girlfriend. Probably not the girl from McDonalds as it was known back then.

    Eat more kale!

    Death to incels!

    Slava Rossiya!

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    AK understood what’s right for him when his friend took a dive from his eight floor balcony in Moscow and when the war in Ukraine started going south. Now he tweets what needs to be tweeted to virtue signal to “the adult in the room” that he has changed for the better and is ready to go along with the plan, promote it if needed and hopefully play a part. He actually started his transformation during the January 6th Capitol ploy, and was well advanced into his metamorphosis when he cheered Biden stealing the election. But now he has truly joined the “right side of history”. Tolik is a good boy now. The chrysalis has finally broken and out of it came a beautiful butterfly…

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, that's a lot darker than my theory :(

  679. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @AP
    @AaronB


    Countless Christian saints lived in remote islands or caves with barely any contact with any community, especially in the earlier years of Christianity. And lets not forget the Desert Father’s here!
     
    They were engaged in deep prayer, not tourism. And you?

    And lets not forget the Desert Father’s here!
     
    Also, engaged in deep prayer, rather than fun and interesting hiking.

    The Chinese hermits would often write poems in their retreat that would be read by later generations at court
     
    Are you doing something similar?

    The point was not tangible social utility
     
    Nor was the point deliberate avoidance of social utility for the sake of a consumer wilderness experience.

    You are just being a bourgeois consumer when you are out there, but in your arrogance compare yourself to these saints and poets.

    In other words, you are the opposite of those saints and poets. You are all about self-indulgence and pride:

    “A long time a go a certain Cynic philosopher proudly paraded around Athens in a moth-eaten coat, hoping that everyone would admire his contempt for convention. When Socrates met him, he said: Through the hole in your coat I see your vanity. Your dirt, too, dear sir, is self-indulgent and your self-indulgence is dirty."

    Replies: @AaronB

    Sure, they were engaged in deep prayer – have you heard of the form of prayer known as contemplation, often regarded as the highest form of prayer? It is very central to the Christian tradition, especially your Orthodox, but in my view it achieved it’s highest expression in certain Chan and Taoist sects.

    In contemplation, you…..do nothing. You relax, still your mind, or simply watch it, and simply be. Preferably in some natural setting. Without the “active”, grasping element of the mind constantly interfering, your original nature as God intended may come to the fore, and your essential connection to the Divine and all of creation may manifest.

    It is, from the bourgeois perspective, a form of pure bummitude 🙂 Only a bum would be so unproductive.

    Are you aware that the early Christian writings on fleeing to the desert stressed one of its main purposes was to realize our “true natures” as God intended free from the dross of civilization, with it’s selfishness, ego, striving?

    And yes, this kind of prayer I do as much as I can in the wilderness.

    Not all Chinese hermits wrote poems. Those who had the talent. Their mere example was of incalculable value, their mere realization of the true ends of life was fruitful for all humanity.

    And my “missives” to Unz are my poetry 🙂

    The fruits of my forays into solitude.

    You are just being a bourgeois consumer when you are out there, but in your arrogance compare yourself to these saints and poets

    I already admitted I am a nothing 🙂 I am doing it for all the wrong reasons, merely a consumer buying a status item to gain social validation in the Unz community 🙂

    In all seriousness, as a modern, and as a weak person of little worth, I can only manifest this noble ancient lifestyle in a broken and fractured and heavily impure and compromised way. You’re quite correct.

    But the message – that I will l, and can, maintain.

  680. @silviosilver
    @LatW


    But a young mind perceives the world acutely, absorbs the world more intensely.
     
    As well as more narrowly, rashly, and impractically. Although at least, being young, they have much time to atone for the folly. It is the young mind that insists on imbibing the wisdom of the ages, enabling it to resist the siren call of youthful idealism, that I reserve my respect for.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Daniil Andreyiev once wrote about the dangers of youth – the “pits for the young ones to fall”. He was right. Problem is, nowadays a lot of people never grow up, they just grow older. Growing up is always allowing one’s inner child to die. Some people cannot stand the prospect of their finitude.

  681. @silviosilver
    @Goldeneye4

    Where's the contradiction? The 2023 tweets are descriptive, not prescriptive. I dislike it, but I agree with his prognosis. Imagine in the very distant future humankind (hopefully sans les groids :) ) sets off for other star systems in generation ships; it appears extremely doubtful we'd be lugging animal stocks along for the ride.

    As for 2019 voiding the efforts of vegan losers tweet, thanks, it's nice to be reminded of some the reasons we all used to think highly of him. Personally, I'd be willing to trade the lives of animals for the lives of vegans, one-for-one. Any takers?

    (Note to any aspiring diss right politicians. This is how you win over the hindoo/sikh constituency: one vegan for one cow. Kill two birds with one stone. Oops, was that offensive? Make it: feed two birds with one scone.)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Sher Singh

    Note to any aspiring politician – do not side with the diss right, especially in Moscow. As my father used to say : “It is good to be a Communist and to live in Paris.” We can adapt it jnto the current situation and make it into : “It is good to be a right winger nationalist and to live in Bnei Brak”.

  682. @AaronB
    @AP

    1) Perhaps this is one form of social compromise then. Pay your mite to Leviathan, then pursue the true ends of human life, contemplation. It's a start :)

    Of course, provision must be made for those who feel a strong vocation to a life of contemplation at an earlier age, but that can be extended once we secure the above described beachhead within mainstream society.

    2) Well, many Hindu yogis were doing drugs, and limited drug use has its place in shamanic traditions.

    But the excessive drug use is an attempt to escape from a society entirely based on not recognizing the true ends of human life. A society that freely offers a route to a life of contemplation - or less loftily, simply a route out of the rat race which destroys our souls - will see a precipitous drop in drug use and general dysfunctional behavior.

    It is only a society that insists on seeing the rat race as the only legitimate path that engenders mass drug use and anti-social behavior.

    At the moment, our dysfunctional drug users are also our canaries in the coal mine - they embody a stark warning to us and a clarion call to wake up, but we - in our thickheadedness - treat it merely as a problem of social technique.

    We moderns have not yet recovered the ability to go "meta" and question our values, an ability gradually lost as modernity impoverished our conceptual categories.

    This advanced cognitive technique cannot survive in an era of impoverished factual language.

    3) Ah, but I want to see you taking up a loin cloth and sleeping on a bed of pine needles :) And in your 50s, not old age.

    Yes, you are a nobleman, but that occupation has sadly gone defunct, just as 18th century carriage builder is no longer a viable occupation.

    Today, the elite are the bourgeois - whose values and mentality you naturally seek to embody. I think you are using some dim family tradition of past glory to motivate a social striving that is as sordid as it has always been.

    But traditionally, the nobility despised bourgeois values of striving and hard work, and at least aspired to lives of refined leisure - a preserve free from the taint of sordid social striving - and were more likely to become contemplatives or sybarites, both occupations closer to the homeless you despise than your bourgeois social striving.

    I almost wish you were a nobleman, and it wasn't just some dim family tradition with no relevance to today.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @AP

    Of course, provision must be made for those who feel a strong vocation to a life of contemplation at an earlier age,

    There it is, the money quote. And it really is a “money” quote. Pay up, fund my “vocation” – my life of easy leisure, which for the sake of conning you, I shall pretend is a life of spartan self-sacrifice.

    I know you hate being pinned down on concrete specificities, but here the question must be put simply and straightforwardly: what’s in it for the rest of society? Those Taoist hermits you rave on about, what’s been their legacy? If they had never existed, this world would be worse off how exactly? (Note: this isn’t a question about how the world would have fared without their philosophy, but about going off to live as hermits.)

    A society that freely offers a route to a life of contemplation – or less loftily, simply a route out of the rat race which destroys our souls – will see a precipitous drop in drug use and general dysfunctional behavior.

    Dream on.

    Rather than six months in the wilderness, next time how about six months on urban safari? Why not spend some actual time in the company of your fellow travelers? Are you afraid it might prove a sobering experience?

    At the moment, our dysfunctional drug users are also our canaries in the coal mine – they embody a stark warning to us and a clarion call to wake up, but we – in our thickheadedness – treat it merely as a problem of social technique.

    Aaron’s variation on the commie criminals-are-noble-revolutionaries theme. And just as wrongheaded.

    But traditionally, the nobility despised bourgeois values of striving and hard work, and at least aspired to lives of refined leisure – a preserve free from the taint of sordid social striving – and were more likely to become contemplatives or sybarites, both occupations closer to the homeless you despise than your bourgeois social striving.

    Confirmation bias on steroids, just like your art/civilization “theory.”

    • Agree: AP
    • Replies: @AaronB
    @silviosilver

    When I say provision must be made, I merely mean it must became a socially validated choice, and economic conditions must be restructured to facilitate it (affordable housing rather than artificially high rents favoring oligarchs, huge rise in minimum wage in line with actual contributions labor makes to profit, land reform to end the total monopoly the wealthy and the government have on land (beginning with the Enclosure Act in England, which was basically just theft), which allows them to completely structure the economy according to their principles).

    Nothing more sinister than this, Silvio, and certainly not a public subsidy, God forbid - merely a return of all that the rich and powerful steal through totally monopolizing land and structuring the economy to concentrate wealth in their hands.


    what’s in it for the rest of society? Those Taoist hermits you rave on about, what’s been their legacy? If they had never existed, this world would be worse off how exactly? (Note: this isn’t a question about how the world would have fared without their philosophy, but about going off to live as hermits.)
     
    I explained this, but you sir, are an inattentive reader :)

    The benefits to the rest of society are various and manifold, quite aside from the obvious justice and spiritual pleasure of allowing those with different personalities and values to live as they see fit and not unfairly structuring the entire system to reflect entirely one-sided values and coercing everyone to participate.(perhaps the question should be, what's in it for us letting the wealthy and powerful structure the system entirely in their favor :) )

    1) That some section of society drops out of the rat race to focus on higher things reminds everyone that the true ends of human life are not ephemera like making money and social status games, but that we are called to beauty and love - a service of incalculable and even indispensable worth.

    2) To provide consolation and succor to those who wish to but cannot escape the rat race - a ray of light and hope in the darkness of their condition that allows them to keep on living.

    3) To introduce a leavening agent into society - a vivid reminder of an alternative set of values, that will have the effect of limiting the scope and intensity of the rat race in favor of humanity and compassion, and to integrate elements of the contemplative life into everyday life as much as possible, leading to greater contentment and happiness.

    4) To actually sustain the world - if no one is pursuing the true end of human life as God intended, and all the multitudes and hosts of humanity are lost on trivia and ephemera like making money and playing status games, why should God allow the world to continue?

    5) And most trivially, from the social perspective to defuse the powder keg of revolutionaries and restive malcontents who are often thwarted spiritualists or proto-spiritualists who see no choice but to work towards toppling the social system that provides them with no outlet, and to reduce dysfunctional and anti-social behavior, drug use and homelessness of the pernicious kind (in favor of the good kind) across the board.

    6) To inspire those that are fitted to take the next step into a life of contemplation and connection to the Infinite, but lack the courage in the face of overwhelming social pressure to remain focused on ephemera and trivia.

    7) What is the point of the "Taoist philosophy" if not a single person lives according to it's principles and values?

    8) The "rest of society" has no right to deny happiness to any minority - a human being is not "the property" of society, and a society that allows various divergent personality types the freedom to pursue their bliss is better for everyone, provided it doesn't interfere with anyone else (no, losing their "productive capacity" to enrich you does not count as interfering with you).

    Confirmation bias on steroids, just like your art/civilization “theory.”
     
    Ok, so you don't know much about European aristocrats (or those of ancient Greece, or China). When two educated people from a common culture discuss certain topics there is an assumed background of shared information, not every detail can be "proven" (without recourse to large tomes of cultural history).

    I'm not saying your stupid, you're one of the smarter people here, but there are obviously large lacunae in your cultural education (although today the cultural consensus has broken down).

    To any educated person in say 1950, my above comment on aristocrats would have been completely uncontroversial and would have served as a perfectly acceptable starting point for a conversation.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  683. @AaronB
    @LatW

    You make a good point, but let's develop this theme a bit further and see if we can come up with a more comprehensive and rounded view.

    Typically, youth is far more accepting of adventure and hardship than old age, where you are more frail and tired, and where typically people crave comfort and security far more. Would you disagree with this?

    It is far more difficult for an old man to wear a loincloth and wander the mountains, sleeping on a bed of pine needles, eating skimpy food that you can't always count on getting, suffering through the heat of the summer and the cold of the winter, without being able to count on the support of family and friends. This is much more a young man's game.

    And it's important to clarify exactly what sort of life they gave it all up for - you seem to imagine it was retirement to a comfortable, well appointed, country estate. Lol no.

    In the Hindu tradition, the essence was to strip oneself of all but the bare essentials so there is nothing between you and the Divine. Poverty was essential.

    In the Chinese, one aspired to live in a bare bones thatched hut that leaked in the rain, had no insulation, sleep on a straw mat, have perhaps one Buddhist sutra or Taoist scroll, and spend your days wandering the mountains. Food was scanty and barely sufficient, often harvested from the mountain itself.

    The point was - Nature in its magnificence was all one needed and the more stuff you had the less you were One with it.

    The life was one of extreme deprivation and uncertainty and physically demanding as well.

    And even while at court, men cherished an artistic and philosophical tradition that held this life as the highest, and yearned for when they could adopt it.

    Next, let us consider the question of reward - typically, the young man competes and works and the true reward of his labors only comes later in life, when he is established and successful. That's when he has the most money, status, honor, and respect, and can really enjoy what he worked for.

    To give all that up? Maybe there something more important.

    Two more crucial points must be made -

    One, men did not take up this life in extreme old age, although it extended into old age - they began it typically in their late 40s and 50s when men are considered at the peak of their worth, mature, experienced, fully mastered their profession, with social connections, etc.

    Moreover, countless young men took up the life too, and this was socially validated - one of China's greatest poets and one of my favorite, Tao Chien, was repeatedly invited to a position and court but despised it so much that he fled back to his ancestral farm which was mired in poverty, his house in disrepair with barely enough to eat, in a depopulated part of the country, and where he lived in abject poverty - but delighted in endless changing of the seasons and wandering the countryside (he did have a family though).

    He described his time at court as his tem year mistake.

    Finally, as to sainthood requiring service to the community - in a way yes, but not as you think. Countless Christian saints lived in remote islands or caves with barely any contact with any community, especially in the earlier years of Christianity. And lets not forget the Desert Father's here! And yet this itself was felt to be a service to the community and mankind, because living a holy life was intrinsically valuable and reflected well on all mankind. The point was not tangible social utility. In addition, their mere example was felt to be comforting and consoling and provided a valuable signpost to the true ends of life for everyone, which not activity in this world but becoming One with the Infinite.

    The Chinese hermits would often write poems in their retreat that would be read by later generations at court, inspiring them to take up a similar life when they could.

    Of course, many saints also participated in communal life on the fringes and offered advice and consolation, especially later.

    It was only much later as the winds of modernity began swelling on the horizon ominously that it became more and more to be felt that without some tangible social utility the life of the saint or hermit had no utility - but that was the advent of the movement towards nihilism, culminating today.

    Replies: @AP, @LatW

    Typically, youth is far more accepting of adventure and hardship than old age, where you are more frail and tired, and where typically people crave comfort and security far more. Would you disagree with this?

    It depends. At a very old age, one has already completed their adventures and has been able to enjoy certain things at the peak of their life. It might be easier at that point to leave those things behind, they may even appear as a burden, the middle age is when you try to cope with life’s big problems and try to solve them, at an older age, I imagine, one would prefer to let go of them and maybe turn to more spiritual endeavors.

    [MORE]

    In the Old Prussian religion, the skygod was represented in three forms – as a youth wearing a green wreath, as a man in his prime, God Perkunas (Father Thunder), wearing a wreath of red flames (intense life at one’s prime), and, finally, as an old man, wearing a white headscarf as a symbol of the underworld. This symbolism seems quite fitting.

    As to comfort and security, one doesn’t really need all that much to feel somewhat secure and comfortable. Once, when traveling through the West, we encountered an older guy who was the guardian of the campgrounds, and he was all alone there, in his rather comfortable but modest trailer, with a beautiful, large, white hound. The woods where he lived were very wild, dense, full of wild animals. He had very little but he was totally fine. He was well into his 60s, maybe even older and doing quite well. A younger person may not be as inclined to choose such a lifestyle, especially if they had a spouse, children, a few more milestones to achieve in their career, maybe other aspirations.

    In the Hindu tradition, the essence was to strip oneself of all but the bare essentials so there is nothing between you and the Divine. Poverty was essential.

    Well, this is ascetic praxis, poverty is not a goal in itself here, just a kind of a spiritual tool, a means to an end.

    spend your days wandering the mountains. Food was scanty and barely sufficient, often harvested from the mountain itself.

    There is the Japanese shinto tradition of mountain worship. Sangaku shinkō. The mountains are divine and the abode of ancestral spirits. With streams that run through the mountain and the forests nearby. There are resources there, even if scarce, it is called “ascetic cuisine”. The Japanese even create modern cuisine reminiscent of these ancient spiritual practices:

    https://www.tsuruokagastronomy.com/shojin-ryori

    “Since days of old, mountain priests (yamabushi) have only eaten ascetic meals served at temple lodgings. They believed that eating meals sourced from the mountains they wandered would help them form better connections to their natural landscape, as well as absorb the mountain’s spiritual energy, ultimately allowing them to appreciate nature’s blessings more fully.”

    In the US there are streams that run through rocks, there are pools filled with glacial water coming from the mountains. The water is ice cold, but on a hot summer day, once you get used to it, you can fully immerse yourself in it and it can be an amazing, refreshing experience.

    One, men did not take up this life in extreme old age, although it extended into old age – they began it typically in their late 40s and 50s when men are considered at the peak of their worth, mature, experienced, fully mastered their profession, with social connections, etc.

    If so, then I accept your argument. I had previously thought you meant really old age, as I said above, to give things up in your 40s, 50s is a bit early and could be a bit of a sacrifice.

    Finally, as to sainthood requiring service to the community – in a way yes, but not as you think. Countless Christian saints lived in remote islands or caves with barely any contact with any community, especially in the earlier years of Christianity. And yet this itself was felt to be a service to the community and mankind, because living a holy life was intrinsically valuable and reflected well on all mankind.

    This is true, this was intrinsically valuable, as an example of purity and chastity. This still remains to some extent in our secular society, when even if not religious, people view a priest as intrinsically valuable (even aside from their actual service).

    It was only much later as the winds of modernity began swelling on the horizon ominously that it became more and more to be felt that without some tangible social utility the life of the saint or hermit had no utility – but that was the advent of the movement towards nihilism, culminating today.

    I understand your point, but being an hermit is not for everyone. And just because someone chooses to live outside of society or to live in poverty, doesn’t mean they should be elevated, as it seemed you insisted in the other thread. But it might be that you meant the idea as such, not actual examples of real people.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @LatW

    Yes, real old age can be a time to embrace spiritual pursuits, I'd agree with you there, but the embrace of a life of hardship and wandering seems like an extra step, and renunciation of city life and family and wealth, as well.

    But at least you seem to agree that at least at some point in life, there are more important things than the social game. That's good.

    I'd also totally agree with you that we need very little in the way of comfort and security to feel content :) Sometimes it takes old age to discover this, but it really applies to any time in life.

    Thanks for the example of the Japanese mountain priests, I like that very much.

    The three personas of the pagan God sounds similar to Hindu ideas about the stages of life - but the point is usually one of ascending value. It may be appropriate for a young man to live on the strife of the world in his season, but it's preparation for a much higher stage - renunciation and contemplation.

    I'm not saying that all drop outs are on the religious path, although I do maintain that many are proto-spiritualists who did not know how to find the path in a society that utterly disvalues it - but even ordinary drop outs from the rat race should be recognized as making a legitimate choice that has some spiritual worth, and society should be structured to accommodate them rather than insist on harnessing their productive potential to enrich the wealthy. I don't mean subsidies, but a path to modest and minimal self support that doesn't eat up all their time, steal their self respect, or deaden their souls.

    As you say, dropping out isn't for everyone - but neither is the rat race.

    Replies: @LatW

  684. @Ivashka the fool
    I might have been right about Arestovitch and the helicopter crash. Especially moving because in the beginning of the discussion he mentions yours truly as the national subconscious archetype of the Russian people. I am truly flattered.

    Jokes aside, strong interview, if not killed this guy will go far. References to archetypes and an intuitive feeling of where the whole situation is going and how it could be turned around. I like the man.

    For Russian speakers only, sorry but they don't even try speaking Ukrainian. Those who will be capable of watching, thinking and realizing what game they're playing would realize why they speak the "language of the enemy"



    https://youtu.be/QEvuI3Ln6Gg

    Replies: @LatW

    Especially moving because in the beginning of the discussion he mentions yours truly as the national subconscious archetype of the Russian people. I am truly flattered.

    LOL. They do these chat series where they all sit around the table eating cake (must be Kiev torte) and discuss these grandiose geopolitical visions for Ukraine. I guess as a Russian, one must be mellow and tolerant enough, as well as with a sense of humor, to not be triggered and truly enjoy some of these gems they produce.

    References to archetypes and an intuitive feeling of where the whole situation is going and how it could be turned around. I like the man.

    Me too. Definitely not boring.

    This archetype that he talks about that is supposedly characteristic of the Ukrainian nation is not really unique to just them. Other EE nations sometimes take out their worst emotions on their own and envy their own most (this is a huge flaw). Plus, everyone was very traumatized by what happened in Dnipro.

    thinking and realizing what game they’re playing would realize why they speak the “language of the enemy”

    Well, the Russophone Kyiv has produced some strong, ambitious patriots. 🙂 I still have to get used to how he and other Russophone Ukrainians call Russians “they”, while speaking their language. It simply means that no one has a monopoly on the Russian language. I guess when you aspire to be the real heir of the Kievan Rus, it doesn’t matter which Rus language you speak.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW


    I guess when you aspire to be the real heir of the Kievan Rus, it doesn’t matter which Rus language you speak.
     
    Yes, this is extremely important, because these people start to think, talk and act as a subject of geopolitics, not as an object. They start to think as a center of a territory, not a border. I have asked in the past why not claim directly the name of Rus instead of going along with a name that suggests a limitrophe frontier status? Ukrainians usually answer along the lines of what Kuchma wrote 20 years ago : "Ukraine is not Russia". Well hello, EusFed is not Russia either. So who's gonna be Russia in the end if everyone eschews the honor of taking and upholding the heritage of Rus in a straightforward manner, without ambivalence or ambiguity?



    And it is easier to be a subject when you speak a language most people around you understand, and declare an open and flexible identity. They could go very far if they keep moving that way.

    Moreover, Arestovych citing Strugatsky brothers is a direct call to people like me, who have all grown up reading their books. He talks about Schedrovitskyi (the methodologist who invented the Russkyi Mir concept) in approving terms. Schedrovitsky was the mentor of Sergei Pereslegin, while Arestovych alludes to some of the themes people such as Galkovsky and Fursov discuss, acknowledging them from an Ukrainian perspective. Mentions tangentially Pelevin's novel SNUFF, which I personally find quite on point describing the current conflict between the two Rus people. Talks about Khazaria as someone who would have read Gumilyov would do.

    The impression he gives is that he might one day suddenly look into the camera and say : "Russian - speaking intellectuals of the World - unite ! Your chains are the only thing that you have to lose. " This guy is some actor alright. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he is an adept of Chaos Magick. He might really pull out something important and interesting if he keeps trying, which I believe he will.

    Now let's see if he can survive (first of all intellectually survive his cocaine snorting habits).

    Replies: @LatW

  685. @silviosilver
    @Goldeneye4

    Where's the contradiction? The 2023 tweets are descriptive, not prescriptive. I dislike it, but I agree with his prognosis. Imagine in the very distant future humankind (hopefully sans les groids :) ) sets off for other star systems in generation ships; it appears extremely doubtful we'd be lugging animal stocks along for the ride.

    As for 2019 voiding the efforts of vegan losers tweet, thanks, it's nice to be reminded of some the reasons we all used to think highly of him. Personally, I'd be willing to trade the lives of animals for the lives of vegans, one-for-one. Any takers?

    (Note to any aspiring diss right politicians. This is how you win over the hindoo/sikh constituency: one vegan for one cow. Kill two birds with one stone. Oops, was that offensive? Make it: feed two birds with one scone.)

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Sher Singh

    😉

  686. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Where did I hate on Polska ?

    I was just surprised that they do not teach you the prehistory of your people. Of all the Slavs the Poles should be the ones to claim the Tollense battle, the Corded Ware, the Unitice and the Lusatian Cultures.

    If they tell nothing of the above in school then there must be a reason.

    (And I think I know what this reason is... )

    🙂

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Well, https://www.unz.com/aanglin/wef-polish-president-urges-more-military-support-for-zelenskopolis/

    …many haters of Poland there!

    You are just typical Russian, thinking about in Poland primarily in terms of Catholicism, whereas Catholicism in Poland as a semi-national identity is really the time between the Counter-Reformation and Partitions.

    Well, they probably don’t teach about those archaeological cultures in school (with small exceptions, for example Lusatian culture’s Biskupin is NOT Polish, probably due to Lusatians cremations habits) because they have bigger problems at home, so to say. The official school version claims that Poland was a union of smaller tribes like Lędzianie, Ślężanie, Wiślanie etc… but archaeology has been unable to provide enough proofs for their existence.

    The newest version of Polish origins, not yet in school books, suggests that Poland was a creation of Great Moravians, who left Great Moravia. The arguments for that are, for example, the same building techniques in Great Moravia and early Polish grody, and slave trade as substantial source of income in early Poland and Great Moravia (since you don’t enslave your own people, the enslavers must have come from somewhere else).
    Interestingly this theory is somehow supported by one of legends dealing with Polish origins, namely, “There were once three brothers: Lech, Czech, Rus. They went in three different directions and founded 3 countries: Poland, Czechia (Bohemia), and Kiev Russia (alternative version to Varangians here)”. However, the legend never says who was the father of 3 brothers . Well, now we know: he was some Great Moravia ruler/prince!

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neolithic_circular_enclosures_in_Central_Europe

    Recently more and more rondels are discovered in Poland from air. The presence of one close to Biskupin suggests some kind of continuity between Biskupin settlement and rondel, and then between Neolithic population and Lusatian culture. On the other hand, it suggests less continuity between Lusatians and Indo-Europeans.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    I don't think of Poland in Catholic terms, that would be an understatement. I am much more radical than that : for me the Lyakhs are just latinized Moskals. As soon as they would start using the Great Moravian Slav script (that is Кириллица) they will suddenly feel an upsurge of brotherly affection towards their estranged Eastern brethren. (Just kidding 😋)



    Now about all you wrote above, it is not contradictive or mutually exclusive at all and might all exactly come together to explain the genesis of not only Poland, but historical Slavdom in general. It is all part and parcel of the same historical process.

    Have you ever heard of the Gnezdovo necropolis where the largest princely kurgans have shown influences of the Great Moravia ?

    Have you noticed that Great Moravia has included Noricum where Central European Veneti lived in Roman Empire times ?

    (That's where the name of Vienna comes from. From these Veneti of old, through the Latin Vindabona castrum in Pannonia).

    That according to Guzel and Lomonosov, the early Slav tribes came from the Danube and were there called Noritsy / Noricy (Норици). ?

    Perhaps you might be familiar with the hagiographic Life of Saint Severinus that also mentions Rugians in Noricum during the Migrations Period ?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severinus_of_Noricum

    The same Rugians that gave its name to the island of Rugen. The last pagan Wends of Arkona, but described in the times of Saint Severinus as Eastern Germanic tribesmen. Just like the Vandals who had Alans as allies. Those Vandals who were in early middle ages sometimes equated with Rus.

    Add the Huns into the mix, whose multi-ethnic subjects used a Balto-Slav dialect as a creole - koine language.

    Now put the pieces of the puzzle together. It has taken me a couple of years a dozen years ago, but it was worth it.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  687. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, https://www.unz.com/aanglin/wef-polish-president-urges-more-military-support-for-zelenskopolis/

    ...many haters of Poland there!

    You are just typical Russian, thinking about in Poland primarily in terms of Catholicism, whereas Catholicism in Poland as a semi-national identity is really the time between the Counter-Reformation and Partitions.

    Well, they probably don't teach about those archaeological cultures in school (with small exceptions, for example Lusatian culture's Biskupin is NOT Polish, probably due to Lusatians cremations habits) because they have bigger problems at home, so to say. The official school version claims that Poland was a union of smaller tribes like Lędzianie, Ślężanie, Wiślanie etc... but archaeology has been unable to provide enough proofs for their existence.

    The newest version of Polish origins, not yet in school books, suggests that Poland was a creation of Great Moravians, who left Great Moravia. The arguments for that are, for example, the same building techniques in Great Moravia and early Polish grody, and slave trade as substantial source of income in early Poland and Great Moravia (since you don't enslave your own people, the enslavers must have come from somewhere else).
    Interestingly this theory is somehow supported by one of legends dealing with Polish origins, namely, "There were once three brothers: Lech, Czech, Rus. They went in three different directions and founded 3 countries: Poland, Czechia (Bohemia), and Kiev Russia (alternative version to Varangians here)". However, the legend never says who was the father of 3 brothers . Well, now we know: he was some Great Moravia ruler/prince!

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Ivashka the fool

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neolithic_circular_enclosures_in_Central_Europe

    Recently more and more rondels are discovered in Poland from air. The presence of one close to Biskupin suggests some kind of continuity between Biskupin settlement and rondel, and then between Neolithic population and Lusatian culture. On the other hand, it suggests less continuity between Lusatians and Indo-Europeans.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    But of course there was a continuity, it's just that they integrated various non - Indo-European cultural influences.



    Corded Ware folks coexisted and interacted with the Tripyllian, the Megalithic, the Bell-Beaker, the Seima-Turbino, the Akozino-Malar etc. But they stayed more or less the same people.

    Follow the sequence: Corded Ware - Battle Axe - Unetice - Lusatian - pre-Balto-Slav / Veneti - Balto-Slav - Balty & Slovene - Slavs - Czech / Lekh / Rus .

    Same population through millenia, in more or less constant territory with admixture and influence from the neighboring ethnic groups and cultures.

    I mean that is the most logical view. Why should it have been otherwise?

    (To please and placate our Bell Beaker descended "partners" to the west and / or our Akozino - Malar & Sargat descended "friends" to the north?)

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  688. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @silviosilver
    @AaronB


    Of course, provision must be made for those who feel a strong vocation to a life of contemplation at an earlier age,
     
    There it is, the money quote. And it really is a "money" quote. Pay up, fund my "vocation" - my life of easy leisure, which for the sake of conning you, I shall pretend is a life of spartan self-sacrifice.

    I know you hate being pinned down on concrete specificities, but here the question must be put simply and straightforwardly: what's in it for the rest of society? Those Taoist hermits you rave on about, what's been their legacy? If they had never existed, this world would be worse off how exactly? (Note: this isn't a question about how the world would have fared without their philosophy, but about going off to live as hermits.)


    A society that freely offers a route to a life of contemplation – or less loftily, simply a route out of the rat race which destroys our souls – will see a precipitous drop in drug use and general dysfunctional behavior.
     
    Dream on.

    Rather than six months in the wilderness, next time how about six months on urban safari? Why not spend some actual time in the company of your fellow travelers? Are you afraid it might prove a sobering experience?


    At the moment, our dysfunctional drug users are also our canaries in the coal mine – they embody a stark warning to us and a clarion call to wake up, but we – in our thickheadedness – treat it merely as a problem of social technique.
     
    Aaron's variation on the commie criminals-are-noble-revolutionaries theme. And just as wrongheaded.

    But traditionally, the nobility despised bourgeois values of striving and hard work, and at least aspired to lives of refined leisure – a preserve free from the taint of sordid social striving – and were more likely to become contemplatives or sybarites, both occupations closer to the homeless you despise than your bourgeois social striving.
     
    Confirmation bias on steroids, just like your art/civilization "theory."

    Replies: @AaronB

    When I say provision must be made, I merely mean it must became a socially validated choice, and economic conditions must be restructured to facilitate it (affordable housing rather than artificially high rents favoring oligarchs, huge rise in minimum wage in line with actual contributions labor makes to profit, land reform to end the total monopoly the wealthy and the government have on land (beginning with the Enclosure Act in England, which was basically just theft), which allows them to completely structure the economy according to their principles).

    Nothing more sinister than this, Silvio, and certainly not a public subsidy, God forbid – merely a return of all that the rich and powerful steal through totally monopolizing land and structuring the economy to concentrate wealth in their hands.

    what’s in it for the rest of society? Those Taoist hermits you rave on about, what’s been their legacy? If they had never existed, this world would be worse off how exactly? (Note: this isn’t a question about how the world would have fared without their philosophy, but about going off to live as hermits.)

    I explained this, but you sir, are an inattentive reader 🙂

    The benefits to the rest of society are various and manifold, quite aside from the obvious justice and spiritual pleasure of allowing those with different personalities and values to live as they see fit and not unfairly structuring the entire system to reflect entirely one-sided values and coercing everyone to participate.(perhaps the question should be, what’s in it for us letting the wealthy and powerful structure the system entirely in their favor 🙂 )

    1) That some section of society drops out of the rat race to focus on higher things reminds everyone that the true ends of human life are not ephemera like making money and social status games, but that we are called to beauty and love – a service of incalculable and even indispensable worth.

    2) To provide consolation and succor to those who wish to but cannot escape the rat race – a ray of light and hope in the darkness of their condition that allows them to keep on living.

    3) To introduce a leavening agent into society – a vivid reminder of an alternative set of values, that will have the effect of limiting the scope and intensity of the rat race in favor of humanity and compassion, and to integrate elements of the contemplative life into everyday life as much as possible, leading to greater contentment and happiness.

    4) To actually sustain the world – if no one is pursuing the true end of human life as God intended, and all the multitudes and hosts of humanity are lost on trivia and ephemera like making money and playing status games, why should God allow the world to continue?

    5) And most trivially, from the social perspective to defuse the powder keg of revolutionaries and restive malcontents who are often thwarted spiritualists or proto-spiritualists who see no choice but to work towards toppling the social system that provides them with no outlet, and to reduce dysfunctional and anti-social behavior, drug use and homelessness of the pernicious kind (in favor of the good kind) across the board.

    6) To inspire those that are fitted to take the next step into a life of contemplation and connection to the Infinite, but lack the courage in the face of overwhelming social pressure to remain focused on ephemera and trivia.

    7) What is the point of the “Taoist philosophy” if not a single person lives according to it’s principles and values?

    8) The “rest of society” has no right to deny happiness to any minority – a human being is not “the property” of society, and a society that allows various divergent personality types the freedom to pursue their bliss is better for everyone, provided it doesn’t interfere with anyone else (no, losing their “productive capacity” to enrich you does not count as interfering with you).

    Confirmation bias on steroids, just like your art/civilization “theory.”

    Ok, so you don’t know much about European aristocrats (or those of ancient Greece, or China). When two educated people from a common culture discuss certain topics there is an assumed background of shared information, not every detail can be “proven” (without recourse to large tomes of cultural history).

    I’m not saying your stupid, you’re one of the smarter people here, but there are obviously large lacunae in your cultural education (although today the cultural consensus has broken down).

    To any educated person in say 1950, my above comment on aristocrats would have been completely uncontroversial and would have served as a perfectly acceptable starting point for a conversation.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @AaronB

    Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

    A few words to clear the air before I respond. I'd like you to know that I'm virtually never satisfied with the posts I address to you. Somehow I can never manage to catch myself before hitting the damn "publish comment" button, but afterwards I always feel I've come across as too agitated, too snappy, too dismissive, too much like a simplistic bumpkin incapable of contemplating what has been presented to him, as though I'm outraged someone could hold such an opinion and that it must be eradicated posthaste. That attitude's not at all conducive to an actual discussion, which after all is what I'm here for, so all credit to you for maintaining a civil tone. (If we're keeping score, you're one-up, two-up, hell ten-up on me on that count.) The same is true for my replies to most posters actually, but I think I'm on my worst behavior with you.

    IRL, I'm actually a very easy going guy, nothing at all like the abrasive asshole I can be online. Possibly that's just my imagination, but I interact with a pretty broad sweep of people of all sorts of backgrounds, and IRL if people feel you're jumping down their throat, they either get mad or leave quickly. The fact that they don't - quite the contrary - leads me to believe I'm doing something right. Then again, that's not a skill that came naturally to me. I started out in life with a very fiery temper, which got me into all sorts of bother, and it took some harsh life lessons to get me to change my ways. I suppose that I'm still, after all this time, yet to make the same transition in online interaction.

    Turning to the points you made, I'll try for once not to rush it, and just address my claim of confirmation bias. For the accusation to hold water, obviously there must be plenty of examples of whatever is being "confirmed" - otherwise no examples, no confirmation. The bias relates to ignoring examples which disconfirm the thesis you're propounding. And these, I think, abound. "Aristocrats aspired to lives of refined leisure? Oh that's hogwash" is certainly not what I meant to imply. It's that in addition to their aspirations towards refinement, they were involved in plenty of scheming and plotting - not a crime to call it "striving" - all with a view to improving their social position.

    Is it too much to believe that for many of them these activities took priority? European history (I know nothing of China, but I'll risk assuming the same was true) would have looked nothing like it did were this not the case. It's as though you'd have us believe "the man's a duke, he couldn't possibly be involved in a plot against the king, he's too intoxicated with cultural refinement for anything so worldly." And ought we always to believe that an aristocrat is up to what he claims he is up to, or is a degree of suspicion warranted? A white elite libtard waxes lyrical about diversity, so surely he fills his life with blacks at every opportunity, right? Or perhaps we're just talking past each other.

    Going back to your art theory, similarly, it's not that I believe there's nothing to it. Not at all. I have no doubt it holds true in numerous cases. But not all. Imo, not even in most cases. When it comes to discussing art in any kind of depth, I know very well I'm in over my head, so I normally don't even try. But I've read enough to know there any competing schools of thought out there (and retain some vague idea of what they're saying) to feel confident that you are being too adamant that your explanation holds true in every case. I think you're at a point where you've come up with what you believe is comprehensive philosophy of good living - and as I've said to you before, go ahead, follow your own bliss - and you're trying to shoehorn far too much into it, almost as though you think your philosophy of the good life would fall apart if you didn't.

    Replies: @AaronB, @AaronB, @AaronB

  689. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @LatW
    @AaronB


    Typically, youth is far more accepting of adventure and hardship than old age, where you are more frail and tired, and where typically people crave comfort and security far more. Would you disagree with this?
     
    It depends. At a very old age, one has already completed their adventures and has been able to enjoy certain things at the peak of their life. It might be easier at that point to leave those things behind, they may even appear as a burden, the middle age is when you try to cope with life's big problems and try to solve them, at an older age, I imagine, one would prefer to let go of them and maybe turn to more spiritual endeavors.

    In the Old Prussian religion, the skygod was represented in three forms - as a youth wearing a green wreath, as a man in his prime, God Perkunas (Father Thunder), wearing a wreath of red flames (intense life at one's prime), and, finally, as an old man, wearing a white headscarf as a symbol of the underworld. This symbolism seems quite fitting.

    As to comfort and security, one doesn't really need all that much to feel somewhat secure and comfortable. Once, when traveling through the West, we encountered an older guy who was the guardian of the campgrounds, and he was all alone there, in his rather comfortable but modest trailer, with a beautiful, large, white hound. The woods where he lived were very wild, dense, full of wild animals. He had very little but he was totally fine. He was well into his 60s, maybe even older and doing quite well. A younger person may not be as inclined to choose such a lifestyle, especially if they had a spouse, children, a few more milestones to achieve in their career, maybe other aspirations.

    In the Hindu tradition, the essence was to strip oneself of all but the bare essentials so there is nothing between you and the Divine. Poverty was essential.
     
    Well, this is ascetic praxis, poverty is not a goal in itself here, just a kind of a spiritual tool, a means to an end.

    spend your days wandering the mountains. Food was scanty and barely sufficient, often harvested from the mountain itself.
     
    There is the Japanese shinto tradition of mountain worship. Sangaku shinkō. The mountains are divine and the abode of ancestral spirits. With streams that run through the mountain and the forests nearby. There are resources there, even if scarce, it is called "ascetic cuisine". The Japanese even create modern cuisine reminiscent of these ancient spiritual practices:

    https://www.tsuruokagastronomy.com/shojin-ryori

    "Since days of old, mountain priests (yamabushi) have only eaten ascetic meals served at temple lodgings. They believed that eating meals sourced from the mountains they wandered would help them form better connections to their natural landscape, as well as absorb the mountain’s spiritual energy, ultimately allowing them to appreciate nature’s blessings more fully."

    In the US there are streams that run through rocks, there are pools filled with glacial water coming from the mountains. The water is ice cold, but on a hot summer day, once you get used to it, you can fully immerse yourself in it and it can be an amazing, refreshing experience.

    One, men did not take up this life in extreme old age, although it extended into old age – they began it typically in their late 40s and 50s when men are considered at the peak of their worth, mature, experienced, fully mastered their profession, with social connections, etc.
     
    If so, then I accept your argument. I had previously thought you meant really old age, as I said above, to give things up in your 40s, 50s is a bit early and could be a bit of a sacrifice.

    Finally, as to sainthood requiring service to the community – in a way yes, but not as you think. Countless Christian saints lived in remote islands or caves with barely any contact with any community, especially in the earlier years of Christianity. And yet this itself was felt to be a service to the community and mankind, because living a holy life was intrinsically valuable and reflected well on all mankind.
     
    This is true, this was intrinsically valuable, as an example of purity and chastity. This still remains to some extent in our secular society, when even if not religious, people view a priest as intrinsically valuable (even aside from their actual service).

    It was only much later as the winds of modernity began swelling on the horizon ominously that it became more and more to be felt that without some tangible social utility the life of the saint or hermit had no utility – but that was the advent of the movement towards nihilism, culminating today.
     
    I understand your point, but being an hermit is not for everyone. And just because someone chooses to live outside of society or to live in poverty, doesn't mean they should be elevated, as it seemed you insisted in the other thread. But it might be that you meant the idea as such, not actual examples of real people.

    Replies: @AaronB

    Yes, real old age can be a time to embrace spiritual pursuits, I’d agree with you there, but the embrace of a life of hardship and wandering seems like an extra step, and renunciation of city life and family and wealth, as well.

    But at least you seem to agree that at least at some point in life, there are more important things than the social game. That’s good.

    I’d also totally agree with you that we need very little in the way of comfort and security to feel content 🙂 Sometimes it takes old age to discover this, but it really applies to any time in life.

    Thanks for the example of the Japanese mountain priests, I like that very much.

    The three personas of the pagan God sounds similar to Hindu ideas about the stages of life – but the point is usually one of ascending value. It may be appropriate for a young man to live on the strife of the world in his season, but it’s preparation for a much higher stage – renunciation and contemplation.

    I’m not saying that all drop outs are on the religious path, although I do maintain that many are proto-spiritualists who did not know how to find the path in a society that utterly disvalues it – but even ordinary drop outs from the rat race should be recognized as making a legitimate choice that has some spiritual worth, and society should be structured to accommodate them rather than insist on harnessing their productive potential to enrich the wealthy. I don’t mean subsidies, but a path to modest and minimal self support that doesn’t eat up all their time, steal their self respect, or deaden their souls.

    As you say, dropping out isn’t for everyone – but neither is the rat race.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @AaronB


    But at least you seem to agree that at least at some point in life, there are more important things than the social game. That’s good.
     
    By social game, you mean the family and work relationships, as well as social life? Are children included in your picture?

    It sometimes feels like you are promoting MGTOW, which, in and of itself, on surface, may not seem like a harmful idea, certainly, one wouldn't want to oppress anyone, right? But in reality this can seriously destabilize things.

    I'm also not entirely sure one has to reach old age or to even become an hermit to experience spiritual insights.

    Thanks for the example of the Japanese mountain priests, I like that very much.
     
    Yes, I liked it very much as well, it is similar to my ancestral religion. I should probably delve into it a bit more.

    The three personas of the pagan God sounds similar to Hindu ideas about the stages of life – but the point is usually one of ascending value. It may be appropriate for a young man to live on the strife of the world in his season, but it’s preparation for a much higher stage – renunciation and contemplation.
     
    In the Baltic religion there was an elder priest who lived in a temple in a grove and tended to an eternal fire there. Very few were allowed to go in this grove so the priest spent a lot of time there alone. This might be a little similar to what you talk about but this priest served a very important social function (wise counsel and he was a kind of a leader). It wasn't just individualistic mediation, but contemplation was, of course, a big part of it.

    but even ordinary drop outs from the rat race should be recognized as making a legitimate choice that has some spiritual worth, and society should be structured to accommodate them rather than insist on harnessing their productive potential to enrich the wealthy. I don’t mean subsidies, but a path to modest and minimal self support that doesn’t eat up all their time, steal their self respect, or deaden their souls.
     
    I think it depends on the person. When you give, it's important to see that it's not wasted. Because if you start giving out free things, too many may show up for it and it will create a moral hazard. I'm not saying this because I'm stingy, no. Not at all. It's simply because I don't like a situation where one part of able bodied society works (including mothers) and another doesn't.

    But I have had such friends myself, the kind that you describe. I have actually helped a poet friend of mine to build a heritage project that we were both interested in. This is something that neither he nor I could've achieved on our own. So the result of this collaboration was positive.

    As to the change in the economic relationships that you propose in the post above - those are very substantial changes that would resemble European revolutions. It would require either a revolutionary type of awakening within the populace (and it wouldn't be unanimous) or an armed revolution. Normally I would oppose such, however, one must admit that the cost of living in the West has risen in the recent years (or decades?), wages have grown but have not kept up, so I do agree that some very basic milestones take longer too achieve, too long, frankly. So in that regard you do have a point.

    However, what you propose might only make things worse. To give free housing and to relieve men of any duties whatsoever is a very, very slippery slope. Sometimes it leads to social collapse, the way it did after the fall of the USSR. Then the weak suffer and it's not right.

    Also, you may want to consider that some people view work as a value of its own. Work is something that structures one's life (of course, so does meditation & prayer), work is valuable not only in the results that it brings, or as a service to others, work can be viewed as something that promotes the Greek technē - a means to promote the development of the human being.

    Btw, I noticed you mentioned that this "prose" here on this forum is your contribution to society. Even if I don't agree on all your points, I must admit that you do indeed write well - you are able to use language quite skillfully.

    Replies: @AaronB

  690. @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Especially moving because in the beginning of the discussion he mentions yours truly as the national subconscious archetype of the Russian people. I am truly flattered.
     
    LOL. They do these chat series where they all sit around the table eating cake (must be Kiev torte) and discuss these grandiose geopolitical visions for Ukraine. I guess as a Russian, one must be mellow and tolerant enough, as well as with a sense of humor, to not be triggered and truly enjoy some of these gems they produce.

    References to archetypes and an intuitive feeling of where the whole situation is going and how it could be turned around. I like the man.
     
    Me too. Definitely not boring.

    This archetype that he talks about that is supposedly characteristic of the Ukrainian nation is not really unique to just them. Other EE nations sometimes take out their worst emotions on their own and envy their own most (this is a huge flaw). Plus, everyone was very traumatized by what happened in Dnipro.

    thinking and realizing what game they’re playing would realize why they speak the “language of the enemy”
     
    Well, the Russophone Kyiv has produced some strong, ambitious patriots. :) I still have to get used to how he and other Russophone Ukrainians call Russians "they", while speaking their language. It simply means that no one has a monopoly on the Russian language. I guess when you aspire to be the real heir of the Kievan Rus, it doesn't matter which Rus language you speak.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    I guess when you aspire to be the real heir of the Kievan Rus, it doesn’t matter which Rus language you speak.

    Yes, this is extremely important, because these people start to think, talk and act as a subject of geopolitics, not as an object. They start to think as a center of a territory, not a border. I have asked in the past why not claim directly the name of Rus instead of going along with a name that suggests a limitrophe frontier status? Ukrainians usually answer along the lines of what Kuchma wrote 20 years ago : “Ukraine is not Russia”. Well hello, EusFed is not Russia either. So who’s gonna be Russia in the end if everyone eschews the honor of taking and upholding the heritage of Rus in a straightforward manner, without ambivalence or ambiguity?

    [MORE]

    And it is easier to be a subject when you speak a language most people around you understand, and declare an open and flexible identity. They could go very far if they keep moving that way.

    Moreover, Arestovych citing Strugatsky brothers is a direct call to people like me, who have all grown up reading their books. He talks about Schedrovitskyi (the methodologist who invented the Russkyi Mir concept) in approving terms. Schedrovitsky was the mentor of Sergei Pereslegin, while Arestovych alludes to some of the themes people such as Galkovsky and Fursov discuss, acknowledging them from an Ukrainian perspective. Mentions tangentially Pelevin’s novel SNUFF, which I personally find quite on point describing the current conflict between the two Rus people. Talks about Khazaria as someone who would have read Gumilyov would do.

    The impression he gives is that he might one day suddenly look into the camera and say : “Russian – speaking intellectuals of the World – unite ! Your chains are the only thing that you have to lose. ” This guy is some actor alright. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if he is an adept of Chaos Magick. He might really pull out something important and interesting if he keeps trying, which I believe he will.

    Now let’s see if he can survive (first of all intellectually survive his cocaine snorting habits).

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Yes, this is extremely important, because these people start to think, talk and act as a subject of geopolitics, not as an object. They start to think as a center of a territory, not a border.
     
    The Ukrainian nationalists spoke in those kinds of terms already a long time ago, it's just that they were not in power. There were such murmurs already in 2014, notably A.Biletsky spoke of extensively of Ukraino-centrism (referring to the likes of Yuri Lipa and his Black Sea Doctrine from the 1920s). They just didn't have much power, whereas Arestovych now has more access to mass audience and the president's administration.

    I have asked in the past why not claim directly the name of Rus instead of going along with a name that suggests a limitrophe frontier status? Ukrainians usually answer along the lines of what Kuchma wrote 20 years ago : “Ukraine is not Russia”.
     
    No, they do know they are Rus. But Rus' with the мягкий знак. Some of the more hardliner types speak about how Peter I stole their name, etc. So they are well aware of this problem, I think it's just hard to rename a country, plus Ukraine is a brand now in the West. They could brand it eventually as "Ukraine, the land of the original Rus" or something like that. I see why you talk about the name, it is very important, but even more important is the content. :)

    So who’s gonna be Russia in the end if everyone eschews the honor of taking and upholding the heritage of Rus in a straightforward manner, without ambivalence or ambiguity?
     
    This is a very good point. Well, it is a bit similar to Britain and Britain's children, USA and Canada, etc. You know in Russian and Latvian, England is called Anglia, the rest of the Commonwealth states are not called Little Anglias or similar, they have their own, new names, but, as a group of peoples, they are still commonly called the Anglos. So it might be something similar for the Rus eventually as well. It's a bit more edifying than just "Eastern Slavs" (although I have nothing against that one either).

    And it is easier to be a subject when you speak a language most people around you understand, and declare an open and flexible identity. They could go very far if they keep moving that way
     
    .

    I think this is one option that can co-exist with a more hardline nationalist position. These two outlooks will fight but they can co-exist. The more flexible identity could be used as a basis to assemble a wider following.

    He is quite popular among the Baltic people, too. But for us, we wouldn't have to compromise our native language at home, the Russian language is just for communication with some neighbors. In Ukraine this could be an issue for some types, but I don't think it will be because they are very organically bilingual. Eventually more Ukrainian will be spoken. That's why I sometimes wonder what language the children will communicate in, because it will be important.

    Moreover, Arestovych citing Strugatsky brothers is a direct call to people like me, who have all grown up reading their books.
     
    Yea, when I heard him cite Strugatsky brothers, I immediately thought of you and realized that there are cultural references that can be utilized. I think he did a whole series of videos on the Strugatsky topic. He also sometimes does that tune from Yeralash, which is funny. I think he talks about those Russian icons as something to learn from, not necessarily follow the Russkiy Mir. They want to build their own project. This project will have to find some kind of an alignment with Europe.

    But he can be provocative sometimes and Ukrainian ethno-nats don't like him. So he should be careful not to run his mouth too much. Tough thing because his best material comes from open communication. LOL Ideally, others should join him to form some kind of a team of intellectuals with slightly varying views (but one goal).

    I wouldn’t be surprised at all if he is an adept of Chaos Magick. He might really pull out something important and interesting if he keeps trying, which I believe he will.
     
    I doubt he's an adept of Chaos Magic, but he is a type who would be able to understand some of it probably. He definitely enjoys language and symbols. Chaos Magic is also a Western phenomenon, or rather, was built in the West (even if it references the East in some cases).

    It is also clear that he respects the tradition of Western rationalism.

    Now let’s see if he can survive (first of all intellectually survive his cocaine snorting habits).
     
    He is on Feigin every day for hours and it would be much more visible if he did snort cocaine - yes, he does talk fast, but his demeanor is usually quite calm, he does not seem too fidgety, irritable or restless, pupils do not appear to be dilated and eyes don't appear sensitive to light.

    Even if it were so that they occasionally snort some cocaine, cocaine is not as bad as heroin or even some heavy painkillers, I imagine, it's easier to get off cocaine than other types of drugs.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Another Polish Perspective

  691. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, https://www.unz.com/aanglin/wef-polish-president-urges-more-military-support-for-zelenskopolis/

    ...many haters of Poland there!

    You are just typical Russian, thinking about in Poland primarily in terms of Catholicism, whereas Catholicism in Poland as a semi-national identity is really the time between the Counter-Reformation and Partitions.

    Well, they probably don't teach about those archaeological cultures in school (with small exceptions, for example Lusatian culture's Biskupin is NOT Polish, probably due to Lusatians cremations habits) because they have bigger problems at home, so to say. The official school version claims that Poland was a union of smaller tribes like Lędzianie, Ślężanie, Wiślanie etc... but archaeology has been unable to provide enough proofs for their existence.

    The newest version of Polish origins, not yet in school books, suggests that Poland was a creation of Great Moravians, who left Great Moravia. The arguments for that are, for example, the same building techniques in Great Moravia and early Polish grody, and slave trade as substantial source of income in early Poland and Great Moravia (since you don't enslave your own people, the enslavers must have come from somewhere else).
    Interestingly this theory is somehow supported by one of legends dealing with Polish origins, namely, "There were once three brothers: Lech, Czech, Rus. They went in three different directions and founded 3 countries: Poland, Czechia (Bohemia), and Kiev Russia (alternative version to Varangians here)". However, the legend never says who was the father of 3 brothers . Well, now we know: he was some Great Moravia ruler/prince!

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Ivashka the fool

    I don’t think of Poland in Catholic terms, that would be an understatement. I am much more radical than that : for me the Lyakhs are just latinized Moskals. As soon as they would start using the Great Moravian Slav script (that is Кириллица) they will suddenly feel an upsurge of brotherly affection towards their estranged Eastern brethren. (Just kidding 😋)

    [MORE]

    Now about all you wrote above, it is not contradictive or mutually exclusive at all and might all exactly come together to explain the genesis of not only Poland, but historical Slavdom in general. It is all part and parcel of the same historical process.

    Have you ever heard of the Gnezdovo necropolis where the largest princely kurgans have shown influences of the Great Moravia ?

    Have you noticed that Great Moravia has included Noricum where Central European Veneti lived in Roman Empire times ?

    (That’s where the name of Vienna comes from. From these Veneti of old, through the Latin Vindabona castrum in Pannonia).

    That according to Guzel and Lomonosov, the early Slav tribes came from the Danube and were there called Noritsy / Noricy (Норици). ?

    Perhaps you might be familiar with the hagiographic Life of Saint Severinus that also mentions Rugians in Noricum during the Migrations Period ?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severinus_of_Noricum

    The same Rugians that gave its name to the island of Rugen. The last pagan Wends of Arkona, but described in the times of Saint Severinus as Eastern Germanic tribesmen. Just like the Vandals who had Alans as allies. Those Vandals who were in early middle ages sometimes equated with Rus.

    Add the Huns into the mix, whose multi-ethnic subjects used a Balto-Slav dialect as a creole – koine language.

    Now put the pieces of the puzzle together. It has taken me a couple of years a dozen years ago, but it was worth it.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Ivashka the fool


    Now put the pieces of the puzzle together. It has taken me a couple of years a dozen years ago, but it was worth it.
     
    Would it be too much to ask of you to put together your final thoughts about this sequence, and share with the many admirers that you've accumulated here the fruits of your labors? I'm certain that what took you a "couple of years" to discern could take me 4-5 years to do so, and I'm much older than you were 12 years ago. I think to finally put it all down in writing would be beneficial for you too.
  692. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neolithic_circular_enclosures_in_Central_Europe

    Recently more and more rondels are discovered in Poland from air. The presence of one close to Biskupin suggests some kind of continuity between Biskupin settlement and rondel, and then between Neolithic population and Lusatian culture. On the other hand, it suggests less continuity between Lusatians and Indo-Europeans.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    But of course there was a continuity, it’s just that they integrated various non – Indo-European cultural influences.

    [MORE]

    Corded Ware folks coexisted and interacted with the Tripyllian, the Megalithic, the Bell-Beaker, the Seima-Turbino, the Akozino-Malar etc. But they stayed more or less the same people.

    Follow the sequence: Corded Ware – Battle Axe – Unetice – Lusatian – pre-Balto-Slav / Veneti – Balto-Slav – Balty & Slovene – Slavs – Czech / Lekh / Rus .

    Same population through millenia, in more or less constant territory with admixture and influence from the neighboring ethnic groups and cultures.

    I mean that is the most logical view. Why should it have been otherwise?

    (To please and placate our Bell Beaker descended “partners” to the west and / or our Akozino – Malar & Sargat descended “friends” to the north?)

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, in Poland we call people like you Wielkorus; all Slavdom is for you in some way Russian. It may also explain why you look for continuity everywhere. You are just smaller version of Pan-Serbian Odyssey, since you limit your claims to Slavs only. But you were so long in America that you seem sincerely believe in melting pot theory! Well, here in Europe we have never believed this: this is why we had so many wars and states etc.


    But of course there was a continuity, it’s just that they integrated various non – Indo-European cultural influences.
     
    Looking for continuation is a scourge of prehistory, which, I was told once, came from politics. If you could show "your" people were somewhere in bygone times, you could claim the land where you found the remnants! It is what German archaeology was doing pre-WWII and WWII, not just in reference to the East but the West too. But others started to follow in their steps after 1945.
    Unfortunately, it is very easy to claim continuation in prehistory - you just have to found respective ceramics and then you can claim at least some "admixture".

    Looking at closer history, eg. Mongol invasion of Rusia or Manchu invasion of China, we see that invaders try to live in some kind of Apartheid. Manchu had parallel institutions for themselves in China (like their own army) and their own quotas in administration. Something like that suggests discontinuation after conquest, not a melting pot, at least in the short- and medium term. Moreover, some degree of genetic continuity (of the Chinese and the Muscovy) is not tantamount to cultural continuity of the entire society. So really we should look for high degree of cultural continuity as a confirmation of substantial genetic continuity, not vice versa.

    As a counterpoint to your thesis, Unetice culture seems to be a genetic continuation of Globular Amphorae Culture which is decisively non-Indo-Europan. Unetice also seems to be genetic and cultural kin of Cucuteni-Trypillia culture, especially in their love for living in crowded settlements of longhouses (or other shared houses). This love for crowd I find decidedly un-Slavic. That are pre-cities, not villages.

    All that forgets the problem that there was some male population exchange in East & Central Europe at least, since the female population of these regions is genetically older than its male population. That suggests either armed invasion, or resettlement after a plague (maybe the second, judging from Cucuteni-Trypillia custom of burning their own houses, probably an answer to plague as a primitive form of dezinfection) .

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burned_house_horizon

    The current research is decidedly focused on finding continuity, though. Look for example at this article:

    https://scienceinpoland.pap.pl/en/node/82059

    The title says: Bronze Age DNA Shows Direct Genetic Link to Current Inhabitants of Southern Poland

    Great! Continuity!

    However, in the article itself we find:

    . It has now turned out that communities several hundred years younger (the Mierzanowice and Trzcinies cultures) exhibit genetic continuity (associated with the Corded Ware culture) present in the female lines.


    So it was all about female lines...?! Why there are specifically interested in them anyway?!Not a word in article why there is apparent discontinuity in Y-DNA. Of course, the research was set up since they investigated only female-transferred DNA... but well, why?

    Later we find:
    According to Dr. Juras, the population associated with the Strzyżów culture has genetically most in common with steppe communities.

    The descendants of people associated with the Strzyżów culture could have come to the lands of present-day south-eastern Poland with the first migration from the steppe during the late Neolithic. But they formed an isolated population that developed independently of the Corded Ware culture community.

    So now we get admission that all people were Corded Ware (remember, the use of word "associated" aka "admixture") but not really Corded Ware. So steppe people were not really behind Corded Ware...?!!!! Uff, ufff I am getting a headache, as usually when reading some paper with agenda, which here is (1) Corded ware are steppe people, (2) there is matrilineal continuity, (3) that matrilineal continuity is observed among Corded Ware descendants.

    I am always alarmed by these matrilineal continuity claims as it suggests cousin marriage/endogamy which again suggests non-steppe people, which seems to be a hidden point of the article as they admit on one point that the only not-really-Corded Ware culture is the most steppe one. Uff! Something is definitely fuzzy about this article. You may understand now why prehistory is not my favourite part of history.

    That there is something someone wants to hide is clear from the misleading title anyway.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Sher Singh

  693. @Greasy William

    Also, this “Karlin Community” seems to be quite devoid of…any Karlins…
     
    He had a falling out with his readers

    Replies: @TalhaAtUnz2, @Emil Nikola Richard

    He had a falling out with his readers

    I would not put it like that at all.

    More like he tossed all his readers out of his fantasy luxury yacht or lifeboat or whatever he thinks he is propelling his ego with. I forget his exact message in this regard but it was something which I read as “none of you is in my league or fit to be in my entourage”. He thinks he is bigger than unz.com. Or thought he did.

    Bitcoin is bouncing back. Maybe he could too.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    none of you is in my league or fit to be in my entourage”.

     

    He got a big ego boost at the time from being cited by Ross Douthat in the NYT: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/26/opinion/vladimir-putin-clash-of-civilizations.html

    People in the Anglosphere were turning to him as one of the few English-speaking Russian nationalist writers.

    I think he may even have excepted the Kremlin to turn to him for analytical advice. His biggest fantasy/dream after all was to be read by Putin. But his star faded as the war dragged on. His recent criticisms of "the Kremlins" has a tinge of bitterness to it; perhaps borne out of a feeling of rejection.

    Definitely never a good idea to burn bridges like he did; even if he excepted to move onto bigger things. Akin to someone trashing his humble hometown after moving to the big city. I don't think he'll ever be able to replicate the commentariat he gathered here. Sher Singh's post some time ago on the characters found in Karlin's Discord confirm this.

    Quality > quantity.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @AP
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    He thinks he is bigger than unz.com.
     
    He's certainly better than almost all of the other writers.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  694. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Greasy William


    He had a falling out with his readers
     
    I would not put it like that at all.

    More like he tossed all his readers out of his fantasy luxury yacht or lifeboat or whatever he thinks he is propelling his ego with. I forget his exact message in this regard but it was something which I read as "none of you is in my league or fit to be in my entourage". He thinks he is bigger than unz.com. Or thought he did.

    Bitcoin is bouncing back. Maybe he could too.

    Replies: @Yahya, @AP

    none of you is in my league or fit to be in my entourage”.

    He got a big ego boost at the time from being cited by Ross Douthat in the NYT: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/26/opinion/vladimir-putin-clash-of-civilizations.html

    People in the Anglosphere were turning to him as one of the few English-speaking Russian nationalist writers.

    I think he may even have excepted the Kremlin to turn to him for analytical advice. His biggest fantasy/dream after all was to be read by Putin. But his star faded as the war dragged on. His recent criticisms of “the Kremlins” has a tinge of bitterness to it; perhaps borne out of a feeling of rejection.

    Definitely never a good idea to burn bridges like he did; even if he excepted to move onto bigger things. Akin to someone trashing his humble hometown after moving to the big city. I don’t think he’ll ever be able to replicate the commentariat he gathered here. Sher Singh’s post some time ago on the characters found in Karlin’s Discord confirm this.

    Quality > quantity.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya


    People in the Anglosphere were turning to him as one of the few English-speaking Russian nationalist writers.
     
    I have recently come accross a description of Karlin by an interesting Russian blogger as "a singularity enthusiast".
  695. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    I don't think of Poland in Catholic terms, that would be an understatement. I am much more radical than that : for me the Lyakhs are just latinized Moskals. As soon as they would start using the Great Moravian Slav script (that is Кириллица) they will suddenly feel an upsurge of brotherly affection towards their estranged Eastern brethren. (Just kidding 😋)



    Now about all you wrote above, it is not contradictive or mutually exclusive at all and might all exactly come together to explain the genesis of not only Poland, but historical Slavdom in general. It is all part and parcel of the same historical process.

    Have you ever heard of the Gnezdovo necropolis where the largest princely kurgans have shown influences of the Great Moravia ?

    Have you noticed that Great Moravia has included Noricum where Central European Veneti lived in Roman Empire times ?

    (That's where the name of Vienna comes from. From these Veneti of old, through the Latin Vindabona castrum in Pannonia).

    That according to Guzel and Lomonosov, the early Slav tribes came from the Danube and were there called Noritsy / Noricy (Норици). ?

    Perhaps you might be familiar with the hagiographic Life of Saint Severinus that also mentions Rugians in Noricum during the Migrations Period ?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severinus_of_Noricum

    The same Rugians that gave its name to the island of Rugen. The last pagan Wends of Arkona, but described in the times of Saint Severinus as Eastern Germanic tribesmen. Just like the Vandals who had Alans as allies. Those Vandals who were in early middle ages sometimes equated with Rus.

    Add the Huns into the mix, whose multi-ethnic subjects used a Balto-Slav dialect as a creole - koine language.

    Now put the pieces of the puzzle together. It has taken me a couple of years a dozen years ago, but it was worth it.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Now put the pieces of the puzzle together. It has taken me a couple of years a dozen years ago, but it was worth it.

    Would it be too much to ask of you to put together your final thoughts about this sequence, and share with the many admirers that you’ve accumulated here the fruits of your labors? I’m certain that what took you a “couple of years” to discern could take me 4-5 years to do so, and I’m much older than you were 12 years ago. I think to finally put it all down in writing would be beneficial for you too.

  696. @Sean
    Re 'Alec Baldwin to be charged with involuntary manslaughter'. The prosecution think because they have evidence of him making inaccurate statements about how he handled the trigger and hammer of the gun in the fatal on set incident nothing he says will count, and so he can be found guilty of reckless disregard for another's safety, but they are totally wrong in my opinion because what Baldwin had no way to know that was he was handling was potentially lethal.


    I read up on the professional protocols years in relation to the accidental death of Brandon Lee by gunshot on a film set. It was true even back then and was even more true after the death of Lee that live rounds of firearm ammunition are NEVER permitted on a film set, so they cannot be loaded into a gun by mistake,. Blanks and dummy rounds are carefully marked with a color code to avoid confusion as to what is being taken onto a film set does not include live rounds. These precautions are the professional responsibility of the weapons master, who hence is making sure the 'weapons' on set are not really weapons at all, but props that (even if there is an oversight) might at most go bang.

    Therefore Baldwin had a reasonable expectation that he could not possibly shoot anyone with the gun no matter how he manipulated it because it was, like all guns on film sets, in effect a harmless prop. That Baldwin is mistaken about whether he had his finger on the trigger is essentially irrelevant to whether he had a reasonable expectation the prop could not possibly be a loaded with a live round gun.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    in my opinion because what Baldwin had no way to know that was he was handling was potentially lethal.

    This is a dumb opinion.

    He has been around guns his entire life. He has heard safety protocols repeated 100000 X and this is not rocket science. It’s not like he is an illiterate ghetto negro.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    He has been around guns his entire life.
     
    You are talking as if Baldwin brought it from his personal home firearms collection and would not let anyone look at it before the incident, which would entail his having a duty to treat it in accordance with gun safety and be liable to prosecution if he failed to do so. But this was a movie prop supplied to the production by its weapons master. Again, his expectation that a prop on a Western film set brought there by the production's weapons master, prepared by them to be used in a scene where Baldwin would draw it, and issued to him as part of his costume would and could under no circumstances contain a potentially lethal cartridge was entirely reasonable. Especially for someone like Baldwin who has worked on numerous action films before and understands there is a expert responsible for making certain no such thing can happen.

    Everyone has a job to do on a film and they all are concerned to make sure they do their own job properly. Baldwin was on the set to do a job in the capacity he was hired, which is the one of trained actor. It was no more Baldwin's duty to check whether a prop he was to use might be capable of killing someone than it would have been for him to ensure food he was to give to someone to eat in a scene had not been contaminated with botulism by careless caterers.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Wokechoke

  697. 2022 birth data out.

    Declines of 4-10% in Europe all-round, except Portugal and Serbia.

    Anglosphere comparatively stable.

    Middle East also flat at a higher baseline.

    East Asia is toast.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya

    https://www.thelancet.com/infographics-do/population-forecast

    , @Blinky Bill
    @Yahya


    East Asia is toast.
     
    The solution is right before their eyes, they simply need to reach out and grasp it.



    https://twitter.com/qin_duke/status/1616810855911260160?s=20&t=mn9vD77IvJd-gyx2DokBMw

    Replies: @songbird

  698. @Yahya
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    none of you is in my league or fit to be in my entourage”.

     

    He got a big ego boost at the time from being cited by Ross Douthat in the NYT: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/26/opinion/vladimir-putin-clash-of-civilizations.html

    People in the Anglosphere were turning to him as one of the few English-speaking Russian nationalist writers.

    I think he may even have excepted the Kremlin to turn to him for analytical advice. His biggest fantasy/dream after all was to be read by Putin. But his star faded as the war dragged on. His recent criticisms of "the Kremlins" has a tinge of bitterness to it; perhaps borne out of a feeling of rejection.

    Definitely never a good idea to burn bridges like he did; even if he excepted to move onto bigger things. Akin to someone trashing his humble hometown after moving to the big city. I don't think he'll ever be able to replicate the commentariat he gathered here. Sher Singh's post some time ago on the characters found in Karlin's Discord confirm this.

    Quality > quantity.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    People in the Anglosphere were turning to him as one of the few English-speaking Russian nationalist writers.

    I have recently come accross a description of Karlin by an interesting Russian blogger as “a singularity enthusiast”.

  699. @Yahya
    2022 birth data out.

    https://twitter.com/BirthGauge/status/1616599342357291008?s=20&t=2ySvQZW7rfmGO9SxR232XQ

    Declines of 4-10% in Europe all-round, except Portugal and Serbia.

    Anglosphere comparatively stable.

    Middle East also flat at a higher baseline.

    East Asia is toast.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Blinky Bill

    • Thanks: Yahya
  700. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    But of course there was a continuity, it's just that they integrated various non - Indo-European cultural influences.



    Corded Ware folks coexisted and interacted with the Tripyllian, the Megalithic, the Bell-Beaker, the Seima-Turbino, the Akozino-Malar etc. But they stayed more or less the same people.

    Follow the sequence: Corded Ware - Battle Axe - Unetice - Lusatian - pre-Balto-Slav / Veneti - Balto-Slav - Balty & Slovene - Slavs - Czech / Lekh / Rus .

    Same population through millenia, in more or less constant territory with admixture and influence from the neighboring ethnic groups and cultures.

    I mean that is the most logical view. Why should it have been otherwise?

    (To please and placate our Bell Beaker descended "partners" to the west and / or our Akozino - Malar & Sargat descended "friends" to the north?)

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Well, in Poland we call people like you Wielkorus; all Slavdom is for you in some way Russian. It may also explain why you look for continuity everywhere. You are just smaller version of Pan-Serbian Odyssey, since you limit your claims to Slavs only. But you were so long in America that you seem sincerely believe in melting pot theory! Well, here in Europe we have never believed this: this is why we had so many wars and states etc.

    But of course there was a continuity, it’s just that they integrated various non – Indo-European cultural influences.

    Looking for continuation is a scourge of prehistory, which, I was told once, came from politics. If you could show “your” people were somewhere in bygone times, you could claim the land where you found the remnants! It is what German archaeology was doing pre-WWII and WWII, not just in reference to the East but the West too. But others started to follow in their steps after 1945.
    Unfortunately, it is very easy to claim continuation in prehistory – you just have to found respective ceramics and then you can claim at least some “admixture”.

    Looking at closer history, eg. Mongol invasion of Rusia or Manchu invasion of China, we see that invaders try to live in some kind of Apartheid. Manchu had parallel institutions for themselves in China (like their own army) and their own quotas in administration. Something like that suggests discontinuation after conquest, not a melting pot, at least in the short- and medium term. Moreover, some degree of genetic continuity (of the Chinese and the Muscovy) is not tantamount to cultural continuity of the entire society. So really we should look for high degree of cultural continuity as a confirmation of substantial genetic continuity, not vice versa.

    As a counterpoint to your thesis, Unetice culture seems to be a genetic continuation of Globular Amphorae Culture which is decisively non-Indo-Europan. Unetice also seems to be genetic and cultural kin of Cucuteni-Trypillia culture, especially in their love for living in crowded settlements of longhouses (or other shared houses). This love for crowd I find decidedly un-Slavic. That are pre-cities, not villages.

    All that forgets the problem that there was some male population exchange in East & Central Europe at least, since the female population of these regions is genetically older than its male population. That suggests either armed invasion, or resettlement after a plague (maybe the second, judging from Cucuteni-Trypillia custom of burning their own houses, probably an answer to plague as a primitive form of dezinfection) .

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burned_house_horizon

    The current research is decidedly focused on finding continuity, though. Look for example at this article:

    https://scienceinpoland.pap.pl/en/node/82059

    The title says: Bronze Age DNA Shows Direct Genetic Link to Current Inhabitants of Southern Poland

    Great! Continuity!

    However, in the article itself we find:

    . It has now turned out that communities several hundred years younger (the Mierzanowice and Trzcinies cultures) exhibit genetic continuity (associated with the Corded Ware culture) present in the female lines.

    So it was all about female lines…?! Why there are specifically interested in them anyway?!Not a word in article why there is apparent discontinuity in Y-DNA. Of course, the research was set up since they investigated only female-transferred DNA… but well, why?

    Later we find:
    According to Dr. Juras, the population associated with the Strzyżów culture has genetically most in common with steppe communities.

    The descendants of people associated with the Strzyżów culture could have come to the lands of present-day south-eastern Poland with the first migration from the steppe during the late Neolithic. But they formed an isolated population that developed independently of the Corded Ware culture community.

    So now we get admission that all people were Corded Ware (remember, the use of word “associated” aka “admixture”) but not really Corded Ware. So steppe people were not really behind Corded Ware…?!!!! Uff, ufff I am getting a headache, as usually when reading some paper with agenda, which here is (1) Corded ware are steppe people, (2) there is matrilineal continuity, (3) that matrilineal continuity is observed among Corded Ware descendants.

    I am always alarmed by these matrilineal continuity claims as it suggests cousin marriage/endogamy which again suggests non-steppe people, which seems to be a hidden point of the article as they admit on one point that the only not-really-Corded Ware culture is the most steppe one. Uff! Something is definitely fuzzy about this article. You may understand now why prehistory is not my favourite part of history.

    That there is something someone wants to hide is clear from the misleading title anyway.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    As a counterpoint to your thesis, Unetice culture seems to be a genetic continuation of Globular Amphorae Culture which is decisively non-Indo-Europan. Unetice also seems to be genetic and cultural kin of Cucuteni-Trypillia culture, especially in their love for living in crowded settlements of longhouses (or other shared houses). This love for crowd I find decidedly un-Slavic. That are pre-cities, not villages.
     
    That's the second time that you wrote something that seems to demonstrate that you don't really read my comments before replying.



    I have written that Globular Amphora influenced Corded Ware, but have never written that Globular Amphora (let alone Tripolye) were Indo-European.

    AFAIK Globular Amphora might be seen as a hybrid culture arising during / after the collapse of Tripolye people, through intermixing of the surviving Tripolian farmers with pre-Corded War hunter - gatherer people from the Sredny Stog culture. Globular Amphora and Unetice are separated by at least a 500 years period how can anyone talk of any "continuity" or even influence between them ?

    Especially at a time when an average human life duration was around 35 years ?

    About Unetice, I have written that it was a culture that arose at the interface of the (Eastern) Bell Beaker and Corded Ware realms. I have also written that it was the cradle of the ancient European religion. I am quite certain that it used most probably PIE language as its koine or creole. But I have never written that it was produced only by Y haplogroup R1a people. Neither have I written anything about the primary origins of the PIE which are impossible to determine exactly (but I don't think Bell-Beaker folks were PIE speakers).

    About steppe - ancestry, it is a misnomer, which comes from the outdated Gambutas theories. There were no ferocious "Kurgan people" coming from the East and invading the "peace loving" (human sacrifice practicing and cannibalistic) "Old Europe" cultures. Yamnaya did not alter the genetic landscape of Old Europe, they were probably too few and far between and a substantial number of them migrated south insead of going west. Corded Ware is Old Europe, as is Megalithic Culture and the survivors of Linearband Ceramic Culture etc.

    The ones who invaded and genocided came not from the eastern steppes and were not Yamnaya people (let alone Corded Ware), they came from the westernmost part of Europe (Iberian peninsula) and were the Bell-Beaker folks. It took them centuries to conquer Western Europe and arrive in the region where Unetice would later develop and which was inhabited by the Corded Ware folks. We should think of these invaders as we think of their Conquistador descendants in the New World. For the ancestors of the Slav it was the first Drang nach Osten that they had to face and survive, but as we know today it was hardly the last.

    That's what they are trying to hide by not describing Y haplogroups, and only looking at the mtDNA haplogroups. Female populations weren't killed, they procreated with the conquerors. The Western European people are the population that arose from this process. A process that has met its limits around the Tollense river where an important group of Bell Beaker would be conquerors and their surviving Megalithic Europe and Corded Ware slaves were slaughtered. Ruthlessly ambushed and killed to the last as someone would kill a rabid animal. Another very significant historical moment that they prefer not to emphasize too much in European schools.

    Now, about the Moskal and Lyakh relationship, I have some diluted (Orthodox) Polish ancestry on my mother's side that I have been able to trace to the Great Lithuanian Duchy in modern day Belarus, close to the border of Ukraine. I have a substantial Ukrainian ancestry, obviously Russian too with perhaps some Tatar and Mordvin admixture, and I am fine with that. Most of these people's populations are descended from the Corded Ware folks.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Another Polish Perspective

    , @Sher Singh
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Looking for continuation is a scourge of prehistory, which, I was told once, came from politics. If you could show “your” people were somewhere in bygone times, you could claim the land where you found the remnants!
     
    Excellent point & explains a lot of the everything was Germanic/Nordic theories.

    Thanks!

    Replies: @Coconuts

  701. @songbird
    @Yahya


    He’s a generic Irish-American who likes to LARP as a Brit and “European” (with a strange attachment to Germany). He may have a Norman ancestor or two, but there’s nothing Norman about him.
     
    So all Europeans should be particularists and only appreciate and work to defend their own country, and not cooperate? And refrain from admiring or having any interest in other European countries? Even neighboring ones like the UK to Ireland? Or core strategic heartlands like Germany?

    Please, explain your reasoning.

    Replies: @S

    So all Europeans should be particularists and only appreciate and work to defend their own country, and not cooperate? And refrain from admiring or having any interest in other European countries? Even neighboring ones like the UK to Ireland? Or core strategic heartlands like Germany?…Please, explain your reasoning.

    Apparently, Songbird, you are in violation of certain of the rules of the Multi-Cult game, and have been put on notice.

    As a Euro, irregardless of the particular tribe you may belong to and it’s unique history, you are expected to collectively simply go wander off somewhere and die, without even a whimper of protest.

    Not doing that, as you are not, and instead displaying life affirming behaviour, is an affront to certain of their sensibilities. As in the clip below, it is a veritable slap in their face.

    Should enough follow you in your renegade path (renegade in the modern progressive death affirming view of things), and choose life as one should, at least some Euro peoples might survive these treacherous times.

    I see that as a very positive outcome, in small part as it would stop the Multi-Cultists and their collaborators from committing genocide in the truest sense of that often much abused term, a burden no one should have upon themselves, their present soul destroying hatreds blinding them (in at least certain instances) to what they are in reality doing.

    Anyhow, in the case of even some Euro peoples surviving, there would almost certainly be a murmur, arising to a deafening crescendo, coming from the throats of the progressive (so called) Multi-Culturalists and their collaborators, perhaps the loudest voices of them all being from those who put on airs of peace and love, such as troll these very threads…

    ‘But, But, But,….You are supposed to die!…You are supposed to die!!…You are supposed to die!!!’

    • Replies: @songbird
    @S

    What really amazes me is how easy it is to perceive powerful resentment and even hatred in many of these migrants that have come into Ireland. It really just is incredible. And you can witness it clearly - there's plenty of videos.

    Effectively, it seems to me to be a complete duplication of the worst part of the American experience racially speaking, without any of the usual historical or economic excuses even remotely possible.

    I don't even know how people advocating for open borders, or a weak response to them would even attempt to explain it away. It is so shocking to see. Maybe, they would blame higher rates of mental illness or psychopathy. (at least, if they were HBD aware). Maybe, others would say that it is simply a case of American culture being transplanted.

    But to me, there is an obvious and more direct explanation:

    Some people are just in the wrong environment (to the point where it drives them crazy), and no amount of accommodation will change that. The better and more humane solution is simply to put them back into their native environment.

    Replies: @S

  702. @Yahya
    @Blinky Bill

    “Wu tang kangz, la!”

    我们是国王


    https://img.i-scmp.com/cdn-cgi/image/fit=contain,width=1098,format=auto/sites/default/files/styles/1200x800/public/d8/images/canvas/2022/11/24/92501af7-5de2-4c55-8a48-e93643cc7f83_63bf7a8c.jpg?itok=mmjFk6xW&v=1669285977

    Replies: @songbird, @Talha, @Blinky Bill

    Happy Chinese New Year Yahya!

    [MORE]

    • Thanks: Yahya
    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Blinky Bill

    It's sad farewell for Year Tiger which is always my favorite year.

    Welcome year rabbit!

    https://wallpapers.com/images/hd/bugs-bunny-waiting-for-doc-gr98p3jyx2ms6mjs.jpg

    Replies: @songbird

  703. @AaronB
    @AP

    1) Perhaps this is one form of social compromise then. Pay your mite to Leviathan, then pursue the true ends of human life, contemplation. It's a start :)

    Of course, provision must be made for those who feel a strong vocation to a life of contemplation at an earlier age, but that can be extended once we secure the above described beachhead within mainstream society.

    2) Well, many Hindu yogis were doing drugs, and limited drug use has its place in shamanic traditions.

    But the excessive drug use is an attempt to escape from a society entirely based on not recognizing the true ends of human life. A society that freely offers a route to a life of contemplation - or less loftily, simply a route out of the rat race which destroys our souls - will see a precipitous drop in drug use and general dysfunctional behavior.

    It is only a society that insists on seeing the rat race as the only legitimate path that engenders mass drug use and anti-social behavior.

    At the moment, our dysfunctional drug users are also our canaries in the coal mine - they embody a stark warning to us and a clarion call to wake up, but we - in our thickheadedness - treat it merely as a problem of social technique.

    We moderns have not yet recovered the ability to go "meta" and question our values, an ability gradually lost as modernity impoverished our conceptual categories.

    This advanced cognitive technique cannot survive in an era of impoverished factual language.

    3) Ah, but I want to see you taking up a loin cloth and sleeping on a bed of pine needles :) And in your 50s, not old age.

    Yes, you are a nobleman, but that occupation has sadly gone defunct, just as 18th century carriage builder is no longer a viable occupation.

    Today, the elite are the bourgeois - whose values and mentality you naturally seek to embody. I think you are using some dim family tradition of past glory to motivate a social striving that is as sordid as it has always been.

    But traditionally, the nobility despised bourgeois values of striving and hard work, and at least aspired to lives of refined leisure - a preserve free from the taint of sordid social striving - and were more likely to become contemplatives or sybarites, both occupations closer to the homeless you despise than your bourgeois social striving.

    I almost wish you were a nobleman, and it wasn't just some dim family tradition with no relevance to today.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @AP

    At the moment, our dysfunctional drug users are also our canaries in the coal mine – they embody a stark warning to us and a clarion call to wake up, but we – in our thickheadedness – treat it merely as a problem of social technique.

    They are suffering people who engage in self-indulgent sins that harm them. The humane and loving thing to do is to help them, not celebrate their degradation.

    nobleman, but that occupation has sadly gone defunct

    The bourgeois can only think in bourgeois terms. It is not an “occupation” and not everything is an “occupation.”

    But traditionally, the nobility despised bourgeois values of striving and hard work, and at least aspired to lives of refined leisure

    What nonsense.

    Traditionally the nobility were focused on service, from highest to lowest. And this meant a lot of hard work. I knew my grandfather well, he worked 60-80 hours weekly building up and creating institutions that benefited the people (I will be vague about this to avoid doxxing) and refusing offers to sell out that were worth tens of millions. Yes, he had servants and a driver, but this doesn’t preclude hard work. Military officers, a common vocation among noblemen, gave their lives in service unflinchingly. Greek Catholic priests of gentry background, in addition to engaging in the usual parish work, organized schools for the villagers, agitated against evils such as alcoholism, even used their lands as “model farms” to teach the peasants better agricultural methods. Running cities and counties required hard work. My relatives did all of these things. Not a single one was a lazy degenerate. The Christian idea “Where much is given, much is expected” was a way of life. How different from the times of wicked Rome.

    The bourgeois usurpers created fairytales of leisure and parasitism which you, the bourgeois, take for granted. And you, the bourgeois, can only think of hard work as “striving.”

    Of course, the bourgeois system has in the end proved to a very efficient way of building up universal prosperity and ameliorating suffering, much better at that than the old order, so I do not condemn it. In its own impersonal way it has been far more effective than the nobility had been in hundreds of years when it comes to helping others. Credit should be given where it is due. But you are a bourgeois who has rejected the one great thing the bourgeois have done: harness striving for the greater good. You just want to consume.

    And of course one can work hard and help others in the modern bourgeois world. Not only in obvious fields such as research or medicine.

  704. @Blinky Bill
    @Yahya

    Happy Chinese New Year Yahya!


    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fm932kgXkAAzMx9.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    It’s sad farewell for Year Tiger which is always my favorite year.

    Welcome year rabbit!

    • Thanks: Blinky Bill
    • Replies: @songbird
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    What does it mean?

    https://twitter.com/manchuxi/status/1617198389036290050?s=20&t=W-6sAu9VaKIuodMWjN6Heg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  705. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Greasy William


    He had a falling out with his readers
     
    I would not put it like that at all.

    More like he tossed all his readers out of his fantasy luxury yacht or lifeboat or whatever he thinks he is propelling his ego with. I forget his exact message in this regard but it was something which I read as "none of you is in my league or fit to be in my entourage". He thinks he is bigger than unz.com. Or thought he did.

    Bitcoin is bouncing back. Maybe he could too.

    Replies: @Yahya, @AP

    He thinks he is bigger than unz.com.

    He’s certainly better than almost all of the other writers.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @AP

    It's not the writerly expertise he's above.

    He thinks alt covid, alt right &c. are socio economic downers and wants to distance himself from his youthful indiscretions. Like I don't tell anybody in the real world I've been to 200 Dead shows. : )

    Is he still buds with Emil Kierkegard? Race realism is as deplorable as it gets but who cares about consistency?

  706. @Yahya
    2022 birth data out.

    https://twitter.com/BirthGauge/status/1616599342357291008?s=20&t=2ySvQZW7rfmGO9SxR232XQ

    Declines of 4-10% in Europe all-round, except Portugal and Serbia.

    Anglosphere comparatively stable.

    Middle East also flat at a higher baseline.

    East Asia is toast.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Blinky Bill

    East Asia is toast.

    The solution is right before their eyes, they simply need to reach out and grasp it.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Blinky Bill

    IMO, it would be pretty easy for East Asians to turn it around.

    Koreans, at least, (and I think the Japanese too) seem to have pretty high asabiyyah. Like during the Debt Crisis when people donated $2 billion worth of personal jewelry.

    Replies: @Thulean Friend

  707. @AP
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    He thinks he is bigger than unz.com.
     
    He's certainly better than almost all of the other writers.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    It’s not the writerly expertise he’s above.

    He thinks alt covid, alt right &c. are socio economic downers and wants to distance himself from his youthful indiscretions. Like I don’t tell anybody in the real world I’ve been to 200 Dead shows. : )

    Is he still buds with Emil Kierkegard? Race realism is as deplorable as it gets but who cares about consistency?

  708. @Ivashka the fool
    @QCIC

    AK understood what's right for him when his friend took a dive from his eight floor balcony in Moscow and when the war in Ukraine started going south. Now he tweets what needs to be tweeted to virtue signal to "the adult in the room" that he has changed for the better and is ready to go along with the plan, promote it if needed and hopefully play a part. He actually started his transformation during the January 6th Capitol ploy, and was well advanced into his metamorphosis when he cheered Biden stealing the election. But now he has truly joined the "right side of history". Tolik is a good boy now. The chrysalis has finally broken and out of it came a beautiful butterfly...

    Replies: @QCIC

    Well, that’s a lot darker than my theory 🙁

  709. @AaronB
    @silviosilver

    When I say provision must be made, I merely mean it must became a socially validated choice, and economic conditions must be restructured to facilitate it (affordable housing rather than artificially high rents favoring oligarchs, huge rise in minimum wage in line with actual contributions labor makes to profit, land reform to end the total monopoly the wealthy and the government have on land (beginning with the Enclosure Act in England, which was basically just theft), which allows them to completely structure the economy according to their principles).

    Nothing more sinister than this, Silvio, and certainly not a public subsidy, God forbid - merely a return of all that the rich and powerful steal through totally monopolizing land and structuring the economy to concentrate wealth in their hands.


    what’s in it for the rest of society? Those Taoist hermits you rave on about, what’s been their legacy? If they had never existed, this world would be worse off how exactly? (Note: this isn’t a question about how the world would have fared without their philosophy, but about going off to live as hermits.)
     
    I explained this, but you sir, are an inattentive reader :)

    The benefits to the rest of society are various and manifold, quite aside from the obvious justice and spiritual pleasure of allowing those with different personalities and values to live as they see fit and not unfairly structuring the entire system to reflect entirely one-sided values and coercing everyone to participate.(perhaps the question should be, what's in it for us letting the wealthy and powerful structure the system entirely in their favor :) )

    1) That some section of society drops out of the rat race to focus on higher things reminds everyone that the true ends of human life are not ephemera like making money and social status games, but that we are called to beauty and love - a service of incalculable and even indispensable worth.

    2) To provide consolation and succor to those who wish to but cannot escape the rat race - a ray of light and hope in the darkness of their condition that allows them to keep on living.

    3) To introduce a leavening agent into society - a vivid reminder of an alternative set of values, that will have the effect of limiting the scope and intensity of the rat race in favor of humanity and compassion, and to integrate elements of the contemplative life into everyday life as much as possible, leading to greater contentment and happiness.

    4) To actually sustain the world - if no one is pursuing the true end of human life as God intended, and all the multitudes and hosts of humanity are lost on trivia and ephemera like making money and playing status games, why should God allow the world to continue?

    5) And most trivially, from the social perspective to defuse the powder keg of revolutionaries and restive malcontents who are often thwarted spiritualists or proto-spiritualists who see no choice but to work towards toppling the social system that provides them with no outlet, and to reduce dysfunctional and anti-social behavior, drug use and homelessness of the pernicious kind (in favor of the good kind) across the board.

    6) To inspire those that are fitted to take the next step into a life of contemplation and connection to the Infinite, but lack the courage in the face of overwhelming social pressure to remain focused on ephemera and trivia.

    7) What is the point of the "Taoist philosophy" if not a single person lives according to it's principles and values?

    8) The "rest of society" has no right to deny happiness to any minority - a human being is not "the property" of society, and a society that allows various divergent personality types the freedom to pursue their bliss is better for everyone, provided it doesn't interfere with anyone else (no, losing their "productive capacity" to enrich you does not count as interfering with you).

    Confirmation bias on steroids, just like your art/civilization “theory.”
     
    Ok, so you don't know much about European aristocrats (or those of ancient Greece, or China). When two educated people from a common culture discuss certain topics there is an assumed background of shared information, not every detail can be "proven" (without recourse to large tomes of cultural history).

    I'm not saying your stupid, you're one of the smarter people here, but there are obviously large lacunae in your cultural education (although today the cultural consensus has broken down).

    To any educated person in say 1950, my above comment on aristocrats would have been completely uncontroversial and would have served as a perfectly acceptable starting point for a conversation.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

    A few words to clear the air before I respond. I’d like you to know that I’m virtually never satisfied with the posts I address to you. Somehow I can never manage to catch myself before hitting the damn “publish comment” button, but afterwards I always feel I’ve come across as too agitated, too snappy, too dismissive, too much like a simplistic bumpkin incapable of contemplating what has been presented to him, as though I’m outraged someone could hold such an opinion and that it must be eradicated posthaste. That attitude’s not at all conducive to an actual discussion, which after all is what I’m here for, so all credit to you for maintaining a civil tone. (If we’re keeping score, you’re one-up, two-up, hell ten-up on me on that count.) The same is true for my replies to most posters actually, but I think I’m on my worst behavior with you.

    IRL, I’m actually a very easy going guy, nothing at all like the abrasive asshole I can be online. Possibly that’s just my imagination, but I interact with a pretty broad sweep of people of all sorts of backgrounds, and IRL if people feel you’re jumping down their throat, they either get mad or leave quickly. The fact that they don’t – quite the contrary – leads me to believe I’m doing something right. Then again, that’s not a skill that came naturally to me. I started out in life with a very fiery temper, which got me into all sorts of bother, and it took some harsh life lessons to get me to change my ways. I suppose that I’m still, after all this time, yet to make the same transition in online interaction.

    Turning to the points you made, I’ll try for once not to rush it, and just address my claim of confirmation bias. For the accusation to hold water, obviously there must be plenty of examples of whatever is being “confirmed” – otherwise no examples, no confirmation. The bias relates to ignoring examples which disconfirm the thesis you’re propounding. And these, I think, abound. “Aristocrats aspired to lives of refined leisure? Oh that’s hogwash” is certainly not what I meant to imply. It’s that in addition to their aspirations towards refinement, they were involved in plenty of scheming and plotting – not a crime to call it “striving” – all with a view to improving their social position.

    Is it too much to believe that for many of them these activities took priority? European history (I know nothing of China, but I’ll risk assuming the same was true) would have looked nothing like it did were this not the case. It’s as though you’d have us believe “the man’s a duke, he couldn’t possibly be involved in a plot against the king, he’s too intoxicated with cultural refinement for anything so worldly.” And ought we always to believe that an aristocrat is up to what he claims he is up to, or is a degree of suspicion warranted? A white elite libtard waxes lyrical about diversity, so surely he fills his life with blacks at every opportunity, right? Or perhaps we’re just talking past each other.

    Going back to your art theory, similarly, it’s not that I believe there’s nothing to it. Not at all. I have no doubt it holds true in numerous cases. But not all. Imo, not even in most cases. When it comes to discussing art in any kind of depth, I know very well I’m in over my head, so I normally don’t even try. But I’ve read enough to know there any competing schools of thought out there (and retain some vague idea of what they’re saying) to feel confident that you are being too adamant that your explanation holds true in every case. I think you’re at a point where you’ve come up with what you believe is comprehensive philosophy of good living – and as I’ve said to you before, go ahead, follow your own bliss – and you’re trying to shoehorn far too much into it, almost as though you think your philosophy of the good life would fall apart if you didn’t.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @silviosilver

    Naahh, don't even worry about it dude :) I mean, I appreciate the explanation, but it's totally unnecessary. For my money, you have one of the most vigorous and vivid writing styles here, and I enjoy reading you - so what if you're a bit "salty" :) I always think the best way to write is unpremeditated, shoot from the hip - you feel like you're dealing with an authentic character, warts and all, which is great.

    For what it's worth, I often feel like I write too aggressively and immediately regret it and vow to be a little softer and nicer next time - with at best temporary success lol. We are what we are.

    One of the things I appreciate about many of the Zen people, in both China and Japan, especially in the early years, is that they deliberately cultivated an unpremeditated, shoot from the hip style, and were not afraid to be sharp, irritable, aggressive - you feel like you're dealing with a piece of nature as God made it, a natural human being, flaws and imperfections and all. It's like coming into contact with a rugged mountain. It's a breath of fresh air after the solemn, "pious" air of most religious writing. And yet they managed to convey the most profound spiritual truths.

    In our bland modern times, with it's scientific temper and belief that people should be "neutral", "objective", colorless, passionless, emotionless, and matter of fact, I feel the most important thing is to be an authentic character, warts and all. We've lost connection to our true selves and so produce hordes of dull, mild people (the "vanilla White guy" trope of American popular culture, educated in a scientific manner and disconnected from his emotions - luckily no longer as prevalent)

    Gone are those wonderful, eccentric, strong characters the English used to produce so prolifically in the 19th century! The fascinating paradox is that a society with a superabundance of formal rules like Victorian England provides a "safe space" for the expression of personality - provided one obeys all the rules, one can be oneself. The rules provide a kind of "cover" - and perhaps even an incentive to be yourself, as rules are irksome and promote a backlash. I think a superabundance of "formality" also fosters a strong sense of humor as it's counterpoint, as stiff formality is after all silly :) It's impossible, after a certain point, to not see it as a collective joke.

    Jewishness is somewhat like this too - as long as you obey all those stupid and complex rules, you're allowed to be really weird and eccentric. So sitting down with a bunch of Brooklyn Jews is a bit like being in a Dickens novel, with all these eccentric, strongly marked, weird types pontificating on all and sundry. I'm not a big fan of Jewish life for various reasons and think it's often toxic and dysfunctional, but I do appreciate the characters it produces.

    The important thing is - to not allow oneself to be smothered by a "dull respectability" - or at least, to do it with a wink and a smile 😉

    But look at what I've done, went off on a long ramble about nothing instead of addressing your substantive points. I couldn't stop myself once I got going lol - but I actually think that rather than a minor footnote, you've raised an important topic in its own right!

    I'll respond to your substantive in another comment.

    , @AaronB
    @silviosilver

    Ok, so you make a pretty good point about aristocrats, and you've brought to light areas that need to be clarified and distinctions that need to be made.

    Of course you're right that aristocrats were an endlessly scheming, plotting, backstabbing, poisoning, rebelling lot, and of course it was about position and advantage at court and all that. In fact I'd say aristocrats in this sense were more strivy than the bourgeois and were often disgustingly sycophantic and self-abasing in their jockeying for position.

    But this kind of thing is compatible with a life of refined leisure, in fact it's the sort of "game" one might play freed from the burdens of working for a living and freed from excessive social anxiety :) Aristocrats had a certain baseline security that came with inherited rank and status that significantly reduced the social anxiety that characterized the bourgeois striver.

    So for instance it's characteristic of a bourgeois striver to anxiously display his success - drive a Mercedes, wear expensive watches, dress more flamboyantly, drop veiled allusions to his wealth and success in conversation, etc - whereas aristocrats cultivated understated elegance - sometimes letting themselves go into what might be called "elegant dishevelment" which a bourgeois would not dare emulate - and a conversational style that featured self-depreciation as it's trademark.

    It was sort of an "anti-striving" culture in a way - another feature of this anti-striver mentality was the cultivation of a certain languid, relaxed, utterly at ease personal style - visible striving, visible effort, was seen as ""vulgar". All had to be easy, effortless, relaxed.

    Now, as for labor - freed from the burdens of working for a living, aristocrats played "games", either hunting, sports, adventuring, duelling, or created salons where sophisticated conversations would last long into the night and all the great wits of the day would attend, patronized art or poetry, and had lavish banquets.

    The point is, the bourgeois mentality of "hard work" for the purpose of accumulating mere money and the sort of sober, plodding, nose to the grindstone advancement through a career, all accompanied by social anxiety and thus insisting on a dull respectability and conformity to convention, was not the aristocratic lifestyle.

    Mind you, I'm not necessarily defending the aristocratic lifestyle - at its worst, it was unbearably artificial, pompous, wasteful, and viciously arrogant and cruel to the lower classes, but at its best it presented certain very attractive features compared to the dull conventionality of bourgeois life.

    To the Greeks, "leisure" was an explicit ideal, celebrated as the highest end of life - for the Chinese likewise, refined leisure was explicitly celebrated as the highest sort of life. Indeed for all pre-bourgouis cultures leisure was the highest form of life and work was not celebrated for its own sake. Modern bourgeois culture is perhaps the first in history to celebrate work and make it into an intrinsic virtue - and this is in fact a massive revolution in human affairs (which in my view must be overturned :) ). All previous cultures celebrated the contemplative life as the highest.

    And it is my belief that the modern celebration of work and disvaluing of the contemplative life is somehow at the very heart of modern nihilism, and that is a very significant fact.

    As a final remark, of course there was also an aristocratic tradition of "service", often military, and the English aristocracy often provided motivated and self-sacrificing officers and empire-builders to their country - and this was a very attractive thing indeed.

    But this too is a far cry from the kind bourgeois hard work celebration of someone like AP :)

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Coconuts, @AP

    , @AaronB
    @silviosilver

    As for art, well, what would an art that didn't deal in the ideal, the possible, that didn't point to something beyond actually existing conditions, look like?

    Well, it would be a photograph, or a facsimile :)

    And not those carefully curated photographs that do constitute art of a sort - but precisely because what they depict is highly selected and curated and not merely "what's there".

    Think of two houses - one a concrete block, one an ornate Gothic pile. It seems to me indisputable that the Gothic pile - which is an attempt to incorporate "beauty" - integrates completely unnecessary elements into it that play no function, and thus point to something "beyond".

    What would an art "celebrating" the actual look like? Even art that seeks to glorify a battle, or a king, is highly selective in what it depicts, and depicts a sort of "ideal" battle or king, with many "realistic" elements left out.

    And that is because the actual world is always less than ideal - unless you're prepared to deny this, as Dmitry thinks AP is doing.

    Which begs the question - if the world was one of ideal perfection, would art even exist, or would the world itself be the work of art?

    Replies: @silviosilver

  710. @A123
    @Beckow


    US is involved in an almost existential way
     
    As an American, I can tell you that this is *NOT* the case.

    It is a budget item. A superficial (though very expensive) 🇺🇦fad🇺🇦. America is going to walk away, and virtually no one will care. Remember, most Americans cannot locate Ukraine on a globe.

    No one likes to be tied to losses, so there will be an Orwellian 1984 retcon to create mental and emotional separation from the European Elite's fiasco. Any story that begins,"Not-The-President Biden was manipulated...", immediately has massive credibility.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Beckow

    By “US” I meant the Washington ruling class – they are fully committed, this is “it” for them. Whether they manage to take along the 99% of Americans who are not involved we don’t know. But based on the level of media and government control (close to total when it comes to anything Russian) and the blase uninformed and emotionally manipulated nature of the people, it wouldn’t surprise me if the people went along.

    In any case, the rulers can’t afford to lose this one and have no way of winning it. That creates a dilemma – will they escalate to the big boom in order not to lose face? And will Russia play along? Or is there some less dramatic way out?

    We don’t know, but this is the most dangerous moment in human history. We are at this point because a bunch of retards with maps in Washington-London decided it was a good idea to expand Nato into Ukraine and checkmate Russia. Instead we got this mess.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Beckow


    By “US” I meant the Washington ruling class – they are fully committed, this is “it” for them.
     
    There is no proof for your claim of "full commitment". All of the evidence is 100% against your premise:

    • No war taxes
    • No war bonds
    • No conscription
    • No rationing
    • No emergency manufacturing

    If Washington was gearing up for a fight there would be a Declaration of War. Not-The-President Biden cannot even obtain a quasi-legal Authorization for Use of Military Force [AUMF].


    In any case, the rulers can’t afford to lose this one and have no way of winning it.
     
    The U.S. is not in this fight so it is not even a win/lose scenario. Walking away is merely mildly embarrassing and easily "affordable".

    The upcoming investigation of ties between Hunter Biden and Burisma will cast disrepute on support for the Kiev regime. The White House occupant is going to struggle with House Appropriations. There will be much less money in the future.

    At some point Not-The-President Biden will be thrown to the wolves. Part of that cleansing will be jettisoning his son's fiasco in Ukraine. To swamp creatures, political survival is much more important than consistent policy.
    ___

    If the European Elite establishment wants Ukraine in the EU, they are going to have to fund the fight & subsequent reconstruction.

    However, as I have suggested previously, the European WEF masterminding this conflict does not even want to "win" the war. Their idea of "success" is turning Ukraine into a failed state.

    PEACE 😇

  711. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, in Poland we call people like you Wielkorus; all Slavdom is for you in some way Russian. It may also explain why you look for continuity everywhere. You are just smaller version of Pan-Serbian Odyssey, since you limit your claims to Slavs only. But you were so long in America that you seem sincerely believe in melting pot theory! Well, here in Europe we have never believed this: this is why we had so many wars and states etc.


    But of course there was a continuity, it’s just that they integrated various non – Indo-European cultural influences.
     
    Looking for continuation is a scourge of prehistory, which, I was told once, came from politics. If you could show "your" people were somewhere in bygone times, you could claim the land where you found the remnants! It is what German archaeology was doing pre-WWII and WWII, not just in reference to the East but the West too. But others started to follow in their steps after 1945.
    Unfortunately, it is very easy to claim continuation in prehistory - you just have to found respective ceramics and then you can claim at least some "admixture".

    Looking at closer history, eg. Mongol invasion of Rusia or Manchu invasion of China, we see that invaders try to live in some kind of Apartheid. Manchu had parallel institutions for themselves in China (like their own army) and their own quotas in administration. Something like that suggests discontinuation after conquest, not a melting pot, at least in the short- and medium term. Moreover, some degree of genetic continuity (of the Chinese and the Muscovy) is not tantamount to cultural continuity of the entire society. So really we should look for high degree of cultural continuity as a confirmation of substantial genetic continuity, not vice versa.

    As a counterpoint to your thesis, Unetice culture seems to be a genetic continuation of Globular Amphorae Culture which is decisively non-Indo-Europan. Unetice also seems to be genetic and cultural kin of Cucuteni-Trypillia culture, especially in their love for living in crowded settlements of longhouses (or other shared houses). This love for crowd I find decidedly un-Slavic. That are pre-cities, not villages.

    All that forgets the problem that there was some male population exchange in East & Central Europe at least, since the female population of these regions is genetically older than its male population. That suggests either armed invasion, or resettlement after a plague (maybe the second, judging from Cucuteni-Trypillia custom of burning their own houses, probably an answer to plague as a primitive form of dezinfection) .

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burned_house_horizon

    The current research is decidedly focused on finding continuity, though. Look for example at this article:

    https://scienceinpoland.pap.pl/en/node/82059

    The title says: Bronze Age DNA Shows Direct Genetic Link to Current Inhabitants of Southern Poland

    Great! Continuity!

    However, in the article itself we find:

    . It has now turned out that communities several hundred years younger (the Mierzanowice and Trzcinies cultures) exhibit genetic continuity (associated with the Corded Ware culture) present in the female lines.


    So it was all about female lines...?! Why there are specifically interested in them anyway?!Not a word in article why there is apparent discontinuity in Y-DNA. Of course, the research was set up since they investigated only female-transferred DNA... but well, why?

    Later we find:
    According to Dr. Juras, the population associated with the Strzyżów culture has genetically most in common with steppe communities.

    The descendants of people associated with the Strzyżów culture could have come to the lands of present-day south-eastern Poland with the first migration from the steppe during the late Neolithic. But they formed an isolated population that developed independently of the Corded Ware culture community.

    So now we get admission that all people were Corded Ware (remember, the use of word "associated" aka "admixture") but not really Corded Ware. So steppe people were not really behind Corded Ware...?!!!! Uff, ufff I am getting a headache, as usually when reading some paper with agenda, which here is (1) Corded ware are steppe people, (2) there is matrilineal continuity, (3) that matrilineal continuity is observed among Corded Ware descendants.

    I am always alarmed by these matrilineal continuity claims as it suggests cousin marriage/endogamy which again suggests non-steppe people, which seems to be a hidden point of the article as they admit on one point that the only not-really-Corded Ware culture is the most steppe one. Uff! Something is definitely fuzzy about this article. You may understand now why prehistory is not my favourite part of history.

    That there is something someone wants to hide is clear from the misleading title anyway.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Sher Singh

    As a counterpoint to your thesis, Unetice culture seems to be a genetic continuation of Globular Amphorae Culture which is decisively non-Indo-Europan. Unetice also seems to be genetic and cultural kin of Cucuteni-Trypillia culture, especially in their love for living in crowded settlements of longhouses (or other shared houses). This love for crowd I find decidedly un-Slavic. That are pre-cities, not villages.

    That’s the second time that you wrote something that seems to demonstrate that you don’t really read my comments before replying.

    [MORE]

    I have written that Globular Amphora influenced Corded Ware, but have never written that Globular Amphora (let alone Tripolye) were Indo-European.

    AFAIK Globular Amphora might be seen as a hybrid culture arising during / after the collapse of Tripolye people, through intermixing of the surviving Tripolian farmers with pre-Corded War hunter – gatherer people from the Sredny Stog culture. Globular Amphora and Unetice are separated by at least a 500 years period how can anyone talk of any “continuity” or even influence between them ?

    Especially at a time when an average human life duration was around 35 years ?

    About Unetice, I have written that it was a culture that arose at the interface of the (Eastern) Bell Beaker and Corded Ware realms. I have also written that it was the cradle of the ancient European religion. I am quite certain that it used most probably PIE language as its koine or creole. But I have never written that it was produced only by Y haplogroup R1a people. Neither have I written anything about the primary origins of the PIE which are impossible to determine exactly (but I don’t think Bell-Beaker folks were PIE speakers).

    About steppe – ancestry, it is a misnomer, which comes from the outdated Gambutas theories. There were no ferocious “Kurgan people” coming from the East and invading the “peace loving” (human sacrifice practicing and cannibalistic) “Old Europe” cultures. Yamnaya did not alter the genetic landscape of Old Europe, they were probably too few and far between and a substantial number of them migrated south insead of going west. Corded Ware is Old Europe, as is Megalithic Culture and the survivors of Linearband Ceramic Culture etc.

    The ones who invaded and genocided came not from the eastern steppes and were not Yamnaya people (let alone Corded Ware), they came from the westernmost part of Europe (Iberian peninsula) and were the Bell-Beaker folks. It took them centuries to conquer Western Europe and arrive in the region where Unetice would later develop and which was inhabited by the Corded Ware folks. We should think of these invaders as we think of their Conquistador descendants in the New World. For the ancestors of the Slav it was the first Drang nach Osten that they had to face and survive, but as we know today it was hardly the last.

    That’s what they are trying to hide by not describing Y haplogroups, and only looking at the mtDNA haplogroups. Female populations weren’t killed, they procreated with the conquerors. The Western European people are the population that arose from this process. A process that has met its limits around the Tollense river where an important group of Bell Beaker would be conquerors and their surviving Megalithic Europe and Corded Ware slaves were slaughtered. Ruthlessly ambushed and killed to the last as someone would kill a rabid animal. Another very significant historical moment that they prefer not to emphasize too much in European schools.

    Now, about the Moskal and Lyakh relationship, I have some diluted (Orthodox) Polish ancestry on my mother’s side that I have been able to trace to the Great Lithuanian Duchy in modern day Belarus, close to the border of Ukraine. I have a substantial Ukrainian ancestry, obviously Russian too with perhaps some Tatar and Mordvin admixture, and I am fine with that. Most of these people’s populations are descended from the Corded Ware folks.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    I have a substantial Ukrainian ancestry, obviously Russian too with perhaps some Tatar and Mordvin admixture, and I am fine with that.
     
    Don't you also believe that at some point admixture becomes excessive - "not fine"? Isn't this the basis on which you challenged AK's right to claim Slavic identity? If so, have you come up with any schema which stands a realistic chance of achieving widespread acceptance? Slavs/R1A aside, the question is of general relevance to any group seeking to genetically define itself and to pursue the political measures necessary to preserve itself.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Blinky Bill

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    That’s the second time that you wrote something that seems to demonstrate that you don’t really read my comments before replying.
     
    I am sorry, but you wrote neither about Globular Amphora nor Cucuteni-Trypillia cultures in this thread, and your comment that I was responding to the last time was pretty sketchy. I don't feel obliged to comb through Bashybuzuk archives, especially as I remember you mainly from non-Karlin threads. I was never so impressed so as to click on your name and read all your comments. I hope you are not a narcist coming here back for narcistic supply and you will thus withstand this confession of mine. You have many admirers here anyway ;)

    About steppe – ancestry, it is a misnomer, which comes from the outdated Gambutas theories. There were no ferocious “Kurgan people” coming from the East and invading the “peace loving” (human sacrifice practicing and cannibalistic) “Old Europe” cultures.
     
    The problem of steppe-ancestry is misleading (I find that Yamnaya, primarily R1b, became a prime candidate for these steppe invaders pretty strange, actually), because it mixes the problem of genetic replacement of males, and of cultural replacement. I would say Gimbutas got the cultural change much better than the processes which had led to it. Both kind of changes did happen, and they were so thorough that I find "plagues" theory more convincing that "First Holocaust of Europe/Systematic Massacres" theory - why kill slaves anyway...? The only historical analogy to that is the substantial removal of pre-Columbian Y-DNA from South America: it probably happened at least as much by plagues as by massacres; and male slaves had much higher mortality than female ones. Were the Bell Beakers the Nazis of pre-history..? I don't think so - they were in Sardinia, but Sardinia still has one of the Europe's oldest genetic lineages. They were surely aggressive, but the technology was not ready yet for full-scale massacres, and the technical distance between them and their victims wasn't so great like between Conquistadors and Indians, the latter still living in the pre-iron age.

    The kin relations were fundamentally different in Old and New Europe - matrilineality vs patrilineality. This is cultural change more substantial than the disappearance of very Goddess/Lady of Old Europe istelf, I would say. Your theory "of evolution and of massacres by Bell-Beakers" does not really explain why that would happen at all.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  712. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    I am sometimes surprised how strong hatred Poland can sometimes arise in people (moreover, often having nothing to do with Poland); it is almost as if Poles were Jews...

    "Dekalog" was made as TV series; this is why its episodes aren't too long. However,
    "A Short Film about Killing" also had its cinematic version: it was the first Kieslowski movie which was noticed in the West.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Yahya

    it is almost as if Poles were Jews…

    Almost as if they were…

    • LOL: Ivashka the fool
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Yahya

    Well, in my old Polish/Ukrainian neighborhood in Mpls, it was a well know fact that:

    "Being Polish is a profession, not a nationality". :-)

    My Polish grandfather was the only one that I never had the good fortune of meeting. Once I retire and have more time to spend in Ukraine, I plan to research that part of my lineage.

    , @Dmitry
    @Yahya



    it is almost as if Poles were Jews…

     

    Almost as if they were…

     

    If you had anti-Polish views, there is a problematic influence in Israel's political culture, although reducing in the last decade (Lapid family from Hungary, Bennett family from a religious cult in San Francisco) - the influence of the secular Israeli clique that had Polish culture .

    Ruling clique of culturally early 20th century middle class liberal Polish people, from North East Poland/Lithuania zone.

    They have positive late 19th century culture, like to idealize English culture (this is positive), egalitarian progressive nationalism (this is positive), idealizing agricultural life, but like most people from the Polish culture space, they seem to be imagining secretly they are special noble people (in the Polish culture, most Catholic Poles say they are descended from aristocrats).

    It's a clique of secular Jewish families from a small area of villages in Poland to the border of Lithuania, but when they have now their own estate in the Middle East, where they could be politically managing the Arab Jewish peasants (nowadays Netanyahu's job), importing and controlling passive demoralized postsoviet cattle from Russia/Ukraine and Ethiopians (well this was Rabin's dream - Rabin actually from more East), or compromising and controlling with local religious cults of Amish (Haredi - this is Netanyahu's job nowadays, but before Rabin), or Mormons (religious nationalists). These religious cults were easy to control because they have specificied insular demands.

    If you watch video below when the Italian Prime Minister is in the Israeli parliament. President of Israel (Herzog) is opposition leader to Netanyahu and attacks him in the political space. At 1:10 he says behind it "we are all very close friends on both sides". And their great-grandparents surely from the same villages in Poland near Ben Gurion's family.

    Listen to what Herzog says 1:10

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DIvbsfJ624

    If you were enough of anti-Poland conspiracy theorist in Israel, there is also stereotype Polish style facial expressions Netanyahu is using increasingly.

    Netanyahu starts to imitate Kaczynski's facial expression, not just his methods of control of country. Soon he can maneuver full control of the political system.

    https://static.wirtualnemedia.pl/media/top/jaroslawkaczynski2022-655.jpg

    https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/66AA/production/_112428262_mediaitem112428260.jpg.webp

    Replies: @Dmitry, @Another Polish Perspective

  713. @Beckow
    @A123

    By "US" I meant the Washington ruling class - they are fully committed, this is "it" for them. Whether they manage to take along the 99% of Americans who are not involved we don't know. But based on the level of media and government control (close to total when it comes to anything Russian) and the blase uninformed and emotionally manipulated nature of the people, it wouldn't surprise me if the people went along.

    In any case, the rulers can't afford to lose this one and have no way of winning it. That creates a dilemma - will they escalate to the big boom in order not to lose face? And will Russia play along? Or is there some less dramatic way out?

    We don't know, but this is the most dangerous moment in human history. We are at this point because a bunch of retards with maps in Washington-London decided it was a good idea to expand Nato into Ukraine and checkmate Russia. Instead we got this mess.

    Replies: @A123

    By “US” I meant the Washington ruling class – they are fully committed, this is “it” for them.

    There is no proof for your claim of “full commitment”. All of the evidence is 100% against your premise:

    • No war taxes
    • No war bonds
    • No conscription
    • No rationing
    • No emergency manufacturing

    If Washington was gearing up for a fight there would be a Declaration of War. Not-The-President Biden cannot even obtain a quasi-legal Authorization for Use of Military Force [AUMF].

    In any case, the rulers can’t afford to lose this one and have no way of winning it.

    The U.S. is not in this fight so it is not even a win/lose scenario. Walking away is merely mildly embarrassing and easily “affordable”.

    The upcoming investigation of ties between Hunter Biden and Burisma will cast disrepute on support for the Kiev regime. The White House occupant is going to struggle with House Appropriations. There will be much less money in the future.

    At some point Not-The-President Biden will be thrown to the wolves. Part of that cleansing will be jettisoning his son’s fiasco in Ukraine. To swamp creatures, political survival is much more important than consistent policy.
    ___

    If the European Elite establishment wants Ukraine in the EU, they are going to have to fund the fight & subsequent reconstruction.

    However, as I have suggested previously, the European WEF masterminding this conflict does not even want to “win” the war. Their idea of “success” is turning Ukraine into a failed state.

    PEACE 😇

  714. @AP
    @silviosilver

    Everything you wrote was correct in this post.


    How do you know he “blindly” followed it? How do you know he didn’t question it and, having questioned it, having examined various alternatives, agreed that it was sound advice?
     
    If one has to run away in order to achieve “transcendence” or “authenticity” than that authenticity is weak or fake, dependent on external factors rather than on something within oneself. Someone capable of these things can do them in any environment, be it a factory or office or shop, while being productive (that is, giving back to the community rather than just taking its fruits). AaronB is as spiritual in his flight from civilization, as are his equals - middle aged bourgeois women making eat-pray-love vacations in India or Africa, except he probably doesn’t have sex with the locals. It is no wonder that the person with whom he has the least contentious interactions is the materialist atheist Mikel (whom I do not criticize here, because he seems to be authentic and honest to himself).

    Maybe because none of my ancestors were bourgeois, we don’t feel the need to distance ourselves from the modern capitalist system here, as if to prove something by rejecting it. Objectively, as I wrote, it’s the best tool invented to maximize material prosperity and thereby to eliminate tragedies such as famines and real impoverishment (not the fake voluntary and self-indulgent kind). One must really hate people to condemn such a system or even to refuse to participate in it, in order to pursue a life of self-indulgence, living off fruits that others have planted while whining about the planters and telling oneself lies about somehow being more intuitive or transcendent than they are.

    Feudalism had its own advantages (beauty probably peaked in that world) and we did no worse under that system, but it is not coming back and we do not choose when we are born but live the best we can in the place we find ourselves in. We once built conservatories and schools, financed churches, composed music, performed music, served as military officers or priests. In the current efficient system we outsource much (but not all!) such work through high tax rates and election choices while enjoying the prosperity that we share with others, in the most prosperous age in human history. A prosperity that need not be expressed solely in material pleasures or possessions (this is probably the only way that someone like AaronB can understand prosperity), it can be transformed into much more.

    The bourgeois’s flight into the wilderness is not Christlike at all. It reveals an inability to love others. Flight from marriage means the person can’t appreciate one other’s soul enough to spend a lifetime exploring it and the world together. Choosing childlessness is to prevent bringing another soul into this world and a flight from a fundamental and truly transformative human experience, which may be scary for some. This is why abortion, in addition to murder, is an act of extreme cowardice and denial. Flight from work reflects the inability or laziness to see beauty in seemingly mundane settings and interactions, as well as obvious selfishness.

    Replies: @Mikel

    It is no wonder that the person with whom he has the least contentious interactions is the materialist atheist Mikel

    No, it has nothing to do with my involuntary atheism/existentialism. It’s just that we share the same passion for the natural landscapes of the US West (not a very materialistic thing to feel the same calling for). That makes me overlook the many differences that we have and actually wonder what else we may have in common. I guess I would regard his posts in a totally different light if he was as indifferent to natural beauty as Silviosilver is. But I would still find him interesting to read, as I do Silviosilver. I also admire his ability to be constantly reading a tremendous amount of profound, intellectually demanding books. I doubt you would be debating him yourself if you didn’t find his opinions challenging enough to spend your time on.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Mikel


    his posts in a totally different light if he was as indifferent to natural beauty as Silviosilver is.
     
    Ouch, I'm not completely indifferent to it. Of course I appreciate it, when I'm around it. I just seldom feel any need to go looking for it. There's a lovely track I like to walk along with a river on one side and, for a large stretch of it a lush manicured golf course, on the other side. (Part of the reason I used to be an avid golfer was the beautiful surrounds.) That's generally enough 'nature' for me.

    If I need more, I like to take long drives through the countryside where I know the scenery is to my liking. After a drive like that, months will pass before I feel the urge again. Even more occasionally, I'll go 'exploring' in new areas where I'm not sure what I'll find. So there's a bit of appreciation there, but I admit I'm not exactly mesmerized by natural beauty. And the reason I don't go with other people is because when I have, they always want to stay longer than I do. It doesn't take very long for my feeling to become oh come on, haven't we seen it now, how much longer do you wanna stay?

    (Think of the scene in National Lampoon's Vacation where Chevy Chase and his wife breath in the beauty of the Grand Canyon for all of like three seconds. I can relate, lol. Aaron shaking his head that I'm yet again missing the point.)

    , @AaronB
    @Mikel

    Actually, I'd say no true atheist/materialist would have a passion for nature like you do :)

    You have a beliefless, wordless religion - which is probably really the best kind.

  715. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    As a counterpoint to your thesis, Unetice culture seems to be a genetic continuation of Globular Amphorae Culture which is decisively non-Indo-Europan. Unetice also seems to be genetic and cultural kin of Cucuteni-Trypillia culture, especially in their love for living in crowded settlements of longhouses (or other shared houses). This love for crowd I find decidedly un-Slavic. That are pre-cities, not villages.
     
    That's the second time that you wrote something that seems to demonstrate that you don't really read my comments before replying.



    I have written that Globular Amphora influenced Corded Ware, but have never written that Globular Amphora (let alone Tripolye) were Indo-European.

    AFAIK Globular Amphora might be seen as a hybrid culture arising during / after the collapse of Tripolye people, through intermixing of the surviving Tripolian farmers with pre-Corded War hunter - gatherer people from the Sredny Stog culture. Globular Amphora and Unetice are separated by at least a 500 years period how can anyone talk of any "continuity" or even influence between them ?

    Especially at a time when an average human life duration was around 35 years ?

    About Unetice, I have written that it was a culture that arose at the interface of the (Eastern) Bell Beaker and Corded Ware realms. I have also written that it was the cradle of the ancient European religion. I am quite certain that it used most probably PIE language as its koine or creole. But I have never written that it was produced only by Y haplogroup R1a people. Neither have I written anything about the primary origins of the PIE which are impossible to determine exactly (but I don't think Bell-Beaker folks were PIE speakers).

    About steppe - ancestry, it is a misnomer, which comes from the outdated Gambutas theories. There were no ferocious "Kurgan people" coming from the East and invading the "peace loving" (human sacrifice practicing and cannibalistic) "Old Europe" cultures. Yamnaya did not alter the genetic landscape of Old Europe, they were probably too few and far between and a substantial number of them migrated south insead of going west. Corded Ware is Old Europe, as is Megalithic Culture and the survivors of Linearband Ceramic Culture etc.

    The ones who invaded and genocided came not from the eastern steppes and were not Yamnaya people (let alone Corded Ware), they came from the westernmost part of Europe (Iberian peninsula) and were the Bell-Beaker folks. It took them centuries to conquer Western Europe and arrive in the region where Unetice would later develop and which was inhabited by the Corded Ware folks. We should think of these invaders as we think of their Conquistador descendants in the New World. For the ancestors of the Slav it was the first Drang nach Osten that they had to face and survive, but as we know today it was hardly the last.

    That's what they are trying to hide by not describing Y haplogroups, and only looking at the mtDNA haplogroups. Female populations weren't killed, they procreated with the conquerors. The Western European people are the population that arose from this process. A process that has met its limits around the Tollense river where an important group of Bell Beaker would be conquerors and their surviving Megalithic Europe and Corded Ware slaves were slaughtered. Ruthlessly ambushed and killed to the last as someone would kill a rabid animal. Another very significant historical moment that they prefer not to emphasize too much in European schools.

    Now, about the Moskal and Lyakh relationship, I have some diluted (Orthodox) Polish ancestry on my mother's side that I have been able to trace to the Great Lithuanian Duchy in modern day Belarus, close to the border of Ukraine. I have a substantial Ukrainian ancestry, obviously Russian too with perhaps some Tatar and Mordvin admixture, and I am fine with that. Most of these people's populations are descended from the Corded Ware folks.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Another Polish Perspective

    I have a substantial Ukrainian ancestry, obviously Russian too with perhaps some Tatar and Mordvin admixture, and I am fine with that.

    Don’t you also believe that at some point admixture becomes excessive – “not fine”? Isn’t this the basis on which you challenged AK’s right to claim Slavic identity? If so, have you come up with any schema which stands a realistic chance of achieving widespread acceptance? Slavs/R1A aside, the question is of general relevance to any group seeking to genetically define itself and to pursue the political measures necessary to preserve itself.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    I was just trolling AK, most of our interactions were trolling each other anyway. I think he mostly found my posting entertaining, he has an excellent sense of humor.

    I don't really care about anyone's ethnic makeup. Not anymore. I have come a long way from the maximalist РНЕ attitudes that I shared in my youth. Quite frankly, my kids themselves are quite an ethnic mix, and they are great kids.

    But I do care whether someone respects his ancestors and takes care of being honorable to not bring shame on their memories. I have never written anything negative about the people whom my ancestors have been part of. I have a healthy deal of respect for all of these groups they have been mostly honest, hardworking and industrious in their own way.

    Now about the desirable genetic make-up, just follow the selfish gene way: everything that increases the fitness and the potential rate of success of your progeny is great. Look for what you're missing and try to find it in the spouse. Whether the kids are blue-eyed blond Ubermenshen is irrelevant. IQ, health (including the psychological aspects), stamina and good looks that's what I would look for today, if I had to find myself a wife to procreate with. Luckily, my procreation period is finished. Kids are nearly grown up and will go their own way. They have a better character than I do, thanks to their mother for that, they live in a mostly peaceful environment, they should be doing fine.

    I hope to retire to some cabin in the woods one day and live a quiet life if providence / karma would allow me so. Read books, walk the dogs, hike through the nearby forests. Listen to great music.

    As our Muslim friends would say : In'sha'Allah.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Mr. Hack, @silviosilver

    , @Blinky Bill
    @silviosilver

    Silviosilver I've always found your comments enlightening, in particular this one from many years ago, it's always stuck with me.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-conventional-wisdom-in-a-nutshell/#comment-930525



    This meme also flashes in my mind every time I read one of your comments. 😅

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FbOXb_BUIAAEgJh.jpg

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @silviosilver

  716. @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    I have a substantial Ukrainian ancestry, obviously Russian too with perhaps some Tatar and Mordvin admixture, and I am fine with that.
     
    Don't you also believe that at some point admixture becomes excessive - "not fine"? Isn't this the basis on which you challenged AK's right to claim Slavic identity? If so, have you come up with any schema which stands a realistic chance of achieving widespread acceptance? Slavs/R1A aside, the question is of general relevance to any group seeking to genetically define itself and to pursue the political measures necessary to preserve itself.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Blinky Bill

    I was just trolling AK, most of our interactions were trolling each other anyway. I think he mostly found my posting entertaining, he has an excellent sense of humor.

    [MORE]

    I don’t really care about anyone’s ethnic makeup. Not anymore. I have come a long way from the maximalist РНЕ attitudes that I shared in my youth. Quite frankly, my kids themselves are quite an ethnic mix, and they are great kids.

    But I do care whether someone respects his ancestors and takes care of being honorable to not bring shame on their memories. I have never written anything negative about the people whom my ancestors have been part of. I have a healthy deal of respect for all of these groups they have been mostly honest, hardworking and industrious in their own way.

    Now about the desirable genetic make-up, just follow the selfish gene way: everything that increases the fitness and the potential rate of success of your progeny is great. Look for what you’re missing and try to find it in the spouse. Whether the kids are blue-eyed blond Ubermenshen is irrelevant. IQ, health (including the psychological aspects), stamina and good looks that’s what I would look for today, if I had to find myself a wife to procreate with. Luckily, my procreation period is finished. Kids are nearly grown up and will go their own way. They have a better character than I do, thanks to their mother for that, they live in a mostly peaceful environment, they should be doing fine.

    I hope to retire to some cabin in the woods one day and live a quiet life if providence / karma would allow me so. Read books, walk the dogs, hike through the nearby forests. Listen to great music.

    As our Muslim friends would say : In’sha’Allah.

    • Agree: AP
    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool

    If you don't mind me asking, what became of Alexander Barkashov? Is he still active in Rus Fed politics?

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Mr. Hack
    @Ivashka the fool


    But I do care whether someone respects his ancestors and takes care of being honorable to not bring shame on their memories.
     
    Respecting ones own ethnicity is easy enough for me to understand, with plenty of churches in the US that still exhibit some ethnic flavor or another. Civic organizations seem to abound here too, whether its the Italian-American club, the Polish White Eagle organization, B'nai Brith, etc, etc. But it's respecting ones haplogroup (that I think that you're promoting) that I find difficult to understand? If its just taking care not to be dishonoring or bringing shame on ones pre-historic ancestors, then I think that 99%+ of all people are safe from being guilty of such charges, if not 100% of all readers of this website? Could you be more specific about what you mean here?

    https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/arcadianews.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/d/14/d1499ad0-98d4-11ec-baa9-9b4cf52c15e5/621d30318cddf.image.jpg?resize=400%2C225
    Irish Cultural Center Phoenix AZ (quite the elaborate complex built about 10 years ago)

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Ivashka the fool

    , @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    I was just trolling AK, most of our interactions were trolling each other anyway.
     
    It sounded more serious than trolling to me, but okay, I'll take your word for it. Still, to get technical on you, that would just mean that you actually did accept AK as a member of the Slavic fold, but it changes nothing about the nature of the concern you were expressing about Slavic interests, as you understood them. If you've since changed your mind about those interests, fair enough, but it wasn't obvious to me at all in anything you've been saying since your return.

    Now about the desirable genetic make-up, just follow the selfish gene way: everything that increases the fitness and the potential rate of success of your progeny is great.
     
    Not sure where this came from. :) I didn't ask you anything about "desirable" genetic make-up.

    When Gautama Buddha spoke to his disciples he often started his talk by addressing the assembly as “Good sons and good daughters of good families…”.
     
    Given the totality of the Buddha's teachings, you don't think there's some other reason he might have had to have thusly begun an address? Surely the idea the Buddha can be recruited as a haplogroup worshiper avant la lettre is a leap of logic worthy of a 'prosperity gospel' exegete.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  717. @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    I have a substantial Ukrainian ancestry, obviously Russian too with perhaps some Tatar and Mordvin admixture, and I am fine with that.
     
    Don't you also believe that at some point admixture becomes excessive - "not fine"? Isn't this the basis on which you challenged AK's right to claim Slavic identity? If so, have you come up with any schema which stands a realistic chance of achieving widespread acceptance? Slavs/R1A aside, the question is of general relevance to any group seeking to genetically define itself and to pursue the political measures necessary to preserve itself.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Blinky Bill

    Silviosilver I’ve always found your comments enlightening, in particular this one from many years ago, it’s always stuck with me.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-conventional-wisdom-in-a-nutshell/#comment-930525

    [MORE]

    This meme also flashes in my mind every time I read one of your comments. 😅

    • Agree: Ivashka the fool, S
    • LOL: silviosilver
    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    I would add that preserving "racial purity" is something better done in one's own homeland. If one chooses the life of an immigrant and doesn't want to go back home for whatever reason, then one is just an immigrant among others. And if the natives don't care for the Great Replacement, then why should we ? As the French saying goes, one should not trying to be more catholic than the pope.

    https://static.dw.com/image/19141999_6.jpg

    Especially, this pope...

    🙂

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @S, @Dmitry

    , @silviosilver
    @Blinky Bill

    Well thanks Bill. I cringed when I saw the date of that post you linked to. I often cringe when I reread something I wrote a year ago, let alone eight years ago, lol. Or another response I have is when I'm rereading something I said, but for whatever reason I'm unaware that it's my own post, and I find myself agreeing with it - this writer is showing good sense! - and then I realize I was the author, and boom, I find a hundred faults with it, haha.

    Much truth in that meme. So can I lean on you as a character witness when I'm hauled off by the inquisition? :)

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

  718. @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    it is almost as if Poles were Jews…
     
    Almost as if they were...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEL0RL_bBkw&ab_channel=OlgaMieleszczuk

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Dmitry

    Well, in my old Polish/Ukrainian neighborhood in Mpls, it was a well know fact that:

    “Being Polish is a profession, not a nationality”. 🙂

    My Polish grandfather was the only one that I never had the good fortune of meeting. Once I retire and have more time to spend in Ukraine, I plan to research that part of my lineage.

  719. @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    I was just trolling AK, most of our interactions were trolling each other anyway. I think he mostly found my posting entertaining, he has an excellent sense of humor.

    I don't really care about anyone's ethnic makeup. Not anymore. I have come a long way from the maximalist РНЕ attitudes that I shared in my youth. Quite frankly, my kids themselves are quite an ethnic mix, and they are great kids.

    But I do care whether someone respects his ancestors and takes care of being honorable to not bring shame on their memories. I have never written anything negative about the people whom my ancestors have been part of. I have a healthy deal of respect for all of these groups they have been mostly honest, hardworking and industrious in their own way.

    Now about the desirable genetic make-up, just follow the selfish gene way: everything that increases the fitness and the potential rate of success of your progeny is great. Look for what you're missing and try to find it in the spouse. Whether the kids are blue-eyed blond Ubermenshen is irrelevant. IQ, health (including the psychological aspects), stamina and good looks that's what I would look for today, if I had to find myself a wife to procreate with. Luckily, my procreation period is finished. Kids are nearly grown up and will go their own way. They have a better character than I do, thanks to their mother for that, they live in a mostly peaceful environment, they should be doing fine.

    I hope to retire to some cabin in the woods one day and live a quiet life if providence / karma would allow me so. Read books, walk the dogs, hike through the nearby forests. Listen to great music.

    As our Muslim friends would say : In'sha'Allah.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Mr. Hack, @silviosilver

    If you don’t mind me asking, what became of Alexander Barkashov? Is he still active in Rus Fed politics?

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    Last time I checked, many years ago, he still had a small cult follow-up. He renounced his neo-pagan outlook (an Orthodox Christian - Vedic mix) and went back to the more normative Orthodox Faith, but in a kind of ultra-orthodox sect that doesn't mix with the official ROC. He has supposedly become a monastic. He is not really active in politics anymore. I think Dark October of 1993 was a very difficult moment for him and the movement - hundreds of militants were killed in action or have been executed the night following their surrender, mostly young people. He might feel somewhat responsible for their deaths. I would if I was him...

  720. @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    I was just trolling AK, most of our interactions were trolling each other anyway. I think he mostly found my posting entertaining, he has an excellent sense of humor.

    I don't really care about anyone's ethnic makeup. Not anymore. I have come a long way from the maximalist РНЕ attitudes that I shared in my youth. Quite frankly, my kids themselves are quite an ethnic mix, and they are great kids.

    But I do care whether someone respects his ancestors and takes care of being honorable to not bring shame on their memories. I have never written anything negative about the people whom my ancestors have been part of. I have a healthy deal of respect for all of these groups they have been mostly honest, hardworking and industrious in their own way.

    Now about the desirable genetic make-up, just follow the selfish gene way: everything that increases the fitness and the potential rate of success of your progeny is great. Look for what you're missing and try to find it in the spouse. Whether the kids are blue-eyed blond Ubermenshen is irrelevant. IQ, health (including the psychological aspects), stamina and good looks that's what I would look for today, if I had to find myself a wife to procreate with. Luckily, my procreation period is finished. Kids are nearly grown up and will go their own way. They have a better character than I do, thanks to their mother for that, they live in a mostly peaceful environment, they should be doing fine.

    I hope to retire to some cabin in the woods one day and live a quiet life if providence / karma would allow me so. Read books, walk the dogs, hike through the nearby forests. Listen to great music.

    As our Muslim friends would say : In'sha'Allah.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Mr. Hack, @silviosilver

    But I do care whether someone respects his ancestors and takes care of being honorable to not bring shame on their memories.

    Respecting ones own ethnicity is easy enough for me to understand, with plenty of churches in the US that still exhibit some ethnic flavor or another. Civic organizations seem to abound here too, whether its the Italian-American club, the Polish White Eagle organization, B’nai Brith, etc, etc. But it’s respecting ones haplogroup (that I think that you’re promoting) that I find difficult to understand? If its just taking care not to be dishonoring or bringing shame on ones pre-historic ancestors, then I think that 99%+ of all people are safe from being guilty of such charges, if not 100% of all readers of this website? Could you be more specific about what you mean here?

    https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/arcadianews.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/d/14/d1499ad0-98d4-11ec-baa9-9b4cf52c15e5/621d30318cddf.image.jpg?resize=400%2C225
    Irish Cultural Center Phoenix AZ (quite the elaborate complex built about 10 years ago)

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Mr. Hack

    https://www.irishcentral.com/uploads/article-v2/2019/10/135766/cropped_irish_cultural_center_and_mcclelland_library_fb.jpg?t=1572471176

    The Irish Cultural Center and McClelland Library in Phoenix, AZ

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @Mr. Hack

    Ethnicities change, just ask our young Arab friend here. Languages change, British people didn't speak English a thousand years ago. Cultures evolve or regress, people change religious affiliation (most our ancestors did). But the haplogroup is a tag - an indelible mark that follows our lineage from one generation to another. It's a great way to follow one's ancestry and learn what have one's ancestors been through, where they most probably lived etc.

    Respecting one's haplogroup would be bizarre, it doesn’t change anything in the phenotype. But respecting one's lineage is in my opinion quite natural. That's what people did for thousands of years. When Gautama Buddha spoke to his disciples he often started his talk by addressing the assembly as "Good sons and good daughters of good families...". It has been natural in the traditional societies to do one's best to keep the reputation of one's ancestors clean and respected.

    But of course, we don't live in a traditional society anymore...

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Another Polish Perspective, @Mr. Hack

  721. @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    Well you’ve given me almost nothing to go on.
     
    I know, but I thought it was worth asking because if it was shown on the multicultural channel here (SBS), it was presumably a bit of a hit in the home country, not some obscure flick no one's seen.

    Anyway, I actually I managed to find it: فيلم محطة الأنس It appears to have been some musical comedy. The song I was I referring to starts at around the 1:19 mark.

    It often astonishes me how little detail it takes for someone to remember a movie. There was an Australian internet forum back in the heyday of internet forums that used to have "what movie is this?" threads, from which I received some good answers to my inquiries, one in particular on the basis of no more detail than I gave you for this one. [Just checked: Whirlpool, apparently still active]

    I think I said something like "Saw it with my parents on TV when I was a kid, and my parents said they'd seen it before, guessing probably around the early 80s. At the end, a group of people emerges from what might have been a tunnel, into an open road in the countryside and they walk off into the distance with the sun glaring in front of them. I remember feeling relief that 'they made it, the survived' so maybe a disaster movie." That is absolutely fuck all to go on, but someone managed to give me the title. (Actually, I feel like watching it, but I've forgotten its name again lol.)

    Replies: @Yahya

    Anyway, I actually I managed to find it: فيلم محطة الأنس It appears to have been some musical comedy. The song I was I referring to starts at around the 1:19 mark.

    The song sounds like a generic movie intro piece. Don’t think it’s a proper full-length song; if it is I have no clue what its name is.

    This composer produces a lot of TV scores in a similar vein to the song you posted:

    I’m not a fan of this musical style tbh.

    The movie you mentioned is known but not one of the great classics of Egyptian cinema.

    If you’re interested in Egyptian classics this is a good list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_100_Egyptian_films

    I recommend starting with Youssef Chahine; Egypt’s greatest director.

    Some of his movies are available on Netflix with English subtitles. Alexandria, Why? Is my favorite thus far. Djamilah is available on YouTube with English subs. It’s about the Algerian independence. The cinematography is weak though.

    On the whole; I prefer movies from other Arab countries. Not a big fan of the Egyptian style of cinematography. Egypt functions as the Hollywood of the Arab world; so a lot of the movies are designed for mass consumption; they tend to a low level. The few movies coming out of the Levant tend to be of higher artistic quality.

    I recommend watching the works of the Nazarene trio: Hanni Abu Assad, Elia Suleiman, Michel Khleifi. Hani Abu Assad’s Paradise Now is an interesting dive into the world of resistance fighters / terrorists, and is available on Netflix. Elia Suleiman’s movies tend to be on the artsy side; but the dry humor is sophisticated and the cinematography is sublime.

    I’ve only watched one of Michel Khleifi’s works; called Wedding In Galilee. It’s a very good film that would have been even better had the casting been more judicious. It appears that Khleifi went the Robert Bresson route of hiring amateurs instead of real actors; perhaps in the hope of making it seem more realistic. But the technique largely fails; the schlocky acting induces cringe makes things look less realistic. I was however pleased with his decision to hire two hotties to portray the main characters Sumaya and Samira; who rarely for an Arab movie, appeared nude in the film. A very pleasant surprise.

    All three of these directors are from Nazareth; a laudably artistic town.

    • Thanks: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    I recommend watching the works of the Nazarene trio: Hanni Abu Assad, Elia Suleiman, Michel Khleifi.
     
    I've watched movies from all three. The two you mentioned (Paradise Now and Wedding in Galilee) and All That Remains by Suleiman.

    I've read quite a lot about Israel/Palestine, especially the period leading up to and including the '48 war. Reading about it is one thing, but since I've never been in anything like a wartime situation, I find it hard to imagine what it looked like "on the ground," so I find it helps to see it depicted on screen. Of the three films mentioned here, only the last deals with the '48 war. And you're right about Suleiman: I don't know what the proper film critic term for it is, but there were parts of that film which, for want of a better word, felt a bit too 'artsy' for me, although it didn't completely ruin my viewing.

    A couple of others I've seen related to that theme are Bab al-Shams (2005), whose plot wasn't particularly gripping but was exactly what I was looking for in terms of depicting the conflict "on the ground." And the Israeli film House on Chelouche Street (1973), about a family Egyptian Jewish immigrants just before the war - produced by Menahem Golan, one half of the dynamic Golan and Globus duo, who in the 80s produced a tone of redblooded action flicks to help rightwing Americans feel great about their country. It didn't deal directly with the war, but the threat of it looms in the background as the British are set to pull out, contributing to the characters' nervous tension. (I thought the actress Michal Bat-Adam, who as on older girl comes onto the main character, was very attractive, more in a 'cute' rather than 'hawt' way. 8/10. She didn't age well imo.)
  722. @Blinky Bill
    @silviosilver

    Silviosilver I've always found your comments enlightening, in particular this one from many years ago, it's always stuck with me.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-conventional-wisdom-in-a-nutshell/#comment-930525



    This meme also flashes in my mind every time I read one of your comments. 😅

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FbOXb_BUIAAEgJh.jpg

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @silviosilver

    I would add that preserving “racial purity” is something better done in one’s own homeland. If one chooses the life of an immigrant and doesn’t want to go back home for whatever reason, then one is just an immigrant among others. And if the natives don’t care for the Great Replacement, then why should we ? As the French saying goes, one should not trying to be more catholic than the pope.

    Especially, this pope…

    🙂

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Don't worry I read that an anti-pope is soon to be chosen by "people of Rome" (so much for recognition of "Polish Catholicism" haha), whoever they are... True Petrus Romanus, in other words.

    , @S
    @Ivashka the fool

    Welcome back to the site, Bashybuzuk!

    About the 'racial purity' thing, my take on it is that is something for each people to decide just how 'pure' or 'impure they wish to be, or remain, once they've been given all the facts. This is something which should be treated collectively as sacrosanct, just as a person's physical body ideally is treated as sancrosanct.



    The thing is people haven't been given the facts and just about everywhere the 'mass immigration' thing is being put in place by diktat.

    The United States is the model for this.

    I believe I've pretty much proved in my post archives that chattel slavery and it's trade was not 'abolished' as proclaimed, but rather was monetized in the early 19th century with the introduction of wage slavery (ie specifically the so called 'cheap labor'/'mass immigration' system) in the United States, something which was put in place by diktat just as chattel slavery had been in 17th century Virginia and New England.

    The historic prime directive for the elite and their hangers on promoting either chattel or wage slavery is to do anything (but anything!) than pay their own people the prevailing real time local rates for labor. Importing by diktat alien chattel or wage slaves to do the work instead of hiring their own at fair living wages answers this call nicely...for them.

    This wage slavery system is the economic and political basis of the modern progressive Multi-Cultural state, a state which in many ways closely parallels the Anglosphere chattel slave holding society it directly evolved from, the 'immigrant' from a financial point of view, being the slave.

    This is what I mean when I say that, should they succeed in creating their 'United States of the World' global super state, it is to be a slavery based world order, just as the United States and the rest of the Anglosphere, with their wage slavery, are slavery based today.

    My guess is that their intention with the impending world war is they intend to wipe out the majority of most peoples, and that the bulk of the five hundred million survivors will be (purely by chance!) Sub-Saharan Africans with their dominant genes. They will be crudely used (as they are crudely being used now) to breed out of existance most of the non-Saharan survivors, so that the resulting vast majority of humanity will for practical purposes be 80 or 90% Sub-Saharan African in their genetic make up.

    In other words, most people are to be made into what are known in the vernacular as 'Blacks' with a likely 85 IQ.

    In regards to a declaration that was heard recently, but with a slight addendum, see below. After the world war, and with the proper conditioning, providing someone or something doesn't intervene first, it could maybe be done:

    'You will have nothing, and you will work for nothing, and you will be happy.'

    Replies: @silviosilver, @AnonfromTN

    , @Dmitry
    @Ivashka the fool

    He follows the religion, ignores the politics. He will be elected by religious people in the Vatican, but wouldn't be elected if he was a politician among the mainstream population.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJia-ZBRqoE

    If you remember from the political point of view, younger people in Europe mostly don't care about the Pope. But the people still care about the Pope in Europe are mostly older. So, he's not going to become politically popular with majority of young people or old people in Europe. But he doesn't care, it's Bible teaching.

    By the way, maybe it's personal, but do you a feel change after February 24? I had some delusion of origin from a hinterland slightly Europe. But with the change of politics, it becomes difficult to avoid feeling like the more comfortable version of the people in that video. Maybe the Pope would wash our feet. It sounds like something subjective, but it's actually about the objective change of situation. It's now an objectively different situation.

  723. @Mr. Hack
    @Ivashka the fool


    But I do care whether someone respects his ancestors and takes care of being honorable to not bring shame on their memories.
     
    Respecting ones own ethnicity is easy enough for me to understand, with plenty of churches in the US that still exhibit some ethnic flavor or another. Civic organizations seem to abound here too, whether its the Italian-American club, the Polish White Eagle organization, B'nai Brith, etc, etc. But it's respecting ones haplogroup (that I think that you're promoting) that I find difficult to understand? If its just taking care not to be dishonoring or bringing shame on ones pre-historic ancestors, then I think that 99%+ of all people are safe from being guilty of such charges, if not 100% of all readers of this website? Could you be more specific about what you mean here?

    https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/arcadianews.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/d/14/d1499ad0-98d4-11ec-baa9-9b4cf52c15e5/621d30318cddf.image.jpg?resize=400%2C225
    Irish Cultural Center Phoenix AZ (quite the elaborate complex built about 10 years ago)

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Ivashka the fool


    The Irish Cultural Center and McClelland Library in Phoenix, AZ

    • Thanks: Ivashka the fool
  724. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Sean


    in my opinion because what Baldwin had no way to know that was he was handling was potentially lethal.
     
    This is a dumb opinion.

    He has been around guns his entire life. He has heard safety protocols repeated 100000 X and this is not rocket science. It's not like he is an illiterate ghetto negro.

    Replies: @Sean

    He has been around guns his entire life.

    You are talking as if Baldwin brought it from his personal home firearms collection and would not let anyone look at it before the incident, which would entail his having a duty to treat it in accordance with gun safety and be liable to prosecution if he failed to do so. But this was a movie prop supplied to the production by its weapons master. Again, his expectation that a prop on a Western film set brought there by the production’s weapons master, prepared by them to be used in a scene where Baldwin would draw it, and issued to him as part of his costume would and could under no circumstances contain a potentially lethal cartridge was entirely reasonable. Especially for someone like Baldwin who has worked on numerous action films before and understands there is a expert responsible for making certain no such thing can happen.

    Everyone has a job to do on a film and they all are concerned to make sure they do their own job properly. Baldwin was on the set to do a job in the capacity he was hired, which is the one of trained actor. It was no more Baldwin’s duty to check whether a prop he was to use might be capable of killing someone than it would have been for him to ensure food he was to give to someone to eat in a scene had not been contaminated with botulism by careless caterers.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Sean

    Guns on set = safety meeting before every shift. Association with a workplace fatality is extremely detrimental to a person's career prospects. Multiply that by 1000 when the fatality is avoidable with standard safety method.

    Baldwin is in deep sh!+.

    Replies: @Sean

    , @Wokechoke
    @Sean

    The fun part is that Baldwin did infact shoot and kill someone. He's been holier than thou about ordinary guys who have a rifle or a self-loading-rifle as evil. Even if they have never used the rifles to shoot at anyone.

    He's an absolute motherfucker. Fuck that asshole.

  725. @Mr. Hack
    @Ivashka the fool


    But I do care whether someone respects his ancestors and takes care of being honorable to not bring shame on their memories.
     
    Respecting ones own ethnicity is easy enough for me to understand, with plenty of churches in the US that still exhibit some ethnic flavor or another. Civic organizations seem to abound here too, whether its the Italian-American club, the Polish White Eagle organization, B'nai Brith, etc, etc. But it's respecting ones haplogroup (that I think that you're promoting) that I find difficult to understand? If its just taking care not to be dishonoring or bringing shame on ones pre-historic ancestors, then I think that 99%+ of all people are safe from being guilty of such charges, if not 100% of all readers of this website? Could you be more specific about what you mean here?

    https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/arcadianews.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/d/14/d1499ad0-98d4-11ec-baa9-9b4cf52c15e5/621d30318cddf.image.jpg?resize=400%2C225
    Irish Cultural Center Phoenix AZ (quite the elaborate complex built about 10 years ago)

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Ivashka the fool

    Ethnicities change, just ask our young Arab friend here. Languages change, British people didn’t speak English a thousand years ago. Cultures evolve or regress, people change religious affiliation (most our ancestors did). But the haplogroup is a tag – an indelible mark that follows our lineage from one generation to another. It’s a great way to follow one’s ancestry and learn what have one’s ancestors been through, where they most probably lived etc.

    Respecting one’s haplogroup would be bizarre, it doesn’t change anything in the phenotype. But respecting one’s lineage is in my opinion quite natural. That’s what people did for thousands of years. When Gautama Buddha spoke to his disciples he often started his talk by addressing the assembly as “Good sons and good daughters of good families…”. It has been natural in the traditional societies to do one’s best to keep the reputation of one’s ancestors clean and respected.

    But of course, we don’t live in a traditional society anymore…

    • Thanks: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    But the haplogroup is a tag – an indelible mark that follows our lineage from one generation to another.
     
    Yes, exactly, we know that now and do not need a proxy connection to our ancestors by the worship of their lineage. It is half-deification like that of Roman emperors - in case of living ones, Romans did not worship them per se, but they worshipped the divine element of their nature, called numen.
    Likewise, you seem to think that there was something special in your ancestors without being able to name that.

    If your ancestors, by chance, were men of some great accomplishment, or of great ethical standards, you could consider honouring them in some sense (well, in such a case they would probably be already elevated to altars as saints), but otherwise...? You do understand that a cult of ancestors is also a cult of bad guys in your lineage, don't you..?!

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    The quotation on Buddha you have just provided plus the fact that Buddha himself was a royal son, weakens his message to me. It looks like making himself credible to upper classes in some way;)
    I wrote about this myself in my last message to HeavilyMarbledSteak in the previous thread:


    Personally, I was always suspicious of royal lineages at the helm of Christianity (David lineage) or Buddha (a royal son too)…. at the very core of religions of equality lies some royal founder.
    It does not make a sense, really. It looks more like this royal founder makes his religion credible to power-wielding elites. It is not without a reason that they choose the royal Melchizedek as Jesus counterpart in Old Testament.
    What, where are we now ..?! In the world of Disney “Encanto” when some special, gifted people (harassed in the past by some evil, Indo-European looking horseman haha), simply speaking – a natural royalty (a failed Messiah of “Matrix” bears the name of the first French royal dynasty, Merovings), takes care of less gifted people..?
     

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @Mr. Hack
    @Ivashka the fool


    But of course, we don’t live in a traditional society anymore…
     
    Exactly, and that's what I was hinting at when I wrote:

    If its just taking care not to be dishonoring or bringing shame on ones pre-historic ancestors, then I think that 99%+ of all people are safe from being guilty of such charges, if not 100% of all readers of this website?
     
    Sure, you can find a few websites or blogs where certain individuals are interested in this kind of thing, but what of the mass of humanity, even those that live in societies that still have managed to maintain most of their haplogroup intact, not eroded by the inevitable forces of globalism? I once even queeried you about your own children's abilities to "respect one's halogroup" which even you admitted was beyond being a daunting task. Respecting one's ethnicity is much easier as evidenced by the building of structures (the Irish one is actually made of stone, not concrete or brick. how expenssive was that, and what a statement!) that help keep the memory and "honor" intact for generations to see.

    http://tidy-lapel.flywheelsites.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/McClellandIrishLibraryMikeMoore2-e1411517804529.jpg
    Very reminiscent of medieval stone built structures in Ireland. The Irish have really managed to put their money where their mouths (hearts) are located.

  726. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    As a counterpoint to your thesis, Unetice culture seems to be a genetic continuation of Globular Amphorae Culture which is decisively non-Indo-Europan. Unetice also seems to be genetic and cultural kin of Cucuteni-Trypillia culture, especially in their love for living in crowded settlements of longhouses (or other shared houses). This love for crowd I find decidedly un-Slavic. That are pre-cities, not villages.
     
    That's the second time that you wrote something that seems to demonstrate that you don't really read my comments before replying.



    I have written that Globular Amphora influenced Corded Ware, but have never written that Globular Amphora (let alone Tripolye) were Indo-European.

    AFAIK Globular Amphora might be seen as a hybrid culture arising during / after the collapse of Tripolye people, through intermixing of the surviving Tripolian farmers with pre-Corded War hunter - gatherer people from the Sredny Stog culture. Globular Amphora and Unetice are separated by at least a 500 years period how can anyone talk of any "continuity" or even influence between them ?

    Especially at a time when an average human life duration was around 35 years ?

    About Unetice, I have written that it was a culture that arose at the interface of the (Eastern) Bell Beaker and Corded Ware realms. I have also written that it was the cradle of the ancient European religion. I am quite certain that it used most probably PIE language as its koine or creole. But I have never written that it was produced only by Y haplogroup R1a people. Neither have I written anything about the primary origins of the PIE which are impossible to determine exactly (but I don't think Bell-Beaker folks were PIE speakers).

    About steppe - ancestry, it is a misnomer, which comes from the outdated Gambutas theories. There were no ferocious "Kurgan people" coming from the East and invading the "peace loving" (human sacrifice practicing and cannibalistic) "Old Europe" cultures. Yamnaya did not alter the genetic landscape of Old Europe, they were probably too few and far between and a substantial number of them migrated south insead of going west. Corded Ware is Old Europe, as is Megalithic Culture and the survivors of Linearband Ceramic Culture etc.

    The ones who invaded and genocided came not from the eastern steppes and were not Yamnaya people (let alone Corded Ware), they came from the westernmost part of Europe (Iberian peninsula) and were the Bell-Beaker folks. It took them centuries to conquer Western Europe and arrive in the region where Unetice would later develop and which was inhabited by the Corded Ware folks. We should think of these invaders as we think of their Conquistador descendants in the New World. For the ancestors of the Slav it was the first Drang nach Osten that they had to face and survive, but as we know today it was hardly the last.

    That's what they are trying to hide by not describing Y haplogroups, and only looking at the mtDNA haplogroups. Female populations weren't killed, they procreated with the conquerors. The Western European people are the population that arose from this process. A process that has met its limits around the Tollense river where an important group of Bell Beaker would be conquerors and their surviving Megalithic Europe and Corded Ware slaves were slaughtered. Ruthlessly ambushed and killed to the last as someone would kill a rabid animal. Another very significant historical moment that they prefer not to emphasize too much in European schools.

    Now, about the Moskal and Lyakh relationship, I have some diluted (Orthodox) Polish ancestry on my mother's side that I have been able to trace to the Great Lithuanian Duchy in modern day Belarus, close to the border of Ukraine. I have a substantial Ukrainian ancestry, obviously Russian too with perhaps some Tatar and Mordvin admixture, and I am fine with that. Most of these people's populations are descended from the Corded Ware folks.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Another Polish Perspective

    That’s the second time that you wrote something that seems to demonstrate that you don’t really read my comments before replying.

    I am sorry, but you wrote neither about Globular Amphora nor Cucuteni-Trypillia cultures in this thread, and your comment that I was responding to the last time was pretty sketchy. I don’t feel obliged to comb through Bashybuzuk archives, especially as I remember you mainly from non-Karlin threads. I was never so impressed so as to click on your name and read all your comments. I hope you are not a narcist coming here back for narcistic supply and you will thus withstand this confession of mine. You have many admirers here anyway 😉

    About steppe – ancestry, it is a misnomer, which comes from the outdated Gambutas theories. There were no ferocious “Kurgan people” coming from the East and invading the “peace loving” (human sacrifice practicing and cannibalistic) “Old Europe” cultures.

    The problem of steppe-ancestry is misleading (I find that Yamnaya, primarily R1b, became a prime candidate for these steppe invaders pretty strange, actually), because it mixes the problem of genetic replacement of males, and of cultural replacement. I would say Gimbutas got the cultural change much better than the processes which had led to it. Both kind of changes did happen, and they were so thorough that I find “plagues” theory more convincing that “First Holocaust of Europe/Systematic Massacres” theory – why kill slaves anyway…? The only historical analogy to that is the substantial removal of pre-Columbian Y-DNA from South America: it probably happened at least as much by plagues as by massacres; and male slaves had much higher mortality than female ones. Were the Bell Beakers the Nazis of pre-history..? I don’t think so – they were in Sardinia, but Sardinia still has one of the Europe’s oldest genetic lineages. They were surely aggressive, but the technology was not ready yet for full-scale massacres, and the technical distance between them and their victims wasn’t so great like between Conquistadors and Indians, the latter still living in the pre-iron age.

    The kin relations were fundamentally different in Old and New Europe – matrilineality vs patrilineality. This is cultural change more substantial than the disappearance of very Goddess/Lady of Old Europe istelf, I would say. Your theory “of evolution and of massacres by Bell-Beakers” does not really explain why that would happen at all.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    I am sorry, but you wrote neither about Globular Amphora nor Cucuteni-Trypillia cultures in this thread
     
    I wrote about it when I answered AP in this very thread. You might have a look if you're interested.

    They were surely aggressive, but the technology was not ready yet for full-scale massacres,
     
    The Bell Beaker genocide of other European male lineages is unfortunately not a theory, I wish it was.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/science/is-distinctive-dna-marker-proof-of-ancient-genocide-1.1426197

    https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/feb/21/arrival-of-beaker-folk-changed-britain-forever-ancient-dna-study-shows

    FYI the Mohawk warriors did exactly the same using Neolithic weaponry and a few muskets supplied by the Dutch: they massacred the males of competing tribes and incorporated the children and the women in their tribal structure. Thule Inuit people mostly annihilated and replaced the Dorset Inuit. Both had the same technical level and used similar neolithic weaponry. Corded Ware Battle Axe people wreaked havoc in Scandinavia killed men, children and women alike. The Bible describes ancient Isrealites doing the same in Canaan. The Qin massacred the Jurchen (Oirat Mongols). Even Chimpanzees massacre other nearby bands. Genocides are nothing new or exceptional.

    The Tollense Bell-Beaker warrior band was very numerous for their time, they had a vastly superior weaponry compared to the Corded Ware of the time in that region and they had a cavalry, something most Corded Ware groups did not have at the time. These invaders were followed by hundreds of females and children whose skeletons show signs of premature wear due to hard work and lenghty walks. Most probably slaves. They got killed using typical Neolithic weaponry, most probably in an ambush while they were crossing the marshes on a wooden gateway in a forested and swampy region. The Bell-Beaker culture did not move further east. The Corded Ware folks in the east survived, while Central European Corded Ware folks got annihilated and replaced by Eastern Bell-Beaker.

    Draw your own conclusions.

    Anyway, I wrote what I know about the topic and don't want to go on forever pointlessly debating someone who doesn't even know about the history of his own country. I am sorry to be blunt, but your surprising ignorance about the Wends is a proof of your lack of knowledge about the history of the Balto-Slav - that is history of Poland.

    Sorry, but at this point, it would be a waste of effort to keep this discussion going.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Another Polish Perspective, @songbird

  727. @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    I would add that preserving "racial purity" is something better done in one's own homeland. If one chooses the life of an immigrant and doesn't want to go back home for whatever reason, then one is just an immigrant among others. And if the natives don't care for the Great Replacement, then why should we ? As the French saying goes, one should not trying to be more catholic than the pope.

    https://static.dw.com/image/19141999_6.jpg

    Especially, this pope...

    🙂

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @S, @Dmitry

    Don’t worry I read that an anti-pope is soon to be chosen by “people of Rome” (so much for recognition of “Polish Catholicism” haha), whoever they are… True Petrus Romanus, in other words.

  728. @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool

    If you don't mind me asking, what became of Alexander Barkashov? Is he still active in Rus Fed politics?

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Last time I checked, many years ago, he still had a small cult follow-up. He renounced his neo-pagan outlook (an Orthodox Christian – Vedic mix) and went back to the more normative Orthodox Faith, but in a kind of ultra-orthodox sect that doesn’t mix with the official ROC. He has supposedly become a monastic. He is not really active in politics anymore. I think Dark October of 1993 was a very difficult moment for him and the movement – hundreds of militants were killed in action or have been executed the night following their surrender, mostly young people. He might feel somewhat responsible for their deaths. I would if I was him…

    • Thanks: Blinky Bill
  729. @Ivashka the fool
    @Mr. Hack

    Ethnicities change, just ask our young Arab friend here. Languages change, British people didn't speak English a thousand years ago. Cultures evolve or regress, people change religious affiliation (most our ancestors did). But the haplogroup is a tag - an indelible mark that follows our lineage from one generation to another. It's a great way to follow one's ancestry and learn what have one's ancestors been through, where they most probably lived etc.

    Respecting one's haplogroup would be bizarre, it doesn’t change anything in the phenotype. But respecting one's lineage is in my opinion quite natural. That's what people did for thousands of years. When Gautama Buddha spoke to his disciples he often started his talk by addressing the assembly as "Good sons and good daughters of good families...". It has been natural in the traditional societies to do one's best to keep the reputation of one's ancestors clean and respected.

    But of course, we don't live in a traditional society anymore...

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Another Polish Perspective, @Mr. Hack

    But the haplogroup is a tag – an indelible mark that follows our lineage from one generation to another.

    Yes, exactly, we know that now and do not need a proxy connection to our ancestors by the worship of their lineage. It is half-deification like that of Roman emperors – in case of living ones, Romans did not worship them per se, but they worshipped the divine element of their nature, called numen.
    Likewise, you seem to think that there was something special in your ancestors without being able to name that.

    If your ancestors, by chance, were men of some great accomplishment, or of great ethical standards, you could consider honouring them in some sense (well, in such a case they would probably be already elevated to altars as saints), but otherwise…? You do understand that a cult of ancestors is also a cult of bad guys in your lineage, don’t you..?!

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Do what you want about your ancestors, and I will do what I want about mine. I will honor mine, feel free to despise yours. To each his own.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  730. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    That’s the second time that you wrote something that seems to demonstrate that you don’t really read my comments before replying.
     
    I am sorry, but you wrote neither about Globular Amphora nor Cucuteni-Trypillia cultures in this thread, and your comment that I was responding to the last time was pretty sketchy. I don't feel obliged to comb through Bashybuzuk archives, especially as I remember you mainly from non-Karlin threads. I was never so impressed so as to click on your name and read all your comments. I hope you are not a narcist coming here back for narcistic supply and you will thus withstand this confession of mine. You have many admirers here anyway ;)

    About steppe – ancestry, it is a misnomer, which comes from the outdated Gambutas theories. There were no ferocious “Kurgan people” coming from the East and invading the “peace loving” (human sacrifice practicing and cannibalistic) “Old Europe” cultures.
     
    The problem of steppe-ancestry is misleading (I find that Yamnaya, primarily R1b, became a prime candidate for these steppe invaders pretty strange, actually), because it mixes the problem of genetic replacement of males, and of cultural replacement. I would say Gimbutas got the cultural change much better than the processes which had led to it. Both kind of changes did happen, and they were so thorough that I find "plagues" theory more convincing that "First Holocaust of Europe/Systematic Massacres" theory - why kill slaves anyway...? The only historical analogy to that is the substantial removal of pre-Columbian Y-DNA from South America: it probably happened at least as much by plagues as by massacres; and male slaves had much higher mortality than female ones. Were the Bell Beakers the Nazis of pre-history..? I don't think so - they were in Sardinia, but Sardinia still has one of the Europe's oldest genetic lineages. They were surely aggressive, but the technology was not ready yet for full-scale massacres, and the technical distance between them and their victims wasn't so great like between Conquistadors and Indians, the latter still living in the pre-iron age.

    The kin relations were fundamentally different in Old and New Europe - matrilineality vs patrilineality. This is cultural change more substantial than the disappearance of very Goddess/Lady of Old Europe istelf, I would say. Your theory "of evolution and of massacres by Bell-Beakers" does not really explain why that would happen at all.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    I am sorry, but you wrote neither about Globular Amphora nor Cucuteni-Trypillia cultures in this thread

    I wrote about it when I answered AP in this very thread. You might have a look if you’re interested.

    They were surely aggressive, but the technology was not ready yet for full-scale massacres,

    The Bell Beaker genocide of other European male lineages is unfortunately not a theory, I wish it was.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/science/is-distinctive-dna-marker-proof-of-ancient-genocide-1.1426197

    https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/feb/21/arrival-of-beaker-folk-changed-britain-forever-ancient-dna-study-shows

    FYI the Mohawk warriors did exactly the same using Neolithic weaponry and a few muskets supplied by the Dutch: they massacred the males of competing tribes and incorporated the children and the women in their tribal structure. Thule Inuit people mostly annihilated and replaced the Dorset Inuit. Both had the same technical level and used similar neolithic weaponry. Corded Ware Battle Axe people wreaked havoc in Scandinavia killed men, children and women alike. The Bible describes ancient Isrealites doing the same in Canaan. The Qin massacred the Jurchen (Oirat Mongols). Even Chimpanzees massacre other nearby bands. Genocides are nothing new or exceptional.

    The Tollense Bell-Beaker warrior band was very numerous for their time, they had a vastly superior weaponry compared to the Corded Ware of the time in that region and they had a cavalry, something most Corded Ware groups did not have at the time. These invaders were followed by hundreds of females and children whose skeletons show signs of premature wear due to hard work and lenghty walks. Most probably slaves. They got killed using typical Neolithic weaponry, most probably in an ambush while they were crossing the marshes on a wooden gateway in a forested and swampy region. The Bell-Beaker culture did not move further east. The Corded Ware folks in the east survived, while Central European Corded Ware folks got annihilated and replaced by Eastern Bell-Beaker.

    Draw your own conclusions.

    Anyway, I wrote what I know about the topic and don’t want to go on forever pointlessly debating someone who doesn’t even know about the history of his own country. I am sorry to be blunt, but your surprising ignorance about the Wends is a proof of your lack of knowledge about the history of the Balto-Slav – that is history of Poland.

    Sorry, but at this point, it would be a waste of effort to keep this discussion going.

    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool


    Dzungar 😉

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Ok, you did write about Globular Amphora and Cucuteni-Tripilia cultures when exploring AP lineage of R1a Z92. I admit, I did not read this comment but there are so many comments here that some naturally get skipped. The one you meant was hidden too. Anyway, it wasn't a comment addressed to me so I don't think you can really charge me with ignorance here and you kind of gaslighted me before, CHARGING ME WITH NOT READING YOUR COMMENT TO AP. THIS WAS NOT FAIR. I am not your child, I don't have to listen to your every word. And please remember that your first charge I responded in the comment no. 569
    If you were charitable you would provide me simply with a number of your comment to AP, so I wouldn't need to comb through your archive. Maybe you wanted to me feel badly for being this pesky Pole questioning your Russian words...?

    Bell-Beakers were stopped at Tollensee, so they weren't invincible.


    I am sorry to be blunt, but your surprising ignorance about the Wends is a proof of your lack of knowledge about the history of the Balto-Slav – that is history of Poland.
     
    As for Wends, yesterday not just me but LatW was surprised that they apparently have a definitive genetic existence now.
    I know about Wends, however the received knowledge in Poland is that they were some semi-mythical people living in North Poland, likely contemporaneous with Roman Empire. Otherwise Juliusz Słowacki would at least include some specific historic circumstances in his play. Not much has changed concerning knowledge of Wends since the 19th century, so they are not talked about in schools. Well, why should I accept your Wends theory anyway...? You make mainly assertions, with few arguments.

    And that you expect me to know that Obotrites were Wends for Germans is a kind of pro-German cultural imperialism: why do you expect me to prefer German names for Slavs anyway...?!

    , @songbird
    @Ivashka the fool


    Thule Inuit people mostly annihilated and replaced the Dorset Inuit. Both had the same technical level and used similar neolithic weaponry.
     
    Usual conception seems to be that the Thule had a boatload of technology that the Dorset lacked and this facilitated the destruction of the Dorset.

    Dorset lacked the bow and arrow. Didn't have dog sleds, harpoons or kayaks (couldn't hunt large whales). The Thule actually had some limited metallurgy. Iron (cold-forged) from meteorites, copper from Coppermine River.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cape_York_meteorite
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper_Inuit

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  731. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool


    But the haplogroup is a tag – an indelible mark that follows our lineage from one generation to another.
     
    Yes, exactly, we know that now and do not need a proxy connection to our ancestors by the worship of their lineage. It is half-deification like that of Roman emperors - in case of living ones, Romans did not worship them per se, but they worshipped the divine element of their nature, called numen.
    Likewise, you seem to think that there was something special in your ancestors without being able to name that.

    If your ancestors, by chance, were men of some great accomplishment, or of great ethical standards, you could consider honouring them in some sense (well, in such a case they would probably be already elevated to altars as saints), but otherwise...? You do understand that a cult of ancestors is also a cult of bad guys in your lineage, don't you..?!

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Do what you want about your ancestors, and I will do what I want about mine. I will honor mine, feel free to despise yours. To each his own.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Ivashka the fool

    So how exactly do you go about honoring your ancestors? Both Buddhists and Orthodox Christians honor their immediate ancestors perhaps somewhat similarly. Besides prayers, food is communally shared by the family and friends of the dearly departed by the Orthodox community after the moleben commemoration service. For Buddhists, its a little bit different, where the food is offered at the gravesite of the deceased relative. Also, for the moleben service, a booklet is used to include the names of the departed, however, I've seen as many as three pages of names listed within the booklet, but nowhere the names going back as far as the Corded ware, Beaker-Bell or even the Indo European period.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  732. @Ivashka the fool
    @Mr. Hack

    Ethnicities change, just ask our young Arab friend here. Languages change, British people didn't speak English a thousand years ago. Cultures evolve or regress, people change religious affiliation (most our ancestors did). But the haplogroup is a tag - an indelible mark that follows our lineage from one generation to another. It's a great way to follow one's ancestry and learn what have one's ancestors been through, where they most probably lived etc.

    Respecting one's haplogroup would be bizarre, it doesn’t change anything in the phenotype. But respecting one's lineage is in my opinion quite natural. That's what people did for thousands of years. When Gautama Buddha spoke to his disciples he often started his talk by addressing the assembly as "Good sons and good daughters of good families...". It has been natural in the traditional societies to do one's best to keep the reputation of one's ancestors clean and respected.

    But of course, we don't live in a traditional society anymore...

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Another Polish Perspective, @Mr. Hack

    The quotation on Buddha you have just provided plus the fact that Buddha himself was a royal son, weakens his message to me. It looks like making himself credible to upper classes in some way;)
    I wrote about this myself in my last message to HeavilyMarbledSteak in the previous thread:

    Personally, I was always suspicious of royal lineages at the helm of Christianity (David lineage) or Buddha (a royal son too)…. at the very core of religions of equality lies some royal founder.
    It does not make a sense, really. It looks more like this royal founder makes his religion credible to power-wielding elites. It is not without a reason that they choose the royal Melchizedek as Jesus counterpart in Old Testament.
    What, where are we now ..?! In the world of Disney “Encanto” when some special, gifted people (harassed in the past by some evil, Indo-European looking horseman haha), simply speaking – a natural royalty (a failed Messiah of “Matrix” bears the name of the first French royal dynasty, Merovings), takes care of less gifted people..?

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Another Polish Perspective

    http://www.travel-images.com/pht/india337.jpg

    Buddha was a white supremacist. His original band of disciples were all in the 1%. Those blue eyes came from the steppe.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  733. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    I am sorry, but you wrote neither about Globular Amphora nor Cucuteni-Trypillia cultures in this thread
     
    I wrote about it when I answered AP in this very thread. You might have a look if you're interested.

    They were surely aggressive, but the technology was not ready yet for full-scale massacres,
     
    The Bell Beaker genocide of other European male lineages is unfortunately not a theory, I wish it was.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/science/is-distinctive-dna-marker-proof-of-ancient-genocide-1.1426197

    https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/feb/21/arrival-of-beaker-folk-changed-britain-forever-ancient-dna-study-shows

    FYI the Mohawk warriors did exactly the same using Neolithic weaponry and a few muskets supplied by the Dutch: they massacred the males of competing tribes and incorporated the children and the women in their tribal structure. Thule Inuit people mostly annihilated and replaced the Dorset Inuit. Both had the same technical level and used similar neolithic weaponry. Corded Ware Battle Axe people wreaked havoc in Scandinavia killed men, children and women alike. The Bible describes ancient Isrealites doing the same in Canaan. The Qin massacred the Jurchen (Oirat Mongols). Even Chimpanzees massacre other nearby bands. Genocides are nothing new or exceptional.

    The Tollense Bell-Beaker warrior band was very numerous for their time, they had a vastly superior weaponry compared to the Corded Ware of the time in that region and they had a cavalry, something most Corded Ware groups did not have at the time. These invaders were followed by hundreds of females and children whose skeletons show signs of premature wear due to hard work and lenghty walks. Most probably slaves. They got killed using typical Neolithic weaponry, most probably in an ambush while they were crossing the marshes on a wooden gateway in a forested and swampy region. The Bell-Beaker culture did not move further east. The Corded Ware folks in the east survived, while Central European Corded Ware folks got annihilated and replaced by Eastern Bell-Beaker.

    Draw your own conclusions.

    Anyway, I wrote what I know about the topic and don't want to go on forever pointlessly debating someone who doesn't even know about the history of his own country. I am sorry to be blunt, but your surprising ignorance about the Wends is a proof of your lack of knowledge about the history of the Balto-Slav - that is history of Poland.

    Sorry, but at this point, it would be a waste of effort to keep this discussion going.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Another Polish Perspective, @songbird

    [MORE]

    Dzungar 😉

    • Agree: Ivashka the fool
    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    Yeah you're right. Should have been more careful. My bad. I always mix the two of them.



    https://youtube.com/shorts/8GHWnFlqNrc?feature=share

    🙂

  734. @Blinky Bill
    @Ivashka the fool


    Dzungar 😉

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Yeah you’re right. Should have been more careful. My bad. I always mix the two of them.

  735. @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    I would add that preserving "racial purity" is something better done in one's own homeland. If one chooses the life of an immigrant and doesn't want to go back home for whatever reason, then one is just an immigrant among others. And if the natives don't care for the Great Replacement, then why should we ? As the French saying goes, one should not trying to be more catholic than the pope.

    https://static.dw.com/image/19141999_6.jpg

    Especially, this pope...

    🙂

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @S, @Dmitry

    Welcome back to the site, Bashybuzuk!

    About the ‘racial purity’ thing, my take on it is that is something for each people to decide just how ‘pure’ or ‘impure they wish to be, or remain, once they’ve been given all the facts. This is something which should be treated collectively as sacrosanct, just as a person’s physical body ideally is treated as sancrosanct.

    [MORE]

    The thing is people haven’t been given the facts and just about everywhere the ‘mass immigration’ thing is being put in place by diktat.

    The United States is the model for this.

    I believe I’ve pretty much proved in my post archives that chattel slavery and it’s trade was not ‘abolished’ as proclaimed, but rather was monetized in the early 19th century with the introduction of wage slavery (ie specifically the so called ‘cheap labor’/’mass immigration’ system) in the United States, something which was put in place by diktat just as chattel slavery had been in 17th century Virginia and New England.

    The historic prime directive for the elite and their hangers on promoting either chattel or wage slavery is to do anything (but anything!) than pay their own people the prevailing real time local rates for labor. Importing by diktat alien chattel or wage slaves to do the work instead of hiring their own at fair living wages answers this call nicely…for them.

    This wage slavery system is the economic and political basis of the modern progressive Multi-Cultural state, a state which in many ways closely parallels the Anglosphere chattel slave holding society it directly evolved from, the ‘immigrant’ from a financial point of view, being the slave.

    This is what I mean when I say that, should they succeed in creating their ‘United States of the World’ global super state, it is to be a slavery based world order, just as the United States and the rest of the Anglosphere, with their wage slavery, are slavery based today.

    My guess is that their intention with the impending world war is they intend to wipe out the majority of most peoples, and that the bulk of the five hundred million survivors will be (purely by chance!) Sub-Saharan Africans with their dominant genes. They will be crudely used (as they are crudely being used now) to breed out of existance most of the non-Saharan survivors, so that the resulting vast majority of humanity will for practical purposes be 80 or 90% Sub-Saharan African in their genetic make up.

    In other words, most people are to be made into what are known in the vernacular as ‘Blacks’ with a likely 85 IQ.

    In regards to a declaration that was heard recently, but with a slight addendum, see below. After the world war, and with the proper conditioning, providing someone or something doesn’t intervene first, it could maybe be done:

    ‘You will have nothing, and you will work for nothing, and you will be happy.’

    • Agree: Ivashka the fool
    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @S


    About the ‘racial purity’ thing, my take on it is that is something for each people to decide just how ‘pure’ or ‘impure they wish to be, or remain, once they’ve been given all the facts. This is something which should be treated collectively as sacrosanct, just as a person’s physical body ideally is treated as sancrosanct.
     
    I'll be blunt: by itself that is inadequate to the task of actual preservation. It is, however, a very useful attitude, or a useful orientation, to promote towards race and racial thinking during the all-important 'preparatory' stage - preparatory in the sense of drawing sufficient attention to the issue and generating sufficient concern over it, an attention and concern without which all will surely be lost and the white man's epitaph will read "Too few knew, fewer still cared."

    Even if he's aware of the terminal nature of the status quo, I can understand perfectly well why someone might wish to sidestep questions of "so, what do you want to do then?", both in order not to generate counterproductive alarm, as well as for the simpler reason that things are so up in the air, that who the hell knows what the future holds? Nevertheless, it is from time to time worth reminding ourselves that preservationist efforts must satisfy certain requirements, or there won't be any preservation at all.

    In Richard McCulloch's words, "Racial preservation has to be based on racial reality. It has to face the facts, ask the right questions and provide the right answers, however difficult they may be." Reality, not fantasy. The right questions, not irrelevancies. Correct answers, not falsehoods. And it is difficult. Very, very difficult. To be a 'racist' today is to play life on the hardest difficulty setting. For many people, a proper understanding of the racial predicament is the worst news they ever heard. The worst news in all of recorded and unrecorded history. There's a reason so many of them seem to go postal when they begin to wrap their minds around it. (Although people usually tune out well before they reach such an understanding. The very idea that there's anything to even think about appalls them.)

    The most difficult aspect, I think, is understanding that, in the long-term, racial preservation requires (using McCulloch's term) reproductive isolation. McCulloch was concerned with nordic/northwest European preservation specifically, although he has relaxed that 'requirement' more recently, but the same logic applies to any race, however one defines it. It's nothing less than a question of potential permanence or certain oblivion. To pretend otherwise is to be like a man who has jumped off the 20th storey and as he passes the 10th he wonders what all the fuss is about, "I'm still alive, what's everyone so worried about?"

    Traditionally, WNs who have understood this have reacted maximally urgently, maximally insultingly, and maximally threateningly, all of which have been tremendous mistakes - a full frontal assault on what 'the regime' has plowed immense financial, physical and psychological resources in preparation for. (I like to say Sun Tzu would have had their guts for garters.) In the same essay from which I quoted above, McCulloch writes:

    Is there anything we could offer the groups selected for separation that would significantly lessen their opposition to it? What could be done to accommodate those groups, to lessen their opposition to separation, and possibly even gain some measure of support?

    If I've ever made any original contribution to the debate, I would like to think that it's answering with a resounding yes to that question. My answer depends completely on WN willingness to comply with the sort of partitioning outlined by McCulloch (not necessarily that one in particular, but something along those lines). That in turn requires a great deal of trust, trust which for a long time I thought would never be forthcoming, but I have come to believe - hopefully not too foolishly - that such an accommodation could indeed be reached and maintained. Where there's a will there's a way, and where there's racial goodwill, a way forward can be found.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @S, @Sher Singh

    , @AnonfromTN
    @S

    My two cents about handles. In sharp contrast to “Bashibuzuk”, which sounded right, “Ivashka the fool” sounds all wrong. Based on Russian folk tales, it should have been either “Ivanushka the little fool” (Иванушка дурачок) or “Ivan the fool” (Иван дурак).

    Replies: @QCIC

  736. @Ivashka the fool
    @Mr. Hack

    Ethnicities change, just ask our young Arab friend here. Languages change, British people didn't speak English a thousand years ago. Cultures evolve or regress, people change religious affiliation (most our ancestors did). But the haplogroup is a tag - an indelible mark that follows our lineage from one generation to another. It's a great way to follow one's ancestry and learn what have one's ancestors been through, where they most probably lived etc.

    Respecting one's haplogroup would be bizarre, it doesn’t change anything in the phenotype. But respecting one's lineage is in my opinion quite natural. That's what people did for thousands of years. When Gautama Buddha spoke to his disciples he often started his talk by addressing the assembly as "Good sons and good daughters of good families...". It has been natural in the traditional societies to do one's best to keep the reputation of one's ancestors clean and respected.

    But of course, we don't live in a traditional society anymore...

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Another Polish Perspective, @Mr. Hack

    But of course, we don’t live in a traditional society anymore…

    Exactly, and that’s what I was hinting at when I wrote:

    If its just taking care not to be dishonoring or bringing shame on ones pre-historic ancestors, then I think that 99%+ of all people are safe from being guilty of such charges, if not 100% of all readers of this website?

    Sure, you can find a few websites or blogs where certain individuals are interested in this kind of thing, but what of the mass of humanity, even those that live in societies that still have managed to maintain most of their haplogroup intact, not eroded by the inevitable forces of globalism? I once even queeried you about your own children’s abilities to “respect one’s halogroup” which even you admitted was beyond being a daunting task. Respecting one’s ethnicity is much easier as evidenced by the building of structures (the Irish one is actually made of stone, not concrete or brick. how expenssive was that, and what a statement!) that help keep the memory and “honor” intact for generations to see.
    Very reminiscent of medieval stone built structures in Ireland. The Irish have really managed to put their money where their mouths (hearts) are located.

  737. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    I am sorry, but you wrote neither about Globular Amphora nor Cucuteni-Trypillia cultures in this thread
     
    I wrote about it when I answered AP in this very thread. You might have a look if you're interested.

    They were surely aggressive, but the technology was not ready yet for full-scale massacres,
     
    The Bell Beaker genocide of other European male lineages is unfortunately not a theory, I wish it was.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/science/is-distinctive-dna-marker-proof-of-ancient-genocide-1.1426197

    https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/feb/21/arrival-of-beaker-folk-changed-britain-forever-ancient-dna-study-shows

    FYI the Mohawk warriors did exactly the same using Neolithic weaponry and a few muskets supplied by the Dutch: they massacred the males of competing tribes and incorporated the children and the women in their tribal structure. Thule Inuit people mostly annihilated and replaced the Dorset Inuit. Both had the same technical level and used similar neolithic weaponry. Corded Ware Battle Axe people wreaked havoc in Scandinavia killed men, children and women alike. The Bible describes ancient Isrealites doing the same in Canaan. The Qin massacred the Jurchen (Oirat Mongols). Even Chimpanzees massacre other nearby bands. Genocides are nothing new or exceptional.

    The Tollense Bell-Beaker warrior band was very numerous for their time, they had a vastly superior weaponry compared to the Corded Ware of the time in that region and they had a cavalry, something most Corded Ware groups did not have at the time. These invaders were followed by hundreds of females and children whose skeletons show signs of premature wear due to hard work and lenghty walks. Most probably slaves. They got killed using typical Neolithic weaponry, most probably in an ambush while they were crossing the marshes on a wooden gateway in a forested and swampy region. The Bell-Beaker culture did not move further east. The Corded Ware folks in the east survived, while Central European Corded Ware folks got annihilated and replaced by Eastern Bell-Beaker.

    Draw your own conclusions.

    Anyway, I wrote what I know about the topic and don't want to go on forever pointlessly debating someone who doesn't even know about the history of his own country. I am sorry to be blunt, but your surprising ignorance about the Wends is a proof of your lack of knowledge about the history of the Balto-Slav - that is history of Poland.

    Sorry, but at this point, it would be a waste of effort to keep this discussion going.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Another Polish Perspective, @songbird

    Ok, you did write about Globular Amphora and Cucuteni-Tripilia cultures when exploring AP lineage of R1a Z92. I admit, I did not read this comment but there are so many comments here that some naturally get skipped. The one you meant was hidden too. Anyway, it wasn’t a comment addressed to me so I don’t think you can really charge me with ignorance here and you kind of gaslighted me before, CHARGING ME WITH NOT READING YOUR COMMENT TO AP. THIS WAS NOT FAIR. I am not your child, I don’t have to listen to your every word. And please remember that your first charge I responded in the comment no. 569
    If you were charitable you would provide me simply with a number of your comment to AP, so I wouldn’t need to comb through your archive. Maybe you wanted to me feel badly for being this pesky Pole questioning your Russian words…?

    Bell-Beakers were stopped at Tollensee, so they weren’t invincible.

    I am sorry to be blunt, but your surprising ignorance about the Wends is a proof of your lack of knowledge about the history of the Balto-Slav – that is history of Poland.

    As for Wends, yesterday not just me but LatW was surprised that they apparently have a definitive genetic existence now.
    I know about Wends, however the received knowledge in Poland is that they were some semi-mythical people living in North Poland, likely contemporaneous with Roman Empire. Otherwise Juliusz Słowacki would at least include some specific historic circumstances in his play. Not much has changed concerning knowledge of Wends since the 19th century, so they are not talked about in schools. Well, why should I accept your Wends theory anyway…? You make mainly assertions, with few arguments.

    And that you expect me to know that Obotrites were Wends for Germans is a kind of pro-German cultural imperialism: why do you expect me to prefer German names for Slavs anyway…?!

  738. Well, as I wrote previously, if we truly wanted to preserve our kin, our clan, our tribe, then in an ideal situation we would have the genetic component of our ancestors mainly preserved and we would have the memetic package of the myths, legends, esoteric teachings plus the semantic field needed to interpret the wisdom of ages. To do that we would need a dedicated class of people acting as a living memory of the ethnic group, that would be the priests. The genetic component could be enhanced through a careful selection of mates and avoidance of misalliance. We should have laws and traditions put in place to exclude as strongly as possible conjugal infidelity and the birth of bastards.

    Guess what population has all these components intact in our day and age ?

    I am pretty sure you know the answer.

    About the buildings and the works of art:

    They get taken by invaders, destroyed and canceled. We are ourselves the best sacred space to keep the memories of our ancestors alive. They are literally within us. No one can take them from us if don’t let them go ourselves.

    But if we let go of their memories, then we get lost and we vanish slowly but surely.

    A tree without roots cannot grow. A flower cut from its stem withers and dies.

  739. @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW


    I guess when you aspire to be the real heir of the Kievan Rus, it doesn’t matter which Rus language you speak.
     
    Yes, this is extremely important, because these people start to think, talk and act as a subject of geopolitics, not as an object. They start to think as a center of a territory, not a border. I have asked in the past why not claim directly the name of Rus instead of going along with a name that suggests a limitrophe frontier status? Ukrainians usually answer along the lines of what Kuchma wrote 20 years ago : "Ukraine is not Russia". Well hello, EusFed is not Russia either. So who's gonna be Russia in the end if everyone eschews the honor of taking and upholding the heritage of Rus in a straightforward manner, without ambivalence or ambiguity?



    And it is easier to be a subject when you speak a language most people around you understand, and declare an open and flexible identity. They could go very far if they keep moving that way.

    Moreover, Arestovych citing Strugatsky brothers is a direct call to people like me, who have all grown up reading their books. He talks about Schedrovitskyi (the methodologist who invented the Russkyi Mir concept) in approving terms. Schedrovitsky was the mentor of Sergei Pereslegin, while Arestovych alludes to some of the themes people such as Galkovsky and Fursov discuss, acknowledging them from an Ukrainian perspective. Mentions tangentially Pelevin's novel SNUFF, which I personally find quite on point describing the current conflict between the two Rus people. Talks about Khazaria as someone who would have read Gumilyov would do.

    The impression he gives is that he might one day suddenly look into the camera and say : "Russian - speaking intellectuals of the World - unite ! Your chains are the only thing that you have to lose. " This guy is some actor alright. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he is an adept of Chaos Magick. He might really pull out something important and interesting if he keeps trying, which I believe he will.

    Now let's see if he can survive (first of all intellectually survive his cocaine snorting habits).

    Replies: @LatW

    Yes, this is extremely important, because these people start to think, talk and act as a subject of geopolitics, not as an object. They start to think as a center of a territory, not a border.

    The Ukrainian nationalists spoke in those kinds of terms already a long time ago, it’s just that they were not in power. There were such murmurs already in 2014, notably A.Biletsky spoke of extensively of Ukraino-centrism (referring to the likes of Yuri Lipa and his Black Sea Doctrine from the 1920s). They just didn’t have much power, whereas Arestovych now has more access to mass audience and the president’s administration.

    I have asked in the past why not claim directly the name of Rus instead of going along with a name that suggests a limitrophe frontier status? Ukrainians usually answer along the lines of what Kuchma wrote 20 years ago : “Ukraine is not Russia”.

    No, they do know they are Rus. But Rus’ with the мягкий знак. Some of the more hardliner types speak about how Peter I stole their name, etc. So they are well aware of this problem, I think it’s just hard to rename a country, plus Ukraine is a brand now in the West. They could brand it eventually as “Ukraine, the land of the original Rus” or something like that. I see why you talk about the name, it is very important, but even more important is the content. 🙂

    [MORE]

    So who’s gonna be Russia in the end if everyone eschews the honor of taking and upholding the heritage of Rus in a straightforward manner, without ambivalence or ambiguity?

    This is a very good point. Well, it is a bit similar to Britain and Britain’s children, USA and Canada, etc. You know in Russian and Latvian, England is called Anglia, the rest of the Commonwealth states are not called Little Anglias or similar, they have their own, new names, but, as a group of peoples, they are still commonly called the Anglos. So it might be something similar for the Rus eventually as well. It’s a bit more edifying than just “Eastern Slavs” (although I have nothing against that one either).

    And it is easier to be a subject when you speak a language most people around you understand, and declare an open and flexible identity. They could go very far if they keep moving that way

    .

    I think this is one option that can co-exist with a more hardline nationalist position. These two outlooks will fight but they can co-exist. The more flexible identity could be used as a basis to assemble a wider following.

    He is quite popular among the Baltic people, too. But for us, we wouldn’t have to compromise our native language at home, the Russian language is just for communication with some neighbors. In Ukraine this could be an issue for some types, but I don’t think it will be because they are very organically bilingual. Eventually more Ukrainian will be spoken. That’s why I sometimes wonder what language the children will communicate in, because it will be important.

    Moreover, Arestovych citing Strugatsky brothers is a direct call to people like me, who have all grown up reading their books.

    Yea, when I heard him cite Strugatsky brothers, I immediately thought of you and realized that there are cultural references that can be utilized. I think he did a whole series of videos on the Strugatsky topic. He also sometimes does that tune from Yeralash, which is funny. I think he talks about those Russian icons as something to learn from, not necessarily follow the Russkiy Mir. They want to build their own project. This project will have to find some kind of an alignment with Europe.

    But he can be provocative sometimes and Ukrainian ethno-nats don’t like him. So he should be careful not to run his mouth too much. Tough thing because his best material comes from open communication. LOL Ideally, others should join him to form some kind of a team of intellectuals with slightly varying views (but one goal).

    I wouldn’t be surprised at all if he is an adept of Chaos Magick. He might really pull out something important and interesting if he keeps trying, which I believe he will.

    I doubt he’s an adept of Chaos Magic, but he is a type who would be able to understand some of it probably. He definitely enjoys language and symbols. Chaos Magic is also a Western phenomenon, or rather, was built in the West (even if it references the East in some cases).

    It is also clear that he respects the tradition of Western rationalism.

    Now let’s see if he can survive (first of all intellectually survive his cocaine snorting habits).

    He is on Feigin every day for hours and it would be much more visible if he did snort cocaine – yes, he does talk fast, but his demeanor is usually quite calm, he does not seem too fidgety, irritable or restless, pupils do not appear to be dilated and eyes don’t appear sensitive to light.

    Even if it were so that they occasionally snort some cocaine, cocaine is not as bad as heroin or even some heavy painkillers, I imagine, it’s easier to get off cocaine than other types of drugs.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    Have you ever heard of Pyzhikov ?

    https://youtu.be/3AUL5qgDsVY

    https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9F%D1%8B%D0%B6%D0%B8%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2,_%D0%90%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%BA%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B4%D1%80_%D0%92%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%B4%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87

    He was doing an incredible work for the rehabilitation of paganism in RusFed.

    Unfortunately he unexpectedly died before he could complete his endeavor.

    Replies: @LatW

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @LatW

    Which Strugackis books were most popular in USSR, and which are now in Russia and Ukraine respectively..?

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @LatW

  740. @Sean
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    He has been around guns his entire life.
     
    You are talking as if Baldwin brought it from his personal home firearms collection and would not let anyone look at it before the incident, which would entail his having a duty to treat it in accordance with gun safety and be liable to prosecution if he failed to do so. But this was a movie prop supplied to the production by its weapons master. Again, his expectation that a prop on a Western film set brought there by the production's weapons master, prepared by them to be used in a scene where Baldwin would draw it, and issued to him as part of his costume would and could under no circumstances contain a potentially lethal cartridge was entirely reasonable. Especially for someone like Baldwin who has worked on numerous action films before and understands there is a expert responsible for making certain no such thing can happen.

    Everyone has a job to do on a film and they all are concerned to make sure they do their own job properly. Baldwin was on the set to do a job in the capacity he was hired, which is the one of trained actor. It was no more Baldwin's duty to check whether a prop he was to use might be capable of killing someone than it would have been for him to ensure food he was to give to someone to eat in a scene had not been contaminated with botulism by careless caterers.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Wokechoke

    Guns on set = safety meeting before every shift. Association with a workplace fatality is extremely detrimental to a person’s career prospects. Multiply that by 1000 when the fatality is avoidable with standard safety method.

    Baldwin is in deep sh!+.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    You keep calling it a 'gun', but it was a film's prop on the set of a film with a budget of $6–7.3 million Baldwin had a reasonable expectation would not have live ammunition in it, because the production's armorer had properly made sure there were not only no live rounds in the gun before bringing it to the set, but no live rounds either in or out of any firearm props on the set, as has long been standard practice. A box marked dummy rounds appeared from nowhere.


    At 10 a.m. Zachry, Gutierrez Reed and a prop assistant loaded five rounds into Baldwin’s gun and two other guns using bullets from the box that been found in prop truck that morning, according to the lawsuit. Gutierrez Reed, wo believed the box only contained dummy rounds, tried to load a sixth bullet, but it got stuck. Throughout the morning, Baldwin handled the gun with the five rounds.Gutierrez Reed, wo believed the box only contained dummy rounds, tried to load a sixth bullet, but it got stuck. Throughout the morning, Baldwin handled the gun with the five rounds. After lunch, Gutierrez Reed cleaned a chamber in Baldwin’s gun and then “pulled another round from the dummy box, shook it, and placed it in the chamber,” the suit said. The film’s props department safeguarded the guns, but not the ammunition, the lawsuit states.
     
    Her father, who is renowned by ruther elderly weapons master, had taken actors on a previous film to a target range for live firing practice (don't ask me why) and the live rounds left over from that session somehow got into a box with dummy rounds that materialized on the set.


    There is an internet rumour that during the making of Sniper Special Ops Steven Seagal brought a loaded .45 auto

    Seagal insists on bringing his own 1911 to set and wearing it during filming. At one point a colleague was asked to help him with the gun in his trailer and before handing it to the colleague Seagal went “Whoops let me unload it first” and proceeded to eject the mag and eject his Black Talon hollowpoint from the chamber. MY DUDE BROUGHT LIVE AMMO TO SET AND HAD IT LOCKED AND LOADED; IT DOESNT MATTER IF ITS IN YOUR TRAILER STEVEN YOU DONT BRING LIVE AMMO TO SET WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK
     
    It should be noted that Seagal's latter films such as SSO areextreme quicky cheapos. Rust was not. It just had a girl in charge of the guns ammunition being loaded.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

  741. @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Yes, this is extremely important, because these people start to think, talk and act as a subject of geopolitics, not as an object. They start to think as a center of a territory, not a border.
     
    The Ukrainian nationalists spoke in those kinds of terms already a long time ago, it's just that they were not in power. There were such murmurs already in 2014, notably A.Biletsky spoke of extensively of Ukraino-centrism (referring to the likes of Yuri Lipa and his Black Sea Doctrine from the 1920s). They just didn't have much power, whereas Arestovych now has more access to mass audience and the president's administration.

    I have asked in the past why not claim directly the name of Rus instead of going along with a name that suggests a limitrophe frontier status? Ukrainians usually answer along the lines of what Kuchma wrote 20 years ago : “Ukraine is not Russia”.
     
    No, they do know they are Rus. But Rus' with the мягкий знак. Some of the more hardliner types speak about how Peter I stole their name, etc. So they are well aware of this problem, I think it's just hard to rename a country, plus Ukraine is a brand now in the West. They could brand it eventually as "Ukraine, the land of the original Rus" or something like that. I see why you talk about the name, it is very important, but even more important is the content. :)

    So who’s gonna be Russia in the end if everyone eschews the honor of taking and upholding the heritage of Rus in a straightforward manner, without ambivalence or ambiguity?
     
    This is a very good point. Well, it is a bit similar to Britain and Britain's children, USA and Canada, etc. You know in Russian and Latvian, England is called Anglia, the rest of the Commonwealth states are not called Little Anglias or similar, they have their own, new names, but, as a group of peoples, they are still commonly called the Anglos. So it might be something similar for the Rus eventually as well. It's a bit more edifying than just "Eastern Slavs" (although I have nothing against that one either).

    And it is easier to be a subject when you speak a language most people around you understand, and declare an open and flexible identity. They could go very far if they keep moving that way
     
    .

    I think this is one option that can co-exist with a more hardline nationalist position. These two outlooks will fight but they can co-exist. The more flexible identity could be used as a basis to assemble a wider following.

    He is quite popular among the Baltic people, too. But for us, we wouldn't have to compromise our native language at home, the Russian language is just for communication with some neighbors. In Ukraine this could be an issue for some types, but I don't think it will be because they are very organically bilingual. Eventually more Ukrainian will be spoken. That's why I sometimes wonder what language the children will communicate in, because it will be important.

    Moreover, Arestovych citing Strugatsky brothers is a direct call to people like me, who have all grown up reading their books.
     
    Yea, when I heard him cite Strugatsky brothers, I immediately thought of you and realized that there are cultural references that can be utilized. I think he did a whole series of videos on the Strugatsky topic. He also sometimes does that tune from Yeralash, which is funny. I think he talks about those Russian icons as something to learn from, not necessarily follow the Russkiy Mir. They want to build their own project. This project will have to find some kind of an alignment with Europe.

    But he can be provocative sometimes and Ukrainian ethno-nats don't like him. So he should be careful not to run his mouth too much. Tough thing because his best material comes from open communication. LOL Ideally, others should join him to form some kind of a team of intellectuals with slightly varying views (but one goal).

    I wouldn’t be surprised at all if he is an adept of Chaos Magick. He might really pull out something important and interesting if he keeps trying, which I believe he will.
     
    I doubt he's an adept of Chaos Magic, but he is a type who would be able to understand some of it probably. He definitely enjoys language and symbols. Chaos Magic is also a Western phenomenon, or rather, was built in the West (even if it references the East in some cases).

    It is also clear that he respects the tradition of Western rationalism.

    Now let’s see if he can survive (first of all intellectually survive his cocaine snorting habits).
     
    He is on Feigin every day for hours and it would be much more visible if he did snort cocaine - yes, he does talk fast, but his demeanor is usually quite calm, he does not seem too fidgety, irritable or restless, pupils do not appear to be dilated and eyes don't appear sensitive to light.

    Even if it were so that they occasionally snort some cocaine, cocaine is not as bad as heroin or even some heavy painkillers, I imagine, it's easier to get off cocaine than other types of drugs.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Another Polish Perspective

    Have you ever heard of Pyzhikov ?

    https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9F%D1%8B%D0%B6%D0%B8%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2,_%D0%90%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%BA%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B4%D1%80_%D0%92%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%B4%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87

    He was doing an incredible work for the rehabilitation of paganism in RusFed.

    Unfortunately he unexpectedly died before he could complete his endeavor.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Have you ever heard of Pyzhikov ?
     
    I don't know much about him, but thanks for the link. It looks like there is a documentary about the Raskol based on his work. It deals with all those things you've written about before (linked below).

    It seems he was a friend of Evgeny Spitsin (he is quite pro-Soviet, but, more relevantly, he has some studies on Slavic ethnogenesis and the ancient Rus). It seems they are both students of Valentin Sedov, a well known Russian archeologist (who worked at the Latvian Academy of Science at one point, I have his book on Balts (in Latvian)).

    He was doing an incredible work for the rehabilitation of paganism in RusFed.
     
    Was it for paganism or for Old Believers? It looks like his father was an Old Believer and asked him to research this.

    This looks like a neat book:

    https://kniga.lv/shop/korennaja-rossija-byliny-zagovory-obrjady/

    Unfortunately he unexpectedly died before he could complete his endeavor.

     

    Yea, a very early death... actually, a beautiful death if one can say so, since he essentially passed away in the archives.

    Btw, this series mentions that Old Believers were more affluent than I had thought before. I thought it was because they were hard working, but Spitsin mentions in the series that this was due to their communal capitalism and that this hadn't been researched but would be important for the future. And that Pyzhikov had just started researching this...

    Interesting - this series claims that the owners of the majority of the larger factories in Moscow in the beginning of the 20th century were owned by Old Believers. You know this is a lesser known side of the Old Believers... that they supported the revolution of 1905, and then, as I understand, later they received their rights back from Nikolai. It could be seen as the old Russian worldview continuing to fight against the new Russian worldview. When you watch these series, analyzing the economic side of it in particular, you start to understand how this might be an inconvenient truth today.

    Interesting description of the Russian община (community). I wonder if this isn't a somewhat idealized view of it (in this series). The series seems a bit ideologically loaded and critical of Western (St Pete) capitalism.

    Btw, have you heard of the concept of домострой? This may be connected to these communities.

    His quote:

    "Староверие ниоткуда не появлялось, оно всегда было! Оно составляет суть этой земли. Это даже не староверие, а истинноверие. Это магистральный духовный путь нашей страны, это выражение сути самой России, которая без староверия не существует в принципе. А где центр тяжести в причине раскола? Центр тяжести староверия находился в народе, а то, что было навязано, имело центр тяжести в элите. И это породило раскол. Преодолевать его можно только на условиях равноправности.."

    https://www.youtube.com/@user-ej1nn8wu9g
  742. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    The quotation on Buddha you have just provided plus the fact that Buddha himself was a royal son, weakens his message to me. It looks like making himself credible to upper classes in some way;)
    I wrote about this myself in my last message to HeavilyMarbledSteak in the previous thread:


    Personally, I was always suspicious of royal lineages at the helm of Christianity (David lineage) or Buddha (a royal son too)…. at the very core of religions of equality lies some royal founder.
    It does not make a sense, really. It looks more like this royal founder makes his religion credible to power-wielding elites. It is not without a reason that they choose the royal Melchizedek as Jesus counterpart in Old Testament.
    What, where are we now ..?! In the world of Disney “Encanto” when some special, gifted people (harassed in the past by some evil, Indo-European looking horseman haha), simply speaking – a natural royalty (a failed Messiah of “Matrix” bears the name of the first French royal dynasty, Merovings), takes care of less gifted people..?
     

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Buddha was a white supremacist. His original band of disciples were all in the 1%. Those blue eyes came from the steppe.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    OTOH, Buddha spoke against the Varna system and encouraged his disciples to leave their families behind and become a wandering monk.

    https://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/buddhism/lifebuddha/2_24lbud.htm

    http://www.buddhasutra.com/files/khaggavisana_sutta.htm

  743. @S
    @songbird


    So all Europeans should be particularists and only appreciate and work to defend their own country, and not cooperate? And refrain from admiring or having any interest in other European countries? Even neighboring ones like the UK to Ireland? Or core strategic heartlands like Germany?...Please, explain your reasoning.
     
    Apparently, Songbird, you are in violation of certain of the rules of the Multi-Cult game, and have been put on notice.

    As a Euro, irregardless of the particular tribe you may belong to and it's unique history, you are expected to collectively simply go wander off somewhere and die, without even a whimper of protest.

    Not doing that, as you are not, and instead displaying life affirming behaviour, is an affront to certain of their sensibilities. As in the clip below, it is a veritable slap in their face.

    Should enough follow you in your renegade path (renegade in the modern progressive death affirming view of things), and choose life as one should, at least some Euro peoples might survive these treacherous times.

    I see that as a very positive outcome, in small part as it would stop the Multi-Cultists and their collaborators from committing genocide in the truest sense of that often much abused term, a burden no one should have upon themselves, their present soul destroying hatreds blinding them (in at least certain instances) to what they are in reality doing.

    Anyhow, in the case of even some Euro peoples surviving, there would almost certainly be a murmur, arising to a deafening crescendo, coming from the throats of the progressive (so called) Multi-Culturalists and their collaborators, perhaps the loudest voices of them all being from those who put on airs of peace and love, such as troll these very threads...

    'But, But, But,....You are supposed to die!...You are supposed to die!!...You are supposed to die!!!'


    https://youtu.be/IP11jDHwX98

    Replies: @songbird

    What really amazes me is how easy it is to perceive powerful resentment and even hatred in many of these migrants that have come into Ireland.

    [MORE]
    It really just is incredible. And you can witness it clearly – there’s plenty of videos.

    Effectively, it seems to me to be a complete duplication of the worst part of the American experience racially speaking, without any of the usual historical or economic excuses even remotely possible.

    I don’t even know how people advocating for open borders, or a weak response to them would even attempt to explain it away. It is so shocking to see. Maybe, they would blame higher rates of mental illness or psychopathy. (at least, if they were HBD aware). Maybe, others would say that it is simply a case of American culture being transplanted.

    But to me, there is an obvious and more direct explanation:

    Some people are just in the wrong environment (to the point where it drives them crazy), and no amount of accommodation will change that. The better and more humane solution is simply to put them back into their native environment.

    • Replies: @S
    @songbird


    What really amazes me is how easy it is to perceive powerful resentment and even hatred in many of these migrants that have come into Ireland.
     
    Sad to hear that.

    If it's like everywhere else, where the media is tightly controlled and directed, the native Irish are being told one thing, and the settlers/colonists another.

    The Irish I imagine are being told 'you yourselves were once 'immigrants', it's only fair and just you allow these new 'immigrants' in. However, if the truth of the matter were being told by the powers that be, it would instead be 'you Irish were once exploited and preyed upon enmasse as wage slaves, it is only fair and just therefore that these other peoples were preyed upon and exploited in the same manner as well', and 'how dare you resist that, which wouldn't sell.

    Meanwhile, I figure the colonists/invaders in Ireland are being told 'the Irish were willing members of the British Empire who faithfully served it to oppress you, and this is your hour of revenge', ie whatever sells, the truth be damned. If they were told the truth, it would instead be the Irish themselves were forcibly incorporated into the Empire, and were colonized by it, just as youbare now forcibly colonizing them, which doesn't have quite the same ring to it.


    But to me, there is an obvious and more direct explanation: Some people are just in the wrong environment (to the point where it drives them crazy), and no amount of accommodation will change that. The better and more humane solution is simply to put them back into their native environment.
     
    This sounds about right, rather than the loaded lie term of Irish 'racism'. The Irish have the right to remain as they are physically as a people without being forcibly changed into something unrecognizable by evil doers.
  744. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective


    I am sorry, but you wrote neither about Globular Amphora nor Cucuteni-Trypillia cultures in this thread
     
    I wrote about it when I answered AP in this very thread. You might have a look if you're interested.

    They were surely aggressive, but the technology was not ready yet for full-scale massacres,
     
    The Bell Beaker genocide of other European male lineages is unfortunately not a theory, I wish it was.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/science/is-distinctive-dna-marker-proof-of-ancient-genocide-1.1426197

    https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/feb/21/arrival-of-beaker-folk-changed-britain-forever-ancient-dna-study-shows

    FYI the Mohawk warriors did exactly the same using Neolithic weaponry and a few muskets supplied by the Dutch: they massacred the males of competing tribes and incorporated the children and the women in their tribal structure. Thule Inuit people mostly annihilated and replaced the Dorset Inuit. Both had the same technical level and used similar neolithic weaponry. Corded Ware Battle Axe people wreaked havoc in Scandinavia killed men, children and women alike. The Bible describes ancient Isrealites doing the same in Canaan. The Qin massacred the Jurchen (Oirat Mongols). Even Chimpanzees massacre other nearby bands. Genocides are nothing new or exceptional.

    The Tollense Bell-Beaker warrior band was very numerous for their time, they had a vastly superior weaponry compared to the Corded Ware of the time in that region and they had a cavalry, something most Corded Ware groups did not have at the time. These invaders were followed by hundreds of females and children whose skeletons show signs of premature wear due to hard work and lenghty walks. Most probably slaves. They got killed using typical Neolithic weaponry, most probably in an ambush while they were crossing the marshes on a wooden gateway in a forested and swampy region. The Bell-Beaker culture did not move further east. The Corded Ware folks in the east survived, while Central European Corded Ware folks got annihilated and replaced by Eastern Bell-Beaker.

    Draw your own conclusions.

    Anyway, I wrote what I know about the topic and don't want to go on forever pointlessly debating someone who doesn't even know about the history of his own country. I am sorry to be blunt, but your surprising ignorance about the Wends is a proof of your lack of knowledge about the history of the Balto-Slav - that is history of Poland.

    Sorry, but at this point, it would be a waste of effort to keep this discussion going.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Another Polish Perspective, @songbird

    Thule Inuit people mostly annihilated and replaced the Dorset Inuit. Both had the same technical level and used similar neolithic weaponry.

    Usual conception seems to be that the Thule had a boatload of technology that the Dorset lacked and this facilitated the destruction of the Dorset.

    Dorset lacked the bow and arrow. Didn’t have dog sleds, harpoons or kayaks (couldn’t hunt large whales). The Thule actually had some limited metallurgy. Iron (cold-forged) from meteorites, copper from Coppermine River.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cape_York_meteorite
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper_Inuit

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @songbird

    Thanks, didn't know that. I knew that Chukchis were much more technically evolved compared to their American cousins, but I thought that the Dorset and the Thule Inuits were quite similar. Will look into the links that you have posted.

    Replies: @songbird

  745. @songbird
    @Ivashka the fool


    Thule Inuit people mostly annihilated and replaced the Dorset Inuit. Both had the same technical level and used similar neolithic weaponry.
     
    Usual conception seems to be that the Thule had a boatload of technology that the Dorset lacked and this facilitated the destruction of the Dorset.

    Dorset lacked the bow and arrow. Didn't have dog sleds, harpoons or kayaks (couldn't hunt large whales). The Thule actually had some limited metallurgy. Iron (cold-forged) from meteorites, copper from Coppermine River.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cape_York_meteorite
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper_Inuit

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Thanks, didn’t know that. I knew that Chukchis were much more technically evolved compared to their American cousins, but I thought that the Dorset and the Thule Inuits were quite similar. Will look into the links that you have posted.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Ivashka the fool


    I knew that Chukchis were much more technically evolved compared to their American cousins
     
    The armor that they wore was some pretty crazy stuff. Maybe, the most straight-forward evidence to back cold winters theory?

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/20/%D0%9A%D0%BE%D0%B6%D0%B0%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B9_%D0%BF%D0%B0%D0%BD%D1%86%D0%B8%D1%80%D1%8C.jpg

    Also heard that the Thule 100% replaced the Dorset:

    You can say that we are settling a long debate in Arctic archeology about the Paleo-Eskimos. That is: are they actually representing a different indigenous population?”

    Archeologists analyzed remains found in the Arctic and compared them with DNA of ancient and present-day Inuit.

    There was no match.

    The Paleo-Eskimos came from Siberia about 5,000 years ago and spread all the way from Alaska to Greenland before dying out around 700 years ago. Willerslev says the extinction seemed to happen about the same time that Inuit were moving into the Arctic.

    Why the Paleo-Eskimos didn’t intermix with Inuit remains a mystery, and an anomaly.

    “Almost in all other cases where we look back in the past and we see people meeting each other, they might be fighting with each other but normally they actually have sex with each other as well. For some reason, this just didn’t happen.”
     
    https://web.archive.org/web/20141109101343/http://www.cbc.ca/m/touch/canada/story/1.2749691

    Pretty interesting to theorize about.

    Maybe, it is not evolutionary sound to take women in war when you are operating in small Arctic bands? Because there is a chance that they will go Hannah Duston on your ass, wiping out your whole, small group in the middle of the night.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hannah_Duston

    BTW, I'm not 100% certain that the Dorset didn't use iron from the same meteorite. They may have in fact both picked it up the idea from the Vikings, who also have appeared to use it.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  746. @Blinky Bill
    @Yahya


    East Asia is toast.
     
    The solution is right before their eyes, they simply need to reach out and grasp it.



    https://twitter.com/qin_duke/status/1616810855911260160?s=20&t=mn9vD77IvJd-gyx2DokBMw

    Replies: @songbird

    IMO, it would be pretty easy for East Asians to turn it around.

    Koreans, at least, (and I think the Japanese too) seem to have pretty high asabiyyah. Like during the Debt Crisis when people donated $2 billion worth of personal jewelry.

    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
    @songbird


    IMO, it would be pretty easy for East Asians to turn it around.

    Koreans, at least, (and I think the Japanese too) seem to have pretty high asabiyyah. Like during the Debt Crisis when people donated $2 billion worth of personal jewelry.

     

    I suspect East Asian fertility being lowest in the world probably has biological antecedents. You're correct about higher tribalism, which reflects itself into manifested xenophobia. Japan and Korea have both opened up a smidgen in recent years but this all tentative and could easily be reversed. It's a mixed bag: they don't get many highly-skilled immigrants but they also don't get the riff-raff.

    That said, a cardinal mistake 3rd world triumphalists fall into is assuming higher population will automatically lead to future influence. Pakistani diplomats keep stalking the halls of power with their begging bowls. Egypt was recently bailed out by IMF & Saudis, being forced to devalue its increasingly useless currency once more. It has now lost half its value against the USD in the past year alone.

    https://i.imgur.com/d0HtfmY.png

    Why send in tanks when buying off a few local kleptocrats is sufficient? It's cheaper, more durable while creating buy-in among local elites to do your bidding. For the richest, you don't even need to give them money. They have that already. Just give them a reliable and hassle-free way to launder their ill-gotten gains into offshore accounts & luxurious overseas properties.

    In some ways this is a good development, because Western elites have found a way to control third world countries without overt colonialism or armed intervention, ultimately contributing to a more peaceful world. And why not? Certainly the 3rd world elites themselves seem to have a nice time, even the stateless ones:

    https://www.dirt.com/gallery/more-dirt/politicians/kurdistans-barzani-family-seeks-30-million-for-bowling-alley-equipped-beverly-hills-mansion-1203579381/barzani3/

    Who can blame them?

    Replies: @songbird

  747. @AaronB
    @LatW

    Yes, real old age can be a time to embrace spiritual pursuits, I'd agree with you there, but the embrace of a life of hardship and wandering seems like an extra step, and renunciation of city life and family and wealth, as well.

    But at least you seem to agree that at least at some point in life, there are more important things than the social game. That's good.

    I'd also totally agree with you that we need very little in the way of comfort and security to feel content :) Sometimes it takes old age to discover this, but it really applies to any time in life.

    Thanks for the example of the Japanese mountain priests, I like that very much.

    The three personas of the pagan God sounds similar to Hindu ideas about the stages of life - but the point is usually one of ascending value. It may be appropriate for a young man to live on the strife of the world in his season, but it's preparation for a much higher stage - renunciation and contemplation.

    I'm not saying that all drop outs are on the religious path, although I do maintain that many are proto-spiritualists who did not know how to find the path in a society that utterly disvalues it - but even ordinary drop outs from the rat race should be recognized as making a legitimate choice that has some spiritual worth, and society should be structured to accommodate them rather than insist on harnessing their productive potential to enrich the wealthy. I don't mean subsidies, but a path to modest and minimal self support that doesn't eat up all their time, steal their self respect, or deaden their souls.

    As you say, dropping out isn't for everyone - but neither is the rat race.

    Replies: @LatW

    But at least you seem to agree that at least at some point in life, there are more important things than the social game. That’s good.

    By social game, you mean the family and work relationships, as well as social life? Are children included in your picture?

    It sometimes feels like you are promoting MGTOW, which, in and of itself, on surface, may not seem like a harmful idea, certainly, one wouldn’t want to oppress anyone, right? But in reality this can seriously destabilize things.

    I’m also not entirely sure one has to reach old age or to even become an hermit to experience spiritual insights.

    [MORE]

    Thanks for the example of the Japanese mountain priests, I like that very much.

    Yes, I liked it very much as well, it is similar to my ancestral religion. I should probably delve into it a bit more.

    The three personas of the pagan God sounds similar to Hindu ideas about the stages of life – but the point is usually one of ascending value. It may be appropriate for a young man to live on the strife of the world in his season, but it’s preparation for a much higher stage – renunciation and contemplation.

    In the Baltic religion there was an elder priest who lived in a temple in a grove and tended to an eternal fire there. Very few were allowed to go in this grove so the priest spent a lot of time there alone. This might be a little similar to what you talk about but this priest served a very important social function (wise counsel and he was a kind of a leader). It wasn’t just individualistic mediation, but contemplation was, of course, a big part of it.

    but even ordinary drop outs from the rat race should be recognized as making a legitimate choice that has some spiritual worth, and society should be structured to accommodate them rather than insist on harnessing their productive potential to enrich the wealthy. I don’t mean subsidies, but a path to modest and minimal self support that doesn’t eat up all their time, steal their self respect, or deaden their souls.

    I think it depends on the person. When you give, it’s important to see that it’s not wasted. Because if you start giving out free things, too many may show up for it and it will create a moral hazard. I’m not saying this because I’m stingy, no. Not at all. It’s simply because I don’t like a situation where one part of able bodied society works (including mothers) and another doesn’t.

    But I have had such friends myself, the kind that you describe. I have actually helped a poet friend of mine to build a heritage project that we were both interested in. This is something that neither he nor I could’ve achieved on our own. So the result of this collaboration was positive.

    As to the change in the economic relationships that you propose in the post above – those are very substantial changes that would resemble European revolutions. It would require either a revolutionary type of awakening within the populace (and it wouldn’t be unanimous) or an armed revolution. Normally I would oppose such, however, one must admit that the cost of living in the West has risen in the recent years (or decades?), wages have grown but have not kept up, so I do agree that some very basic milestones take longer too achieve, too long, frankly. So in that regard you do have a point.

    However, what you propose might only make things worse. To give free housing and to relieve men of any duties whatsoever is a very, very slippery slope. Sometimes it leads to social collapse, the way it did after the fall of the USSR. Then the weak suffer and it’s not right.

    Also, you may want to consider that some people view work as a value of its own. Work is something that structures one’s life (of course, so does meditation & prayer), work is valuable not only in the results that it brings, or as a service to others, work can be viewed as something that promotes the Greek technē – a means to promote the development of the human being.

    Btw, I noticed you mentioned that this “prose” here on this forum is your contribution to society. Even if I don’t agree on all your points, I must admit that you do indeed write well – you are able to use language quite skillfully.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @LatW

    So when I said the social game, I meant the quest for status and rank, respect and honor - which consumes such an incredible amount of our lives - the need to be seen as respectable, and the social conformity and conventional behavior that this engenders.

    With regard to marriage and children, there is indeed a "social dimension" to this, insofar as many people marry to socially conform and become respectable, and that I would include in the "social game", but there is also an aspect to marriage and children that isn't necessarily a part of that but more about intrinsic satisfaction to those who derive it from that.

    I'm not at all promoting MGTOW - that is a resentment-based rejection of women that has nothing to do with spirituality. I like women, don't think they're heartless monsters lol out to ruin me, and I think that marriage and kids can be, if done for the right reasons and not out of a sense of social duty, very satisfying and healthy.

    However, I'd say that all the great spiritual traditions recognize that there are higher pursuits than marriage and children, so any system which places that at the summit, is limited in my view - and marriage as social duty and convention, often leads to misery.

    In fact, I'm very opposed to the right-wing promotion of marriage as duty and a dismal chore one must undertake in service to the community - I think that gloomy view has led to the decline of marriage, and I wrote here in the past about how I think to make marriage and children popular again - a right wing preoccupation - we should emphasize it's fun and joyous aspects, and as something one might spontaneously do for sheer joy (I think hiking with kids is one of the funnest things I've ever done).


    Yes, I liked it very much as well, it is similar to my ancestral religion. I should probably delve into it a bit more.
     
    Oh yeah, I'm a huge fan of Japanese culture. I think we can learn so much from them, and I read a lot of the Japanese classics. Japan is a fascinating fusion of pagan, animist, and Buddhist elements.

    In truth, even though I talk about the "higher" religions like Christianity and Buddhism primarily, I think paganism (especially "high" paganism) and animism are indispensable perspectives and have actually been subsumed into the higher religions and fertilized them extensively to the point where we no longer notice it, but couldn't do without it.

    Christianity without the pagan and animist elements which it adopted would be an entirely different, and impoverished beast, and so would Buddhism. We need legends and myths and fantasy and the sense that the world is alive. And what would Christianity be without Platonism!

    David Bentley Hart makes the interesting point that modern nihilism is so deep and intractable precisely because Christianity assumed into itself all the animism and paganism of the past and when it got discredited (through it's alliance with power), we didn't even have the "default" human spirituality of animism and paganism to fall back on. The whole package got discredited.

    In a way, things like Christianity and Buddhism are just the capstones on a rich substrate of pagan and animist sensibility. They complete it, and are indispensable in their own right, but depend on it too.

    It wasn’t just individualistic mediation, but contemplation was, of course, a big part of it.

     

    So that Baltic priest is engaging in a very legitimate form of spirituality, and very poetic too.

    However, the "concrete, tangible" social utility of what he's doing is not the only way the contemplative life assists humanity, it's just that as modern life progressed we insisted more abd more on tangible, material help as we lost sight of the intangible realm - and I submit this was a step towards nihilism, which is ultimately disbelief in the intangible.

    A holy man completely alone in his cave, having no contact with anyone, helps all mankind through the intangible realm - one, by becoming one with the Infinite he brings the Infinite down to earth and generates positive energy in the universe, and two, by example and hearsay, he reaches people psychologically and gives inspiration and comfort that at least some humans are realizing what God made us for, not social trivia.

    Traditionally, this intangible help was considered immensely more beneficial than anything tangible, because before the advent of nihilism the realm of spirit was seen as more important than the material realm (which was something of an illusion).

    As I said, modern nihilism can be said to be a loss of belief in the intangible, the realm of spirit, and an insistence on the material.

    Of course, advice and counsel have always had their place - after all, the Desert Father's left behind them a magnificent record of sayings well worth reading!

    think it depends on the person. When you give, it’s important to see that it’s not wasted. Because if you start giving out free things, too many may show up for it and it will create a moral hazard. I’m not saying this because I’m stingy, no. Not at all. It’s simply because I don’t like a situation where one part of able bodied society works (including mothers) and another doesn’t.

     

    Fair enough, but this is a "prudential" calculation that is not the calculation of God, certainly not in Christianity - we are told to give freely and without stint or calculation, not according to the wisdom of this world.

    Spiritual logic is different than worldly logic, and obeys different laws. Giving prudentially reinforces a certain logic of self-interest, but giving freely reinforces a morality of pure generosity - this may create an atmosphere conducive to moral reform, ad it is based on pure love, and ultimately it may be the calculated form of giving that creates long term moral hazard.

    That is what is so "startlingly" novel about Christianity - at least one of the things. It looked more deeply into the true sources of our problems than what is apparent on the surface.

    One may disagree with this, but it's good that we at least have this radical alternative perspective in view, which is why I was so opposed to AP rendering Christianity gutless and eviscerating it of all it's radical novelty.

    As to the change in the economic relationships that you propose in the post above – those are very substantial changes that would resemble European revolutions. It would require either a revolutionary type of awakening within the populace (and it wouldn’t be unanimous) or an armed revolution
     
    .

    Indeed, it would require nothing less than a drastic moral revolution - one that Christianity began long ago, and will culminate in the future, with God's light breaking into the world and setting everything alight.

    In the meantime, we can take what small steps we can.

    However, what you propose might only make things worse. To give free housing and to relieve men of any duties whatsoever is a very, very slippery slope. Sometimes it leads to social collapse, the way it did after the fall of the USSR. Then the weak suffer and it’s not right.
     
    I understand that this is the standard view, and is a big reason that such measures haven't been taken despite the means to doing so existing fir quite some time.

    However, as human beings we are all born with the right to free housing and enough land that's needed for our food - think of a hunter gatherer boring into a forest, he has "free" housing and food. By what right do the oligarchs monopolize all land and force us into a system of their devising?

    Is returning our birthright to us a moral hazard, or does forcing us into an artificial state of struggle for what is our by birth making us vicious?

    Also, you may want to consider that some people view work as a value of its own. Work is something that structures one’s life (of course, so does meditation & prayer), work is valuable not only in the results that it brings, or as a service to others, work can be viewed as something that promotes the Greek technē – a means to promote the development of the human being.

     

    Sure, I'd agree with this. But is this the kind of work that is done in a modern economy? There are forms of craftsmanship - techne, as you say - that are indeed a beautiful extension of our humanity, and a blacksmith, a basket weaver, a leather worker, a carver of statues from wood or stone, a hunter, may well be developing his humanity and even attaining union with the Infinite through his work.

    But of course, since the Industrial Revolution, this has not been most of our work. Factory work, office work, is a different beast.

    Even so, let us remember that the Greeks prized leisure and contemplation above all, and thought that too much time spent at a craft would distort one physically and spiritually.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @LatW

  748. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Another Polish Perspective

    http://www.travel-images.com/pht/india337.jpg

    Buddha was a white supremacist. His original band of disciples were all in the 1%. Those blue eyes came from the steppe.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    OTOH, Buddha spoke against the Varna system and encouraged his disciples to leave their families behind and become a wandering monk.

    https://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/buddhism/lifebuddha/2_24lbud.htm

    http://www.buddhasutra.com/files/khaggavisana_sutta.htm

  749. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Sean

    Guns on set = safety meeting before every shift. Association with a workplace fatality is extremely detrimental to a person's career prospects. Multiply that by 1000 when the fatality is avoidable with standard safety method.

    Baldwin is in deep sh!+.

    Replies: @Sean

    You keep calling it a ‘gun’, but it was a film’s prop on the set of a film with a budget of $6–7.3 million Baldwin had a reasonable expectation would not have live ammunition in it, because the production’s armorer had properly made sure there were not only no live rounds in the gun before bringing it to the set, but no live rounds either in or out of any firearm props on the set, as has long been standard practice. A box marked dummy rounds appeared from nowhere.

    At 10 a.m. Zachry, Gutierrez Reed and a prop assistant loaded five rounds into Baldwin’s gun and two other guns using bullets from the box that been found in prop truck that morning, according to the lawsuit. Gutierrez Reed, wo believed the box only contained dummy rounds, tried to load a sixth bullet, but it got stuck. Throughout the morning, Baldwin handled the gun with the five rounds.Gutierrez Reed, wo believed the box only contained dummy rounds, tried to load a sixth bullet, but it got stuck. Throughout the morning, Baldwin handled the gun with the five rounds. After lunch, Gutierrez Reed cleaned a chamber in Baldwin’s gun and then “pulled another round from the dummy box, shook it, and placed it in the chamber,” the suit said. The film’s props department safeguarded the guns, but not the ammunition, the lawsuit states.

    Her father, who is renowned by ruther elderly weapons master, had taken actors on a previous film to a target range for live firing practice (don’t ask me why) and the live rounds left over from that session somehow got into a box with dummy rounds that materialized on the set.

    There is an internet rumour that during the making of Sniper Special Ops Steven Seagal brought a loaded .45 auto

    Seagal insists on bringing his own 1911 to set and wearing it during filming. At one point a colleague was asked to help him with the gun in his trailer and before handing it to the colleague Seagal went “Whoops let me unload it first” and proceeded to eject the mag and eject his Black Talon hollowpoint from the chamber. MY DUDE BROUGHT LIVE AMMO TO SET AND HAD IT LOCKED AND LOADED; IT DOESNT MATTER IF ITS IN YOUR TRAILER STEVEN YOU DONT BRING LIVE AMMO TO SET WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK

    It should be noted that Seagal’s latter films such as SSO areextreme quicky cheapos. Rust was not. It just had a girl in charge of the guns ammunition being loaded.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @Sean

    Alec Baldwin is a cunt who profited from glamorizing guns and violence. He attacked white 2nd amendment guys for merely safely possessing a self-loading-rifle. He's no better than self absorbed incompetent nigger.

  750. @Sean
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    He has been around guns his entire life.
     
    You are talking as if Baldwin brought it from his personal home firearms collection and would not let anyone look at it before the incident, which would entail his having a duty to treat it in accordance with gun safety and be liable to prosecution if he failed to do so. But this was a movie prop supplied to the production by its weapons master. Again, his expectation that a prop on a Western film set brought there by the production's weapons master, prepared by them to be used in a scene where Baldwin would draw it, and issued to him as part of his costume would and could under no circumstances contain a potentially lethal cartridge was entirely reasonable. Especially for someone like Baldwin who has worked on numerous action films before and understands there is a expert responsible for making certain no such thing can happen.

    Everyone has a job to do on a film and they all are concerned to make sure they do their own job properly. Baldwin was on the set to do a job in the capacity he was hired, which is the one of trained actor. It was no more Baldwin's duty to check whether a prop he was to use might be capable of killing someone than it would have been for him to ensure food he was to give to someone to eat in a scene had not been contaminated with botulism by careless caterers.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Wokechoke

    The fun part is that Baldwin did infact shoot and kill someone. He’s been holier than thou about ordinary guys who have a rifle or a self-loading-rifle as evil. Even if they have never used the rifles to shoot at anyone.

    He’s an absolute motherfucker. Fuck that asshole.

  751. @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Yes, this is extremely important, because these people start to think, talk and act as a subject of geopolitics, not as an object. They start to think as a center of a territory, not a border.
     
    The Ukrainian nationalists spoke in those kinds of terms already a long time ago, it's just that they were not in power. There were such murmurs already in 2014, notably A.Biletsky spoke of extensively of Ukraino-centrism (referring to the likes of Yuri Lipa and his Black Sea Doctrine from the 1920s). They just didn't have much power, whereas Arestovych now has more access to mass audience and the president's administration.

    I have asked in the past why not claim directly the name of Rus instead of going along with a name that suggests a limitrophe frontier status? Ukrainians usually answer along the lines of what Kuchma wrote 20 years ago : “Ukraine is not Russia”.
     
    No, they do know they are Rus. But Rus' with the мягкий знак. Some of the more hardliner types speak about how Peter I stole their name, etc. So they are well aware of this problem, I think it's just hard to rename a country, plus Ukraine is a brand now in the West. They could brand it eventually as "Ukraine, the land of the original Rus" or something like that. I see why you talk about the name, it is very important, but even more important is the content. :)

    So who’s gonna be Russia in the end if everyone eschews the honor of taking and upholding the heritage of Rus in a straightforward manner, without ambivalence or ambiguity?
     
    This is a very good point. Well, it is a bit similar to Britain and Britain's children, USA and Canada, etc. You know in Russian and Latvian, England is called Anglia, the rest of the Commonwealth states are not called Little Anglias or similar, they have their own, new names, but, as a group of peoples, they are still commonly called the Anglos. So it might be something similar for the Rus eventually as well. It's a bit more edifying than just "Eastern Slavs" (although I have nothing against that one either).

    And it is easier to be a subject when you speak a language most people around you understand, and declare an open and flexible identity. They could go very far if they keep moving that way
     
    .

    I think this is one option that can co-exist with a more hardline nationalist position. These two outlooks will fight but they can co-exist. The more flexible identity could be used as a basis to assemble a wider following.

    He is quite popular among the Baltic people, too. But for us, we wouldn't have to compromise our native language at home, the Russian language is just for communication with some neighbors. In Ukraine this could be an issue for some types, but I don't think it will be because they are very organically bilingual. Eventually more Ukrainian will be spoken. That's why I sometimes wonder what language the children will communicate in, because it will be important.

    Moreover, Arestovych citing Strugatsky brothers is a direct call to people like me, who have all grown up reading their books.
     
    Yea, when I heard him cite Strugatsky brothers, I immediately thought of you and realized that there are cultural references that can be utilized. I think he did a whole series of videos on the Strugatsky topic. He also sometimes does that tune from Yeralash, which is funny. I think he talks about those Russian icons as something to learn from, not necessarily follow the Russkiy Mir. They want to build their own project. This project will have to find some kind of an alignment with Europe.

    But he can be provocative sometimes and Ukrainian ethno-nats don't like him. So he should be careful not to run his mouth too much. Tough thing because his best material comes from open communication. LOL Ideally, others should join him to form some kind of a team of intellectuals with slightly varying views (but one goal).

    I wouldn’t be surprised at all if he is an adept of Chaos Magick. He might really pull out something important and interesting if he keeps trying, which I believe he will.
     
    I doubt he's an adept of Chaos Magic, but he is a type who would be able to understand some of it probably. He definitely enjoys language and symbols. Chaos Magic is also a Western phenomenon, or rather, was built in the West (even if it references the East in some cases).

    It is also clear that he respects the tradition of Western rationalism.

    Now let’s see if he can survive (first of all intellectually survive his cocaine snorting habits).
     
    He is on Feigin every day for hours and it would be much more visible if he did snort cocaine - yes, he does talk fast, but his demeanor is usually quite calm, he does not seem too fidgety, irritable or restless, pupils do not appear to be dilated and eyes don't appear sensitive to light.

    Even if it were so that they occasionally snort some cocaine, cocaine is not as bad as heroin or even some heavy painkillers, I imagine, it's easier to get off cocaine than other types of drugs.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Another Polish Perspective

    Which Strugackis books were most popular in USSR, and which are now in Russia and Ukraine respectively..?

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Few weeks ago I was watching the movie "Player" of Robert Altman. It starts with a discussion on a script concerning "spaceship survivors on Earth"... this was actually a cameo appearance of an idea which was developed by Strugackis' in "Roadside Picnic", not that I liked the book much. I must say I have never fully understood the phenomenon of Strugackis popularity in USSR (Kir Bulychov was much more to my liking), unless of course Strugackis were privy to some secret knowledge, and let's say "It is hard to be a god" was really saying something about UFOs, as some thought. And Don Rumata was like Cagiostro.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    , @LatW
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Which Strugackis books were most popular in USSR, and which are now in Russia and Ukraine respectively..?
     
    Sci-fi is not really my cup of tea, so I can't be of help here, I'm afraid. Bashi might know this much better.

    I just know that Arestovych has some kind of a self-development school (he calls it "school of thinking") and a part of that he published some videos where he discusses Strugatsky's works ("Hard to be a God" and a few others). It looks like he's trying to use some of the insights he has drawn from those titles into his own archeo-futuristic musings. Of course, Stalker was known among sci-fi fans in the Baltics (it was filmed in Tallinn, Estonia).

    Btw, regarding the above discussion about Wends. Yes, it is true that some Russians use these theories to claim that they have a right to space in Central Europe. Also, Russian Rodnovers idealize the island of Rugen. Even though this is essentially heritage of Western Slavs, their distant relatives. I usually dismiss these theories, but Bashi wrote about it quite compellingly and it inspires imagination.

    However, we do know for a fact that the so called Texas Wends are Sorbs (even if Germanized). Wends are simply Lechitic Slavs.

    Replies: @songbird, @Another Polish Perspective

  752. @Sean
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    You keep calling it a 'gun', but it was a film's prop on the set of a film with a budget of $6–7.3 million Baldwin had a reasonable expectation would not have live ammunition in it, because the production's armorer had properly made sure there were not only no live rounds in the gun before bringing it to the set, but no live rounds either in or out of any firearm props on the set, as has long been standard practice. A box marked dummy rounds appeared from nowhere.


    At 10 a.m. Zachry, Gutierrez Reed and a prop assistant loaded five rounds into Baldwin’s gun and two other guns using bullets from the box that been found in prop truck that morning, according to the lawsuit. Gutierrez Reed, wo believed the box only contained dummy rounds, tried to load a sixth bullet, but it got stuck. Throughout the morning, Baldwin handled the gun with the five rounds.Gutierrez Reed, wo believed the box only contained dummy rounds, tried to load a sixth bullet, but it got stuck. Throughout the morning, Baldwin handled the gun with the five rounds. After lunch, Gutierrez Reed cleaned a chamber in Baldwin’s gun and then “pulled another round from the dummy box, shook it, and placed it in the chamber,” the suit said. The film’s props department safeguarded the guns, but not the ammunition, the lawsuit states.
     
    Her father, who is renowned by ruther elderly weapons master, had taken actors on a previous film to a target range for live firing practice (don't ask me why) and the live rounds left over from that session somehow got into a box with dummy rounds that materialized on the set.


    There is an internet rumour that during the making of Sniper Special Ops Steven Seagal brought a loaded .45 auto

    Seagal insists on bringing his own 1911 to set and wearing it during filming. At one point a colleague was asked to help him with the gun in his trailer and before handing it to the colleague Seagal went “Whoops let me unload it first” and proceeded to eject the mag and eject his Black Talon hollowpoint from the chamber. MY DUDE BROUGHT LIVE AMMO TO SET AND HAD IT LOCKED AND LOADED; IT DOESNT MATTER IF ITS IN YOUR TRAILER STEVEN YOU DONT BRING LIVE AMMO TO SET WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK
     
    It should be noted that Seagal's latter films such as SSO areextreme quicky cheapos. Rust was not. It just had a girl in charge of the guns ammunition being loaded.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    Alec Baldwin is a cunt who profited from glamorizing guns and violence. He attacked white 2nd amendment guys for merely safely possessing a self-loading-rifle. He’s no better than self absorbed incompetent nigger.

  753. SJW’s fail again.

    ==================
    Go Woke. Go Broke!
    ==================

    They have to realize this stuff is not selling. When will we reach Peak Stupid? It has to be soon. Can it be now?

    PEACE 😇

  754. @Ivashka the fool
    @songbird

    Thanks, didn't know that. I knew that Chukchis were much more technically evolved compared to their American cousins, but I thought that the Dorset and the Thule Inuits were quite similar. Will look into the links that you have posted.

    Replies: @songbird

    I knew that Chukchis were much more technically evolved compared to their American cousins

    The armor that they wore was some pretty crazy stuff. Maybe, the most straight-forward evidence to back cold winters theory?

    [MORE]

    Also heard that the Thule 100% replaced the Dorset:

    You can say that we are settling a long debate in Arctic archeology about the Paleo-Eskimos. That is: are they actually representing a different indigenous population?”

    Archeologists analyzed remains found in the Arctic and compared them with DNA of ancient and present-day Inuit.

    There was no match.

    The Paleo-Eskimos came from Siberia about 5,000 years ago and spread all the way from Alaska to Greenland before dying out around 700 years ago. Willerslev says the extinction seemed to happen about the same time that Inuit were moving into the Arctic.

    Why the Paleo-Eskimos didn’t intermix with Inuit remains a mystery, and an anomaly.

    “Almost in all other cases where we look back in the past and we see people meeting each other, they might be fighting with each other but normally they actually have sex with each other as well. For some reason, this just didn’t happen.”

    https://web.archive.org/web/20141109101343/http://www.cbc.ca/m/touch/canada/story/1.2749691

    Pretty interesting to theorize about.

    Maybe, it is not evolutionary sound to take women in war when you are operating in small Arctic bands? Because there is a chance that they will go Hannah Duston on your ass, wiping out your whole, small group in the middle of the night.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hannah_Duston

    BTW, I’m not 100% certain that the Dorset didn’t use iron from the same meteorite. They may have in fact both picked it up the idea from the Vikings, who also have appeared to use it.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @songbird

    You would only take captives if you would think increasing the number of people you interact with useful. For instance, you might need to clear more forest through slash and burn to increase your agricultural produce. Or you would need slaves to mine copper and / or tin so you could produce bronze weapons. Or you feel the need to sacrifice and eat human beings to "feed the gods" or "absorb the captives' mana". I think that would be the main reasons to capture a human being alive in a Neolithic context.

    But in the Arctic, the ressources are so scarce that adding captive slaves to your clan is only a hassle. When you are killing other people just to keep or acquire hunting grounds, and you are often starving anyways, then adding captives would not help your situation. They probably just killed the Dorset on the spot when they met them, and if they raped their women, they probably just killed them after abusing them. They might have eaten their victims too.

    https://www.jstor.org/stable/40316364

    And yeah Chukchis were formidable warriors, Russians had all the trouble in the world conquering Chukotka. AFAIR the Russian troops even had to be pulled from the region completely before coming back. Imagine if the Chukchis had guns at the time. One of the things that Chukchis did and Russians found appalling was that Chukchis preferred killing their women and children when they were surrounded. Possibly Chukchis thought that Russian soldiers would torture and kill them anyway. Also in the Inuit religion, the dead live forever in the afterlife hunting grounds where the hunt is always successful and there is no hunger or disease. Killing sick relatives and letting their young children die would sometimes have been an act of mercy.

    https://visitgreenland.com/about-greenland/qilakitsoq-mummies/

    Replies: @Greasy William

  755. @Another Polish Perspective
    @LatW

    Which Strugackis books were most popular in USSR, and which are now in Russia and Ukraine respectively..?

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @LatW

    Few weeks ago I was watching the movie “Player” of Robert Altman. It starts with a discussion on a script concerning “spaceship survivors on Earth”… this was actually a cameo appearance of an idea which was developed by Strugackis’ in “Roadside Picnic”, not that I liked the book much. I must say I have never fully understood the phenomenon of Strugackis popularity in USSR (Kir Bulychov was much more to my liking), unless of course Strugackis were privy to some secret knowledge, and let’s say “It is hard to be a god” was really saying something about UFOs, as some thought. And Don Rumata was like Cagiostro.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Cagliostro or Comte de Saint-Germain.

  756. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Few weeks ago I was watching the movie "Player" of Robert Altman. It starts with a discussion on a script concerning "spaceship survivors on Earth"... this was actually a cameo appearance of an idea which was developed by Strugackis' in "Roadside Picnic", not that I liked the book much. I must say I have never fully understood the phenomenon of Strugackis popularity in USSR (Kir Bulychov was much more to my liking), unless of course Strugackis were privy to some secret knowledge, and let's say "It is hard to be a god" was really saying something about UFOs, as some thought. And Don Rumata was like Cagiostro.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    Cagliostro or Comte de Saint-Germain.

  757. @songbird
    @Ivashka the fool


    I knew that Chukchis were much more technically evolved compared to their American cousins
     
    The armor that they wore was some pretty crazy stuff. Maybe, the most straight-forward evidence to back cold winters theory?

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/20/%D0%9A%D0%BE%D0%B6%D0%B0%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B9_%D0%BF%D0%B0%D0%BD%D1%86%D0%B8%D1%80%D1%8C.jpg

    Also heard that the Thule 100% replaced the Dorset:

    You can say that we are settling a long debate in Arctic archeology about the Paleo-Eskimos. That is: are they actually representing a different indigenous population?”

    Archeologists analyzed remains found in the Arctic and compared them with DNA of ancient and present-day Inuit.

    There was no match.

    The Paleo-Eskimos came from Siberia about 5,000 years ago and spread all the way from Alaska to Greenland before dying out around 700 years ago. Willerslev says the extinction seemed to happen about the same time that Inuit were moving into the Arctic.

    Why the Paleo-Eskimos didn’t intermix with Inuit remains a mystery, and an anomaly.

    “Almost in all other cases where we look back in the past and we see people meeting each other, they might be fighting with each other but normally they actually have sex with each other as well. For some reason, this just didn’t happen.”
     
    https://web.archive.org/web/20141109101343/http://www.cbc.ca/m/touch/canada/story/1.2749691

    Pretty interesting to theorize about.

    Maybe, it is not evolutionary sound to take women in war when you are operating in small Arctic bands? Because there is a chance that they will go Hannah Duston on your ass, wiping out your whole, small group in the middle of the night.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hannah_Duston

    BTW, I'm not 100% certain that the Dorset didn't use iron from the same meteorite. They may have in fact both picked it up the idea from the Vikings, who also have appeared to use it.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    You would only take captives if you would think increasing the number of people you interact with useful. For instance, you might need to clear more forest through slash and burn to increase your agricultural produce. Or you would need slaves to mine copper and / or tin so you could produce bronze weapons. Or you feel the need to sacrifice and eat human beings to “feed the gods” or “absorb the captives’ mana”. I think that would be the main reasons to capture a human being alive in a Neolithic context.

    But in the Arctic, the ressources are so scarce that adding captive slaves to your clan is only a hassle. When you are killing other people just to keep or acquire hunting grounds, and you are often starving anyways, then adding captives would not help your situation. They probably just killed the Dorset on the spot when they met them, and if they raped their women, they probably just killed them after abusing them. They might have eaten their victims too.

    https://www.jstor.org/stable/40316364

    And yeah Chukchis were formidable warriors, Russians had all the trouble in the world conquering Chukotka. AFAIR the Russian troops even had to be pulled from the region completely before coming back. Imagine if the Chukchis had guns at the time. One of the things that Chukchis did and Russians found appalling was that Chukchis preferred killing their women and children when they were surrounded. Possibly Chukchis thought that Russian soldiers would torture and kill them anyway. Also in the Inuit religion, the dead live forever in the afterlife hunting grounds where the hunt is always successful and there is no hunger or disease. Killing sick relatives and letting their young children die would sometimes have been an act of mercy.

    https://visitgreenland.com/about-greenland/qilakitsoq-mummies/

    • Thanks: songbird
    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Ivashka the fool


    Also in the Inuit religion, the dead live forever in the afterlife hunting grounds where the hunt is always successful and there is no hunger or disease.
     
    Great. So I'll just end up starving to death in the afterlife because I'm too lazy to hunt. I just can't catch a break.
  758. @Another Polish Perspective
    @LatW

    Which Strugackis books were most popular in USSR, and which are now in Russia and Ukraine respectively..?

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @LatW

    Which Strugackis books were most popular in USSR, and which are now in Russia and Ukraine respectively..?

    Sci-fi is not really my cup of tea, so I can’t be of help here, I’m afraid. Bashi might know this much better.

    I just know that Arestovych has some kind of a self-development school (he calls it “school of thinking”) and a part of that he published some videos where he discusses Strugatsky’s works (“Hard to be a God” and a few others). It looks like he’s trying to use some of the insights he has drawn from those titles into his own archeo-futuristic musings. Of course, Stalker was known among sci-fi fans in the Baltics (it was filmed in Tallinn, Estonia).

    Btw, regarding the above discussion about Wends. Yes, it is true that some Russians use these theories to claim that they have a right to space in Central Europe. Also, Russian Rodnovers idealize the island of Rugen. Even though this is essentially heritage of Western Slavs, their distant relatives. I usually dismiss these theories, but Bashi wrote about it quite compellingly and it inspires imagination.

    However, we do know for a fact that the so called Texas Wends are Sorbs (even if Germanized). Wends are simply Lechitic Slavs.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @LatW


    However, we do know for a fact that the so called Texas Wends are Sorbs (even if Germanized)
     
    Latw, you have burst my bubble. I thought this guy was talking about real Wends:

    The melodies which were sung had a striking resemblance to those of the Wendish nations. This is one of the many features of similarity which strike me between those nations and the Irish. Both manufacture, and have an exclusive taste for, spirit distilled from corn; both live almost entirely on potatoes; both have the bagpipe; both are passionate lovers of singing and dancing, and yet their national airs are of a melancholy character; both are oppressed by a foreign nation, and speak a gradually expiring language, which is rich and poetical, though possessed of no literature; both honour the descendants of their ancient princes, and cherish the principle that what is not renounced is not utterly lost; both are superstitious, cunning, and greatly given to exaggeration; rebellious where they can, but somewhat cringing to decided and established power; both like to go ragged, even when they have the means of dressing better; and lastly, spite of their miserable living, both are capable of great exertion, though they prefer indolence and loitering; and both alike enjoy a fertile soil, which the Wendish phrase calls “the roast meat of poor people.” The better qualities which distinguish the Irish are theirs alone.
     
    Tour in England, Ireland, and France, in the years 1826, 1827, 1828 and 1829.
    Fürst von Hermann Pückler-Muskau
    https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/46223/pg46223-images.html#LETTER_XXXVIII

    Replies: @LatW

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @LatW

    Bashybuzuk/Ivashka ethnogenesis theory stresses the continuity of indigenous elements, as you could expect from Rodnover. Well, last year I visited in Poland rodzimowiercy presentation where a lecturer claimed that Minoans were Indo-Europeans. I guess you can stretch continuity hypothesis that way too, if you want everyone to be indigenous ;)

    Yes, it somehow confirm what I read once that Strugackis are considered to be more than sci-fi in the (post)Soviet space. But from my personal reading of them, putting aside some allusions to Soviet reality, it could be a Soviet introduction to the "Ancient Astronauts" theory. It would be good to know whether Strugackis commented on Daeniken ideas in any way.


    However, we do know for a fact that the so called Texas Wends are Sorbs (even if Germanized). Wends are simply Lechitic Slavs.
     
    It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.

    But Wends are not Lechitic Slavs (maybe in some artificial classifications), that are Poles. I think that should be obvious, Poles = Lachs [Lachy]. Wends, however, can call themselves Czech Slavs since their land was once part of the Kingdom of Czechs.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lands_of_the_Bohemian_Crown

    Replies: @LatW

  759. I don’t think some people understand just how dark Russia’s strategic situation is. Here are two factors I’ve finally come to realize in the last few days after earlier believing that Russia was in decent shape:

    1. Ukraine has essentially unlimited manpower to tap should it prove necessary. Ultimately, Ukraine has 5 million guys it can mobilize if it needs to. More still if it makes heavy use of women in non combat roles. And more further still when considering mercenaries and foreign “advisors”. There is ZERO possibility of Russia winning this war through attrition

    2. Even if the US were to totally end all aid to Ukraine, and I don’t see that happening, Europe + Canada + UK can easily fill the gap. This is true even if there is a global financial crisis (as I believe there will be). It’s just that the economic resources available to the West are so incredibly huge that it is able to outproduce Russia by using only a fraction of its (the West’s) GDP.

    The only way Russia could be bailed out now is if the financial crisis that is set to begin in May is so severe that it politically roils the West to the point that the West is unable, or unwilling, to provide Ukraine with sufficient arms and funds to continue fighting. Now I could see there maybe being a situation where the West doesn’t supply Ukraine with enough to drive Russia out of Ukraine, but I really cannot think of any scenario where the West doesn’t continue to provide Ukraine with enough to prevent full Russian conquest.

    So right now, I can’t see Russia winning. Even if Russia got its act together and fully mobilized, I don’t think that will be enough. And if the front line gets stalemated, I definitely would expect Western backed Ukraine to defeat Russia in a “war of the missiles” once the West has had the chance to properly arm the Ukrainians. The longer this thing goes on, the worse it is going to get for Russia.

    I don’t believe the West will allow Ukraine to retake Crimea or the far eastern regions of the Ukraine that Russia had pre invasion, but I do think that ultimately Russia is going to lose all of it’s other gains from this operation.

    Right now, I’m thinking this most likely ends with a return to Feb ’21 borders and Putin stepping down (the only good thing to come from this madness).

    What a fiasco.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Greasy William

    Thank you, I'd grown tired of scrolling past all the obscure race/ethnic based comments.

    MEN DON'T MAKE POTTERY SO STFU ABOUT IT

    , @QCIC
    @Greasy William

    Untrained manpower is not very effective against cluster bombs.

    +++

    These "Russia is fvkd" scenarios seem to assume she will keep playing with the gloves on.

    Why do you assume that? The gloves are apparently on by choice and not as a result of external military pressure.

    +++

    My current speculation is different from the MacGregor/Ritter idea of waiting for the ground to freeze. I think Russia will wait until Spring is close, then disable pipelines, rail lines, highways and runways connecting Ukraine to the West. So far these targets seem to have only been attacked on a limited basis. Without fuel or resupply for Ukraine, the work for the Russian forces will go faster. Waiting avoids having too many civilians freezing and starving to death.

    I assume the longer the West prolongs the inevitable, the more Russia emotionally accepts that post-SMO Ukraine will be a bombed out wasteland.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    , @Wokechoke
    @Greasy William

    Generally an army as an institution morally collapses when the stochastic chance of being killed reaches a probability of 1. When the dead and maimed begin to equal the initial numbers of an army deployed.

    France reached that point in 1917. Germany reached that moment in 1918. Ottoman Empire too. The Russian Empire famously had a moral collapse of its army in 1917. Germany only avoided it for a year because it was fed on a steady diet of victory up to the Kaiserschlacht battles: Michael, Georgette and Blucher and Freidensturm...where they lost 700,000 men a week or two.


    The British military avoided this by deft management of creature comforts and troop rotation but another year of campaigning would have crippled them.

    Replies: @Greasy William

  760. @Ivashka the fool
    @songbird

    You would only take captives if you would think increasing the number of people you interact with useful. For instance, you might need to clear more forest through slash and burn to increase your agricultural produce. Or you would need slaves to mine copper and / or tin so you could produce bronze weapons. Or you feel the need to sacrifice and eat human beings to "feed the gods" or "absorb the captives' mana". I think that would be the main reasons to capture a human being alive in a Neolithic context.

    But in the Arctic, the ressources are so scarce that adding captive slaves to your clan is only a hassle. When you are killing other people just to keep or acquire hunting grounds, and you are often starving anyways, then adding captives would not help your situation. They probably just killed the Dorset on the spot when they met them, and if they raped their women, they probably just killed them after abusing them. They might have eaten their victims too.

    https://www.jstor.org/stable/40316364

    And yeah Chukchis were formidable warriors, Russians had all the trouble in the world conquering Chukotka. AFAIR the Russian troops even had to be pulled from the region completely before coming back. Imagine if the Chukchis had guns at the time. One of the things that Chukchis did and Russians found appalling was that Chukchis preferred killing their women and children when they were surrounded. Possibly Chukchis thought that Russian soldiers would torture and kill them anyway. Also in the Inuit religion, the dead live forever in the afterlife hunting grounds where the hunt is always successful and there is no hunger or disease. Killing sick relatives and letting their young children die would sometimes have been an act of mercy.

    https://visitgreenland.com/about-greenland/qilakitsoq-mummies/

    Replies: @Greasy William

    Also in the Inuit religion, the dead live forever in the afterlife hunting grounds where the hunt is always successful and there is no hunger or disease.

    Great. So I’ll just end up starving to death in the afterlife because I’m too lazy to hunt. I just can’t catch a break.

  761. @Mikel
    @AP


    It is no wonder that the person with whom he has the least contentious interactions is the materialist atheist Mikel
     
    No, it has nothing to do with my involuntary atheism/existentialism. It's just that we share the same passion for the natural landscapes of the US West (not a very materialistic thing to feel the same calling for). That makes me overlook the many differences that we have and actually wonder what else we may have in common. I guess I would regard his posts in a totally different light if he was as indifferent to natural beauty as Silviosilver is. But I would still find him interesting to read, as I do Silviosilver. I also admire his ability to be constantly reading a tremendous amount of profound, intellectually demanding books. I doubt you would be debating him yourself if you didn't find his opinions challenging enough to spend your time on.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @AaronB

    his posts in a totally different light if he was as indifferent to natural beauty as Silviosilver is.

    Ouch, I’m not completely indifferent to it. Of course I appreciate it, when I’m around it. I just seldom feel any need to go looking for it. There’s a lovely track I like to walk along with a river on one side and, for a large stretch of it a lush manicured golf course, on the other side. (Part of the reason I used to be an avid golfer was the beautiful surrounds.) That’s generally enough ‘nature’ for me.

    If I need more, I like to take long drives through the countryside where I know the scenery is to my liking. After a drive like that, months will pass before I feel the urge again. Even more occasionally, I’ll go ‘exploring’ in new areas where I’m not sure what I’ll find. So there’s a bit of appreciation there, but I admit I’m not exactly mesmerized by natural beauty. And the reason I don’t go with other people is because when I have, they always want to stay longer than I do. It doesn’t take very long for my feeling to become oh come on, haven’t we seen it now, how much longer do you wanna stay?

    (Think of the scene in National Lampoon’s Vacation where Chevy Chase and his wife breath in the beauty of the Grand Canyon for all of like three seconds. I can relate, lol. Aaron shaking his head that I’m yet again missing the point.)

    • LOL: Mikel
  762. @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    Have you ever heard of Pyzhikov ?

    https://youtu.be/3AUL5qgDsVY

    https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9F%D1%8B%D0%B6%D0%B8%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2,_%D0%90%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%BA%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B4%D1%80_%D0%92%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%B4%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87

    He was doing an incredible work for the rehabilitation of paganism in RusFed.

    Unfortunately he unexpectedly died before he could complete his endeavor.

    Replies: @LatW

    Have you ever heard of Pyzhikov ?

    I don’t know much about him, but thanks for the link. It looks like there is a documentary about the Raskol based on his work. It deals with all those things you’ve written about before (linked below).

    It seems he was a friend of Evgeny Spitsin (he is quite pro-Soviet, but, more relevantly, he has some studies on Slavic ethnogenesis and the ancient Rus). It seems they are both students of Valentin Sedov, a well known Russian archeologist (who worked at the Latvian Academy of Science at one point, I have his book on Balts (in Latvian)).

    [MORE]

    He was doing an incredible work for the rehabilitation of paganism in RusFed.

    Was it for paganism or for Old Believers? It looks like his father was an Old Believer and asked him to research this.

    This looks like a neat book:

    https://kniga.lv/shop/korennaja-rossija-byliny-zagovory-obrjady/

    Unfortunately he unexpectedly died before he could complete his endeavor.

    Yea, a very early death… actually, a beautiful death if one can say so, since he essentially passed away in the archives.

    Btw, this series mentions that Old Believers were more affluent than I had thought before. I thought it was because they were hard working, but Spitsin mentions in the series that this was due to their communal capitalism and that this hadn’t been researched but would be important for the future. And that Pyzhikov had just started researching this…

    Interesting – this series claims that the owners of the majority of the larger factories in Moscow in the beginning of the 20th century were owned by Old Believers. You know this is a lesser known side of the Old Believers… that they supported the revolution of 1905, and then, as I understand, later they received their rights back from Nikolai. It could be seen as the old Russian worldview continuing to fight against the new Russian worldview. When you watch these series, analyzing the economic side of it in particular, you start to understand how this might be an inconvenient truth today.

    Interesting description of the Russian община (community). I wonder if this isn’t a somewhat idealized view of it (in this series). The series seems a bit ideologically loaded and critical of Western (St Pete) capitalism.

    Btw, have you heard of the concept of домострой? This may be connected to these communities.

    His quote:

    “Староверие ниоткуда не появлялось, оно всегда было! Оно составляет суть этой земли. Это даже не староверие, а истинноверие. Это магистральный духовный путь нашей страны, это выражение сути самой России, которая без староверия не существует в принципе. А где центр тяжести в причине раскола? Центр тяжести староверия находился в народе, а то, что было навязано, имело центр тяжести в элите. И это породило раскол. Преодолевать его можно только на условиях равноправности..”

    https://www.youtube.com/@user-ej1nn8wu9g

  763. @Blinky Bill
    @silviosilver

    Silviosilver I've always found your comments enlightening, in particular this one from many years ago, it's always stuck with me.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-conventional-wisdom-in-a-nutshell/#comment-930525



    This meme also flashes in my mind every time I read one of your comments. 😅

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FbOXb_BUIAAEgJh.jpg

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @silviosilver

    Well thanks Bill. I cringed when I saw the date of that post you linked to. I often cringe when I reread something I wrote a year ago, let alone eight years ago, lol. Or another response I have is when I’m rereading something I said, but for whatever reason I’m unaware that it’s my own post, and I find myself agreeing with it – this writer is showing good sense! – and then I realize I was the author, and boom, I find a hundred faults with it, haha.

    Much truth in that meme. So can I lean on you as a character witness when I’m hauled off by the inquisition? 🙂

    • Replies: @Blinky Bill
    @silviosilver


    So can I lean on you as a character witness when I’m hauled off by the inquisition?
     
    “If you feel pain, you're alive, if you feel other people's pain, you're a human being.” — Leo Tolstoy




    https://youtu.be/zJMt3pJwIhY
  764. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @silviosilver
    @AaronB

    Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

    A few words to clear the air before I respond. I'd like you to know that I'm virtually never satisfied with the posts I address to you. Somehow I can never manage to catch myself before hitting the damn "publish comment" button, but afterwards I always feel I've come across as too agitated, too snappy, too dismissive, too much like a simplistic bumpkin incapable of contemplating what has been presented to him, as though I'm outraged someone could hold such an opinion and that it must be eradicated posthaste. That attitude's not at all conducive to an actual discussion, which after all is what I'm here for, so all credit to you for maintaining a civil tone. (If we're keeping score, you're one-up, two-up, hell ten-up on me on that count.) The same is true for my replies to most posters actually, but I think I'm on my worst behavior with you.

    IRL, I'm actually a very easy going guy, nothing at all like the abrasive asshole I can be online. Possibly that's just my imagination, but I interact with a pretty broad sweep of people of all sorts of backgrounds, and IRL if people feel you're jumping down their throat, they either get mad or leave quickly. The fact that they don't - quite the contrary - leads me to believe I'm doing something right. Then again, that's not a skill that came naturally to me. I started out in life with a very fiery temper, which got me into all sorts of bother, and it took some harsh life lessons to get me to change my ways. I suppose that I'm still, after all this time, yet to make the same transition in online interaction.

    Turning to the points you made, I'll try for once not to rush it, and just address my claim of confirmation bias. For the accusation to hold water, obviously there must be plenty of examples of whatever is being "confirmed" - otherwise no examples, no confirmation. The bias relates to ignoring examples which disconfirm the thesis you're propounding. And these, I think, abound. "Aristocrats aspired to lives of refined leisure? Oh that's hogwash" is certainly not what I meant to imply. It's that in addition to their aspirations towards refinement, they were involved in plenty of scheming and plotting - not a crime to call it "striving" - all with a view to improving their social position.

    Is it too much to believe that for many of them these activities took priority? European history (I know nothing of China, but I'll risk assuming the same was true) would have looked nothing like it did were this not the case. It's as though you'd have us believe "the man's a duke, he couldn't possibly be involved in a plot against the king, he's too intoxicated with cultural refinement for anything so worldly." And ought we always to believe that an aristocrat is up to what he claims he is up to, or is a degree of suspicion warranted? A white elite libtard waxes lyrical about diversity, so surely he fills his life with blacks at every opportunity, right? Or perhaps we're just talking past each other.

    Going back to your art theory, similarly, it's not that I believe there's nothing to it. Not at all. I have no doubt it holds true in numerous cases. But not all. Imo, not even in most cases. When it comes to discussing art in any kind of depth, I know very well I'm in over my head, so I normally don't even try. But I've read enough to know there any competing schools of thought out there (and retain some vague idea of what they're saying) to feel confident that you are being too adamant that your explanation holds true in every case. I think you're at a point where you've come up with what you believe is comprehensive philosophy of good living - and as I've said to you before, go ahead, follow your own bliss - and you're trying to shoehorn far too much into it, almost as though you think your philosophy of the good life would fall apart if you didn't.

    Replies: @AaronB, @AaronB, @AaronB

    Naahh, don’t even worry about it dude 🙂 I mean, I appreciate the explanation, but it’s totally unnecessary. For my money, you have one of the most vigorous and vivid writing styles here, and I enjoy reading you – so what if you’re a bit “salty” 🙂 I always think the best way to write is unpremeditated, shoot from the hip – you feel like you’re dealing with an authentic character, warts and all, which is great.

    For what it’s worth, I often feel like I write too aggressively and immediately regret it and vow to be a little softer and nicer next time – with at best temporary success lol. We are what we are.

    One of the things I appreciate about many of the Zen people, in both China and Japan, especially in the early years, is that they deliberately cultivated an unpremeditated, shoot from the hip style, and were not afraid to be sharp, irritable, aggressive – you feel like you’re dealing with a piece of nature as God made it, a natural human being, flaws and imperfections and all. It’s like coming into contact with a rugged mountain. It’s a breath of fresh air after the solemn, “pious” air of most religious writing. And yet they managed to convey the most profound spiritual truths.

    In our bland modern times, with it’s scientific temper and belief that people should be “neutral”, “objective”, colorless, passionless, emotionless, and matter of fact, I feel the most important thing is to be an authentic character, warts and all. We’ve lost connection to our true selves and so produce hordes of dull, mild people (the “vanilla White guy” trope of American popular culture, educated in a scientific manner and disconnected from his emotions – luckily no longer as prevalent)

    Gone are those wonderful, eccentric, strong characters the English used to produce so prolifically in the 19th century! The fascinating paradox is that a society with a superabundance of formal rules like Victorian England provides a “safe space” for the expression of personality – provided one obeys all the rules, one can be oneself. The rules provide a kind of “cover” – and perhaps even an incentive to be yourself, as rules are irksome and promote a backlash. I think a superabundance of “formality” also fosters a strong sense of humor as it’s counterpoint, as stiff formality is after all silly 🙂 It’s impossible, after a certain point, to not see it as a collective joke.

    Jewishness is somewhat like this too – as long as you obey all those stupid and complex rules, you’re allowed to be really weird and eccentric. So sitting down with a bunch of Brooklyn Jews is a bit like being in a Dickens novel, with all these eccentric, strongly marked, weird types pontificating on all and sundry. I’m not a big fan of Jewish life for various reasons and think it’s often toxic and dysfunctional, but I do appreciate the characters it produces.

    The important thing is – to not allow oneself to be smothered by a “dull respectability” – or at least, to do it with a wink and a smile 😉

    But look at what I’ve done, went off on a long ramble about nothing instead of addressing your substantive points. I couldn’t stop myself once I got going lol – but I actually think that rather than a minor footnote, you’ve raised an important topic in its own right!

    I’ll respond to your substantive in another comment.

  765. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Anyway, I actually I managed to find it: فيلم محطة الأنس It appears to have been some musical comedy. The song I was I referring to starts at around the 1:19 mark.
     
    The song sounds like a generic movie intro piece. Don’t think it’s a proper full-length song; if it is I have no clue what its name is.

    This composer produces a lot of TV scores in a similar vein to the song you posted:

    https://youtu.be/OOF4semjAJU

    I’m not a fan of this musical style tbh.

    The movie you mentioned is known but not one of the great classics of Egyptian cinema.

    If you’re interested in Egyptian classics this is a good list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_100_Egyptian_films

    I recommend starting with Youssef Chahine; Egypt’s greatest director.

    Some of his movies are available on Netflix with English subtitles. Alexandria, Why? Is my favorite thus far. Djamilah is available on YouTube with English subs. It’s about the Algerian independence. The cinematography is weak though.

    https://youtu.be/TcfEvyl6qmc

    On the whole; I prefer movies from other Arab countries. Not a big fan of the Egyptian style of cinematography. Egypt functions as the Hollywood of the Arab world; so a lot of the movies are designed for mass consumption; they tend to a low level. The few movies coming out of the Levant tend to be of higher artistic quality.

    I recommend watching the works of the Nazarene trio: Hanni Abu Assad, Elia Suleiman, Michel Khleifi. Hani Abu Assad’s Paradise Now is an interesting dive into the world of resistance fighters / terrorists, and is available on Netflix. Elia Suleiman’s movies tend to be on the artsy side; but the dry humor is sophisticated and the cinematography is sublime.

    I’ve only watched one of Michel Khleifi’s works; called Wedding In Galilee. It’s a very good film that would have been even better had the casting been more judicious. It appears that Khleifi went the Robert Bresson route of hiring amateurs instead of real actors; perhaps in the hope of making it seem more realistic. But the technique largely fails; the schlocky acting induces cringe makes things look less realistic. I was however pleased with his decision to hire two hotties to portray the main characters Sumaya and Samira; who rarely for an Arab movie, appeared nude in the film. A very pleasant surprise.


    https://www.workersliberty.org/files/pictures/Galilee.jpg


    All three of these directors are from Nazareth; a laudably artistic town.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    I recommend watching the works of the Nazarene trio: Hanni Abu Assad, Elia Suleiman, Michel Khleifi.

    I’ve watched movies from all three. The two you mentioned (Paradise Now and Wedding in Galilee) and All That Remains by Suleiman.

    I’ve read quite a lot about Israel/Palestine, especially the period leading up to and including the ’48 war. Reading about it is one thing, but since I’ve never been in anything like a wartime situation, I find it hard to imagine what it looked like “on the ground,” so I find it helps to see it depicted on screen. Of the three films mentioned here, only the last deals with the ’48 war. And you’re right about Suleiman: I don’t know what the proper film critic term for it is, but there were parts of that film which, for want of a better word, felt a bit too ‘artsy’ for me, although it didn’t completely ruin my viewing.

    A couple of others I’ve seen related to that theme are Bab al-Shams (2005), whose plot wasn’t particularly gripping but was exactly what I was looking for in terms of depicting the conflict “on the ground.” And the Israeli film House on Chelouche Street (1973), about a family Egyptian Jewish immigrants just before the war – produced by Menahem Golan, one half of the dynamic Golan and Globus duo, who in the 80s produced a tone of redblooded action flicks to help rightwing Americans feel great about their country. It didn’t deal directly with the war, but the threat of it looms in the background as the British are set to pull out, contributing to the characters’ nervous tension. (I thought the actress Michal Bat-Adam, who as on older girl comes onto the main character, was very attractive, more in a ‘cute’ rather than ‘hawt’ way. 8/10. She didn’t age well imo.)

  766. Unofficial RF propaganda dunked on by Actual Westerner

    These boiler room accounts are doing more to undermine any support from the US Right than the entire mainstream Western media.

    We want our lands back, we don’t want Dugin. Get that through your thick skulls.

  767. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @silviosilver
    @AaronB

    Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

    A few words to clear the air before I respond. I'd like you to know that I'm virtually never satisfied with the posts I address to you. Somehow I can never manage to catch myself before hitting the damn "publish comment" button, but afterwards I always feel I've come across as too agitated, too snappy, too dismissive, too much like a simplistic bumpkin incapable of contemplating what has been presented to him, as though I'm outraged someone could hold such an opinion and that it must be eradicated posthaste. That attitude's not at all conducive to an actual discussion, which after all is what I'm here for, so all credit to you for maintaining a civil tone. (If we're keeping score, you're one-up, two-up, hell ten-up on me on that count.) The same is true for my replies to most posters actually, but I think I'm on my worst behavior with you.

    IRL, I'm actually a very easy going guy, nothing at all like the abrasive asshole I can be online. Possibly that's just my imagination, but I interact with a pretty broad sweep of people of all sorts of backgrounds, and IRL if people feel you're jumping down their throat, they either get mad or leave quickly. The fact that they don't - quite the contrary - leads me to believe I'm doing something right. Then again, that's not a skill that came naturally to me. I started out in life with a very fiery temper, which got me into all sorts of bother, and it took some harsh life lessons to get me to change my ways. I suppose that I'm still, after all this time, yet to make the same transition in online interaction.

    Turning to the points you made, I'll try for once not to rush it, and just address my claim of confirmation bias. For the accusation to hold water, obviously there must be plenty of examples of whatever is being "confirmed" - otherwise no examples, no confirmation. The bias relates to ignoring examples which disconfirm the thesis you're propounding. And these, I think, abound. "Aristocrats aspired to lives of refined leisure? Oh that's hogwash" is certainly not what I meant to imply. It's that in addition to their aspirations towards refinement, they were involved in plenty of scheming and plotting - not a crime to call it "striving" - all with a view to improving their social position.

    Is it too much to believe that for many of them these activities took priority? European history (I know nothing of China, but I'll risk assuming the same was true) would have looked nothing like it did were this not the case. It's as though you'd have us believe "the man's a duke, he couldn't possibly be involved in a plot against the king, he's too intoxicated with cultural refinement for anything so worldly." And ought we always to believe that an aristocrat is up to what he claims he is up to, or is a degree of suspicion warranted? A white elite libtard waxes lyrical about diversity, so surely he fills his life with blacks at every opportunity, right? Or perhaps we're just talking past each other.

    Going back to your art theory, similarly, it's not that I believe there's nothing to it. Not at all. I have no doubt it holds true in numerous cases. But not all. Imo, not even in most cases. When it comes to discussing art in any kind of depth, I know very well I'm in over my head, so I normally don't even try. But I've read enough to know there any competing schools of thought out there (and retain some vague idea of what they're saying) to feel confident that you are being too adamant that your explanation holds true in every case. I think you're at a point where you've come up with what you believe is comprehensive philosophy of good living - and as I've said to you before, go ahead, follow your own bliss - and you're trying to shoehorn far too much into it, almost as though you think your philosophy of the good life would fall apart if you didn't.

    Replies: @AaronB, @AaronB, @AaronB

    Ok, so you make a pretty good point about aristocrats, and you’ve brought to light areas that need to be clarified and distinctions that need to be made.

    Of course you’re right that aristocrats were an endlessly scheming, plotting, backstabbing, poisoning, rebelling lot, and of course it was about position and advantage at court and all that. In fact I’d say aristocrats in this sense were more strivy than the bourgeois and were often disgustingly sycophantic and self-abasing in their jockeying for position.

    But this kind of thing is compatible with a life of refined leisure, in fact it’s the sort of “game” one might play freed from the burdens of working for a living and freed from excessive social anxiety 🙂 Aristocrats had a certain baseline security that came with inherited rank and status that significantly reduced the social anxiety that characterized the bourgeois striver.

    So for instance it’s characteristic of a bourgeois striver to anxiously display his success – drive a Mercedes, wear expensive watches, dress more flamboyantly, drop veiled allusions to his wealth and success in conversation, etc – whereas aristocrats cultivated understated elegance – sometimes letting themselves go into what might be called “elegant dishevelment” which a bourgeois would not dare emulate – and a conversational style that featured self-depreciation as it’s trademark.

    It was sort of an “anti-striving” culture in a way – another feature of this anti-striver mentality was the cultivation of a certain languid, relaxed, utterly at ease personal style – visible striving, visible effort, was seen as “”vulgar”. All had to be easy, effortless, relaxed.

    Now, as for labor – freed from the burdens of working for a living, aristocrats played “games”, either hunting, sports, adventuring, duelling, or created salons where sophisticated conversations would last long into the night and all the great wits of the day would attend, patronized art or poetry, and had lavish banquets.

    The point is, the bourgeois mentality of “hard work” for the purpose of accumulating mere money and the sort of sober, plodding, nose to the grindstone advancement through a career, all accompanied by social anxiety and thus insisting on a dull respectability and conformity to convention, was not the aristocratic lifestyle.

    Mind you, I’m not necessarily defending the aristocratic lifestyle – at its worst, it was unbearably artificial, pompous, wasteful, and viciously arrogant and cruel to the lower classes, but at its best it presented certain very attractive features compared to the dull conventionality of bourgeois life.

    To the Greeks, “leisure” was an explicit ideal, celebrated as the highest end of life – for the Chinese likewise, refined leisure was explicitly celebrated as the highest sort of life. Indeed for all pre-bourgouis cultures leisure was the highest form of life and work was not celebrated for its own sake. Modern bourgeois culture is perhaps the first in history to celebrate work and make it into an intrinsic virtue – and this is in fact a massive revolution in human affairs (which in my view must be overturned 🙂 ). All previous cultures celebrated the contemplative life as the highest.

    And it is my belief that the modern celebration of work and disvaluing of the contemplative life is somehow at the very heart of modern nihilism, and that is a very significant fact.

    As a final remark, of course there was also an aristocratic tradition of “service”, often military, and the English aristocracy often provided motivated and self-sacrificing officers and empire-builders to their country – and this was a very attractive thing indeed.

    But this too is a far cry from the kind bourgeois hard work celebration of someone like AP 🙂

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @AaronB

    For a lot of people the thing that separates them from a life of choosing between heating their home and eating decent food is they adopted an ethic of hard work. Life on the dole is for subsistence survival minimum.

    I suppose living off your parents might be better. I used to have a tennis buddy who liked to mock me for serving the man. He lived with his mother who ordered him to get up before noon and was appalled at his lack of character.

    , @Coconuts
    @AaronB


    And it is my belief that the modern celebration of work and disvaluing of the contemplative life is somehow at the very heart of modern nihilism, and that is a very significant fact.
     
    There seems to have been a lot of concern about what the impact of the 'burgherisation' would ultimately be, towards the end of the 19th century and up to WW2, on the left and the right:

    Zola's heroes are very much the products of the century of the city and of the factory, caught in the mantrap and lacerated by it to the bone, to the marrow. The Frenchman of the IIIrd Republic, as a bourgeois, he is no longer truly bourgeois, as a worker any remaining traces of the peasant and the artisan and all values of race and life are dead in him. He is only good for voting and heavy drinking. His daughter will be a prostitute. Beyond alcohol lies insanity and crime. Coupeau's Delerium Tremens is very much the contemporary of the portraits of alcoholic despair produced by bourgeois art at that time in the works of Baudelaire, Verlaine, Rimbaud.
     
    Written in 1940, it looks like not only being applicable to France. The last alcohol phase was maybe the babyboomers and Gen X. Perhaps the insanity stage is being reached at the moment (e.g. Woke). What might the crime stage involve?

    Replies: @AaronB

    , @AP
    @AaronB


    But this kind of thing is compatible with a life of refined leisure [of aristocrats]
     
    You repeat bourgeois fairytales that were used to justify the bourgeois takeover of the Western world. What you described would be considered an embarrassment.

    Consider the Russian Grand Duke Sergei Alexandrovich, who served as Governor of Moscow . He wasn't particularly successful but was hardly living a life of refined leisure. From wiki:

    "was extremely conscientious in carrying out his duties: “Even in the country when he was supposed to be resting," his niece remembered, "he was constantly receiving couriers from Moscow and giving audiences.” He paid much attention to detail, attending personally to matters that could easily have been left to subordinates, punishing corruption and fraud. At times, he would go about the city incognito to see conditions for himself.[31] In private, he and his wife were concerned about the poverty they saw in Moscow and the surrounding countryside, discussing ways to improve it.[32]

    Welfare organizations and charities always attracted Sergei's attention and he became either chairman or patron of scores of them.[33] He was, for example, chairman of the Moscow Society for the Care, Upbringing, and Education of Blind Children; of the Society for Homeless, Neglected Children, and Convicted Adolescents; and the Moscow Department of the Russian Department Society of National Health Protection.[33]

    How many hours a week you figure was was busy in service to others? Much more the typical modern bourgeois.

    And it was similar as one goes further down, with regional governors, mayors of cities, owners of estates. One of my relatives managed a village that he owned, was also a physician, a poet, and was also a mayor of the local regional capital (now in SE Poland) where under his tenure he modernized all the city's infrastructure.

    And then look at noblemen such as Pilsudski, Hrushevsky, the Baltic Germans Barons who played a large role in running Russia, the Prussian Junkers (was Hindenburg who worked until his death leading a life of lazy refined leisure?), etc. etc.

    Don't attribute your own personal laziness to entire classes of people or equate being productive to "bourgeois values" or given the bourgeois a monopoly on hard work.

    And it is my belief that the modern celebration of work and disvaluing of the contemplative life
     
    Or, you are a lazy parasite who claims that work and contemplation must be opposed to one another as an excuse for taking the fruits of your parents' labor and refusing to be a productive person.

    As a final remark, of course there was also an aristocratic tradition of “service”
     
    You pretend that it was not central, and that they did not work hard.

    But they worked just as hard if not more so than modern bourgeois. The legacy of beauty and power of the Western world was the result of hard work by the nobility. They organized and funded conservatories, gave their lives in battle, immersed themselves in scholarly works, built educational networks, explored the world, ran and modernized cities and provinces, etc.

    To the Greeks, “leisure” was an explicit ideal
     
    Correct, and this differentiated Christendom from the Classical Greeks right away and sharply differentiated Christian aristocrats from Classical Greeks.
  768. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @silviosilver
    @AaronB

    Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

    A few words to clear the air before I respond. I'd like you to know that I'm virtually never satisfied with the posts I address to you. Somehow I can never manage to catch myself before hitting the damn "publish comment" button, but afterwards I always feel I've come across as too agitated, too snappy, too dismissive, too much like a simplistic bumpkin incapable of contemplating what has been presented to him, as though I'm outraged someone could hold such an opinion and that it must be eradicated posthaste. That attitude's not at all conducive to an actual discussion, which after all is what I'm here for, so all credit to you for maintaining a civil tone. (If we're keeping score, you're one-up, two-up, hell ten-up on me on that count.) The same is true for my replies to most posters actually, but I think I'm on my worst behavior with you.

    IRL, I'm actually a very easy going guy, nothing at all like the abrasive asshole I can be online. Possibly that's just my imagination, but I interact with a pretty broad sweep of people of all sorts of backgrounds, and IRL if people feel you're jumping down their throat, they either get mad or leave quickly. The fact that they don't - quite the contrary - leads me to believe I'm doing something right. Then again, that's not a skill that came naturally to me. I started out in life with a very fiery temper, which got me into all sorts of bother, and it took some harsh life lessons to get me to change my ways. I suppose that I'm still, after all this time, yet to make the same transition in online interaction.

    Turning to the points you made, I'll try for once not to rush it, and just address my claim of confirmation bias. For the accusation to hold water, obviously there must be plenty of examples of whatever is being "confirmed" - otherwise no examples, no confirmation. The bias relates to ignoring examples which disconfirm the thesis you're propounding. And these, I think, abound. "Aristocrats aspired to lives of refined leisure? Oh that's hogwash" is certainly not what I meant to imply. It's that in addition to their aspirations towards refinement, they were involved in plenty of scheming and plotting - not a crime to call it "striving" - all with a view to improving their social position.

    Is it too much to believe that for many of them these activities took priority? European history (I know nothing of China, but I'll risk assuming the same was true) would have looked nothing like it did were this not the case. It's as though you'd have us believe "the man's a duke, he couldn't possibly be involved in a plot against the king, he's too intoxicated with cultural refinement for anything so worldly." And ought we always to believe that an aristocrat is up to what he claims he is up to, or is a degree of suspicion warranted? A white elite libtard waxes lyrical about diversity, so surely he fills his life with blacks at every opportunity, right? Or perhaps we're just talking past each other.

    Going back to your art theory, similarly, it's not that I believe there's nothing to it. Not at all. I have no doubt it holds true in numerous cases. But not all. Imo, not even in most cases. When it comes to discussing art in any kind of depth, I know very well I'm in over my head, so I normally don't even try. But I've read enough to know there any competing schools of thought out there (and retain some vague idea of what they're saying) to feel confident that you are being too adamant that your explanation holds true in every case. I think you're at a point where you've come up with what you believe is comprehensive philosophy of good living - and as I've said to you before, go ahead, follow your own bliss - and you're trying to shoehorn far too much into it, almost as though you think your philosophy of the good life would fall apart if you didn't.

    Replies: @AaronB, @AaronB, @AaronB

    As for art, well, what would an art that didn’t deal in the ideal, the possible, that didn’t point to something beyond actually existing conditions, look like?

    Well, it would be a photograph, or a facsimile 🙂

    And not those carefully curated photographs that do constitute art of a sort – but precisely because what they depict is highly selected and curated and not merely “what’s there”.

    Think of two houses – one a concrete block, one an ornate Gothic pile. It seems to me indisputable that the Gothic pile – which is an attempt to incorporate “beauty” – integrates completely unnecessary elements into it that play no function, and thus point to something “beyond”.

    What would an art “celebrating” the actual look like? Even art that seeks to glorify a battle, or a king, is highly selective in what it depicts, and depicts a sort of “ideal” battle or king, with many “realistic” elements left out.

    And that is because the actual world is always less than ideal – unless you’re prepared to deny this, as Dmitry thinks AP is doing.

    Which begs the question – if the world was one of ideal perfection, would art even exist, or would the world itself be the work of art?

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @AaronB


    As for art, well, what would an art that didn’t deal in the ideal, the possible, that didn’t point to something beyond actually existing conditions, look like?
     
    It would look like the modernist and postmodernist monstrosities which inspire, at best, puzzlement and, often enough, outright disgust. It is ironic that art which is supposed to "challenge" us and "shatter conventionality" drives the common man to cling more tightly to bourgeois values than ever. Not that he necessarily announces this; rebuked for his impertinence in questioning the aesthetic value of the pile of trash that has been presented to him as "art," he quietly withdraws and surrenders the domain, and busies himself cultivating those behaviors most conducive to the pursuit of economic ends.

    What would an art “celebrating” the actual look like? Even art that seeks to glorify a battle, or a king, is highly selective in what it depicts, and depicts a sort of “ideal” battle or king, with many “realistic” elements left out.
     
    You say "even art that seeks to glorify..." as though such art were exceptional rather than commonplace. But I'm glad it's you rather than I who brought up this example, because as far as I can make out, it poses an insurmountable problem for your oppositional theory of art. Wouldn't your theory claim the artist depicting that battles wishes it had never taken place? Or that the civilization that made such a battle possible had never existed? Why not? Once you posit intrinsic oppositional motivation as the catch-all explanation, why arbitrarily stop at one level of opposition?

    In fact, it seems it shouldn't matter what elements of the battle the artist selected, or indeed whether he selected a battle or a bowl of fruit, since for you the explanation always reduces to one thing: the artist despises civilization and is merely using art as a means of convincing people to abandon civilization and pursue the contemplative life - retreat to the mountains and look at waterfalls all day, and become, like the animals, reliant solely upon the bounty of nature for one's sustenance. (I'm getting histrionic again, but the conclusion seems unavoidable if everyone were to follow your lead.)

    Replies: @AaronB

  769. RF unofficial and even some official propaganda loves “Russophobia” (homophobia) and “Russian Lives Matter” (Black). Pale appropriation of the worst Western tropes.

    No one in the West will ever take this at face value, because no one seriously thinks that RF is a Jewish Asiatic Neo-Soviet state, only Azov stans would really think this way.

    Some would call this “slave morality”. And they would be right.

  770. https://twitter.com/Nikol_ovich/status/1616993271971979264

    We are not allowed to get deportations because advocacy is de-jure and de-facto illegal. And every time that RF official and unofficial propaganda claims that Third World poverty is because of Western colonialism and greed, our inviolable rights of Self-Determination are trampled upon.

    Muslims literally have entire cities that are closed to Non-Muslims, they have entire countries were Non-Muslims cannot construct religious buildings.

    And yet we have to appease their feelings, not just to satisfy the feelings of Western liberals, but also of illiberal RF.

    NO

    We want our lands back.

  771. Sher Singh says:
    @Another Polish Perspective
    @Ivashka the fool

    Well, in Poland we call people like you Wielkorus; all Slavdom is for you in some way Russian. It may also explain why you look for continuity everywhere. You are just smaller version of Pan-Serbian Odyssey, since you limit your claims to Slavs only. But you were so long in America that you seem sincerely believe in melting pot theory! Well, here in Europe we have never believed this: this is why we had so many wars and states etc.


    But of course there was a continuity, it’s just that they integrated various non – Indo-European cultural influences.
     
    Looking for continuation is a scourge of prehistory, which, I was told once, came from politics. If you could show "your" people were somewhere in bygone times, you could claim the land where you found the remnants! It is what German archaeology was doing pre-WWII and WWII, not just in reference to the East but the West too. But others started to follow in their steps after 1945.
    Unfortunately, it is very easy to claim continuation in prehistory - you just have to found respective ceramics and then you can claim at least some "admixture".

    Looking at closer history, eg. Mongol invasion of Rusia or Manchu invasion of China, we see that invaders try to live in some kind of Apartheid. Manchu had parallel institutions for themselves in China (like their own army) and their own quotas in administration. Something like that suggests discontinuation after conquest, not a melting pot, at least in the short- and medium term. Moreover, some degree of genetic continuity (of the Chinese and the Muscovy) is not tantamount to cultural continuity of the entire society. So really we should look for high degree of cultural continuity as a confirmation of substantial genetic continuity, not vice versa.

    As a counterpoint to your thesis, Unetice culture seems to be a genetic continuation of Globular Amphorae Culture which is decisively non-Indo-Europan. Unetice also seems to be genetic and cultural kin of Cucuteni-Trypillia culture, especially in their love for living in crowded settlements of longhouses (or other shared houses). This love for crowd I find decidedly un-Slavic. That are pre-cities, not villages.

    All that forgets the problem that there was some male population exchange in East & Central Europe at least, since the female population of these regions is genetically older than its male population. That suggests either armed invasion, or resettlement after a plague (maybe the second, judging from Cucuteni-Trypillia custom of burning their own houses, probably an answer to plague as a primitive form of dezinfection) .

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burned_house_horizon

    The current research is decidedly focused on finding continuity, though. Look for example at this article:

    https://scienceinpoland.pap.pl/en/node/82059

    The title says: Bronze Age DNA Shows Direct Genetic Link to Current Inhabitants of Southern Poland

    Great! Continuity!

    However, in the article itself we find:

    . It has now turned out that communities several hundred years younger (the Mierzanowice and Trzcinies cultures) exhibit genetic continuity (associated with the Corded Ware culture) present in the female lines.


    So it was all about female lines...?! Why there are specifically interested in them anyway?!Not a word in article why there is apparent discontinuity in Y-DNA. Of course, the research was set up since they investigated only female-transferred DNA... but well, why?

    Later we find:
    According to Dr. Juras, the population associated with the Strzyżów culture has genetically most in common with steppe communities.

    The descendants of people associated with the Strzyżów culture could have come to the lands of present-day south-eastern Poland with the first migration from the steppe during the late Neolithic. But they formed an isolated population that developed independently of the Corded Ware culture community.

    So now we get admission that all people were Corded Ware (remember, the use of word "associated" aka "admixture") but not really Corded Ware. So steppe people were not really behind Corded Ware...?!!!! Uff, ufff I am getting a headache, as usually when reading some paper with agenda, which here is (1) Corded ware are steppe people, (2) there is matrilineal continuity, (3) that matrilineal continuity is observed among Corded Ware descendants.

    I am always alarmed by these matrilineal continuity claims as it suggests cousin marriage/endogamy which again suggests non-steppe people, which seems to be a hidden point of the article as they admit on one point that the only not-really-Corded Ware culture is the most steppe one. Uff! Something is definitely fuzzy about this article. You may understand now why prehistory is not my favourite part of history.

    That there is something someone wants to hide is clear from the misleading title anyway.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Sher Singh

    Looking for continuation is a scourge of prehistory, which, I was told once, came from politics. If you could show “your” people were somewhere in bygone times, you could claim the land where you found the remnants!

    Excellent point & explains a lot of the everything was Germanic/Nordic theories.

    Thanks!

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @Sher Singh

    German Aryanism and Pan-Germanism from the late 19th and early 20th centuries is like a whole mythology. They made quite a great story out of it.

    Possibly some of the anti-Enlightenment and Folkish thinkers the Woke draw on were also part of the inspiration for it, so the continued influence of wokeness will mean attention keeps getting drawn back to it.

  772. @Greasy William
    I don't think some people understand just how dark Russia's strategic situation is. Here are two factors I've finally come to realize in the last few days after earlier believing that Russia was in decent shape:

    1. Ukraine has essentially unlimited manpower to tap should it prove necessary. Ultimately, Ukraine has 5 million guys it can mobilize if it needs to. More still if it makes heavy use of women in non combat roles. And more further still when considering mercenaries and foreign "advisors". There is ZERO possibility of Russia winning this war through attrition

    2. Even if the US were to totally end all aid to Ukraine, and I don't see that happening, Europe + Canada + UK can easily fill the gap. This is true even if there is a global financial crisis (as I believe there will be). It's just that the economic resources available to the West are so incredibly huge that it is able to outproduce Russia by using only a fraction of its (the West's) GDP.

    The only way Russia could be bailed out now is if the financial crisis that is set to begin in May is so severe that it politically roils the West to the point that the West is unable, or unwilling, to provide Ukraine with sufficient arms and funds to continue fighting. Now I could see there maybe being a situation where the West doesn't supply Ukraine with enough to drive Russia out of Ukraine, but I really cannot think of any scenario where the West doesn't continue to provide Ukraine with enough to prevent full Russian conquest.


    So right now, I can't see Russia winning. Even if Russia got its act together and fully mobilized, I don't think that will be enough. And if the front line gets stalemated, I definitely would expect Western backed Ukraine to defeat Russia in a "war of the missiles" once the West has had the chance to properly arm the Ukrainians. The longer this thing goes on, the worse it is going to get for Russia.

    I don't believe the West will allow Ukraine to retake Crimea or the far eastern regions of the Ukraine that Russia had pre invasion, but I do think that ultimately Russia is going to lose all of it's other gains from this operation.

    Right now, I'm thinking this most likely ends with a return to Feb '21 borders and Putin stepping down (the only good thing to come from this madness).

    What a fiasco.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @QCIC, @Wokechoke

    Thank you, I’d grown tired of scrolling past all the obscure race/ethnic based comments.

    MEN DON’T MAKE POTTERY SO STFU ABOUT IT

  773. @LatW
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Which Strugackis books were most popular in USSR, and which are now in Russia and Ukraine respectively..?
     
    Sci-fi is not really my cup of tea, so I can't be of help here, I'm afraid. Bashi might know this much better.

    I just know that Arestovych has some kind of a self-development school (he calls it "school of thinking") and a part of that he published some videos where he discusses Strugatsky's works ("Hard to be a God" and a few others). It looks like he's trying to use some of the insights he has drawn from those titles into his own archeo-futuristic musings. Of course, Stalker was known among sci-fi fans in the Baltics (it was filmed in Tallinn, Estonia).

    Btw, regarding the above discussion about Wends. Yes, it is true that some Russians use these theories to claim that they have a right to space in Central Europe. Also, Russian Rodnovers idealize the island of Rugen. Even though this is essentially heritage of Western Slavs, their distant relatives. I usually dismiss these theories, but Bashi wrote about it quite compellingly and it inspires imagination.

    However, we do know for a fact that the so called Texas Wends are Sorbs (even if Germanized). Wends are simply Lechitic Slavs.

    Replies: @songbird, @Another Polish Perspective

    However, we do know for a fact that the so called Texas Wends are Sorbs (even if Germanized)

    Latw, you have burst my bubble. I thought this guy was talking about real Wends:

    [MORE]

    The melodies which were sung had a striking resemblance to those of the Wendish nations. This is one of the many features of similarity which strike me between those nations and the Irish. Both manufacture, and have an exclusive taste for, spirit distilled from corn; both live almost entirely on potatoes; both have the bagpipe; both are passionate lovers of singing and dancing, and yet their national airs are of a melancholy character; both are oppressed by a foreign nation, and speak a gradually expiring language, which is rich and poetical, though possessed of no literature; both honour the descendants of their ancient princes, and cherish the principle that what is not renounced is not utterly lost; both are superstitious, cunning, and greatly given to exaggeration; rebellious where they can, but somewhat cringing to decided and established power; both like to go ragged, even when they have the means of dressing better; and lastly, spite of their miserable living, both are capable of great exertion, though they prefer indolence and loitering; and both alike enjoy a fertile soil, which the Wendish phrase calls “the roast meat of poor people.” The better qualities which distinguish the Irish are theirs alone.

    Tour in England, Ireland, and France, in the years 1826, 1827, 1828 and 1829.
    Fürst von Hermann Pückler-Muskau
    https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/46223/pg46223-images.html#LETTER_XXXVIII

    • Replies: @LatW
    @songbird

    Have you heard of the Celtic bear goddess Artio?

    There is a bear statue on Mount Sleza in Poland (on Czech border) that apparently dates back to 400BC and could be Celtic (La Tène culture). It must be those ancestors of Wends that Bashi is talking about.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/Poland_mount_Sleza_-_ancient_cult_figure.jpg

    In Balkans

    https://balkancelts.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/arm.jpg

    Replies: @LatW, @Another Polish Perspective

  774. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @Mikel
    @AP


    It is no wonder that the person with whom he has the least contentious interactions is the materialist atheist Mikel
     
    No, it has nothing to do with my involuntary atheism/existentialism. It's just that we share the same passion for the natural landscapes of the US West (not a very materialistic thing to feel the same calling for). That makes me overlook the many differences that we have and actually wonder what else we may have in common. I guess I would regard his posts in a totally different light if he was as indifferent to natural beauty as Silviosilver is. But I would still find him interesting to read, as I do Silviosilver. I also admire his ability to be constantly reading a tremendous amount of profound, intellectually demanding books. I doubt you would be debating him yourself if you didn't find his opinions challenging enough to spend your time on.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @AaronB

    Actually, I’d say no true atheist/materialist would have a passion for nature like you do 🙂

    You have a beliefless, wordless religion – which is probably really the best kind.

  775. https://twitter.com/PeImeniPusha/status/1616947988043288577

    Kadyrov ethnically cleansed Slavs out of his ethnostate. But its more offensive to this boiler room account (pretending to be a Jewish Communist) that his feelings were hurt because of a peaceful protest in a Western land.

    All RF propaganda is the worst, it is legions behind what Ukraine does.

    Why is it so hard to acknowledge that Western conservatives have the rights of Self-Determination?

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @216


    America is a country of roughly three hundred million people in a world that is around nine billion people, give or take. That is three percent of the global population, but responsible for at least half the war mongering in the world.

    If we add in the population of Europe, then we get to roughly 13% of the global population. It is reasonable to wonder if the rest of the world is going to continue to tolerate this 13% of the population being responsible for over half of the wars in the world.
     
    https://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=28874
    https://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=29113

    Why is it so hard to acknowledge that Western conservatives have the rights of Self-Determination?
     
    No one recognizes the powerless.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  776. There are no Anti-Imperalists, there are simply just Anti-White Racists

  777. @Greasy William
    I don't think some people understand just how dark Russia's strategic situation is. Here are two factors I've finally come to realize in the last few days after earlier believing that Russia was in decent shape:

    1. Ukraine has essentially unlimited manpower to tap should it prove necessary. Ultimately, Ukraine has 5 million guys it can mobilize if it needs to. More still if it makes heavy use of women in non combat roles. And more further still when considering mercenaries and foreign "advisors". There is ZERO possibility of Russia winning this war through attrition

    2. Even if the US were to totally end all aid to Ukraine, and I don't see that happening, Europe + Canada + UK can easily fill the gap. This is true even if there is a global financial crisis (as I believe there will be). It's just that the economic resources available to the West are so incredibly huge that it is able to outproduce Russia by using only a fraction of its (the West's) GDP.

    The only way Russia could be bailed out now is if the financial crisis that is set to begin in May is so severe that it politically roils the West to the point that the West is unable, or unwilling, to provide Ukraine with sufficient arms and funds to continue fighting. Now I could see there maybe being a situation where the West doesn't supply Ukraine with enough to drive Russia out of Ukraine, but I really cannot think of any scenario where the West doesn't continue to provide Ukraine with enough to prevent full Russian conquest.


    So right now, I can't see Russia winning. Even if Russia got its act together and fully mobilized, I don't think that will be enough. And if the front line gets stalemated, I definitely would expect Western backed Ukraine to defeat Russia in a "war of the missiles" once the West has had the chance to properly arm the Ukrainians. The longer this thing goes on, the worse it is going to get for Russia.

    I don't believe the West will allow Ukraine to retake Crimea or the far eastern regions of the Ukraine that Russia had pre invasion, but I do think that ultimately Russia is going to lose all of it's other gains from this operation.

    Right now, I'm thinking this most likely ends with a return to Feb '21 borders and Putin stepping down (the only good thing to come from this madness).

    What a fiasco.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @QCIC, @Wokechoke

    Untrained manpower is not very effective against cluster bombs.

    +++

    These “Russia is fvkd” scenarios seem to assume she will keep playing with the gloves on.

    Why do you assume that? The gloves are apparently on by choice and not as a result of external military pressure.

    +++

    My current speculation is different from the MacGregor/Ritter idea of waiting for the ground to freeze. I think Russia will wait until Spring is close, then disable pipelines, rail lines, highways and runways connecting Ukraine to the West. So far these targets seem to have only been attacked on a limited basis. Without fuel or resupply for Ukraine, the work for the Russian forces will go faster. Waiting avoids having too many civilians freezing and starving to death.

    I assume the longer the West prolongs the inevitable, the more Russia emotionally accepts that post-SMO Ukraine will be a bombed out wasteland.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @QCIC


    Why do you assume that?
     
    What else can Russia do short of nukes?

    Untrained manpower is not very effective against cluster bombs.
     
    The Soviets did a hell of a lot with untrained manpower in WWII. As time goes on, Ukraine is going to be able to train and arm guys at a faster rate.

    Replies: @QCIC, @Beckow

  778. @songbird
    @LatW


    However, we do know for a fact that the so called Texas Wends are Sorbs (even if Germanized)
     
    Latw, you have burst my bubble. I thought this guy was talking about real Wends:

    The melodies which were sung had a striking resemblance to those of the Wendish nations. This is one of the many features of similarity which strike me between those nations and the Irish. Both manufacture, and have an exclusive taste for, spirit distilled from corn; both live almost entirely on potatoes; both have the bagpipe; both are passionate lovers of singing and dancing, and yet their national airs are of a melancholy character; both are oppressed by a foreign nation, and speak a gradually expiring language, which is rich and poetical, though possessed of no literature; both honour the descendants of their ancient princes, and cherish the principle that what is not renounced is not utterly lost; both are superstitious, cunning, and greatly given to exaggeration; rebellious where they can, but somewhat cringing to decided and established power; both like to go ragged, even when they have the means of dressing better; and lastly, spite of their miserable living, both are capable of great exertion, though they prefer indolence and loitering; and both alike enjoy a fertile soil, which the Wendish phrase calls “the roast meat of poor people.” The better qualities which distinguish the Irish are theirs alone.
     
    Tour in England, Ireland, and France, in the years 1826, 1827, 1828 and 1829.
    Fürst von Hermann Pückler-Muskau
    https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/46223/pg46223-images.html#LETTER_XXXVIII

    Replies: @LatW

    Have you heard of the Celtic bear goddess Artio?

    There is a bear statue on Mount Sleza in Poland (on Czech border) that apparently dates back to 400BC and could be Celtic (La Tène culture). It must be those ancestors of Wends that Bashi is talking about.

    In Balkans

    • Thanks: songbird
    • Replies: @LatW
    @LatW

    Sorry, the bottom ones are from Ireland. But they do look a bit like the one on top.

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @LatW

    Ślęża is not really on Czech border, it is closer to Wrocław (Breslau) than to Czech border. A mountain which is on the Polish-Czech border, is, for example, Śnieżnik, or Śnieżka.

    But it is true that Ślęża is supposed to have been some sacred pagan mountain. Andrzej Sapkowski in his Husitic trilogy depicted it as such too ;)

  779. @LatW
    @songbird

    Have you heard of the Celtic bear goddess Artio?

    There is a bear statue on Mount Sleza in Poland (on Czech border) that apparently dates back to 400BC and could be Celtic (La Tène culture). It must be those ancestors of Wends that Bashi is talking about.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/Poland_mount_Sleza_-_ancient_cult_figure.jpg

    In Balkans

    https://balkancelts.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/arm.jpg

    Replies: @LatW, @Another Polish Perspective

    Sorry, the bottom ones are from Ireland. But they do look a bit like the one on top.

  780. @AaronB
    @silviosilver

    As for art, well, what would an art that didn't deal in the ideal, the possible, that didn't point to something beyond actually existing conditions, look like?

    Well, it would be a photograph, or a facsimile :)

    And not those carefully curated photographs that do constitute art of a sort - but precisely because what they depict is highly selected and curated and not merely "what's there".

    Think of two houses - one a concrete block, one an ornate Gothic pile. It seems to me indisputable that the Gothic pile - which is an attempt to incorporate "beauty" - integrates completely unnecessary elements into it that play no function, and thus point to something "beyond".

    What would an art "celebrating" the actual look like? Even art that seeks to glorify a battle, or a king, is highly selective in what it depicts, and depicts a sort of "ideal" battle or king, with many "realistic" elements left out.

    And that is because the actual world is always less than ideal - unless you're prepared to deny this, as Dmitry thinks AP is doing.

    Which begs the question - if the world was one of ideal perfection, would art even exist, or would the world itself be the work of art?

    Replies: @silviosilver

    As for art, well, what would an art that didn’t deal in the ideal, the possible, that didn’t point to something beyond actually existing conditions, look like?

    It would look like the modernist and postmodernist monstrosities which inspire, at best, puzzlement and, often enough, outright disgust. It is ironic that art which is supposed to “challenge” us and “shatter conventionality” drives the common man to cling more tightly to bourgeois values than ever. Not that he necessarily announces this; rebuked for his impertinence in questioning the aesthetic value of the pile of trash that has been presented to him as “art,” he quietly withdraws and surrenders the domain, and busies himself cultivating those behaviors most conducive to the pursuit of economic ends.

    What would an art “celebrating” the actual look like? Even art that seeks to glorify a battle, or a king, is highly selective in what it depicts, and depicts a sort of “ideal” battle or king, with many “realistic” elements left out.

    You say “even art that seeks to glorify…” as though such art were exceptional rather than commonplace. But I’m glad it’s you rather than I who brought up this example, because as far as I can make out, it poses an insurmountable problem for your oppositional theory of art. Wouldn’t your theory claim the artist depicting that battles wishes it had never taken place? Or that the civilization that made such a battle possible had never existed? Why not? Once you posit intrinsic oppositional motivation as the catch-all explanation, why arbitrarily stop at one level of opposition?

    In fact, it seems it shouldn’t matter what elements of the battle the artist selected, or indeed whether he selected a battle or a bowl of fruit, since for you the explanation always reduces to one thing: the artist despises civilization and is merely using art as a means of convincing people to abandon civilization and pursue the contemplative life – retreat to the mountains and look at waterfalls all day, and become, like the animals, reliant solely upon the bounty of nature for one’s sustenance. (I’m getting histrionic again, but the conclusion seems unavoidable if everyone were to follow your lead.)

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @silviosilver


    It would look like the modernist and postmodernist monstrosities which inspire, at best, puzzlement and, often enough, outright disgust
     
    Exactly :)

    The death of art in the West was born of the spirit of "realism" which eventually took over all areas of culture.

    Modern art attempts to "shock" you not by showing you an idealized realm of beauty and perfection - but by showing you the ugliest aspects of reality.

    It is precisely a protest against the ideal.

    In its way, it too is selective - it selects the worst aspects of reality as somehow characteristic.

    Art is supposed to challenge your complacency in the face of imperfection - modern art "challenges" you to see the worst aspects of reality.

    It is part and parcel of that entire spiritual movement that began as "realism", and "neutrality", and "objectivity", and "scientific fact" - supposedly, it was an attempt to see the "unvarnished " truth about life, but as I told Mikel on the other thread, in reality "objectivity" is in practice a set of distinct and powerful cognitive biases of its own, insofar as it automatically discounts beauty or the ideal as at a possible aspect of reality.

    So "objectivity" in practice starts with a cognitive bias - beauty and the ideal are not in any sense part of reality, therefore only the ugly is "true". So objectivity searches for the ugly.

    But of course, perhaps beauty and the ideal are more real than what we see, or an aspect of reality - but to believe that, you can't take as your starting point - an unproven assumption - that only what is materially visible belongs to reality.

    Exact parallels can be found with our philosophies - Darwinism tells us that only strife and competition are really true, etc, because true reality must be ugly.

    As songbird was complaining about earlier, the Medieval era is depicted in movies as relentlessly gray and ugly because our starting point is a cognitive bias that the most characteristic thing about unvarnished reality is it's ugliness, and Medieval times were less technologically advanced than ours and so closer to unvarnished reality. Yet we know from paintings and historical records that even though there was much dirt, the Medieval era was a festive riot of color, paegentry, ornament, decoration, and beauty, especially among the nobility and the chivalric orders.

    So too it is with our architecture - we build utilitarian boxes because ornament is somehow a "lie".

    And that is why poetry died too - we want "truth", and poetry is a "lie".

    Modern art is what you get when you relentlessly focus on the factual and discount the ideal and the imaginative - but since true neutrality is impossible, it can only assure itself that it has eliminated the ideal by searching for it's opposite, ugliness, the worst aspects of the real.

    So - the drive to eliminate the ideal and grasp the actual inevitably develops into a bias to search for ugliness, because only in the presence of the worst can be assured you've cured yourself of the desire for the ideal.

    You say “even art that seeks to glorify…” as though such art were exceptional rather than commonplace. But I’m glad it’s you rather than I who brought up this example, because as far as I can make out, it poses an insurmountable problem for your oppositional theory of art. Wouldn’t your theory claim the artist depicting that battles wishes it had never taken place? Or that the civilization that made such a battle possible had never existed? Why not? Once you posit intrinsic oppositional motivation as the catch-all explanation, why arbitrarily stop at one level of opposition?
     
    Not necessarily. But you're bringing up really good areas that need clarification and elaboration.

    "Oppositional" merely indicates that it is in some sense opposed to facts as they are materially visible to our senses on their own. In that sense, "glorifying" a battle means adding a dimension of perfection and idealism to it, and subtracting the less ideal aspects, to create a highly selective vision.

    A battle as it should be as it approaches the ideal, without cowardice, full of noble heros and valiant warriors, great kings and princes, performing noble deeds of courage and showing magnanimity to defeated foes, without the low, the craven, the weak and ugly, the treacherous and the backstabbing, the muck and the mire. There is an idealistic moral dimension to the depiction as well. (The ugly elements may be included in a minor key to offset the splendor of our side as we would like to imagine ourselves, minus all our frailties and imperfections)

    In that sense, a true artist always creates in opposition to existing conditions.

    But you know what? It just occurred to me that the source of our confusion here is that you are taking me to mean that an artist creates in opposition to the professed values of his society - but I only mean he is always creating in opposition to his actual society.

    To return to Bach, I would freely admit he was creating out of an effort to fulfill the professed values of his society, which were Christian, but that simultaneously implied a criticism of his actual society, which fell woefully short of Christian ideals.

    To take the example of a non-Christian warrior society, an artist may seek to depict an idealized version of it's professed values - every man a courageous and magnanimous fighter who never runs from a battle and is surpassingly skilled and strong - but since human reality is composed of cowards and the treacherous and the weak, this will be an implied criticism of how his society actually is at the same time.

    In a nutshell, since a society always falls short of its own ideal - unless it sets the bar really low - and the artists task is to depict the ideal, the artist is always creating in opposition to existing conditions on one level while exhorting his society to rise to it's own vision of itself.

    And the more lofty the ideal, the greater this gap is. While even a warrior society has an idealistic moral dimension, Christianity is one of the loftiest ideals humanity has ever conceived, and the gap between it's ideal and actually existing European society will be particularly large, and the creations of an artist in a Christian society will be in particular tension with his actual society.

    In fact, it seems it shouldn’t matter what elements of the battle the artist selected, or indeed whether he selected a battle or a bowl of fruit, since for you the explanation always reduces to one thing: the artist despises civilization and is merely using art as a means of convincing people to abandon civilization and pursue the contemplative life – retreat to the mountains and look at waterfalls all day, and become, like the animals, reliant solely upon the bounty of nature for one’s sustenance.
     
    No, no, no :) But I now see where the confusion lies.

    By "civilization" I meant that set of accomodations, practices, and compromises a society enacts in order to accumulate wealth and power, which, since we live in a corrupted world, leads to compromises with the ideal.

    A noble warrior who never stoops to treachery is not best suited to make his society as rich and powerful as possible and advance the cause of complex civilization. Indeed, the early history of the British in India is one of base treachery as they gobbled up provinces through deceit, such that the Indian "nabobs" were often shunned as moral lepers back in "decent" British society when they returned home hoping to capitalize on their riches.

    But it certainly advanced the cause of British civilization :)

    Replies: @AaronB

  781. @QCIC
    @Greasy William

    Untrained manpower is not very effective against cluster bombs.

    +++

    These "Russia is fvkd" scenarios seem to assume she will keep playing with the gloves on.

    Why do you assume that? The gloves are apparently on by choice and not as a result of external military pressure.

    +++

    My current speculation is different from the MacGregor/Ritter idea of waiting for the ground to freeze. I think Russia will wait until Spring is close, then disable pipelines, rail lines, highways and runways connecting Ukraine to the West. So far these targets seem to have only been attacked on a limited basis. Without fuel or resupply for Ukraine, the work for the Russian forces will go faster. Waiting avoids having too many civilians freezing and starving to death.

    I assume the longer the West prolongs the inevitable, the more Russia emotionally accepts that post-SMO Ukraine will be a bombed out wasteland.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    Why do you assume that?

    What else can Russia do short of nukes?

    Untrained manpower is not very effective against cluster bombs.

    The Soviets did a hell of a lot with untrained manpower in WWII. As time goes on, Ukraine is going to be able to train and arm guys at a faster rate.

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Greasy William

    Heavy bombing instead of the limited airstrikes employed so far.

    , @Beckow
    @Greasy William


    ...untrained manpower in WWII
     
    A very different current situation: borders are open, families are small, there is more information. No advanced country can expend manpower for too long - that's why Nato is staying out.

    Washington hopes that the above manpower dilemmas will apply to Russia first. Some of it will, but Russia has much better numbers and that matters. Kiev can theoretically assemble a 10-million army, but they are simply not in a position to do it. Most likely the willingness to die will peter out and only a core group will continue to fight. When morale breaks - and it will - it happens suddenly and is unstoppable. So whose morale will break first?

    Replies: @QCIC

  782. Sher Singh says:
    @216
    https://twitter.com/PeImeniPusha/status/1616947988043288577

    Kadyrov ethnically cleansed Slavs out of his ethnostate. But its more offensive to this boiler room account (pretending to be a Jewish Communist) that his feelings were hurt because of a peaceful protest in a Western land.

    All RF propaganda is the worst, it is legions behind what Ukraine does.

    Why is it so hard to acknowledge that Western conservatives have the rights of Self-Determination?

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    America is a country of roughly three hundred million people in a world that is around nine billion people, give or take. That is three percent of the global population, but responsible for at least half the war mongering in the world.

    If we add in the population of Europe, then we get to roughly 13% of the global population. It is reasonable to wonder if the rest of the world is going to continue to tolerate this 13% of the population being responsible for over half of the wars in the world.

    https://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=28874
    https://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=29113

    Why is it so hard to acknowledge that Western conservatives have the rights of Self-Determination?

    No one recognizes the powerless.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Sher Singh

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/787635978746986496/1018763649713704970/unknown.png

    You're also a fucking perv/faggot.

    Get rekt nigger faggot - put that on your pronouns.

  783. @Sher Singh
    @216


    America is a country of roughly three hundred million people in a world that is around nine billion people, give or take. That is three percent of the global population, but responsible for at least half the war mongering in the world.

    If we add in the population of Europe, then we get to roughly 13% of the global population. It is reasonable to wonder if the rest of the world is going to continue to tolerate this 13% of the population being responsible for over half of the wars in the world.
     
    https://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=28874
    https://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=29113

    Why is it so hard to acknowledge that Western conservatives have the rights of Self-Determination?
     
    No one recognizes the powerless.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    You’re also a fucking perv/faggot.

    Get rekt nigger faggot – put that on your pronouns.

  784. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @LatW
    @AaronB


    But at least you seem to agree that at least at some point in life, there are more important things than the social game. That’s good.
     
    By social game, you mean the family and work relationships, as well as social life? Are children included in your picture?

    It sometimes feels like you are promoting MGTOW, which, in and of itself, on surface, may not seem like a harmful idea, certainly, one wouldn't want to oppress anyone, right? But in reality this can seriously destabilize things.

    I'm also not entirely sure one has to reach old age or to even become an hermit to experience spiritual insights.

    Thanks for the example of the Japanese mountain priests, I like that very much.
     
    Yes, I liked it very much as well, it is similar to my ancestral religion. I should probably delve into it a bit more.

    The three personas of the pagan God sounds similar to Hindu ideas about the stages of life – but the point is usually one of ascending value. It may be appropriate for a young man to live on the strife of the world in his season, but it’s preparation for a much higher stage – renunciation and contemplation.
     
    In the Baltic religion there was an elder priest who lived in a temple in a grove and tended to an eternal fire there. Very few were allowed to go in this grove so the priest spent a lot of time there alone. This might be a little similar to what you talk about but this priest served a very important social function (wise counsel and he was a kind of a leader). It wasn't just individualistic mediation, but contemplation was, of course, a big part of it.

    but even ordinary drop outs from the rat race should be recognized as making a legitimate choice that has some spiritual worth, and society should be structured to accommodate them rather than insist on harnessing their productive potential to enrich the wealthy. I don’t mean subsidies, but a path to modest and minimal self support that doesn’t eat up all their time, steal their self respect, or deaden their souls.
     
    I think it depends on the person. When you give, it's important to see that it's not wasted. Because if you start giving out free things, too many may show up for it and it will create a moral hazard. I'm not saying this because I'm stingy, no. Not at all. It's simply because I don't like a situation where one part of able bodied society works (including mothers) and another doesn't.

    But I have had such friends myself, the kind that you describe. I have actually helped a poet friend of mine to build a heritage project that we were both interested in. This is something that neither he nor I could've achieved on our own. So the result of this collaboration was positive.

    As to the change in the economic relationships that you propose in the post above - those are very substantial changes that would resemble European revolutions. It would require either a revolutionary type of awakening within the populace (and it wouldn't be unanimous) or an armed revolution. Normally I would oppose such, however, one must admit that the cost of living in the West has risen in the recent years (or decades?), wages have grown but have not kept up, so I do agree that some very basic milestones take longer too achieve, too long, frankly. So in that regard you do have a point.

    However, what you propose might only make things worse. To give free housing and to relieve men of any duties whatsoever is a very, very slippery slope. Sometimes it leads to social collapse, the way it did after the fall of the USSR. Then the weak suffer and it's not right.

    Also, you may want to consider that some people view work as a value of its own. Work is something that structures one's life (of course, so does meditation & prayer), work is valuable not only in the results that it brings, or as a service to others, work can be viewed as something that promotes the Greek technē - a means to promote the development of the human being.

    Btw, I noticed you mentioned that this "prose" here on this forum is your contribution to society. Even if I don't agree on all your points, I must admit that you do indeed write well - you are able to use language quite skillfully.

    Replies: @AaronB

    So when I said the social game, I meant the quest for status and rank, respect and honor – which consumes such an incredible amount of our lives – the need to be seen as respectable, and the social conformity and conventional behavior that this engenders.

    With regard to marriage and children, there is indeed a “social dimension” to this, insofar as many people marry to socially conform and become respectable, and that I would include in the “social game”, but there is also an aspect to marriage and children that isn’t necessarily a part of that but more about intrinsic satisfaction to those who derive it from that.

    I’m not at all promoting MGTOW – that is a resentment-based rejection of women that has nothing to do with spirituality. I like women, don’t think they’re heartless monsters lol out to ruin me, and I think that marriage and kids can be, if done for the right reasons and not out of a sense of social duty, very satisfying and healthy.

    However, I’d say that all the great spiritual traditions recognize that there are higher pursuits than marriage and children, so any system which places that at the summit, is limited in my view – and marriage as social duty and convention, often leads to misery.

    In fact, I’m very opposed to the right-wing promotion of marriage as duty and a dismal chore one must undertake in service to the community – I think that gloomy view has led to the decline of marriage, and I wrote here in the past about how I think to make marriage and children popular again – a right wing preoccupation – we should emphasize it’s fun and joyous aspects, and as something one might spontaneously do for sheer joy (I think hiking with kids is one of the funnest things I’ve ever done).

    Yes, I liked it very much as well, it is similar to my ancestral religion. I should probably delve into it a bit more.

    Oh yeah, I’m a huge fan of Japanese culture. I think we can learn so much from them, and I read a lot of the Japanese classics. Japan is a fascinating fusion of pagan, animist, and Buddhist elements.

    In truth, even though I talk about the “higher” religions like Christianity and Buddhism primarily, I think paganism (especially “high” paganism) and animism are indispensable perspectives and have actually been subsumed into the higher religions and fertilized them extensively to the point where we no longer notice it, but couldn’t do without it.

    Christianity without the pagan and animist elements which it adopted would be an entirely different, and impoverished beast, and so would Buddhism. We need legends and myths and fantasy and the sense that the world is alive. And what would Christianity be without Platonism!

    David Bentley Hart makes the interesting point that modern nihilism is so deep and intractable precisely because Christianity assumed into itself all the animism and paganism of the past and when it got discredited (through it’s alliance with power), we didn’t even have the “default” human spirituality of animism and paganism to fall back on. The whole package got discredited.

    In a way, things like Christianity and Buddhism are just the capstones on a rich substrate of pagan and animist sensibility. They complete it, and are indispensable in their own right, but depend on it too.

    It wasn’t just individualistic mediation, but contemplation was, of course, a big part of it.

    So that Baltic priest is engaging in a very legitimate form of spirituality, and very poetic too.

    However, the “concrete, tangible” social utility of what he’s doing is not the only way the contemplative life assists humanity, it’s just that as modern life progressed we insisted more abd more on tangible, material help as we lost sight of the intangible realm – and I submit this was a step towards nihilism, which is ultimately disbelief in the intangible.

    A holy man completely alone in his cave, having no contact with anyone, helps all mankind through the intangible realm – one, by becoming one with the Infinite he brings the Infinite down to earth and generates positive energy in the universe, and two, by example and hearsay, he reaches people psychologically and gives inspiration and comfort that at least some humans are realizing what God made us for, not social trivia.

    Traditionally, this intangible help was considered immensely more beneficial than anything tangible, because before the advent of nihilism the realm of spirit was seen as more important than the material realm (which was something of an illusion).

    As I said, modern nihilism can be said to be a loss of belief in the intangible, the realm of spirit, and an insistence on the material.

    Of course, advice and counsel have always had their place – after all, the Desert Father’s left behind them a magnificent record of sayings well worth reading!

    think it depends on the person. When you give, it’s important to see that it’s not wasted. Because if you start giving out free things, too many may show up for it and it will create a moral hazard. I’m not saying this because I’m stingy, no. Not at all. It’s simply because I don’t like a situation where one part of able bodied society works (including mothers) and another doesn’t.

    Fair enough, but this is a “prudential” calculation that is not the calculation of God, certainly not in Christianity – we are told to give freely and without stint or calculation, not according to the wisdom of this world.

    Spiritual logic is different than worldly logic, and obeys different laws. Giving prudentially reinforces a certain logic of self-interest, but giving freely reinforces a morality of pure generosity – this may create an atmosphere conducive to moral reform, ad it is based on pure love, and ultimately it may be the calculated form of giving that creates long term moral hazard.

    That is what is so “startlingly” novel about Christianity – at least one of the things. It looked more deeply into the true sources of our problems than what is apparent on the surface.

    One may disagree with this, but it’s good that we at least have this radical alternative perspective in view, which is why I was so opposed to AP rendering Christianity gutless and eviscerating it of all it’s radical novelty.

    As to the change in the economic relationships that you propose in the post above – those are very substantial changes that would resemble European revolutions. It would require either a revolutionary type of awakening within the populace (and it wouldn’t be unanimous) or an armed revolution

    .

    Indeed, it would require nothing less than a drastic moral revolution – one that Christianity began long ago, and will culminate in the future, with God’s light breaking into the world and setting everything alight.

    In the meantime, we can take what small steps we can.

    However, what you propose might only make things worse. To give free housing and to relieve men of any duties whatsoever is a very, very slippery slope. Sometimes it leads to social collapse, the way it did after the fall of the USSR. Then the weak suffer and it’s not right.

    I understand that this is the standard view, and is a big reason that such measures haven’t been taken despite the means to doing so existing fir quite some time.

    However, as human beings we are all born with the right to free housing and enough land that’s needed for our food – think of a hunter gatherer boring into a forest, he has “free” housing and food. By what right do the oligarchs monopolize all land and force us into a system of their devising?

    Is returning our birthright to us a moral hazard, or does forcing us into an artificial state of struggle for what is our by birth making us vicious?

    Also, you may want to consider that some people view work as a value of its own. Work is something that structures one’s life (of course, so does meditation & prayer), work is valuable not only in the results that it brings, or as a service to others, work can be viewed as something that promotes the Greek technē – a means to promote the development of the human being.

    Sure, I’d agree with this. But is this the kind of work that is done in a modern economy? There are forms of craftsmanship – techne, as you say – that are indeed a beautiful extension of our humanity, and a blacksmith, a basket weaver, a leather worker, a carver of statues from wood or stone, a hunter, may well be developing his humanity and even attaining union with the Infinite through his work.

    But of course, since the Industrial Revolution, this has not been most of our work. Factory work, office work, is a different beast.

    Even so, let us remember that the Greeks prized leisure and contemplation above all, and thought that too much time spent at a craft would distort one physically and spiritually.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @AaronB


    Christianity without the pagan and animist elements which it adopted would be an entirely different, and impoverished beast, and so would Buddhism. We need legends and myths and fantasy and the sense that the world is alive. And what would Christianity be without Platonism!
     
    Christianity without Platonism would result in God - without all His hypostases - being closer to people. Now, God the Father is rather a reclusive, far-away character in Christianity.

    David Bentley Hart makes the interesting point that modern nihilism is so deep and intractable precisely because Christianity assumed into itself all the animism and paganism of the past and when it got discredited (through it’s alliance with power), we didn’t even have the “default” human spirituality of animism and paganism to fall back on. The whole package got discredited.

     

    This is a very good point. If the quasi-pagan cult of Mary, even now often known under her pagan name "Our Lady", wanted to part with Christianity, it couldn't leave Jesus the Jewish Messiah behind, even if it could leave God the Father...

    Replies: @AaronB

    , @LatW
    @AaronB


    So when I said the social game, I meant the quest for status and rank, respect and honor – which consumes such an incredible amount of our lives – the need to be seen as respectable, and the social conformity and conventional behavior that this engenders.
     
    You might be overestimating people's need for this - this does exist but it's not unavoidable. There are a lot of people who just float through life and care little about "status" or "rank". The fact that you stress this so much could mean that, via projection, you care more about these things than you let on. Or maybe you are rebelling against your family who may have pressured you in the past. I'm just guessing (and I apologize if I'm wrong).


    but there is also an aspect to marriage and children that isn’t necessarily a part of that but more about intrinsic satisfaction to those who derive it from that.
     
    So you don't think real love exists, just satisfaction?

    A holy man completely alone in his cave, having no contact with anyone, helps all mankind through the intangible realm – one, by becoming one with the Infinite he brings the Infinite down to earth and generates positive energy in the universe, and two, by example and hearsay, he reaches people psychologically and gives inspiration and comfort that at least some humans are realizing what God made us for, not social trivia.
     
    I don't disagree with this. This has been the case in most traditional cultures. It's just a question as to who is to be deemed a "holy man".

    As I said, modern nihilism can be said to be a loss of belief in the intangible, the realm of spirit, and an insistence on the material.
     
    It seems you are attributing this to wider society today, and to some extent one can agree that there is indeed some nihilism in modern life, however, "belief in the intangible" is largely a subjective experience, thus I'm not sure that you can speak for everyone - you do not have access to other people's souls and cannot tell how they experience the divine or even spiritual life.

    we are told to give freely and without stint or calculation, not according to the wisdom of this world
     
    We should be led by rationality, so as to not create more harm or unintended consequences. That someone, at one point, gives "prudentially", as you say, doesn't mean that, at another time, they do not give "freely". Many give freely, for example, to children, even children that are not their own. Mothers give freely to their children, even though there is also the maternal instinct. Friends give advice and free work to friends all the time.

    Of course, you can argue that giving freely also brings gratification and that in this regard it can be viewed as "selfish" but then such arguments become almost absurd. I understand what you mean. Safest is to give out of love.

    However, as human beings we are all born with the right to free housing and enough land that’s needed for our food
     
    Maybe, remember also that there are different kinds of housing.
    Would it be possible to maintain private ownership (up to a certain wealth level, rather high, but not such that allows to buy up too much the way it is now) but eradicate the oligarchy?

    think of a hunter gatherer boring into a forest, he has “free” housing and food.
     
    Only the gatherer has food that is somewhat free (but even gathering can be hard work at times that requires time and patience). The hunter has to hunt the food, this is quite hard (I'm not sure you realize how fast and sometimes even dangerous animals are). So this is all work. But, yea, in a sense, it is free. Surely, there is much to be harvested in the woods, feel free. Isn't most of it available?

    Is returning our birthright to us a moral hazard, or does forcing us into an artificial state of struggle for what is our by birth making us vicious?
     
    I think it's a question of balance. Certainly, what is happening with the wealth inequality now is not entirely healthy or right.

    techne, as you say – that are indeed a beautiful extension of our humanity, and a blacksmith, a basket weaver, a leather worker, a carver of statues from wood or stone, a hunter, may well be developing his humanity and even attaining union with the Infinite through his work.
     
    I would go even further than skilled trades, although some skilled trades are quite beautiful and even pleasant to perform. With good equipment, factory work can be quite satisfying as well. But I view the concept of technē even broader and would extend it to occupations such as conductor or musician, designer, architect, one can learn a lot from business, not to mention all the humanities professions that can be quite gratifying.

    But of course, since the Industrial Revolution, this has not been most of our work. Factory work, office work, is a different beast.
     
    It depends, a lot of people enjoy their careers and pursuits, or they enjoy it some days and not on other days. Also, people bounce all the time - millennials stay at one job on average for 2 years these days. You're being a bit too categorical. But you do have a point that a person should be able to bail, if it becomes "soul crushing", as you say. And search for something that is less so.

    Which many have done, btw. Apparently, male employment is the lowest it's ever been in America.


    let us remember that the Greeks prized leisure and contemplation above all
     
    Well, which Greeks, there are several schools. Contemplation for Greeks was actually not leisure but training of the soul. The Greeks prized arete above all - pursuit of excellence or full potential. It is connected to the virtues that are listed in Aristotle's Nicomachean Ethics. Somehow I do not recall that this book specifically praised "leisure" as a virtue in itself.
  785. @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    I was just trolling AK, most of our interactions were trolling each other anyway. I think he mostly found my posting entertaining, he has an excellent sense of humor.

    I don't really care about anyone's ethnic makeup. Not anymore. I have come a long way from the maximalist РНЕ attitudes that I shared in my youth. Quite frankly, my kids themselves are quite an ethnic mix, and they are great kids.

    But I do care whether someone respects his ancestors and takes care of being honorable to not bring shame on their memories. I have never written anything negative about the people whom my ancestors have been part of. I have a healthy deal of respect for all of these groups they have been mostly honest, hardworking and industrious in their own way.

    Now about the desirable genetic make-up, just follow the selfish gene way: everything that increases the fitness and the potential rate of success of your progeny is great. Look for what you're missing and try to find it in the spouse. Whether the kids are blue-eyed blond Ubermenshen is irrelevant. IQ, health (including the psychological aspects), stamina and good looks that's what I would look for today, if I had to find myself a wife to procreate with. Luckily, my procreation period is finished. Kids are nearly grown up and will go their own way. They have a better character than I do, thanks to their mother for that, they live in a mostly peaceful environment, they should be doing fine.

    I hope to retire to some cabin in the woods one day and live a quiet life if providence / karma would allow me so. Read books, walk the dogs, hike through the nearby forests. Listen to great music.

    As our Muslim friends would say : In'sha'Allah.

    Replies: @Blinky Bill, @Mr. Hack, @silviosilver

    I was just trolling AK, most of our interactions were trolling each other anyway.

    It sounded more serious than trolling to me, but okay, I’ll take your word for it. Still, to get technical on you, that would just mean that you actually did accept AK as a member of the Slavic fold, but it changes nothing about the nature of the concern you were expressing about Slavic interests, as you understood them. If you’ve since changed your mind about those interests, fair enough, but it wasn’t obvious to me at all in anything you’ve been saying since your return.

    Now about the desirable genetic make-up, just follow the selfish gene way: everything that increases the fitness and the potential rate of success of your progeny is great.

    Not sure where this came from. 🙂 I didn’t ask you anything about “desirable” genetic make-up.

    When Gautama Buddha spoke to his disciples he often started his talk by addressing the assembly as “Good sons and good daughters of good families…”.

    Given the totality of the Buddha’s teachings, you don’t think there’s some other reason he might have had to have thusly begun an address? Surely the idea the Buddha can be recruited as a haplogroup worshiper avant la lettre is a leap of logic worthy of a ‘prosperity gospel’ exegete.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    Bodh Avatar Ji was definitely casteist, but neither Europe nor India are 100% R1A.
    The highest %s like Khatris or Malwai Jatt are 65-70%.

    Bodh Avatar Ji said Kshatriyas are supreme to Brahmins, but that Arihant are always twice-born.
    Vajrayna Buddhists like Tibetans or Mongols respect the Sikh Gurus - One Vedic culture.

    ---
    This obviously has nothing to do with what's discussed here & neither do Vedic Aryans.
    We've always viewed ourselves as Indigenous to Panjab, and that's that.

    Foreigners can't accept that because without Panjab what is this whole Indo-Europe larp?
    A bunch of pastoral cultures that ultimately converted almost fully to Christianity and Islam.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

  786. Sher Singh says:
    @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    I was just trolling AK, most of our interactions were trolling each other anyway.
     
    It sounded more serious than trolling to me, but okay, I'll take your word for it. Still, to get technical on you, that would just mean that you actually did accept AK as a member of the Slavic fold, but it changes nothing about the nature of the concern you were expressing about Slavic interests, as you understood them. If you've since changed your mind about those interests, fair enough, but it wasn't obvious to me at all in anything you've been saying since your return.

    Now about the desirable genetic make-up, just follow the selfish gene way: everything that increases the fitness and the potential rate of success of your progeny is great.
     
    Not sure where this came from. :) I didn't ask you anything about "desirable" genetic make-up.

    When Gautama Buddha spoke to his disciples he often started his talk by addressing the assembly as “Good sons and good daughters of good families…”.
     
    Given the totality of the Buddha's teachings, you don't think there's some other reason he might have had to have thusly begun an address? Surely the idea the Buddha can be recruited as a haplogroup worshiper avant la lettre is a leap of logic worthy of a 'prosperity gospel' exegete.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    Bodh Avatar Ji was definitely casteist, but neither Europe nor India are 100% R1A.
    The highest %s like Khatris or Malwai Jatt are 65-70%.

    Bodh Avatar Ji said Kshatriyas are supreme to Brahmins, but that Arihant are always twice-born.
    Vajrayna Buddhists like Tibetans or Mongols respect the Sikh Gurus – One Vedic culture.


    This obviously has nothing to do with what’s discussed here & neither do Vedic Aryans.
    We’ve always viewed ourselves as Indigenous to Panjab, and that’s that.

    Foreigners can’t accept that because without Panjab what is this whole Indo-Europe larp?
    A bunch of pastoral cultures that ultimately converted almost fully to Christianity and Islam.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

  787. @songbird
    @S

    What really amazes me is how easy it is to perceive powerful resentment and even hatred in many of these migrants that have come into Ireland. It really just is incredible. And you can witness it clearly - there's plenty of videos.

    Effectively, it seems to me to be a complete duplication of the worst part of the American experience racially speaking, without any of the usual historical or economic excuses even remotely possible.

    I don't even know how people advocating for open borders, or a weak response to them would even attempt to explain it away. It is so shocking to see. Maybe, they would blame higher rates of mental illness or psychopathy. (at least, if they were HBD aware). Maybe, others would say that it is simply a case of American culture being transplanted.

    But to me, there is an obvious and more direct explanation:

    Some people are just in the wrong environment (to the point where it drives them crazy), and no amount of accommodation will change that. The better and more humane solution is simply to put them back into their native environment.

    Replies: @S

    What really amazes me is how easy it is to perceive powerful resentment and even hatred in many of these migrants that have come into Ireland.

    Sad to hear that.

    If it’s like everywhere else, where the media is tightly controlled and directed, the native Irish are being told one thing, and the settlers/colonists another.

    [MORE]

    The Irish I imagine are being told ‘you yourselves were once ‘immigrants’, it’s only fair and just you allow these new ‘immigrants’ in. However, if the truth of the matter were being told by the powers that be, it would instead be ‘you Irish were once exploited and preyed upon enmasse as wage slaves, it is only fair and just therefore that these other peoples were preyed upon and exploited in the same manner as well’, and ‘how dare you resist that, which wouldn’t sell.

    Meanwhile, I figure the colonists/invaders in Ireland are being told ‘the Irish were willing members of the British Empire who faithfully served it to oppress you, and this is your hour of revenge’, ie whatever sells, the truth be damned. If they were told the truth, it would instead be the Irish themselves were forcibly incorporated into the Empire, and were colonized by it, just as youbare now forcibly colonizing them, which doesn’t have quite the same ring to it.

    But to me, there is an obvious and more direct explanation: Some people are just in the wrong environment (to the point where it drives them crazy), and no amount of accommodation will change that. The better and more humane solution is simply to put them back into their native environment.

    This sounds about right, rather than the loaded lie term of Irish ‘racism’. The Irish have the right to remain as they are physically as a people without being forcibly changed into something unrecognizable by evil doers.

    • Agree: songbird
  788. Geo_monitor
    @colonelhomsi
    Economist is forced to admit that in the “liberated” areas of the Kharkov region, locals still miss the Russians and “pro-Russian sentiment in the region remains strong”..

    [MORE]

  789. Arthur Morgan
    @ArthurM40330824
    #AZOV fighter code name Chemist
    Said when they were fighting for #Mariupol 60% of locals supported #Russia and spoke in #Russian. 20% just wanted peace and 20% felt that AZOV was their heroes.
    So this explains a lot of why AZOV treated locals with such cruelty.

    [MORE]

  790. @LatW
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Which Strugackis books were most popular in USSR, and which are now in Russia and Ukraine respectively..?
     
    Sci-fi is not really my cup of tea, so I can't be of help here, I'm afraid. Bashi might know this much better.

    I just know that Arestovych has some kind of a self-development school (he calls it "school of thinking") and a part of that he published some videos where he discusses Strugatsky's works ("Hard to be a God" and a few others). It looks like he's trying to use some of the insights he has drawn from those titles into his own archeo-futuristic musings. Of course, Stalker was known among sci-fi fans in the Baltics (it was filmed in Tallinn, Estonia).

    Btw, regarding the above discussion about Wends. Yes, it is true that some Russians use these theories to claim that they have a right to space in Central Europe. Also, Russian Rodnovers idealize the island of Rugen. Even though this is essentially heritage of Western Slavs, their distant relatives. I usually dismiss these theories, but Bashi wrote about it quite compellingly and it inspires imagination.

    However, we do know for a fact that the so called Texas Wends are Sorbs (even if Germanized). Wends are simply Lechitic Slavs.

    Replies: @songbird, @Another Polish Perspective

    Bashybuzuk/Ivashka ethnogenesis theory stresses the continuity of indigenous elements, as you could expect from Rodnover. Well, last year I visited in Poland rodzimowiercy presentation where a lecturer claimed that Minoans were Indo-Europeans. I guess you can stretch continuity hypothesis that way too, if you want everyone to be indigenous 😉

    Yes, it somehow confirm what I read once that Strugackis are considered to be more than sci-fi in the (post)Soviet space. But from my personal reading of them, putting aside some allusions to Soviet reality, it could be a Soviet introduction to the “Ancient Astronauts” theory. It would be good to know whether Strugackis commented on Daeniken ideas in any way.

    However, we do know for a fact that the so called Texas Wends are Sorbs (even if Germanized). Wends are simply Lechitic Slavs.

    It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.

    But Wends are not Lechitic Slavs (maybe in some artificial classifications), that are Poles. I think that should be obvious, Poles = Lachs [Lachy]. Wends, however, can call themselves Czech Slavs since their land was once part of the Kingdom of Czechs.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lands_of_the_Bohemian_Crown

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Bashybuzuk/Ivashka ethnogenesis theory stresses the continuity of indigenous elements, as you could expect from Rodnover.
     
    It's not bad as a principle (rather, it is good). However, when it becomes too obscure, one starts having questions. This is why it's better to stick with Iron Age when you talk about nations. :) What he writes is interesting, but I have seen some in Russia use it for political purposes. From the POV of Slavic unity, there is of course nothing wrong with admiring Arkona and such. It's just that those people had way more to do with today's Poles than today's Eastern Slavs.

    It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.
     
    Yes, it's a shame. They are a bit like some Germanized Baltic people in Prussia, sad. But then it's a question why as to why the ones in Texas choose to call themselves Wends if they are Sorbs... by this logic, Wend is the German name for Western Slav. They chose that because they were already pretty Germanized at that point. They went to the US in mid 19th century.

    But Wends are not Lechitic Slavs (maybe in some artificial classifications), that are Poles.
     
    Well, from what I understand, Wends are Lechitic Slavs, but not all Lechitic Slavs are Wends.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lechites

    Wenden are mention together with Drevani and those are Polabians from what I understand. I looked at their language, or what survives of it, it looks like heavily Germanized Polish. It's possible (or probably even likely) that in earlier times it was more purely Slavic.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends

    "Wends (Old English: Winedas [ˈwi.ne.dɑs]; Old Norse: Vindar; German: Wenden [ˈvɛn.dn̩], Winden [ˈvɪn.dn̩]; Danish: vendere; Swedish: vender; Polish: Wendowie, Czech: Wendové) is a historical name for the Lechitic Slavs. It refers not to a homogeneous people, but to various peoples, tribes or groups depending on where and when it was used. In the modern day, communities identifying as Wendish exist in Slovenia, Austria, Lusatia, Texas, and Australia.

    It's probably just the "historical name" for the Western most Slavic peoples.

    As to the bear statue, yes, it is near Wroclaw and not precisely on the Czech border, but I mentioned Czech Rep because apparently this ancient Celtic spread was more prevalent there than in Poland. That would explain why the bear is exactly there.

    Replies: @LatW, @Another Polish Perspective

  791. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @silviosilver
    @AaronB


    As for art, well, what would an art that didn’t deal in the ideal, the possible, that didn’t point to something beyond actually existing conditions, look like?
     
    It would look like the modernist and postmodernist monstrosities which inspire, at best, puzzlement and, often enough, outright disgust. It is ironic that art which is supposed to "challenge" us and "shatter conventionality" drives the common man to cling more tightly to bourgeois values than ever. Not that he necessarily announces this; rebuked for his impertinence in questioning the aesthetic value of the pile of trash that has been presented to him as "art," he quietly withdraws and surrenders the domain, and busies himself cultivating those behaviors most conducive to the pursuit of economic ends.

    What would an art “celebrating” the actual look like? Even art that seeks to glorify a battle, or a king, is highly selective in what it depicts, and depicts a sort of “ideal” battle or king, with many “realistic” elements left out.
     
    You say "even art that seeks to glorify..." as though such art were exceptional rather than commonplace. But I'm glad it's you rather than I who brought up this example, because as far as I can make out, it poses an insurmountable problem for your oppositional theory of art. Wouldn't your theory claim the artist depicting that battles wishes it had never taken place? Or that the civilization that made such a battle possible had never existed? Why not? Once you posit intrinsic oppositional motivation as the catch-all explanation, why arbitrarily stop at one level of opposition?

    In fact, it seems it shouldn't matter what elements of the battle the artist selected, or indeed whether he selected a battle or a bowl of fruit, since for you the explanation always reduces to one thing: the artist despises civilization and is merely using art as a means of convincing people to abandon civilization and pursue the contemplative life - retreat to the mountains and look at waterfalls all day, and become, like the animals, reliant solely upon the bounty of nature for one's sustenance. (I'm getting histrionic again, but the conclusion seems unavoidable if everyone were to follow your lead.)

    Replies: @AaronB

    It would look like the modernist and postmodernist monstrosities which inspire, at best, puzzlement and, often enough, outright disgust

    Exactly 🙂

    The death of art in the West was born of the spirit of “realism” which eventually took over all areas of culture.

    Modern art attempts to “shock” you not by showing you an idealized realm of beauty and perfection – but by showing you the ugliest aspects of reality.

    It is precisely a protest against the ideal.

    In its way, it too is selective – it selects the worst aspects of reality as somehow characteristic.

    Art is supposed to challenge your complacency in the face of imperfection – modern art “challenges” you to see the worst aspects of reality.

    It is part and parcel of that entire spiritual movement that began as “realism”, and “neutrality”, and “objectivity”, and “scientific fact” – supposedly, it was an attempt to see the “unvarnished ” truth about life, but as I told Mikel on the other thread, in reality “objectivity” is in practice a set of distinct and powerful cognitive biases of its own, insofar as it automatically discounts beauty or the ideal as at a possible aspect of reality.

    So “objectivity” in practice starts with a cognitive bias – beauty and the ideal are not in any sense part of reality, therefore only the ugly is “true”. So objectivity searches for the ugly.

    But of course, perhaps beauty and the ideal are more real than what we see, or an aspect of reality – but to believe that, you can’t take as your starting point – an unproven assumption – that only what is materially visible belongs to reality.

    Exact parallels can be found with our philosophies – Darwinism tells us that only strife and competition are really true, etc, because true reality must be ugly.

    As songbird was complaining about earlier, the Medieval era is depicted in movies as relentlessly gray and ugly because our starting point is a cognitive bias that the most characteristic thing about unvarnished reality is it’s ugliness, and Medieval times were less technologically advanced than ours and so closer to unvarnished reality. Yet we know from paintings and historical records that even though there was much dirt, the Medieval era was a festive riot of color, paegentry, ornament, decoration, and beauty, especially among the nobility and the chivalric orders.

    So too it is with our architecture – we build utilitarian boxes because ornament is somehow a “lie”.

    And that is why poetry died too – we want “truth”, and poetry is a “lie”.

    Modern art is what you get when you relentlessly focus on the factual and discount the ideal and the imaginative – but since true neutrality is impossible, it can only assure itself that it has eliminated the ideal by searching for it’s opposite, ugliness, the worst aspects of the real.

    So – the drive to eliminate the ideal and grasp the actual inevitably develops into a bias to search for ugliness, because only in the presence of the worst can be assured you’ve cured yourself of the desire for the ideal.

    You say “even art that seeks to glorify…” as though such art were exceptional rather than commonplace. But I’m glad it’s you rather than I who brought up this example, because as far as I can make out, it poses an insurmountable problem for your oppositional theory of art. Wouldn’t your theory claim the artist depicting that battles wishes it had never taken place? Or that the civilization that made such a battle possible had never existed? Why not? Once you posit intrinsic oppositional motivation as the catch-all explanation, why arbitrarily stop at one level of opposition?

    Not necessarily. But you’re bringing up really good areas that need clarification and elaboration.

    “Oppositional” merely indicates that it is in some sense opposed to facts as they are materially visible to our senses on their own. In that sense, “glorifying” a battle means adding a dimension of perfection and idealism to it, and subtracting the less ideal aspects, to create a highly selective vision.

    A battle as it should be as it approaches the ideal, without cowardice, full of noble heros and valiant warriors, great kings and princes, performing noble deeds of courage and showing magnanimity to defeated foes, without the low, the craven, the weak and ugly, the treacherous and the backstabbing, the muck and the mire. There is an idealistic moral dimension to the depiction as well. (The ugly elements may be included in a minor key to offset the splendor of our side as we would like to imagine ourselves, minus all our frailties and imperfections)

    In that sense, a true artist always creates in opposition to existing conditions.

    But you know what? It just occurred to me that the source of our confusion here is that you are taking me to mean that an artist creates in opposition to the professed values of his society – but I only mean he is always creating in opposition to his actual society.

    To return to Bach, I would freely admit he was creating out of an effort to fulfill the professed values of his society, which were Christian, but that simultaneously implied a criticism of his actual society, which fell woefully short of Christian ideals.

    To take the example of a non-Christian warrior society, an artist may seek to depict an idealized version of it’s professed values – every man a courageous and magnanimous fighter who never runs from a battle and is surpassingly skilled and strong – but since human reality is composed of cowards and the treacherous and the weak, this will be an implied criticism of how his society actually is at the same time.

    In a nutshell, since a society always falls short of its own ideal – unless it sets the bar really low – and the artists task is to depict the ideal, the artist is always creating in opposition to existing conditions on one level while exhorting his society to rise to it’s own vision of itself.

    And the more lofty the ideal, the greater this gap is. While even a warrior society has an idealistic moral dimension, Christianity is one of the loftiest ideals humanity has ever conceived, and the gap between it’s ideal and actually existing European society will be particularly large, and the creations of an artist in a Christian society will be in particular tension with his actual society.

    In fact, it seems it shouldn’t matter what elements of the battle the artist selected, or indeed whether he selected a battle or a bowl of fruit, since for you the explanation always reduces to one thing: the artist despises civilization and is merely using art as a means of convincing people to abandon civilization and pursue the contemplative life – retreat to the mountains and look at waterfalls all day, and become, like the animals, reliant solely upon the bounty of nature for one’s sustenance.

    No, no, no 🙂 But I now see where the confusion lies.

    By “civilization” I meant that set of accomodations, practices, and compromises a society enacts in order to accumulate wealth and power, which, since we live in a corrupted world, leads to compromises with the ideal.

    A noble warrior who never stoops to treachery is not best suited to make his society as rich and powerful as possible and advance the cause of complex civilization. Indeed, the early history of the British in India is one of base treachery as they gobbled up provinces through deceit, such that the Indian “nabobs” were often shunned as moral lepers back in “decent” British society when they returned home hoping to capitalize on their riches.

    But it certainly advanced the cause of British civilization 🙂

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @AaronB


    To return to Bach, I would freely admit he was creating out of an effort to fulfill the professed values of his society, which were Christian, but that simultaneously implied a criticism of his actual society, which fell woefully short of Christian ideals.
     
    I'd add an important qualification to this.

    A society never has one unified set of values But is always composed to some extent of competing sets of values, generally one more idealistic and one more oriented towards brute success in this corrupted world with all it's sordid compromises and base necessities.

    The artist always creates out of the idealistic set of values, so it cannot be said he fulfills the professed ideals of his society on their totality, but only in part - at their best, I'd say :)
  792. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @AaronB
    @silviosilver


    It would look like the modernist and postmodernist monstrosities which inspire, at best, puzzlement and, often enough, outright disgust
     
    Exactly :)

    The death of art in the West was born of the spirit of "realism" which eventually took over all areas of culture.

    Modern art attempts to "shock" you not by showing you an idealized realm of beauty and perfection - but by showing you the ugliest aspects of reality.

    It is precisely a protest against the ideal.

    In its way, it too is selective - it selects the worst aspects of reality as somehow characteristic.

    Art is supposed to challenge your complacency in the face of imperfection - modern art "challenges" you to see the worst aspects of reality.

    It is part and parcel of that entire spiritual movement that began as "realism", and "neutrality", and "objectivity", and "scientific fact" - supposedly, it was an attempt to see the "unvarnished " truth about life, but as I told Mikel on the other thread, in reality "objectivity" is in practice a set of distinct and powerful cognitive biases of its own, insofar as it automatically discounts beauty or the ideal as at a possible aspect of reality.

    So "objectivity" in practice starts with a cognitive bias - beauty and the ideal are not in any sense part of reality, therefore only the ugly is "true". So objectivity searches for the ugly.

    But of course, perhaps beauty and the ideal are more real than what we see, or an aspect of reality - but to believe that, you can't take as your starting point - an unproven assumption - that only what is materially visible belongs to reality.

    Exact parallels can be found with our philosophies - Darwinism tells us that only strife and competition are really true, etc, because true reality must be ugly.

    As songbird was complaining about earlier, the Medieval era is depicted in movies as relentlessly gray and ugly because our starting point is a cognitive bias that the most characteristic thing about unvarnished reality is it's ugliness, and Medieval times were less technologically advanced than ours and so closer to unvarnished reality. Yet we know from paintings and historical records that even though there was much dirt, the Medieval era was a festive riot of color, paegentry, ornament, decoration, and beauty, especially among the nobility and the chivalric orders.

    So too it is with our architecture - we build utilitarian boxes because ornament is somehow a "lie".

    And that is why poetry died too - we want "truth", and poetry is a "lie".

    Modern art is what you get when you relentlessly focus on the factual and discount the ideal and the imaginative - but since true neutrality is impossible, it can only assure itself that it has eliminated the ideal by searching for it's opposite, ugliness, the worst aspects of the real.

    So - the drive to eliminate the ideal and grasp the actual inevitably develops into a bias to search for ugliness, because only in the presence of the worst can be assured you've cured yourself of the desire for the ideal.

    You say “even art that seeks to glorify…” as though such art were exceptional rather than commonplace. But I’m glad it’s you rather than I who brought up this example, because as far as I can make out, it poses an insurmountable problem for your oppositional theory of art. Wouldn’t your theory claim the artist depicting that battles wishes it had never taken place? Or that the civilization that made such a battle possible had never existed? Why not? Once you posit intrinsic oppositional motivation as the catch-all explanation, why arbitrarily stop at one level of opposition?
     
    Not necessarily. But you're bringing up really good areas that need clarification and elaboration.

    "Oppositional" merely indicates that it is in some sense opposed to facts as they are materially visible to our senses on their own. In that sense, "glorifying" a battle means adding a dimension of perfection and idealism to it, and subtracting the less ideal aspects, to create a highly selective vision.

    A battle as it should be as it approaches the ideal, without cowardice, full of noble heros and valiant warriors, great kings and princes, performing noble deeds of courage and showing magnanimity to defeated foes, without the low, the craven, the weak and ugly, the treacherous and the backstabbing, the muck and the mire. There is an idealistic moral dimension to the depiction as well. (The ugly elements may be included in a minor key to offset the splendor of our side as we would like to imagine ourselves, minus all our frailties and imperfections)

    In that sense, a true artist always creates in opposition to existing conditions.

    But you know what? It just occurred to me that the source of our confusion here is that you are taking me to mean that an artist creates in opposition to the professed values of his society - but I only mean he is always creating in opposition to his actual society.

    To return to Bach, I would freely admit he was creating out of an effort to fulfill the professed values of his society, which were Christian, but that simultaneously implied a criticism of his actual society, which fell woefully short of Christian ideals.

    To take the example of a non-Christian warrior society, an artist may seek to depict an idealized version of it's professed values - every man a courageous and magnanimous fighter who never runs from a battle and is surpassingly skilled and strong - but since human reality is composed of cowards and the treacherous and the weak, this will be an implied criticism of how his society actually is at the same time.

    In a nutshell, since a society always falls short of its own ideal - unless it sets the bar really low - and the artists task is to depict the ideal, the artist is always creating in opposition to existing conditions on one level while exhorting his society to rise to it's own vision of itself.

    And the more lofty the ideal, the greater this gap is. While even a warrior society has an idealistic moral dimension, Christianity is one of the loftiest ideals humanity has ever conceived, and the gap between it's ideal and actually existing European society will be particularly large, and the creations of an artist in a Christian society will be in particular tension with his actual society.

    In fact, it seems it shouldn’t matter what elements of the battle the artist selected, or indeed whether he selected a battle or a bowl of fruit, since for you the explanation always reduces to one thing: the artist despises civilization and is merely using art as a means of convincing people to abandon civilization and pursue the contemplative life – retreat to the mountains and look at waterfalls all day, and become, like the animals, reliant solely upon the bounty of nature for one’s sustenance.
     
    No, no, no :) But I now see where the confusion lies.

    By "civilization" I meant that set of accomodations, practices, and compromises a society enacts in order to accumulate wealth and power, which, since we live in a corrupted world, leads to compromises with the ideal.

    A noble warrior who never stoops to treachery is not best suited to make his society as rich and powerful as possible and advance the cause of complex civilization. Indeed, the early history of the British in India is one of base treachery as they gobbled up provinces through deceit, such that the Indian "nabobs" were often shunned as moral lepers back in "decent" British society when they returned home hoping to capitalize on their riches.

    But it certainly advanced the cause of British civilization :)

    Replies: @AaronB

    To return to Bach, I would freely admit he was creating out of an effort to fulfill the professed values of his society, which were Christian, but that simultaneously implied a criticism of his actual society, which fell woefully short of Christian ideals.

    I’d add an important qualification to this.

    A society never has one unified set of values But is always composed to some extent of competing sets of values, generally one more idealistic and one more oriented towards brute success in this corrupted world with all it’s sordid compromises and base necessities.

    The artist always creates out of the idealistic set of values, so it cannot be said he fulfills the professed ideals of his society on their totality, but only in part – at their best, I’d say 🙂

  793. @AaronB
    @LatW

    So when I said the social game, I meant the quest for status and rank, respect and honor - which consumes such an incredible amount of our lives - the need to be seen as respectable, and the social conformity and conventional behavior that this engenders.

    With regard to marriage and children, there is indeed a "social dimension" to this, insofar as many people marry to socially conform and become respectable, and that I would include in the "social game", but there is also an aspect to marriage and children that isn't necessarily a part of that but more about intrinsic satisfaction to those who derive it from that.

    I'm not at all promoting MGTOW - that is a resentment-based rejection of women that has nothing to do with spirituality. I like women, don't think they're heartless monsters lol out to ruin me, and I think that marriage and kids can be, if done for the right reasons and not out of a sense of social duty, very satisfying and healthy.

    However, I'd say that all the great spiritual traditions recognize that there are higher pursuits than marriage and children, so any system which places that at the summit, is limited in my view - and marriage as social duty and convention, often leads to misery.

    In fact, I'm very opposed to the right-wing promotion of marriage as duty and a dismal chore one must undertake in service to the community - I think that gloomy view has led to the decline of marriage, and I wrote here in the past about how I think to make marriage and children popular again - a right wing preoccupation - we should emphasize it's fun and joyous aspects, and as something one might spontaneously do for sheer joy (I think hiking with kids is one of the funnest things I've ever done).


    Yes, I liked it very much as well, it is similar to my ancestral religion. I should probably delve into it a bit more.
     
    Oh yeah, I'm a huge fan of Japanese culture. I think we can learn so much from them, and I read a lot of the Japanese classics. Japan is a fascinating fusion of pagan, animist, and Buddhist elements.

    In truth, even though I talk about the "higher" religions like Christianity and Buddhism primarily, I think paganism (especially "high" paganism) and animism are indispensable perspectives and have actually been subsumed into the higher religions and fertilized them extensively to the point where we no longer notice it, but couldn't do without it.

    Christianity without the pagan and animist elements which it adopted would be an entirely different, and impoverished beast, and so would Buddhism. We need legends and myths and fantasy and the sense that the world is alive. And what would Christianity be without Platonism!

    David Bentley Hart makes the interesting point that modern nihilism is so deep and intractable precisely because Christianity assumed into itself all the animism and paganism of the past and when it got discredited (through it's alliance with power), we didn't even have the "default" human spirituality of animism and paganism to fall back on. The whole package got discredited.

    In a way, things like Christianity and Buddhism are just the capstones on a rich substrate of pagan and animist sensibility. They complete it, and are indispensable in their own right, but depend on it too.

    It wasn’t just individualistic mediation, but contemplation was, of course, a big part of it.

     

    So that Baltic priest is engaging in a very legitimate form of spirituality, and very poetic too.

    However, the "concrete, tangible" social utility of what he's doing is not the only way the contemplative life assists humanity, it's just that as modern life progressed we insisted more abd more on tangible, material help as we lost sight of the intangible realm - and I submit this was a step towards nihilism, which is ultimately disbelief in the intangible.

    A holy man completely alone in his cave, having no contact with anyone, helps all mankind through the intangible realm - one, by becoming one with the Infinite he brings the Infinite down to earth and generates positive energy in the universe, and two, by example and hearsay, he reaches people psychologically and gives inspiration and comfort that at least some humans are realizing what God made us for, not social trivia.

    Traditionally, this intangible help was considered immensely more beneficial than anything tangible, because before the advent of nihilism the realm of spirit was seen as more important than the material realm (which was something of an illusion).

    As I said, modern nihilism can be said to be a loss of belief in the intangible, the realm of spirit, and an insistence on the material.

    Of course, advice and counsel have always had their place - after all, the Desert Father's left behind them a magnificent record of sayings well worth reading!

    think it depends on the person. When you give, it’s important to see that it’s not wasted. Because if you start giving out free things, too many may show up for it and it will create a moral hazard. I’m not saying this because I’m stingy, no. Not at all. It’s simply because I don’t like a situation where one part of able bodied society works (including mothers) and another doesn’t.

     

    Fair enough, but this is a "prudential" calculation that is not the calculation of God, certainly not in Christianity - we are told to give freely and without stint or calculation, not according to the wisdom of this world.

    Spiritual logic is different than worldly logic, and obeys different laws. Giving prudentially reinforces a certain logic of self-interest, but giving freely reinforces a morality of pure generosity - this may create an atmosphere conducive to moral reform, ad it is based on pure love, and ultimately it may be the calculated form of giving that creates long term moral hazard.

    That is what is so "startlingly" novel about Christianity - at least one of the things. It looked more deeply into the true sources of our problems than what is apparent on the surface.

    One may disagree with this, but it's good that we at least have this radical alternative perspective in view, which is why I was so opposed to AP rendering Christianity gutless and eviscerating it of all it's radical novelty.

    As to the change in the economic relationships that you propose in the post above – those are very substantial changes that would resemble European revolutions. It would require either a revolutionary type of awakening within the populace (and it wouldn’t be unanimous) or an armed revolution
     
    .

    Indeed, it would require nothing less than a drastic moral revolution - one that Christianity began long ago, and will culminate in the future, with God's light breaking into the world and setting everything alight.

    In the meantime, we can take what small steps we can.

    However, what you propose might only make things worse. To give free housing and to relieve men of any duties whatsoever is a very, very slippery slope. Sometimes it leads to social collapse, the way it did after the fall of the USSR. Then the weak suffer and it’s not right.
     
    I understand that this is the standard view, and is a big reason that such measures haven't been taken despite the means to doing so existing fir quite some time.

    However, as human beings we are all born with the right to free housing and enough land that's needed for our food - think of a hunter gatherer boring into a forest, he has "free" housing and food. By what right do the oligarchs monopolize all land and force us into a system of their devising?

    Is returning our birthright to us a moral hazard, or does forcing us into an artificial state of struggle for what is our by birth making us vicious?

    Also, you may want to consider that some people view work as a value of its own. Work is something that structures one’s life (of course, so does meditation & prayer), work is valuable not only in the results that it brings, or as a service to others, work can be viewed as something that promotes the Greek technē – a means to promote the development of the human being.

     

    Sure, I'd agree with this. But is this the kind of work that is done in a modern economy? There are forms of craftsmanship - techne, as you say - that are indeed a beautiful extension of our humanity, and a blacksmith, a basket weaver, a leather worker, a carver of statues from wood or stone, a hunter, may well be developing his humanity and even attaining union with the Infinite through his work.

    But of course, since the Industrial Revolution, this has not been most of our work. Factory work, office work, is a different beast.

    Even so, let us remember that the Greeks prized leisure and contemplation above all, and thought that too much time spent at a craft would distort one physically and spiritually.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @LatW

    Christianity without the pagan and animist elements which it adopted would be an entirely different, and impoverished beast, and so would Buddhism. We need legends and myths and fantasy and the sense that the world is alive. And what would Christianity be without Platonism!

    Christianity without Platonism would result in God – without all His hypostases – being closer to people. Now, God the Father is rather a reclusive, far-away character in Christianity.

    David Bentley Hart makes the interesting point that modern nihilism is so deep and intractable precisely because Christianity assumed into itself all the animism and paganism of the past and when it got discredited (through it’s alliance with power), we didn’t even have the “default” human spirituality of animism and paganism to fall back on. The whole package got discredited.

    This is a very good point. If the quasi-pagan cult of Mary, even now often known under her pagan name “Our Lady”, wanted to part with Christianity, it couldn’t leave Jesus the Jewish Messiah behind, even if it could leave God the Father…

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Platonism helped develop certain aspects implicit in the Christian conception of God.

    I wouldn't say God is reclusive in Christianity - in proper Christianity, God's "immanence" is heavily emphasized, but at the same time there is a very real danger that the concept of God devolves into a mere "superman" type, which is morally dangerous to worship.

    So you don't want God too close either or you get just a "creature" among creatures rather than the source of Goodness itself. Platonism was a good bulwark against this tendency.

    I don't know if you're familiar with Bruce Charlton - he's this atheist scientist who converted to Christianity, but decided to dispense with all the classical Greek metaphysics and theology. What he ended up with was a conception of God as a creature among creatures, a discrete entity among entities, imperfect and limited, a mere superman type, who at best assists humanity on its evolutionary path - an impoverished religion so far below the grandeur and majesty of classical metaphysics with it's conception of God as the ground of all being, as the source of Goodness itself rather than just a good thing, and as immanent in everything, that one almost prefers atheism. One also sees the influence of that dismal modern literalism that he no doubt couldn't shake off from his scientific training.

    As for the hypostases, people seem to desire intermediaries between themselves and God - angels, spirits, Mary, etc. Elite Hinduism is one of the purest forms of monotheism there is, but the Hindus could not dispense with all their colorful God's in the pantheon. Even the Buddhists needed their great Bodhisattva of compassion, Avalokiteshvara, and many others, besides.

    This corresponds to something in the human psyche.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  794. @AnonfromTN
    @Ivashka the fool

    I think he resigned before, because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk (told the truth for a change, which is unacceptable in Ukraine). That helo crash was a response to interior minister demand for a cut in money for selling Western weapons sent to Ukraine to third countries and/or in drug trafficking money made by Uki ministry of defence

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @LatW, @sudden death

    because he acknowledged that Uki anti-rocket fire was responsible for the blast of residential building in Dnepropetrovsk

    Regurgitation of RF made propjunk is strongly not recommended, because it is apparent they can’t afford to cite or show correctly even those things which may be perverted as being useful to Z purposes.

    Leaving aside the very truthufulness of it or not, what has been said in that live stream by participating Arestovich sounded way different than above citation – UA anti-air rocket shot down flying RF rocket in the air, which then fell on the building and blew up. Bit later he specifically wrote in his social media that without any doubt all responsibility for such situation and victims goes only for attacking side, but not the one which is defending itself from flying rockets by destroying them in the air while flying.

  795. @LatW
    @songbird

    Have you heard of the Celtic bear goddess Artio?

    There is a bear statue on Mount Sleza in Poland (on Czech border) that apparently dates back to 400BC and could be Celtic (La Tène culture). It must be those ancestors of Wends that Bashi is talking about.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/Poland_mount_Sleza_-_ancient_cult_figure.jpg

    In Balkans

    https://balkancelts.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/arm.jpg

    Replies: @LatW, @Another Polish Perspective

    Ślęża is not really on Czech border, it is closer to Wrocław (Breslau) than to Czech border. A mountain which is on the Polish-Czech border, is, for example, Śnieżnik, or Śnieżka.

    But it is true that Ślęża is supposed to have been some sacred pagan mountain. Andrzej Sapkowski in his Husitic trilogy depicted it as such too 😉

  796. @songbird
    @Blinky Bill

    IMO, it would be pretty easy for East Asians to turn it around.

    Koreans, at least, (and I think the Japanese too) seem to have pretty high asabiyyah. Like during the Debt Crisis when people donated $2 billion worth of personal jewelry.

    Replies: @Thulean Friend

    IMO, it would be pretty easy for East Asians to turn it around.

    Koreans, at least, (and I think the Japanese too) seem to have pretty high asabiyyah. Like during the Debt Crisis when people donated $2 billion worth of personal jewelry.

    I suspect East Asian fertility being lowest in the world probably has biological antecedents. You’re correct about higher tribalism, which reflects itself into manifested xenophobia. Japan and Korea have both opened up a smidgen in recent years but this all tentative and could easily be reversed. It’s a mixed bag: they don’t get many highly-skilled immigrants but they also don’t get the riff-raff.

    That said, a cardinal mistake 3rd world triumphalists fall into is assuming higher population will automatically lead to future influence. Pakistani diplomats keep stalking the halls of power with their begging bowls. Egypt was recently bailed out by IMF & Saudis, being forced to devalue its increasingly useless currency once more. It has now lost half its value against the USD in the past year alone.

    Why send in tanks when buying off a few local kleptocrats is sufficient? It’s cheaper, more durable while creating buy-in among local elites to do your bidding. For the richest, you don’t even need to give them money. They have that already. Just give them a reliable and hassle-free way to launder their ill-gotten gains into offshore accounts & luxurious overseas properties.

    In some ways this is a good development, because Western elites have found a way to control third world countries without overt colonialism or armed intervention, ultimately contributing to a more peaceful world. And why not? Certainly the 3rd world elites themselves seem to have a nice time, even the stateless ones:

    https://www.dirt.com/gallery/more-dirt/politicians/kurdistans-barzani-family-seeks-30-million-for-bowling-alley-equipped-beverly-hills-mansion-1203579381/barzani3/

    Who can blame them?

    • Agree: Ivashka the fool
    • Replies: @songbird
    @Thulean Friend


    I suspect East Asian fertility being lowest in the world probably has biological antecedents.
     
    Japan (1.3) actually has a higher TFR than Italy (1.24, or 1.18 for citizens) and a higher TFR than Chile (1.22). (PR has a TFR of 1, but not certain if it should be counted)

    So I'm not sure the premise holds up, in technical terms. Though, obviously, if we took averages, it would be true.

    I see a lot of low-hanging fruit, if they wanted to pick it. The TFR of their entertainment must be insanely low - that could be changed with directives or other inducements. They could gut their education industry which is highly over-developed (though there are a lot of special interests here), and try to shift away from credentialism. Am sure they could do something with housing to make it cheaper.

    Even if there is some special biological susceptibility to low TFR - that is bridgeable by changing the culture.

    Was recently reading a passage from some a book written by someone spending a few years in an Irish village, (what differed here from other travelers is that they had overwintered there) and I was blown away by mention of a custom that I had never heard of before. Apparently, on the day before Ash Wednesday, girls and boys aged 8-15 would go out hunting unmarried women and lasso them and throw them in the river (which must have been quite cold).

    This was a village near to where quite a lot of my ancestors lived. Irish genealogical records are generally pretty poor, but I had to look at them. And I was shocked to see that in this area, time and time again, for every marriage of my ancestors that I could find that had a surviving date, they had married in February or March.

    That said, a cardinal mistake 3rd world triumphalists fall into is assuming higher population will automatically lead to future influence.
     
    It's conceivable that in some countries it has led to brain drain, in effect, diminishing influence, even as the pop grows.

    Anyway, I think it is pretty obvious by now that neither Nigeria or Pakistan can be the equivalent of a peak Germany, through scale alone. I wonder what will happen, as some of these dreams of convergence burn out. Or, maybe, it has happened already?

    Pakistani diplomats keep stalking the halls of power with their begging bowls.
     
    Recently heard that Ukraine is getting artillery shells from Pakistan. Personally, I find something really disturbing about that.

    People talk about the declining influence of Europe a lot, like how the Chinese sent nobody important to WEF, but to think that Europeans are killing each other with weapons supplied from the Third World (whether sent to Russians or Ukrainians) that has to be some new lowpoint in European civilization.
  797. @S
    @Ivashka the fool

    Welcome back to the site, Bashybuzuk!

    About the 'racial purity' thing, my take on it is that is something for each people to decide just how 'pure' or 'impure they wish to be, or remain, once they've been given all the facts. This is something which should be treated collectively as sacrosanct, just as a person's physical body ideally is treated as sancrosanct.



    The thing is people haven't been given the facts and just about everywhere the 'mass immigration' thing is being put in place by diktat.

    The United States is the model for this.

    I believe I've pretty much proved in my post archives that chattel slavery and it's trade was not 'abolished' as proclaimed, but rather was monetized in the early 19th century with the introduction of wage slavery (ie specifically the so called 'cheap labor'/'mass immigration' system) in the United States, something which was put in place by diktat just as chattel slavery had been in 17th century Virginia and New England.

    The historic prime directive for the elite and their hangers on promoting either chattel or wage slavery is to do anything (but anything!) than pay their own people the prevailing real time local rates for labor. Importing by diktat alien chattel or wage slaves to do the work instead of hiring their own at fair living wages answers this call nicely...for them.

    This wage slavery system is the economic and political basis of the modern progressive Multi-Cultural state, a state which in many ways closely parallels the Anglosphere chattel slave holding society it directly evolved from, the 'immigrant' from a financial point of view, being the slave.

    This is what I mean when I say that, should they succeed in creating their 'United States of the World' global super state, it is to be a slavery based world order, just as the United States and the rest of the Anglosphere, with their wage slavery, are slavery based today.

    My guess is that their intention with the impending world war is they intend to wipe out the majority of most peoples, and that the bulk of the five hundred million survivors will be (purely by chance!) Sub-Saharan Africans with their dominant genes. They will be crudely used (as they are crudely being used now) to breed out of existance most of the non-Saharan survivors, so that the resulting vast majority of humanity will for practical purposes be 80 or 90% Sub-Saharan African in their genetic make up.

    In other words, most people are to be made into what are known in the vernacular as 'Blacks' with a likely 85 IQ.

    In regards to a declaration that was heard recently, but with a slight addendum, see below. After the world war, and with the proper conditioning, providing someone or something doesn't intervene first, it could maybe be done:

    'You will have nothing, and you will work for nothing, and you will be happy.'

    Replies: @silviosilver, @AnonfromTN

    About the ‘racial purity’ thing, my take on it is that is something for each people to decide just how ‘pure’ or ‘impure they wish to be, or remain, once they’ve been given all the facts. This is something which should be treated collectively as sacrosanct, just as a person’s physical body ideally is treated as sancrosanct.

    I’ll be blunt: by itself that is inadequate to the task of actual preservation. It is, however, a very useful attitude, or a useful orientation, to promote towards race and racial thinking during the all-important ‘preparatory’ stage – preparatory in the sense of drawing sufficient attention to the issue and generating sufficient concern over it, an attention and concern without which all will surely be lost and the white man’s epitaph will read “Too few knew, fewer still cared.”

    Even if he’s aware of the terminal nature of the status quo, I can understand perfectly well why someone might wish to sidestep questions of “so, what do you want to do then?”, both in order not to generate counterproductive alarm, as well as for the simpler reason that things are so up in the air, that who the hell knows what the future holds? Nevertheless, it is from time to time worth reminding ourselves that preservationist efforts must satisfy certain requirements, or there won’t be any preservation at all.

    In Richard McCulloch’s words, “Racial preservation has to be based on racial reality. It has to face the facts, ask the right questions and provide the right answers, however difficult they may be.” Reality, not fantasy. The right questions, not irrelevancies. Correct answers, not falsehoods. And it is difficult. Very, very difficult. To be a ‘racist’ today is to play life on the hardest difficulty setting. For many people, a proper understanding of the racial predicament is the worst news they ever heard. The worst news in all of recorded and unrecorded history. There’s a reason so many of them seem to go postal when they begin to wrap their minds around it. (Although people usually tune out well before they reach such an understanding. The very idea that there’s anything to even think about appalls them.)

    The most difficult aspect, I think, is understanding that, in the long-term, racial preservation requires (using McCulloch’s term) reproductive isolation. McCulloch was concerned with nordic/northwest European preservation specifically, although he has relaxed that ‘requirement’ more recently, but the same logic applies to any race, however one defines it. It’s nothing less than a question of potential permanence or certain oblivion. To pretend otherwise is to be like a man who has jumped off the 20th storey and as he passes the 10th he wonders what all the fuss is about, “I’m still alive, what’s everyone so worried about?”

    Traditionally, WNs who have understood this have reacted maximally urgently, maximally insultingly, and maximally threateningly, all of which have been tremendous mistakes – a full frontal assault on what ‘the regime’ has plowed immense financial, physical and psychological resources in preparation for. (I like to say Sun Tzu would have had their guts for garters.) In the same essay from which I quoted above, McCulloch writes:

    Is there anything we could offer the groups selected for separation that would significantly lessen their opposition to it? What could be done to accommodate those groups, to lessen their opposition to separation, and possibly even gain some measure of support?

    If I’ve ever made any original contribution to the debate, I would like to think that it’s answering with a resounding yes to that question. My answer depends completely on WN willingness to comply with the sort of partitioning outlined by McCulloch (not necessarily that one in particular, but something along those lines). That in turn requires a great deal of trust, trust which for a long time I thought would never be forthcoming, but I have come to believe – hopefully not too foolishly – that such an accommodation could indeed be reached and maintained. Where there’s a will there’s a way, and where there’s racial goodwill, a way forward can be found.

    • Thanks: LatW
    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don't get the cause - then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it - without answering these questions clearly there is no solution to the problem.

    Regarding the separation aspect and the manners to make it desirable for those you would like to separate from, as long as they're more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.

    One has to make it desirable, even vital, for them to go back. It took a massacre of unprecedented proportions and a complete overhaul of the pre-war life, to make most European Jews even want to try to consider relocating to Palestine. And even that way more than half of them preferred relocating to America. It took Perestroika to make Soviet Jews emigrate, and again - many chose to go West.

    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It's not doable.

    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?

    Answer this first.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @A123, @Sher Singh, @Dmitry, @AP, @silviosilver

    , @S
    @silviosilver


    Where there’s a will there’s a way, and where there’s racial goodwill, a way forward can be found.
     
    I very much agree with that. Thanks for the post.
    , @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver


    The most difficult aspect, I think, is understanding that, in the long-term, racial preservation requires (using McCulloch’s term) reproductive isolation. McCulloch was concerned with nordic/northwest European preservation specifically, although he has relaxed that ‘requirement’ more recently, but the same logic applies to any race, however one defines it. It’s nothing less than a question of potential permanence or certain oblivion. To pretend otherwise is to be like a man who has jumped off the 20th storey and as he passes the 10th he wonders what all the fuss is about, “I’m still alive, what’s everyone so worried about?”
     
    Completely uncontroversial outside christendom & almos unworkable within it.

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/777363024196796426/852791619115417620/unknown.png

    Really says a lot that they see no way to control their women outside apocalyptic ethnic cleansing.


    There’s a reason so many of them seem to go postal when they begin to wrap their minds around it.
     
    No, it's because IQ & impulse control correlate with class & WNs tend to be on the lower end..
  798. Egypt was recently bailed out by IMF & Saudis, being forced to devalue its increasingly useless currency once more. It has now lost half its value against the USD in the past year alone

    Quite possible that this is the result of a loss of faith in fiat currencies in general and it just so happens that it is hitting the developing countries first.

  799. @Ron Unz
    I just happened to watch the latest short interview with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Qs21LFWtQ

    He claims that the Ukrainians have probably lost almost 160,000 dead and the Russians perhaps 20,000 or less. The Ukrainians may have also suffered another 300,000 wounded. He seems to think that the outcome of the war might well be the collapse of NATO.

    He sounds awfully, awfully confident that he knows what he's talking about, though others can judge for themselves. Wars have an objective existence, and eventually everyone will have to acknowledge the difference between propagandistic fantasies and factual reality.

    I'm curious what most of you think about these sorts of strong claims.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Greasy William, @Sean, @Chebyshev, @Antiwar7, @QCIC, @Mikel, @LatW, @Antiwar7, @Wokechoke, @Miro23

    Col. Douglas Macgregor has the top level experience, and has been saying for some time that Russia has the strategic advantage: better military industrial capacity, better supply situation and now, the right equipment and right troops in the right places. So, in his opinion, it’s just a matter of time until Ukraine capitulates – or Nuland/ Kagan do something crazy and nuclear (always possible). He does allow that possibility.

    The latest news seems to show the Russians advancing and the Ukrainians in trouble.

    Looking at Macgregor’s latest videos, he regards the supply of advanced Western equipment as too little and too late. Also, it requires too much training, its often non-compatible, hard to get to the right place and lacks the air cover it was designed for.

  800. @silviosilver
    @S


    About the ‘racial purity’ thing, my take on it is that is something for each people to decide just how ‘pure’ or ‘impure they wish to be, or remain, once they’ve been given all the facts. This is something which should be treated collectively as sacrosanct, just as a person’s physical body ideally is treated as sancrosanct.
     
    I'll be blunt: by itself that is inadequate to the task of actual preservation. It is, however, a very useful attitude, or a useful orientation, to promote towards race and racial thinking during the all-important 'preparatory' stage - preparatory in the sense of drawing sufficient attention to the issue and generating sufficient concern over it, an attention and concern without which all will surely be lost and the white man's epitaph will read "Too few knew, fewer still cared."

    Even if he's aware of the terminal nature of the status quo, I can understand perfectly well why someone might wish to sidestep questions of "so, what do you want to do then?", both in order not to generate counterproductive alarm, as well as for the simpler reason that things are so up in the air, that who the hell knows what the future holds? Nevertheless, it is from time to time worth reminding ourselves that preservationist efforts must satisfy certain requirements, or there won't be any preservation at all.

    In Richard McCulloch's words, "Racial preservation has to be based on racial reality. It has to face the facts, ask the right questions and provide the right answers, however difficult they may be." Reality, not fantasy. The right questions, not irrelevancies. Correct answers, not falsehoods. And it is difficult. Very, very difficult. To be a 'racist' today is to play life on the hardest difficulty setting. For many people, a proper understanding of the racial predicament is the worst news they ever heard. The worst news in all of recorded and unrecorded history. There's a reason so many of them seem to go postal when they begin to wrap their minds around it. (Although people usually tune out well before they reach such an understanding. The very idea that there's anything to even think about appalls them.)

    The most difficult aspect, I think, is understanding that, in the long-term, racial preservation requires (using McCulloch's term) reproductive isolation. McCulloch was concerned with nordic/northwest European preservation specifically, although he has relaxed that 'requirement' more recently, but the same logic applies to any race, however one defines it. It's nothing less than a question of potential permanence or certain oblivion. To pretend otherwise is to be like a man who has jumped off the 20th storey and as he passes the 10th he wonders what all the fuss is about, "I'm still alive, what's everyone so worried about?"

    Traditionally, WNs who have understood this have reacted maximally urgently, maximally insultingly, and maximally threateningly, all of which have been tremendous mistakes - a full frontal assault on what 'the regime' has plowed immense financial, physical and psychological resources in preparation for. (I like to say Sun Tzu would have had their guts for garters.) In the same essay from which I quoted above, McCulloch writes:

    Is there anything we could offer the groups selected for separation that would significantly lessen their opposition to it? What could be done to accommodate those groups, to lessen their opposition to separation, and possibly even gain some measure of support?

    If I've ever made any original contribution to the debate, I would like to think that it's answering with a resounding yes to that question. My answer depends completely on WN willingness to comply with the sort of partitioning outlined by McCulloch (not necessarily that one in particular, but something along those lines). That in turn requires a great deal of trust, trust which for a long time I thought would never be forthcoming, but I have come to believe - hopefully not too foolishly - that such an accommodation could indeed be reached and maintained. Where there's a will there's a way, and where there's racial goodwill, a way forward can be found.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @S, @Sher Singh

    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don’t get the cause – then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it – without answering these questions clearly there is no solution to the problem.

    Regarding the separation aspect and the manners to make it desirable for those you would like to separate from, as long as they’re more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.

    One has to make it desirable, even vital, for them to go back. It took a massacre of unprecedented proportions and a complete overhaul of the pre-war life, to make most European Jews even want to try to consider relocating to Palestine. And even that way more than half of them preferred relocating to America. It took Perestroika to make Soviet Jews emigrate, and again – many chose to go West.

    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It’s not doable.

    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?

    Answer this first.

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @Ivashka the fool


    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?
     
    It might be the contraceptive pill?
    , @A123
    @Ivashka the fool


    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don’t get the cause – then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it
     

    Cause: Islamic SJW's want to diminish Judeo-Christian beliefs as that threatens their multiculturalist dogma.

    Cause: MegaCorporations want to diminish the power of citizen workers. Inflating the supply of labour makes everything they do cheaper.

    Cause: Government authoritarians want to push citizens onto the dole. This makes them compliant with large government as it is linked to their survival.

    The exact mix of these three interrelated causes vary by location, but they are the top contenders.


    as long as they’re more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.
    ...
    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It’s not doable.
     

    America has an issue dating back "centuries". Limiting the question "decades" is much more practical. The U.S. has all sorts of doable options:

    • Bringing legal migration to near zero.
    • Ending drop location "birthright" citizenship for illegals, refugees, tourists, and all other temporary visas. This does not require a Constitutional Amendment.
    • Could the Minneapolis Somalis, including Ilhan Omar, be rounded up and sent back to Africa? Yes. It would be very doable.

    Islam is about 1% of the total U.S. population..... Yet: (1)


    There’s one place in America where they are vastly over-represented. -- State prisons.

    Take Maryland, which has an estimated 70,000 Muslims, making up over 1% of the population. But of Maryland’s 18,562 prisoners, 5,084 were Muslims.

    That’s 27.4% or over 1 in 4 prisoners.

    It would also mean that 1 out of 13 Muslims in Maryland may have been in a state prison.

    Those are startling numbers, yet they come from Muslim Advocates, an Islamist legal advocacy group. Both MA’s numbers and the number of Muslims in different states may be miscounted, yet these figures raise serious questions about public safety and the toll that immigration is taking on our communities.
     

    An outright prohibition on Islam would be desirable, but require a Constitutional Amendment. However, restoring Judeo-Christian values and ethics to the public square would render open Islamists a tainted & shunned underclass only capable of menial work. It would naturally breed, convert, and marry out over time.

     

    The Jihad problem in Europe is much more dramatic. De-Islamification is necessary, doable, and very hard. Sweden & Germany may be lost causes that have to be walled off to contain the threat.

    Incidentally, this is another reason why the EU needs to be dissolved. The idea of Schengen transit will have to end as part of the strategy to expel Jihadists. If they can move freely it will extend the problem for yet more decades. Any place declaring as "sanctuary" must be isolated.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.jihadwatch.org/2019/08/in-5-states-1-in-5-prisoners-are-muslim

    Replies: @216

    , @Sher Singh
    @Ivashka the fool

    You just deny citizenship & tax industries which employ them.
    You don't even need cleansing or separation pre se - just restore patriarchy.

    Obviously, the type who would do that will also ethnically cleanse.
    However, a patriarchal society will get a TFR closer to 6 & out-breed migrants.

    What stands in between is the obedience & moral supremacism of Hajnal Euros

    https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/147470491501300114

    Feminists were extolling communal living v the nuclear family awhile back.
    This reduces the child-rearing load on the mother.
    From entire tribes/clans raising kids full-time we no longer have even mothers.

    Perhaps, the Left will come to these solutions however, they won't be racialist.
    At the same time, the elitism among those circles acts as a strong racial filter.

    , @Dmitry
    @Ivashka the fool

    Soviet "Jews" going to Israel is not related to the holocaust except in some ideological propaganda that might be presented for charities. In reality, because of being opportunity to go live in developed country (in terms of income and public services), even though not a desirable developed country, from country with low income and the always increasing asset stripping of public sphere.*

    If Israel had open borders with Russia (instead of closing borders except with people that have documentary evidence of Jewish grandparent, which is maybe less than one or two percent of the population), then the immigration would be around 30 million Russians immigrating to Israel between 2000-2020. https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-151/#comment-4701156 Possibly higher as cities which had larger Jewish minority include Moscow and Saint-Petersburg that lowers the emigration number (for obvious reason) compared to other parts of the country.

    If a country like UK or France had open borders with Russia, then half of the young population would have emigrated from Russia within a few years, especially from the provincial areas. This is before recent events. Imagine if Australia was opening border, where there are beaches and warm weather.

    Before recent events, millions of young people would just emigrate to work in MacDonald's. For example, McDonald’s in Australia pays $18 an hour for the same job that McDonald’s in Russia pays $1,90 an hour (and still has no problem with recruitment). 9,5 McDonald’s employees in Russia are equivalent value to 1 McDonald’s employee in Australia.

    Media space in Russia doesn't talk about this for ideological reasons, but all countries in this development level have the same problem and lower in the ranking has more problems - Uzbekistan rejects the Kremlin invitation to join the open border space every year because of they don't want to lose even more of their people.

    -

    *Elite things are something different which I don't understand. Why Kudrin was registering Israeli citizenship this year before becoming manager of Yandex.


    cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it
     
    BBC has published an interesting article about Japan, where they say it's a very happy charming country, people lived well there, but the society is aging and dying, population falls, without adequate immigration, property prices fall.

    But the author doesn't connect the two sides. There is happy, charming country, partly related to the population decline without immigration, property price fall is bad for owners, but housing was more affordable for buyers, ecology improves, there are more wild spaces, there are higher teacher to student ratio in schools, the traffice jam is smaller.

    They don't seem to understand there are normal mix of pluses and minuses with the political choice of a developed country's immigration policy. E.g. "Large parts of the country could return to the wild." This is usual mix of good and bad.
    https://twitter.com/JeromeTaylor/status/1616995825594544128

    Replies: @Dmitry, @Ivashka the fool

    , @AP
    @Ivashka the fool

    Does this seem to be a worthwhile book?


    https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-scythian-empire-book-review-history-the-riders-from-the-steppe-11674233967

    ‘The Scythian Empire’ Review: The Riders From the Steppe
    A powerful central Asian culture left its mark on civilizations from the Black Sea to the Yellow River, but history has better remembered its successors.

    Scholarly depth and breadth rarely meet on equal terms. In “The Scythian Empire: Central Eurasia and the Birth of the Classical Age From Persia to China,” Christopher I. Beckwith marries the two to memorable effect.



    A professor of Eurasian studies at Indiana University Bloomington, Mr. Beckwith asserts the primacy of the Scythian Empire’s influence on the classical age. The Scythians, pastoral nomads who roamed the Central Eurasian steppe zone from around the eighth century B.C., are traditionally dismissed as uncouth predators whose legacy was negative, inconsequential or, at best, ambiguous. In the fifth century B.C., Aristophanes portrayed oafish, heavily accented Scythians policing Athens, while Herodotus decried their rule over the vanquished for its “violence and . . . pride”: “besides exacting from each the tribute which was assessed, they rode about the land carrying off everyone’s possessions.” Yet to Mr. Beckwith, the Scythians represent “one of the least known but most influential realms in all of world history.”

    Historians have acknowledged Scythian innovations, including an unprecedented feudal structure, monotheism and sophisticated weapons—namely, short composite bows that allowed mounted archers greater range of movement. These practices are typically thought to have been copied by their better-known imperial successors, the Medes and Persians. Mr. Beckwith contends, however, that the Medes and Persians were actually “creolized” Scythians.

    Pre-Scythian Medes inhabited parts of contemporary Iran, Turkey and Iraq; theirs was “strictly a geographical region, not an ethnolinguistic entity or a political unit,” according to Mr. Beckwith. A fully realized Mede polity dates to Cyaxares’s overthrow of the Scythians (ca. 620 B.C.). “Raised as a Scythian,” Cyaxares is not known to have altered any “inherited Scythian clothing, weapons, state structure, religious beliefs, etc,” Mr. Beckwith writes. To do so would have gone against the grain, “because by that time . . . the Scythians . . . and the native peoples had merged.”

    The reigns of the Medes and Persians, initiated by coups, were validated by their leaders’ identification with the Scythians’ royal lineage. Cyaxares, who led an allied force against the Assyrians, captured and destroyed Nineveh in 612 B.C. He was followed by his purported son, Astyages. Cyrus II, Astyages’s Persian grandson, in turn seized power in 550 B.C. Carrying on the Scytho-Mede line, Cyrus “kept the Empire and the entire imperial system intact—with the exception of the religious element—when he overthrew the Mede king.” Mr. Beckwith refers to this longest-lasting iteration as the Scytho-Mede-Persian Empire.

    If the Medes and Persians were, in essential respects, Scythian by another name, why was the Scythian system so attractive to usurpers and impervious to change? The appeals of Scythian feudalism were its religious justification and the coherence of its “package”—the sovereign served the one God of Heaven and was supported by an evolving pyramid of vassals. Religion legitimized the king and imbued his subjects, direct and indirect, with divine purpose. Later claimants, Mr. Beckwith observes, could not retain their feudal hierarchy without its religious underpinning.

    Proof can be found in the short-lived polytheism of Cyrus and Cambyses II: “They clearly did not understand,” Mr. Beckwith points out, “that because local ‘national God’ cults legitimized local national rulers, i.e., independent kings, a single unified empire required a single ruler legitimized by a single God.” Darius I restored the status quo ante, declaring, “The Great God is Ahuramazdā, who created this earth, who created that heaven, who created man, who created happiness for man, who made Darius king, one king of many, one lord of many.”

    Mr. Beckwith cites linguistic evidence for the Scythians’ widespread legacy. Three cities called Agamatāna were built by Scythians (or Scythian speakers) “at the same time, but very far apart”: the Mede capital in modern-day Iran and, thousands of miles to the east, successive capitals of the Scytho-Chinese state of Chao. The author also notes that variants of the Scythian word for “royal line,” Aria, preserved its meaning in Bactrian, Old Persian and Chinese: “This word Harya . . . came to be used by Chinese speakers in the fourth century B.C. to refer to themselves, i.e., ‘us the Chinese’, meaning those who belonged to the legitimate ruling lineage, Harya.” A national signifier from Iran to China, Aria attests to Scythian reach.

    An epilogue on capital-P Philosophy considers Scythian links to the “first great philosophers” of Greece, Iran, India and China: Anacharsis (“the Scythian”), Zoroaster, Gautama (“the Scythian Sage”) and Laotzu. Anacharsis, an early Greek Skeptic was half Scythian by birth and education. Zoroaster’s Gathas (“Hymns”) were composed in Old Avestan, an archaic dialect of Imperial Scythian. Gautama hailed from northwestern India or Central Asia, “regions known to have been ruled by the Scythians, Scytho-Medes, and related peoples who succeeded them.” Mr. Beckwith transcribes the foreign-born Laotzu’s full name, Lao-tan—“lao” was formerly pronounced like “k’ao”—into the Sanskrit Gautama. For Mr. Beckwith, the simultaneous appearance of these revolutionary figures and ideas was no coincidence. Rejecting the belief that ancient cultures were conceived locally, he proposes that the Scythians were the common denominator that “produced the great shared cultural flowering known as the Classical Age.”

    Of Mr. Beckwith’s eight fresh and penetrating chapters, only the sixth, on Classical Scythian philology, is likely to challenge the nonspecialist. For the rest of the text, his prose and data-driven analysis are clear. But superior delivery does not on its own set his book apart. “The Scythian Empire” is simply, dazzlingly original. Ever-narrowing fields of academic study and inability to see the whole historical picture, he suggests, partly explain the Scythians’ discredit and neglect. As for Mr. Beckwith, his curiosity, imagination and learning—from the Yellow River to the Danube, from archaeology to linguistics—do what every history ought to do but few achieve: compel the reader to think.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Another Polish Perspective

    , @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?
     
    It's been asked and answered a thousand times. Competently answered, too. There are multiple reasons, though for any of them one can always ask "well why did that happen?" and then put the same question to whatever answer is given, like a child pestering his parents with an infinite series of "but why?" At some point, this has to be seen simply as an obstructionist tactic.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  801. @Greasy William
    I don't think some people understand just how dark Russia's strategic situation is. Here are two factors I've finally come to realize in the last few days after earlier believing that Russia was in decent shape:

    1. Ukraine has essentially unlimited manpower to tap should it prove necessary. Ultimately, Ukraine has 5 million guys it can mobilize if it needs to. More still if it makes heavy use of women in non combat roles. And more further still when considering mercenaries and foreign "advisors". There is ZERO possibility of Russia winning this war through attrition

    2. Even if the US were to totally end all aid to Ukraine, and I don't see that happening, Europe + Canada + UK can easily fill the gap. This is true even if there is a global financial crisis (as I believe there will be). It's just that the economic resources available to the West are so incredibly huge that it is able to outproduce Russia by using only a fraction of its (the West's) GDP.

    The only way Russia could be bailed out now is if the financial crisis that is set to begin in May is so severe that it politically roils the West to the point that the West is unable, or unwilling, to provide Ukraine with sufficient arms and funds to continue fighting. Now I could see there maybe being a situation where the West doesn't supply Ukraine with enough to drive Russia out of Ukraine, but I really cannot think of any scenario where the West doesn't continue to provide Ukraine with enough to prevent full Russian conquest.


    So right now, I can't see Russia winning. Even if Russia got its act together and fully mobilized, I don't think that will be enough. And if the front line gets stalemated, I definitely would expect Western backed Ukraine to defeat Russia in a "war of the missiles" once the West has had the chance to properly arm the Ukrainians. The longer this thing goes on, the worse it is going to get for Russia.

    I don't believe the West will allow Ukraine to retake Crimea or the far eastern regions of the Ukraine that Russia had pre invasion, but I do think that ultimately Russia is going to lose all of it's other gains from this operation.

    Right now, I'm thinking this most likely ends with a return to Feb '21 borders and Putin stepping down (the only good thing to come from this madness).

    What a fiasco.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @QCIC, @Wokechoke

    Generally an army as an institution morally collapses when the stochastic chance of being killed reaches a probability of 1. When the dead and maimed begin to equal the initial numbers of an army deployed.

    France reached that point in 1917. Germany reached that moment in 1918. Ottoman Empire too. The Russian Empire famously had a moral collapse of its army in 1917. Germany only avoided it for a year because it was fed on a steady diet of victory up to the Kaiserschlacht battles: Michael, Georgette and Blucher and Freidensturm…where they lost 700,000 men a week or two.

    The British military avoided this by deft management of creature comforts and troop rotation but another year of campaigning would have crippled them.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Wokechoke

    so what are you saying? That if Russia inflicts enough casualties on the Ukrainian army this year, the Ukrainians will give up?

    Replies: @A123, @Emil Nikola Richard

  802. @silviosilver
    @S


    About the ‘racial purity’ thing, my take on it is that is something for each people to decide just how ‘pure’ or ‘impure they wish to be, or remain, once they’ve been given all the facts. This is something which should be treated collectively as sacrosanct, just as a person’s physical body ideally is treated as sancrosanct.
     
    I'll be blunt: by itself that is inadequate to the task of actual preservation. It is, however, a very useful attitude, or a useful orientation, to promote towards race and racial thinking during the all-important 'preparatory' stage - preparatory in the sense of drawing sufficient attention to the issue and generating sufficient concern over it, an attention and concern without which all will surely be lost and the white man's epitaph will read "Too few knew, fewer still cared."

    Even if he's aware of the terminal nature of the status quo, I can understand perfectly well why someone might wish to sidestep questions of "so, what do you want to do then?", both in order not to generate counterproductive alarm, as well as for the simpler reason that things are so up in the air, that who the hell knows what the future holds? Nevertheless, it is from time to time worth reminding ourselves that preservationist efforts must satisfy certain requirements, or there won't be any preservation at all.

    In Richard McCulloch's words, "Racial preservation has to be based on racial reality. It has to face the facts, ask the right questions and provide the right answers, however difficult they may be." Reality, not fantasy. The right questions, not irrelevancies. Correct answers, not falsehoods. And it is difficult. Very, very difficult. To be a 'racist' today is to play life on the hardest difficulty setting. For many people, a proper understanding of the racial predicament is the worst news they ever heard. The worst news in all of recorded and unrecorded history. There's a reason so many of them seem to go postal when they begin to wrap their minds around it. (Although people usually tune out well before they reach such an understanding. The very idea that there's anything to even think about appalls them.)

    The most difficult aspect, I think, is understanding that, in the long-term, racial preservation requires (using McCulloch's term) reproductive isolation. McCulloch was concerned with nordic/northwest European preservation specifically, although he has relaxed that 'requirement' more recently, but the same logic applies to any race, however one defines it. It's nothing less than a question of potential permanence or certain oblivion. To pretend otherwise is to be like a man who has jumped off the 20th storey and as he passes the 10th he wonders what all the fuss is about, "I'm still alive, what's everyone so worried about?"

    Traditionally, WNs who have understood this have reacted maximally urgently, maximally insultingly, and maximally threateningly, all of which have been tremendous mistakes - a full frontal assault on what 'the regime' has plowed immense financial, physical and psychological resources in preparation for. (I like to say Sun Tzu would have had their guts for garters.) In the same essay from which I quoted above, McCulloch writes:

    Is there anything we could offer the groups selected for separation that would significantly lessen their opposition to it? What could be done to accommodate those groups, to lessen their opposition to separation, and possibly even gain some measure of support?

    If I've ever made any original contribution to the debate, I would like to think that it's answering with a resounding yes to that question. My answer depends completely on WN willingness to comply with the sort of partitioning outlined by McCulloch (not necessarily that one in particular, but something along those lines). That in turn requires a great deal of trust, trust which for a long time I thought would never be forthcoming, but I have come to believe - hopefully not too foolishly - that such an accommodation could indeed be reached and maintained. Where there's a will there's a way, and where there's racial goodwill, a way forward can be found.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @S, @Sher Singh

    Where there’s a will there’s a way, and where there’s racial goodwill, a way forward can be found.

    I very much agree with that. Thanks for the post.

  803. @AaronB
    @silviosilver

    Ok, so you make a pretty good point about aristocrats, and you've brought to light areas that need to be clarified and distinctions that need to be made.

    Of course you're right that aristocrats were an endlessly scheming, plotting, backstabbing, poisoning, rebelling lot, and of course it was about position and advantage at court and all that. In fact I'd say aristocrats in this sense were more strivy than the bourgeois and were often disgustingly sycophantic and self-abasing in their jockeying for position.

    But this kind of thing is compatible with a life of refined leisure, in fact it's the sort of "game" one might play freed from the burdens of working for a living and freed from excessive social anxiety :) Aristocrats had a certain baseline security that came with inherited rank and status that significantly reduced the social anxiety that characterized the bourgeois striver.

    So for instance it's characteristic of a bourgeois striver to anxiously display his success - drive a Mercedes, wear expensive watches, dress more flamboyantly, drop veiled allusions to his wealth and success in conversation, etc - whereas aristocrats cultivated understated elegance - sometimes letting themselves go into what might be called "elegant dishevelment" which a bourgeois would not dare emulate - and a conversational style that featured self-depreciation as it's trademark.

    It was sort of an "anti-striving" culture in a way - another feature of this anti-striver mentality was the cultivation of a certain languid, relaxed, utterly at ease personal style - visible striving, visible effort, was seen as ""vulgar". All had to be easy, effortless, relaxed.

    Now, as for labor - freed from the burdens of working for a living, aristocrats played "games", either hunting, sports, adventuring, duelling, or created salons where sophisticated conversations would last long into the night and all the great wits of the day would attend, patronized art or poetry, and had lavish banquets.

    The point is, the bourgeois mentality of "hard work" for the purpose of accumulating mere money and the sort of sober, plodding, nose to the grindstone advancement through a career, all accompanied by social anxiety and thus insisting on a dull respectability and conformity to convention, was not the aristocratic lifestyle.

    Mind you, I'm not necessarily defending the aristocratic lifestyle - at its worst, it was unbearably artificial, pompous, wasteful, and viciously arrogant and cruel to the lower classes, but at its best it presented certain very attractive features compared to the dull conventionality of bourgeois life.

    To the Greeks, "leisure" was an explicit ideal, celebrated as the highest end of life - for the Chinese likewise, refined leisure was explicitly celebrated as the highest sort of life. Indeed for all pre-bourgouis cultures leisure was the highest form of life and work was not celebrated for its own sake. Modern bourgeois culture is perhaps the first in history to celebrate work and make it into an intrinsic virtue - and this is in fact a massive revolution in human affairs (which in my view must be overturned :) ). All previous cultures celebrated the contemplative life as the highest.

    And it is my belief that the modern celebration of work and disvaluing of the contemplative life is somehow at the very heart of modern nihilism, and that is a very significant fact.

    As a final remark, of course there was also an aristocratic tradition of "service", often military, and the English aristocracy often provided motivated and self-sacrificing officers and empire-builders to their country - and this was a very attractive thing indeed.

    But this too is a far cry from the kind bourgeois hard work celebration of someone like AP :)

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Coconuts, @AP

    For a lot of people the thing that separates them from a life of choosing between heating their home and eating decent food is they adopted an ethic of hard work. Life on the dole is for subsistence survival minimum.

    I suppose living off your parents might be better. I used to have a tennis buddy who liked to mock me for serving the man. He lived with his mother who ordered him to get up before noon and was appalled at his lack of character.

  804. @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don't get the cause - then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it - without answering these questions clearly there is no solution to the problem.

    Regarding the separation aspect and the manners to make it desirable for those you would like to separate from, as long as they're more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.

    One has to make it desirable, even vital, for them to go back. It took a massacre of unprecedented proportions and a complete overhaul of the pre-war life, to make most European Jews even want to try to consider relocating to Palestine. And even that way more than half of them preferred relocating to America. It took Perestroika to make Soviet Jews emigrate, and again - many chose to go West.

    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It's not doable.

    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?

    Answer this first.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @A123, @Sher Singh, @Dmitry, @AP, @silviosilver

    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?

    It might be the contraceptive pill?

  805. @Wokechoke
    @Greasy William

    Generally an army as an institution morally collapses when the stochastic chance of being killed reaches a probability of 1. When the dead and maimed begin to equal the initial numbers of an army deployed.

    France reached that point in 1917. Germany reached that moment in 1918. Ottoman Empire too. The Russian Empire famously had a moral collapse of its army in 1917. Germany only avoided it for a year because it was fed on a steady diet of victory up to the Kaiserschlacht battles: Michael, Georgette and Blucher and Freidensturm...where they lost 700,000 men a week or two.


    The British military avoided this by deft management of creature comforts and troop rotation but another year of campaigning would have crippled them.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    so what are you saying? That if Russia inflicts enough casualties on the Ukrainian army this year, the Ukrainians will give up?

    • Replies: @A123
    @Greasy William


    so what are you saying? That if Russia inflicts enough casualties on the Ukrainian army this year, the Ukrainians will give up?
     
    Ukrainians do not need to "give up". They have to "become rational".

    Kiev regime aggression is propped up by foreign funding. This will be reduced by Fall/Winter this year, unless France & Germany step up in a huge way.

    High casualties plus a shortage of war material will make Zelensky's dream of retaking Crimea appear suicidal to the Ukrainian people. After that -- there will be new, agreement capable, leadership Kiev.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @A123

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Greasy William

    Not exactly. What is likely to happen is they will become the Euro version of Palestine with vastly reduced territory a European Gaza Strip. Periodically they will pay teenagers to throw rocks at and suicide bomb the Russian oppressors. P~.8.

    No jets, no tanks, AK-47's a black market item. With the mega market right over the border the black market will be large. The ones in control of the AK-47's won't be pointing them at any Russians.

    Replies: @A123

  806. @Sher Singh
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Looking for continuation is a scourge of prehistory, which, I was told once, came from politics. If you could show “your” people were somewhere in bygone times, you could claim the land where you found the remnants!
     
    Excellent point & explains a lot of the everything was Germanic/Nordic theories.

    Thanks!

    Replies: @Coconuts

    German Aryanism and Pan-Germanism from the late 19th and early 20th centuries is like a whole mythology. They made quite a great story out of it.

    Possibly some of the anti-Enlightenment and Folkish thinkers the Woke draw on were also part of the inspiration for it, so the continued influence of wokeness will mean attention keeps getting drawn back to it.

  807. @Ivashka the fool
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Do what you want about your ancestors, and I will do what I want about mine. I will honor mine, feel free to despise yours. To each his own.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    So how exactly do you go about honoring your ancestors? Both Buddhists and Orthodox Christians honor their immediate ancestors perhaps somewhat similarly. Besides prayers, food is communally shared by the family and friends of the dearly departed by the Orthodox community after the moleben commemoration service. For Buddhists, its a little bit different, where the food is offered at the gravesite of the deceased relative. Also, for the moleben service, a booklet is used to include the names of the departed, however, I’ve seen as many as three pages of names listed within the booklet, but nowhere the names going back as far as the Corded ware, Beaker-Bell or even the Indo European period.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Mr. Hack

    Oh, and I'm pretty sure that at the end of the recitation of names within the prayer book there's a catch all phrase including all of the ancestors not recited...so formally there's a nod to those ancestors as well. But you're not an Orthodox Christian, so do you do so in a Buddhist fashion then, or some other way?

  808. @Mr. Hack
    @Ivashka the fool

    So how exactly do you go about honoring your ancestors? Both Buddhists and Orthodox Christians honor their immediate ancestors perhaps somewhat similarly. Besides prayers, food is communally shared by the family and friends of the dearly departed by the Orthodox community after the moleben commemoration service. For Buddhists, its a little bit different, where the food is offered at the gravesite of the deceased relative. Also, for the moleben service, a booklet is used to include the names of the departed, however, I've seen as many as three pages of names listed within the booklet, but nowhere the names going back as far as the Corded ware, Beaker-Bell or even the Indo European period.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Oh, and I’m pretty sure that at the end of the recitation of names within the prayer book there’s a catch all phrase including all of the ancestors not recited…so formally there’s a nod to those ancestors as well. But you’re not an Orthodox Christian, so do you do so in a Buddhist fashion then, or some other way?

  809. @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don't get the cause - then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it - without answering these questions clearly there is no solution to the problem.

    Regarding the separation aspect and the manners to make it desirable for those you would like to separate from, as long as they're more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.

    One has to make it desirable, even vital, for them to go back. It took a massacre of unprecedented proportions and a complete overhaul of the pre-war life, to make most European Jews even want to try to consider relocating to Palestine. And even that way more than half of them preferred relocating to America. It took Perestroika to make Soviet Jews emigrate, and again - many chose to go West.

    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It's not doable.

    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?

    Answer this first.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @A123, @Sher Singh, @Dmitry, @AP, @silviosilver

    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don’t get the cause – then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it

    Cause: Islamic SJW’s want to diminish Judeo-Christian beliefs as that threatens their multiculturalist dogma.

    Cause: MegaCorporations want to diminish the power of citizen workers. Inflating the supply of labour makes everything they do cheaper.

    Cause: Government authoritarians want to push citizens onto the dole. This makes them compliant with large government as it is linked to their survival.

    The exact mix of these three interrelated causes vary by location, but they are the top contenders.

    as long as they’re more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.

    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It’s not doable.

    America has an issue dating back “centuries”. Limiting the question “decades” is much more practical. The U.S. has all sorts of doable options:

    • Bringing legal migration to near zero.
    • Ending drop location “birthright” citizenship for illegals, refugees, tourists, and all other temporary visas. This does not require a Constitutional Amendment.
    • Could the Minneapolis Somalis, including Ilhan Omar, be rounded up and sent back to Africa? Yes. It would be very doable.

    Islam is about 1% of the total U.S. population….. Yet: (1)

    There’s one place in America where they are vastly over-represented. — State prisons.

    Take Maryland, which has an estimated 70,000 Muslims, making up over 1% of the population. But of Maryland’s 18,562 prisoners, 5,084 were Muslims.

    That’s 27.4% or over 1 in 4 prisoners.

    It would also mean that 1 out of 13 Muslims in Maryland may have been in a state prison.

    Those are startling numbers, yet they come from Muslim Advocates, an Islamist legal advocacy group. Both MA’s numbers and the number of Muslims in different states may be miscounted, yet these figures raise serious questions about public safety and the toll that immigration is taking on our communities.

    An outright prohibition on Islam would be desirable, but require a Constitutional Amendment. However, restoring Judeo-Christian values and ethics to the public square would render open Islamists a tainted & shunned underclass only capable of menial work. It would naturally breed, convert, and marry out over time.

    The Jihad problem in Europe is much more dramatic. De-Islamification is necessary, doable, and very hard. Sweden & Germany may be lost causes that have to be walled off to contain the threat.

    Incidentally, this is another reason why the EU needs to be dissolved. The idea of Schengen transit will have to end as part of the strategy to expel Jihadists. If they can move freely it will extend the problem for yet more decades. Any place declaring as “sanctuary” must be isolated.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.jihadwatch.org/2019/08/in-5-states-1-in-5-prisoners-are-muslim

    • Replies: @216
    @A123

    The West must go down the long, hard road of creating a "patriotic Muslim" identity analogous to the Tatar/Hui. Muslim occupiers of the Western lands are being subverted by liberalism, at a far faster rate than they attract any native converts. Criticism of Islam has not brought the Right any policy gains, but because the criticism has been rooted in liberal rhetoric, (rather than in the claims of Christianity or race realism) it has only contributed to decreased levels of religiosity.

    There is a very simple problem with mass deportations, the West will catch nukes if it does so. Even bans on immigration could see assets nationalized.

    Replies: @A123, @Sher Singh

  810. @Greasy William
    @Wokechoke

    so what are you saying? That if Russia inflicts enough casualties on the Ukrainian army this year, the Ukrainians will give up?

    Replies: @A123, @Emil Nikola Richard

    so what are you saying? That if Russia inflicts enough casualties on the Ukrainian army this year, the Ukrainians will give up?

    Ukrainians do not need to “give up”. They have to “become rational”.

    Kiev regime aggression is propped up by foreign funding. This will be reduced by Fall/Winter this year, unless France & Germany step up in a huge way.

    High casualties plus a shortage of war material will make Zelensky’s dream of retaking Crimea appear suicidal to the Ukrainian people. After that — there will be new, agreement capable, leadership Kiev.

    PEACE 😇

    • Disagree: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @A123
    @A123


    new, agreement capable, leadership Kiev.
     
    That should of course read:

    new, agreement capable, leadership *in* Kiev.

    A way to make minor edits beyond 5 minutes would be incredibly useful. Alas, it is much more technically complex than one might think. (sigh)

    PEACE 😇
  811. @A123
    @Greasy William


    so what are you saying? That if Russia inflicts enough casualties on the Ukrainian army this year, the Ukrainians will give up?
     
    Ukrainians do not need to "give up". They have to "become rational".

    Kiev regime aggression is propped up by foreign funding. This will be reduced by Fall/Winter this year, unless France & Germany step up in a huge way.

    High casualties plus a shortage of war material will make Zelensky's dream of retaking Crimea appear suicidal to the Ukrainian people. After that -- there will be new, agreement capable, leadership Kiev.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @A123

    new, agreement capable, leadership Kiev.

    That should of course read:

    new, agreement capable, leadership *in* Kiev.

    A way to make minor edits beyond 5 minutes would be incredibly useful. Alas, it is much more technically complex than one might think. (sigh)

    PEACE 😇

  812. @Greasy William
    @QCIC


    Why do you assume that?
     
    What else can Russia do short of nukes?

    Untrained manpower is not very effective against cluster bombs.
     
    The Soviets did a hell of a lot with untrained manpower in WWII. As time goes on, Ukraine is going to be able to train and arm guys at a faster rate.

    Replies: @QCIC, @Beckow

    Heavy bombing instead of the limited airstrikes employed so far.

  813. @Greasy William
    @Wokechoke

    so what are you saying? That if Russia inflicts enough casualties on the Ukrainian army this year, the Ukrainians will give up?

    Replies: @A123, @Emil Nikola Richard

    Not exactly. What is likely to happen is they will become the Euro version of Palestine with vastly reduced territory a European Gaza Strip. Periodically they will pay teenagers to throw rocks at and suicide bomb the Russian oppressors. P~.8.

    No jets, no tanks, AK-47’s a black market item. With the mega market right over the border the black market will be large. The ones in control of the AK-47’s won’t be pointing them at any Russians.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    What is likely to happen is they will become the Euro version of Palestine with vastly reduced territory a European Gaza Strip. Periodically they will pay teenagers to throw rocks at and suicide bomb the Russian oppressors.
     
    There is a mental parallel between Gazan Jihadists and Ukie Maximalists. However, geography makes the later situation more pliable.

    It is unlikely to be that contentious, because Ukraine is physically huge. An "artillery range" wide band with little population will develop along the armistice line. Families will move West taking their teenagers with them. Most of those who stay will be older, tied to the land/river, and not interested in provocative head butting.

    If the Muslim colonists in Gaza had a place to go, 50+ miles away from the nearest indigenous Palestinian Jew, many families would voluntarily resettle. How many really want to live under Iranian Hamas terrorist misrule? One key benefit of the Saudi solution -- It would allow the current inhabitants to move away from fence line posturing and violence.

    PEACE 😇
  814. @A123
    @Ivashka the fool


    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don’t get the cause – then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it
     

    Cause: Islamic SJW's want to diminish Judeo-Christian beliefs as that threatens their multiculturalist dogma.

    Cause: MegaCorporations want to diminish the power of citizen workers. Inflating the supply of labour makes everything they do cheaper.

    Cause: Government authoritarians want to push citizens onto the dole. This makes them compliant with large government as it is linked to their survival.

    The exact mix of these three interrelated causes vary by location, but they are the top contenders.


    as long as they’re more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.
    ...
    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It’s not doable.
     

    America has an issue dating back "centuries". Limiting the question "decades" is much more practical. The U.S. has all sorts of doable options:

    • Bringing legal migration to near zero.
    • Ending drop location "birthright" citizenship for illegals, refugees, tourists, and all other temporary visas. This does not require a Constitutional Amendment.
    • Could the Minneapolis Somalis, including Ilhan Omar, be rounded up and sent back to Africa? Yes. It would be very doable.

    Islam is about 1% of the total U.S. population..... Yet: (1)


    There’s one place in America where they are vastly over-represented. -- State prisons.

    Take Maryland, which has an estimated 70,000 Muslims, making up over 1% of the population. But of Maryland’s 18,562 prisoners, 5,084 were Muslims.

    That’s 27.4% or over 1 in 4 prisoners.

    It would also mean that 1 out of 13 Muslims in Maryland may have been in a state prison.

    Those are startling numbers, yet they come from Muslim Advocates, an Islamist legal advocacy group. Both MA’s numbers and the number of Muslims in different states may be miscounted, yet these figures raise serious questions about public safety and the toll that immigration is taking on our communities.
     

    An outright prohibition on Islam would be desirable, but require a Constitutional Amendment. However, restoring Judeo-Christian values and ethics to the public square would render open Islamists a tainted & shunned underclass only capable of menial work. It would naturally breed, convert, and marry out over time.

     

    The Jihad problem in Europe is much more dramatic. De-Islamification is necessary, doable, and very hard. Sweden & Germany may be lost causes that have to be walled off to contain the threat.

    Incidentally, this is another reason why the EU needs to be dissolved. The idea of Schengen transit will have to end as part of the strategy to expel Jihadists. If they can move freely it will extend the problem for yet more decades. Any place declaring as "sanctuary" must be isolated.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.jihadwatch.org/2019/08/in-5-states-1-in-5-prisoners-are-muslim

    Replies: @216

    The West must go down the long, hard road of creating a “patriotic Muslim” identity analogous to the Tatar/Hui. Muslim occupiers of the Western lands are being subverted by liberalism, at a far faster rate than they attract any native converts. Criticism of Islam has not brought the Right any policy gains, but because the criticism has been rooted in liberal rhetoric, (rather than in the claims of Christianity or race realism) it has only contributed to decreased levels of religiosity.

    There is a very simple problem with mass deportations, the West will catch nukes if it does so. Even bans on immigration could see assets nationalized.

    • Replies: @A123
    @216


    The West must go down the long, hard road of creating a “patriotic Muslim” identity analogous to the Tatar/Hui.
     
    How is this achievable?

    It would take, at a minimum State mosques, State mullahs/imams, native language texts, and barriers to online radicalization. China is executing this strategy to some effect. However, it is hard to see how this can work on Europe or America.

    The numbers must be brought down to protect Christians, especially in Europe. That means closing mosques and returning the unwanted to their MENA origins.

    There is a very simple problem with mass deportations, the West will catch nukes if it does so.
     
    While a potential issue with repatriation of Pakistani combatants, you are overly alarmist. It would be pretty easy to identify the culprit as there is only one suspect. France and the UK could sterilize Pakistan with no U.S. assistance.

    Even bans on immigration could see assets nationalized.
     
    As for nationalisation of Somali investments for the return of Somali invaders, that is obviously a net win. Ditto for Ethiopia, Eritrea, Sudan, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, etc.

    There simply are not that many Western owned, African assets that can be stolen. And, if some are lost (shrug) it is worth it to permanently decontaminate Christendom.

    PEACE 😇
    , @Sher Singh
    @216


    The West must go down the long, hard road of creating a “patriotic Muslim” identity analogous to the Tatar/Hui. Muslim occupiers of the Western lands are being subverted by liberalism, at a far faster rate than they attract any native converts.
     
    However, they're not subverted faster than the rate of immigration.

    Criticism of Islam has not brought the Right any policy gains, but because the criticism has been rooted in liberal rhetoric, (rather than in the claims of Christianity or race realism) it has only contributed to decreased levels of religiosity.
     
    Exactly, it only hardens Muslim ethnic identity & creates a pan-ethnic diaspora Muslim culture.

    There is a very simple problem with mass deportations, the West will catch nukes if it does so. Even bans on immigration could see assets nationalized.
     
    By who? No nuclear power is gonna use em vs the West over deportations. See China v Uighurs

    Jim says a woman must be married to the 1st man who beds her & honor killing is wrong.
    You're also a christcuck & so I think you want this issue prolonged and filmed.
  815. @Greasy William
    @QCIC


    Why do you assume that?
     
    What else can Russia do short of nukes?

    Untrained manpower is not very effective against cluster bombs.
     
    The Soviets did a hell of a lot with untrained manpower in WWII. As time goes on, Ukraine is going to be able to train and arm guys at a faster rate.

    Replies: @QCIC, @Beckow

    …untrained manpower in WWII

    A very different current situation: borders are open, families are small, there is more information. No advanced country can expend manpower for too long – that’s why Nato is staying out.

    Washington hopes that the above manpower dilemmas will apply to Russia first. Some of it will, but Russia has much better numbers and that matters. Kiev can theoretically assemble a 10-million army, but they are simply not in a position to do it. Most likely the willingness to die will peter out and only a core group will continue to fight. When morale breaks – and it will – it happens suddenly and is unstoppable. So whose morale will break first?

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @Beckow

    Why would Russia's morale break? I think the longer this drags on the more serious it looks from a Russian perspective in the sense of more existential and less optional. It also gives Russian Rossiya messaging a chance to catch up.

    Replies: @Greasy William

  816. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Greasy William

    Not exactly. What is likely to happen is they will become the Euro version of Palestine with vastly reduced territory a European Gaza Strip. Periodically they will pay teenagers to throw rocks at and suicide bomb the Russian oppressors. P~.8.

    No jets, no tanks, AK-47's a black market item. With the mega market right over the border the black market will be large. The ones in control of the AK-47's won't be pointing them at any Russians.

    Replies: @A123

    What is likely to happen is they will become the Euro version of Palestine with vastly reduced territory a European Gaza Strip. Periodically they will pay teenagers to throw rocks at and suicide bomb the Russian oppressors.

    There is a mental parallel between Gazan Jihadists and Ukie Maximalists. However, geography makes the later situation more pliable.

    It is unlikely to be that contentious, because Ukraine is physically huge. An “artillery range” wide band with little population will develop along the armistice line. Families will move West taking their teenagers with them. Most of those who stay will be older, tied to the land/river, and not interested in provocative head butting.

    If the Muslim colonists in Gaza had a place to go, 50+ miles away from the nearest indigenous Palestinian Jew, many families would voluntarily resettle. How many really want to live under Iranian Hamas terrorist misrule? One key benefit of the Saudi solution — It would allow the current inhabitants to move away from fence line posturing and violence.

    PEACE 😇

  817. @AaronB
    @silviosilver

    Ok, so you make a pretty good point about aristocrats, and you've brought to light areas that need to be clarified and distinctions that need to be made.

    Of course you're right that aristocrats were an endlessly scheming, plotting, backstabbing, poisoning, rebelling lot, and of course it was about position and advantage at court and all that. In fact I'd say aristocrats in this sense were more strivy than the bourgeois and were often disgustingly sycophantic and self-abasing in their jockeying for position.

    But this kind of thing is compatible with a life of refined leisure, in fact it's the sort of "game" one might play freed from the burdens of working for a living and freed from excessive social anxiety :) Aristocrats had a certain baseline security that came with inherited rank and status that significantly reduced the social anxiety that characterized the bourgeois striver.

    So for instance it's characteristic of a bourgeois striver to anxiously display his success - drive a Mercedes, wear expensive watches, dress more flamboyantly, drop veiled allusions to his wealth and success in conversation, etc - whereas aristocrats cultivated understated elegance - sometimes letting themselves go into what might be called "elegant dishevelment" which a bourgeois would not dare emulate - and a conversational style that featured self-depreciation as it's trademark.

    It was sort of an "anti-striving" culture in a way - another feature of this anti-striver mentality was the cultivation of a certain languid, relaxed, utterly at ease personal style - visible striving, visible effort, was seen as ""vulgar". All had to be easy, effortless, relaxed.

    Now, as for labor - freed from the burdens of working for a living, aristocrats played "games", either hunting, sports, adventuring, duelling, or created salons where sophisticated conversations would last long into the night and all the great wits of the day would attend, patronized art or poetry, and had lavish banquets.

    The point is, the bourgeois mentality of "hard work" for the purpose of accumulating mere money and the sort of sober, plodding, nose to the grindstone advancement through a career, all accompanied by social anxiety and thus insisting on a dull respectability and conformity to convention, was not the aristocratic lifestyle.

    Mind you, I'm not necessarily defending the aristocratic lifestyle - at its worst, it was unbearably artificial, pompous, wasteful, and viciously arrogant and cruel to the lower classes, but at its best it presented certain very attractive features compared to the dull conventionality of bourgeois life.

    To the Greeks, "leisure" was an explicit ideal, celebrated as the highest end of life - for the Chinese likewise, refined leisure was explicitly celebrated as the highest sort of life. Indeed for all pre-bourgouis cultures leisure was the highest form of life and work was not celebrated for its own sake. Modern bourgeois culture is perhaps the first in history to celebrate work and make it into an intrinsic virtue - and this is in fact a massive revolution in human affairs (which in my view must be overturned :) ). All previous cultures celebrated the contemplative life as the highest.

    And it is my belief that the modern celebration of work and disvaluing of the contemplative life is somehow at the very heart of modern nihilism, and that is a very significant fact.

    As a final remark, of course there was also an aristocratic tradition of "service", often military, and the English aristocracy often provided motivated and self-sacrificing officers and empire-builders to their country - and this was a very attractive thing indeed.

    But this too is a far cry from the kind bourgeois hard work celebration of someone like AP :)

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Coconuts, @AP

    And it is my belief that the modern celebration of work and disvaluing of the contemplative life is somehow at the very heart of modern nihilism, and that is a very significant fact.

    There seems to have been a lot of concern about what the impact of the ‘burgherisation’ would ultimately be, towards the end of the 19th century and up to WW2, on the left and the right:

    Zola’s heroes are very much the products of the century of the city and of the factory, caught in the mantrap and lacerated by it to the bone, to the marrow. The Frenchman of the IIIrd Republic, as a bourgeois, he is no longer truly bourgeois, as a worker any remaining traces of the peasant and the artisan and all values of race and life are dead in him. He is only good for voting and heavy drinking. His daughter will be a prostitute. Beyond alcohol lies insanity and crime. Coupeau’s Delerium Tremens is very much the contemporary of the portraits of alcoholic despair produced by bourgeois art at that time in the works of Baudelaire, Verlaine, Rimbaud.

    Written in 1940, it looks like not only being applicable to France. The last alcohol phase was maybe the babyboomers and Gen X. Perhaps the insanity stage is being reached at the moment (e.g. Woke). What might the crime stage involve?

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @Coconuts

    Well, perhaps we can avoid the crime stage by restoring contemplation and leisure to their rightful place on top of the hierarchy of values :)

    See my reply to LatW on the new thread.

  818. @S
    @Ivashka the fool

    Welcome back to the site, Bashybuzuk!

    About the 'racial purity' thing, my take on it is that is something for each people to decide just how 'pure' or 'impure they wish to be, or remain, once they've been given all the facts. This is something which should be treated collectively as sacrosanct, just as a person's physical body ideally is treated as sancrosanct.



    The thing is people haven't been given the facts and just about everywhere the 'mass immigration' thing is being put in place by diktat.

    The United States is the model for this.

    I believe I've pretty much proved in my post archives that chattel slavery and it's trade was not 'abolished' as proclaimed, but rather was monetized in the early 19th century with the introduction of wage slavery (ie specifically the so called 'cheap labor'/'mass immigration' system) in the United States, something which was put in place by diktat just as chattel slavery had been in 17th century Virginia and New England.

    The historic prime directive for the elite and their hangers on promoting either chattel or wage slavery is to do anything (but anything!) than pay their own people the prevailing real time local rates for labor. Importing by diktat alien chattel or wage slaves to do the work instead of hiring their own at fair living wages answers this call nicely...for them.

    This wage slavery system is the economic and political basis of the modern progressive Multi-Cultural state, a state which in many ways closely parallels the Anglosphere chattel slave holding society it directly evolved from, the 'immigrant' from a financial point of view, being the slave.

    This is what I mean when I say that, should they succeed in creating their 'United States of the World' global super state, it is to be a slavery based world order, just as the United States and the rest of the Anglosphere, with their wage slavery, are slavery based today.

    My guess is that their intention with the impending world war is they intend to wipe out the majority of most peoples, and that the bulk of the five hundred million survivors will be (purely by chance!) Sub-Saharan Africans with their dominant genes. They will be crudely used (as they are crudely being used now) to breed out of existance most of the non-Saharan survivors, so that the resulting vast majority of humanity will for practical purposes be 80 or 90% Sub-Saharan African in their genetic make up.

    In other words, most people are to be made into what are known in the vernacular as 'Blacks' with a likely 85 IQ.

    In regards to a declaration that was heard recently, but with a slight addendum, see below. After the world war, and with the proper conditioning, providing someone or something doesn't intervene first, it could maybe be done:

    'You will have nothing, and you will work for nothing, and you will be happy.'

    Replies: @silviosilver, @AnonfromTN

    My two cents about handles. In sharp contrast to “Bashibuzuk”, which sounded right, “Ivashka the fool” sounds all wrong. Based on Russian folk tales, it should have been either “Ivanushka the little fool” (Иванушка дурачок) or “Ivan the fool” (Иван дурак).

    • Replies: @QCIC
    @AnonfromTN

    Maybe the ChatGPT updated version of Bashybuzik doesn't have these subtleties dialed in yet...

  819. Sher Singh says:
    @silviosilver
    @S


    About the ‘racial purity’ thing, my take on it is that is something for each people to decide just how ‘pure’ or ‘impure they wish to be, or remain, once they’ve been given all the facts. This is something which should be treated collectively as sacrosanct, just as a person’s physical body ideally is treated as sancrosanct.
     
    I'll be blunt: by itself that is inadequate to the task of actual preservation. It is, however, a very useful attitude, or a useful orientation, to promote towards race and racial thinking during the all-important 'preparatory' stage - preparatory in the sense of drawing sufficient attention to the issue and generating sufficient concern over it, an attention and concern without which all will surely be lost and the white man's epitaph will read "Too few knew, fewer still cared."

    Even if he's aware of the terminal nature of the status quo, I can understand perfectly well why someone might wish to sidestep questions of "so, what do you want to do then?", both in order not to generate counterproductive alarm, as well as for the simpler reason that things are so up in the air, that who the hell knows what the future holds? Nevertheless, it is from time to time worth reminding ourselves that preservationist efforts must satisfy certain requirements, or there won't be any preservation at all.

    In Richard McCulloch's words, "Racial preservation has to be based on racial reality. It has to face the facts, ask the right questions and provide the right answers, however difficult they may be." Reality, not fantasy. The right questions, not irrelevancies. Correct answers, not falsehoods. And it is difficult. Very, very difficult. To be a 'racist' today is to play life on the hardest difficulty setting. For many people, a proper understanding of the racial predicament is the worst news they ever heard. The worst news in all of recorded and unrecorded history. There's a reason so many of them seem to go postal when they begin to wrap their minds around it. (Although people usually tune out well before they reach such an understanding. The very idea that there's anything to even think about appalls them.)

    The most difficult aspect, I think, is understanding that, in the long-term, racial preservation requires (using McCulloch's term) reproductive isolation. McCulloch was concerned with nordic/northwest European preservation specifically, although he has relaxed that 'requirement' more recently, but the same logic applies to any race, however one defines it. It's nothing less than a question of potential permanence or certain oblivion. To pretend otherwise is to be like a man who has jumped off the 20th storey and as he passes the 10th he wonders what all the fuss is about, "I'm still alive, what's everyone so worried about?"

    Traditionally, WNs who have understood this have reacted maximally urgently, maximally insultingly, and maximally threateningly, all of which have been tremendous mistakes - a full frontal assault on what 'the regime' has plowed immense financial, physical and psychological resources in preparation for. (I like to say Sun Tzu would have had their guts for garters.) In the same essay from which I quoted above, McCulloch writes:

    Is there anything we could offer the groups selected for separation that would significantly lessen their opposition to it? What could be done to accommodate those groups, to lessen their opposition to separation, and possibly even gain some measure of support?

    If I've ever made any original contribution to the debate, I would like to think that it's answering with a resounding yes to that question. My answer depends completely on WN willingness to comply with the sort of partitioning outlined by McCulloch (not necessarily that one in particular, but something along those lines). That in turn requires a great deal of trust, trust which for a long time I thought would never be forthcoming, but I have come to believe - hopefully not too foolishly - that such an accommodation could indeed be reached and maintained. Where there's a will there's a way, and where there's racial goodwill, a way forward can be found.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @S, @Sher Singh

    The most difficult aspect, I think, is understanding that, in the long-term, racial preservation requires (using McCulloch’s term) reproductive isolation. McCulloch was concerned with nordic/northwest European preservation specifically, although he has relaxed that ‘requirement’ more recently, but the same logic applies to any race, however one defines it. It’s nothing less than a question of potential permanence or certain oblivion. To pretend otherwise is to be like a man who has jumped off the 20th storey and as he passes the 10th he wonders what all the fuss is about, “I’m still alive, what’s everyone so worried about?”

    Completely uncontroversial outside christendom & almos unworkable within it.

    Really says a lot that they see no way to control their women outside apocalyptic ethnic cleansing.

    There’s a reason so many of them seem to go postal when they begin to wrap their minds around it.

    No, it’s because IQ & impulse control correlate with class & WNs tend to be on the lower end..

  820. Sher Singh says:
    @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don't get the cause - then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it - without answering these questions clearly there is no solution to the problem.

    Regarding the separation aspect and the manners to make it desirable for those you would like to separate from, as long as they're more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.

    One has to make it desirable, even vital, for them to go back. It took a massacre of unprecedented proportions and a complete overhaul of the pre-war life, to make most European Jews even want to try to consider relocating to Palestine. And even that way more than half of them preferred relocating to America. It took Perestroika to make Soviet Jews emigrate, and again - many chose to go West.

    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It's not doable.

    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?

    Answer this first.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @A123, @Sher Singh, @Dmitry, @AP, @silviosilver

    You just deny citizenship & tax industries which employ them.
    You don’t even need cleansing or separation pre se – just restore patriarchy.

    Obviously, the type who would do that will also ethnically cleanse.
    However, a patriarchal society will get a TFR closer to 6 & out-breed migrants.

    [MORE]

    What stands in between is the obedience & moral supremacism of Hajnal Euros

    https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/147470491501300114

    Feminists were extolling communal living v the nuclear family awhile back.
    This reduces the child-rearing load on the mother.
    From entire tribes/clans raising kids full-time we no longer have even mothers.

    Perhaps, the Left will come to these solutions however, they won’t be racialist.
    At the same time, the elitism among those circles acts as a strong racial filter.

  821. @216
    @A123

    The West must go down the long, hard road of creating a "patriotic Muslim" identity analogous to the Tatar/Hui. Muslim occupiers of the Western lands are being subverted by liberalism, at a far faster rate than they attract any native converts. Criticism of Islam has not brought the Right any policy gains, but because the criticism has been rooted in liberal rhetoric, (rather than in the claims of Christianity or race realism) it has only contributed to decreased levels of religiosity.

    There is a very simple problem with mass deportations, the West will catch nukes if it does so. Even bans on immigration could see assets nationalized.

    Replies: @A123, @Sher Singh

    The West must go down the long, hard road of creating a “patriotic Muslim” identity analogous to the Tatar/Hui.

    How is this achievable?

    It would take, at a minimum State mosques, State mullahs/imams, native language texts, and barriers to online radicalization. China is executing this strategy to some effect. However, it is hard to see how this can work on Europe or America.

    The numbers must be brought down to protect Christians, especially in Europe. That means closing mosques and returning the unwanted to their MENA origins.

    There is a very simple problem with mass deportations, the West will catch nukes if it does so.

    While a potential issue with repatriation of Pakistani combatants, you are overly alarmist. It would be pretty easy to identify the culprit as there is only one suspect. France and the UK could sterilize Pakistan with no U.S. assistance.

    Even bans on immigration could see assets nationalized.

    As for nationalisation of Somali investments for the return of Somali invaders, that is obviously a net win. Ditto for Ethiopia, Eritrea, Sudan, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, etc.

    There simply are not that many Western owned, African assets that can be stolen. And, if some are lost (shrug) it is worth it to permanently decontaminate Christendom.

    PEACE 😇

  822. Sher Singh says:
    @216
    @A123

    The West must go down the long, hard road of creating a "patriotic Muslim" identity analogous to the Tatar/Hui. Muslim occupiers of the Western lands are being subverted by liberalism, at a far faster rate than they attract any native converts. Criticism of Islam has not brought the Right any policy gains, but because the criticism has been rooted in liberal rhetoric, (rather than in the claims of Christianity or race realism) it has only contributed to decreased levels of religiosity.

    There is a very simple problem with mass deportations, the West will catch nukes if it does so. Even bans on immigration could see assets nationalized.

    Replies: @A123, @Sher Singh

    The West must go down the long, hard road of creating a “patriotic Muslim” identity analogous to the Tatar/Hui. Muslim occupiers of the Western lands are being subverted by liberalism, at a far faster rate than they attract any native converts.

    However, they’re not subverted faster than the rate of immigration.

    Criticism of Islam has not brought the Right any policy gains, but because the criticism has been rooted in liberal rhetoric, (rather than in the claims of Christianity or race realism) it has only contributed to decreased levels of religiosity.

    Exactly, it only hardens Muslim ethnic identity & creates a pan-ethnic diaspora Muslim culture.

    There is a very simple problem with mass deportations, the West will catch nukes if it does so. Even bans on immigration could see assets nationalized.

    By who? No nuclear power is gonna use em vs the West over deportations. See China v Uighurs

    [MORE]

    Jim says a woman must be married to the 1st man who beds her & honor killing is wrong.
    You’re also a christcuck & so I think you want this issue prolonged and filmed.

  823. @Thulean Friend
    @songbird


    IMO, it would be pretty easy for East Asians to turn it around.

    Koreans, at least, (and I think the Japanese too) seem to have pretty high asabiyyah. Like during the Debt Crisis when people donated $2 billion worth of personal jewelry.

     

    I suspect East Asian fertility being lowest in the world probably has biological antecedents. You're correct about higher tribalism, which reflects itself into manifested xenophobia. Japan and Korea have both opened up a smidgen in recent years but this all tentative and could easily be reversed. It's a mixed bag: they don't get many highly-skilled immigrants but they also don't get the riff-raff.

    That said, a cardinal mistake 3rd world triumphalists fall into is assuming higher population will automatically lead to future influence. Pakistani diplomats keep stalking the halls of power with their begging bowls. Egypt was recently bailed out by IMF & Saudis, being forced to devalue its increasingly useless currency once more. It has now lost half its value against the USD in the past year alone.

    https://i.imgur.com/d0HtfmY.png

    Why send in tanks when buying off a few local kleptocrats is sufficient? It's cheaper, more durable while creating buy-in among local elites to do your bidding. For the richest, you don't even need to give them money. They have that already. Just give them a reliable and hassle-free way to launder their ill-gotten gains into offshore accounts & luxurious overseas properties.

    In some ways this is a good development, because Western elites have found a way to control third world countries without overt colonialism or armed intervention, ultimately contributing to a more peaceful world. And why not? Certainly the 3rd world elites themselves seem to have a nice time, even the stateless ones:

    https://www.dirt.com/gallery/more-dirt/politicians/kurdistans-barzani-family-seeks-30-million-for-bowling-alley-equipped-beverly-hills-mansion-1203579381/barzani3/

    Who can blame them?

    Replies: @songbird

    I suspect East Asian fertility being lowest in the world probably has biological antecedents.

    Japan (1.3) actually has a higher TFR than Italy (1.24, or 1.18 for citizens) and a higher TFR than Chile (1.22). (PR has a TFR of 1, but not certain if it should be counted)

    So I’m not sure the premise holds up, in technical terms. Though, obviously, if we took averages, it would be true.

    [MORE]

    I see a lot of low-hanging fruit, if they wanted to pick it. The TFR of their entertainment must be insanely low – that could be changed with directives or other inducements. They could gut their education industry which is highly over-developed (though there are a lot of special interests here), and try to shift away from credentialism. Am sure they could do something with housing to make it cheaper.

    Even if there is some special biological susceptibility to low TFR – that is bridgeable by changing the culture.

    Was recently reading a passage from some a book written by someone spending a few years in an Irish village, (what differed here from other travelers is that they had overwintered there) and I was blown away by mention of a custom that I had never heard of before. Apparently, on the day before Ash Wednesday, girls and boys aged 8-15 would go out hunting unmarried women and lasso them and throw them in the river (which must have been quite cold).

    This was a village near to where quite a lot of my ancestors lived. Irish genealogical records are generally pretty poor, but I had to look at them. And I was shocked to see that in this area, time and time again, for every marriage of my ancestors that I could find that had a surviving date, they had married in February or March.

    That said, a cardinal mistake 3rd world triumphalists fall into is assuming higher population will automatically lead to future influence.

    It’s conceivable that in some countries it has led to brain drain, in effect, diminishing influence, even as the pop grows.

    Anyway, I think it is pretty obvious by now that neither Nigeria or Pakistan can be the equivalent of a peak Germany, through scale alone. I wonder what will happen, as some of these dreams of convergence burn out. Or, maybe, it has happened already?

    Pakistani diplomats keep stalking the halls of power with their begging bowls.

    Recently heard that Ukraine is getting artillery shells from Pakistan. Personally, I find something really disturbing about that.

    People talk about the declining influence of Europe a lot, like how the Chinese sent nobody important to WEF, but to think that Europeans are killing each other with weapons supplied from the Third World (whether sent to Russians or Ukrainians) that has to be some new lowpoint in European civilization.

  824. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Blinky Bill

    It's sad farewell for Year Tiger which is always my favorite year.

    Welcome year rabbit!

    https://wallpapers.com/images/hd/bugs-bunny-waiting-for-doc-gr98p3jyx2ms6mjs.jpg

    Replies: @songbird

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird

    It means the Chinese in 2023 are now 1000X funnier than Americans. You can't win them all!

  825. @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don't get the cause - then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it - without answering these questions clearly there is no solution to the problem.

    Regarding the separation aspect and the manners to make it desirable for those you would like to separate from, as long as they're more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.

    One has to make it desirable, even vital, for them to go back. It took a massacre of unprecedented proportions and a complete overhaul of the pre-war life, to make most European Jews even want to try to consider relocating to Palestine. And even that way more than half of them preferred relocating to America. It took Perestroika to make Soviet Jews emigrate, and again - many chose to go West.

    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It's not doable.

    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?

    Answer this first.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @A123, @Sher Singh, @Dmitry, @AP, @silviosilver

    Soviet “Jews” going to Israel is not related to the holocaust except in some ideological propaganda that might be presented for charities. In reality, because of being opportunity to go live in developed country (in terms of income and public services), even though not a desirable developed country, from country with low income and the always increasing asset stripping of public sphere.*

    If Israel had open borders with Russia (instead of closing borders except with people that have documentary evidence of Jewish grandparent, which is maybe less than one or two percent of the population), then the immigration would be around 30 million Russians immigrating to Israel between 2000-2020. https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-151/#comment-4701156 Possibly higher as cities which had larger Jewish minority include Moscow and Saint-Petersburg that lowers the emigration number (for obvious reason) compared to other parts of the country.

    If a country like UK or France had open borders with Russia, then half of the young population would have emigrated from Russia within a few years, especially from the provincial areas. This is before recent events. Imagine if Australia was opening border, where there are beaches and warm weather.

    Before recent events, millions of young people would just emigrate to work in MacDonald’s. For example, McDonald’s in Australia pays $18 an hour for the same job that McDonald’s in Russia pays $1,90 an hour (and still has no problem with recruitment). 9,5 McDonald’s employees in Russia are equivalent value to 1 McDonald’s employee in Australia.

    Media space in Russia doesn’t talk about this for ideological reasons, but all countries in this development level have the same problem and lower in the ranking has more problems – Uzbekistan rejects the Kremlin invitation to join the open border space every year because of they don’t want to lose even more of their people.

    *Elite things are something different which I don’t understand. Why Kudrin was registering Israeli citizenship this year before becoming manager of Yandex.

    cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it

    BBC has published an interesting article about Japan, where they say it’s a very happy charming country, people lived well there, but the society is aging and dying, population falls, without adequate immigration, property prices fall.

    But the author doesn’t connect the two sides. There is happy, charming country, partly related to the population decline without immigration, property price fall is bad for owners, but housing was more affordable for buyers, ecology improves, there are more wild spaces, there are higher teacher to student ratio in schools, the traffice jam is smaller.

    They don’t seem to understand there are normal mix of pluses and minuses with the political choice of a developed country’s immigration policy. E.g. “Large parts of the country could return to the wild.” This is usual mix of good and bad.
    https://twitter.com/JeromeTaylor/status/1616995825594544128

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @Dmitry


    Media space in Russia doesn’t talk about this for ideological reasons, but all countries in this development level have the same problem and lower in the ranking has more problems
     
    This is also how Prokhorov's political agenda (join the EU, join NATO) in the President's election in 2012, is probably impossible for Russia, from both sides. Europe would not want to be flooded with tens of millions of immigrants from Russia and Russia would lose its people and the demographics in relation to young people would become like Bulgaria or worse.

    So, Russia chooses open borders with countries with lower development level and closes borders with countries with higher development level. This is the policy to increase immigration/reduce emigration.

    If Russia had a higher birthrate, then authorities could be more warm about emigration, as too many young people is negative for political stability. Authorities often want to reduce the number of young people as the young people are engine for revolution and political instability. But currently the authorities had a strong control and there is proportionally the smallest number of population age 20-25 in all times.

    For countries like Uzbekistan there is the problem of emigration to Russia. But they would have compensation of remittance payment within a country that doesn't have many resources except its emigrants and its population pyramid can create political instability anyway. At some way, the authorities in Uzbekistan will be worried about the large cohort of young people they will receive in the next years. When there is a large cohort of young people especially when it surpasses available jobs, there are conditions for revolution against the government.

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @Dmitry


    Soviet “Jews” going to Israel is not related to the holocaust
     
    Yes I agree, and I didn't write it was related to holocaust. I wrote that it was due to Perestroika (and of course fall of USSR).

    BBC has published an interesting article about Japan, where they say it’s a very happy charming country, people lived well there, but the society is aging and dying, population falls, without adequate immigration, property prices fall.
     
    Are you suggesting that those who benefit most from the mass immigration to the West are also the same who benefit the most from higher inflation?

    Careful where you thread Dmitry, because one of the reasons given for the increasing inflation this years is the war in Ukraine...

    https://cs14.pikabu.ru/post_img/big/2023/01/15/0/1673732523140415236.jpg

    All wars are banker wars ?

    All immigration is banker immigration ?

    Oy vey ! Oy gevalt...

    This might be seen as antisemitic... Be careful...

    Replies: @Dmitry

  826. @Dmitry
    @Ivashka the fool

    Soviet "Jews" going to Israel is not related to the holocaust except in some ideological propaganda that might be presented for charities. In reality, because of being opportunity to go live in developed country (in terms of income and public services), even though not a desirable developed country, from country with low income and the always increasing asset stripping of public sphere.*

    If Israel had open borders with Russia (instead of closing borders except with people that have documentary evidence of Jewish grandparent, which is maybe less than one or two percent of the population), then the immigration would be around 30 million Russians immigrating to Israel between 2000-2020. https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-151/#comment-4701156 Possibly higher as cities which had larger Jewish minority include Moscow and Saint-Petersburg that lowers the emigration number (for obvious reason) compared to other parts of the country.

    If a country like UK or France had open borders with Russia, then half of the young population would have emigrated from Russia within a few years, especially from the provincial areas. This is before recent events. Imagine if Australia was opening border, where there are beaches and warm weather.

    Before recent events, millions of young people would just emigrate to work in MacDonald's. For example, McDonald’s in Australia pays $18 an hour for the same job that McDonald’s in Russia pays $1,90 an hour (and still has no problem with recruitment). 9,5 McDonald’s employees in Russia are equivalent value to 1 McDonald’s employee in Australia.

    Media space in Russia doesn't talk about this for ideological reasons, but all countries in this development level have the same problem and lower in the ranking has more problems - Uzbekistan rejects the Kremlin invitation to join the open border space every year because of they don't want to lose even more of their people.

    -

    *Elite things are something different which I don't understand. Why Kudrin was registering Israeli citizenship this year before becoming manager of Yandex.


    cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it
     
    BBC has published an interesting article about Japan, where they say it's a very happy charming country, people lived well there, but the society is aging and dying, population falls, without adequate immigration, property prices fall.

    But the author doesn't connect the two sides. There is happy, charming country, partly related to the population decline without immigration, property price fall is bad for owners, but housing was more affordable for buyers, ecology improves, there are more wild spaces, there are higher teacher to student ratio in schools, the traffice jam is smaller.

    They don't seem to understand there are normal mix of pluses and minuses with the political choice of a developed country's immigration policy. E.g. "Large parts of the country could return to the wild." This is usual mix of good and bad.
    https://twitter.com/JeromeTaylor/status/1616995825594544128

    Replies: @Dmitry, @Ivashka the fool

    Media space in Russia doesn’t talk about this for ideological reasons, but all countries in this development level have the same problem and lower in the ranking has more problems

    This is also how Prokhorov’s political agenda (join the EU, join NATO) in the President’s election in 2012, is probably impossible for Russia, from both sides. Europe would not want to be flooded with tens of millions of immigrants from Russia and Russia would lose its people and the demographics in relation to young people would become like Bulgaria or worse.

    So, Russia chooses open borders with countries with lower development level and closes borders with countries with higher development level. This is the policy to increase immigration/reduce emigration.

    If Russia had a higher birthrate, then authorities could be more warm about emigration, as too many young people is negative for political stability. Authorities often want to reduce the number of young people as the young people are engine for revolution and political instability. But currently the authorities had a strong control and there is proportionally the smallest number of population age 20-25 in all times.

    For countries like Uzbekistan there is the problem of emigration to Russia. But they would have compensation of remittance payment within a country that doesn’t have many resources except its emigrants and its population pyramid can create political instability anyway. At some way, the authorities in Uzbekistan will be worried about the large cohort of young people they will receive in the next years. When there is a large cohort of young people especially when it surpasses available jobs, there are conditions for revolution against the government.

  827. @songbird
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    What does it mean?

    https://twitter.com/manchuxi/status/1617198389036290050?s=20&t=W-6sAu9VaKIuodMWjN6Heg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    It means the Chinese in 2023 are now 1000X funnier than Americans. You can’t win them all!

    • Agree: songbird
  828. @Another Polish Perspective
    @LatW

    Bashybuzuk/Ivashka ethnogenesis theory stresses the continuity of indigenous elements, as you could expect from Rodnover. Well, last year I visited in Poland rodzimowiercy presentation where a lecturer claimed that Minoans were Indo-Europeans. I guess you can stretch continuity hypothesis that way too, if you want everyone to be indigenous ;)

    Yes, it somehow confirm what I read once that Strugackis are considered to be more than sci-fi in the (post)Soviet space. But from my personal reading of them, putting aside some allusions to Soviet reality, it could be a Soviet introduction to the "Ancient Astronauts" theory. It would be good to know whether Strugackis commented on Daeniken ideas in any way.


    However, we do know for a fact that the so called Texas Wends are Sorbs (even if Germanized). Wends are simply Lechitic Slavs.
     
    It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.

    But Wends are not Lechitic Slavs (maybe in some artificial classifications), that are Poles. I think that should be obvious, Poles = Lachs [Lachy]. Wends, however, can call themselves Czech Slavs since their land was once part of the Kingdom of Czechs.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lands_of_the_Bohemian_Crown

    Replies: @LatW

    Bashybuzuk/Ivashka ethnogenesis theory stresses the continuity of indigenous elements, as you could expect from Rodnover.

    It’s not bad as a principle (rather, it is good). However, when it becomes too obscure, one starts having questions. This is why it’s better to stick with Iron Age when you talk about nations. 🙂 What he writes is interesting, but I have seen some in Russia use it for political purposes. From the POV of Slavic unity, there is of course nothing wrong with admiring Arkona and such. It’s just that those people had way more to do with today’s Poles than today’s Eastern Slavs.

    It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.

    Yes, it’s a shame. They are a bit like some Germanized Baltic people in Prussia, sad. But then it’s a question why as to why the ones in Texas choose to call themselves Wends if they are Sorbs… by this logic, Wend is the German name for Western Slav. They chose that because they were already pretty Germanized at that point. They went to the US in mid 19th century.

    But Wends are not Lechitic Slavs (maybe in some artificial classifications), that are Poles.

    Well, from what I understand, Wends are Lechitic Slavs, but not all Lechitic Slavs are Wends.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lechites

    Wenden are mention together with Drevani and those are Polabians from what I understand. I looked at their language, or what survives of it, it looks like heavily Germanized Polish. It’s possible (or probably even likely) that in earlier times it was more purely Slavic.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends

    “Wends (Old English: Winedas [ˈwi.ne.dɑs]; Old Norse: Vindar; German: Wenden [ˈvɛn.dn̩], Winden [ˈvɪn.dn̩]; Danish: vendere; Swedish: vender; Polish: Wendowie, Czech: Wendové) is a historical name for the Lechitic Slavs. It refers not to a homogeneous people, but to various peoples, tribes or groups depending on where and when it was used. In the modern day, communities identifying as Wendish exist in Slovenia, Austria, Lusatia, Texas, and Australia.

    It’s probably just the “historical name” for the Western most Slavic peoples.

    As to the bear statue, yes, it is near Wroclaw and not precisely on the Czech border, but I mentioned Czech Rep because apparently this ancient Celtic spread was more prevalent there than in Poland. That would explain why the bear is exactly there.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @LatW


    but I have seen some in Russia use it for political purposes.
     
    It's not even directed at Eastern Europeans, we are too small and unworthy for them, it's directed at Germans.
    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @LatW


    Well, from what I understand, Wends are Lechitic Slavs, but not all Lechitic Slavs are Wends.
     
    The problem with these "multiple Lechitic tribes" theory is that there are very scarce archaeological remnants for this multitude. It is still the standard history taught in Polish schools, but is increasingly questioned. The theory is a kind of bridge over the fact of the emergence of Poland and the previous scant written references to few tribes there, but archaeology did not provide the expected evidence of mini-states (ok, of Latvia-size) which could merge in the one large state of Poland.

    Similarly,
    Wends as name that


    refers not to a homogeneous people, but to various peoples, tribes or groups depending on where and when it was used.
     
    seems to me to be suspicious in the sense that this name couldn't be produced by the interested people themselves (Likewise, the name of Galia was imposed by Romans), so the name could be produced only be outsiders, in this case, Germans, and it is known that Germans had clear ideas only about Slavic lands directly bordering their East Marchies.

    The article of Wikipedia you brought up seems to be an example of a skilful German-[influenced] manipulation (of the kind where they replaced "Germans" with "Nazis" in public discourse) in that that in its first paragraphs there is not one word of German origin of the name. However, there is assertion of some marginal people who apparently are the continuation of those ancient Wends (so the suggestion), this time in "Slovenia, Austria, Lusatia, Texas, and Australia". That they use two Slavic land - Slovenia and Lusatia (the original home of Wends!!!) - as lands of self-identyfing wends is especially SNEAKY, but also patently UNTRUE. I know for sure that Sorbs in Lusatia identify as Sorbs, not as Wends.
    Even the German state officially identify them now as "das sorbische Volk", not "Wends".

    https://www.bmi.bund.de/DE/themen/heimat-integration/minderheiten/minderheiten-in-deutschland/minderheiten-in-deutschland-node.html

    Instead of Slavs, a name which by its nature conveys the sense of unity among all Slavs, we get some "Wends" who are Slavic but maybe not really, and anyway seem prone to Germanization.... clear "divide et impera" move.


    I mentioned Czech Rep because apparently this ancient Celtic spread was more prevalent there than in Poland. That would explain why the bear is exactly there.
     
    Yes, you are right that Czechia used to be much more Celtic than Poland. And Wrocław from time to time belonged to Czechs (Crown of Bohemia) too.

    Replies: @LatW

  829. @Ivashka the fool
    @Blinky Bill

    I would add that preserving "racial purity" is something better done in one's own homeland. If one chooses the life of an immigrant and doesn't want to go back home for whatever reason, then one is just an immigrant among others. And if the natives don't care for the Great Replacement, then why should we ? As the French saying goes, one should not trying to be more catholic than the pope.

    https://static.dw.com/image/19141999_6.jpg

    Especially, this pope...

    🙂

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @S, @Dmitry

    He follows the religion, ignores the politics. He will be elected by religious people in the Vatican, but wouldn’t be elected if he was a politician among the mainstream population.

    If you remember from the political point of view, younger people in Europe mostly don’t care about the Pope. But the people still care about the Pope in Europe are mostly older. So, he’s not going to become politically popular with majority of young people or old people in Europe. But he doesn’t care, it’s Bible teaching.

    By the way, maybe it’s personal, but do you a feel change after February 24? I had some delusion of origin from a hinterland slightly Europe. But with the change of politics, it becomes difficult to avoid feeling like the more comfortable version of the people in that video. Maybe the Pope would wash our feet. It sounds like something subjective, but it’s actually about the objective change of situation. It’s now an objectively different situation.

  830. @LatW
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Bashybuzuk/Ivashka ethnogenesis theory stresses the continuity of indigenous elements, as you could expect from Rodnover.
     
    It's not bad as a principle (rather, it is good). However, when it becomes too obscure, one starts having questions. This is why it's better to stick with Iron Age when you talk about nations. :) What he writes is interesting, but I have seen some in Russia use it for political purposes. From the POV of Slavic unity, there is of course nothing wrong with admiring Arkona and such. It's just that those people had way more to do with today's Poles than today's Eastern Slavs.

    It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.
     
    Yes, it's a shame. They are a bit like some Germanized Baltic people in Prussia, sad. But then it's a question why as to why the ones in Texas choose to call themselves Wends if they are Sorbs... by this logic, Wend is the German name for Western Slav. They chose that because they were already pretty Germanized at that point. They went to the US in mid 19th century.

    But Wends are not Lechitic Slavs (maybe in some artificial classifications), that are Poles.
     
    Well, from what I understand, Wends are Lechitic Slavs, but not all Lechitic Slavs are Wends.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lechites

    Wenden are mention together with Drevani and those are Polabians from what I understand. I looked at their language, or what survives of it, it looks like heavily Germanized Polish. It's possible (or probably even likely) that in earlier times it was more purely Slavic.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends

    "Wends (Old English: Winedas [ˈwi.ne.dɑs]; Old Norse: Vindar; German: Wenden [ˈvɛn.dn̩], Winden [ˈvɪn.dn̩]; Danish: vendere; Swedish: vender; Polish: Wendowie, Czech: Wendové) is a historical name for the Lechitic Slavs. It refers not to a homogeneous people, but to various peoples, tribes or groups depending on where and when it was used. In the modern day, communities identifying as Wendish exist in Slovenia, Austria, Lusatia, Texas, and Australia.

    It's probably just the "historical name" for the Western most Slavic peoples.

    As to the bear statue, yes, it is near Wroclaw and not precisely on the Czech border, but I mentioned Czech Rep because apparently this ancient Celtic spread was more prevalent there than in Poland. That would explain why the bear is exactly there.

    Replies: @LatW, @Another Polish Perspective

    but I have seen some in Russia use it for political purposes.

    It’s not even directed at Eastern Europeans, we are too small and unworthy for them, it’s directed at Germans.

  831. @LatW
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Bashybuzuk/Ivashka ethnogenesis theory stresses the continuity of indigenous elements, as you could expect from Rodnover.
     
    It's not bad as a principle (rather, it is good). However, when it becomes too obscure, one starts having questions. This is why it's better to stick with Iron Age when you talk about nations. :) What he writes is interesting, but I have seen some in Russia use it for political purposes. From the POV of Slavic unity, there is of course nothing wrong with admiring Arkona and such. It's just that those people had way more to do with today's Poles than today's Eastern Slavs.

    It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.It is a pity that Sorbs took the German name for themselves. If any Slavs need a helping hand of their bigger brothers, it is certainly Sorbs.
     
    Yes, it's a shame. They are a bit like some Germanized Baltic people in Prussia, sad. But then it's a question why as to why the ones in Texas choose to call themselves Wends if they are Sorbs... by this logic, Wend is the German name for Western Slav. They chose that because they were already pretty Germanized at that point. They went to the US in mid 19th century.

    But Wends are not Lechitic Slavs (maybe in some artificial classifications), that are Poles.
     
    Well, from what I understand, Wends are Lechitic Slavs, but not all Lechitic Slavs are Wends.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lechites

    Wenden are mention together with Drevani and those are Polabians from what I understand. I looked at their language, or what survives of it, it looks like heavily Germanized Polish. It's possible (or probably even likely) that in earlier times it was more purely Slavic.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wends

    "Wends (Old English: Winedas [ˈwi.ne.dɑs]; Old Norse: Vindar; German: Wenden [ˈvɛn.dn̩], Winden [ˈvɪn.dn̩]; Danish: vendere; Swedish: vender; Polish: Wendowie, Czech: Wendové) is a historical name for the Lechitic Slavs. It refers not to a homogeneous people, but to various peoples, tribes or groups depending on where and when it was used. In the modern day, communities identifying as Wendish exist in Slovenia, Austria, Lusatia, Texas, and Australia.

    It's probably just the "historical name" for the Western most Slavic peoples.

    As to the bear statue, yes, it is near Wroclaw and not precisely on the Czech border, but I mentioned Czech Rep because apparently this ancient Celtic spread was more prevalent there than in Poland. That would explain why the bear is exactly there.

    Replies: @LatW, @Another Polish Perspective

    Well, from what I understand, Wends are Lechitic Slavs, but not all Lechitic Slavs are Wends.

    The problem with these “multiple Lechitic tribes” theory is that there are very scarce archaeological remnants for this multitude. It is still the standard history taught in Polish schools, but is increasingly questioned. The theory is a kind of bridge over the fact of the emergence of Poland and the previous scant written references to few tribes there, but archaeology did not provide the expected evidence of mini-states (ok, of Latvia-size) which could merge in the one large state of Poland.

    Similarly,
    Wends as name that

    refers not to a homogeneous people, but to various peoples, tribes or groups depending on where and when it was used.

    seems to me to be suspicious in the sense that this name couldn’t be produced by the interested people themselves (Likewise, the name of Galia was imposed by Romans), so the name could be produced only be outsiders, in this case, Germans, and it is known that Germans had clear ideas only about Slavic lands directly bordering their East Marchies.

    The article of Wikipedia you brought up seems to be an example of a skilful German-[influenced] manipulation (of the kind where they replaced “Germans” with “Nazis” in public discourse) in that that in its first paragraphs there is not one word of German origin of the name. However, there is assertion of some marginal people who apparently are the continuation of those ancient Wends (so the suggestion), this time in “Slovenia, Austria, Lusatia, Texas, and Australia”. That they use two Slavic land – Slovenia and Lusatia (the original home of Wends!!!) – as lands of self-identyfing wends is especially SNEAKY, but also patently UNTRUE. I know for sure that Sorbs in Lusatia identify as Sorbs, not as Wends.
    Even the German state officially identify them now as “das sorbische Volk”, not “Wends”.

    https://www.bmi.bund.de/DE/themen/heimat-integration/minderheiten/minderheiten-in-deutschland/minderheiten-in-deutschland-node.html

    Instead of Slavs, a name which by its nature conveys the sense of unity among all Slavs, we get some “Wends” who are Slavic but maybe not really, and anyway seem prone to Germanization…. clear “divide et impera” move.

    I mentioned Czech Rep because apparently this ancient Celtic spread was more prevalent there than in Poland. That would explain why the bear is exactly there.

    Yes, you are right that Czechia used to be much more Celtic than Poland. And Wrocław from time to time belonged to Czechs (Crown of Bohemia) too.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Another Polish Perspective


    so the name could be produced only be outsiders, in this case, Germans, and it is known that Germans had clear ideas only about Slavic lands directly bordering their East Marchies.
     
    In that case, that's what it is - the Westernmost Slavic tribes, problem solved.

    Saxon Eastern March in 965–1128 (you can see all the old Slavic names there):

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saxon_Eastern_March#/media/File:Marchia_Wschodnia_ok._1000.svg

    I know for sure that Sorbs in Lusatia identify as Sorbs, not as Wends.
     
    It is well known, of course, that they identify as Sorbs and are called that. I think the ones in Texas that call themselves "Wends" use a German name because they are more "old fashioned", maybe derive their identity from the Middle Ages. They are some old Lutheran group. "Wendish" is upper Sorbian language.

    Their cultural center is in Bautzen and they say "Witaj" for "hi", same es Poles and Ukrainians.

    Anyway, I think we should be grateful to these people, such as the poor Rani (Ruyan) people (in current Denmark).

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pg5UeGtTrD8

    Replies: @LatW

  832. @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    it is almost as if Poles were Jews…
     
    Almost as if they were...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEL0RL_bBkw&ab_channel=OlgaMieleszczuk

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Dmitry

    it is almost as if Poles were Jews…

    Almost as if they were…

    If you had anti-Polish views, there is a problematic influence in Israel’s political culture, although reducing in the last decade (Lapid family from Hungary, Bennett family from a religious cult in San Francisco) – the influence of the secular Israeli clique that had Polish culture .

    [MORE]

    Ruling clique of culturally early 20th century middle class liberal Polish people, from North East Poland/Lithuania zone.

    They have positive late 19th century culture, like to idealize English culture (this is positive), egalitarian progressive nationalism (this is positive), idealizing agricultural life, but like most people from the Polish culture space, they seem to be imagining secretly they are special noble people (in the Polish culture, most Catholic Poles say they are descended from aristocrats).

    It’s a clique of secular Jewish families from a small area of villages in Poland to the border of Lithuania, but when they have now their own estate in the Middle East, where they could be politically managing the Arab Jewish peasants (nowadays Netanyahu’s job), importing and controlling passive demoralized postsoviet cattle from Russia/Ukraine and Ethiopians (well this was Rabin’s dream – Rabin actually from more East), or compromising and controlling with local religious cults of Amish (Haredi – this is Netanyahu’s job nowadays, but before Rabin), or Mormons (religious nationalists). These religious cults were easy to control because they have specificied insular demands.

    If you watch video below when the Italian Prime Minister is in the Israeli parliament. President of Israel (Herzog) is opposition leader to Netanyahu and attacks him in the political space. At 1:10 he says behind it “we are all very close friends on both sides”. And their great-grandparents surely from the same villages in Poland near Ben Gurion’s family.

    Listen to what Herzog says 1:10

    If you were enough of anti-Poland conspiracy theorist in Israel, there is also stereotype Polish style facial expressions Netanyahu is using increasingly.

    Netanyahu starts to imitate Kaczynski’s facial expression, not just his methods of control of country. Soon he can maneuver full control of the political system.

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @Dmitry


    Netanyahu starts to imitate Kaczynski’s facial expression, not just his methods of control of country. Soon he can maneuver full control of the political system.
     
    Although just to add of course, this is supposed to be a joke. Netanyahu is not so bad like Kaczynski. He reforms the country and has plenty positive attainments. Netanyahu has imported a lot of the positive American reforms of the economy. And when he tried to control the media, he goes to court. But there are some resemblance with Kaczynski, not only in the facial expression. The attempts for democratic backsliding is reminding of somewhere.

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @Dmitry

    Culture does not create conspiracies.

    It seems that you have heard once something about Frankists, aka followers of Jacob Frank (who was actually a Sephardi from Ottoman Empire), a Polish version of Sabbateanism which advocated conversion of Jews not to Islam, but to Catholicism... in PLC many more of them got ennobled in Lithuania than in Poland, since it was easier to do that in Lithuania. You can sometimes recognize their (probable) descendants from their surnames, eg. Polish minister of health and Covid things, Niedzielski, comes from Niedziela/Sunday: this is a typical surname of a convert.

    They are honoured now. Olga Tokarczuk got a Noble prize for a novel about them. She depicted Jacob Frank as kind of enamoured with the lifestyle of Polish nobility/magnates, like having his own court and troops etc. Well, it is possible that Hassidic custom of "holding court" by tzadik came from emulation of Polish nobility too.

    Replies: @Dmitry

  833. @Dmitry
    @Yahya



    it is almost as if Poles were Jews…

     

    Almost as if they were…

     

    If you had anti-Polish views, there is a problematic influence in Israel's political culture, although reducing in the last decade (Lapid family from Hungary, Bennett family from a religious cult in San Francisco) - the influence of the secular Israeli clique that had Polish culture .

    Ruling clique of culturally early 20th century middle class liberal Polish people, from North East Poland/Lithuania zone.

    They have positive late 19th century culture, like to idealize English culture (this is positive), egalitarian progressive nationalism (this is positive), idealizing agricultural life, but like most people from the Polish culture space, they seem to be imagining secretly they are special noble people (in the Polish culture, most Catholic Poles say they are descended from aristocrats).

    It's a clique of secular Jewish families from a small area of villages in Poland to the border of Lithuania, but when they have now their own estate in the Middle East, where they could be politically managing the Arab Jewish peasants (nowadays Netanyahu's job), importing and controlling passive demoralized postsoviet cattle from Russia/Ukraine and Ethiopians (well this was Rabin's dream - Rabin actually from more East), or compromising and controlling with local religious cults of Amish (Haredi - this is Netanyahu's job nowadays, but before Rabin), or Mormons (religious nationalists). These religious cults were easy to control because they have specificied insular demands.

    If you watch video below when the Italian Prime Minister is in the Israeli parliament. President of Israel (Herzog) is opposition leader to Netanyahu and attacks him in the political space. At 1:10 he says behind it "we are all very close friends on both sides". And their great-grandparents surely from the same villages in Poland near Ben Gurion's family.

    Listen to what Herzog says 1:10

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DIvbsfJ624

    If you were enough of anti-Poland conspiracy theorist in Israel, there is also stereotype Polish style facial expressions Netanyahu is using increasingly.

    Netanyahu starts to imitate Kaczynski's facial expression, not just his methods of control of country. Soon he can maneuver full control of the political system.

    https://static.wirtualnemedia.pl/media/top/jaroslawkaczynski2022-655.jpg

    https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/66AA/production/_112428262_mediaitem112428260.jpg.webp

    Replies: @Dmitry, @Another Polish Perspective

    Netanyahu starts to imitate Kaczynski’s facial expression, not just his methods of control of country. Soon he can maneuver full control of the political system.

    Although just to add of course, this is supposed to be a joke. Netanyahu is not so bad like Kaczynski. He reforms the country and has plenty positive attainments. Netanyahu has imported a lot of the positive American reforms of the economy. And when he tried to control the media, he goes to court. But there are some resemblance with Kaczynski, not only in the facial expression. The attempts for democratic backsliding is reminding of somewhere.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Dmitry


    Netanyahu is not so bad like Kaczynski. He reforms the country and has plenty positive attainments.
     
    I've tried to read up on Kaczynski; but to my chagrin could not find objective and reliable English-language sources. He's been described as "xenophobic", "nationalist" and "authoritarian"; neither of which are bad things in my book. I don't want to opine on Polish internal politics too much; but probably if I were a Pole i'd vote for the nationalist parties which seek to maintain Poland For Poles and resist the migration waves heading into Europe. The (semi-)irreversible nature of immigration policies would make it a number one priority; everything else negotiable.

    You seem to consider democracy as being the Chief Good in politics, to borrow an Aristotelian term; so in your opinion Kaczynski is bad because of the backsliding. But for me the results matter more than the system. The system is only important insofar as it can deliver the results. Many of the greatest world historical leaders were authoritarians; Lee Kuan Yew, Otto von Bismarck, Cardinal Richelieu, Piotr Stolypin, Fouad Chehab etc. On the other hand, many of the worst leaders have also been authoritarians. It's a mixed-bag. But being an authoritarian doesn't necessarily preclude competence or effectiveness. In fact, authoritarians may be more intelligent on average than democratic leaders. Kaczynski will have to be judged on his track record; both in the present and the long-term future.

    But i'd like to hear APP's perspective on Polish politics.

    Dmitry, what is your judgement on Israeli and Russian historical leaders?

    Replies: @Dmitry, @Another Polish Perspective

  834. AP says:
    @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don't get the cause - then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it - without answering these questions clearly there is no solution to the problem.

    Regarding the separation aspect and the manners to make it desirable for those you would like to separate from, as long as they're more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.

    One has to make it desirable, even vital, for them to go back. It took a massacre of unprecedented proportions and a complete overhaul of the pre-war life, to make most European Jews even want to try to consider relocating to Palestine. And even that way more than half of them preferred relocating to America. It took Perestroika to make Soviet Jews emigrate, and again - many chose to go West.

    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It's not doable.

    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?

    Answer this first.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @A123, @Sher Singh, @Dmitry, @AP, @silviosilver

    Does this seem to be a worthwhile book?

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-scythian-empire-book-review-history-the-riders-from-the-steppe-11674233967

    ‘The Scythian Empire’ Review: The Riders From the Steppe
    A powerful central Asian culture left its mark on civilizations from the Black Sea to the Yellow River, but history has better remembered its successors.

    Scholarly depth and breadth rarely meet on equal terms. In “The Scythian Empire: Central Eurasia and the Birth of the Classical Age From Persia to China,” Christopher I. Beckwith marries the two to memorable effect.

    [MORE]

    A professor of Eurasian studies at Indiana University Bloomington, Mr. Beckwith asserts the primacy of the Scythian Empire’s influence on the classical age. The Scythians, pastoral nomads who roamed the Central Eurasian steppe zone from around the eighth century B.C., are traditionally dismissed as uncouth predators whose legacy was negative, inconsequential or, at best, ambiguous. In the fifth century B.C., Aristophanes portrayed oafish, heavily accented Scythians policing Athens, while Herodotus decried their rule over the vanquished for its “violence and . . . pride”: “besides exacting from each the tribute which was assessed, they rode about the land carrying off everyone’s possessions.” Yet to Mr. Beckwith, the Scythians represent “one of the least known but most influential realms in all of world history.”

    Historians have acknowledged Scythian innovations, including an unprecedented feudal structure, monotheism and sophisticated weapons—namely, short composite bows that allowed mounted archers greater range of movement. These practices are typically thought to have been copied by their better-known imperial successors, the Medes and Persians. Mr. Beckwith contends, however, that the Medes and Persians were actually “creolized” Scythians.

    Pre-Scythian Medes inhabited parts of contemporary Iran, Turkey and Iraq; theirs was “strictly a geographical region, not an ethnolinguistic entity or a political unit,” according to Mr. Beckwith. A fully realized Mede polity dates to Cyaxares’s overthrow of the Scythians (ca. 620 B.C.). “Raised as a Scythian,” Cyaxares is not known to have altered any “inherited Scythian clothing, weapons, state structure, religious beliefs, etc,” Mr. Beckwith writes. To do so would have gone against the grain, “because by that time . . . the Scythians . . . and the native peoples had merged.”

    The reigns of the Medes and Persians, initiated by coups, were validated by their leaders’ identification with the Scythians’ royal lineage. Cyaxares, who led an allied force against the Assyrians, captured and destroyed Nineveh in 612 B.C. He was followed by his purported son, Astyages. Cyrus II, Astyages’s Persian grandson, in turn seized power in 550 B.C. Carrying on the Scytho-Mede line, Cyrus “kept the Empire and the entire imperial system intact—with the exception of the religious element—when he overthrew the Mede king.” Mr. Beckwith refers to this longest-lasting iteration as the Scytho-Mede-Persian Empire.

    If the Medes and Persians were, in essential respects, Scythian by another name, why was the Scythian system so attractive to usurpers and impervious to change? The appeals of Scythian feudalism were its religious justification and the coherence of its “package”—the sovereign served the one God of Heaven and was supported by an evolving pyramid of vassals. Religion legitimized the king and imbued his subjects, direct and indirect, with divine purpose. Later claimants, Mr. Beckwith observes, could not retain their feudal hierarchy without its religious underpinning.

    Proof can be found in the short-lived polytheism of Cyrus and Cambyses II: “They clearly did not understand,” Mr. Beckwith points out, “that because local ‘national God’ cults legitimized local national rulers, i.e., independent kings, a single unified empire required a single ruler legitimized by a single God.” Darius I restored the status quo ante, declaring, “The Great God is Ahuramazdā, who created this earth, who created that heaven, who created man, who created happiness for man, who made Darius king, one king of many, one lord of many.”

    Mr. Beckwith cites linguistic evidence for the Scythians’ widespread legacy. Three cities called Agamatāna were built by Scythians (or Scythian speakers) “at the same time, but very far apart”: the Mede capital in modern-day Iran and, thousands of miles to the east, successive capitals of the Scytho-Chinese state of Chao. The author also notes that variants of the Scythian word for “royal line,” Aria, preserved its meaning in Bactrian, Old Persian and Chinese: “This word Harya . . . came to be used by Chinese speakers in the fourth century B.C. to refer to themselves, i.e., ‘us the Chinese’, meaning those who belonged to the legitimate ruling lineage, Harya.” A national signifier from Iran to China, Aria attests to Scythian reach.

    An epilogue on capital-P Philosophy considers Scythian links to the “first great philosophers” of Greece, Iran, India and China: Anacharsis (“the Scythian”), Zoroaster, Gautama (“the Scythian Sage”) and Laotzu. Anacharsis, an early Greek Skeptic was half Scythian by birth and education. Zoroaster’s Gathas (“Hymns”) were composed in Old Avestan, an archaic dialect of Imperial Scythian. Gautama hailed from northwestern India or Central Asia, “regions known to have been ruled by the Scythians, Scytho-Medes, and related peoples who succeeded them.” Mr. Beckwith transcribes the foreign-born Laotzu’s full name, Lao-tan—“lao” was formerly pronounced like “k’ao”—into the Sanskrit Gautama. For Mr. Beckwith, the simultaneous appearance of these revolutionary figures and ideas was no coincidence. Rejecting the belief that ancient cultures were conceived locally, he proposes that the Scythians were the common denominator that “produced the great shared cultural flowering known as the Classical Age.”

    Of Mr. Beckwith’s eight fresh and penetrating chapters, only the sixth, on Classical Scythian philology, is likely to challenge the nonspecialist. For the rest of the text, his prose and data-driven analysis are clear. But superior delivery does not on its own set his book apart. “The Scythian Empire” is simply, dazzlingly original. Ever-narrowing fields of academic study and inability to see the whole historical picture, he suggests, partly explain the Scythians’ discredit and neglect. As for Mr. Beckwith, his curiosity, imagination and learning—from the Yellow River to the Danube, from archaeology to linguistics—do what every history ought to do but few achieve: compel the reader to think.

    • Disagree: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @AP

    Yes it looks highly interesting although perhaps stretched a bit when it comes to Lao Tzu. The rest is more or less how I see it. Especially the sentence below:


    Mr. Beckwith contends, however, that the Medes and Persians were actually “creolized” Scythians.
     
    Absolutely correct.

    And after the fall of the different Scythian confederations, the Sarmatians, the Xiongnu, the Kushans, the Hephtalite, the Turks and finally the Mongols - all used the social system, the nomadic tool kit and even to some degree the religious patterns that have been created by the Indo-Iranian tribes that the Greek named using the exonyme Scythians.

    Basically, people originating in Sintashta-Arkaim/Andronovo culture have dominated the main part of Eurasian plain for nearly 2000 years.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b8/Indo-Iranian_origins.png/290px-Indo-Iranian_origins.png

    Most researchers associate the Andronovo horizon with early Indo-Iranian languages, though it may have overlapped the early Uralic-speaking area at its northern fringe.[8] Allentoft et al. (2015) concluded from their genetic studies that the Andronovo culture and the preceding Sintashta culture should be partially derived from the Corded Ware culture, given the higher proportion of ancestry matching the earlier farmers of Europe, similar to the admixture found in the genomes of the Corded Ware population.[9]
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andronovo_culture



    An anecdote; when I first read the Suzuki translation of the Lankavatara Sutra, one of the final paragraphs presented the scribe that transcribed it as belonging to the "tribe of Soma", which Suzuki translated as "the Moon tribe". I had a chuckle, because Soma was the famous entheogen used by the Vedic Aryans and named Haoma (or Hauma) by the Avestan Aryans. It was indeed considered as being "moon-like" when mixed into water (probably through some opalescent whitish colloidal effect).

    So about Scythians, the best at producing Soma / Haoma were the Saka haumavarga. Saka for Scythians (as well as Shakya in the Buddha's clan name) and I am pretty sure that you can understand the meaning if varga (варка) from your knowledge of the Slav languages. So basically, the scribe who wrote the Lankavatara Sutra translated by Suzuki might well have been a Scythian "drug dealer" from modern day Central Asia.

    https://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/haumavarga

    Therefore I have not been in the least surprised when I one day saw this image:

    https://i.natgeofe.com/n/22e9031b-68d7-4169-83e3-49c860122f9f/59670.jpg

    (I wonder what this "Scythian Bodhisattva" carried in his stash bag...)

    🙂

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @sudden death

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @AP

    I am not an expert on Scythians, but I too have taken notice of the recent emergence of the fad for Scythians. My intuition says to me that there is something wrong in presenting Scythians as essentially pre-Mongols in their reach, and Persians as form of Scythians. But as usually, truth lies in details. Maybe in free time I will look for them.
    There could be an agenda here stemming from the fact that Persians freed the Jews. Persian rule was also quite unpopular in Egypt. Maybe someone doesn't like them for that, as Jews of course have no reason to present Persians as Scythians.

  835. @Dmitry
    @Yahya



    it is almost as if Poles were Jews…

     

    Almost as if they were…

     

    If you had anti-Polish views, there is a problematic influence in Israel's political culture, although reducing in the last decade (Lapid family from Hungary, Bennett family from a religious cult in San Francisco) - the influence of the secular Israeli clique that had Polish culture .

    Ruling clique of culturally early 20th century middle class liberal Polish people, from North East Poland/Lithuania zone.

    They have positive late 19th century culture, like to idealize English culture (this is positive), egalitarian progressive nationalism (this is positive), idealizing agricultural life, but like most people from the Polish culture space, they seem to be imagining secretly they are special noble people (in the Polish culture, most Catholic Poles say they are descended from aristocrats).

    It's a clique of secular Jewish families from a small area of villages in Poland to the border of Lithuania, but when they have now their own estate in the Middle East, where they could be politically managing the Arab Jewish peasants (nowadays Netanyahu's job), importing and controlling passive demoralized postsoviet cattle from Russia/Ukraine and Ethiopians (well this was Rabin's dream - Rabin actually from more East), or compromising and controlling with local religious cults of Amish (Haredi - this is Netanyahu's job nowadays, but before Rabin), or Mormons (religious nationalists). These religious cults were easy to control because they have specificied insular demands.

    If you watch video below when the Italian Prime Minister is in the Israeli parliament. President of Israel (Herzog) is opposition leader to Netanyahu and attacks him in the political space. At 1:10 he says behind it "we are all very close friends on both sides". And their great-grandparents surely from the same villages in Poland near Ben Gurion's family.

    Listen to what Herzog says 1:10

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DIvbsfJ624

    If you were enough of anti-Poland conspiracy theorist in Israel, there is also stereotype Polish style facial expressions Netanyahu is using increasingly.

    Netanyahu starts to imitate Kaczynski's facial expression, not just his methods of control of country. Soon he can maneuver full control of the political system.

    https://static.wirtualnemedia.pl/media/top/jaroslawkaczynski2022-655.jpg

    https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/66AA/production/_112428262_mediaitem112428260.jpg.webp

    Replies: @Dmitry, @Another Polish Perspective

    Culture does not create conspiracies.

    It seems that you have heard once something about Frankists, aka followers of Jacob Frank (who was actually a Sephardi from Ottoman Empire), a Polish version of Sabbateanism which advocated conversion of Jews not to Islam, but to Catholicism… in PLC many more of them got ennobled in Lithuania than in Poland, since it was easier to do that in Lithuania. You can sometimes recognize their (probable) descendants from their surnames, eg. Polish minister of health and Covid things, Niedzielski, comes from Niedziela/Sunday: this is a typical surname of a convert.

    They are honoured now. Olga Tokarczuk got a Noble prize for a novel about them. She depicted Jacob Frank as kind of enamoured with the lifestyle of Polish nobility/magnates, like having his own court and troops etc. Well, it is possible that Hassidic custom of “holding court” by tzadik came from emulation of Polish nobility too.

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Polish minister of health and Covid things, Niedzielski, comes from Niedziela/Sunday
     
    Sadly I don't know enough about Poland's politics to know those examples.

    But in the Kaczynski brothers, the currently ruling Jaroslaw expression reminds me less of Netanyahu, than the old President of Poland Lech Kaczynski.

    Jaroslaw looks a bit too suppressed and nonexpressive, but Lech has more similar expressions.

    Lech Kaczynski died when he was only 60 and Netanyahu is 73, so the current Netanyahu is maybe too unmatched for age (I guess pensioners develop new face expressions), but if you try to find photos of Netanyahu from a few years ago.

    There is the neutral Lech Kaczynski when he was age 50s.

    https://i.imgur.com/U4OyM5D.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/dtZAQ2y.jpg

    When they are they anxious
    https://i.imgur.com/DYgEWtl.jpg
    https://i.imgur.com/ok0uWa5.jpg

    They have more similar expression when they are smiling ("how can we slowly backslide this democracy")


    https://i.imgur.com/LBgx6HX.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/vY66bI8.jpg

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  836. One of Netanyahu’s political skills, seems to be avoiding working class voters feeling that he is a nonreligious Polish Jew, that will be some cousin with grandparents from the same Zionist club in the village in Poland, as the liberal opponent.

    In Israel, Netanyahu’s voting base, are including disproportionately Iraqi Jews, Moroccans, Yemenis, Algerians, Iranians, Ethiopians, religious nationalists, unreligious Russians and Ukrainians. His coalition alliance goes to the most working class religious political groups (Shas) which use identity politics against the secular Polish Jewish political families.

    But in Bat Yam or South Tel Aviv, working class Iraqis, Iranians and Yemenis are feeling “Netanyahu is one of ours”.

    I guess like Bill Clinton was popular with African Americans. “Bill Clinton plays the saxophone”.

    Or voters in Wyoming saying “Trump is fighting against the wealthy New York urban people that live in skyscrapers”.

    Deri supporters slam Ashkenazi judges ‘who killed our ancestors’

    Incensed crowds gather outside Jerusalem home of disgraced minister, hurling racial epithets and echoing accusations of past discrimination of Sephardic Jews by ‘Ashkenazi elites’; ‘white Ashkenazim have taken our leader’

    Avshalom Ohayon, a Shas activist and confidant of Interior and Health Minister Arye Deri, made harsh remarks on Wednesday night against the High Court of Justice, following the ruling that disqualified the Shas chief from serving as minister.

    “Ten white Ashkenazi judges. The same ones who killed our ancestors,” Ohayon said outside of Deri’s home to the applause of the crowd that gathered on site, echoing accusations of past discrimination of Sephardic Jews by “Ashkenazi elites.”

    The ultra-Orthodox party caters mainly to a consistency of impoverished and working-class Sephardic Jews.

    “We will not remain silent,” he continued. “God willing, the nation will rise up. We’re sick of you corrupt white people.”

    Ohayon continued his screed by calling the judges “detached” and “not attentive to the voice of the people.” He also said that “the High Court, which is meant to safeguard the country’s democracy, has proven that it is anti-democratic.

    “We will not stop. We came to govern. What’s truer than the polls? We are witnessing a coup by the detached patrons. White Ashkenazim have taken our leader. We will not rest and we will not remain silent” ..

    Meanwhile, a cadre of Deri’s allies arrived at his home, including Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich, and Shas MKs. Several Rabbis also paid a visit to his residence to express their support.

    https://www.ynetnews.com/article/hyfevabos

  837. @AaronB
    @silviosilver

    Ok, so you make a pretty good point about aristocrats, and you've brought to light areas that need to be clarified and distinctions that need to be made.

    Of course you're right that aristocrats were an endlessly scheming, plotting, backstabbing, poisoning, rebelling lot, and of course it was about position and advantage at court and all that. In fact I'd say aristocrats in this sense were more strivy than the bourgeois and were often disgustingly sycophantic and self-abasing in their jockeying for position.

    But this kind of thing is compatible with a life of refined leisure, in fact it's the sort of "game" one might play freed from the burdens of working for a living and freed from excessive social anxiety :) Aristocrats had a certain baseline security that came with inherited rank and status that significantly reduced the social anxiety that characterized the bourgeois striver.

    So for instance it's characteristic of a bourgeois striver to anxiously display his success - drive a Mercedes, wear expensive watches, dress more flamboyantly, drop veiled allusions to his wealth and success in conversation, etc - whereas aristocrats cultivated understated elegance - sometimes letting themselves go into what might be called "elegant dishevelment" which a bourgeois would not dare emulate - and a conversational style that featured self-depreciation as it's trademark.

    It was sort of an "anti-striving" culture in a way - another feature of this anti-striver mentality was the cultivation of a certain languid, relaxed, utterly at ease personal style - visible striving, visible effort, was seen as ""vulgar". All had to be easy, effortless, relaxed.

    Now, as for labor - freed from the burdens of working for a living, aristocrats played "games", either hunting, sports, adventuring, duelling, or created salons where sophisticated conversations would last long into the night and all the great wits of the day would attend, patronized art or poetry, and had lavish banquets.

    The point is, the bourgeois mentality of "hard work" for the purpose of accumulating mere money and the sort of sober, plodding, nose to the grindstone advancement through a career, all accompanied by social anxiety and thus insisting on a dull respectability and conformity to convention, was not the aristocratic lifestyle.

    Mind you, I'm not necessarily defending the aristocratic lifestyle - at its worst, it was unbearably artificial, pompous, wasteful, and viciously arrogant and cruel to the lower classes, but at its best it presented certain very attractive features compared to the dull conventionality of bourgeois life.

    To the Greeks, "leisure" was an explicit ideal, celebrated as the highest end of life - for the Chinese likewise, refined leisure was explicitly celebrated as the highest sort of life. Indeed for all pre-bourgouis cultures leisure was the highest form of life and work was not celebrated for its own sake. Modern bourgeois culture is perhaps the first in history to celebrate work and make it into an intrinsic virtue - and this is in fact a massive revolution in human affairs (which in my view must be overturned :) ). All previous cultures celebrated the contemplative life as the highest.

    And it is my belief that the modern celebration of work and disvaluing of the contemplative life is somehow at the very heart of modern nihilism, and that is a very significant fact.

    As a final remark, of course there was also an aristocratic tradition of "service", often military, and the English aristocracy often provided motivated and self-sacrificing officers and empire-builders to their country - and this was a very attractive thing indeed.

    But this too is a far cry from the kind bourgeois hard work celebration of someone like AP :)

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Coconuts, @AP

    But this kind of thing is compatible with a life of refined leisure [of aristocrats]

    You repeat bourgeois fairytales that were used to justify the bourgeois takeover of the Western world. What you described would be considered an embarrassment.

    Consider the Russian Grand Duke Sergei Alexandrovich, who served as Governor of Moscow . He wasn’t particularly successful but was hardly living a life of refined leisure. From wiki:

    “was extremely conscientious in carrying out his duties: “Even in the country when he was supposed to be resting,” his niece remembered, “he was constantly receiving couriers from Moscow and giving audiences.” He paid much attention to detail, attending personally to matters that could easily have been left to subordinates, punishing corruption and fraud. At times, he would go about the city incognito to see conditions for himself.[31] In private, he and his wife were concerned about the poverty they saw in Moscow and the surrounding countryside, discussing ways to improve it.[32]

    Welfare organizations and charities always attracted Sergei’s attention and he became either chairman or patron of scores of them.[33] He was, for example, chairman of the Moscow Society for the Care, Upbringing, and Education of Blind Children; of the Society for Homeless, Neglected Children, and Convicted Adolescents; and the Moscow Department of the Russian Department Society of National Health Protection.[33]

    How many hours a week you figure was was busy in service to others? Much more the typical modern bourgeois.

    And it was similar as one goes further down, with regional governors, mayors of cities, owners of estates. One of my relatives managed a village that he owned, was also a physician, a poet, and was also a mayor of the local regional capital (now in SE Poland) where under his tenure he modernized all the city’s infrastructure.

    And then look at noblemen such as Pilsudski, Hrushevsky, the Baltic Germans Barons who played a large role in running Russia, the Prussian Junkers (was Hindenburg who worked until his death leading a life of lazy refined leisure?), etc. etc.

    Don’t attribute your own personal laziness to entire classes of people or equate being productive to “bourgeois values” or given the bourgeois a monopoly on hard work.

    And it is my belief that the modern celebration of work and disvaluing of the contemplative life

    Or, you are a lazy parasite who claims that work and contemplation must be opposed to one another as an excuse for taking the fruits of your parents’ labor and refusing to be a productive person.

    As a final remark, of course there was also an aristocratic tradition of “service”

    You pretend that it was not central, and that they did not work hard.

    But they worked just as hard if not more so than modern bourgeois. The legacy of beauty and power of the Western world was the result of hard work by the nobility. They organized and funded conservatories, gave their lives in battle, immersed themselves in scholarly works, built educational networks, explored the world, ran and modernized cities and provinces, etc.

    To the Greeks, “leisure” was an explicit ideal

    Correct, and this differentiated Christendom from the Classical Greeks right away and sharply differentiated Christian aristocrats from Classical Greeks.

    • Agree: Ivashka the fool
  838. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Dmitry

    Culture does not create conspiracies.

    It seems that you have heard once something about Frankists, aka followers of Jacob Frank (who was actually a Sephardi from Ottoman Empire), a Polish version of Sabbateanism which advocated conversion of Jews not to Islam, but to Catholicism... in PLC many more of them got ennobled in Lithuania than in Poland, since it was easier to do that in Lithuania. You can sometimes recognize their (probable) descendants from their surnames, eg. Polish minister of health and Covid things, Niedzielski, comes from Niedziela/Sunday: this is a typical surname of a convert.

    They are honoured now. Olga Tokarczuk got a Noble prize for a novel about them. She depicted Jacob Frank as kind of enamoured with the lifestyle of Polish nobility/magnates, like having his own court and troops etc. Well, it is possible that Hassidic custom of "holding court" by tzadik came from emulation of Polish nobility too.

    Replies: @Dmitry

    Polish minister of health and Covid things, Niedzielski, comes from Niedziela/Sunday

    Sadly I don’t know enough about Poland’s politics to know those examples.

    But in the Kaczynski brothers, the currently ruling Jaroslaw expression reminds me less of Netanyahu, than the old President of Poland Lech Kaczynski.

    Jaroslaw looks a bit too suppressed and nonexpressive, but Lech has more similar expressions.

    Lech Kaczynski died when he was only 60 and Netanyahu is 73, so the current Netanyahu is maybe too unmatched for age (I guess pensioners develop new face expressions), but if you try to find photos of Netanyahu from a few years ago.

    There is the neutral Lech Kaczynski when he was age 50s.

    When they are they anxioushttps://i.imgur.com/ok0uWa5.jpg

    They have more similar expression when they are smiling (“how can we slowly backslide this democracy”)

    • LOL: Ivashka the fool
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Dmitry

    What you are proposing is rather autistic.

    That are general expressions of human emotions: by recognizing their similarity, humans identify emotions, not individual persons.

    Anyway, the usual motif of Doppelgaenger stories is that this double is doing everything the opposite way in comparison to its original.

    Replies: @Dmitry

  839. @Dmitry
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Polish minister of health and Covid things, Niedzielski, comes from Niedziela/Sunday
     
    Sadly I don't know enough about Poland's politics to know those examples.

    But in the Kaczynski brothers, the currently ruling Jaroslaw expression reminds me less of Netanyahu, than the old President of Poland Lech Kaczynski.

    Jaroslaw looks a bit too suppressed and nonexpressive, but Lech has more similar expressions.

    Lech Kaczynski died when he was only 60 and Netanyahu is 73, so the current Netanyahu is maybe too unmatched for age (I guess pensioners develop new face expressions), but if you try to find photos of Netanyahu from a few years ago.

    There is the neutral Lech Kaczynski when he was age 50s.

    https://i.imgur.com/U4OyM5D.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/dtZAQ2y.jpg

    When they are they anxious
    https://i.imgur.com/DYgEWtl.jpg
    https://i.imgur.com/ok0uWa5.jpg

    They have more similar expression when they are smiling ("how can we slowly backslide this democracy")


    https://i.imgur.com/LBgx6HX.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/vY66bI8.jpg

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    What you are proposing is rather autistic.

    That are general expressions of human emotions: by recognizing their similarity, humans identify emotions, not individual persons.

    Anyway, the usual motif of Doppelgaenger stories is that this double is doing everything the opposite way in comparison to its original.

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @Another Polish Perspective

    There are general expressions of human emotions, but there are also expressions which come from your family, nationality and culture.

    You can turn the sound off in your television and you'll know what country you are in.

    If you compare France with Russia, or Italian with Scottish. People in different nationality do all that differently.

    Also even the way people are walking is different by nationality. I've had experience just knowing there are people from Russia from the other side of the street in a dark street in a foreign country (and Ukraine/Belarus are identical as Russia). You just know, because there is something subtle in the way people walk which is different.

    -

    Obviously Netanyahu and Kaczynski are becoming culturally distant compared to his parent who was born in Poland, and the personality type is not very similar (Netanyahu very expressive and emotional). But they do the same thing with their eyebrows and mouths.

    Netanyahu reminds of still impressions of Polish culture, whereas young Israeli politicians cannot remind of them. I guess like perhaps around 1960s/1970s Israel perhaps developed more of its own expressions and manners, probably accelerating after absorbing massive immigration of Mizrachi Jews (like massive immigration of Italians create the Argentinian expressions).

  840. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Dmitry

    What you are proposing is rather autistic.

    That are general expressions of human emotions: by recognizing their similarity, humans identify emotions, not individual persons.

    Anyway, the usual motif of Doppelgaenger stories is that this double is doing everything the opposite way in comparison to its original.

    Replies: @Dmitry

    There are general expressions of human emotions, but there are also expressions which come from your family, nationality and culture.

    You can turn the sound off in your television and you’ll know what country you are in.

    If you compare France with Russia, or Italian with Scottish. People in different nationality do all that differently.

    Also even the way people are walking is different by nationality. I’ve had experience just knowing there are people from Russia from the other side of the street in a dark street in a foreign country (and Ukraine/Belarus are identical as Russia). You just know, because there is something subtle in the way people walk which is different.

    Obviously Netanyahu and Kaczynski are becoming culturally distant compared to his parent who was born in Poland, and the personality type is not very similar (Netanyahu very expressive and emotional). But they do the same thing with their eyebrows and mouths.

    Netanyahu reminds of still impressions of Polish culture, whereas young Israeli politicians cannot remind of them. I guess like perhaps around 1960s/1970s Israel perhaps developed more of its own expressions and manners, probably accelerating after absorbing massive immigration of Mizrachi Jews (like massive immigration of Italians create the Argentinian expressions).

  841. @AP
    @Ivashka the fool

    Does this seem to be a worthwhile book?


    https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-scythian-empire-book-review-history-the-riders-from-the-steppe-11674233967

    ‘The Scythian Empire’ Review: The Riders From the Steppe
    A powerful central Asian culture left its mark on civilizations from the Black Sea to the Yellow River, but history has better remembered its successors.

    Scholarly depth and breadth rarely meet on equal terms. In “The Scythian Empire: Central Eurasia and the Birth of the Classical Age From Persia to China,” Christopher I. Beckwith marries the two to memorable effect.



    A professor of Eurasian studies at Indiana University Bloomington, Mr. Beckwith asserts the primacy of the Scythian Empire’s influence on the classical age. The Scythians, pastoral nomads who roamed the Central Eurasian steppe zone from around the eighth century B.C., are traditionally dismissed as uncouth predators whose legacy was negative, inconsequential or, at best, ambiguous. In the fifth century B.C., Aristophanes portrayed oafish, heavily accented Scythians policing Athens, while Herodotus decried their rule over the vanquished for its “violence and . . . pride”: “besides exacting from each the tribute which was assessed, they rode about the land carrying off everyone’s possessions.” Yet to Mr. Beckwith, the Scythians represent “one of the least known but most influential realms in all of world history.”

    Historians have acknowledged Scythian innovations, including an unprecedented feudal structure, monotheism and sophisticated weapons—namely, short composite bows that allowed mounted archers greater range of movement. These practices are typically thought to have been copied by their better-known imperial successors, the Medes and Persians. Mr. Beckwith contends, however, that the Medes and Persians were actually “creolized” Scythians.

    Pre-Scythian Medes inhabited parts of contemporary Iran, Turkey and Iraq; theirs was “strictly a geographical region, not an ethnolinguistic entity or a political unit,” according to Mr. Beckwith. A fully realized Mede polity dates to Cyaxares’s overthrow of the Scythians (ca. 620 B.C.). “Raised as a Scythian,” Cyaxares is not known to have altered any “inherited Scythian clothing, weapons, state structure, religious beliefs, etc,” Mr. Beckwith writes. To do so would have gone against the grain, “because by that time . . . the Scythians . . . and the native peoples had merged.”

    The reigns of the Medes and Persians, initiated by coups, were validated by their leaders’ identification with the Scythians’ royal lineage. Cyaxares, who led an allied force against the Assyrians, captured and destroyed Nineveh in 612 B.C. He was followed by his purported son, Astyages. Cyrus II, Astyages’s Persian grandson, in turn seized power in 550 B.C. Carrying on the Scytho-Mede line, Cyrus “kept the Empire and the entire imperial system intact—with the exception of the religious element—when he overthrew the Mede king.” Mr. Beckwith refers to this longest-lasting iteration as the Scytho-Mede-Persian Empire.

    If the Medes and Persians were, in essential respects, Scythian by another name, why was the Scythian system so attractive to usurpers and impervious to change? The appeals of Scythian feudalism were its religious justification and the coherence of its “package”—the sovereign served the one God of Heaven and was supported by an evolving pyramid of vassals. Religion legitimized the king and imbued his subjects, direct and indirect, with divine purpose. Later claimants, Mr. Beckwith observes, could not retain their feudal hierarchy without its religious underpinning.

    Proof can be found in the short-lived polytheism of Cyrus and Cambyses II: “They clearly did not understand,” Mr. Beckwith points out, “that because local ‘national God’ cults legitimized local national rulers, i.e., independent kings, a single unified empire required a single ruler legitimized by a single God.” Darius I restored the status quo ante, declaring, “The Great God is Ahuramazdā, who created this earth, who created that heaven, who created man, who created happiness for man, who made Darius king, one king of many, one lord of many.”

    Mr. Beckwith cites linguistic evidence for the Scythians’ widespread legacy. Three cities called Agamatāna were built by Scythians (or Scythian speakers) “at the same time, but very far apart”: the Mede capital in modern-day Iran and, thousands of miles to the east, successive capitals of the Scytho-Chinese state of Chao. The author also notes that variants of the Scythian word for “royal line,” Aria, preserved its meaning in Bactrian, Old Persian and Chinese: “This word Harya . . . came to be used by Chinese speakers in the fourth century B.C. to refer to themselves, i.e., ‘us the Chinese’, meaning those who belonged to the legitimate ruling lineage, Harya.” A national signifier from Iran to China, Aria attests to Scythian reach.

    An epilogue on capital-P Philosophy considers Scythian links to the “first great philosophers” of Greece, Iran, India and China: Anacharsis (“the Scythian”), Zoroaster, Gautama (“the Scythian Sage”) and Laotzu. Anacharsis, an early Greek Skeptic was half Scythian by birth and education. Zoroaster’s Gathas (“Hymns”) were composed in Old Avestan, an archaic dialect of Imperial Scythian. Gautama hailed from northwestern India or Central Asia, “regions known to have been ruled by the Scythians, Scytho-Medes, and related peoples who succeeded them.” Mr. Beckwith transcribes the foreign-born Laotzu’s full name, Lao-tan—“lao” was formerly pronounced like “k’ao”—into the Sanskrit Gautama. For Mr. Beckwith, the simultaneous appearance of these revolutionary figures and ideas was no coincidence. Rejecting the belief that ancient cultures were conceived locally, he proposes that the Scythians were the common denominator that “produced the great shared cultural flowering known as the Classical Age.”

    Of Mr. Beckwith’s eight fresh and penetrating chapters, only the sixth, on Classical Scythian philology, is likely to challenge the nonspecialist. For the rest of the text, his prose and data-driven analysis are clear. But superior delivery does not on its own set his book apart. “The Scythian Empire” is simply, dazzlingly original. Ever-narrowing fields of academic study and inability to see the whole historical picture, he suggests, partly explain the Scythians’ discredit and neglect. As for Mr. Beckwith, his curiosity, imagination and learning—from the Yellow River to the Danube, from archaeology to linguistics—do what every history ought to do but few achieve: compel the reader to think.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Another Polish Perspective

    Yes it looks highly interesting although perhaps stretched a bit when it comes to Lao Tzu. The rest is more or less how I see it. Especially the sentence below:

    Mr. Beckwith contends, however, that the Medes and Persians were actually “creolized” Scythians.

    Absolutely correct.

    And after the fall of the different Scythian confederations, the Sarmatians, the Xiongnu, the Kushans, the Hephtalite, the Turks and finally the Mongols – all used the social system, the nomadic tool kit and even to some degree the religious patterns that have been created by the Indo-Iranian tribes that the Greek named using the exonyme Scythians.

    Basically, people originating in Sintashta-Arkaim/Andronovo culture have dominated the main part of Eurasian plain for nearly 2000 years.

    Most researchers associate the Andronovo horizon with early Indo-Iranian languages, though it may have overlapped the early Uralic-speaking area at its northern fringe.[8] Allentoft et al. (2015) concluded from their genetic studies that the Andronovo culture and the preceding Sintashta culture should be partially derived from the Corded Ware culture, given the higher proportion of ancestry matching the earlier farmers of Europe, similar to the admixture found in the genomes of the Corded Ware population.[9]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andronovo_culture

    [MORE]

    An anecdote; when I first read the Suzuki translation of the Lankavatara Sutra, one of the final paragraphs presented the scribe that transcribed it as belonging to the “tribe of Soma”, which Suzuki translated as “the Moon tribe”. I had a chuckle, because Soma was the famous entheogen used by the Vedic Aryans and named Haoma (or Hauma) by the Avestan Aryans. It was indeed considered as being “moon-like” when mixed into water (probably through some opalescent whitish colloidal effect).

    So about Scythians, the best at producing Soma / Haoma were the Saka haumavarga. Saka for Scythians (as well as Shakya in the Buddha’s clan name) and I am pretty sure that you can understand the meaning if varga (варка) from your knowledge of the Slav languages. So basically, the scribe who wrote the Lankavatara Sutra translated by Suzuki might well have been a Scythian “drug dealer” from modern day Central Asia.

    https://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/haumavarga

    Therefore I have not been in the least surprised when I one day saw this image:

    (I wonder what this “Scythian Bodhisattva” carried in his stash bag…)

    🙂

    • Thanks: AP
    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Ivashka the fool


    An anecdote; when I first read the Suzuki translation of the Lankavatara Sutra, one of the final paragraphs presented the scribe that transcribed it as belonging to the “tribe of Soma”, which Suzuki translated as “the Moon tribe”.
     
    Soma is another name for the moon & Soma-Vansh another name for Lunar Dynasty.
    You eat beef why are you even discussing this?

    https://twitter.com/akali_berserker/status/1616827460305432576

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @sudden death
    @Ivashka the fool

    According to this memer (have no idea how wrong/right) Andronovo were blond?:

    https://twitter.com/AquaPaadre/status/1548396438144487424

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  842. @Dmitry
    @Dmitry


    Netanyahu starts to imitate Kaczynski’s facial expression, not just his methods of control of country. Soon he can maneuver full control of the political system.
     
    Although just to add of course, this is supposed to be a joke. Netanyahu is not so bad like Kaczynski. He reforms the country and has plenty positive attainments. Netanyahu has imported a lot of the positive American reforms of the economy. And when he tried to control the media, he goes to court. But there are some resemblance with Kaczynski, not only in the facial expression. The attempts for democratic backsliding is reminding of somewhere.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Netanyahu is not so bad like Kaczynski. He reforms the country and has plenty positive attainments.

    I’ve tried to read up on Kaczynski; but to my chagrin could not find objective and reliable English-language sources. He’s been described as “xenophobic”, “nationalist” and “authoritarian”; neither of which are bad things in my book. I don’t want to opine on Polish internal politics too much; but probably if I were a Pole i’d vote for the nationalist parties which seek to maintain Poland For Poles and resist the migration waves heading into Europe. The (semi-)irreversible nature of immigration policies would make it a number one priority; everything else negotiable.

    You seem to consider democracy as being the Chief Good in politics, to borrow an Aristotelian term; so in your opinion Kaczynski is bad because of the backsliding. But for me the results matter more than the system. The system is only important insofar as it can deliver the results. Many of the greatest world historical leaders were authoritarians; Lee Kuan Yew, Otto von Bismarck, Cardinal Richelieu, Piotr Stolypin, Fouad Chehab etc. On the other hand, many of the worst leaders have also been authoritarians. It’s a mixed-bag. But being an authoritarian doesn’t necessarily preclude competence or effectiveness. In fact, authoritarians may be more intelligent on average than democratic leaders. Kaczynski will have to be judged on his track record; both in the present and the long-term future.

    But i’d like to hear APP’s perspective on Polish politics.

    Dmitry, what is your judgement on Israeli and Russian historical leaders?

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @Yahya


    Russian historical leaders

     

    It's only Yeltsin/Putin since independence. It should be Yeltsin-Putin, as the same cartel, just with some changes of boss, underboss, consiglieres etc.

    From the non-clickable options shown, the most sensible was Prokhorov in 2012. But non-clickable.


    , what is your judgement on Israeli an
     
    In economics, it is possible Lapid was a responsible manager. They reduced debt:GDP ratio more than 10% in a single year. This speed of fall in debt:GDP ratio is very fast.
    https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-israels-debt-gdp-ratio-shrank-dramatically-in-2022-1001435908

    But some things was becoming worse. https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-car-thefts-in-israel-double-1001434711 I guess the Israel-Palestinian conflict was less violent in 2022 at least, than 2021.


    )irreversible nature of immigration
     
    Poland's government don't control so much of their immigration policy. EU controls most of it. They have open-borders with the EU bloc. But it's a less relevant for them as few immigrants who have access to the Schengen Area, will stay in Poland.

    This is why a lot of this is political trading between EU countries. There is a system where they all outsource their immigration policy to the EU and the countries which receive most of the immigration will be the wealthy Western European countries. Small numbers of immigrants would choose to stay in Poland when they can go to Germany.

    For their own immigration policy, Poland give more visas to non-EU citizens (mostly temporary working visas for Ukrainians, Belarusians and Turks), than all other EU countries combined.


    Kaczynski is bad because of the backsliding
     
    If they have some compensatory results for backsliding.

    For example, Lee Kuan Yew has success with the housing policy in Singapore (probably including the forced "melting pot"). He was able to continue the English legal tradition there. His authoritarian policy was probably negative, but there are many positive things.

    Kaczynski. Poland's situation improves, receiving first world infrastructure, but in terms of etiology, this was funded by the EU. EU gave over hundred billion of dollars to invest in Poland.

    To some extent, Kaczynski's party's rhetoric threatens this funding in future. If you make these anti-German campaigns in the media, to be popular with older low income base, but German taxpayers are paying the receipts for the shiny new things they base their legacy from.

    At the same time industry is more controlled by Germany. Regions of Poland which support Kaczynski, are demographically collapsing as the young people exit and fertility rate of those which stay is lower than Japan. Management of the coronavirus crisis was incompetent for Poland compared to Western Europe. They have more energy independence from Russia than some of Central Europe, but using coal, so, having the worst air pollution in Europe.

    GDP per capita doesn't really seem to converge with Western Europe, if you look at the nominal data. I'm sure there are positive things as well that Kaczynski attained. He is a trade-union leader. He says he has improve the conditions for working class people. Although they have installed neoliberal banker Morawiecki, to Prime Minister. Poland has at least been developing and improving, although not because of its politicians.

    Probably the vast increase in military spending will be negative for long-term. They will spend $21 billion for their military next year. It is 4 times more than Egypt.

    Replies: @AP

    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    KACZYNSKIS. I have positive view of Kaczynskis as persons and moderately positive as politicians. The first connects to two as Kaczynski have been one of the few Polish politicans who were known as not to become corrupt or greedy from the former anti-communist opposition, especially in the time of "wild capitalism" preceding Polish accession to EU. At that time Kaczynskis had their ownn small party (Porozumienie Centrum - the Agreement for Center), so called 'cadre party" (like Bolsheviks before 1917) from where the most trusted by Kaczynski politicans came after 2002, when PiS (Law and Justice) was created and Porozumienie Centrum liquidated. Kaczynski political skills - ruling on the base of small group of trusted politicians - came from Porozuminie Centrum times. It was Lech Kaczynski who was the man of the people, his brother has always been known as a backroom schemer - Jarosław is not overly popular, he didn't win presidential elections even in the wake of his brother death in Katyn in 2010.

    Nevertheless, his agenda is popular - the very name of his party, "Law and Justice" was born out of opposition to wild capitalism of the nineties. His politics of ending of deference to Germans especially and broadly, to West Europe, is correct, especially as Germans are very hypocritical, often equating European values with German values. It does exist mainly in terms of politics however - Polish consular service in Poland is still more concerned with "German sovereignty" than with helping Polish citizens there, and that despite special law PiS made which explicitly demands that Polish consuls fight discrimination of Polish citizens abroad (that the law was made which actually forces upon consuls their nominal duties, speaks of the problem). It also shows the problem of reforms when the will of politicians is not made into reality by officials, who do know that politicians are transitory. That they expect this transition is also a proof that Poland is not experienced as a dictatorship by Poles themselves.

    The very good example of that is the debate on the independence of the courts, judges being long-term officials like consuls. However to understand this debate, one has yet to know that in Europe, constitutional courts can often nullify a law (such is a case in Poland, Germany and Israel at least) if they deem it "unconstitutional", effectively resulting by the rule of judges: it is sometimes called "judical activism". That is often a matter of judges fancy or political stance, since it is easy to find anything within the very broad statements of constitution. Moreover, those judges are not democratically elected, so even if you win elections, judges can hamper your agenda.

    The independence of courts is of minimal significance to a normal citizen, due to the fact that it is very improbable that his appeal to the highest court will be taken and decided upon - in Germany, 97% of all individually submitted constitutional lawsuits are discarded by Bundesverfassungsgericht without deciding on their merits. In Poland, a single citizen cannot even submit such a lawsuit to Constitutional Court.
    In normal judicial proceedings, it is of no importance since in civil law system there is no stare decisis principle but the "free assessment of proofs" principle, "free" of course for a court not for you. It essentially means that a court can skew the outcome just by ignoring your arguments, also that from European law (like Strasbourg or Luxembourg tribunal). In other words, you have a right to address a court but you do not have a right to have your arguments addressed by a court, even if your arguments are based on EU or ECHR jurisprudence. It is a much bigger problem in Germany than in Poland actually, where there is absolutely no deference to international law INSIDE Germany: Bundesverfassungsgericht has an unofficial doctrine of the primacy of the German law over ECHR or EU law.

    Is manipulation around courts political ? Yes, it is . But everyone should understand that truly independent judiciary would be chosen by lot and for short terms (eg. 2 years) - anything else than that is not fully independent.

    In Poland itself PiS corrected some of the most painful deficits of legal system in Poland, like the possibility of losing a lawsuit against you simply by not knowing about it, since it was enough to send a lawsuit to your official registered address, which in Poland can be only one ("meldunek") - and after 14 days it was delivered by the power of "delivery fiction" legal concept. Now your opponent must establish your real address

    Is Kaczynski a dictator? Of course no, since he has rather weak parliamentary (but not constitutional majority) and is rather likely that he will lose this majority in the next elections.

    THE NEGATIVE CONSEQUENCES OF POLISH MEMBERSHIP IN EU.
    1) a lot of young people emigrated to EU and will probably not come back - you could say this prepared way to emigration to Poland of Ukrainians (and their "work" visas did not allow for Schengen travel, so they were "encouraged" to stay in Poland too). The initial process of mass emigration FROM Poland was a kind of grooming Poland for accepting immigration in this way.

    2) skewing economy towards EU-fundable projects, like constructions projects. There is too much money in that. It results in 2a) constant repairs of roads which were deliberately built/repaired with defects just few years ago. It was also visible when Poland wanted to shift EU funds for Polish railways to roads: it was clear that there is "patron-client" relationship between construction firms and politicians - and you can so easily milk the railway funds since railway construction is much more regulated than roads construction 2b) building of unnecessary things like some airports, aquaparks in cities, projects which now have problems with sustaining themselves due to growing energy prices or lack of customers. Well, if you like, you can get EU funds for opening a park with alpacas too.
    In terms of housing, the counterpart to this is the growth of banking sectors funding developers (who are some of the new Polish oligarchs) who build heavily overpriced apartments which people than buy with mortgages. The worth of PL banking sector is now more than Polish GDP, it is 137% of GDP! It means the value of credits portfolio is worth more than everything produced in Poland in a year - and remember that part of that GDP is building sector itself, a sector which provides products which can be mortgaged. So its even worse, as it is a closed loop.

    It could be different. The matter was generally decided in the pre-EU period after 1989, when a lot of advanced Polish industry was sold to the Western companies which then liquidated it, eg. ELWRO - Poland had one of best electronic industries in the East Bloc, producing not just mainframe computers but also its own personal computers, even if with text-based interface (but also with graphic one on license). I don't say Poland could be a Taiwan of Europe (but it did produce its own microprocessors too), but certainly could be helped to become part of the world high tech industry chain.

    There must be understood that Kaczynski voters - who are around 25% of society since 50% of Poles do not vote at all - mostly did not participate in this milking of EU funds. Nevertheless, because EU projects, different than simple infrastructure building, must be international (eg. participants must be from at least 5 EU countries), Kaczynski is dependent to some extent on EU funding too. There is simply not enough of Polish economy not connected to EU to build prosperity upon. So he did not take such a confrontational course like Orban, who also has a bonus of constitutional majority, smaller country, being much popular among international right, and being a former Soros man - who knows whether he isn't just controlled opposition within EU?

    Orban, with his image of loose cannon, has its advantages for EU too - he can veto something which EU officially supports, but unofficially is aware of its divisiveness, like anti-Russian stance. Orban also canalizes internal opposition in EU countries into the fight for parliament seats as he is a "successful" example of achieving power by constitutional means.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Mr. Hack, @Another Polish Perspective

  843. @Dmitry
    @Ivashka the fool

    Soviet "Jews" going to Israel is not related to the holocaust except in some ideological propaganda that might be presented for charities. In reality, because of being opportunity to go live in developed country (in terms of income and public services), even though not a desirable developed country, from country with low income and the always increasing asset stripping of public sphere.*

    If Israel had open borders with Russia (instead of closing borders except with people that have documentary evidence of Jewish grandparent, which is maybe less than one or two percent of the population), then the immigration would be around 30 million Russians immigrating to Israel between 2000-2020. https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-151/#comment-4701156 Possibly higher as cities which had larger Jewish minority include Moscow and Saint-Petersburg that lowers the emigration number (for obvious reason) compared to other parts of the country.

    If a country like UK or France had open borders with Russia, then half of the young population would have emigrated from Russia within a few years, especially from the provincial areas. This is before recent events. Imagine if Australia was opening border, where there are beaches and warm weather.

    Before recent events, millions of young people would just emigrate to work in MacDonald's. For example, McDonald’s in Australia pays $18 an hour for the same job that McDonald’s in Russia pays $1,90 an hour (and still has no problem with recruitment). 9,5 McDonald’s employees in Russia are equivalent value to 1 McDonald’s employee in Australia.

    Media space in Russia doesn't talk about this for ideological reasons, but all countries in this development level have the same problem and lower in the ranking has more problems - Uzbekistan rejects the Kremlin invitation to join the open border space every year because of they don't want to lose even more of their people.

    -

    *Elite things are something different which I don't understand. Why Kudrin was registering Israeli citizenship this year before becoming manager of Yandex.


    cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it
     
    BBC has published an interesting article about Japan, where they say it's a very happy charming country, people lived well there, but the society is aging and dying, population falls, without adequate immigration, property prices fall.

    But the author doesn't connect the two sides. There is happy, charming country, partly related to the population decline without immigration, property price fall is bad for owners, but housing was more affordable for buyers, ecology improves, there are more wild spaces, there are higher teacher to student ratio in schools, the traffice jam is smaller.

    They don't seem to understand there are normal mix of pluses and minuses with the political choice of a developed country's immigration policy. E.g. "Large parts of the country could return to the wild." This is usual mix of good and bad.
    https://twitter.com/JeromeTaylor/status/1616995825594544128

    Replies: @Dmitry, @Ivashka the fool

    Soviet “Jews” going to Israel is not related to the holocaust

    Yes I agree, and I didn’t write it was related to holocaust. I wrote that it was due to Perestroika (and of course fall of USSR).

    BBC has published an interesting article about Japan, where they say it’s a very happy charming country, people lived well there, but the society is aging and dying, population falls, without adequate immigration, property prices fall.

    Are you suggesting that those who benefit most from the mass immigration to the West are also the same who benefit the most from higher inflation?

    Careful where you thread Dmitry, because one of the reasons given for the increasing inflation this years is the war in Ukraine…

    [MORE]


    All wars are banker wars ?

    All immigration is banker immigration ?

    Oy vey ! Oy gevalt…

    This might be seen as antisemitic… Be careful…

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @Ivashka the fool


    I wrote that it was due to Perestroika (and of course fall of USSR).
     
    With Perestroika (I think 1990 is the year emigration was beginning to flood) there were opportunities for some Soviet citizens which had a grandparent with "Jew" and "German" nationality in their documents, to exit with open borders to Israel (for "Jews") and Germany (for "Germans" and "Jews"), although no open borders for most nationalities unless they have advantage of education, money or family.

    Most of those emigrants would not know or care anything special for Israel or Germany. It's like people going to Kazakhstan and Georgia today. It's because they see an open door, not because of special love for Khachapuri.

    In the 2010s, (talking about before 2022) most ordinary young people would exit Russia if there were open borders with a developed country. But unless you have advantage of education, money and family, it's not easy for ordinary people to exit to any developed country.

    Most of the world's population dream to emigrate to developed countries, at least the younger people. If developed countries have open borders, and the undeveloped countries don't close borders for exit, then young people will exit to the same developed countries.

    Most of the world doesn't have a nice country, will not be born in one. So most of the world always will try to go to countries with civilized conditions. The main question is about whether the policy is to open/close border. Strength of motive for the peoples' movement mostly just delta in the living conditions between the countries.

    -

    From the global view, it would be more sustainable to expand the number of countries with civilized conditions. But as we discussed a lot, the conditions for a civilized country, are requiring sometimes centuries of development, installation of anglosaxon legal tradition etc.



    BBC has published an interesting article about Japan, where they say it’s a very happy charming country, people lived well there, but the society is aging and dying, population falls, without adequate immigration, property prices fall.
     
    to the West are also the same who benefit the most from higher inflation?

     

    I think pensions are more requiring constant immigration in the West than the mortgage industry

    What do you think about this article?
    https://wealthandpoverty.center/2021/09/12/demographic-collapse-2-ponzi-schemes.

    Although the property price could at least be constant. The pensions need more people like the Ponzi.

    Careful where you thread Dmitry, because one of the reasons given for the increasing inflation this years is the war in Ukraine…
     

    I don't think the special military operation is a bank's conspiracy. Banks are losing large part of their money this year especially investment. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-01-06/wall-street-ends-worst-investment-banking-year-since-2016

    But more self-interest of the rulers, can explain these events. After all, they thought they would win the war and have some victory parades by now.



    -

    *Perhaps even in the 1960s/1970s, millions of people would have exited if they have opportunity.

    But compared to today, there was more investment in public sphere and some things were less diverged.

    You know one of the more scary things found in the World Bank website, life expectancy in Ukraine was higher than Japan in the 1960s (nowadays lower than Brazil).
    https://i.imgur.com/yshRxmx.jpg

    But in the last 40 years, Bangladesh converged in this indicator even before the war. This is not Brazil, but Bangladesh.

    https://i.imgur.com/UB3ATeR.jpg

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  844. @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    To cure a disease you have to identify the pathogen and/or its physiological cause. If you don't get the cause - then you cannot solve the problem.

    What is the cause of mass immigration in (former) European majority territories, who benefits from this immigration and why those benefiting from this mass movement have chosen to maximize it - without answering these questions clearly there is no solution to the problem.

    Regarding the separation aspect and the manners to make it desirable for those you would like to separate from, as long as they're more comfortable in the lands where they came in the last decades, than in the lands where their ancestors lived for millenia past, they will cling to stay in their newly acquired and often minimal comfort.

    One has to make it desirable, even vital, for them to go back. It took a massacre of unprecedented proportions and a complete overhaul of the pre-war life, to make most European Jews even want to try to consider relocating to Palestine. And even that way more than half of them preferred relocating to America. It took Perestroika to make Soviet Jews emigrate, and again - many chose to go West.

    Just imagine what it would take to make an immigrant from the DRC leave Belgium and go back to North Kivu or a Detroit Afro-American to go back to Wakanda.

    It's not doable.

    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?

    Answer this first.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @A123, @Sher Singh, @Dmitry, @AP, @silviosilver

    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?

    It’s been asked and answered a thousand times. Competently answered, too. There are multiple reasons, though for any of them one can always ask “well why did that happen?” and then put the same question to whatever answer is given, like a child pestering his parents with an infinite series of “but why?” At some point, this has to be seen simply as an obstructionist tactic.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @silviosilver

    Okay, let's not answer this question. We both know the answer (see my reply to Dmitry above).

    What are you and/or other White Nationalists gonna do about the root of the problem ?

    Is there anything that can reasonably be done that had not been tried already ?

    If there's nothing to do about the main causal element, then the problem cannot reasonably be expected to be solved.

    Let's ponder a little, if the problem of the separation and preservation of a more humane and civilized society is impossible, if we are going the way of the Latin Roman Empire around the end of the third century AD, then what should be the focus of the most perceptive of men ?

    (I know you are one of those, no irony here - your comments show that you are highly intelligent)

  845. @Beckow
    @Greasy William


    ...untrained manpower in WWII
     
    A very different current situation: borders are open, families are small, there is more information. No advanced country can expend manpower for too long - that's why Nato is staying out.

    Washington hopes that the above manpower dilemmas will apply to Russia first. Some of it will, but Russia has much better numbers and that matters. Kiev can theoretically assemble a 10-million army, but they are simply not in a position to do it. Most likely the willingness to die will peter out and only a core group will continue to fight. When morale breaks - and it will - it happens suddenly and is unstoppable. So whose morale will break first?

    Replies: @QCIC

    Why would Russia’s morale break? I think the longer this drags on the more serious it looks from a Russian perspective in the sense of more existential and less optional. It also gives Russian Rossiya messaging a chance to catch up.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @QCIC

    It does appear that Russian morale is holding up pretty well and Beckow makes a point that I hadsn't considered.

    After seeing the behavior of the Poles and Germans over the last couple of days, the West, outside of the US, may indeed be too spiritually weak to do what is necessary to save Ukraine. And the Ukrainian state and society may not actually be capable of mobilizing anymore than they already have.

    So that leaves the US. As of now, the US has not provided Ukraine with enough material to regain any lost territory, let alone all of it. Will the US eventually do so? I don't know. Right now it appears that the US only wants to send Ukraine what it needs to survive.

    We'll have a better idea in the fall where things are headed.

  846. @AnonfromTN
    @S

    My two cents about handles. In sharp contrast to “Bashibuzuk”, which sounded right, “Ivashka the fool” sounds all wrong. Based on Russian folk tales, it should have been either “Ivanushka the little fool” (Иванушка дурачок) or “Ivan the fool” (Иван дурак).

    Replies: @QCIC

    Maybe the ChatGPT updated version of Bashybuzik doesn’t have these subtleties dialed in yet…

  847. @Another Polish Perspective
    @LatW


    Well, from what I understand, Wends are Lechitic Slavs, but not all Lechitic Slavs are Wends.
     
    The problem with these "multiple Lechitic tribes" theory is that there are very scarce archaeological remnants for this multitude. It is still the standard history taught in Polish schools, but is increasingly questioned. The theory is a kind of bridge over the fact of the emergence of Poland and the previous scant written references to few tribes there, but archaeology did not provide the expected evidence of mini-states (ok, of Latvia-size) which could merge in the one large state of Poland.

    Similarly,
    Wends as name that


    refers not to a homogeneous people, but to various peoples, tribes or groups depending on where and when it was used.
     
    seems to me to be suspicious in the sense that this name couldn't be produced by the interested people themselves (Likewise, the name of Galia was imposed by Romans), so the name could be produced only be outsiders, in this case, Germans, and it is known that Germans had clear ideas only about Slavic lands directly bordering their East Marchies.

    The article of Wikipedia you brought up seems to be an example of a skilful German-[influenced] manipulation (of the kind where they replaced "Germans" with "Nazis" in public discourse) in that that in its first paragraphs there is not one word of German origin of the name. However, there is assertion of some marginal people who apparently are the continuation of those ancient Wends (so the suggestion), this time in "Slovenia, Austria, Lusatia, Texas, and Australia". That they use two Slavic land - Slovenia and Lusatia (the original home of Wends!!!) - as lands of self-identyfing wends is especially SNEAKY, but also patently UNTRUE. I know for sure that Sorbs in Lusatia identify as Sorbs, not as Wends.
    Even the German state officially identify them now as "das sorbische Volk", not "Wends".

    https://www.bmi.bund.de/DE/themen/heimat-integration/minderheiten/minderheiten-in-deutschland/minderheiten-in-deutschland-node.html

    Instead of Slavs, a name which by its nature conveys the sense of unity among all Slavs, we get some "Wends" who are Slavic but maybe not really, and anyway seem prone to Germanization.... clear "divide et impera" move.


    I mentioned Czech Rep because apparently this ancient Celtic spread was more prevalent there than in Poland. That would explain why the bear is exactly there.
     
    Yes, you are right that Czechia used to be much more Celtic than Poland. And Wrocław from time to time belonged to Czechs (Crown of Bohemia) too.

    Replies: @LatW

    so the name could be produced only be outsiders, in this case, Germans, and it is known that Germans had clear ideas only about Slavic lands directly bordering their East Marchies.

    In that case, that’s what it is – the Westernmost Slavic tribes, problem solved.

    Saxon Eastern March in 965–1128 (you can see all the old Slavic names there):

    I know for sure that Sorbs in Lusatia identify as Sorbs, not as Wends.

    It is well known, of course, that they identify as Sorbs and are called that. I think the ones in Texas that call themselves “Wends” use a German name because they are more “old fashioned”, maybe derive their identity from the Middle Ages. They are some old Lutheran group. “Wendish” is upper Sorbian language.

    Their cultural center is in Bautzen and they say “Witaj” for “hi”, same es Poles and Ukrainians.

    Anyway, I think we should be grateful to these people, such as the poor Rani (Ruyan) people (in current Denmark).

    • Replies: @LatW
    @LatW

    Sorry, the map didn't post. You can see it under this wiki link:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saxon_Eastern_March

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  848. @LatW
    @Another Polish Perspective


    so the name could be produced only be outsiders, in this case, Germans, and it is known that Germans had clear ideas only about Slavic lands directly bordering their East Marchies.
     
    In that case, that's what it is - the Westernmost Slavic tribes, problem solved.

    Saxon Eastern March in 965–1128 (you can see all the old Slavic names there):

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saxon_Eastern_March#/media/File:Marchia_Wschodnia_ok._1000.svg

    I know for sure that Sorbs in Lusatia identify as Sorbs, not as Wends.
     
    It is well known, of course, that they identify as Sorbs and are called that. I think the ones in Texas that call themselves "Wends" use a German name because they are more "old fashioned", maybe derive their identity from the Middle Ages. They are some old Lutheran group. "Wendish" is upper Sorbian language.

    Their cultural center is in Bautzen and they say "Witaj" for "hi", same es Poles and Ukrainians.

    Anyway, I think we should be grateful to these people, such as the poor Rani (Ruyan) people (in current Denmark).

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pg5UeGtTrD8

    Replies: @LatW

    Sorry, the map didn’t post. You can see it under this wiki link:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saxon_Eastern_March

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    The Lusatian Sorbs are undergoing a kind of cultural revival of late. But they are only a thiny surviving group in a large Slav population that has been Germanized. Around 30% of current Eastern Germanic population is of haplogroup R1a. It was probably much higher in pre-war Prussia and Pomerania.

    But what is important is not so much the ancient Slav lands, it is the cultural and physical survival of the today's Slavs that is important. And just like the cultural and physical survival of other European ethnic groups is today far from certain, the survival of all Slavs (and Balts too) is far from guaranteed.

    Currently, the descendants of the Corded Ware people are probably the most numerous group in Europe or at least at near parity with the descendants of Bell Beaker folks. But by the end of this century, the situation could be very different.

    What do you think could be do done to ensure the survival of the native European ethnic groups ?

    Replies: @LatW

  849. @silviosilver
    @Ivashka the fool


    Especially that White Nationalists do not ask the right question first : how did we get there in the first place and why ?
     
    It's been asked and answered a thousand times. Competently answered, too. There are multiple reasons, though for any of them one can always ask "well why did that happen?" and then put the same question to whatever answer is given, like a child pestering his parents with an infinite series of "but why?" At some point, this has to be seen simply as an obstructionist tactic.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Okay, let’s not answer this question. We both know the answer (see my reply to Dmitry above).

    What are you and/or other White Nationalists gonna do about the root of the problem ?

    Is there anything that can reasonably be done that had not been tried already ?

    If there’s nothing to do about the main causal element, then the problem cannot reasonably be expected to be solved.

    Let’s ponder a little, if the problem of the separation and preservation of a more humane and civilized society is impossible, if we are going the way of the Latin Roman Empire around the end of the third century AD, then what should be the focus of the most perceptive of men ?

    (I know you are one of those, no irony here – your comments show that you are highly intelligent)

  850. @Ivashka the fool
    @Dmitry


    Soviet “Jews” going to Israel is not related to the holocaust
     
    Yes I agree, and I didn't write it was related to holocaust. I wrote that it was due to Perestroika (and of course fall of USSR).

    BBC has published an interesting article about Japan, where they say it’s a very happy charming country, people lived well there, but the society is aging and dying, population falls, without adequate immigration, property prices fall.
     
    Are you suggesting that those who benefit most from the mass immigration to the West are also the same who benefit the most from higher inflation?

    Careful where you thread Dmitry, because one of the reasons given for the increasing inflation this years is the war in Ukraine...

    https://cs14.pikabu.ru/post_img/big/2023/01/15/0/1673732523140415236.jpg

    All wars are banker wars ?

    All immigration is banker immigration ?

    Oy vey ! Oy gevalt...

    This might be seen as antisemitic... Be careful...

    Replies: @Dmitry

    I wrote that it was due to Perestroika (and of course fall of USSR).

    With Perestroika (I think 1990 is the year emigration was beginning to flood) there were opportunities for some Soviet citizens which had a grandparent with “Jew” and “German” nationality in their documents, to exit with open borders to Israel (for “Jews”) and Germany (for “Germans” and “Jews”), although no open borders for most nationalities unless they have advantage of education, money or family.

    Most of those emigrants would not know or care anything special for Israel or Germany. It’s like people going to Kazakhstan and Georgia today. It’s because they see an open door, not because of special love for Khachapuri.

    In the 2010s, (talking about before 2022) most ordinary young people would exit Russia if there were open borders with a developed country. But unless you have advantage of education, money and family, it’s not easy for ordinary people to exit to any developed country.

    Most of the world’s population dream to emigrate to developed countries, at least the younger people. If developed countries have open borders, and the undeveloped countries don’t close borders for exit, then young people will exit to the same developed countries.

    Most of the world doesn’t have a nice country, will not be born in one. So most of the world always will try to go to countries with civilized conditions. The main question is about whether the policy is to open/close border. Strength of motive for the peoples’ movement mostly just delta in the living conditions between the countries.

    From the global view, it would be more sustainable to expand the number of countries with civilized conditions. But as we discussed a lot, the conditions for a civilized country, are requiring sometimes centuries of development, installation of anglosaxon legal tradition etc.

    BBC has published an interesting article about Japan, where they say it’s a very happy charming country, people lived well there, but the society is aging and dying, population falls, without adequate immigration, property prices fall.

    to the West are also the same who benefit the most from higher inflation?

    I think pensions are more requiring constant immigration in the West than the mortgage industry

    What do you think about this article?
    https://wealthandpoverty.center/2021/09/12/demographic-collapse-2-ponzi-schemes.

    Although the property price could at least be constant. The pensions need more people like the Ponzi.

    Careful where you thread Dmitry, because one of the reasons given for the increasing inflation this years is the war in Ukraine…

    I don’t think the special military operation is a bank’s conspiracy. Banks are losing large part of their money this year especially investment. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-01-06/wall-street-ends-worst-investment-banking-year-since-2016

    But more self-interest of the rulers, can explain these events. After all, they thought they would win the war and have some victory parades by now.

    [MORE]

    *Perhaps even in the 1960s/1970s, millions of people would have exited if they have opportunity.

    But compared to today, there was more investment in public sphere and some things were less diverged.

    You know one of the more scary things found in the World Bank website, life expectancy in Ukraine was higher than Japan in the 1960s (nowadays lower than Brazil).

    But in the last 40 years, Bangladesh converged in this indicator even before the war. This is not Brazil, but Bangladesh.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Dmitry


    Most of the world’s population dream to emigrate to developed countries, at least the younger people. If developed countries have open borders, and the undeveloped countries don’t close borders for exit, then young people will exit to the same developed countries.

    Most of the world doesn’t have a nice country, will not be born in one. So most of the world always will try to go to countries with civilized conditions. The main question is about whether the policy is to open/close border. Strength of motive for the peoples’ movement mostly just delta in the living conditions between the countries
     

    Perhaps I wasn't clear enough when I wrote the reply to Silvio earlier today, but it is one of the aspects that I wanted to emphasize. People will always attempt to increase their level of well-being, even if at the expense of others.

    Regarding SMO, the main objective of this war is the final solution of the Eastern Slav problem. If it doesn’t culminate in an outright nuclear conflict, this war last for years and will end up with both Russian and Ukrainian populations reaching a demographic tipping point towards the dustbin of history.

    And yes, for some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome. They have strategic objectives for the decades (centuries) to come, and preventing the ressources of the Eurasian landmass from being wasted on the upkeep of imbecile aborigines, or falling in the wrong hands, might well be among these desirable outcomes.

    Why bombing Eastern Slavs into the stone age, when they are eager to bomb each-other themselves...

    Replies: @Yahya, @Dmitry

  851. @QCIC
    @Beckow

    Why would Russia's morale break? I think the longer this drags on the more serious it looks from a Russian perspective in the sense of more existential and less optional. It also gives Russian Rossiya messaging a chance to catch up.

    Replies: @Greasy William

    It does appear that Russian morale is holding up pretty well and Beckow makes a point that I hadsn’t considered.

    After seeing the behavior of the Poles and Germans over the last couple of days, the West, outside of the US, may indeed be too spiritually weak to do what is necessary to save Ukraine. And the Ukrainian state and society may not actually be capable of mobilizing anymore than they already have.

    So that leaves the US. As of now, the US has not provided Ukraine with enough material to regain any lost territory, let alone all of it. Will the US eventually do so? I don’t know. Right now it appears that the US only wants to send Ukraine what it needs to survive.

    We’ll have a better idea in the fall where things are headed.

  852. @LatW
    @LatW

    Sorry, the map didn't post. You can see it under this wiki link:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saxon_Eastern_March

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    The Lusatian Sorbs are undergoing a kind of cultural revival of late. But they are only a thiny surviving group in a large Slav population that has been Germanized. Around 30% of current Eastern Germanic population is of haplogroup R1a. It was probably much higher in pre-war Prussia and Pomerania.

    But what is important is not so much the ancient Slav lands, it is the cultural and physical survival of the today’s Slavs that is important. And just like the cultural and physical survival of other European ethnic groups is today far from certain, the survival of all Slavs (and Balts too) is far from guaranteed.

    Currently, the descendants of the Corded Ware people are probably the most numerous group in Europe or at least at near parity with the descendants of Bell Beaker folks. But by the end of this century, the situation could be very different.

    What do you think could be do done to ensure the survival of the native European ethnic groups ?

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Around 30% of current Eastern Germanic population is of haplogroup R1a. It was probably much higher in pre-war Prussia and Pomerania.
     
    Absolutely, I heard that Prussia was up to 30% Baltic (Germanized Balts) up until the end. I haven't found the exact percentage, but it would make sense that it is at least that. And according to Gimbutas, there are some signs that there may have been Balts in Pomerania. Likewise, those Slavs might have been still pretty densely living there in the 20th century. We lost a lot in the 20th century.

    Currently, the descendants of the Corded Ware people are probably the most numerous group in Europe or at least at near parity with the descendants of Bell Beaker folks. But by the end of this century, the situation could be very different.
     
    The numbers are quite large so I wouldn't panic but the trends are not that great. As to timing, we are already almost a quarter of century into this century so majority of those who are born now will most likely be living by the end of this century. But that's nit picking and doesn't solve the overall problem since the negative trend stays.

    What do you think could be do done to ensure the survival of the native European ethnic groups ?
     
    To be honest, I'm not sure I can add anything new or original to what has already been said here many times.

    It would depend on what approach the society would be ready to take - the soft approach or a more radical one. In the current situation, women desire slightly more children than they end up having so it would be a good start to at least allow those women who want to have a higher number of children, achieve that goal. It looks like what works is to have a well organized space that is not inside the city but not too far from the city - creating somewhat self-sufficient neighborhoods a short ride from the city would help. They should make it less of a burden for young couples to acquire those spaces. So the youth can enjoy some happiness, but also don't wait too long.

    Two things that young women fear a lot is the pain of childbirth and many also do not want to have children out of wedlock. There's not much to be done about the first one except prepare mentally (there is also epidural) but the second one can be manipulated somehow - either by encouraging relatively early marriage (maybe not as early as in the Soviet days but not that much later), or remove the stigma entirely on out of wedlock births (as long as they happen in stable LTRs) as they have done in Scandinavia. Although the problem there is not really stigma but how women feel inside (so more educated women may still not be ok with it). But if at least some of those fears could be addressed or alleviated, then it might help.

    Under the radical approach, assuming that positive economic incentives are in place, one would need to start with manipulating the sexual market. Take control over the younger female population (of course, not put them on house arrest, lol, but control them through guidance, many young women act according to their interests / instincts but many don't or are too naive and should be helped).

    This would require to significantly clamp down on pre-marital sex (or casual sex), close hook up sites, etc., take some of the women out of the job market for a while. Basically make women only available for long term relationships or marriage. It doesn't have to be full Sharia, just a few things. Not punish people for their mishaps (as is the case in Sharia), but simply not allow them to get away with it and not allow them too many choices. It could be a kind of an experiment and see how it works. Keep men employed, of course. Control alpha males, if possible.

    I have a few other ideas, but they might sound a bit too uncivilized so I may not share them right now. Better to focus on the family as a priority. Frankly, the first, more mellow approach, could already work, if done right.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  853. @Dmitry
    @Ivashka the fool


    I wrote that it was due to Perestroika (and of course fall of USSR).
     
    With Perestroika (I think 1990 is the year emigration was beginning to flood) there were opportunities for some Soviet citizens which had a grandparent with "Jew" and "German" nationality in their documents, to exit with open borders to Israel (for "Jews") and Germany (for "Germans" and "Jews"), although no open borders for most nationalities unless they have advantage of education, money or family.

    Most of those emigrants would not know or care anything special for Israel or Germany. It's like people going to Kazakhstan and Georgia today. It's because they see an open door, not because of special love for Khachapuri.

    In the 2010s, (talking about before 2022) most ordinary young people would exit Russia if there were open borders with a developed country. But unless you have advantage of education, money and family, it's not easy for ordinary people to exit to any developed country.

    Most of the world's population dream to emigrate to developed countries, at least the younger people. If developed countries have open borders, and the undeveloped countries don't close borders for exit, then young people will exit to the same developed countries.

    Most of the world doesn't have a nice country, will not be born in one. So most of the world always will try to go to countries with civilized conditions. The main question is about whether the policy is to open/close border. Strength of motive for the peoples' movement mostly just delta in the living conditions between the countries.

    -

    From the global view, it would be more sustainable to expand the number of countries with civilized conditions. But as we discussed a lot, the conditions for a civilized country, are requiring sometimes centuries of development, installation of anglosaxon legal tradition etc.



    BBC has published an interesting article about Japan, where they say it’s a very happy charming country, people lived well there, but the society is aging and dying, population falls, without adequate immigration, property prices fall.
     
    to the West are also the same who benefit the most from higher inflation?

     

    I think pensions are more requiring constant immigration in the West than the mortgage industry

    What do you think about this article?
    https://wealthandpoverty.center/2021/09/12/demographic-collapse-2-ponzi-schemes.

    Although the property price could at least be constant. The pensions need more people like the Ponzi.

    Careful where you thread Dmitry, because one of the reasons given for the increasing inflation this years is the war in Ukraine…
     

    I don't think the special military operation is a bank's conspiracy. Banks are losing large part of their money this year especially investment. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-01-06/wall-street-ends-worst-investment-banking-year-since-2016

    But more self-interest of the rulers, can explain these events. After all, they thought they would win the war and have some victory parades by now.



    -

    *Perhaps even in the 1960s/1970s, millions of people would have exited if they have opportunity.

    But compared to today, there was more investment in public sphere and some things were less diverged.

    You know one of the more scary things found in the World Bank website, life expectancy in Ukraine was higher than Japan in the 1960s (nowadays lower than Brazil).
    https://i.imgur.com/yshRxmx.jpg

    But in the last 40 years, Bangladesh converged in this indicator even before the war. This is not Brazil, but Bangladesh.

    https://i.imgur.com/UB3ATeR.jpg

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Most of the world’s population dream to emigrate to developed countries, at least the younger people. If developed countries have open borders, and the undeveloped countries don’t close borders for exit, then young people will exit to the same developed countries.

    Most of the world doesn’t have a nice country, will not be born in one. So most of the world always will try to go to countries with civilized conditions. The main question is about whether the policy is to open/close border. Strength of motive for the peoples’ movement mostly just delta in the living conditions between the countries

    Perhaps I wasn’t clear enough when I wrote the reply to Silvio earlier today, but it is one of the aspects that I wanted to emphasize. People will always attempt to increase their level of well-being, even if at the expense of others.

    Regarding SMO, the main objective of this war is the final solution of the Eastern Slav problem. If it doesn’t culminate in an outright nuclear conflict, this war last for years and will end up with both Russian and Ukrainian populations reaching a demographic tipping point towards the dustbin of history.

    And yes, for some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome. They have strategic objectives for the decades (centuries) to come, and preventing the ressources of the Eurasian landmass from being wasted on the upkeep of imbecile aborigines, or falling in the wrong hands, might well be among these desirable outcomes.

    Why bombing Eastern Slavs into the stone age, when they are eager to bomb each-other themselves…

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    Regarding SMO, the main objective of this war is the final solution of the Eastern Slav problem. And yes, for some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome.
     
    Can you point to specific financial elites who wish to genocide Eastern Slavs? And perhaps provide concrete evidence of their intentions?

    I don’t agree with your take. My working theory is that the main cause of Western demographic displacement is the “virtue-signaling liberal” segment of society. They constitute perhaps 20-25% of the Western population; but are disproportionately well-educated and located near centers of power. Jews are naturally over-represented; but are by no means the sole actors. Nor are they originators of the anti-racist/pro-migration meme. They merely provide intellectual firepower to existing currents of thought in Western society. Simply put; these virtue-signaling liberals have convinced themselves; and practically everyone else; that racism is the highest evil and openness to foreigners the highest good. Therefore; advocating for migration is virtuos; and against migration is racist. A banal theory, perhaps simplistic, but one that I feel gets close to reality.

    The causes of the Russia-Ukraine conflict are mani-fold and complex. I think Martin Van Crevald wrote a perceptive article on the topic: https://www.martin-van-creveld.com/what-putin-wants/ But one should always know that these things remain hidden from plain sight.

    And Allah knows what they hide, and what they reveal.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Coconuts, @Ivashka the fool

    , @Dmitry
    @Ivashka the fool


    some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome
     
    One of the main activity of the last twenty years was petrodollar recycling to the West. Extracting resources, exchanging for money, which is then moved to the West, while only a very small proportion of the profits are re-invested in Russia.

    And even with ordinary people, all the IKEA and H&M was enjoying the Russian market, as they sell for higher prices than in the West. This was accelerating even after "our Crimea".

    For example, richest man in the world is Bernard Arnault. He owns Louis Vuitton, Moët etc. Of course, postsoviet elites are will be in somewhere near top 2 largest customers in the world for those brands, even if they buy in Milan.*

    So, the previous "equilibrium" of Putin, has been extremely profitable for Western business. This was Moscow was using rhetorical from Cold War time for the domestic consumption, while moving the country's money to the supposed enemy.

    "Special military operation" was removing Russia from this system, so I don't see it will be great from the situation of the Western business zone.

    The main profits of lawyers in London for some years, were the legal arguments between businessmen in Russia.

    Of course, in the military view, now the West is "slow cooking the frog", where they slowly give weapons for Kiev so the frog doesn't jump out of the hot water too early.

    When the West is bored from this, they will eventually cook the frog. But this new situation not going to generate as much profits as the previous "equilibrium" where Russia was moving the petrodollars to the West.


    both Russian and Ukrainian populations reaching a demographic tipping point towards the dustbin of history
     
    It's very bad for Ukraine, I'm not sure it will have such negative effect in Russia for demographics.

    Population of Russian Federation will be going to 120 million in the next decades whether or not war. But it's not so easy to emigrate nowadays, even more difficult than one year ago.

    It's more the soul of the postsoviet space is broken and in 10 years, I doubt we will be saying it has recovered. Maybe Ukraine will develop something from this in terms of the nation building, but they will be in Europe then.


    -


    -
    *In some old humor.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqLfL9bP5EA

  854. @Ivashka the fool
    @Dmitry


    Most of the world’s population dream to emigrate to developed countries, at least the younger people. If developed countries have open borders, and the undeveloped countries don’t close borders for exit, then young people will exit to the same developed countries.

    Most of the world doesn’t have a nice country, will not be born in one. So most of the world always will try to go to countries with civilized conditions. The main question is about whether the policy is to open/close border. Strength of motive for the peoples’ movement mostly just delta in the living conditions between the countries
     

    Perhaps I wasn't clear enough when I wrote the reply to Silvio earlier today, but it is one of the aspects that I wanted to emphasize. People will always attempt to increase their level of well-being, even if at the expense of others.

    Regarding SMO, the main objective of this war is the final solution of the Eastern Slav problem. If it doesn’t culminate in an outright nuclear conflict, this war last for years and will end up with both Russian and Ukrainian populations reaching a demographic tipping point towards the dustbin of history.

    And yes, for some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome. They have strategic objectives for the decades (centuries) to come, and preventing the ressources of the Eurasian landmass from being wasted on the upkeep of imbecile aborigines, or falling in the wrong hands, might well be among these desirable outcomes.

    Why bombing Eastern Slavs into the stone age, when they are eager to bomb each-other themselves...

    Replies: @Yahya, @Dmitry

    Regarding SMO, the main objective of this war is the final solution of the Eastern Slav problem. And yes, for some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome.

    Can you point to specific financial elites who wish to genocide Eastern Slavs? And perhaps provide concrete evidence of their intentions?

    I don’t agree with your take. My working theory is that the main cause of Western demographic displacement is the “virtue-signaling liberal” segment of society. They constitute perhaps 20-25% of the Western population; but are disproportionately well-educated and located near centers of power. Jews are naturally over-represented; but are by no means the sole actors. Nor are they originators of the anti-racist/pro-migration meme. They merely provide intellectual firepower to existing currents of thought in Western society. Simply put; these virtue-signaling liberals have convinced themselves; and practically everyone else; that racism is the highest evil and openness to foreigners the highest good. Therefore; advocating for migration is virtuos; and against migration is racist. A banal theory, perhaps simplistic, but one that I feel gets close to reality.

    The causes of the Russia-Ukraine conflict are mani-fold and complex. I think Martin Van Crevald wrote a perceptive article on the topic: https://www.martin-van-creveld.com/what-putin-wants/ But one should always know that these things remain hidden from plain sight.

    And Allah knows what they hide, and what they reveal.

    • Replies: @Greasy William
    @Yahya


    Simply put; these virtue-signaling liberals have convinced themselves; and practically everyone else; that racism is the highest evil and openness to foreigners the highest good.
     
    Do you know any of these people personally?

    They were ready to have Kyrie Irving lynched for daring to question the vaccine. They love objectively racist people like Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden. They are unwilling to share any of their wealth or power with non whites and they REALLY aren't willing to allow non white children into their schools. They are certainly unwilling to intermarry with any non whites who aren't fully deracinated. A huge part of their emotional attachment to Ukraine is because the Ukrainians are white.

    My entire family are white liberals and I can honestly say that these people really don't like non whites that much. They might like them in the abstract but it is more a performative/religious thing for them then something that is a meaningful part of their daily life.

    You don't have to take my word for it, just bash white liberals or advocate a policy that will harm white liberals and watch them chimp out. It's not about race, it's about tribe.
    , @Coconuts
    @Yahya


    They constitute perhaps 20-25% of the Western population; but are disproportionately well-educated and located near centers of power.
     
    These sound a lot like the 'Anywhere' group identified in British politics by David Goodhart, his idea was that they tend to define themselves by educational and career achievement much more than by local, often inherited identities (these are the 'Somewheres'). I thought his analysis was pretty accurate when he first presented it in his book about Brexit, that was around 2017/18. The Woke phenomena seems to be confirming and deepening a lot of what he wrote then.

    Jews are naturally over-represented; but are by no means the sole actors. Nor are they originators of the anti-racist/pro-migration meme.
     
    Tend to agree as well. If you were in university in a Western country and studying the humanities the intellectual influence of French/North African Jews would be hard to avoid. But these were often quite strange people generally (e.g. homosexual, interested in boys).

    Simply put; these virtue-signaling liberals have convinced themselves; and practically everyone else; that racism is the highest evil and openness to foreigners the highest good. Therefore; advocating for migration is virtuos; and against migration is racist.
     
    I think Paul Gottfried was onto something with his idea that Anti-Fascist internationalism has become the guiding ideology among the Western Anywhere group. Nowadays it is easier to get hold of the texts of far-right authors from continental Europe than it used to be, even a decade ago. Some of the major French ones were rarely reprinted after 1945 and you would have to go out of the way to find them, even university courses dealing with the period wouldn't really point you in the direction of reading them. When you do, it fills in some gaps in understanding Inter-war culture and politics, but also I think you can see what later authors on the post-war left were reacting and responding to; what they thought they had to deconstruct.

    The original motivations behind this must have been idealistic, there was an optimism about the potential of rejuvenated humanism and Marxism to liberate the world and the overriding thing about avoiding another major European war.

    Just now the generation that experienced the war first hand have nearly all died and the living memory of the last war is fading, the 'Boomer Truth Regime' looks like it is starting to drift into the territory of fulfilling various of the predictions made by the 'damned masters' of the pre-WW2 far-right.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    , @Ivashka the fool
    @Yahya


    Can you point to specific financial elites who wish to genocide Eastern Slavs? And perhaps provide concrete evidence of their intentions?
     
    That's a no go zone.
    I would not post anything about it.
    I prefer being the Y haplogroup worshipping fool that I am, instead of digging into the realm of the deeper levels of transnational financial structure.
    Questions one shouldn't ask, things one would better not know.
    Notice how Sylvio stopped short of discussing the economic motives behind the mass immigration?
    That's the wise man's attitude...

    🙂



    An old Jewish man that I've known while young, and who have been through 10 years of Soviet camps for telling anti-Stalin jokes on a train, once told me that to live a happy life one shouldn't read either Marx or Freud.
    I would add a dozen other authors to the list, Anthony C. Sutton being one of these, and would strongly advise about never looking too closely at the history of the BIS. But if one is young, strong willed, interested about how things really work and has too much time on one's hands after relinquishing the foreign movies' watching and Arab music analyzing, then one might start by reading Sutton, learning about the BIS, analyzing the Gvishiani and Club of Rome love affair, looking into who was it that promoted Herr Shwab to his perching 50 years ago, and then going into analyzing the cross holding of shares into the major Funds and TNCs. Then one would discover what Trevor Moore and his buddies alluded to in their hilarious "Kitten History" video in which they talk about "6 global companies own(ing) everything". Trevor Moore died an untimely death after making too many jokes about very serious matters. He fell from his 2nd floor balcony right on his neck, he was alone at home when it happened.

    🙂
  855. @AaronB
    @LatW

    So when I said the social game, I meant the quest for status and rank, respect and honor - which consumes such an incredible amount of our lives - the need to be seen as respectable, and the social conformity and conventional behavior that this engenders.

    With regard to marriage and children, there is indeed a "social dimension" to this, insofar as many people marry to socially conform and become respectable, and that I would include in the "social game", but there is also an aspect to marriage and children that isn't necessarily a part of that but more about intrinsic satisfaction to those who derive it from that.

    I'm not at all promoting MGTOW - that is a resentment-based rejection of women that has nothing to do with spirituality. I like women, don't think they're heartless monsters lol out to ruin me, and I think that marriage and kids can be, if done for the right reasons and not out of a sense of social duty, very satisfying and healthy.

    However, I'd say that all the great spiritual traditions recognize that there are higher pursuits than marriage and children, so any system which places that at the summit, is limited in my view - and marriage as social duty and convention, often leads to misery.

    In fact, I'm very opposed to the right-wing promotion of marriage as duty and a dismal chore one must undertake in service to the community - I think that gloomy view has led to the decline of marriage, and I wrote here in the past about how I think to make marriage and children popular again - a right wing preoccupation - we should emphasize it's fun and joyous aspects, and as something one might spontaneously do for sheer joy (I think hiking with kids is one of the funnest things I've ever done).


    Yes, I liked it very much as well, it is similar to my ancestral religion. I should probably delve into it a bit more.
     
    Oh yeah, I'm a huge fan of Japanese culture. I think we can learn so much from them, and I read a lot of the Japanese classics. Japan is a fascinating fusion of pagan, animist, and Buddhist elements.

    In truth, even though I talk about the "higher" religions like Christianity and Buddhism primarily, I think paganism (especially "high" paganism) and animism are indispensable perspectives and have actually been subsumed into the higher religions and fertilized them extensively to the point where we no longer notice it, but couldn't do without it.

    Christianity without the pagan and animist elements which it adopted would be an entirely different, and impoverished beast, and so would Buddhism. We need legends and myths and fantasy and the sense that the world is alive. And what would Christianity be without Platonism!

    David Bentley Hart makes the interesting point that modern nihilism is so deep and intractable precisely because Christianity assumed into itself all the animism and paganism of the past and when it got discredited (through it's alliance with power), we didn't even have the "default" human spirituality of animism and paganism to fall back on. The whole package got discredited.

    In a way, things like Christianity and Buddhism are just the capstones on a rich substrate of pagan and animist sensibility. They complete it, and are indispensable in their own right, but depend on it too.

    It wasn’t just individualistic mediation, but contemplation was, of course, a big part of it.

     

    So that Baltic priest is engaging in a very legitimate form of spirituality, and very poetic too.

    However, the "concrete, tangible" social utility of what he's doing is not the only way the contemplative life assists humanity, it's just that as modern life progressed we insisted more abd more on tangible, material help as we lost sight of the intangible realm - and I submit this was a step towards nihilism, which is ultimately disbelief in the intangible.

    A holy man completely alone in his cave, having no contact with anyone, helps all mankind through the intangible realm - one, by becoming one with the Infinite he brings the Infinite down to earth and generates positive energy in the universe, and two, by example and hearsay, he reaches people psychologically and gives inspiration and comfort that at least some humans are realizing what God made us for, not social trivia.

    Traditionally, this intangible help was considered immensely more beneficial than anything tangible, because before the advent of nihilism the realm of spirit was seen as more important than the material realm (which was something of an illusion).

    As I said, modern nihilism can be said to be a loss of belief in the intangible, the realm of spirit, and an insistence on the material.

    Of course, advice and counsel have always had their place - after all, the Desert Father's left behind them a magnificent record of sayings well worth reading!

    think it depends on the person. When you give, it’s important to see that it’s not wasted. Because if you start giving out free things, too many may show up for it and it will create a moral hazard. I’m not saying this because I’m stingy, no. Not at all. It’s simply because I don’t like a situation where one part of able bodied society works (including mothers) and another doesn’t.

     

    Fair enough, but this is a "prudential" calculation that is not the calculation of God, certainly not in Christianity - we are told to give freely and without stint or calculation, not according to the wisdom of this world.

    Spiritual logic is different than worldly logic, and obeys different laws. Giving prudentially reinforces a certain logic of self-interest, but giving freely reinforces a morality of pure generosity - this may create an atmosphere conducive to moral reform, ad it is based on pure love, and ultimately it may be the calculated form of giving that creates long term moral hazard.

    That is what is so "startlingly" novel about Christianity - at least one of the things. It looked more deeply into the true sources of our problems than what is apparent on the surface.

    One may disagree with this, but it's good that we at least have this radical alternative perspective in view, which is why I was so opposed to AP rendering Christianity gutless and eviscerating it of all it's radical novelty.

    As to the change in the economic relationships that you propose in the post above – those are very substantial changes that would resemble European revolutions. It would require either a revolutionary type of awakening within the populace (and it wouldn’t be unanimous) or an armed revolution
     
    .

    Indeed, it would require nothing less than a drastic moral revolution - one that Christianity began long ago, and will culminate in the future, with God's light breaking into the world and setting everything alight.

    In the meantime, we can take what small steps we can.

    However, what you propose might only make things worse. To give free housing and to relieve men of any duties whatsoever is a very, very slippery slope. Sometimes it leads to social collapse, the way it did after the fall of the USSR. Then the weak suffer and it’s not right.
     
    I understand that this is the standard view, and is a big reason that such measures haven't been taken despite the means to doing so existing fir quite some time.

    However, as human beings we are all born with the right to free housing and enough land that's needed for our food - think of a hunter gatherer boring into a forest, he has "free" housing and food. By what right do the oligarchs monopolize all land and force us into a system of their devising?

    Is returning our birthright to us a moral hazard, or does forcing us into an artificial state of struggle for what is our by birth making us vicious?

    Also, you may want to consider that some people view work as a value of its own. Work is something that structures one’s life (of course, so does meditation & prayer), work is valuable not only in the results that it brings, or as a service to others, work can be viewed as something that promotes the Greek technē – a means to promote the development of the human being.

     

    Sure, I'd agree with this. But is this the kind of work that is done in a modern economy? There are forms of craftsmanship - techne, as you say - that are indeed a beautiful extension of our humanity, and a blacksmith, a basket weaver, a leather worker, a carver of statues from wood or stone, a hunter, may well be developing his humanity and even attaining union with the Infinite through his work.

    But of course, since the Industrial Revolution, this has not been most of our work. Factory work, office work, is a different beast.

    Even so, let us remember that the Greeks prized leisure and contemplation above all, and thought that too much time spent at a craft would distort one physically and spiritually.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @LatW

    So when I said the social game, I meant the quest for status and rank, respect and honor – which consumes such an incredible amount of our lives – the need to be seen as respectable, and the social conformity and conventional behavior that this engenders.

    You might be overestimating people’s need for this – this does exist but it’s not unavoidable. There are a lot of people who just float through life and care little about “status” or “rank”. The fact that you stress this so much could mean that, via projection, you care more about these things than you let on. Or maybe you are rebelling against your family who may have pressured you in the past. I’m just guessing (and I apologize if I’m wrong).

    [MORE]

    but there is also an aspect to marriage and children that isn’t necessarily a part of that but more about intrinsic satisfaction to those who derive it from that.

    So you don’t think real love exists, just satisfaction?

    A holy man completely alone in his cave, having no contact with anyone, helps all mankind through the intangible realm – one, by becoming one with the Infinite he brings the Infinite down to earth and generates positive energy in the universe, and two, by example and hearsay, he reaches people psychologically and gives inspiration and comfort that at least some humans are realizing what God made us for, not social trivia.

    I don’t disagree with this. This has been the case in most traditional cultures. It’s just a question as to who is to be deemed a “holy man”.

    As I said, modern nihilism can be said to be a loss of belief in the intangible, the realm of spirit, and an insistence on the material.

    It seems you are attributing this to wider society today, and to some extent one can agree that there is indeed some nihilism in modern life, however, “belief in the intangible” is largely a subjective experience, thus I’m not sure that you can speak for everyone – you do not have access to other people’s souls and cannot tell how they experience the divine or even spiritual life.

    we are told to give freely and without stint or calculation, not according to the wisdom of this world

    We should be led by rationality, so as to not create more harm or unintended consequences. That someone, at one point, gives “prudentially”, as you say, doesn’t mean that, at another time, they do not give “freely”. Many give freely, for example, to children, even children that are not their own. Mothers give freely to their children, even though there is also the maternal instinct. Friends give advice and free work to friends all the time.

    Of course, you can argue that giving freely also brings gratification and that in this regard it can be viewed as “selfish” but then such arguments become almost absurd. I understand what you mean. Safest is to give out of love.

    However, as human beings we are all born with the right to free housing and enough land that’s needed for our food

    Maybe, remember also that there are different kinds of housing.
    Would it be possible to maintain private ownership (up to a certain wealth level, rather high, but not such that allows to buy up too much the way it is now) but eradicate the oligarchy?

    think of a hunter gatherer boring into a forest, he has “free” housing and food.

    Only the gatherer has food that is somewhat free (but even gathering can be hard work at times that requires time and patience). The hunter has to hunt the food, this is quite hard (I’m not sure you realize how fast and sometimes even dangerous animals are). So this is all work. But, yea, in a sense, it is free. Surely, there is much to be harvested in the woods, feel free. Isn’t most of it available?

    Is returning our birthright to us a moral hazard, or does forcing us into an artificial state of struggle for what is our by birth making us vicious?

    I think it’s a question of balance. Certainly, what is happening with the wealth inequality now is not entirely healthy or right.

    techne, as you say – that are indeed a beautiful extension of our humanity, and a blacksmith, a basket weaver, a leather worker, a carver of statues from wood or stone, a hunter, may well be developing his humanity and even attaining union with the Infinite through his work.

    I would go even further than skilled trades, although some skilled trades are quite beautiful and even pleasant to perform. With good equipment, factory work can be quite satisfying as well. But I view the concept of technē even broader and would extend it to occupations such as conductor or musician, designer, architect, one can learn a lot from business, not to mention all the humanities professions that can be quite gratifying.

    But of course, since the Industrial Revolution, this has not been most of our work. Factory work, office work, is a different beast.

    It depends, a lot of people enjoy their careers and pursuits, or they enjoy it some days and not on other days. Also, people bounce all the time – millennials stay at one job on average for 2 years these days. You’re being a bit too categorical. But you do have a point that a person should be able to bail, if it becomes “soul crushing”, as you say. And search for something that is less so.

    Which many have done, btw. Apparently, male employment is the lowest it’s ever been in America.

    let us remember that the Greeks prized leisure and contemplation above all

    Well, which Greeks, there are several schools. Contemplation for Greeks was actually not leisure but training of the soul. The Greeks prized arete above all – pursuit of excellence or full potential. It is connected to the virtues that are listed in Aristotle’s Nicomachean Ethics. Somehow I do not recall that this book specifically praised “leisure” as a virtue in itself.

  856. Sher Singh says:
    @Ivashka the fool
    @AP

    Yes it looks highly interesting although perhaps stretched a bit when it comes to Lao Tzu. The rest is more or less how I see it. Especially the sentence below:


    Mr. Beckwith contends, however, that the Medes and Persians were actually “creolized” Scythians.
     
    Absolutely correct.

    And after the fall of the different Scythian confederations, the Sarmatians, the Xiongnu, the Kushans, the Hephtalite, the Turks and finally the Mongols - all used the social system, the nomadic tool kit and even to some degree the religious patterns that have been created by the Indo-Iranian tribes that the Greek named using the exonyme Scythians.

    Basically, people originating in Sintashta-Arkaim/Andronovo culture have dominated the main part of Eurasian plain for nearly 2000 years.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b8/Indo-Iranian_origins.png/290px-Indo-Iranian_origins.png

    Most researchers associate the Andronovo horizon with early Indo-Iranian languages, though it may have overlapped the early Uralic-speaking area at its northern fringe.[8] Allentoft et al. (2015) concluded from their genetic studies that the Andronovo culture and the preceding Sintashta culture should be partially derived from the Corded Ware culture, given the higher proportion of ancestry matching the earlier farmers of Europe, similar to the admixture found in the genomes of the Corded Ware population.[9]
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andronovo_culture



    An anecdote; when I first read the Suzuki translation of the Lankavatara Sutra, one of the final paragraphs presented the scribe that transcribed it as belonging to the "tribe of Soma", which Suzuki translated as "the Moon tribe". I had a chuckle, because Soma was the famous entheogen used by the Vedic Aryans and named Haoma (or Hauma) by the Avestan Aryans. It was indeed considered as being "moon-like" when mixed into water (probably through some opalescent whitish colloidal effect).

    So about Scythians, the best at producing Soma / Haoma were the Saka haumavarga. Saka for Scythians (as well as Shakya in the Buddha's clan name) and I am pretty sure that you can understand the meaning if varga (варка) from your knowledge of the Slav languages. So basically, the scribe who wrote the Lankavatara Sutra translated by Suzuki might well have been a Scythian "drug dealer" from modern day Central Asia.

    https://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/haumavarga

    Therefore I have not been in the least surprised when I one day saw this image:

    https://i.natgeofe.com/n/22e9031b-68d7-4169-83e3-49c860122f9f/59670.jpg

    (I wonder what this "Scythian Bodhisattva" carried in his stash bag...)

    🙂

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @sudden death

    An anecdote; when I first read the Suzuki translation of the Lankavatara Sutra, one of the final paragraphs presented the scribe that transcribed it as belonging to the “tribe of Soma”, which Suzuki translated as “the Moon tribe”.

    Soma is another name for the moon & Soma-Vansh another name for Lunar Dynasty.
    You eat beef why are you even discussing this?

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Sher Singh

    I was writing about Vedic Aryans and Avestan Aryans. Soma moon goddess is post-Vedic and has nothing to do with Saka people anyway. Please tell me more about Kushans and Spenta Huna conquests of northern India.

  857. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    Regarding SMO, the main objective of this war is the final solution of the Eastern Slav problem. And yes, for some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome.
     
    Can you point to specific financial elites who wish to genocide Eastern Slavs? And perhaps provide concrete evidence of their intentions?

    I don’t agree with your take. My working theory is that the main cause of Western demographic displacement is the “virtue-signaling liberal” segment of society. They constitute perhaps 20-25% of the Western population; but are disproportionately well-educated and located near centers of power. Jews are naturally over-represented; but are by no means the sole actors. Nor are they originators of the anti-racist/pro-migration meme. They merely provide intellectual firepower to existing currents of thought in Western society. Simply put; these virtue-signaling liberals have convinced themselves; and practically everyone else; that racism is the highest evil and openness to foreigners the highest good. Therefore; advocating for migration is virtuos; and against migration is racist. A banal theory, perhaps simplistic, but one that I feel gets close to reality.

    The causes of the Russia-Ukraine conflict are mani-fold and complex. I think Martin Van Crevald wrote a perceptive article on the topic: https://www.martin-van-creveld.com/what-putin-wants/ But one should always know that these things remain hidden from plain sight.

    And Allah knows what they hide, and what they reveal.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Coconuts, @Ivashka the fool

    Simply put; these virtue-signaling liberals have convinced themselves; and practically everyone else; that racism is the highest evil and openness to foreigners the highest good.

    Do you know any of these people personally?

    They were ready to have Kyrie Irving lynched for daring to question the vaccine. They love objectively racist people like Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden. They are unwilling to share any of their wealth or power with non whites and they REALLY aren’t willing to allow non white children into their schools. They are certainly unwilling to intermarry with any non whites who aren’t fully deracinated. A huge part of their emotional attachment to Ukraine is because the Ukrainians are white.

    My entire family are white liberals and I can honestly say that these people really don’t like non whites that much. They might like them in the abstract but it is more a performative/religious thing for them then something that is a meaningful part of their daily life.

    You don’t have to take my word for it, just bash white liberals or advocate a policy that will harm white liberals and watch them chimp out. It’s not about race, it’s about tribe.

    • Agree: Sher Singh, Ivashka the fool
  858. @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    The Lusatian Sorbs are undergoing a kind of cultural revival of late. But they are only a thiny surviving group in a large Slav population that has been Germanized. Around 30% of current Eastern Germanic population is of haplogroup R1a. It was probably much higher in pre-war Prussia and Pomerania.

    But what is important is not so much the ancient Slav lands, it is the cultural and physical survival of the today's Slavs that is important. And just like the cultural and physical survival of other European ethnic groups is today far from certain, the survival of all Slavs (and Balts too) is far from guaranteed.

    Currently, the descendants of the Corded Ware people are probably the most numerous group in Europe or at least at near parity with the descendants of Bell Beaker folks. But by the end of this century, the situation could be very different.

    What do you think could be do done to ensure the survival of the native European ethnic groups ?

    Replies: @LatW

    Around 30% of current Eastern Germanic population is of haplogroup R1a. It was probably much higher in pre-war Prussia and Pomerania.

    Absolutely, I heard that Prussia was up to 30% Baltic (Germanized Balts) up until the end. I haven’t found the exact percentage, but it would make sense that it is at least that. And according to Gimbutas, there are some signs that there may have been Balts in Pomerania. Likewise, those Slavs might have been still pretty densely living there in the 20th century. We lost a lot in the 20th century.

    Currently, the descendants of the Corded Ware people are probably the most numerous group in Europe or at least at near parity with the descendants of Bell Beaker folks. But by the end of this century, the situation could be very different.

    The numbers are quite large so I wouldn’t panic but the trends are not that great. As to timing, we are already almost a quarter of century into this century so majority of those who are born now will most likely be living by the end of this century. But that’s nit picking and doesn’t solve the overall problem since the negative trend stays.

    [MORE]

    What do you think could be do done to ensure the survival of the native European ethnic groups ?

    To be honest, I’m not sure I can add anything new or original to what has already been said here many times.

    It would depend on what approach the society would be ready to take – the soft approach or a more radical one. In the current situation, women desire slightly more children than they end up having so it would be a good start to at least allow those women who want to have a higher number of children, achieve that goal. It looks like what works is to have a well organized space that is not inside the city but not too far from the city – creating somewhat self-sufficient neighborhoods a short ride from the city would help. They should make it less of a burden for young couples to acquire those spaces. So the youth can enjoy some happiness, but also don’t wait too long.

    Two things that young women fear a lot is the pain of childbirth and many also do not want to have children out of wedlock. There’s not much to be done about the first one except prepare mentally (there is also epidural) but the second one can be manipulated somehow – either by encouraging relatively early marriage (maybe not as early as in the Soviet days but not that much later), or remove the stigma entirely on out of wedlock births (as long as they happen in stable LTRs) as they have done in Scandinavia. Although the problem there is not really stigma but how women feel inside (so more educated women may still not be ok with it). But if at least some of those fears could be addressed or alleviated, then it might help.

    Under the radical approach, assuming that positive economic incentives are in place, one would need to start with manipulating the sexual market. Take control over the younger female population (of course, not put them on house arrest, lol, but control them through guidance, many young women act according to their interests / instincts but many don’t or are too naive and should be helped).

    This would require to significantly clamp down on pre-marital sex (or casual sex), close hook up sites, etc., take some of the women out of the job market for a while. Basically make women only available for long term relationships or marriage. It doesn’t have to be full Sharia, just a few things. Not punish people for their mishaps (as is the case in Sharia), but simply not allow them to get away with it and not allow them too many choices. It could be a kind of an experiment and see how it works. Keep men employed, of course. Control alpha males, if possible.

    I have a few other ideas, but they might sound a bit too uncivilized so I may not share them right now. Better to focus on the family as a priority. Frankly, the first, more mellow approach, could already work, if done right.

    • Thanks: Ivashka the fool
    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    Problem is, most young people live online as much or even more than they do IRL. The trends they follow are often shaped on line. It will be difficult to control teh internets. Imagine the stink, the cries and the gnashing of teeth if and when someone cuts off Twitch and Discord, not to mention other obvious sites...

    Replies: @LatW

  859. @Yahya
    @Dmitry


    Netanyahu is not so bad like Kaczynski. He reforms the country and has plenty positive attainments.
     
    I've tried to read up on Kaczynski; but to my chagrin could not find objective and reliable English-language sources. He's been described as "xenophobic", "nationalist" and "authoritarian"; neither of which are bad things in my book. I don't want to opine on Polish internal politics too much; but probably if I were a Pole i'd vote for the nationalist parties which seek to maintain Poland For Poles and resist the migration waves heading into Europe. The (semi-)irreversible nature of immigration policies would make it a number one priority; everything else negotiable.

    You seem to consider democracy as being the Chief Good in politics, to borrow an Aristotelian term; so in your opinion Kaczynski is bad because of the backsliding. But for me the results matter more than the system. The system is only important insofar as it can deliver the results. Many of the greatest world historical leaders were authoritarians; Lee Kuan Yew, Otto von Bismarck, Cardinal Richelieu, Piotr Stolypin, Fouad Chehab etc. On the other hand, many of the worst leaders have also been authoritarians. It's a mixed-bag. But being an authoritarian doesn't necessarily preclude competence or effectiveness. In fact, authoritarians may be more intelligent on average than democratic leaders. Kaczynski will have to be judged on his track record; both in the present and the long-term future.

    But i'd like to hear APP's perspective on Polish politics.

    Dmitry, what is your judgement on Israeli and Russian historical leaders?

    Replies: @Dmitry, @Another Polish Perspective

    Russian historical leaders

    It’s only Yeltsin/Putin since independence. It should be Yeltsin-Putin, as the same cartel, just with some changes of boss, underboss, consiglieres etc.

    From the non-clickable options shown, the most sensible was Prokhorov in 2012. But non-clickable.

    , what is your judgement on Israeli an

    In economics, it is possible Lapid was a responsible manager. They reduced debt:GDP ratio more than 10% in a single year. This speed of fall in debt:GDP ratio is very fast.
    https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-israels-debt-gdp-ratio-shrank-dramatically-in-2022-1001435908

    But some things was becoming worse. https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-car-thefts-in-israel-double-1001434711 I guess the Israel-Palestinian conflict was less violent in 2022 at least, than 2021.

    )irreversible nature of immigration

    Poland’s government don’t control so much of their immigration policy. EU controls most of it. They have open-borders with the EU bloc. But it’s a less relevant for them as few immigrants who have access to the Schengen Area, will stay in Poland.

    This is why a lot of this is political trading between EU countries. There is a system where they all outsource their immigration policy to the EU and the countries which receive most of the immigration will be the wealthy Western European countries. Small numbers of immigrants would choose to stay in Poland when they can go to Germany.

    For their own immigration policy, Poland give more visas to non-EU citizens (mostly temporary working visas for Ukrainians, Belarusians and Turks), than all other EU countries combined.

    Kaczynski is bad because of the backsliding

    If they have some compensatory results for backsliding.

    For example, Lee Kuan Yew has success with the housing policy in Singapore (probably including the forced “melting pot”). He was able to continue the English legal tradition there. His authoritarian policy was probably negative, but there are many positive things.

    Kaczynski. Poland’s situation improves, receiving first world infrastructure, but in terms of etiology, this was funded by the EU. EU gave over hundred billion of dollars to invest in Poland.

    To some extent, Kaczynski’s party’s rhetoric threatens this funding in future. If you make these anti-German campaigns in the media, to be popular with older low income base, but German taxpayers are paying the receipts for the shiny new things they base their legacy from.

    At the same time industry is more controlled by Germany. Regions of Poland which support Kaczynski, are demographically collapsing as the young people exit and fertility rate of those which stay is lower than Japan. Management of the coronavirus crisis was incompetent for Poland compared to Western Europe. They have more energy independence from Russia than some of Central Europe, but using coal, so, having the worst air pollution in Europe.

    GDP per capita doesn’t really seem to converge with Western Europe, if you look at the nominal data. I’m sure there are positive things as well that Kaczynski attained. He is a trade-union leader. He says he has improve the conditions for working class people. Although they have installed neoliberal banker Morawiecki, to Prime Minister. Poland has at least been developing and improving, although not because of its politicians.

    Probably the vast increase in military spending will be negative for long-term. They will spend $21 billion for their military next year. It is 4 times more than Egypt.

    • Replies: @AP
    @Dmitry


    At the same time industry is more controlled by Germany. Regions of Poland which support Kaczynski, are demographically collapsing as the young people exit
     
    Kaczynsku has a high level of support throughout Poland, even in areas where his support is under 50%. Poland is not as starkly divided as was Ukraine.

    Also, Polish TFR is not completely correlated with PiS support:

    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTm6TyFOABshDveBGSPYH5qem3DlF0J2QfY0A&usqp=CAU

    Replies: @Dmitry

  860. Probably the vast increase in military spending will be negative for long-term.

    It won’t be negative if they manage to create their own domestic military industry.

  861. @Ivashka the fool
    @AP

    Yes it looks highly interesting although perhaps stretched a bit when it comes to Lao Tzu. The rest is more or less how I see it. Especially the sentence below:


    Mr. Beckwith contends, however, that the Medes and Persians were actually “creolized” Scythians.
     
    Absolutely correct.

    And after the fall of the different Scythian confederations, the Sarmatians, the Xiongnu, the Kushans, the Hephtalite, the Turks and finally the Mongols - all used the social system, the nomadic tool kit and even to some degree the religious patterns that have been created by the Indo-Iranian tribes that the Greek named using the exonyme Scythians.

    Basically, people originating in Sintashta-Arkaim/Andronovo culture have dominated the main part of Eurasian plain for nearly 2000 years.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b8/Indo-Iranian_origins.png/290px-Indo-Iranian_origins.png

    Most researchers associate the Andronovo horizon with early Indo-Iranian languages, though it may have overlapped the early Uralic-speaking area at its northern fringe.[8] Allentoft et al. (2015) concluded from their genetic studies that the Andronovo culture and the preceding Sintashta culture should be partially derived from the Corded Ware culture, given the higher proportion of ancestry matching the earlier farmers of Europe, similar to the admixture found in the genomes of the Corded Ware population.[9]
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andronovo_culture



    An anecdote; when I first read the Suzuki translation of the Lankavatara Sutra, one of the final paragraphs presented the scribe that transcribed it as belonging to the "tribe of Soma", which Suzuki translated as "the Moon tribe". I had a chuckle, because Soma was the famous entheogen used by the Vedic Aryans and named Haoma (or Hauma) by the Avestan Aryans. It was indeed considered as being "moon-like" when mixed into water (probably through some opalescent whitish colloidal effect).

    So about Scythians, the best at producing Soma / Haoma were the Saka haumavarga. Saka for Scythians (as well as Shakya in the Buddha's clan name) and I am pretty sure that you can understand the meaning if varga (варка) from your knowledge of the Slav languages. So basically, the scribe who wrote the Lankavatara Sutra translated by Suzuki might well have been a Scythian "drug dealer" from modern day Central Asia.

    https://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/haumavarga

    Therefore I have not been in the least surprised when I one day saw this image:

    https://i.natgeofe.com/n/22e9031b-68d7-4169-83e3-49c860122f9f/59670.jpg

    (I wonder what this "Scythian Bodhisattva" carried in his stash bag...)

    🙂

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @sudden death

    According to this memer (have no idea how wrong/right) Andronovo were blond?:

    https://twitter.com/AquaPaadre/status/1548396438144487424

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @sudden death

    I don't know whether all Andronovo people were blond or not and I don't think that the memmer you mentioned knows it either.

  862. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    Regarding SMO, the main objective of this war is the final solution of the Eastern Slav problem. And yes, for some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome.
     
    Can you point to specific financial elites who wish to genocide Eastern Slavs? And perhaps provide concrete evidence of their intentions?

    I don’t agree with your take. My working theory is that the main cause of Western demographic displacement is the “virtue-signaling liberal” segment of society. They constitute perhaps 20-25% of the Western population; but are disproportionately well-educated and located near centers of power. Jews are naturally over-represented; but are by no means the sole actors. Nor are they originators of the anti-racist/pro-migration meme. They merely provide intellectual firepower to existing currents of thought in Western society. Simply put; these virtue-signaling liberals have convinced themselves; and practically everyone else; that racism is the highest evil and openness to foreigners the highest good. Therefore; advocating for migration is virtuos; and against migration is racist. A banal theory, perhaps simplistic, but one that I feel gets close to reality.

    The causes of the Russia-Ukraine conflict are mani-fold and complex. I think Martin Van Crevald wrote a perceptive article on the topic: https://www.martin-van-creveld.com/what-putin-wants/ But one should always know that these things remain hidden from plain sight.

    And Allah knows what they hide, and what they reveal.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Coconuts, @Ivashka the fool

    They constitute perhaps 20-25% of the Western population; but are disproportionately well-educated and located near centers of power.

    These sound a lot like the ‘Anywhere’ group identified in British politics by David Goodhart, his idea was that they tend to define themselves by educational and career achievement much more than by local, often inherited identities (these are the ‘Somewheres’). I thought his analysis was pretty accurate when he first presented it in his book about Brexit, that was around 2017/18. The Woke phenomena seems to be confirming and deepening a lot of what he wrote then.

    Jews are naturally over-represented; but are by no means the sole actors. Nor are they originators of the anti-racist/pro-migration meme.

    Tend to agree as well. If you were in university in a Western country and studying the humanities the intellectual influence of French/North African Jews would be hard to avoid. But these were often quite strange people generally (e.g. homosexual, interested in boys).

    Simply put; these virtue-signaling liberals have convinced themselves; and practically everyone else; that racism is the highest evil and openness to foreigners the highest good. Therefore; advocating for migration is virtuos; and against migration is racist.

    I think Paul Gottfried was onto something with his idea that Anti-Fascist internationalism has become the guiding ideology among the Western Anywhere group. Nowadays it is easier to get hold of the texts of far-right authors from continental Europe than it used to be, even a decade ago. Some of the major French ones were rarely reprinted after 1945 and you would have to go out of the way to find them, even university courses dealing with the period wouldn’t really point you in the direction of reading them. When you do, it fills in some gaps in understanding Inter-war culture and politics, but also I think you can see what later authors on the post-war left were reacting and responding to; what they thought they had to deconstruct.

    The original motivations behind this must have been idealistic, there was an optimism about the potential of rejuvenated humanism and Marxism to liberate the world and the overriding thing about avoiding another major European war.

    Just now the generation that experienced the war first hand have nearly all died and the living memory of the last war is fading, the ‘Boomer Truth Regime’ looks like it is starting to drift into the territory of fulfilling various of the predictions made by the ‘damned masters’ of the pre-WW2 far-right.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @Coconuts

    I think we often overestimate the importance of ideologies and underestimate the importance of the economy. Both are important. The first modern wave of the non-European immigration to Europe happened during post-WW2 period (les trente glorieuses). And we tend sometimes to believe that the elite groups of high IQ, high wealth and high education status do somehow act irrationally. Perhaps there's a rationale that we want to define on economic grounds to understand why all this happens.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @S

  863. @sudden death
    @Ivashka the fool

    According to this memer (have no idea how wrong/right) Andronovo were blond?:

    https://twitter.com/AquaPaadre/status/1548396438144487424

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    I don’t know whether all Andronovo people were blond or not and I don’t think that the memmer you mentioned knows it either.

  864. @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    Around 30% of current Eastern Germanic population is of haplogroup R1a. It was probably much higher in pre-war Prussia and Pomerania.
     
    Absolutely, I heard that Prussia was up to 30% Baltic (Germanized Balts) up until the end. I haven't found the exact percentage, but it would make sense that it is at least that. And according to Gimbutas, there are some signs that there may have been Balts in Pomerania. Likewise, those Slavs might have been still pretty densely living there in the 20th century. We lost a lot in the 20th century.

    Currently, the descendants of the Corded Ware people are probably the most numerous group in Europe or at least at near parity with the descendants of Bell Beaker folks. But by the end of this century, the situation could be very different.
     
    The numbers are quite large so I wouldn't panic but the trends are not that great. As to timing, we are already almost a quarter of century into this century so majority of those who are born now will most likely be living by the end of this century. But that's nit picking and doesn't solve the overall problem since the negative trend stays.

    What do you think could be do done to ensure the survival of the native European ethnic groups ?
     
    To be honest, I'm not sure I can add anything new or original to what has already been said here many times.

    It would depend on what approach the society would be ready to take - the soft approach or a more radical one. In the current situation, women desire slightly more children than they end up having so it would be a good start to at least allow those women who want to have a higher number of children, achieve that goal. It looks like what works is to have a well organized space that is not inside the city but not too far from the city - creating somewhat self-sufficient neighborhoods a short ride from the city would help. They should make it less of a burden for young couples to acquire those spaces. So the youth can enjoy some happiness, but also don't wait too long.

    Two things that young women fear a lot is the pain of childbirth and many also do not want to have children out of wedlock. There's not much to be done about the first one except prepare mentally (there is also epidural) but the second one can be manipulated somehow - either by encouraging relatively early marriage (maybe not as early as in the Soviet days but not that much later), or remove the stigma entirely on out of wedlock births (as long as they happen in stable LTRs) as they have done in Scandinavia. Although the problem there is not really stigma but how women feel inside (so more educated women may still not be ok with it). But if at least some of those fears could be addressed or alleviated, then it might help.

    Under the radical approach, assuming that positive economic incentives are in place, one would need to start with manipulating the sexual market. Take control over the younger female population (of course, not put them on house arrest, lol, but control them through guidance, many young women act according to their interests / instincts but many don't or are too naive and should be helped).

    This would require to significantly clamp down on pre-marital sex (or casual sex), close hook up sites, etc., take some of the women out of the job market for a while. Basically make women only available for long term relationships or marriage. It doesn't have to be full Sharia, just a few things. Not punish people for their mishaps (as is the case in Sharia), but simply not allow them to get away with it and not allow them too many choices. It could be a kind of an experiment and see how it works. Keep men employed, of course. Control alpha males, if possible.

    I have a few other ideas, but they might sound a bit too uncivilized so I may not share them right now. Better to focus on the family as a priority. Frankly, the first, more mellow approach, could already work, if done right.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    Problem is, most young people live online as much or even more than they do IRL. The trends they follow are often shaped on line. It will be difficult to control teh internets. Imagine the stink, the cries and the gnashing of teeth if and when someone cuts off Twitch and Discord, not to mention other obvious sites…

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    It will be difficult to control teh internets
     
    Of course, it would be difficult. It may not be needed to cut off the whole thing. That's why I wrote that it would be better to try to pull it off via some subtle improvements.

    But that's just part of the problem. Then one has to somehow manage to protect the R1a group from other large groups, which will be an issue in the future.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

  865. @Coconuts
    @Yahya


    They constitute perhaps 20-25% of the Western population; but are disproportionately well-educated and located near centers of power.
     
    These sound a lot like the 'Anywhere' group identified in British politics by David Goodhart, his idea was that they tend to define themselves by educational and career achievement much more than by local, often inherited identities (these are the 'Somewheres'). I thought his analysis was pretty accurate when he first presented it in his book about Brexit, that was around 2017/18. The Woke phenomena seems to be confirming and deepening a lot of what he wrote then.

    Jews are naturally over-represented; but are by no means the sole actors. Nor are they originators of the anti-racist/pro-migration meme.
     
    Tend to agree as well. If you were in university in a Western country and studying the humanities the intellectual influence of French/North African Jews would be hard to avoid. But these were often quite strange people generally (e.g. homosexual, interested in boys).

    Simply put; these virtue-signaling liberals have convinced themselves; and practically everyone else; that racism is the highest evil and openness to foreigners the highest good. Therefore; advocating for migration is virtuos; and against migration is racist.
     
    I think Paul Gottfried was onto something with his idea that Anti-Fascist internationalism has become the guiding ideology among the Western Anywhere group. Nowadays it is easier to get hold of the texts of far-right authors from continental Europe than it used to be, even a decade ago. Some of the major French ones were rarely reprinted after 1945 and you would have to go out of the way to find them, even university courses dealing with the period wouldn't really point you in the direction of reading them. When you do, it fills in some gaps in understanding Inter-war culture and politics, but also I think you can see what later authors on the post-war left were reacting and responding to; what they thought they had to deconstruct.

    The original motivations behind this must have been idealistic, there was an optimism about the potential of rejuvenated humanism and Marxism to liberate the world and the overriding thing about avoiding another major European war.

    Just now the generation that experienced the war first hand have nearly all died and the living memory of the last war is fading, the 'Boomer Truth Regime' looks like it is starting to drift into the territory of fulfilling various of the predictions made by the 'damned masters' of the pre-WW2 far-right.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    I think we often overestimate the importance of ideologies and underestimate the importance of the economy. Both are important. The first modern wave of the non-European immigration to Europe happened during post-WW2 period (les trente glorieuses). And we tend sometimes to believe that the elite groups of high IQ, high wealth and high education status do somehow act irrationally. Perhaps there’s a rationale that we want to define on economic grounds to understand why all this happens.

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @Ivashka the fool


    The first modern wave of the non-European immigration to Europe happened during post-WW2 period (les trente glorieuses).
     
    There are some differences between France and Britain in this respect, when the migration into Britain was more haphazard and ended up being restricted due to democratic mobilisation against the Commonwealth citizenship stuff.

    And we tend sometimes to believe that the elite groups of high IQ, high wealth and high education status do somehow act irrationally.
     
    Speaking of the British ones, I don't think they always act fully aware of what the longer term consequences of what they decide will be. It depends on determining what their policy aims are though.

    Perhaps there’s a rationale that we want to define on economic grounds to understand why all this happens.
     
    There will definitely be ways of explaining it on the basis of economic decision making. But to take an example, various people from the government responsible for the large increase in immigration into the UK after 1997, making Britain a mass immigration society, have openly talked about the ideological aspects of the decision (though these could be seen as ultimately economic, avoiding war or creating larger markets say).

    There are probably other examples of this sort of thing among Northern European countries.
    , @S
    @Ivashka the fool


    I think we often overestimate the importance of ideologies and underestimate the importance of the economy...Perhaps there’s a rationale that we want to define on economic grounds to understand why all this happens.
     
    Yes, follow the money.

    In December, 1863, the financial representative of the Lincoln administration in London, Robert J Walker, taking numerous variables into account, effectively calculated that the North's wage slavery (ie the so called 'cheap labor'/'mass immigration' system, this being the early 19th century monetization of chattel slavery and it's trade) was four times more productive than chattel slavery, and hence far more profitable.



    He did this when he compared economic statistics from the center of wage slavery in the North, Massachusetts, with the center of chattel slavery in the South, South Carolina.

    Walker's London economic calculations were republished in the US North in the Spring of 1864 as part of a 'why we fight' series of articles for Northern consumption. [The original scanned in 1864 US journal article with Walker's London economic calculations and link to it can be found in my post archives.]

    At the time of the 1776 American Revolution chattel slavery was ubiquitous in both the Northern and Southern colonies. Anglo-Saxon elites and hangers on, rather than pay their own the prevailing real time local labor rates, would instead import alien chattel slaves to do this work at far below what they would have to pay their own people.

    Circa 1800 slavers of the British Empire and the US North had realized that slave owners could still avoid paying their own people the prevailing real time local labor rates by importing alien wage slaves (ie so called 'cheap labor'/'immigrants') instead of alien chattel slaves, and simply paying them far below the prevailing real time local labor rates, these often being people who had first been reduced to an unnaturally low state of being such as many of the Irish under British subjugation, or those having been flooded with drugs (opium) such as the Chinese.

    The US North went along with the British Empire's monetization of chattel slavery and adopted the new wage slavery (so called 'cheap labor) system. The South, which had many more chattel slaves than the North, and where chattel slavery had become entrenched, was recalcitrant, however, and would not adopt the new wage slavery system, and hence the 1861-65 war.

    The US Civil War was fought for slavery, despite the lies told to the men, by both sides.

    Some might balk at the idea that there are those who would see the destruction of entire peoples for profit. They were prepared to see 700,000 die in the US Civil War for profit, most being their own people. [The historically slavery corrupted elites and their hangers of both the North and South should of been overthrown instead, and a true abolition of slavery, both chattel and wage, enacted.]

    Below are some excerpts from a 1908 book entitled
    The Wartime Journal of a Georgia Girl (1864-65)written by Eliza Frances Andrews.

    Andrews father was one of the self declared 'privileged 4000', those who owned one hundred or more slaves as in his case, or, one of their business owning allies.

    She says the same thing in words what her Northern elite counter part, Robert J Walker, had said with his London economic calculations.

    From pgs 11, 12, and 13.

    '...the rise of the modern industrial
    system made wage slavery a more efficient agent of
    production than chattel slavery.'

    'Our Southern States, being still in the agricultural stage, on account of our practical monopoly of the world's chief textile staple, were the last of the great civilized nations to find chattel slavery less profitable than wage slavery, and hence the "great moral crusade"of the North against the perverse and unregenerate South.'

    'It was a pure case of economic determinism, which means that our great moral conflict reduces itself, in the last analysis, to a question of dollars and cents, though the real issue was so obscured by other considerations that we of the South honestly believe to this day that we were fighting for States Rights, while the North is equally honest in the conviction that it was engaged in a magnanimous struggle to free the slave.'
     
    She writes about the planned coming global super state, ie the United States of the World, which will be economically slavery based (ie wage slavery, or so called 'cheap labor') unless some radical change takes place first.

    From pgs 17 and 18

    'And now that we have learned wisdom through suffering; now that we have seen how much more can be accomplished by peaceful cooperation under the safe guidance of natural laws, than by wasteful violence, we are prepared to take our part intelligently in the next great forward movement of the race — a movement having for its object not merely a closer union of kindred states, but that grander union dreamed of by the poet, which is to find its consummation in "The parliament of man, the federation of the world."
     
    https://archive.org/details/wartimejournalof00andr/page/12/mode/1up
  866. @Yahya
    @Dmitry


    Netanyahu is not so bad like Kaczynski. He reforms the country and has plenty positive attainments.
     
    I've tried to read up on Kaczynski; but to my chagrin could not find objective and reliable English-language sources. He's been described as "xenophobic", "nationalist" and "authoritarian"; neither of which are bad things in my book. I don't want to opine on Polish internal politics too much; but probably if I were a Pole i'd vote for the nationalist parties which seek to maintain Poland For Poles and resist the migration waves heading into Europe. The (semi-)irreversible nature of immigration policies would make it a number one priority; everything else negotiable.

    You seem to consider democracy as being the Chief Good in politics, to borrow an Aristotelian term; so in your opinion Kaczynski is bad because of the backsliding. But for me the results matter more than the system. The system is only important insofar as it can deliver the results. Many of the greatest world historical leaders were authoritarians; Lee Kuan Yew, Otto von Bismarck, Cardinal Richelieu, Piotr Stolypin, Fouad Chehab etc. On the other hand, many of the worst leaders have also been authoritarians. It's a mixed-bag. But being an authoritarian doesn't necessarily preclude competence or effectiveness. In fact, authoritarians may be more intelligent on average than democratic leaders. Kaczynski will have to be judged on his track record; both in the present and the long-term future.

    But i'd like to hear APP's perspective on Polish politics.

    Dmitry, what is your judgement on Israeli and Russian historical leaders?

    Replies: @Dmitry, @Another Polish Perspective

    KACZYNSKIS. I have positive view of Kaczynskis as persons and moderately positive as politicians. The first connects to two as Kaczynski have been one of the few Polish politicans who were known as not to become corrupt or greedy from the former anti-communist opposition, especially in the time of “wild capitalism” preceding Polish accession to EU. At that time Kaczynskis had their ownn small party (Porozumienie Centrum – the Agreement for Center), so called ‘cadre party” (like Bolsheviks before 1917) from where the most trusted by Kaczynski politicans came after 2002, when PiS (Law and Justice) was created and Porozumienie Centrum liquidated. Kaczynski political skills – ruling on the base of small group of trusted politicians – came from Porozuminie Centrum times. It was Lech Kaczynski who was the man of the people, his brother has always been known as a backroom schemer – Jarosław is not overly popular, he didn’t win presidential elections even in the wake of his brother death in Katyn in 2010.

    Nevertheless, his agenda is popular – the very name of his party, “Law and Justice” was born out of opposition to wild capitalism of the nineties. His politics of ending of deference to Germans especially and broadly, to West Europe, is correct, especially as Germans are very hypocritical, often equating European values with German values. It does exist mainly in terms of politics however – Polish consular service in Poland is still more concerned with “German sovereignty” than with helping Polish citizens there, and that despite special law PiS made which explicitly demands that Polish consuls fight discrimination of Polish citizens abroad (that the law was made which actually forces upon consuls their nominal duties, speaks of the problem). It also shows the problem of reforms when the will of politicians is not made into reality by officials, who do know that politicians are transitory. That they expect this transition is also a proof that Poland is not experienced as a dictatorship by Poles themselves.

    The very good example of that is the debate on the independence of the courts, judges being long-term officials like consuls. However to understand this debate, one has yet to know that in Europe, constitutional courts can often nullify a law (such is a case in Poland, Germany and Israel at least) if they deem it “unconstitutional”, effectively resulting by the rule of judges: it is sometimes called “judical activism”. That is often a matter of judges fancy or political stance, since it is easy to find anything within the very broad statements of constitution. Moreover, those judges are not democratically elected, so even if you win elections, judges can hamper your agenda.

    The independence of courts is of minimal significance to a normal citizen, due to the fact that it is very improbable that his appeal to the highest court will be taken and decided upon – in Germany, 97% of all individually submitted constitutional lawsuits are discarded by Bundesverfassungsgericht without deciding on their merits. In Poland, a single citizen cannot even submit such a lawsuit to Constitutional Court.
    In normal judicial proceedings, it is of no importance since in civil law system there is no stare decisis principle but the “free assessment of proofs” principle, “free” of course for a court not for you. It essentially means that a court can skew the outcome just by ignoring your arguments, also that from European law (like Strasbourg or Luxembourg tribunal). In other words, you have a right to address a court but you do not have a right to have your arguments addressed by a court, even if your arguments are based on EU or ECHR jurisprudence. It is a much bigger problem in Germany than in Poland actually, where there is absolutely no deference to international law INSIDE Germany: Bundesverfassungsgericht has an unofficial doctrine of the primacy of the German law over ECHR or EU law.

    Is manipulation around courts political ? Yes, it is . But everyone should understand that truly independent judiciary would be chosen by lot and for short terms (eg. 2 years) – anything else than that is not fully independent.

    In Poland itself PiS corrected some of the most painful deficits of legal system in Poland, like the possibility of losing a lawsuit against you simply by not knowing about it, since it was enough to send a lawsuit to your official registered address, which in Poland can be only one (“meldunek”) – and after 14 days it was delivered by the power of “delivery fiction” legal concept. Now your opponent must establish your real address

    Is Kaczynski a dictator? Of course no, since he has rather weak parliamentary (but not constitutional majority) and is rather likely that he will lose this majority in the next elections.

    THE NEGATIVE CONSEQUENCES OF POLISH MEMBERSHIP IN EU.
    1) a lot of young people emigrated to EU and will probably not come back – you could say this prepared way to emigration to Poland of Ukrainians (and their “work” visas did not allow for Schengen travel, so they were “encouraged” to stay in Poland too). The initial process of mass emigration FROM Poland was a kind of grooming Poland for accepting immigration in this way.

    2) skewing economy towards EU-fundable projects, like constructions projects. There is too much money in that. It results in 2a) constant repairs of roads which were deliberately built/repaired with defects just few years ago. It was also visible when Poland wanted to shift EU funds for Polish railways to roads: it was clear that there is “patron-client” relationship between construction firms and politicians – and you can so easily milk the railway funds since railway construction is much more regulated than roads construction 2b) building of unnecessary things like some airports, aquaparks in cities, projects which now have problems with sustaining themselves due to growing energy prices or lack of customers. Well, if you like, you can get EU funds for opening a park with alpacas too.
    In terms of housing, the counterpart to this is the growth of banking sectors funding developers (who are some of the new Polish oligarchs) who build heavily overpriced apartments which people than buy with mortgages. The worth of PL banking sector is now more than Polish GDP, it is 137% of GDP! It means the value of credits portfolio is worth more than everything produced in Poland in a year – and remember that part of that GDP is building sector itself, a sector which provides products which can be mortgaged. So its even worse, as it is a closed loop.

    It could be different. The matter was generally decided in the pre-EU period after 1989, when a lot of advanced Polish industry was sold to the Western companies which then liquidated it, eg. ELWRO – Poland had one of best electronic industries in the East Bloc, producing not just mainframe computers but also its own personal computers, even if with text-based interface (but also with graphic one on license). I don’t say Poland could be a Taiwan of Europe (but it did produce its own microprocessors too), but certainly could be helped to become part of the world high tech industry chain.

    There must be understood that Kaczynski voters – who are around 25% of society since 50% of Poles do not vote at all – mostly did not participate in this milking of EU funds. Nevertheless, because EU projects, different than simple infrastructure building, must be international (eg. participants must be from at least 5 EU countries), Kaczynski is dependent to some extent on EU funding too. There is simply not enough of Polish economy not connected to EU to build prosperity upon. So he did not take such a confrontational course like Orban, who also has a bonus of constitutional majority, smaller country, being much popular among international right, and being a former Soros man – who knows whether he isn’t just controlled opposition within EU?

    Orban, with his image of loose cannon, has its advantages for EU too – he can veto something which EU officially supports, but unofficially is aware of its divisiveness, like anti-Russian stance. Orban also canalizes internal opposition in EU countries into the fight for parliament seats as he is a “successful” example of achieving power by constitutional means.

    • Thanks: A123, Yahya
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    I will add that because Jarosław Kaczyński political skills come from lording over small group of trusted politicians, he has problems now with managing his large party - so large that he does not know all its politicians personally - and PiS became more like Fidesz, a broad alliance of like minded people with an injection of careerists, who generate scandals.

    BTW, PiS is not the most right party in Poland, not even in parliament. It is a centrist party - exactly like the name of the old Kaczynskis party, "Porozumienie Centrum".

    Replies: @sudden death

    , @Mr. Hack
    @Another Polish Perspective


    Orban, with his image of loose cannon, has its advantages for EU too – he can veto something which EU officially supports, but unofficially is aware of its divisiveness, like anti-Russian stance. Orban also canalizes internal opposition in EU countries into the fight for parliament seats as he is a “successful” example of achieving power by constitutional means.
     
    Sounds like he's become something like one of the recalcitrant PLC Polish nobles of the 17th century, being able to veto anything that crosses his path, making it difficult to get anything constructive done within the EU.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/db/Polish_Sejm_1622.jpg/800px-Polish_Sejm_1622.jpg
    "Nie pozwalam"!
    , @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective


    and you can so easily milk the railway funds since railway construction is much more regulated than roads construction
     
    SHOULD OF COURSE READ AS

    "and you CANNOT so easily milk the railway funds since railway construction is much more regulated than roads construction"
  867. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    KACZYNSKIS. I have positive view of Kaczynskis as persons and moderately positive as politicians. The first connects to two as Kaczynski have been one of the few Polish politicans who were known as not to become corrupt or greedy from the former anti-communist opposition, especially in the time of "wild capitalism" preceding Polish accession to EU. At that time Kaczynskis had their ownn small party (Porozumienie Centrum - the Agreement for Center), so called 'cadre party" (like Bolsheviks before 1917) from where the most trusted by Kaczynski politicans came after 2002, when PiS (Law and Justice) was created and Porozumienie Centrum liquidated. Kaczynski political skills - ruling on the base of small group of trusted politicians - came from Porozuminie Centrum times. It was Lech Kaczynski who was the man of the people, his brother has always been known as a backroom schemer - Jarosław is not overly popular, he didn't win presidential elections even in the wake of his brother death in Katyn in 2010.

    Nevertheless, his agenda is popular - the very name of his party, "Law and Justice" was born out of opposition to wild capitalism of the nineties. His politics of ending of deference to Germans especially and broadly, to West Europe, is correct, especially as Germans are very hypocritical, often equating European values with German values. It does exist mainly in terms of politics however - Polish consular service in Poland is still more concerned with "German sovereignty" than with helping Polish citizens there, and that despite special law PiS made which explicitly demands that Polish consuls fight discrimination of Polish citizens abroad (that the law was made which actually forces upon consuls their nominal duties, speaks of the problem). It also shows the problem of reforms when the will of politicians is not made into reality by officials, who do know that politicians are transitory. That they expect this transition is also a proof that Poland is not experienced as a dictatorship by Poles themselves.

    The very good example of that is the debate on the independence of the courts, judges being long-term officials like consuls. However to understand this debate, one has yet to know that in Europe, constitutional courts can often nullify a law (such is a case in Poland, Germany and Israel at least) if they deem it "unconstitutional", effectively resulting by the rule of judges: it is sometimes called "judical activism". That is often a matter of judges fancy or political stance, since it is easy to find anything within the very broad statements of constitution. Moreover, those judges are not democratically elected, so even if you win elections, judges can hamper your agenda.

    The independence of courts is of minimal significance to a normal citizen, due to the fact that it is very improbable that his appeal to the highest court will be taken and decided upon - in Germany, 97% of all individually submitted constitutional lawsuits are discarded by Bundesverfassungsgericht without deciding on their merits. In Poland, a single citizen cannot even submit such a lawsuit to Constitutional Court.
    In normal judicial proceedings, it is of no importance since in civil law system there is no stare decisis principle but the "free assessment of proofs" principle, "free" of course for a court not for you. It essentially means that a court can skew the outcome just by ignoring your arguments, also that from European law (like Strasbourg or Luxembourg tribunal). In other words, you have a right to address a court but you do not have a right to have your arguments addressed by a court, even if your arguments are based on EU or ECHR jurisprudence. It is a much bigger problem in Germany than in Poland actually, where there is absolutely no deference to international law INSIDE Germany: Bundesverfassungsgericht has an unofficial doctrine of the primacy of the German law over ECHR or EU law.

    Is manipulation around courts political ? Yes, it is . But everyone should understand that truly independent judiciary would be chosen by lot and for short terms (eg. 2 years) - anything else than that is not fully independent.

    In Poland itself PiS corrected some of the most painful deficits of legal system in Poland, like the possibility of losing a lawsuit against you simply by not knowing about it, since it was enough to send a lawsuit to your official registered address, which in Poland can be only one ("meldunek") - and after 14 days it was delivered by the power of "delivery fiction" legal concept. Now your opponent must establish your real address

    Is Kaczynski a dictator? Of course no, since he has rather weak parliamentary (but not constitutional majority) and is rather likely that he will lose this majority in the next elections.

    THE NEGATIVE CONSEQUENCES OF POLISH MEMBERSHIP IN EU.
    1) a lot of young people emigrated to EU and will probably not come back - you could say this prepared way to emigration to Poland of Ukrainians (and their "work" visas did not allow for Schengen travel, so they were "encouraged" to stay in Poland too). The initial process of mass emigration FROM Poland was a kind of grooming Poland for accepting immigration in this way.

    2) skewing economy towards EU-fundable projects, like constructions projects. There is too much money in that. It results in 2a) constant repairs of roads which were deliberately built/repaired with defects just few years ago. It was also visible when Poland wanted to shift EU funds for Polish railways to roads: it was clear that there is "patron-client" relationship between construction firms and politicians - and you can so easily milk the railway funds since railway construction is much more regulated than roads construction 2b) building of unnecessary things like some airports, aquaparks in cities, projects which now have problems with sustaining themselves due to growing energy prices or lack of customers. Well, if you like, you can get EU funds for opening a park with alpacas too.
    In terms of housing, the counterpart to this is the growth of banking sectors funding developers (who are some of the new Polish oligarchs) who build heavily overpriced apartments which people than buy with mortgages. The worth of PL banking sector is now more than Polish GDP, it is 137% of GDP! It means the value of credits portfolio is worth more than everything produced in Poland in a year - and remember that part of that GDP is building sector itself, a sector which provides products which can be mortgaged. So its even worse, as it is a closed loop.

    It could be different. The matter was generally decided in the pre-EU period after 1989, when a lot of advanced Polish industry was sold to the Western companies which then liquidated it, eg. ELWRO - Poland had one of best electronic industries in the East Bloc, producing not just mainframe computers but also its own personal computers, even if with text-based interface (but also with graphic one on license). I don't say Poland could be a Taiwan of Europe (but it did produce its own microprocessors too), but certainly could be helped to become part of the world high tech industry chain.

    There must be understood that Kaczynski voters - who are around 25% of society since 50% of Poles do not vote at all - mostly did not participate in this milking of EU funds. Nevertheless, because EU projects, different than simple infrastructure building, must be international (eg. participants must be from at least 5 EU countries), Kaczynski is dependent to some extent on EU funding too. There is simply not enough of Polish economy not connected to EU to build prosperity upon. So he did not take such a confrontational course like Orban, who also has a bonus of constitutional majority, smaller country, being much popular among international right, and being a former Soros man - who knows whether he isn't just controlled opposition within EU?

    Orban, with his image of loose cannon, has its advantages for EU too - he can veto something which EU officially supports, but unofficially is aware of its divisiveness, like anti-Russian stance. Orban also canalizes internal opposition in EU countries into the fight for parliament seats as he is a "successful" example of achieving power by constitutional means.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Mr. Hack, @Another Polish Perspective

    I will add that because Jarosław Kaczyński political skills come from lording over small group of trusted politicians, he has problems now with managing his large party – so large that he does not know all its politicians personally – and PiS became more like Fidesz, a broad alliance of like minded people with an injection of careerists, who generate scandals.

    BTW, PiS is not the most right party in Poland, not even in parliament. It is a centrist party – exactly like the name of the old Kaczynskis party, “Porozumienie Centrum”.

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @Another Polish Perspective

    bit offtopic, but how are the most fringe froups doing in Poland these days - relatively shrinking, expanding or stable?

    Do mean Polish respecters of Aryan Nazis, who probably were/are listening rather catchy hymns about WaffenSS:

    https://soundcloud.com/user-733868840/potop-stalingrad-mp3

    And also on the other side there should be Polish Dzerzhinski/Cheka respecters too, even if didn't hear so far any music from them yet;)

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  868. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    KACZYNSKIS. I have positive view of Kaczynskis as persons and moderately positive as politicians. The first connects to two as Kaczynski have been one of the few Polish politicans who were known as not to become corrupt or greedy from the former anti-communist opposition, especially in the time of "wild capitalism" preceding Polish accession to EU. At that time Kaczynskis had their ownn small party (Porozumienie Centrum - the Agreement for Center), so called 'cadre party" (like Bolsheviks before 1917) from where the most trusted by Kaczynski politicans came after 2002, when PiS (Law and Justice) was created and Porozumienie Centrum liquidated. Kaczynski political skills - ruling on the base of small group of trusted politicians - came from Porozuminie Centrum times. It was Lech Kaczynski who was the man of the people, his brother has always been known as a backroom schemer - Jarosław is not overly popular, he didn't win presidential elections even in the wake of his brother death in Katyn in 2010.

    Nevertheless, his agenda is popular - the very name of his party, "Law and Justice" was born out of opposition to wild capitalism of the nineties. His politics of ending of deference to Germans especially and broadly, to West Europe, is correct, especially as Germans are very hypocritical, often equating European values with German values. It does exist mainly in terms of politics however - Polish consular service in Poland is still more concerned with "German sovereignty" than with helping Polish citizens there, and that despite special law PiS made which explicitly demands that Polish consuls fight discrimination of Polish citizens abroad (that the law was made which actually forces upon consuls their nominal duties, speaks of the problem). It also shows the problem of reforms when the will of politicians is not made into reality by officials, who do know that politicians are transitory. That they expect this transition is also a proof that Poland is not experienced as a dictatorship by Poles themselves.

    The very good example of that is the debate on the independence of the courts, judges being long-term officials like consuls. However to understand this debate, one has yet to know that in Europe, constitutional courts can often nullify a law (such is a case in Poland, Germany and Israel at least) if they deem it "unconstitutional", effectively resulting by the rule of judges: it is sometimes called "judical activism". That is often a matter of judges fancy or political stance, since it is easy to find anything within the very broad statements of constitution. Moreover, those judges are not democratically elected, so even if you win elections, judges can hamper your agenda.

    The independence of courts is of minimal significance to a normal citizen, due to the fact that it is very improbable that his appeal to the highest court will be taken and decided upon - in Germany, 97% of all individually submitted constitutional lawsuits are discarded by Bundesverfassungsgericht without deciding on their merits. In Poland, a single citizen cannot even submit such a lawsuit to Constitutional Court.
    In normal judicial proceedings, it is of no importance since in civil law system there is no stare decisis principle but the "free assessment of proofs" principle, "free" of course for a court not for you. It essentially means that a court can skew the outcome just by ignoring your arguments, also that from European law (like Strasbourg or Luxembourg tribunal). In other words, you have a right to address a court but you do not have a right to have your arguments addressed by a court, even if your arguments are based on EU or ECHR jurisprudence. It is a much bigger problem in Germany than in Poland actually, where there is absolutely no deference to international law INSIDE Germany: Bundesverfassungsgericht has an unofficial doctrine of the primacy of the German law over ECHR or EU law.

    Is manipulation around courts political ? Yes, it is . But everyone should understand that truly independent judiciary would be chosen by lot and for short terms (eg. 2 years) - anything else than that is not fully independent.

    In Poland itself PiS corrected some of the most painful deficits of legal system in Poland, like the possibility of losing a lawsuit against you simply by not knowing about it, since it was enough to send a lawsuit to your official registered address, which in Poland can be only one ("meldunek") - and after 14 days it was delivered by the power of "delivery fiction" legal concept. Now your opponent must establish your real address

    Is Kaczynski a dictator? Of course no, since he has rather weak parliamentary (but not constitutional majority) and is rather likely that he will lose this majority in the next elections.

    THE NEGATIVE CONSEQUENCES OF POLISH MEMBERSHIP IN EU.
    1) a lot of young people emigrated to EU and will probably not come back - you could say this prepared way to emigration to Poland of Ukrainians (and their "work" visas did not allow for Schengen travel, so they were "encouraged" to stay in Poland too). The initial process of mass emigration FROM Poland was a kind of grooming Poland for accepting immigration in this way.

    2) skewing economy towards EU-fundable projects, like constructions projects. There is too much money in that. It results in 2a) constant repairs of roads which were deliberately built/repaired with defects just few years ago. It was also visible when Poland wanted to shift EU funds for Polish railways to roads: it was clear that there is "patron-client" relationship between construction firms and politicians - and you can so easily milk the railway funds since railway construction is much more regulated than roads construction 2b) building of unnecessary things like some airports, aquaparks in cities, projects which now have problems with sustaining themselves due to growing energy prices or lack of customers. Well, if you like, you can get EU funds for opening a park with alpacas too.
    In terms of housing, the counterpart to this is the growth of banking sectors funding developers (who are some of the new Polish oligarchs) who build heavily overpriced apartments which people than buy with mortgages. The worth of PL banking sector is now more than Polish GDP, it is 137% of GDP! It means the value of credits portfolio is worth more than everything produced in Poland in a year - and remember that part of that GDP is building sector itself, a sector which provides products which can be mortgaged. So its even worse, as it is a closed loop.

    It could be different. The matter was generally decided in the pre-EU period after 1989, when a lot of advanced Polish industry was sold to the Western companies which then liquidated it, eg. ELWRO - Poland had one of best electronic industries in the East Bloc, producing not just mainframe computers but also its own personal computers, even if with text-based interface (but also with graphic one on license). I don't say Poland could be a Taiwan of Europe (but it did produce its own microprocessors too), but certainly could be helped to become part of the world high tech industry chain.

    There must be understood that Kaczynski voters - who are around 25% of society since 50% of Poles do not vote at all - mostly did not participate in this milking of EU funds. Nevertheless, because EU projects, different than simple infrastructure building, must be international (eg. participants must be from at least 5 EU countries), Kaczynski is dependent to some extent on EU funding too. There is simply not enough of Polish economy not connected to EU to build prosperity upon. So he did not take such a confrontational course like Orban, who also has a bonus of constitutional majority, smaller country, being much popular among international right, and being a former Soros man - who knows whether he isn't just controlled opposition within EU?

    Orban, with his image of loose cannon, has its advantages for EU too - he can veto something which EU officially supports, but unofficially is aware of its divisiveness, like anti-Russian stance. Orban also canalizes internal opposition in EU countries into the fight for parliament seats as he is a "successful" example of achieving power by constitutional means.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Mr. Hack, @Another Polish Perspective

    Orban, with his image of loose cannon, has its advantages for EU too – he can veto something which EU officially supports, but unofficially is aware of its divisiveness, like anti-Russian stance. Orban also canalizes internal opposition in EU countries into the fight for parliament seats as he is a “successful” example of achieving power by constitutional means.

    Sounds like he’s become something like one of the recalcitrant PLC Polish nobles of the 17th century, being able to veto anything that crosses his path, making it difficult to get anything constructive done within the EU.


    “Nie pozwalam”!

    • LOL: LatW
  869. @AP
    @Ivashka the fool

    Does this seem to be a worthwhile book?


    https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-scythian-empire-book-review-history-the-riders-from-the-steppe-11674233967

    ‘The Scythian Empire’ Review: The Riders From the Steppe
    A powerful central Asian culture left its mark on civilizations from the Black Sea to the Yellow River, but history has better remembered its successors.

    Scholarly depth and breadth rarely meet on equal terms. In “The Scythian Empire: Central Eurasia and the Birth of the Classical Age From Persia to China,” Christopher I. Beckwith marries the two to memorable effect.



    A professor of Eurasian studies at Indiana University Bloomington, Mr. Beckwith asserts the primacy of the Scythian Empire’s influence on the classical age. The Scythians, pastoral nomads who roamed the Central Eurasian steppe zone from around the eighth century B.C., are traditionally dismissed as uncouth predators whose legacy was negative, inconsequential or, at best, ambiguous. In the fifth century B.C., Aristophanes portrayed oafish, heavily accented Scythians policing Athens, while Herodotus decried their rule over the vanquished for its “violence and . . . pride”: “besides exacting from each the tribute which was assessed, they rode about the land carrying off everyone’s possessions.” Yet to Mr. Beckwith, the Scythians represent “one of the least known but most influential realms in all of world history.”

    Historians have acknowledged Scythian innovations, including an unprecedented feudal structure, monotheism and sophisticated weapons—namely, short composite bows that allowed mounted archers greater range of movement. These practices are typically thought to have been copied by their better-known imperial successors, the Medes and Persians. Mr. Beckwith contends, however, that the Medes and Persians were actually “creolized” Scythians.

    Pre-Scythian Medes inhabited parts of contemporary Iran, Turkey and Iraq; theirs was “strictly a geographical region, not an ethnolinguistic entity or a political unit,” according to Mr. Beckwith. A fully realized Mede polity dates to Cyaxares’s overthrow of the Scythians (ca. 620 B.C.). “Raised as a Scythian,” Cyaxares is not known to have altered any “inherited Scythian clothing, weapons, state structure, religious beliefs, etc,” Mr. Beckwith writes. To do so would have gone against the grain, “because by that time . . . the Scythians . . . and the native peoples had merged.”

    The reigns of the Medes and Persians, initiated by coups, were validated by their leaders’ identification with the Scythians’ royal lineage. Cyaxares, who led an allied force against the Assyrians, captured and destroyed Nineveh in 612 B.C. He was followed by his purported son, Astyages. Cyrus II, Astyages’s Persian grandson, in turn seized power in 550 B.C. Carrying on the Scytho-Mede line, Cyrus “kept the Empire and the entire imperial system intact—with the exception of the religious element—when he overthrew the Mede king.” Mr. Beckwith refers to this longest-lasting iteration as the Scytho-Mede-Persian Empire.

    If the Medes and Persians were, in essential respects, Scythian by another name, why was the Scythian system so attractive to usurpers and impervious to change? The appeals of Scythian feudalism were its religious justification and the coherence of its “package”—the sovereign served the one God of Heaven and was supported by an evolving pyramid of vassals. Religion legitimized the king and imbued his subjects, direct and indirect, with divine purpose. Later claimants, Mr. Beckwith observes, could not retain their feudal hierarchy without its religious underpinning.

    Proof can be found in the short-lived polytheism of Cyrus and Cambyses II: “They clearly did not understand,” Mr. Beckwith points out, “that because local ‘national God’ cults legitimized local national rulers, i.e., independent kings, a single unified empire required a single ruler legitimized by a single God.” Darius I restored the status quo ante, declaring, “The Great God is Ahuramazdā, who created this earth, who created that heaven, who created man, who created happiness for man, who made Darius king, one king of many, one lord of many.”

    Mr. Beckwith cites linguistic evidence for the Scythians’ widespread legacy. Three cities called Agamatāna were built by Scythians (or Scythian speakers) “at the same time, but very far apart”: the Mede capital in modern-day Iran and, thousands of miles to the east, successive capitals of the Scytho-Chinese state of Chao. The author also notes that variants of the Scythian word for “royal line,” Aria, preserved its meaning in Bactrian, Old Persian and Chinese: “This word Harya . . . came to be used by Chinese speakers in the fourth century B.C. to refer to themselves, i.e., ‘us the Chinese’, meaning those who belonged to the legitimate ruling lineage, Harya.” A national signifier from Iran to China, Aria attests to Scythian reach.

    An epilogue on capital-P Philosophy considers Scythian links to the “first great philosophers” of Greece, Iran, India and China: Anacharsis (“the Scythian”), Zoroaster, Gautama (“the Scythian Sage”) and Laotzu. Anacharsis, an early Greek Skeptic was half Scythian by birth and education. Zoroaster’s Gathas (“Hymns”) were composed in Old Avestan, an archaic dialect of Imperial Scythian. Gautama hailed from northwestern India or Central Asia, “regions known to have been ruled by the Scythians, Scytho-Medes, and related peoples who succeeded them.” Mr. Beckwith transcribes the foreign-born Laotzu’s full name, Lao-tan—“lao” was formerly pronounced like “k’ao”—into the Sanskrit Gautama. For Mr. Beckwith, the simultaneous appearance of these revolutionary figures and ideas was no coincidence. Rejecting the belief that ancient cultures were conceived locally, he proposes that the Scythians were the common denominator that “produced the great shared cultural flowering known as the Classical Age.”

    Of Mr. Beckwith’s eight fresh and penetrating chapters, only the sixth, on Classical Scythian philology, is likely to challenge the nonspecialist. For the rest of the text, his prose and data-driven analysis are clear. But superior delivery does not on its own set his book apart. “The Scythian Empire” is simply, dazzlingly original. Ever-narrowing fields of academic study and inability to see the whole historical picture, he suggests, partly explain the Scythians’ discredit and neglect. As for Mr. Beckwith, his curiosity, imagination and learning—from the Yellow River to the Danube, from archaeology to linguistics—do what every history ought to do but few achieve: compel the reader to think.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool, @Another Polish Perspective

    I am not an expert on Scythians, but I too have taken notice of the recent emergence of the fad for Scythians. My intuition says to me that there is something wrong in presenting Scythians as essentially pre-Mongols in their reach, and Persians as form of Scythians. But as usually, truth lies in details. Maybe in free time I will look for them.
    There could be an agenda here stemming from the fact that Persians freed the Jews. Persian rule was also quite unpopular in Egypt. Maybe someone doesn’t like them for that, as Jews of course have no reason to present Persians as Scythians.

  870. @Sher Singh
    @Ivashka the fool


    An anecdote; when I first read the Suzuki translation of the Lankavatara Sutra, one of the final paragraphs presented the scribe that transcribed it as belonging to the “tribe of Soma”, which Suzuki translated as “the Moon tribe”.
     
    Soma is another name for the moon & Soma-Vansh another name for Lunar Dynasty.
    You eat beef why are you even discussing this?

    https://twitter.com/akali_berserker/status/1616827460305432576

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    I was writing about Vedic Aryans and Avestan Aryans. Soma moon goddess is post-Vedic and has nothing to do with Saka people anyway. Please tell me more about Kushans and Spenta Huna conquests of northern India.

  871. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @Coconuts
    @AaronB


    And it is my belief that the modern celebration of work and disvaluing of the contemplative life is somehow at the very heart of modern nihilism, and that is a very significant fact.
     
    There seems to have been a lot of concern about what the impact of the 'burgherisation' would ultimately be, towards the end of the 19th century and up to WW2, on the left and the right:

    Zola's heroes are very much the products of the century of the city and of the factory, caught in the mantrap and lacerated by it to the bone, to the marrow. The Frenchman of the IIIrd Republic, as a bourgeois, he is no longer truly bourgeois, as a worker any remaining traces of the peasant and the artisan and all values of race and life are dead in him. He is only good for voting and heavy drinking. His daughter will be a prostitute. Beyond alcohol lies insanity and crime. Coupeau's Delerium Tremens is very much the contemporary of the portraits of alcoholic despair produced by bourgeois art at that time in the works of Baudelaire, Verlaine, Rimbaud.
     
    Written in 1940, it looks like not only being applicable to France. The last alcohol phase was maybe the babyboomers and Gen X. Perhaps the insanity stage is being reached at the moment (e.g. Woke). What might the crime stage involve?

    Replies: @AaronB

    Well, perhaps we can avoid the crime stage by restoring contemplation and leisure to their rightful place on top of the hierarchy of values 🙂

    See my reply to LatW on the new thread.

  872. @Ivashka the fool
    @Coconuts

    I think we often overestimate the importance of ideologies and underestimate the importance of the economy. Both are important. The first modern wave of the non-European immigration to Europe happened during post-WW2 period (les trente glorieuses). And we tend sometimes to believe that the elite groups of high IQ, high wealth and high education status do somehow act irrationally. Perhaps there's a rationale that we want to define on economic grounds to understand why all this happens.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @S

    The first modern wave of the non-European immigration to Europe happened during post-WW2 period (les trente glorieuses).

    There are some differences between France and Britain in this respect, when the migration into Britain was more haphazard and ended up being restricted due to democratic mobilisation against the Commonwealth citizenship stuff.

    And we tend sometimes to believe that the elite groups of high IQ, high wealth and high education status do somehow act irrationally.

    Speaking of the British ones, I don’t think they always act fully aware of what the longer term consequences of what they decide will be. It depends on determining what their policy aims are though.

    Perhaps there’s a rationale that we want to define on economic grounds to understand why all this happens.

    There will definitely be ways of explaining it on the basis of economic decision making. But to take an example, various people from the government responsible for the large increase in immigration into the UK after 1997, making Britain a mass immigration society, have openly talked about the ideological aspects of the decision (though these could be seen as ultimately economic, avoiding war or creating larger markets say).

    There are probably other examples of this sort of thing among Northern European countries.

  873. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Yahya

    KACZYNSKIS. I have positive view of Kaczynskis as persons and moderately positive as politicians. The first connects to two as Kaczynski have been one of the few Polish politicans who were known as not to become corrupt or greedy from the former anti-communist opposition, especially in the time of "wild capitalism" preceding Polish accession to EU. At that time Kaczynskis had their ownn small party (Porozumienie Centrum - the Agreement for Center), so called 'cadre party" (like Bolsheviks before 1917) from where the most trusted by Kaczynski politicans came after 2002, when PiS (Law and Justice) was created and Porozumienie Centrum liquidated. Kaczynski political skills - ruling on the base of small group of trusted politicians - came from Porozuminie Centrum times. It was Lech Kaczynski who was the man of the people, his brother has always been known as a backroom schemer - Jarosław is not overly popular, he didn't win presidential elections even in the wake of his brother death in Katyn in 2010.

    Nevertheless, his agenda is popular - the very name of his party, "Law and Justice" was born out of opposition to wild capitalism of the nineties. His politics of ending of deference to Germans especially and broadly, to West Europe, is correct, especially as Germans are very hypocritical, often equating European values with German values. It does exist mainly in terms of politics however - Polish consular service in Poland is still more concerned with "German sovereignty" than with helping Polish citizens there, and that despite special law PiS made which explicitly demands that Polish consuls fight discrimination of Polish citizens abroad (that the law was made which actually forces upon consuls their nominal duties, speaks of the problem). It also shows the problem of reforms when the will of politicians is not made into reality by officials, who do know that politicians are transitory. That they expect this transition is also a proof that Poland is not experienced as a dictatorship by Poles themselves.

    The very good example of that is the debate on the independence of the courts, judges being long-term officials like consuls. However to understand this debate, one has yet to know that in Europe, constitutional courts can often nullify a law (such is a case in Poland, Germany and Israel at least) if they deem it "unconstitutional", effectively resulting by the rule of judges: it is sometimes called "judical activism". That is often a matter of judges fancy or political stance, since it is easy to find anything within the very broad statements of constitution. Moreover, those judges are not democratically elected, so even if you win elections, judges can hamper your agenda.

    The independence of courts is of minimal significance to a normal citizen, due to the fact that it is very improbable that his appeal to the highest court will be taken and decided upon - in Germany, 97% of all individually submitted constitutional lawsuits are discarded by Bundesverfassungsgericht without deciding on their merits. In Poland, a single citizen cannot even submit such a lawsuit to Constitutional Court.
    In normal judicial proceedings, it is of no importance since in civil law system there is no stare decisis principle but the "free assessment of proofs" principle, "free" of course for a court not for you. It essentially means that a court can skew the outcome just by ignoring your arguments, also that from European law (like Strasbourg or Luxembourg tribunal). In other words, you have a right to address a court but you do not have a right to have your arguments addressed by a court, even if your arguments are based on EU or ECHR jurisprudence. It is a much bigger problem in Germany than in Poland actually, where there is absolutely no deference to international law INSIDE Germany: Bundesverfassungsgericht has an unofficial doctrine of the primacy of the German law over ECHR or EU law.

    Is manipulation around courts political ? Yes, it is . But everyone should understand that truly independent judiciary would be chosen by lot and for short terms (eg. 2 years) - anything else than that is not fully independent.

    In Poland itself PiS corrected some of the most painful deficits of legal system in Poland, like the possibility of losing a lawsuit against you simply by not knowing about it, since it was enough to send a lawsuit to your official registered address, which in Poland can be only one ("meldunek") - and after 14 days it was delivered by the power of "delivery fiction" legal concept. Now your opponent must establish your real address

    Is Kaczynski a dictator? Of course no, since he has rather weak parliamentary (but not constitutional majority) and is rather likely that he will lose this majority in the next elections.

    THE NEGATIVE CONSEQUENCES OF POLISH MEMBERSHIP IN EU.
    1) a lot of young people emigrated to EU and will probably not come back - you could say this prepared way to emigration to Poland of Ukrainians (and their "work" visas did not allow for Schengen travel, so they were "encouraged" to stay in Poland too). The initial process of mass emigration FROM Poland was a kind of grooming Poland for accepting immigration in this way.

    2) skewing economy towards EU-fundable projects, like constructions projects. There is too much money in that. It results in 2a) constant repairs of roads which were deliberately built/repaired with defects just few years ago. It was also visible when Poland wanted to shift EU funds for Polish railways to roads: it was clear that there is "patron-client" relationship between construction firms and politicians - and you can so easily milk the railway funds since railway construction is much more regulated than roads construction 2b) building of unnecessary things like some airports, aquaparks in cities, projects which now have problems with sustaining themselves due to growing energy prices or lack of customers. Well, if you like, you can get EU funds for opening a park with alpacas too.
    In terms of housing, the counterpart to this is the growth of banking sectors funding developers (who are some of the new Polish oligarchs) who build heavily overpriced apartments which people than buy with mortgages. The worth of PL banking sector is now more than Polish GDP, it is 137% of GDP! It means the value of credits portfolio is worth more than everything produced in Poland in a year - and remember that part of that GDP is building sector itself, a sector which provides products which can be mortgaged. So its even worse, as it is a closed loop.

    It could be different. The matter was generally decided in the pre-EU period after 1989, when a lot of advanced Polish industry was sold to the Western companies which then liquidated it, eg. ELWRO - Poland had one of best electronic industries in the East Bloc, producing not just mainframe computers but also its own personal computers, even if with text-based interface (but also with graphic one on license). I don't say Poland could be a Taiwan of Europe (but it did produce its own microprocessors too), but certainly could be helped to become part of the world high tech industry chain.

    There must be understood that Kaczynski voters - who are around 25% of society since 50% of Poles do not vote at all - mostly did not participate in this milking of EU funds. Nevertheless, because EU projects, different than simple infrastructure building, must be international (eg. participants must be from at least 5 EU countries), Kaczynski is dependent to some extent on EU funding too. There is simply not enough of Polish economy not connected to EU to build prosperity upon. So he did not take such a confrontational course like Orban, who also has a bonus of constitutional majority, smaller country, being much popular among international right, and being a former Soros man - who knows whether he isn't just controlled opposition within EU?

    Orban, with his image of loose cannon, has its advantages for EU too - he can veto something which EU officially supports, but unofficially is aware of its divisiveness, like anti-Russian stance. Orban also canalizes internal opposition in EU countries into the fight for parliament seats as he is a "successful" example of achieving power by constitutional means.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective, @Mr. Hack, @Another Polish Perspective

    and you can so easily milk the railway funds since railway construction is much more regulated than roads construction

    SHOULD OF COURSE READ AS

    “and you CANNOT so easily milk the railway funds since railway construction is much more regulated than roads construction”

  874. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    I will add that because Jarosław Kaczyński political skills come from lording over small group of trusted politicians, he has problems now with managing his large party - so large that he does not know all its politicians personally - and PiS became more like Fidesz, a broad alliance of like minded people with an injection of careerists, who generate scandals.

    BTW, PiS is not the most right party in Poland, not even in parliament. It is a centrist party - exactly like the name of the old Kaczynskis party, "Porozumienie Centrum".

    Replies: @sudden death

    bit offtopic, but how are the most fringe froups doing in Poland these days – relatively shrinking, expanding or stable?

    Do mean Polish respecters of Aryan Nazis, who probably were/are listening rather catchy hymns about WaffenSS:

    And also on the other side there should be Polish Dzerzhinski/Cheka respecters too, even if didn’t hear so far any music from them yet;)

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @sudden death

    I am not a fan of hard beat, so I don't know for sure, but I think they are rather stable (if there were more of them I would surely hear about them).
    However, there is outpouring of folk projects and folk music or folk-inspired music has become kind of "chic", in juxtaposition to the past where such sounds weren't "cool". What you see below are all big-city dwellers, not some old villagers anymore.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ev5ByPvzgQs

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyRTxlFwbAo

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqUB2h6Q8CA&t

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

  875. @Yahya
    @Ivashka the fool


    Regarding SMO, the main objective of this war is the final solution of the Eastern Slav problem. And yes, for some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome.
     
    Can you point to specific financial elites who wish to genocide Eastern Slavs? And perhaps provide concrete evidence of their intentions?

    I don’t agree with your take. My working theory is that the main cause of Western demographic displacement is the “virtue-signaling liberal” segment of society. They constitute perhaps 20-25% of the Western population; but are disproportionately well-educated and located near centers of power. Jews are naturally over-represented; but are by no means the sole actors. Nor are they originators of the anti-racist/pro-migration meme. They merely provide intellectual firepower to existing currents of thought in Western society. Simply put; these virtue-signaling liberals have convinced themselves; and practically everyone else; that racism is the highest evil and openness to foreigners the highest good. Therefore; advocating for migration is virtuos; and against migration is racist. A banal theory, perhaps simplistic, but one that I feel gets close to reality.

    The causes of the Russia-Ukraine conflict are mani-fold and complex. I think Martin Van Crevald wrote a perceptive article on the topic: https://www.martin-van-creveld.com/what-putin-wants/ But one should always know that these things remain hidden from plain sight.

    And Allah knows what they hide, and what they reveal.

    Replies: @Greasy William, @Coconuts, @Ivashka the fool

    Can you point to specific financial elites who wish to genocide Eastern Slavs? And perhaps provide concrete evidence of their intentions?

    That’s a no go zone.
    I would not post anything about it.
    I prefer being the Y haplogroup worshipping fool that I am, instead of digging into the realm of the deeper levels of transnational financial structure.
    Questions one shouldn’t ask, things one would better not know.
    Notice how Sylvio stopped short of discussing the economic motives behind the mass immigration?
    That’s the wise man’s attitude…

    🙂

    [MORE]

    An old Jewish man that I’ve known while young, and who have been through 10 years of Soviet camps for telling anti-Stalin jokes on a train, once told me that to live a happy life one shouldn’t read either Marx or Freud.
    I would add a dozen other authors to the list, Anthony C. Sutton being one of these, and would strongly advise about never looking too closely at the history of the BIS. But if one is young, strong willed, interested about how things really work and has too much time on one’s hands after relinquishing the foreign movies’ watching and Arab music analyzing, then one might start by reading Sutton, learning about the BIS, analyzing the Gvishiani and Club of Rome love affair, looking into who was it that promoted Herr Shwab to his perching 50 years ago, and then going into analyzing the cross holding of shares into the major Funds and TNCs. Then one would discover what Trevor Moore and his buddies alluded to in their hilarious “Kitten History” video in which they talk about “6 global companies own(ing) everything”. Trevor Moore died an untimely death after making too many jokes about very serious matters. He fell from his 2nd floor balcony right on his neck, he was alone at home when it happened.

    🙂

    • Thanks: Yahya
  876. @sudden death
    @Another Polish Perspective

    bit offtopic, but how are the most fringe froups doing in Poland these days - relatively shrinking, expanding or stable?

    Do mean Polish respecters of Aryan Nazis, who probably were/are listening rather catchy hymns about WaffenSS:

    https://soundcloud.com/user-733868840/potop-stalingrad-mp3

    And also on the other side there should be Polish Dzerzhinski/Cheka respecters too, even if didn't hear so far any music from them yet;)

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    I am not a fan of hard beat, so I don’t know for sure, but I think they are rather stable (if there were more of them I would surely hear about them).
    However, there is outpouring of folk projects and folk music or folk-inspired music has become kind of “chic”, in juxtaposition to the past where such sounds weren’t “cool”. What you see below are all big-city dwellers, not some old villagers anymore.

    • Thanks: sudden death
    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    I am not the great fan of the Polish folk music, but I do like this guy, Adam Strug:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HulJEJt8e3U

    I wouldn't say that this renaissance of folk music was started by PiS policy, but of course PiS is supportive of it, providing funding and scholarships etc. In general, I would say that under PiS the juggernaut of cosmopolitanism in culture has been stopped and even a slow turn away from it has been started.

    There are of course areas where Slavic folklore has had a firm position since the late '80ties - for example in the field I am more familiar with than with folk music - namely, fantasy literature. But that is never translated into English, so people outside Poland are not really aware of it. Luckily Poland is a country large enough to provide market for only-in-Polish works. And that is good, since a language which produces works of art is the first defence line against cosmopolitanism.

    Replies: @Yahya

  877. @Dmitry
    @Yahya


    Russian historical leaders

     

    It's only Yeltsin/Putin since independence. It should be Yeltsin-Putin, as the same cartel, just with some changes of boss, underboss, consiglieres etc.

    From the non-clickable options shown, the most sensible was Prokhorov in 2012. But non-clickable.


    , what is your judgement on Israeli an
     
    In economics, it is possible Lapid was a responsible manager. They reduced debt:GDP ratio more than 10% in a single year. This speed of fall in debt:GDP ratio is very fast.
    https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-israels-debt-gdp-ratio-shrank-dramatically-in-2022-1001435908

    But some things was becoming worse. https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-car-thefts-in-israel-double-1001434711 I guess the Israel-Palestinian conflict was less violent in 2022 at least, than 2021.


    )irreversible nature of immigration
     
    Poland's government don't control so much of their immigration policy. EU controls most of it. They have open-borders with the EU bloc. But it's a less relevant for them as few immigrants who have access to the Schengen Area, will stay in Poland.

    This is why a lot of this is political trading between EU countries. There is a system where they all outsource their immigration policy to the EU and the countries which receive most of the immigration will be the wealthy Western European countries. Small numbers of immigrants would choose to stay in Poland when they can go to Germany.

    For their own immigration policy, Poland give more visas to non-EU citizens (mostly temporary working visas for Ukrainians, Belarusians and Turks), than all other EU countries combined.


    Kaczynski is bad because of the backsliding
     
    If they have some compensatory results for backsliding.

    For example, Lee Kuan Yew has success with the housing policy in Singapore (probably including the forced "melting pot"). He was able to continue the English legal tradition there. His authoritarian policy was probably negative, but there are many positive things.

    Kaczynski. Poland's situation improves, receiving first world infrastructure, but in terms of etiology, this was funded by the EU. EU gave over hundred billion of dollars to invest in Poland.

    To some extent, Kaczynski's party's rhetoric threatens this funding in future. If you make these anti-German campaigns in the media, to be popular with older low income base, but German taxpayers are paying the receipts for the shiny new things they base their legacy from.

    At the same time industry is more controlled by Germany. Regions of Poland which support Kaczynski, are demographically collapsing as the young people exit and fertility rate of those which stay is lower than Japan. Management of the coronavirus crisis was incompetent for Poland compared to Western Europe. They have more energy independence from Russia than some of Central Europe, but using coal, so, having the worst air pollution in Europe.

    GDP per capita doesn't really seem to converge with Western Europe, if you look at the nominal data. I'm sure there are positive things as well that Kaczynski attained. He is a trade-union leader. He says he has improve the conditions for working class people. Although they have installed neoliberal banker Morawiecki, to Prime Minister. Poland has at least been developing and improving, although not because of its politicians.

    Probably the vast increase in military spending will be negative for long-term. They will spend $21 billion for their military next year. It is 4 times more than Egypt.

    Replies: @AP

    At the same time industry is more controlled by Germany. Regions of Poland which support Kaczynski, are demographically collapsing as the young people exit

    Kaczynsku has a high level of support throughout Poland, even in areas where his support is under 50%. Poland is not as starkly divided as was Ukraine.

    Also, Polish TFR is not completely correlated with PiS support:

    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTm6TyFOABshDveBGSPYH5qem3DlF0J2QfY0A&usqp=CAU

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @AP

    PiS voting regions all have period fertility rate below Japan.

    https://i.imgur.com/e4LDflr.jpg

    -


    But that is a relatively less important topic. The topic which is more significant issue in terms of their demographics (which will be why some of the voting and why PiS is so obsessed about Second World War and anti-Germany campaigns), which is independent from the fertility rate, is these regions have the highest emigration of their population. So, the population is falling a lot more rapidly than the natural population decline as the young people are exiting those regions. Birthrate is therefore lower than other regions with the same fertility rate and the median age is very high in these regions.

  878. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @Another Polish Perspective
    @AaronB


    Christianity without the pagan and animist elements which it adopted would be an entirely different, and impoverished beast, and so would Buddhism. We need legends and myths and fantasy and the sense that the world is alive. And what would Christianity be without Platonism!
     
    Christianity without Platonism would result in God - without all His hypostases - being closer to people. Now, God the Father is rather a reclusive, far-away character in Christianity.

    David Bentley Hart makes the interesting point that modern nihilism is so deep and intractable precisely because Christianity assumed into itself all the animism and paganism of the past and when it got discredited (through it’s alliance with power), we didn’t even have the “default” human spirituality of animism and paganism to fall back on. The whole package got discredited.

     

    This is a very good point. If the quasi-pagan cult of Mary, even now often known under her pagan name "Our Lady", wanted to part with Christianity, it couldn't leave Jesus the Jewish Messiah behind, even if it could leave God the Father...

    Replies: @AaronB

    Platonism helped develop certain aspects implicit in the Christian conception of God.

    I wouldn’t say God is reclusive in Christianity – in proper Christianity, God’s “immanence” is heavily emphasized, but at the same time there is a very real danger that the concept of God devolves into a mere “superman” type, which is morally dangerous to worship.

    So you don’t want God too close either or you get just a “creature” among creatures rather than the source of Goodness itself. Platonism was a good bulwark against this tendency.

    I don’t know if you’re familiar with Bruce Charlton – he’s this atheist scientist who converted to Christianity, but decided to dispense with all the classical Greek metaphysics and theology. What he ended up with was a conception of God as a creature among creatures, a discrete entity among entities, imperfect and limited, a mere superman type, who at best assists humanity on its evolutionary path – an impoverished religion so far below the grandeur and majesty of classical metaphysics with it’s conception of God as the ground of all being, as the source of Goodness itself rather than just a good thing, and as immanent in everything, that one almost prefers atheism. One also sees the influence of that dismal modern literalism that he no doubt couldn’t shake off from his scientific training.

    As for the hypostases, people seem to desire intermediaries between themselves and God – angels, spirits, Mary, etc. Elite Hinduism is one of the purest forms of monotheism there is, but the Hindus could not dispense with all their colorful God’s in the pantheon. Even the Buddhists needed their great Bodhisattva of compassion, Avalokiteshvara, and many others, besides.

    This corresponds to something in the human psyche.

    • Replies: @Another Polish Perspective
    @AaronB


    As for the hypostases, people seem to desire intermediaries between themselves and God – angels, spirits, Mary, etc. Elite Hinduism is one of the purest forms of monotheism there is, but the Hindus could not dispense with all their colorful God’s in the pantheon. Even the Buddhists needed their great Bodhisattva of compassion, Avalokiteshvara, and many others, besides.

    This corresponds to something in the human psyche.
     

    It does not correspond to my psyche. But should the worship of God be dependent on your psyche...?
    I may make a bit banal analogy now: during my time at university, when exam time came, I studiously avoided asking other students "what questions you got?" (exams were oral), or "what did you get? was the examiner in a good mood?", in order to avoid being deconcentrated by musings like "Since question concerning A already happened, it won't be asked again. So better repeat problems F &G". This was a good strategy for me.

    If my life here on Earth is a kind of exam time, I imagine getting concerned about St Pachomius or St John of Nepomuk or St Mary is like constantly asking other students those auxiliary questions, hoping that their tangible answers will somehow apply to your life - their ultimate goal is to bring you to live your life like St Pachomius or St John of Nepomuk. But YOU ARE NOT ONE OF THEM. You will forget about yourself in this - in the end, it starts to look like worship of other gods, since the more tangible are those gods, the more false may you become. The question of God's worship is also the question of your identity, of you approaching God as yourself. Of course, you need your "ladder of Jacob" to know the way, but that is the Scripture. You must know the way, not other travellers. And you must travel on your own. Should you be not wary, these auxiliary figures may finally become like your hypostases - other versions of you, but not you exactly - you will end like those souls trapped by Demiurge, even if you become trapped by Mary.

    So comforting are some of travellers that you may forgot the way entirely: so is St Mary the endlessly merciful. So cosy and comforting is her mercy that maybe I will just look at her forever, and she will travel as a proxy of me...? Well, I just lost myself.
    Sometimes some powerful example can be truly uplifting - but I cannot stay longer with anyone. I must go my own way. This is perhaps a solution of the hard problem where the inspiration by "example" ends, and where the worship of new gods starts. But this is also the problem which very often gets skewed to the latter, and to blasphemy.

    Replies: @AaronB

  879. @Another Polish Perspective
    @sudden death

    I am not a fan of hard beat, so I don't know for sure, but I think they are rather stable (if there were more of them I would surely hear about them).
    However, there is outpouring of folk projects and folk music or folk-inspired music has become kind of "chic", in juxtaposition to the past where such sounds weren't "cool". What you see below are all big-city dwellers, not some old villagers anymore.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ev5ByPvzgQs

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyRTxlFwbAo

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqUB2h6Q8CA&t

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    I am not the great fan of the Polish folk music, but I do like this guy, Adam Strug:

    I wouldn’t say that this renaissance of folk music was started by PiS policy, but of course PiS is supportive of it, providing funding and scholarships etc. In general, I would say that under PiS the juggernaut of cosmopolitanism in culture has been stopped and even a slow turn away from it has been started.

    There are of course areas where Slavic folklore has had a firm position since the late ’80ties – for example in the field I am more familiar with than with folk music – namely, fantasy literature. But that is never translated into English, so people outside Poland are not really aware of it. Luckily Poland is a country large enough to provide market for only-in-Polish works. And that is good, since a language which produces works of art is the first defence line against cosmopolitanism.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    I am not the great fan of the Polish folk music, but I do like this guy, Adam Strug:

     

    This "Polish" tune sounds an awful lot like Klezmer music.

    Thanks for confirming what we all knew. The Poles are more Jewish than Jews.

    It's no wonder the best rendition of Hava Nagila came out of Poland.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWPPedsKMUc&ab_channel=JednegoSercaJednegoDucha

    All you need now is to wear the yarmelke and your national transformation will be complete.

    :)

    On a more serious note; Slavs have a special talent for folk music. Balkan, Polish, Russian, Ukrainian folk music is top-quality stuff. I've yet to explore the music of Central European Slavs; but I have high hopes.

    I'm a fan of this Polish-Ukrainian soprano:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSEmslk0nLc&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=11&ab_channel=PLYPAS

    ---

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-CLIgjt1_A&list=OLAK5uy_mzLZrj-lDwrOO4OcA2syw6XAkp3O2EGnI&index=2&ab_channel=OlgaPasichnyk-Topic

    Her vocal style is distinctive; not sure how to describe it. Sort of a cross between operatic - which I typically hate - and Slavic folk (though not of the open-throat "white voice" variant). At any rate, it is a refined yet energetic style.

    Replies: @Dmitry

  880. @silviosilver
    @Blinky Bill

    Well thanks Bill. I cringed when I saw the date of that post you linked to. I often cringe when I reread something I wrote a year ago, let alone eight years ago, lol. Or another response I have is when I'm rereading something I said, but for whatever reason I'm unaware that it's my own post, and I find myself agreeing with it - this writer is showing good sense! - and then I realize I was the author, and boom, I find a hundred faults with it, haha.

    Much truth in that meme. So can I lean on you as a character witness when I'm hauled off by the inquisition? :)

    Replies: @Blinky Bill

    So can I lean on you as a character witness when I’m hauled off by the inquisition?

    “If you feel pain, you’re alive, if you feel other people’s pain, you’re a human being.” — Leo Tolstoy

    [MORE]

    • LOL: Ivashka the fool
  881. @Another Polish Perspective
    @Another Polish Perspective

    I am not the great fan of the Polish folk music, but I do like this guy, Adam Strug:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HulJEJt8e3U

    I wouldn't say that this renaissance of folk music was started by PiS policy, but of course PiS is supportive of it, providing funding and scholarships etc. In general, I would say that under PiS the juggernaut of cosmopolitanism in culture has been stopped and even a slow turn away from it has been started.

    There are of course areas where Slavic folklore has had a firm position since the late '80ties - for example in the field I am more familiar with than with folk music - namely, fantasy literature. But that is never translated into English, so people outside Poland are not really aware of it. Luckily Poland is a country large enough to provide market for only-in-Polish works. And that is good, since a language which produces works of art is the first defence line against cosmopolitanism.

    Replies: @Yahya

    I am not the great fan of the Polish folk music, but I do like this guy, Adam Strug:

    This “Polish” tune sounds an awful lot like Klezmer music.

    Thanks for confirming what we all knew. The Poles are more Jewish than Jews.

    It’s no wonder the best rendition of Hava Nagila came out of Poland.

    All you need now is to wear the yarmelke and your national transformation will be complete.

    🙂

    On a more serious note; Slavs have a special talent for folk music. Balkan, Polish, Russian, Ukrainian folk music is top-quality stuff. I’ve yet to explore the music of Central European Slavs; but I have high hopes.

    I’m a fan of this Polish-Ukrainian soprano:

    Her vocal style is distinctive; not sure how to describe it. Sort of a cross between operatic – which I typically hate – and Slavic folk (though not of the open-throat “white voice” variant). At any rate, it is a refined yet energetic style.

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @Yahya

    In general, Poles and Jews are not similar culturally, because Jews are not homogenous and only the tiny minority of Jews will be speaking Polish nowadays.

    But a small subgroup of Jews, who are born in Poland, or their children, are very similar to Poles - i.e. Polish Catholics and secular Polish Jews are very similar obviously.

    It's relevant because Israel has a lot of the immigrants from Poland in the early years, which often dominates politics and you can see their character in the politics.

    However, Polish Jews only exist today in the older generation. Their children can continue some aspects of Polish culture, but their grandchildren will have the dominant Mizrachi culture and I'm sure almost no-one of their grandchildren will be speaking Polish.

    -

    Israel was former semi-British colony and has English law, with base of Ottoman law. But their population is almost all second world and third world immigrants. Israel only has a minority of immigrants from elite countries and even their immigrants from France are originally from North Africa.

    It's an example where the institutions are from elite origin (i.e. England), but the population is from the poor and nonelite countries. So, there is a divergence of the popular culture and people of the country are second/third world, while the operating system of the country is from first world. Obviously, the operating system is more important and you have success with third world immigration into a developed legal system.

    In early years, the immigrants from countries of Central Europe (Poland, Romania, Hungary etc) were culturally dominating. Even after the population doubles with Middle Eastern immigrants in the 1950s. Party of their television even in 1970s looks like culture of non-Soviet Warsaw Pact countries, because Middle Eastern immigrants was not culturally dominant then. Visual culture more like communist Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Romania or Poland in that time.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnkzBRGSCy4

    But by 1980s, the Middle Eastern people are becoming more dominant in the popular culture..

    In 1990s, Rabin imports postsoviet immigrants, which are really breaking the dominance of the Ashkenazi Jews, at least with the popular culture.

    Today, the popular culture often looks more like Turkey, than Central Europe. If 1970s Navy musical like they are in Warsaw Pact.

    Nowadays, the equivalent of musical is like a Turkish musical. And that's the majority of the Israel popular culture style.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_efGL3npysI

  882. @AaronB
    @Another Polish Perspective

    Platonism helped develop certain aspects implicit in the Christian conception of God.

    I wouldn't say God is reclusive in Christianity - in proper Christianity, God's "immanence" is heavily emphasized, but at the same time there is a very real danger that the concept of God devolves into a mere "superman" type, which is morally dangerous to worship.

    So you don't want God too close either or you get just a "creature" among creatures rather than the source of Goodness itself. Platonism was a good bulwark against this tendency.

    I don't know if you're familiar with Bruce Charlton - he's this atheist scientist who converted to Christianity, but decided to dispense with all the classical Greek metaphysics and theology. What he ended up with was a conception of God as a creature among creatures, a discrete entity among entities, imperfect and limited, a mere superman type, who at best assists humanity on its evolutionary path - an impoverished religion so far below the grandeur and majesty of classical metaphysics with it's conception of God as the ground of all being, as the source of Goodness itself rather than just a good thing, and as immanent in everything, that one almost prefers atheism. One also sees the influence of that dismal modern literalism that he no doubt couldn't shake off from his scientific training.

    As for the hypostases, people seem to desire intermediaries between themselves and God - angels, spirits, Mary, etc. Elite Hinduism is one of the purest forms of monotheism there is, but the Hindus could not dispense with all their colorful God's in the pantheon. Even the Buddhists needed their great Bodhisattva of compassion, Avalokiteshvara, and many others, besides.

    This corresponds to something in the human psyche.

    Replies: @Another Polish Perspective

    As for the hypostases, people seem to desire intermediaries between themselves and God – angels, spirits, Mary, etc. Elite Hinduism is one of the purest forms of monotheism there is, but the Hindus could not dispense with all their colorful God’s in the pantheon. Even the Buddhists needed their great Bodhisattva of compassion, Avalokiteshvara, and many others, besides.

    This corresponds to something in the human psyche.

    It does not correspond to my psyche. But should the worship of God be dependent on your psyche…?
    I may make a bit banal analogy now: during my time at university, when exam time came, I studiously avoided asking other students “what questions you got?” (exams were oral), or “what did you get? was the examiner in a good mood?”, in order to avoid being deconcentrated by musings like “Since question concerning A already happened, it won’t be asked again. So better repeat problems F &G”. This was a good strategy for me.

    If my life here on Earth is a kind of exam time, I imagine getting concerned about St Pachomius or St John of Nepomuk or St Mary is like constantly asking other students those auxiliary questions, hoping that their tangible answers will somehow apply to your life – their ultimate goal is to bring you to live your life like St Pachomius or St John of Nepomuk. But YOU ARE NOT ONE OF THEM. You will forget about yourself in this – in the end, it starts to look like worship of other gods, since the more tangible are those gods, the more false may you become. The question of God’s worship is also the question of your identity, of you approaching God as yourself. Of course, you need your “ladder of Jacob” to know the way, but that is the Scripture. You must know the way, not other travellers. And you must travel on your own. Should you be not wary, these auxiliary figures may finally become like your hypostases – other versions of you, but not you exactly – you will end like those souls trapped by Demiurge, even if you become trapped by Mary.

    So comforting are some of travellers that you may forgot the way entirely: so is St Mary the endlessly merciful. So cosy and comforting is her mercy that maybe I will just look at her forever, and she will travel as a proxy of me…? Well, I just lost myself.
    Sometimes some powerful example can be truly uplifting – but I cannot stay longer with anyone. I must go my own way. This is perhaps a solution of the hard problem where the inspiration by “example” ends, and where the worship of new gods starts. But this is also the problem which very often gets skewed to the latter, and to blasphemy.

    • Replies: @AaronB
    @Another Polish Perspective

    You're definitely right, that the best thing is to approach God directly. But not everyone can do that.

    Even Jews have their saints, like Rav Nachman in Uman, who they treat as an intercessory to God.

    But if you can go direct you definitely should.

  883. AaronB [AKA "HeavilyMarbledSteak"] says:
    @Another Polish Perspective
    @AaronB


    As for the hypostases, people seem to desire intermediaries between themselves and God – angels, spirits, Mary, etc. Elite Hinduism is one of the purest forms of monotheism there is, but the Hindus could not dispense with all their colorful God’s in the pantheon. Even the Buddhists needed their great Bodhisattva of compassion, Avalokiteshvara, and many others, besides.

    This corresponds to something in the human psyche.
     

    It does not correspond to my psyche. But should the worship of God be dependent on your psyche...?
    I may make a bit banal analogy now: during my time at university, when exam time came, I studiously avoided asking other students "what questions you got?" (exams were oral), or "what did you get? was the examiner in a good mood?", in order to avoid being deconcentrated by musings like "Since question concerning A already happened, it won't be asked again. So better repeat problems F &G". This was a good strategy for me.

    If my life here on Earth is a kind of exam time, I imagine getting concerned about St Pachomius or St John of Nepomuk or St Mary is like constantly asking other students those auxiliary questions, hoping that their tangible answers will somehow apply to your life - their ultimate goal is to bring you to live your life like St Pachomius or St John of Nepomuk. But YOU ARE NOT ONE OF THEM. You will forget about yourself in this - in the end, it starts to look like worship of other gods, since the more tangible are those gods, the more false may you become. The question of God's worship is also the question of your identity, of you approaching God as yourself. Of course, you need your "ladder of Jacob" to know the way, but that is the Scripture. You must know the way, not other travellers. And you must travel on your own. Should you be not wary, these auxiliary figures may finally become like your hypostases - other versions of you, but not you exactly - you will end like those souls trapped by Demiurge, even if you become trapped by Mary.

    So comforting are some of travellers that you may forgot the way entirely: so is St Mary the endlessly merciful. So cosy and comforting is her mercy that maybe I will just look at her forever, and she will travel as a proxy of me...? Well, I just lost myself.
    Sometimes some powerful example can be truly uplifting - but I cannot stay longer with anyone. I must go my own way. This is perhaps a solution of the hard problem where the inspiration by "example" ends, and where the worship of new gods starts. But this is also the problem which very often gets skewed to the latter, and to blasphemy.

    Replies: @AaronB

    You’re definitely right, that the best thing is to approach God directly. But not everyone can do that.

    Even Jews have their saints, like Rav Nachman in Uman, who they treat as an intercessory to God.

    But if you can go direct you definitely should.

  884. @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    Problem is, most young people live online as much or even more than they do IRL. The trends they follow are often shaped on line. It will be difficult to control teh internets. Imagine the stink, the cries and the gnashing of teeth if and when someone cuts off Twitch and Discord, not to mention other obvious sites...

    Replies: @LatW

    It will be difficult to control teh internets

    Of course, it would be difficult. It may not be needed to cut off the whole thing. That’s why I wrote that it would be better to try to pull it off via some subtle improvements.

    But that’s just part of the problem. Then one has to somehow manage to protect the R1a group from other large groups, which will be an issue in the future.

    • Replies: @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    It's already an issue today. Perhaps it is not as bad in the Baltics, but in RusFed and Ukraine the demographics are really turning ugly. It's going to be a real population bottleneck coupled with a mass migration of Central Asian populations to RusFed and a massive emigration of Ukrainian and to a lesser extent Russian younger generations.

    As Dmitry wrote, if the borders were opened, millions would leave former USSR territory. Basically, it is a Great Replacement situation, just like in Western Europe. This is especially true of the Russian hinterland, where the proportion of Y haplogroup R1a might in the past reach and even top 70 % of the male population in smaller old towns such as Vladimir, Suzdal' or Yaroslavl.

    The outlook is grim. In Moscow, the proportion of Central Asian immigrants has reached around 30% of the male population. While the Slavs leave to flee war or get killed on the frontline, the Central Asians keep pouring in.

    Спасибо Путину за это...

    https://rospisatel.ru/images/shwab.jpg

    Replies: @LatW, @Wokechoke

  885. @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    It will be difficult to control teh internets
     
    Of course, it would be difficult. It may not be needed to cut off the whole thing. That's why I wrote that it would be better to try to pull it off via some subtle improvements.

    But that's just part of the problem. Then one has to somehow manage to protect the R1a group from other large groups, which will be an issue in the future.

    Replies: @Ivashka the fool

    It’s already an issue today. Perhaps it is not as bad in the Baltics, but in RusFed and Ukraine the demographics are really turning ugly. It’s going to be a real population bottleneck coupled with a mass migration of Central Asian populations to RusFed and a massive emigration of Ukrainian and to a lesser extent Russian younger generations.

    As Dmitry wrote, if the borders were opened, millions would leave former USSR territory. Basically, it is a Great Replacement situation, just like in Western Europe. This is especially true of the Russian hinterland, where the proportion of Y haplogroup R1a might in the past reach and even top 70 % of the male population in smaller old towns such as Vladimir, Suzdal’ or Yaroslavl.

    The outlook is grim. In Moscow, the proportion of Central Asian immigrants has reached around 30% of the male population. While the Slavs leave to flee war or get killed on the frontline, the Central Asians keep pouring in.

    Спасибо Путину за это…

    • Agree: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @LatW
    @Ivashka the fool


    It’s already an issue today. Perhaps it is not as bad in the Baltics
     
    The situation in the Baltics, overall, is better than elsewhere but it is changing quite noticeably. I consider it a very big deal.

    Especially starting around 2016, there has been a noticeable increase in the living standards and an accompanying "labor shortage" (as always). The immigration laws are still somewhat strict, but one can see a lot of Indians (both light and dark) appearing, as well as, unfortunately, some black Africans. And not just "students", unfortunately. Most of them are employed, although some of these industries may not be even needed (such as food delivery).


    but in RusFed and Ukraine the demographics are really turning ugly
     
    Frankly, I believe this Ukrainian demographic catastrophe (the forced exile of so many Ukrainians due to war) is so unjust and so dangerous that there needs to be some kind of an international effort (beyond just the help for the refugees) to mitigate this and help them repatriate. I think the unprecedented nature and the sheer scale calls for it. But as you know, the fate of the one who is drowning is in his own hands. This is very very bad for EE, since we are losing a huge buffer (that we, idiotically, used to take for granted). And their demographic data was dismal even before the war. The only thing that saves them are their sheer numbers. The only silver lining is that at least those who immigrated into Poland will be mixed into another Slavic population.

    As Dmitry wrote, if the borders were opened, millions would leave former USSR territory.

     

    Yea, and a lot of them would eventually be accepted in the West, because they need workers. So Putin's system is kind of lucky in a way that they have been able to keep everyone in by force, now it looks like the goal is to keep the Slavs in, but accept more Central Asians. And I have heard a few Russian ethnonats complain that they don't feel at home, one of the Russian ethnonats who is in Ukraine (on the Ukrainian side) said "I want to be among Slavs". It was so endearing.

    And, btw, it seems there was an influx of Russians into the Baltic States some time around January 2022, so think about it, even before the SMO or right before it... I don't know how many, maybe not a lot, but it can be felt that there are more of them than before. This is all parallel to the Ukrainian refugees. So imagine what goes on elsewhere, in bigger places.


    This is especially true of the Russian hinterland, where the proportion of Y haplogroup R1a might in the past reach and even top 70 % of the male population in smaller old towns such as Vladimir, Suzdal’ or Yaroslavl.
     
    Yes, this is sad...

    Speaking of Russian hinterland, no offense, but some of those places really might need to be abandoned (not most but some, the worst ones) - two options, either they give them a major overhaul or investment, or people should be allowed to move to a better place because it's not entirely fair to them either. Obviously I would support the first option more since it is better to allow the original community survive and thrive.

    Do you believe that 1M younger men bailed due to the mobilization? This is the number that is being thrown around by some experts on YouTube. I wonder where they all are and what they are doing. They say that Georgia's GDP rose by 10% and that Kazakhstan has around 300K of them.


    The outlook is grim. In Moscow, the proportion of Central Asian immigrants has reached around 30% of the male population.
     
    That's is extremely high, higher than I thought. And Moscow is important because it's so huge. The only good thing about it is that Central Asians are not as dangerous as other groups, it might be better than what is going on in Western Europe (however, it doesn't really matter in the big picture).

    I think St Pete is not looking that great either, I haven't been to Russia for a very long time, but I think I saw a video of St Pete about 10 years ago with a Muslim dude in traditional attire and a beard walking through the subway. I was taken aback because it wasn't just a Central Asian tubiteika, but full on Islamo trad gear. I remember thinking to myself, "Oh, this is what walks the streets of St Pete now?". Because St Pete is supposed to be like the Baltics in terms of immigration.


    Спасибо Путину за это…
     
    Well, he is not the only one. There are quite a few selfish elements out there. But, yea, it has always been in his interests to pretend that things are only getting better and in all aspects. I don't think he cares as long as things are somewhat "stable".
    , @Wokechoke
    @Ivashka the fool

    The Muscovite is feeding his Tartars into the Empty Vistula.

  886. @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    It's already an issue today. Perhaps it is not as bad in the Baltics, but in RusFed and Ukraine the demographics are really turning ugly. It's going to be a real population bottleneck coupled with a mass migration of Central Asian populations to RusFed and a massive emigration of Ukrainian and to a lesser extent Russian younger generations.

    As Dmitry wrote, if the borders were opened, millions would leave former USSR territory. Basically, it is a Great Replacement situation, just like in Western Europe. This is especially true of the Russian hinterland, where the proportion of Y haplogroup R1a might in the past reach and even top 70 % of the male population in smaller old towns such as Vladimir, Suzdal' or Yaroslavl.

    The outlook is grim. In Moscow, the proportion of Central Asian immigrants has reached around 30% of the male population. While the Slavs leave to flee war or get killed on the frontline, the Central Asians keep pouring in.

    Спасибо Путину за это...

    https://rospisatel.ru/images/shwab.jpg

    Replies: @LatW, @Wokechoke

    It’s already an issue today. Perhaps it is not as bad in the Baltics

    The situation in the Baltics, overall, is better than elsewhere but it is changing quite noticeably. I consider it a very big deal.

    Especially starting around 2016, there has been a noticeable increase in the living standards and an accompanying “labor shortage” (as always). The immigration laws are still somewhat strict, but one can see a lot of Indians (both light and dark) appearing, as well as, unfortunately, some black Africans. And not just “students”, unfortunately. Most of them are employed, although some of these industries may not be even needed (such as food delivery).

    [MORE]

    but in RusFed and Ukraine the demographics are really turning ugly

    Frankly, I believe this Ukrainian demographic catastrophe (the forced exile of so many Ukrainians due to war) is so unjust and so dangerous that there needs to be some kind of an international effort (beyond just the help for the refugees) to mitigate this and help them repatriate. I think the unprecedented nature and the sheer scale calls for it. But as you know, the fate of the one who is drowning is in his own hands. This is very very bad for EE, since we are losing a huge buffer (that we, idiotically, used to take for granted). And their demographic data was dismal even before the war. The only thing that saves them are their sheer numbers. The only silver lining is that at least those who immigrated into Poland will be mixed into another Slavic population.

    As Dmitry wrote, if the borders were opened, millions would leave former USSR territory.

    Yea, and a lot of them would eventually be accepted in the West, because they need workers. So Putin’s system is kind of lucky in a way that they have been able to keep everyone in by force, now it looks like the goal is to keep the Slavs in, but accept more Central Asians. And I have heard a few Russian ethnonats complain that they don’t feel at home, one of the Russian ethnonats who is in Ukraine (on the Ukrainian side) said “I want to be among Slavs”. It was so endearing.

    And, btw, it seems there was an influx of Russians into the Baltic States some time around January 2022, so think about it, even before the SMO or right before it… I don’t know how many, maybe not a lot, but it can be felt that there are more of them than before. This is all parallel to the Ukrainian refugees. So imagine what goes on elsewhere, in bigger places.

    This is especially true of the Russian hinterland, where the proportion of Y haplogroup R1a might in the past reach and even top 70 % of the male population in smaller old towns such as Vladimir, Suzdal’ or Yaroslavl.

    Yes, this is sad…

    Speaking of Russian hinterland, no offense, but some of those places really might need to be abandoned (not most but some, the worst ones) – two options, either they give them a major overhaul or investment, or people should be allowed to move to a better place because it’s not entirely fair to them either. Obviously I would support the first option more since it is better to allow the original community survive and thrive.

    Do you believe that 1M younger men bailed due to the mobilization? This is the number that is being thrown around by some experts on YouTube. I wonder where they all are and what they are doing. They say that Georgia’s GDP rose by 10% and that Kazakhstan has around 300K of them.

    The outlook is grim. In Moscow, the proportion of Central Asian immigrants has reached around 30% of the male population.

    That’s is extremely high, higher than I thought. And Moscow is important because it’s so huge. The only good thing about it is that Central Asians are not as dangerous as other groups, it might be better than what is going on in Western Europe (however, it doesn’t really matter in the big picture).

    I think St Pete is not looking that great either, I haven’t been to Russia for a very long time, but I think I saw a video of St Pete about 10 years ago with a Muslim dude in traditional attire and a beard walking through the subway. I was taken aback because it wasn’t just a Central Asian tubiteika, but full on Islamo trad gear. I remember thinking to myself, “Oh, this is what walks the streets of St Pete now?”. Because St Pete is supposed to be like the Baltics in terms of immigration.

    Спасибо Путину за это…

    Well, he is not the only one. There are quite a few selfish elements out there. But, yea, it has always been in his interests to pretend that things are only getting better and in all aspects. I don’t think he cares as long as things are somewhat “stable”.

  887. @Ivashka the fool
    @Coconuts

    I think we often overestimate the importance of ideologies and underestimate the importance of the economy. Both are important. The first modern wave of the non-European immigration to Europe happened during post-WW2 period (les trente glorieuses). And we tend sometimes to believe that the elite groups of high IQ, high wealth and high education status do somehow act irrationally. Perhaps there's a rationale that we want to define on economic grounds to understand why all this happens.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @S

    I think we often overestimate the importance of ideologies and underestimate the importance of the economy…Perhaps there’s a rationale that we want to define on economic grounds to understand why all this happens.

    Yes, follow the money.

    In December, 1863, the financial representative of the Lincoln administration in London, Robert J Walker, taking numerous variables into account, effectively calculated that the North’s wage slavery (ie the so called ‘cheap labor’/’mass immigration’ system, this being the early 19th century monetization of chattel slavery and it’s trade) was four times more productive than chattel slavery, and hence far more profitable.

    [MORE]

    He did this when he compared economic statistics from the center of wage slavery in the North, Massachusetts, with the center of chattel slavery in the South, South Carolina.

    Walker’s London economic calculations were republished in the US North in the Spring of 1864 as part of a ‘why we fight’ series of articles for Northern consumption. [The original scanned in 1864 US journal article with Walker’s London economic calculations and link to it can be found in my post archives.]

    At the time of the 1776 American Revolution chattel slavery was ubiquitous in both the Northern and Southern colonies. Anglo-Saxon elites and hangers on, rather than pay their own the prevailing real time local labor rates, would instead import alien chattel slaves to do this work at far below what they would have to pay their own people.

    Circa 1800 slavers of the British Empire and the US North had realized that slave owners could still avoid paying their own people the prevailing real time local labor rates by importing alien wage slaves (ie so called ‘cheap labor’/’immigrants’) instead of alien chattel slaves, and simply paying them far below the prevailing real time local labor rates, these often being people who had first been reduced to an unnaturally low state of being such as many of the Irish under British subjugation, or those having been flooded with drugs (opium) such as the Chinese.

    The US North went along with the British Empire’s monetization of chattel slavery and adopted the new wage slavery (so called ‘cheap labor) system. The South, which had many more chattel slaves than the North, and where chattel slavery had become entrenched, was recalcitrant, however, and would not adopt the new wage slavery system, and hence the 1861-65 war.

    The US Civil War was fought for slavery, despite the lies told to the men, by both sides.

    Some might balk at the idea that there are those who would see the destruction of entire peoples for profit. They were prepared to see 700,000 die in the US Civil War for profit, most being their own people. [The historically slavery corrupted elites and their hangers of both the North and South should of been overthrown instead, and a true abolition of slavery, both chattel and wage, enacted.]

    Below are some excerpts from a 1908 book entitled
    The Wartime Journal of a Georgia Girl (1864-65)written by Eliza Frances Andrews.

    Andrews father was one of the self declared ‘privileged 4000’, those who owned one hundred or more slaves as in his case, or, one of their business owning allies.

    She says the same thing in words what her Northern elite counter part, Robert J Walker, had said with his London economic calculations.

    From pgs 11, 12, and 13.

    ‘…the rise of the modern industrial
    system made wage slavery a more efficient agent of
    production than chattel slavery.’

    ‘Our Southern States, being still in the agricultural stage, on account of our practical monopoly of the world’s chief textile staple, were the last of the great civilized nations to find chattel slavery less profitable than wage slavery, and hence the “great moral crusade”of the North against the perverse and unregenerate South.’

    ‘It was a pure case of economic determinism, which means that our great moral conflict reduces itself, in the last analysis, to a question of dollars and cents, though the real issue was so obscured by other considerations that we of the South honestly believe to this day that we were fighting for States Rights, while the North is equally honest in the conviction that it was engaged in a magnanimous struggle to free the slave.’

    She writes about the planned coming global super state, ie the United States of the World, which will be economically slavery based (ie wage slavery, or so called ‘cheap labor’) unless some radical change takes place first.

    From pgs 17 and 18

    ‘And now that we have learned wisdom through suffering; now that we have seen how much more can be accomplished by peaceful cooperation under the safe guidance of natural laws, than by wasteful violence, we are prepared to take our part intelligently in the next great forward movement of the race — a movement having for its object not merely a closer union of kindred states, but that grander union dreamed of by the poet, which is to find its consummation in “The parliament of man, the federation of the world.”

    https://archive.org/details/wartimejournalof00andr/page/12/mode/1up

    • Thanks: Ivashka the fool
  888. @AP
    @Dmitry


    At the same time industry is more controlled by Germany. Regions of Poland which support Kaczynski, are demographically collapsing as the young people exit
     
    Kaczynsku has a high level of support throughout Poland, even in areas where his support is under 50%. Poland is not as starkly divided as was Ukraine.

    Also, Polish TFR is not completely correlated with PiS support:

    https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTm6TyFOABshDveBGSPYH5qem3DlF0J2QfY0A&usqp=CAU

    Replies: @Dmitry

    PiS voting regions all have period fertility rate below Japan.

    But that is a relatively less important topic. The topic which is more significant issue in terms of their demographics (which will be why some of the voting and why PiS is so obsessed about Second World War and anti-Germany campaigns), which is independent from the fertility rate, is these regions have the highest emigration of their population. So, the population is falling a lot more rapidly than the natural population decline as the young people are exiting those regions. Birthrate is therefore lower than other regions with the same fertility rate and the median age is very high in these regions.

  889. @Yahya
    @Another Polish Perspective


    I am not the great fan of the Polish folk music, but I do like this guy, Adam Strug:

     

    This "Polish" tune sounds an awful lot like Klezmer music.

    Thanks for confirming what we all knew. The Poles are more Jewish than Jews.

    It's no wonder the best rendition of Hava Nagila came out of Poland.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWPPedsKMUc&ab_channel=JednegoSercaJednegoDucha

    All you need now is to wear the yarmelke and your national transformation will be complete.

    :)

    On a more serious note; Slavs have a special talent for folk music. Balkan, Polish, Russian, Ukrainian folk music is top-quality stuff. I've yet to explore the music of Central European Slavs; but I have high hopes.

    I'm a fan of this Polish-Ukrainian soprano:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSEmslk0nLc&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=11&ab_channel=PLYPAS

    ---

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-CLIgjt1_A&list=OLAK5uy_mzLZrj-lDwrOO4OcA2syw6XAkp3O2EGnI&index=2&ab_channel=OlgaPasichnyk-Topic

    Her vocal style is distinctive; not sure how to describe it. Sort of a cross between operatic - which I typically hate - and Slavic folk (though not of the open-throat "white voice" variant). At any rate, it is a refined yet energetic style.

    Replies: @Dmitry

    In general, Poles and Jews are not similar culturally, because Jews are not homogenous and only the tiny minority of Jews will be speaking Polish nowadays.

    But a small subgroup of Jews, who are born in Poland, or their children, are very similar to Poles – i.e. Polish Catholics and secular Polish Jews are very similar obviously.

    It’s relevant because Israel has a lot of the immigrants from Poland in the early years, which often dominates politics and you can see their character in the politics.

    However, Polish Jews only exist today in the older generation. Their children can continue some aspects of Polish culture, but their grandchildren will have the dominant Mizrachi culture and I’m sure almost no-one of their grandchildren will be speaking Polish.

    Israel was former semi-British colony and has English law, with base of Ottoman law. But their population is almost all second world and third world immigrants. Israel only has a minority of immigrants from elite countries and even their immigrants from France are originally from North Africa.

    It’s an example where the institutions are from elite origin (i.e. England), but the population is from the poor and nonelite countries. So, there is a divergence of the popular culture and people of the country are second/third world, while the operating system of the country is from first world. Obviously, the operating system is more important and you have success with third world immigration into a developed legal system.

    In early years, the immigrants from countries of Central Europe (Poland, Romania, Hungary etc) were culturally dominating. Even after the population doubles with Middle Eastern immigrants in the 1950s. Party of their television even in 1970s looks like culture of non-Soviet Warsaw Pact countries, because Middle Eastern immigrants was not culturally dominant then. Visual culture more like communist Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Romania or Poland in that time.

    But by 1980s, the Middle Eastern people are becoming more dominant in the popular culture..

    In 1990s, Rabin imports postsoviet immigrants, which are really breaking the dominance of the Ashkenazi Jews, at least with the popular culture.

    Today, the popular culture often looks more like Turkey, than Central Europe. If 1970s Navy musical like they are in Warsaw Pact.

    Nowadays, the equivalent of musical is like a Turkish musical. And that’s the majority of the Israel popular culture style.

  890. @Ivashka the fool
    @Dmitry


    Most of the world’s population dream to emigrate to developed countries, at least the younger people. If developed countries have open borders, and the undeveloped countries don’t close borders for exit, then young people will exit to the same developed countries.

    Most of the world doesn’t have a nice country, will not be born in one. So most of the world always will try to go to countries with civilized conditions. The main question is about whether the policy is to open/close border. Strength of motive for the peoples’ movement mostly just delta in the living conditions between the countries
     

    Perhaps I wasn't clear enough when I wrote the reply to Silvio earlier today, but it is one of the aspects that I wanted to emphasize. People will always attempt to increase their level of well-being, even if at the expense of others.

    Regarding SMO, the main objective of this war is the final solution of the Eastern Slav problem. If it doesn’t culminate in an outright nuclear conflict, this war last for years and will end up with both Russian and Ukrainian populations reaching a demographic tipping point towards the dustbin of history.

    And yes, for some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome. They have strategic objectives for the decades (centuries) to come, and preventing the ressources of the Eurasian landmass from being wasted on the upkeep of imbecile aborigines, or falling in the wrong hands, might well be among these desirable outcomes.

    Why bombing Eastern Slavs into the stone age, when they are eager to bomb each-other themselves...

    Replies: @Yahya, @Dmitry

    some financial elite circles it might be a desirable outcome

    One of the main activity of the last twenty years was petrodollar recycling to the West. Extracting resources, exchanging for money, which is then moved to the West, while only a very small proportion of the profits are re-invested in Russia.

    And even with ordinary people, all the IKEA and H&M was enjoying the Russian market, as they sell for higher prices than in the West. This was accelerating even after “our Crimea”.

    For example, richest man in the world is Bernard Arnault. He owns Louis Vuitton, Moët etc. Of course, postsoviet elites are will be in somewhere near top 2 largest customers in the world for those brands, even if they buy in Milan.*

    So, the previous “equilibrium” of Putin, has been extremely profitable for Western business. This was Moscow was using rhetorical from Cold War time for the domestic consumption, while moving the country’s money to the supposed enemy.

    “Special military operation” was removing Russia from this system, so I don’t see it will be great from the situation of the Western business zone.

    The main profits of lawyers in London for some years, were the legal arguments between businessmen in Russia.

    Of course, in the military view, now the West is “slow cooking the frog”, where they slowly give weapons for Kiev so the frog doesn’t jump out of the hot water too early.

    When the West is bored from this, they will eventually cook the frog. But this new situation not going to generate as much profits as the previous “equilibrium” where Russia was moving the petrodollars to the West.

    both Russian and Ukrainian populations reaching a demographic tipping point towards the dustbin of history

    It’s very bad for Ukraine, I’m not sure it will have such negative effect in Russia for demographics.

    Population of Russian Federation will be going to 120 million in the next decades whether or not war. But it’s not so easy to emigrate nowadays, even more difficult than one year ago.

    It’s more the soul of the postsoviet space is broken and in 10 years, I doubt we will be saying it has recovered. Maybe Ukraine will develop something from this in terms of the nation building, but they will be in Europe then.


    *In some old humor.

  891. @Ivashka the fool
    @LatW

    It's already an issue today. Perhaps it is not as bad in the Baltics, but in RusFed and Ukraine the demographics are really turning ugly. It's going to be a real population bottleneck coupled with a mass migration of Central Asian populations to RusFed and a massive emigration of Ukrainian and to a lesser extent Russian younger generations.

    As Dmitry wrote, if the borders were opened, millions would leave former USSR territory. Basically, it is a Great Replacement situation, just like in Western Europe. This is especially true of the Russian hinterland, where the proportion of Y haplogroup R1a might in the past reach and even top 70 % of the male population in smaller old towns such as Vladimir, Suzdal' or Yaroslavl.

    The outlook is grim. In Moscow, the proportion of Central Asian immigrants has reached around 30% of the male population. While the Slavs leave to flee war or get killed on the frontline, the Central Asians keep pouring in.

    Спасибо Путину за это...

    https://rospisatel.ru/images/shwab.jpg

    Replies: @LatW, @Wokechoke

    The Muscovite is feeding his Tartars into the Empty Vistula.

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